Re: Healing Diabetes . Info (copy)

[Guest guest]

hello List, what do you all think about this???/

fp

Healing Diabetes . Info (copy)

Hello everybody :

First of all , thank you .

It is great to have this kind of response .

Clearing up some things ;

we are not medicus , we don't joke about it , my English is bad , we

just want to help you , it may cost you some money but remember

this . You only live one's .

There are indeed medicen for people whit diabetes 2 ( and 1 ) .

There is a study , still going on , of more than 400 years in Thayland ,

by a monastery in the area of Muk Da Han .

They developed a medicen on natural basis ( herbs ) , whitout any kind of

side effects .

How did we fond out ?

My mother was looking at a medical t.v. program about diabetes .

There was a man on it , Ruud van wijk , also a dutchman ( we come also

from holland ) who was talking about the possibility's in Thayland

( van Wijk ex diabetes to ) . He lives in the neighbourhood of Muk Da Han .

Ruud van Wijk accompany's diabetic people on their medical trip that last

for 3 weeks .

He asked us to coördinate the people who wants to make the medical trip

and to make it know all over the world .

Here in Europe they are testing the medicen on monkey's and it still take

10-15 years before the medicen will come on the market .

Diabetes 1

Their pancreas didn't grow up , so they are limited .

But they sure can be helped .

It depends on ;

How long they are using insuline , when they are using insuline longer than

3 years . The monk's can bring the use of insuline back to tablets or a

minimem of insuline for 10 years .

0 - 3 years using of insuline . The monk's can delay the use of insuline

for 10 years . It all depends on their induvidual conditions .

This is all general information .

How it works ;

If you want to find out what the monastery can do for you , you have to fill

in

a quistionnaire ( we can send you one on your private mail ) , do this

correct . Send it back to us , so he monastery can give you your results .

We can let you know whitin 2 weeks .

You must be willing to go to Thayland for 3 weeks and consume now

alchoholics .

You can allways ask your quistions .

I know now that you now what you must do .

If the moderator of this list wants me to leave than this is my

last mail if not we have a lot of work to do .

We know that you make the best decision :

Jack en Anita Oostvogels .

[Guest guest]

At 07:52 PM 10/24/99 -0400,Footprints you wrote:

>hello List, what do you all think about this???/

It is look like a bots send that message.

[Guest guest]

whats a bots??

fp

Re: Healing Diabetes . Info (copy)

>

>

>At 07:52 PM 10/24/99 -0400,Footprints you wrote:

>>hello List, what do you all think about this???/

>

>It is look like a bots send that message.

>

>

[Guest guest]

> Oostvogels Jack en Anita wrote:

>

> Hello everybody :

> First of all , thank you .

> It is great to have this kind of response .

>

> Clearing up some things ;

> we are not medicus , we don't joke about it , my English is bad , we

> just want to help you , it may cost you some money but remember

> this . You only live one's .

>

> We know that you make the best decision :

> Jack en Anita Oostvogels .

>

Hey, " Jack en Anita "

Why don't you take this thinly vailed SPAM and shove it? I for one am calling

on the list moderator to ban you from our list. I personally will report your

SPAM to Onelist.com if I see you post any more CRAP! Vultures like you trying

to scam often desperate people with this kind of " hocus pocus " make me sick.

Please, , I think you have been more than tolerant with these miscreants,

it's time to flush the toilet.

[Guest guest]

I think she means an automated mailer or robot.

Meenie

Re: Healing Diabetes . Info (copy)

>

>

>At 07:52 PM 10/24/99 -0400,Footprints you wrote:

>>hello List, what do you all think about this???/

>

>It is look like a bots send that message.

>

>

[Guest guest]

- like Meenie I am on a lower carb/higher protein " diet " also. I have

been doing this for almost one year now and have my BG in control and have

lost around 88 pounds that had refused to come off for years!!!!! I love this

way of eating - Rebekah

[Guest guest]

Reabakah, what do you eat and how do you cook your meat and what veggies do

you eat.

Jean

[Guest guest]

I'm on Atkins Low carb, and I love it. My bg's are within normal

range (after being 180's and upward!!) and I have lost weight.

Meenie

Re: Healing Diabetes . Info (copy)

>From: Jeanbreaux@...

>

>Hi, what did she do to stop use medication for her diabetes. Has anyone

>tried the low carb or no carb diet with diabetes and did it work on them.

My

>doctor just started me on insulin after 23 yrs as a Type 2 on oral

>medication. Let me know what you think about this diet.

>Jean

>

>

[Guest guest]

At 11:26 AM 10/25/99 -0700, s you wrote:

>Why don't you take this thinly vailed SPAM and shove it? I for one am calling

>on the list moderator to ban you from our list. I personally will report your

>SPAM to Onelist.com if I see you post any more CRAP! Vultures like you trying

>to scam often desperate people with this kind of " hocus pocus " make me sick.

>Please, , I think you have been more than tolerant with these miscreants,

>it's time to flush the toilet.

I am with you .

[Guest guest]

Hello or Meenie ,

Jack en Anita .

Is this the way to exchange information ??

Does he know what he is doing to response this way ??

He just sounds like our doctor , when we would have taking

his advise she still was a Diabetes . He makes money with it

we don't . When wants to stay sick lett him .

Do you know that their are no diabetes 2 in Thayland .

Do you know that their are about 200 people cured in Holland .

Send by

Jack en Anita

Re: Healing Diabetes . Info (copy)

>

> Hey, " Jack en Anita "

> Why don't you take this thinly vailed SPAM and shove it? I for one am

calling

> on the list moderator to ban you from our list. I personally will report

your

> SPAM to Onelist.com if I see you post any more CRAP! Vultures like you

trying

> to scam often desperate people with this kind of " hocus pocus " make me

sick.

> Please, , I think you have been more than tolerant with these

miscreants,

> it's time to flush the toilet.

>

>

[Guest guest]

PLEASE. Language like this is NOT necessary!!! Regardless of how you feel

about someone's post, stooping to their level is NOT the way to express your

feelings. Call me easily offended if you wish, but having to explain to my

4-year old as he sits on my lap watching me read email why " that word " was

on the screen was NOT pleasant. Take it to private email.

K.

[Guest guest]

Sorry folks, our moderator is away for a few days and I only have the

capability to respond to these feelings (which I will do below), not to bar

anyone from the list. Please bear with us!

Jack en Anita: What you are posting appears to be spam -One definition of

spam is an unwanted advertisement in an effort to sell junk to people who

are vulnerable. People with any disorder are certainly vulnerable to scams.

No one wants to have this problem.

Most of us here have worked long and hard getting our diabetes under

control. We have learned reams about this problem and we know it doesn't

just disappear.

ie: we aren't stupid.

, I agree with your sentiment but please say it in a way that won't

offend our other list members. Or send them a private email which is what I

intend to do right now. Thanks so much for your help.

Meenie

[Guest guest]

What word was that?? I didn't see anything other than Crap.

fp

Re: Healing Diabetes . Info (copy)

>

>

>PLEASE. Language like this is NOT necessary!!! Regardless of how you feel

>about someone's post, stooping to their level is NOT the way to express

your

>feelings. Call me easily offended if you wish, but having to explain to my

>4-year old as he sits on my lap watching me read email why " that word " was

>on the screen was NOT pleasant. Take it to private email.

>

> K.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Can we drop this subject please????

K.

Re: Healing Diabetes . Info (copy)

>

>

>>

>>

>>PLEASE. Language like this is NOT necessary!!! Regardless of how you feel

>>about someone's post, stooping to their level is NOT the way to express

>your

>>feelings. Call me easily offended if you wish, but having to explain to my

>>4-year old as he sits on my lap watching me read email why " that word " was

>>on the screen was NOT pleasant. Take it to private email.

>>

>> K.

>>

>>

>

>>

[Guest guest]

Athan and Kramer wrote:

>

>

>

> Can we drop this subject please????

>

Although I'm not sure what word in my original post you found unacceptable, my

intentions do not include putting you in an uncomfortable situation with your

four year old. As for my strongly worded condemnation of these unscrupulous

hucksters, again, the only people I hope to offend are " Oostvogels Jack en

Anita " .

I am also not sure what you mean by " Can we drop this subject please???? " . If

you want to end the discourse over what constitutes an offensive word I would be

more than happy too oblige. On the other hand, if you are asking me to stop

attacking these spaming charlatans I must respectfully decline.

As for my " stooping to their level " I do not believe my strongly worded

objections can in any way be compared to their dishonest crap. I have rarely

found it effective to ignore the attacks of the immoral in hopes that they would

go away. Let's make this place a safe place for people to find information and

support at a difficult time in their life. Let's not let profiteers like " Jack

en Anita " muddy the waters.

Many people experience a fair amount of anxiety when first diagnosed with Type

2 Diabetes. It is often difficult to find good information about the path back

to wellness. Even well intentioned doctors are not always up to date on the

verity of effective methods of coping with this condition. What most of us do

know from the start is that we face some serious problems; nerve damage, loss of

limbs, blindness, heart attack, stroke, etc.

The work and discipline required to deal effectively with diabetes can seem

overwhelming at first. It's no wonder any of us yearn for a permanent solution,

a magic pill that will make everything like it was before. Unfortunately their

is no " magic pill " , no four hundred year old cure from the " mystic east " . What

really boils my blood about these parasites is not the obviously immoral

economic rip off they are trying to perpetrate, but rather their invasion of

this place where people have come for information and SUPPORT.

I think the solution is clear. " Oostvogels Jack en Anita " have clearly

violated the Onelist policy on Spam, they should be warned once and then banned

from the list if they continue. Most of us are of course not fooled by these

connivers, but what about someone new to the list looking for the " cure " to

their grandmothers newly diagnosed diabetes? I think we owe it to the more

vulnerable among us to keep this place safe, and to offer positive support until

they can get their feet back on the ground. I believe we are well within our

rights, indeed we have an obligation, to keep profiteering witch doctors like

this off the list.

P.S. While I understand that this kind of confrontation can be uncomfortable

(it leaves a slightly unpleasant feeling in my stomach as well), I think it is

unfortunately necessary at times. Again my intentions are not to upset any of

the other list members, but to confront these snake oil dealers.

Best regards,

[Guest guest]

Oostvogels Jack en Anita wrote:

>

>

>

> Hello or Meenie ,

> Jack en Anita .

> Is this the way to exchange information ??

You are not providing information. You are trying to take advantage of

vulnerable people.

> Does he know what he is doing to response this way ??

Hey, Jack en Anita, you want to say something to me, say it directly. And yes,

I know exactly what I am doing.

> He just sounds like our doctor , when we would have taking

> his advise she still was a Diabetes . He makes money with it

> we don't .

The only people here trying to make any money would be you two quacks.

> When wants to stay sick lett him .

As for " staying sick " , with the help of other diabetics (many on this list),

competent health care workers and my own willingness to change my lifestyle, my

BG's are under tight control.

> Do you know that their are no diabetes 2 in Thayland .

Bull

> Do you know that their are about 200 people cured in Holland .

More lies, let's see the proof, scientific proof.

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

FYI the " Can we drop this subject... " was from to another poster who

asked what the offensive word was

I agree with you about not letting people prey on us here and

protecting the group. My only concern is that perhaps Jack en Anita have

been scammed themselves and/or really think this info they have is

real/true. The only reason I haven't spoken much harder to them is that

they haven't asked for any money for their " information " . Have they asked

anyone privately for money in exchange for information, or anything else?

As I said before, I don't have the ability to bar anyone from this list,

that will have to be up to whenever she gets back. In the meantime I

would caution anyone here to remember that if it sounds too good to be true,

it probably is.

Thanks to you all for your patience

Meenie

Re: Healing Diabetes . Info (copy)

>

>

>Athan and Kramer wrote:

>>

>>

>>

>> Can we drop this subject please????

>>

>

> Although I'm not sure what word in my original post you found

unacceptable, my

>intentions do not include putting you in an uncomfortable situation with

your

>four year old. As for my strongly worded condemnation of these

unscrupulous

>hucksters, again, the only people I hope to offend are " Oostvogels Jack en

>Anita " .

> I am also not sure what you mean by " Can we drop this subject please???? " .

If

>you want to end the discourse over what constitutes an offensive word I

would be

>more than happy too oblige. On the other hand, if you are asking me to

stop

>attacking these spaming charlatans I must respectfully decline.

> As for my " stooping to their level " I do not believe my strongly worded

>objections can in any way be compared to their dishonest crap. I have

rarely

>found it effective to ignore the attacks of the immoral in hopes that they

would

>go away. Let's make this place a safe place for people to find information

and

>support at a difficult time in their life. Let's not let profiteers like

" Jack

>en Anita " muddy the waters.

> Many people experience a fair amount of anxiety when first diagnosed with

Type

>2 Diabetes. It is often difficult to find good information about the path

back

>to wellness. Even well intentioned doctors are not always up to date on

the

>verity of effective methods of coping with this condition. What most of us

do

>know from the start is that we face some serious problems; nerve damage,

loss of

>limbs, blindness, heart attack, stroke, etc.

> The work and discipline required to deal effectively with diabetes can

seem

>overwhelming at first. It's no wonder any of us yearn for a permanent

solution,

>a magic pill that will make everything like it was before. Unfortunately

their

>is no " magic pill " , no four hundred year old cure from the " mystic east " .

What

>really boils my blood about these parasites is not the obviously immoral

>economic rip off they are trying to perpetrate, but rather their invasion

of

>this place where people have come for information and SUPPORT.

> I think the solution is clear. " Oostvogels Jack en Anita " have clearly

>violated the Onelist policy on Spam, they should be warned once and then

banned

>from the list if they continue. Most of us are of course not fooled by

these

>connivers, but what about someone new to the list looking for the " cure " to

>their grandmothers newly diagnosed diabetes? I think we owe it to the more

>vulnerable among us to keep this place safe, and to offer positive support

until

>they can get their feet back on the ground. I believe we are well within

our

>rights, indeed we have an obligation, to keep profiteering witch doctors

like

>this off the list.

>

>

> P.S. While I understand that this kind of confrontation can be

uncomfortable

>(it leaves a slightly unpleasant feeling in my stomach as well), I think it

is

>unfortunately necessary at times. Again my intentions are not to upset any

of

>the other list members, but to confront these snake oil dealers.

>

> Best regards,

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

, I don't necessarily disagree with ya, BUT,

what have these people to gain from this hoax if that is what it is??

fp

Re: Healing Diabetes . Info (copy)

>

>

>Athan and Kramer wrote:

>>

>>

>>

>> Can we drop this subject please????

>>

>

> Although I'm not sure what word in my original post you found

unacceptable, my

>intentions do not include putting you in an uncomfortable situation with

your

>four year old. As for my strongly worded condemnation of these

unscrupulous

>hucksters, again, the only people I hope to offend are " Oostvogels Jack en

>Anita " .

> I am also not sure what you mean by " Can we drop this subject please???? " .

If

>you want to end the discourse over what constitutes an offensive word I

would be

>more than happy too oblige. On the other hand, if you are asking me to

stop

>attacking these spaming charlatans I must respectfully decline.

> As for my " stooping to their level " I do not believe my strongly worded

>objections can in any way be compared to their dishonest crap. I have

rarely

>found it effective to ignore the attacks of the immoral in hopes that they

would

>go away. Let's make this place a safe place for people to find information

and

>support at a difficult time in their life. Let's not let profiteers like

" Jack

>en Anita " muddy the waters.

> Many people experience a fair amount of anxiety when first diagnosed with

Type

>2 Diabetes. It is often difficult to find good information about the path

back

>to wellness. Even well intentioned doctors are not always up to date on

the

>verity of effective methods of coping with this condition. What most of us

do

>know from the start is that we face some serious problems; nerve damage,

loss of

>limbs, blindness, heart attack, stroke, etc.

> The work and discipline required to deal effectively with diabetes can

seem

>overwhelming at first. It's no wonder any of us yearn for a permanent

solution,

>a magic pill that will make everything like it was before. Unfortunately

their

>is no " magic pill " , no four hundred year old cure from the " mystic east " .

What

>really boils my blood about these parasites is not the obviously immoral

>economic rip off they are trying to perpetrate, but rather their invasion

of

>this place where people have come for information and SUPPORT.

> I think the solution is clear. " Oostvogels Jack en Anita " have clearly

>violated the Onelist policy on Spam, they should be warned once and then

banned

>from the list if they continue. Most of us are of course not fooled by

these

>connivers, but what about someone new to the list looking for the " cure " to

>their grandmothers newly diagnosed diabetes? I think we owe it to the more

>vulnerable among us to keep this place safe, and to offer positive support

until

>they can get their feet back on the ground. I believe we are well within

our

>rights, indeed we have an obligation, to keep profiteering witch doctors

like

>this off the list.

>

>

> P.S. While I understand that this kind of confrontation can be

uncomfortable

>(it leaves a slightly unpleasant feeling in my stomach as well), I think it

is

>unfortunately necessary at times. Again my intentions are not to upset any

of

>the other list members, but to confront these snake oil dealers.

>

> Best regards,

>

>

>>

[Guest guest]

Footprints wrote:

>

>

>

> , I don't necessarily disagree with ya, BUT,

> what have these people to gain from this hoax if that is what it is??

> fp

Actually, this is not a " hoax " , nor is it a very new scam. It has been

practiced on cancer patients and their families for decades. The profit is made

by buying relatively cheap " Junkets " and reselling them at inflated rates to

people who are to emotionally invested to question prices. Often the most

desperate, thus the most vulnerable, are hit up for late minute fee increases:

" I'm sorry our cheap accommodation have fallen through, if you don't want to

loss the cost of your non refundable plane tickets we will have to book more

expensive accommodations. " Or: " Oh, we didn't know you were bringing your

husband. We can get you on board but it will cost you more because it is last

minute. We are sorry about the mix up, but it is too late to do anything else

about it. " Once again the wife's ticket and travel cost would be non

refundable. The idea is to " squeeze " people while they are under emotional

stress and less able to make sound decisions. I will not go on and on about how

this kind of travel scam works, suffice it to say an imaginative and

unscrupulous person will find many ways to fleece someone trapped in a foreign

land expecting to have everything already taken care of.

[Guest guest]

Meenie wrote:

>

>

>

> Hi ,

> FYI the " Can we drop this subject... " was from to another poster who

> asked what the offensive word was

> I agree with you about not letting people prey on us here and

> protecting the group. My only concern is that perhaps Jack en Anita have

> been scammed themselves and/or really think this info they have is

> real/true.

I considered this possibility myself, but then why be so circumspect about

where to get this " great wisdom from the East " ? When a list member asked what

cost where involved " J en A " neatly avoided a direct response by replying in

this manor:

" Clearing up some things ; we are not medicus , we don't joke about it , my

English is bad , we just want to help you , it may cost you some money but

remember this . You only live one's . "

On many occasions list members have been asked about the cost of something they

use to help with their diabetes. Most respond to the best of their knowledge,

without fear that they will be accused of spaming, because they are not going to

make a profit from the information or product they have brought forward.

> The only reason I haven't spoken much harder to them is that

> they haven't asked for any money for their " information " . Have they asked

> anyone privately for money in exchange for information, or anything else?

The lack of specific information is one of the things that makes me think they

are victimizers, not victims. By dangling the bait here in this public forum

without technically offering a product for a price they hope to avoid anti

spaming policy. Once their target is lured to private e-mail they ratchet up

their hopes and then spring the cost of the cure on them when the " fish " is

securely hooked. " You only live one's "

> As I said before, I don't have the ability to bar anyone from this list,

> that will have to be up to whenever she gets back. In the meantime I

> would caution anyone here to remember that if it sounds too good to be true,

> it probably is.

This is great advice Meenie. I would also add: " Beware of people who hide in

dark places " . " J en A " have asked that anyone interested contact them off the

list. Why not share this great discovery with everyone out in the open? Why do

they need to deal with people away from the scrutiny of this knowledgeable

public forum? I know of a few other things that scurry away when you turn the

lights on.

> Thanks to you all for your patience

> Meenie

Best regards,

[Guest guest]

OIC.....

fp

Re: Healing Diabetes . Info (copy)

>

>

>Footprints wrote:

>>

>>

>>

>> , I don't necessarily disagree with ya, BUT,

>> what have these people to gain from this hoax if that is what it is??

>> fp

>

>

> Actually, this is not a " hoax " , nor is it a very new scam. It has been

>practiced on cancer patients and their families for decades. The profit is

made

>by buying relatively cheap " Junkets " and reselling them at inflated rates

to

>people who are to emotionally invested to question prices. Often the most

>desperate, thus the most vulnerable, are hit up for late minute fee

increases:

> " I'm sorry our cheap accommodation have fallen through, if you don't want

to

>loss the cost of your non refundable plane tickets we will have to book

more

>expensive accommodations. " Or: " Oh, we didn't know you were bringing your

>husband. We can get you on board but it will cost you more because it is

last

>minute. We are sorry about the mix up, but it is too late to do anything

else

>about it. " Once again the wife's ticket and travel cost would be non

>refundable. The idea is to " squeeze " people while they are under emotional

>stress and less able to make sound decisions. I will not go on and on

about how

>this kind of travel scam works, suffice it to say an imaginative and

>unscrupulous person will find many ways to fleece someone trapped in a

foreign

>land expecting to have everything already taken care of.

>

>

[Guest guest]

If Jack and Anita have real information why not just come out and share

it? That is what real people would do to help another person

suffering!! I am tired of the debate. If you do know then share it or

please quit trying to sell something! Lynn

Lynn Baker

Owner Diabetes-Book-Disc List

http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/Diabetes-Book-Disc

[Guest guest]

All quite true and well put, .

I hope anyone who is tempted by this is taking note of these conversations

and will act with caution.

Meenie

Re: Healing Diabetes . Info (copy)

>

>

>Meenie wrote:

>>

>>

>>

>> Hi ,

>> FYI the " Can we drop this subject... " was from to another poster

who

>> asked what the offensive word was

>> I agree with you about not letting people prey on us here and

>> protecting the group. My only concern is that perhaps Jack en Anita have

>> been scammed themselves and/or really think this info they have is

>> real/true.

>

> I considered this possibility myself, but then why be so circumspect about

>where to get this " great wisdom from the East " ? When a list member asked

what

>cost where involved " J en A " neatly avoided a direct response by replying

in

>this manor:

>

> " Clearing up some things ; we are not medicus , we don't joke about it ,

my

>English is bad , we just want to help you , it may cost you some money but

>remember this . You only live one's . "

>

>

> On many occasions list members have been asked about the cost of something

they

>use to help with their diabetes. Most respond to the best of their

knowledge,

>without fear that they will be accused of spaming, because they are not

going to

>make a profit from the information or product they have brought forward.

>

>> The only reason I haven't spoken much harder to them is that

>> they haven't asked for any money for their " information " . Have they

asked

>> anyone privately for money in exchange for information, or anything else?

>

> The lack of specific information is one of the things that makes me think

they

>are victimizers, not victims. By dangling the bait here in this public

forum

>without technically offering a product for a price they hope to avoid anti

>spaming policy. Once their target is lured to private e-mail they ratchet

up

>their hopes and then spring the cost of the cure on them when the " fish " is

>securely hooked. " You only live one's "

>

>> As I said before, I don't have the ability to bar anyone from this list,

>> that will have to be up to whenever she gets back. In the meantime

I

>> would caution anyone here to remember that if it sounds too good to be

true,

>> it probably is.

>

> This is great advice Meenie. I would also add: " Beware of people who hide

in

>dark places " . " J en A " have asked that anyone interested contact them off

the

>list. Why not share this great discovery with everyone out in the open?

Why do

>they need to deal with people away from the scrutiny of this knowledgeable

>public forum? I know of a few other things that scurry away when you turn

the

>lights on.

>

>> Thanks to you all for your patience

>> Meenie

> Best regards,

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Greetings......List Dwellers......

I think has a fairly good handle on how the 'cure' works, you would

find that little would be as presented or promised.

If its too good to be true, it isn't.

Tom Terrific

[Guest guest]

Way to go, Meenie!

At 08:23 AM 11/1/99 -0500, you wrote:

>

>

>Sorry folks, our moderator is away for a few days and I only have the

>capability to respond to these feelings (which I will do below), not to bar

>anyone from the list. Please bear with us!

>Jack en Anita: What you are posting appears to be spam -One definition of

>spam is an unwanted advertisement in an effort to sell junk to people who

>are vulnerable. People with any disorder are certainly vulnerable to scams.

>No one wants to have this problem.

>Most of us here have worked long and hard getting our diabetes under

>control. We have learned reams about this problem and we know it doesn't

>just disappear.

>ie: we aren't stupid.

>

>, I agree with your sentiment but please say it in a way that won't

>offend our other list members. Or send them a private email which is what I

>intend to do right now. Thanks so much for your help.

> Meenie

>

>>