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I agree this is a TEST LOL

SHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

---Donn & Marilyn wrote:

>

> Its too quiet. This is a test

>

>

> ______________________________________________________________________

>

>

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It is always quiet with this group on the weekends... guess everyone is either

tired or at a party?

Margaret

EMS wanna be

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Well, let me start a little discussion. Are there any departments or services

on this list that do not obtain a signature from a nurse/doctor upon

transferring patient, and/or

are there any departments or services that do not leave a report at the

hospital?

Ricky Black, Battalion Commander

Southlake Fire Services

______________________________________________________________________

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In a message dated 98-10-03 21:04:20 EDT, you write:

<< Well, let me start a little discussion. Are there any departments or

services

on this list that do not obtain a signature from a nurse/doctor upon

transferring patient, and/or

are there any departments or services that do not leave a report at the

hospital?

Ricky Black, Battalion Commander

Southlake Fire Services_ >>

DFW Airport does both of the above!

, BS, EMT/P

DFW Airport DPS

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Please explain your answer Pam. I'm interested as to why you make this

comment.

Ricky Black, Battalion Commander

Southlake Fire Services

______________________________________________________________________

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Hi Ricky! (and others)

I wish to comment about your last question-- that is, to leave-- or not to

leave-- your report at the ED after delivery...

I have been told by my superiors in the past that it is unlawful for you to

leave a pt in the ED without your report following (I have been told that

there is a, by law, 24 hour grace period before the report needs to be

accessible in the patients hospital chart). As we all know, what we do makes

a difference. And the docs and nurses rightfully need to know why and what

we did for Mr. as soon as the question arises. Also, of course, this

is a legal document and once instituted, shows what you did and DIDN'T do

for your patient!

Does anyone know if what I have stated is actually true-- I did not question

it because those were the rules of the company I worked for-- who the heck

am I to make a stink over a good " rule " anyway?

Brad Woodall

[] Re: quiet

>Well, let me start a little discussion. Are there any departments or

services

>on this list that do not obtain a signature from a nurse/doctor upon

>transferring patient, and/or

>are there any departments or services that do not leave a report at the

>hospital?

>

>Ricky Black, Battalion Commander

>Southlake Fire Services

>

>______________________________________________________________________

>

>

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Hey Brad,

Thanks for the response. I am not familiar with this law so Gene, it's your

turn. I posed this question initially because we conducting our patient

reports via computer. Pen based is not up to scale yet, therefore, paramedics

were having to complete a written report, have the nurse sign it and return to

quarters to duplicate the report by entering it into the computer. The long

range goal is to implement pen based computerization. But today, and hence

the question, I would like to have the medics take the patient in, provide a

verbal followup from their phone patch, assist if needed, clear the hospital,

return to quarters, complete the report and send the " FULL DETAILED " report to

the hospital via fax/modum. As always, I want to entertain your thoughts on

this because someone will always have a better idea or may shed some legal

issues on this idea. Look forward to hearing from each of you.

Ricky Black, Battalion Commander

Southlake Fire Services

______________________________________________________________________

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Are there any other agencies who have an active CISM Team.... ( Critical

Incident Stress Management ), If so, is it a private organization of is it

supported by a municipal agency...? (i.e. Fire Dept)

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Hi, Community Fire Department does not require us to obtain a signature...

Steve Watkins EMT-I

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Just my two cents on the Computer reports...

I am currently in Paramedic Completer school. As part of my required

rotations I was working at Herman Hospital ER, here in Houston.

Houston Fire Department is switching over to a notebook style computer to do

their reports. They have a combination of pen based system with a keyboard

located in the back of their ambulances. Their system has a built in cell

phone and automatically sends the entered reports to their headquarters. It

is all paperless and there in lies the rub.

While working at the ER we had no information on the patient contact with

HFD. While the HFD personnel did give a report, the nurse or staff they

reported to was always on the move and did not stay with that patient. As a

result most of the information we had was suplied by Triage. Without a

written report we were in the dark. It was not a big problem on most patients

and the only real impact it had was on my school reports.

The way it was explained to me was HFD would fax a written report within the

hour. I was there for two days and the written report never caught up with

the patient in the ER.

I like their system and it seems like the wave of the future. Would be nice

if the notebook had a built in printer :)

Steve Watkins

EMT-I

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On Sat, 3 Oct 1998 17:53:38 EDT LPate@... writes:

>I was wondering where everyone had gone.

>

It has gotten very quite on this end too. Surely we have not ran out of

things to talk about, huh?

Mildred Mason

>______________________________________________________________________

>

>

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I should hope Not!

Pamela McClanahan

[] Re: quiet

>Well, let me start a little discussion. Are there any departments or

services

>on this list that do not obtain a signature from a nurse/doctor upon

>transferring patient, and/or

>are there any departments or services that do not leave a report at the

>hospital?

>

>Ricky Black, Battalion Commander

>Southlake Fire Services

>

>______________________________________________________________________

>

>

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DFW Airport Dept. of Public Safety has an active CISM team. I am a member of

the team.

, BS, EMT/P

DFW Airport DPS

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In a message dated 10/3/98 11:36:11 PM, you wrote:

> I like their system and it seems like the wave of the future. Would be nice

>if the notebook had a built in printer :)

>

>

> Steve Watkins

> EMT-I

At one point Austin EMS had laserprinters set up in the local ER's... just

cable in and and print... kinda straight forward. However I haven't seen a

computer based run form from them in a while... they may not be using

computers anymore... Anybody Know different? or why Austin Ems backed off of

the computer based system if they really did?...

:-{)>

Jt

john emt-p

austin

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AMR North Texas no longer requires the signature or doctors or nurses when pt

care

has been transferred to them. All that is now required is a simple statement on

your runsheet " Pt care and report given to___________. " Makes it simpler when you

have calls holding.

T.Auanger, EMT-P

AMR Division 7/Hunt County

BatCom401@... wrote:

> Well, let me start a little discussion. Are there any departments or services

> on this list that do not obtain a signature from a nurse/doctor upon

> transferring patient, and/or

> are there any departments or services that do not leave a report at the

> hospital?

>

> Ricky Black, Battalion Commander

> Southlake Fire Services

>

> ______________________________________________________________________

>

>

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I will respond to this. We are able to get signatures from a dr or a nurse

in all hospitals we go into but one. The Elvis Presley Trauma Center at

Memphis refuses to sign for our patients. We then request a name and title

and write it into our reports.

Hope this is what you had reference to. The transports into the Med as the

trauma center is called are inter hospital transports and they are always

expecting our patient for at least 1 to 1 1/2 hours. They told us their

lawyers told them not to sign for the patients.

Food for thought.

Louise Joiner NREMTP in Rural Arkansas

Carebearmedic@...

RaaEMS605@... wrote:

> In a message dated 98-10-03 21:04:20 EDT, you write:

>

> << Well, let me start a little discussion. Are there any departments or

> services

> on this list that do not obtain a signature from a nurse/doctor upon

> transferring patient, and/or

> are there any departments or services that do not leave a report at the

> hospital?

>

> Ricky Black, Battalion Commander

> Southlake Fire Services_ >>

>

> DFW Airport does both of the above!

>

> , BS, EMT/P

> DFW Airport DPS

>

> ______________________________________________________________________

>

>

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Steve

The Arkansas EMT Association is connected to the Arkansas Network and we all

call the Arkansas Network CISD Team when we need them. They are connected in

some way to Arkansas Children's Hospital. I have personally called them a

couple of times for my self and our service has called them several times.

hope this helps.

Louise Joiner NREMTP in Rural Arkansas

Carebearmedic@...

SteveCCFD@... wrote:

> Are there any other agencies who have an active CISM Team.... ( Critical

> Incident Stress Management ), If so, is it a private organization of is it

> supported by a municipal agency...? (i.e. Fire Dept)

>

> ______________________________________________________________________

>

>

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Good Evening...

We do not require our medics to obtain a nurse or physician signature on the

patient chart. We do require that a copy of the chart be left with the

patient's records in the emergency department.

Jack Pitcock, EMT-P

EMS Coordinator

Baytown Health Dept EMS

Baytown, Texas

> [] Re: quiet

>

>

> Well, let me start a little discussion. Are there any

> departments or services

> on this list that do not obtain a signature from a nurse/doctor upon

> transferring patient, and/or

> are there any departments or services that do not leave a report at the

> hospital?

>

> Ricky Black, Battalion Commander

> Southlake Fire Services

>

> ______________________________________________________________________

>

>

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What I meant was this:

I personally will never leave a patient anywhere without having given a

verbal report to the staff. Meaning a nurse or doc that will be assigned to

that patient. Whether it is a hospital , nursing home, clinic, or whatever

facility I am dropping off at. I also Insist on a patient report from a

staff member when I pick up the patent. I will always leave a written report

also. It may be incomplete, but at least have the pertinent info on it. I

will note that is an incomplete report and fax the completed copy ASAP. This

is CYA. I have seen instances when staff has complained about medics not

giving a report, or not given a report to the correct staff member, and they

don't know what that pts. problem is or how to treat it because they have no

paperwork either. It's like the pt. was just dropped off there and they

don't know what to do with them. This is esp. true with the elderly and

unconscious unknown pt. etc.... Critical errors in care can be made because

the staff did not get the pertinent info from the medic.

Pamela McClanahan

[] Re: quiet

>Please explain your answer Pam. I'm interested as to why you make this

>comment.

>

>Ricky Black, Battalion Commander

>Southlake Fire Services

>

>______________________________________________________________________

>

>

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Personally I believe good documentation of whom the patient was released to

is sufficient, as for the Run Reports, I actually think this is a provider

licensure requirement, any of you TDH guys wanna join in on this one?

A., EMT-P

Training Coordinator

Falls County EMS

michaelnelson@...

http://fallscountyems.org

[] Re: quiet

I will respond to this. We are able to get signatures from a dr or a nurse

in all hospitals we go into but one. The Elvis Presley Trauma Center at

Memphis refuses to sign for our patients. We then request a name and title

and write it into our reports.

Hope this is what you had reference to. The transports into the Med as the

trauma center is called are inter hospital transports and they are always

expecting our patient for at least 1 to 1 1/2 hours. They told us their

lawyers told them not to sign for the patients.

Food for thought.

Louise Joiner NREMTP in Rural Arkansas

Carebearmedic@...

RaaEMS605@... wrote:

> In a message dated 98-10-03 21:04:20 EDT, you write:

>

> << Well, let me start a little discussion. Are there any departments or

> services

> on this list that do not obtain a signature from a nurse/doctor upon

> transferring patient, and/or

> are there any departments or services that do not leave a report at the

> hospital?

>

> Ricky Black, Battalion Commander

> Southlake Fire Services_ >>

>

> DFW Airport does both of the above!

>

> , BS, EMT/P

> DFW Airport DPS

>

> ______________________________________________________________________

>

>

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Ricky,

Check with on County EMS, I think Costello, they started

using pen based systems, and have printers with IR ports in the ED's.

A., EMT-P

Training Coordinator

Falls County EMS

michaelnelson@...

http://fallscountyems.org

[] Re: quiet

Hey Brad,

Thanks for the response. I am not familiar with this law so Gene, it's your

turn. I posed this question initially because we conducting our patient

reports via computer. Pen based is not up to scale yet, therefore,

paramedics

were having to complete a written report, have the nurse sign it and return

to

quarters to duplicate the report by entering it into the computer. The long

range goal is to implement pen based computerization. But today, and hence

the question, I would like to have the medics take the patient in, provide a

verbal followup from their phone patch, assist if needed, clear the

hospital,

return to quarters, complete the report and send the " FULL DETAILED " report

to

the hospital via fax/modum. As always, I want to entertain your thoughts on

this because someone will always have a better idea or may shed some legal

issues on this idea. Look forward to hearing from each of you.

Ricky Black, Battalion Commander

Southlake Fire Services

______________________________________________________________________

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At 23:35 10/3/98 EDT, you wrote:

>Are there any other agencies who have an active CISM Team.... ( Critical

>Incident Stress Management ), If so, is it a private organization of is it

>supported by a municipal agency...? (i.e. Fire Dept)

>

>______________________________________________________________________

>

>

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Share on other sites

At 03:21 10/4/98 EDT, you wrote:

>

>In a message dated 10/3/98 11:36:11 PM, you wrote:

>

>> I like their system and it seems like the wave of the future. Would be nice

>>if the notebook had a built in printer :)

>>

>>

>> Steve Watkins

>> EMT-I

>

>At one point Austin EMS had laserprinters set up in the local ER's... just

>cable in and and print... kinda straight forward. However I haven't seen a

>computer based run form from them in a while... they may not be using

>computers anymore... Anybody Know different? or why Austin Ems backed off of

>the computer based system if they really did?...

>

>:-{)>

>Jt

>john emt-p

>austin

>

>______________________________________________________________________

>

>

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Jack Pitcock wrote:

>

> Good Evening...

>

> We do not require our medics to obtain a nurse or physician signature on the

> patient chart. We do require that a copy of the chart be left with the

> patient's records in the emergency department.

>

> Jack Pitcock, EMT-P

> EMS Coordinator

> Baytown Health Dept EMS

> Baytown, Texas

Jack,

In the event of a legal dispute over when and to whom care of your

patient was transferred to the hospital staff, how would you prove it?

If the patient claimed abandonment by your employees, do you have a

legally sufficient and admissible record showing who received the

patient and when?

Gene

--

E. Gandy, JD, EMT-P

EMS Professions Program Director

Tyler Junior College

Tyler, TX

ggan@...

Check out our website at: http://www.tyler.cc.tx.us/emmt/

______________________________________________________________________

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