Re: Tapering sleep meds

December 29, 2011

I understand your situtation. I have tapered off xanax a few times and

for me wasn't that bad. I just took it half as often and lowered the

dose until no more. I have learned that it's very helpful to research

any new med that I am prescribed before I take it, so I know what I'm

getting into. I absolutely can not tolerate anti-depressants. those

are the worst for me. I hope you feel better soon. I also have to

xanax to sleep and reduce my nerves. I just know now that I have to

take it , just like my blood pressure meds. Otherwise I can't sleep at

all. Good luck. I'm sure you'll be free, off the xanax in no time.

> I am attempting to come off years of using ambien and recent increase in

> xanax for sleep. I have found a site called the trap and they have lots of

> resources based on Dr Ashton from england. They are not quick to let one

> into the fold but have given some advice. They suggested crossing over to

> valium and then tapering down. Problem with that is my doc and I guess most

> docs in the US dont want to give you valium. It has a longer 1/2 life and

> supposedly has less withdrawal if you taper very slowly. Anyone have any

> knowledge about this. I had no idea when I started how " habit forming " and

> difficult to withdraw from the benzo's and Z(ambien, zolpidem) drugs were.

> I also did not know I was so dependent on them until I tried to quit. What I

> thought was reaction to not getting good sleep when I would try to stop them

> was really a chemical dependence. It certainly seems a crime to give someone

> that already has insomnia a pill with the side effects of increased

> insomnia. Sure it works for awhile, with terrible side effects of mental

> confusion, anxiety, digestive problems, but if you start taking more, you

> continually need more and you actually can get sick from not taking the

> increased amount.

>

> Bonnie

>

December 29, 2011

Hi Bonnie,My heart goes out to you, from personal experience. You are in a situation that millions around the world are in, and drs don't want to help. they never explained what the benzos and z drugs do. then when you try to get off, they are not willing to do whatever it takes to help you.

i was put on clonazepam for 3 1/2 yrs for sleep. in the fall of '10 i found out it would be hard to get off. i had been having mornings when i couldn't wake up until 11 a.m., then spent the entire day non functioning mentally and physically, almost incoherent. i thought it was the lyme and cos.

in late winter of '11 i started to slowly taper off just 1/2 mg.. on april 9th i again couldn't wake up. i was having a dream, a crazy, scary dream where my mind and insides were spiraling down, almost like imploding. it felt like i was dying. then i realized it was not a dream, but reality. i have a strong faith, and god stood beside me. i asked him if this was death, and he said yes. i have been so sick i was ready to go so i said ok, and he took my fear of dying away. this may sound crazy, but it happened.

i heard my daughter call, yet could not answer. my husband later came to check on me and by then i could talk. i told him i was dying. he did not believe me at first. then i started convulsions. i kept begging my family to let me go, but they fought to keep me here. i knew i was dying--one of the big symptoms of withdrawal. we had no idea what was happening to me.

i was slipping in between convulsions and catatonic states. prior to each convulsion, tingling and numbness would start at my extremities and worked their way until they engulfed my entire body. shaking would begin in my feet and move up until my entire body was convulsing. i also had nausea and chest pains. by the time the paramedics came it had escalated to seizures, flights of ideas, (crazy talk) catatonic states, switching back and forth. they listed me as a 'psych patient'.

in the ambulance i remember hearing the heart monitor slowing down and the par. med. calling me back and shaking me. i felt i was leaving, just going away. he later said i was having a hard time. i remember very little after that. i thought i was silently slipping in and out of consciousness, but later found out i was being very vocal and uncooperative. they could not figure out what it was and so labeled me with anxiety and pseudo seizures.

in the ambulance they had given me zofran for the nausea which unbeknowns to anyone eventually slowed the symptoms. dr explained the lab tests to my husband, said didn't know what was wrong with me and walked off. my daughter then remembered i had stopped the clonazepam 4 days before. they called my sister who googled clon. withdrawal symptoms (on the trap site) and it was a match!!

my husband brought me home and soon after (the zofran had worn off) the convulsions began again so he put some clon. under my tongue. it stopped the convulsions. we knew what it was for sure.

we worked with the trap site, the administer expecting my contact because of her posting with my sister. they helped get me stable, having to increase up to 1 mg. to do so. no withdrawal center in seattle would help me because they are afraid of the seizures from the benzos, so a hospital setting was the only place i could go. we have no insurance and they wanted $6k for a 5 day detox. everything we read said that was too fast. i tapered more slowly and you just read what happened. 5 days was too dangerous for me.

i talked with my fibro dr (who knew nothing of benzo dangers--though he last prescribed it to me) and he agreed to work from the ashton manual. it took almost 2 months to stablize and reduce the clon. while increasing the valium. the equivalent of 1 mg. clon was 20 mg. valium. i am now down to 4 1/2 mg. valium. but it has not been easy.

while trying to stabilize i went through a time of throwing things all over the living room, crazy like. i tried to take pills to kill myself. there were times i thought i was going crazy, often out of control, crying, talking crazy. it took months for the suicide feelings to leave. i had convulsions at the beginning of each taper from april until oct. my sleep decreases as the dose does. i feel increased anxiety. however, even though i continue to have withdrawal symptoms, i am now just feeling like i am finding the real me again.

i tell you this, and anyone who takes this stuff, for many people this is the result of these drugs and how it can take years of your life away. from the time i began it, i had weird symptoms that were blamed on the lyme. there is a lot of overlap of symptoms because of the toxicity of the drug. i began to not know who i was, withdrawn, irritable, unfeeling, and too many symptoms to list.

trap really helped me get through this. they screen their people and keep them in contact with only monitors and administrators to keep a close watch on you. i am not the only one who goes crazy like i did. after you've made about 10 posts, or they see you progressing, they will open the forum up to you. i was anxious to see what others talked about, i didn't want to jump through their hoops. but it was the best thing. they also screen carefully to protect the privacy of others who post.

i didn't realize how unstable i was going off this stuff. i was never left alone for months. many memories gone. maybe all the lyme and cos caused more problems for me. no one knows, but there are those without lyme that went through the withdrawal problems like i did. what i have experienced is embarrassing, humiliating, demoralizing, increased physical and mental problems and changed my life forever. it has been a terrible experience for my family.

one monitor didn't have trouble crossing over to valium, yet had a hard time tapering off valium. some have it easy, some don't. everyone is different, yet no one knows until you go through it. but if a drug is this difficult to get off, can cause my symptoms (and there are so many more i did not list that i had and more on the list that have been reported), this stuff is dangerous.

benzos were fda cleared for only short periods of time, as in days, and never consistent use. they are antiseizure meds, and then they found they made people sleepy, so they started to use it off label for sleep. they were not meant for sleep, but are used for that and cause addiction and dependency. and they change who you are. if you go off too fast you can have symptoms like i did and even die and you will run the risk of what they call protracted withdrawal symptoms which can last years after you are off it.

some can very slowly directly taper off without switching to valium, some cannot. i couldn't so it is taking me longer. even though i continued to have convulsions they were not seizures and much milder than the ones in april. another caution is that once you become addicted to these drugs you must be careful of any other sedative or addictive drug in the future. kind of like alcohol to the alcoholic.

you are wise to seek help to get off. copy the ashton manual and take it to your doctor. explain what you want to do and why. you can also copy any other info on the drug and take it. explain that the valium is the safer way to get off. you have 2 addicting drugs to withdraw from, harder and requires more careful withdrawal. they use valium to help alcoholics to detox also. if he won't help you when you show and explain the info, try another dr.. don't quit trying.

you can try a direct taper, there are a couple sites that use that protocol, but for me i knew it wouldn't work. it may for you. you can try it and if you start to have any serious symptoms, stop, maybe backup a bit, slow down the taper. you will have to stick to very small incremental reductions according to the protocol you choose. if you choose valium, you have to crossover to it as you reduce the others. maybe only one at a time??? when you start tapering off the valium, you can only taper 10% of your current dose every 2-3 wks. slow!!! but safer. do a little more research to make your decision on crossover and taper or direct taper. then follow the protocol that they have found works. don't change it.

please feel free to contact me directly or here in a post. i have no problem sharing where i've been and where i am now. i will help with anything i can.barbara