Re: latest news in the break from nada

[Guest guest]

a,

I don't think it's deluded of you. We love who we love, and that's that.

Now, not speaking from experience (because my dad and stepdad were

more the rager types themselves, very narcissistic etc not dishrags),

but I've heard time and again from KOs that they " love dishrag but...

[he allowed the abuse etc] " . And over time, some people decide that

they are angry at dishrag, and done with him, too.

Especially because when the chips are down, dishrag continues to

choose the abusive partner over even his own kids.

No one's " right " or " wrong " about that, though. It's whatever works

for you. I hope things work for you how you would like!

Janie

[Guest guest]

Whoa, within 10 mins of sending my response I got back two more

emails from dishrag:

a,

This has nothing to do with my birthday. Your mother said

not to call you that weekend, she said that you had already given

your answer. It was my idea to try to negotiate with you, and my

mistake.

Your mother and I just want to reestablish normal relations

so that we can see you and Joe and Cirdan on occasion. Last weekend

you mother stayed in bed almost the whole weekend with her pains.

She is having surgery this Friday on her bursa in her hips so we are

not available this weekend either.

Please don't take my over reaching as a reason to cut us

off. I will be happy to abide by your rules for contacts with your

family.

Love, Dad

and

a,

I would like to stop by your work tomorrow and drop off some

things for Cirdan. Would that be alright or would you rahter wait

until next week when your mother is better and we could both stop by?

D.O.D.

....

I think he's afraid because he knows that if goes back to nada with

my response she's going to blame him too.

Should I tell him that his trying to negotiate with me to come to an

event with my BP sis has nothing to do with my decision to cut off

from Nada? He doesn't know the BPD diagnosis or all the stuff I've

been working on these past 2.5 weeks.

Am I spinning here too? Should I just remain firm to NC?

a

>

> My dad tried calling me again today and left a msg at work to call

him

> and one on my cell saying that " we're going to be in the

neighborhood

> furniture shopping and would like to drop off the gift for Cirdan. "

>

> Two hours later he sent me an email at work (!) that

said...Subject:

> Call Me - Don't be afraid you can call me....

>

> So I sent back an email to him from my personal email to his work

> email saying simply:

>

> I'm done with the cycles of abuse. Love, a

>

> ...

>

> I so hope I can keep some relationship with him after nada and BP

sis

> realize I'm not there anymore as a punching bag. Despite the fact

> that he allowed the emotional/verbal abuse to happen or didn't

have

> the skills to stop it, I still love him. Is that deluded of me?

>

[Guest guest]

Wow, a -- that first email you sent was GREAT, and certainly said it all!

I'd hold to the tone of the first one and send back a brief reply re-stating

your decision and ending all discussion with that. (Remember " no " is a complete

sentence!) Your dad sure knows what buttons to press, though -- he managed to

throw in concern for seeing your kids and nada's upcoming surgery, while taking

great pains at sounding reasonable and sane and completely ignoring your

mentioning " abuse " !

My advice would be to just say whatever you need to say to prevent any unwanted

visits or drop-ins in the future and leave it at that. I wouldn't bring up the

BP or your sister -- it sounds like, the more you engage or try to explain what

you're doing or why, the more you might invite further communications.

Anyhow, I'm sure you'll get more feedback from those here who have actually gone

NC -- my thoughts are with you, though. Great job and stay strong!

Shana

> > Call Me - Don't be afraid you can call me....

> >

> > So I sent back an email to him from my personal email to his

> work

> > email saying simply:

> >

> > I'm done with the cycles of abuse. Love, a

> >

> > ...

> >

> > I so hope I can keep some relationship with him after nada and

> BP

> sis

> > realize I'm not there anymore as a punching bag. Despite the

> fact

> > that he allowed the emotional/verbal abuse to happen or didn't

> have

> > the skills to stop it, I still love him. Is that deluded of me?

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

a,

Party On.

baast2play wrote:

My dad tried calling me again today and left a msg at work to call him

and one on my cell saying that " we're going to be in the neighborhood

furniture shopping and would like to drop off the gift for Cirdan. "

Two hours later he sent me an email at work (!) that said...Subject:

Call Me - Don't be afraid you can call me....

So I sent back an email to him from my personal email to his work

email saying simply:

I'm done with the cycles of abuse. Love, a

....

I so hope I can keep some relationship with him after nada and BP sis

realize I'm not there anymore as a punching bag. Despite the fact

that he allowed the emotional/verbal abuse to happen or didn't have

the skills to stop it, I still love him. Is that deluded of me?

---------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

Janie,

I see a definite right and wrong when it comes to dishrags or anyone who

forsakes their child to abuse instead of protecting them from the abuse or even

taking the abuse so the kid doesn't have to. They are just as sick as the BPD.

Greg.

j_psmythe wrote:

a,

I don't think it's deluded of you. We love who we love, and that's that.

Now, not speaking from experience (because my dad and stepdad were

more the rager types themselves, very narcissistic etc not dishrags),

but I've heard time and again from KOs that they " love dishrag but...

[he allowed the abuse etc] " . And over time, some people decide that

they are angry at dishrag, and done with him, too.

Especially because when the chips are down, dishrag continues to

choose the abusive partner over even his own kids.

No one's " right " or " wrong " about that, though. It's whatever works

for you. I hope things work for you how you would like!

Janie

---------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

Greg,

I'm talking about right and wrong of a KO loving a dishrag or not.

(See the PS) Not right or wrong in the dishrag's behavior.

Janie

In WTOAdultChildren1 , G wrote:

>

> Janie,

>

> I see a definite right and wrong when it comes to dishrags or

anyone who forsakes their child to abuse instead of protecting them

from the abuse or even taking the abuse so the kid doesn't have to.

They are just as sick as the BPD.

>

> Greg.

>

> j_psmythe wrote:

> a,

> I don't think it's deluded of you. We love who we love, and that's

that.

>

> Now, not speaking from experience (because my dad and stepdad were

> more the rager types themselves, very narcissistic etc not dishrags),

> but I've heard time and again from KOs that they " love dishrag but...

> [he allowed the abuse etc] " . And over time, some people decide that

> they are angry at dishrag, and done with him, too.

>

> Especially because when the chips are down, dishrag continues to

> choose the abusive partner over even his own kids.

>

> No one's " right " or " wrong " about that, though. It's whatever works

> for you. I hope things work for you how you would like!

>

> Janie

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

> Get your email and more, right on the new Yahoo.com

>

>

[Guest guest]

Technical Time-Out --

Is " dishrag " dad used for the non-BPD spouse who cleans up the

messes of the BPD?

Didn't find it in my initial abbreviation e-mail from Yahoo....

-Kyla

> > a,

> > I don't think it's deluded of you. We love who we love, and

that's

> that.

> >

> > Now, not speaking from experience (because my dad and stepdad

were

> > more the rager types themselves, very narcissistic etc not

dishrags),

> > but I've heard time and again from KOs that they " love dishrag

but...

> > [he allowed the abuse etc] " . And over time, some people decide

that

> > they are angry at dishrag, and done with him, too.

> >

> > Especially because when the chips are down, dishrag continues to

> > choose the abusive partner over even his own kids.

> >

> > No one's " right " or " wrong " about that, though. It's whatever

works

> > for you. I hope things work for you how you would like!

> >

> > Janie

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ---------------------------------

> > Get your email and more, right on the new Yahoo.com

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Greg-

I would have to disagree. Emotions aren't things you can control,

and love is an emotion. I think the only right or wrong involved in

loving someone is in whether or not your love for someone is the

excuse you (or they) use to continue hurting you. Even after all

she's put me through, I still love my nada, I've just decided that

she's toxic to me and is incapable of reciprocating that love in a

way I find acceptable. That's my right choice. Loving her or not

loving her isn't.

Neko Jaimie

>

> Janie,

>

> I see a definite right and wrong when it comes to dishrags or

anyone who forsakes their child to abuse instead of protecting them

from the abuse or even taking the abuse so the kid doesn't have to.

They are just as sick as the BPD.

>

> Greg.

>

[Guest guest]

I kind of agree with a little of each thing that was said. But I

defiantly agree 110% with Greg the dishrags are just as sick as the

BPD parent! I think Greg was right on in what he said. In my mind

there is no question there. The hard part for me is that because my

dishrag was not always directly involved in the abuse and as a

matter of fact he often never even knew what was happening I find

it hard to stay mad. Often my nada would rack up the cc dishrag

would have to work extra hard hours just to pay the cc off and all

the bills. So he was never home sometimes working out of town for

weeks and had no clue that nada wasn't there. He thought she was at

home when in fact she was at the bars w/ her boyfriends. The part

that makes me mad at him now is that NOW when I try and confront him

on the abuse to him it is water under the bridge. Those are the

times that I get mad. However he is not pressuring me to have a

relationship w/ nada so whatever. I can separate the 2 of them so

long as we don't speak of her. I sometimes think Well nada has an

excuse she is mentally ill. I can't technically be mad at her,

despite all she did I can't respect trust or honor her but I do have

love for her. I would never give her my kidney I would just say

goodbye you have caused enough pain, but I still wish she was well

mentally. As for my dishrag it is harder for me to forgive him

because I feel like he has no excuse he has no reason, So even

though he is not technically mentally ill in my opinion which is by

no means professional I think the dishrags have to be mentally ill

or something. Or they have to be so battered and abused they see no

other way. But I do find my dishrag harder to forgive but easier to

love, and nada harder to love but easier to forgive. Does this make

sense? I think love and forgiveness these are all complicated

matters when it comes to the dishrags and the BPDs. It is all so

touchy and I also think each child suffered a different form of

abuse from each parent so regardless of how much the nadas are alike

no 2 situations are the same. We are all unique and we all have

different degrees of love and hate when it comes to our foo.

Personally I would be glad if my whole foo fell off the face of the

planet today. But if they became well I would be happy for them to.

I can't say I would want them in my life but I would be happy for

them (maybe?) maybe not they caused so much pain I don't know if

they deserve it. Like I said we are all unique. Love Lizzy

> >

> > Janie,

> >

> > I see a definite right and wrong when it comes to dishrags or

> anyone who forsakes their child to abuse instead of protecting

them

> from the abuse or even taking the abuse so the kid doesn't have

to.

> They are just as sick as the BPD.

> >

> > Greg.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Janie,

I agree with you about not being able to chose our feelings. We can chose our

thoughts and behaviors, regardless of our feelings, much like you described. As

we discussed and our posts passed each other, I was referring to behavior of not

protecting a child, especially the dishrag.

I will add that at this point in having no contact with my mother, I really

feel nothing towards her. I don't love her, like her, hate her, anything. I

feel the same about her as I do with the three friends that I've known for life

and said good-bye to. The funny thing was that I used to stay in my head to

figure things out and then acknowledge the feeling(s). " Why " can be a powerful

tool to not look at what needs to be looked at. This is coming from my heart

now and I feel free!!

Greg.

neko_jaimie wrote:

Greg-

I would have to disagree. Emotions aren't things you can control,

and love is an emotion. I think the only right or wrong involved in

loving someone is in whether or not your love for someone is the

excuse you (or they) use to continue hurting you. Even after all

she's put me through, I still love my nada, I've just decided that

she's toxic to me and is incapable of reciprocating that love in a

way I find acceptable. That's my right choice. Loving her or not

loving her isn't.

Neko Jaimie

>

> Janie,

>

> I see a definite right and wrong when it comes to dishrags or

anyone who forsakes their child to abuse instead of protecting them

from the abuse or even taking the abuse so the kid doesn't have to.

They are just as sick as the BPD.

>

> Greg.

>

---------------------------------

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Business.

[Guest guest]

a, it's good that your dad wants to respect your boundaries.

Maybe you could just send him a quick note--expressing that you want

to have a relationship with him eventually, but can't be around your

nada(perhaps indefinitely) because of the abuse you already mentioned.

You may consider telling him that you still love him since that's

obviously on your mind. It's still ok to need a break from the entire

foo(including your dad) while you sort things out though, whether you

want a relationship eventually or not.

Also, try not to worry too much about your dad " getting in trouble " or

taking the blame for your lack of relationship with your nada. He has

to play a role in that dynamic for your nada to keep up blaming him

for her problems. It's not your job to get her to stop blaming him or

to get him to stop accepting abuse.

Trish

> >

> > My dad tried calling me again today and left a msg at work to call

> him

> > and one on my cell saying that " we're going to be in the

> neighborhood

> > furniture shopping and would like to drop off the gift for Cirdan. "

> >

> > Two hours later he sent me an email at work (!) that

> said...Subject:

> > Call Me - Don't be afraid you can call me....

> >

> > So I sent back an email to him from my personal email to his work

> > email saying simply:

> >

> > I'm done with the cycles of abuse. Love, a

> >

> > ...

> >

> > I so hope I can keep some relationship with him after nada and BP

> sis

> > realize I'm not there anymore as a punching bag. Despite the fact

> > that he allowed the emotional/verbal abuse to happen or didn't

> have

> > the skills to stop it, I still love him. Is that deluded of me?

> >

>