Re: How many goals on IEP?

[Guest guest]

My son isn't that way. He's very high functioning and certainly able to learn, but the mainstream class just moves through the material faster and at a higher level than he can handle right now. Also, when I mention goals that need further work in order to master I'm met with resistance about what's 'on the lesson plans for the rest of the year.' I know that can't be a reason, but the reality is... I just don't see how an inclusion setting is appropriate. Not to mention that the teachers haven't received training and we're asking them to track and fade out behaviors...they only seem to tell him to "listen", "pay attention," "shhh"...Sent from my iPhone

I've done this two ways. One way was to have about 35 goals the other way was to have my child pass the end of the year test with a 70% in every subject or now basically to pass the TAKS. We use the general ed curriculum and use the IEP goals for things like social skills and job training. With an IEP teachers are required to do tracking on each goal. We used to get very specific. For instance we had goals in 5th grade that looked like this. "Student will be able to add two digit numbers with 70% accuracy 3 out of 4 trials across three environments." Now (after RPM and currently a 10th grader) our goal is Matt will pass the Math portion of TAKS with access to the general ed curriculum on grade level. In 6th grade my son was included in a Resource class and was a new learner to RPM. While he did fine in the class it moved at a pace that did not cover the material needed to pass the TAKS so we ended up teaching him the TAKS material at home. He could have taken TAKS modified but we knew he could learn more he just needed more time.

I think I'd pick a more general IEP goal set and make it measurable by some kind of standardized testing so to avoid having the teacher only teach what is written. Having a good relationship with your teacher helps also but if the class is so crowded and has lots of behavior issues there may not be time to teach effectively. I have always used outside tutors for support.

Trina

How many goals are generally included in what would be considered a 'good' IEP? As I understand it, the goals should reflect what my son will be tested over throughout the year, right?So, theoretically, if he were having a test over Unit 11 in Social Studies, which is about immigrants, transcontinental railroad, etc then those topics should be included/identified in the IEP? Otherwise, we shouldn't be recording grades on anything else, right?

Thanks,

[Guest guest]

First, tying shoes is a skill a child needs to be successful in the school environment.  If they do it for the child, that fosters dependence.  Second, if he cannot tie his shoes, he may trip and fall in the school environment, so tell them  you will hold them accountable for any injuries resulting from that.

Thirdly, they may be too busy to notice his shoes aren't tied, so he needs to be able to tie them himself.  This is a self-help skill, and if they don't want to " teach " him, then they should have an OT eval and the OT should do this.

Forbid them to tie his shoes unless it is during the context of teaching him to do it for himself., your child is high functioning but cannot function in a fast paced classroom.  If he is in that classroom, it is generally going to be whatever is on the TEKS being taught.  Most of this will not and should not be on the IEP.  What is taught in the general classroom is measured by the report card.  The IEP reflects those skills he needs particular assistance on so that he can be successful in the general curriculum.

Base don what you said earlier, He needs more time to learn, demonstrate, and master skills.  In the general ed room, he is not going to get that kind of time, BUT if a skill is in the IEP, they have to teach him that skill to mastery or the IEP has failed.

This is my thinking, our children are different in that it does take most more time to master skills and learn new things.  So what is most important?If a child does not learn to read, write, and work math to the ninth grade level, they will most likely be unemployable.  If a child does not gain a degree of social competency skills, how are they going to get a job, make friends, and not feel isolated?  If a child has horrible penmanship and cannot fill out a job application that is legible.... do you see where I am going with this?  If a child does not learn to take care of himself and do all the self-help and activities of daily living that we all do without even thinking about it, how are they going to be independent?  If your child does not have enough speech, then they need speech thereapy or for those who will not regain speech,t hey need training in alternative forms of communication.  If a child has sensory issues, how will they be able to cope and survive in a post secondary or work environment? Can the child COMPREHEND what is read?  This is MOST important.

You do not have to put science and social studies objectives onthe IEP.  His scinece/social studies will be TEKS and will be reproted on the report card.  In the vast scheme of things, what good are those subjects going to do him if he doesn't have the reading skills he needs?  Any child who learns to comprehend well CAN LEARN anything else through reading.

So for an IEP, I would stick to the following:readingwriting/penmanshipmathsocial skills trainingOT (if needed, which it probably is)PT (if needed)Speech therapy Sensory integration therapy

coping skills/behavior managementlife skills/activities of daily livingDo not worry about other subjects to the exclusion of these. Let those other ones be reported on the report card -- the problem is that teaching those takes time away from the above that he really needs to focus on.

In our home school, we focus on the above list.  Now that my son has fianlly made a lot of progress, we are adding in a little science and a little social studies, but these are not our focus.  The PSAT and the SAT that are taken to get into college do not focus on those other things.  They focus on reading, writing, and math skills period because if he can read (comprehend) well then they can give hima science text or a social studies text, and the child can READ it and answer questions based on comprehension.  He can pick up any subject he wants to learn at a later date.  focus on what is important.

And giving him the time he needs t be successful should be written into the ARD agreement.  So a modification could be reduced assignments and more time to complete work.Haven

[Guest guest]

Gotcha. Now, about the report card...what do those grades 'mean'?Sent from my iPhone

First, tying shoes is a skill a child needs to be successful in the school environment. If they do it for the child, that fosters dependence. Second, if he cannot tie his shoes, he may trip and fall in the school environment, so tell them you will hold them accountable for any injuries resulting from that.

Thirdly, they may be too busy to notice his shoes aren't tied, so he needs to be able to tie them himself. This is a self-help skill, and if they don't want to "teach" him, then they should have an OT eval and the OT should do this.

Forbid them to tie his shoes unless it is during the context of teaching him to do it for himself., your child is high functioning but cannot function in a fast paced classroom. If he is in that classroom, it is generally going to be whatever is on the TEKS being taught. Most of this will not and should not be on the IEP. What is taught in the general classroom is measured by the report card. The IEP reflects those skills he needs particular assistance on so that he can be successful in the general curriculum.

Base don what you said earlier, He needs more time to learn, demonstrate, and master skills. In the general ed room, he is not going to get that kind of time, BUT if a skill is in the IEP, they have to teach him that skill to mastery or the IEP has failed.

This is my thinking, our children are different in that it does take most more time to master skills and learn new things. So what is most important?If a child does not learn to read, write, and work math to the ninth grade level, they will most likely be unemployable. If a child does not gain a degree of social competency skills, how are they going to get a job, make friends, and not feel isolated? If a child has horrible penmanship and cannot fill out a job application that is legible.... do you see where I am going with this? If a child does not learn to take care of himself and do all the self-help and activities of daily living that we all do without even thinking about it, how are they going to be independent? If your child does not have enough speech, then they need speech thereapy or for those who will not regain speech,t hey need training in alternative forms of communication. If a child has sensory issues, how will they be able to cope and survive in a post secondary or work environment? Can the child COMPREHEND what is read? This is MOST important.

You do not have to put science and social studies objectives onthe IEP. His scinece/social studies will be TEKS and will be reproted on the report card. In the vast scheme of things, what good are those subjects going to do him if he doesn't have the reading skills he needs? Any child who learns to comprehend well CAN LEARN anything else through reading.

So for an IEP, I would stick to the following:readingwriting/penmanshipmathsocial skills trainingOT (if needed, which it probably is)PT (if needed)Speech therapy Sensory integration therapy

coping skills/behavior managementlife skills/activities of daily livingDo not worry about other subjects to the exclusion of these. Let those other ones be reported on the report card -- the problem is that teaching those takes time away from the above that he really needs to focus on.

In our home school, we focus on the above list. Now that my son has fianlly made a lot of progress, we are adding in a little science and a little social studies, but these are not our focus. The PSAT and the SAT that are taken to get into college do not focus on those other things. They focus on reading, writing, and math skills period because if he can read (comprehend) well then they can give hima science text or a social studies text, and the child can READ it and answer questions based on comprehension. He can pick up any subject he wants to learn at a later date. focus on what is important.

And giving him the time he needs t be successful should be written into the ARD agreement. So a modification could be reduced assignments and more time to complete work.Haven

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[Guest guest]

Common problem I think. Resource is too far behind and regular inclusion without an aide isn't productive. Perhaps what you should ask for is inclusion but then take him out to reteach or catch up in a smaller group. We do this pretty successfully but it's not for content it's for homework so he's in class most of the day and has one period free to work on his homework since it takes him longer to do it. This is done in a special ed setting.

If you write IEP goals for all the areas he's behind your correct in wondering who will track it. Regular ed teachers with 30 kids in a class will have a hard time finding the time to reteach and track not to mention that's it's likely he's not the only one in class with unique needs. Figure out what the schools goals are for him. Do they want him to pass the standardized test at the end of the year? If so, they won't want to deviate away from the lesson plan or he won't learn enough of the material to have any chance of passing. A Sped Resource class will have kids on many levels. Typically the teacher teaches at the speed of the slowest learner. Which is probably fine if the goal is to pass Modified TEKS but won't get enough material in to pass more involved tests.

It's tough being in the middle...to advanced for Resource...to many sensory issues and attention issues for independent inclusion. The model of inclusion with a teachers aide to help him and other students stay focused and then take them out one period a day to reteach is ideal. But likely you'll have to fail first and be able to prove he can learn the material if given the proper supports in the proper setting. They likely won't do this just for your son but chances are there are others with severe ADD or ADHD who would also benefit from this model.

 

My son isn't that way. He's very high functioning and certainly able to learn, but the mainstream class just moves through the material faster and at a higher level than he can handle right now. 

Also, when I mention goals that need further work in order to master I'm met with resistance about what's 'on the lesson plans for the rest of the year.' I know that can't be a reason, but the reality is... 

I just don't see how an inclusion setting is appropriate. Not to mention that the teachers haven't received training and we're asking them to track and fade out behaviors...they only seem to tell him to " listen " , " pay attention, " " shhh " ...

Sent from my iPhone

 

I've done this two ways. One way was to have about 35 goals the other way was to have my child pass the end of the year test with a 70% in every subject or now basically to pass the TAKS. We use the general ed curriculum and use the IEP goals for things like social skills and job training. With an IEP teachers are required to do tracking on each goal. We used to get very specific. For instance we had goals in 5th grade that looked like this. " Student will be able to add two digit numbers with 70% accuracy 3 out of 4 trials across three environments. " Now (after RPM and currently a 10th grader) our goal is Matt will pass the Math portion of TAKS  with access to the general ed curriculum on grade level. In 6th grade my son was included in a Resource class and was a new learner to RPM. While he did fine in the class it moved at a pace that did not cover the material needed to pass the TAKS so we ended up teaching him the TAKS material at home. He could have taken TAKS modified but we knew he could learn more he just needed more time.

I think I'd pick a more general IEP goal set and make it measurable by some kind of standardized testing so to avoid having the teacher only teach what is written. Having a good relationship with your teacher helps also but if the class is so crowded and has lots of behavior issues there may not be time to teach effectively. I have always used outside tutors for support.

Trina

 

How many goals are generally included in what would be considered a 'good' IEP? As I understand it, the goals should reflect what my son will be tested over throughout the year, right?So, theoretically, if he were having a test over Unit 11 in Social Studies, which is about immigrants, transcontinental railroad, etc then those topics should be included/identified in the IEP? Otherwise, we shouldn't be recording grades on anything else, right?

Thanks,

[Guest guest]

if i forbid them to tie his shoes unless they do it in a teaching manner they will just do what they are now and let him run around with them untied. i pick him up everyday and they are untied. but i will use the tips you suggested at our next ard. last year when i asked to put shoe tying they said no. but i will ask again and ask for an OT eval if they say no. Sent from my iPhone

First, tying shoes is a skill a child needs to be successful in the school environment. If they do it for the child, that fosters dependence. Second, if he cannot tie his shoes, he may trip and fall in the school environment, so tell them you will hold them accountable for any injuries resulting from that.

Thirdly, they may be too busy to notice his shoes aren't tied, so he needs to be able to tie them himself. This is a self-help skill, and if they don't want to "teach" him, then they should have an OT eval and the OT should do this.

Forbid them to tie his shoes unless it is during the context of teaching him to do it for himself., your child is high functioning but cannot function in a fast paced classroom. If he is in that classroom, it is generally going to be whatever is on the TEKS being taught. Most of this will not and should not be on the IEP. What is taught in the general classroom is measured by the report card. The IEP reflects those skills he needs particular assistance on so that he can be successful in the general curriculum.

Base don what you said earlier, He needs more time to learn, demonstrate, and master skills. In the general ed room, he is not going to get that kind of time, BUT if a skill is in the IEP, they have to teach him that skill to mastery or the IEP has failed.

This is my thinking, our children are different in that it does take most more time to master skills and learn new things. So what is most important?If a child does not learn to read, write, and work math to the ninth grade level, they will most likely be unemployable. If a child does not gain a degree of social competency skills, how are they going to get a job, make friends, and not feel isolated? If a child has horrible penmanship and cannot fill out a job application that is legible.... do you see where I am going with this? If a child does not learn to take care of himself and do all the self-help and activities of daily living that we all do without even thinking about it, how are they going to be independent? If your child does not have enough speech, then they need speech thereapy or for those who will not regain speech,t hey need training in alternative forms of communication. If a child has sensory issues, how will they be able to cope and survive in a post secondary or work environment? Can the child COMPREHEND what is read? This is MOST important.

You do not have to put science and social studies objectives onthe IEP. His scinece/social studies will be TEKS and will be reproted on the report card. In the vast scheme of things, what good are those subjects going to do him if he doesn't have the reading skills he needs? Any child who learns to comprehend well CAN LEARN anything else through reading.

So for an IEP, I would stick to the following:readingwriting/penmanshipmathsocial skills trainingOT (if needed, which it probably is)PT (if needed)Speech therapy Sensory integration therapy

coping skills/behavior managementlife skills/activities of daily livingDo not worry about other subjects to the exclusion of these. Let those other ones be reported on the report card -- the problem is that teaching those takes time away from the above that he really needs to focus on.

In our home school, we focus on the above list. Now that my son has fianlly made a lot of progress, we are adding in a little science and a little social studies, but these are not our focus. The PSAT and the SAT that are taken to get into college do not focus on those other things. They focus on reading, writing, and math skills period because if he can read (comprehend) well then they can give hima science text or a social studies text, and the child can READ it and answer questions based on comprehension. He can pick up any subject he wants to learn at a later date. focus on what is important.

And giving him the time he needs t be successful should be written into the ARD agreement. So a modification could be reduced assignments and more time to complete work.Haven

[Guest guest]

Report card grades mean very little.  they do not hold any weight in court.  they are seen as very subjective.  But if a parent matches the report card grades to the actual work, the they mean a little more.  but for example, in one school I visited as an advocate, the ARD committee said the report card grades were just to denote " participation " and that is why the kid got straight 100's.  But it gives the impression that this kid is pretty smart -- doesn't it.  They haven't even taught this child to read yet!!!

IEP progress report grades can only be valuable IF the parent saves ALL substantive work and matches the work to the IEP objectives and determines whether they match up.  I fear that there is  A LOT of fabircating progres going on with not only implementing IEP's as written but in reporting actual progress.  Parents have to be diligent.

Now, what do the courts look at -- and this is usually when a case gets past due process and into the district court and on up into the supreme court.  I am tired so I am not bothering to capitalize stuff.  The Supreme Court looks at where that child fell on the bell curve two years ago, one year ago, and where it falls on the bell curve today. That is how it determines progress.

If a child starts school and gets on FIE and that child falls in the third percentile that year, that's where he started.  Then the following year the parent can either request that standardized testing be done by then again or I think it is wiser to get outside testing at your own expense in alternate years.

So the parents have their child tested and now let's say the child is at the first percentile.  Wow, what happened in a year?  Well the child regressed.Let's say the child  stays at the third percentile  year after year when standardized testing is done, that is stagnation.

As far as the higher courts go, Standardized test scores rule the roost.  It also says something if the child didn't pass the state mandated tests, especially if they took say the TAKS M instead.  I won't even mention TAKS ALT becasue that test is a joke and  is usually given to kids who don't even meet the criterion of severe disability to be allowed to legally take it, but some school get away with giving it, and just about every kid who gets that one passes it with flying colors, so I wouldn't count that at all in considering progress and I doubt the courts would either.,

so when you get to the part of the IEP that says " Criterion for Mastery "   school districts will almost alwasy say " observation. "   What a joke!Here is the criterion for mastery:   A portfolio of ALL written work and tests.  Video and/ or audiotaped benchmark tests fro things that are not in a written, tangible form, and most importantly that progress will be determined by yearly standardized testing in the areas that are covered in the IEP.  Do not accept observation as a criterion for mastery, but for non-verbal kids or those who cannot write, you may accept it if there are discrete trial tracking sheets AND they do audio or videotaped benchmarks, and label and save those tapes and make them part of your paper trail.

As for the shoe laces, this is what you do.  Every time you pick your child up and find his laces untied, take a picture, and on the back mark the date.  Send a letter requesting they cover this skill in his IEP under life skills or self help skills.  If you find him with untied laces again, take a picture, date it.  Send a letter than says " second notice " or thirtieth notice.  State in your letter how having untied laces puts your child in danger of falling and being hurt. State how you ahve requeted several times that this be part of his IEP.  Now you have created a paper trail.  You could use video too -- preferably one that automatically ahs the date onthe screen when you repaly it at due process if it comes to that. 

[Guest guest]

My older son showed me a way to tie a shoe where the laces are hidden under the tongue of the shoe and tied in a knot. He told me one day after I was battling this issue at school... " Good grief mom none of the kids tie their shoes anymore you just slip them on. " My son with Autism has been getting better with his fine motor skills recently and we may try actually tying shoes again. But I wouldn't block out loads of time for it at school and other than the fact that a tied shoe with the laces showing " isn't cool " here is why....

When my son was around 8 we worked every day on learning to ride a bike. Eventually he learned to pedal forward but didn't break he just ran into everything to stop. We tried again to teach him, several times a year, until at the age of 13 we just gave up and put him on a tandem bike. A month ago we were at a friends motorcycle ranch. Frustrated I just gave my son a bike and said here are the breaks on the handle bars squeeze them. He did. I then said if you squeeze them you will stop. And I'll be darned if that little rascal didn't jump on the seat of that bike, take off a billion miles and hour and stop on a dime when he wanted to. 

Long story short, I could have saved myself and him a lot of frustration had I just waited for his motor skills to catch up and focus on things he could do. If you dive into too many details you'll miss the big picture. I told the school to let me teach him to cook and dress they can teach Chemistry. I suck at math. 

Trina 

 

Report card grades mean very little.  they do not hold any weight in court.  they are seen as very subjective.  But if a parent matches the report card grades to the actual work, the they mean a little more.  but for example, in one school I visited as an advocate, the ARD committee said the report card grades were just to denote " participation " and that is why the kid got straight 100's.  But it gives the impression that this kid is pretty smart -- doesn't it.  They haven't even taught this child to read yet!!!

IEP progress report grades can only be valuable IF the parent saves ALL substantive work and matches the work to the IEP objectives and determines whether they match up.  I fear that there is  A LOT of fabircating progres going on with not only implementing IEP's as written but in reporting actual progress.  Parents have to be diligent.

Now, what do the courts look at -- and this is usually when a case gets past due process and into the district court and on up into the supreme court.  I am tired so I am not bothering to capitalize stuff.  The Supreme Court looks at where that child fell on the bell curve two years ago, one year ago, and where it falls on the bell curve today. That is how it determines progress.

If a child starts school and gets on FIE and that child falls in the third percentile that year, that's where he started.  Then the following year the parent can either request that standardized testing be done by then again or I think it is wiser to get outside testing at your own expense in alternate years.

So the parents have their child tested and now let's say the child is at the first percentile.  Wow, what happened in a year?  Well the child regressed.Let's say the child  stays at the third percentile  year after year when standardized testing is done, that is stagnation.

As far as the higher courts go, Standardized test scores rule the roost.  It also says something if the child didn't pass the state mandated tests, especially if they took say the TAKS M instead.  I won't even mention TAKS ALT becasue that test is a joke and  is usually given to kids who don't even meet the criterion of severe disability to be allowed to legally take it, but some school get away with giving it, and just about every kid who gets that one passes it with flying colors, so I wouldn't count that at all in considering progress and I doubt the courts would either.,

so when you get to the part of the IEP that says " Criterion for Mastery "   school districts will almost alwasy say " observation. "   What a joke!Here is the criterion for mastery:   A portfolio of ALL written work and tests.  Video and/ or audiotaped benchmark tests fro things that are not in a written, tangible form, and most importantly that progress will be determined by yearly standardized testing in the areas that are covered in the IEP.  Do not accept observation as a criterion for mastery, but for non-verbal kids or those who cannot write, you may accept it if there are discrete trial tracking sheets AND they do audio or videotaped benchmarks, and label and save those tapes and make them part of your paper trail.

As for the shoe laces, this is what you do.  Every time you pick your child up and find his laces untied, take a picture, and on the back mark the date.  Send a letter requesting they cover this skill in his IEP under life skills or self help skills.  If you find him with untied laces again, take a picture, date it.  Send a letter than says " second notice " or thirtieth notice.  State in your letter how having untied laces puts your child in danger of falling and being hurt. State how you ahve requeted several times that this be part of his IEP.  Now you have created a paper trail.  You could use video too -- preferably one that automatically ahs the date onthe screen when you repaly it at due process if it comes to that. 

[Guest guest]

Good advice, Trina.  Ethan did not learn to tie his shoes until we started home schooling, but he brought it up, so then I taught him when he was ready to learn it.  the same went for holding his breath under water and learning to swallow pills.  He showed the interest in learning these skills.  I only pushed a little by saying, " When you learn to swallow capsules you won't have to eat the mash anymore. "   it motivated him, but as with learning any new skill, there was a lot of whining and crying and frustration and me saying, " Yes, you can " to his mantra's of " I can't do it. "

It was the same for the three wheeled bicycle.  But within a couple of hours he was taring across the yard.  Now, when he mentions a two-wheeled bike, we will tackle that, and he still need sto learn to swim in the deep end of a pool and jump off the board because he saw other kids doing it and wrote me a note about it, " I want to copy like hte other kids, " it said, so I know he is ready and motivated to learn these skills this summer.  but the group city swim lessons aren't going to work this time (as we tried this last summer and they just didn't have the extra time he needs, so I will be looking for a private swim teacher.

Some things we have to teach even when they don't really want to learn them (like reading) but other skills we can let them guide us to when they are ready.  I never thought I would be able to get my son on a horse again once he got big enough to ride a big one, but now he loves and looks forward to going to hippotherapy, and he is doing really well with it.

Haven