Re: Help, please. I'm unsure of myself...

[Guest guest]

a, I think you're right to wait until Saturday, when you're able to talk to

your therapist and have had more time to decide what you want to do about your

dad. I'd definitely NOT send any link or BPD info. until you've had time to

really mull over what the ramifications might be and if this is something you

really want to do.

It's hard to say what his motives are or what he's really thinking by reading

his email -- but one thing that comes through loud and clear is that you're

feeling pressured into responding before you're really ready.

I say, put yourself first! Protect yourself and stay strong and don't let him

or anyone else push you to do something until you're ready. It's Thursday --

your dad can survive waiting a few days for a reply.

Anyhow, that's my take, for what it's worth.

Shana

Help, please. I'm unsure of myself...

To: WTOAdultChildren1

> Ok, I'm week 2 of NC with my parents. The only reason I gave

> for the

> NC was one email that said " I'm done with the cycles of abuse. "

> I

> have not mentioned BPD or nada. I was waiting to talk to my

> therapist

> on Saturday to get more guidance.

>

> His replies are getting more desperate and urgent. This email

> below

> seseems rational to me, even if one-sided.

>

> I was thinking of just sending a link to the Understanding the

> Borderline Mother book, or to bpdcentral, so that he knows it's

> not

> totally him.

>

> I don't want to manipulate. I don't want to play games. I'm

> not 100%

> sure about NC with dishrag. I know I need to protect myself. I

> know

> dishrag and nada are not my responsibility.

>

> Help!

>

> a

>

>

> ~~~~~

>

> a,

>

> Please open a communications path. This isn't fair. If I've done

> something wrong please let me know so that I can either fix it

> or make

> amends. I have always supported you and volunteered help,

> sometimes

> even

> when you didn't ask.

>

> Love,

>

> Dad

>

> PS. Please copy my home email as well.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Don't think about what you do or don't do for them, only think about

what is best for you at this moment. The best advise I got was to take

it easy on myself during the first month of NC. I was sick and tender,

I was having withdrawals from that dysfunction. Remember your very

tender and any little upset is amplified 10,000 times. I can't imagine

having to think about giving up my father for NC, I can't say I've had

to make the choice. I'm very sorry. I had to give up my brother for

the time being and it will stay like this a long time. I made excuses

for him, but on my moms birthday I had to make a choice. Do I want to

live out the remaining years of my life BP free, or do I want to

compromise that with a direct connection to her(my bro)? He knows what

I'm doing and he repects it, I'm lucky for that. Your father may not

want to understand the truth of why life is turning in this direction

and may not ever want to know. Take some time for yourself, give your

head some mindspace to be able to sleep and function and I know you'll

make the decision that makes you happiest in life. We are all here for

you, let us know if you need anything. You've made it this far, man,

your strong...

>

> Ok, I'm week 2 of NC with my parents. The only reason I gave for the

> NC was one email that said " I'm done with the cycles of abuse. " I

> have not mentioned BPD or nada. I was waiting to talk to my therapist

> on Saturday to get more guidance.

>

> His replies are getting more desperate and urgent. This email below

> seseems rational to me, even if one-sided.

>

> I was thinking of just sending a link to the Understanding the

> Borderline Mother book, or to bpdcentral, so that he knows it's not

> totally him.

>

> I don't want to manipulate. I don't want to play games. I'm not 100%

> sure about NC with dishrag. I know I need to protect myself. I know

> dishrag and nada are not my responsibility.

>

> Help!

>

> a

>

>

> ~~~~~

>

> a,

>

> Please open a communications path. This isn't fair. If I've done

> something wrong please let me know so that I can either fix it or make

> amends. I have always supported you and volunteered help, sometimes

> even

> when you didn't ask.

>

> Love,

>

> Dad

>

> PS. Please copy my home email as well.

>

[Guest guest]

a, If you feel like you need time and space, take it. If it

would relieve some the pressure, and you don't see any risk to

yourself in it, maybe it is worth considering sending a brief email

to your father saying you need space to figure things out and you

will be in touch when you are ready. State that what you need from

him right now is to respect your need for space.

I am in a similar situation - in my case I maintain limited contact

with my mother (holidays, etc) only for my father's sake. I am

starting to question these dynamics more, and understand how heart-

wrenching it is to love one parent while having to protect yourself

from the other.

If I understand your situation correctly, your father witnessed your

mother hurting you and left you to handle it. Well, you have the

right to handle it however you need to. Whether your father fits

into the picture will become clear as time goes on. It is perfectly

reaonable for to you take time away from all the turmoil.

-Caitlyn

[Guest guest]

a,

Could you have a relationship with your dad that had boundaries around it,

such as:

- not discussing nada at all in any way, shape of form.

- time spent is away, just the two of you.

Do you want to have a relationship with your dad that is independent of your

nada? Is he capable of having such a relationship? Does he validate your need

to separate from your nada or is he trying to pull you all together?

Unfortunately, there is no right or wrong answer; only assessing behavior and

assessing what you want and what he wants.

Greg.

baast2play wrote:

Ok, I'm week 2 of NC with my parents. The only reason I gave for the

NC was one email that said " I'm done with the cycles of abuse. " I

have not mentioned BPD or nada. I was waiting to talk to my therapist

on Saturday to get more guidance.

His replies are getting more desperate and urgent. This email below

seseems rational to me, even if one-sided.

I was thinking of just sending a link to the Understanding the

Borderline Mother book, or to bpdcentral, so that he knows it's not

totally him.

I don't want to manipulate. I don't want to play games. I'm not 100%

sure about NC with dishrag. I know I need to protect myself. I know

dishrag and nada are not my responsibility.

Help!

a

~~~~~

a,

Please open a communications path. This isn't fair. If I've done

something wrong please let me know so that I can either fix it or make

amends. I have always supported you and volunteered help, sometimes

even

when you didn't ask.

Love,

Dad

PS. Please copy my home email as well.

---------------------------------

Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+

countries) for 2¢/min or less.

[Guest guest]

His email sounds like HE needs something from you. He's not offering

you anything other than a chance to make HIM feel better by getting

what HE wants.

You've decided right now you aren't willing or able to give that to

him. As an adult you're perfectly free to make that choice for

yourself. Its up to him as an autonomous human being to respect your

choice. He may not like it, but it is YOUR choice to make.

He says " I have always supported you... " Well right now the support

you need from him is to be left alone as you have requested. He's not

doing it. So it seems to me that giving him what he wants (an email

reply) only makes it a " win " for him, but a " lose " for you.

Its a new challenge to make choices that make YOU happy and not them,

isn't it? Those muscles will gain strength the more you use them

Some of my muscles BULGE (but others are as puny as a 99 lb. weakling

getting sand kicked in his face at the beach

Just my $.02 worth.

e

>

> Ok, I'm week 2 of NC with my parents. The only reason I gave for

the

> NC was one email that said " I'm done with the cycles of abuse. " I

> have not mentioned BPD or nada. I was waiting to talk to my

therapist

> on Saturday to get more guidance.

>

> His replies are getting more desperate and urgent. This email

below

> seseems rational to me, even if one-sided.

>

> I was thinking of just sending a link to the Understanding the

> Borderline Mother book, or to bpdcentral, so that he knows it's not

> totally him.

>

> I don't want to manipulate. I don't want to play games. I'm not

100%

> sure about NC with dishrag. I know I need to protect myself. I

know

> dishrag and nada are not my responsibility.

>

> Help!

>

> a

>

>

> ~~~~~

>

> a,

>

> Please open a communications path. This isn't fair. If I've done

> something wrong please let me know so that I can either fix it or

make

> amends. I have always supported you and volunteered help, sometimes

> even

> when you didn't ask.

>

> Love,

>

> Dad

>

> PS. Please copy my home email as well.

>

[Guest guest]

I note that he wants to " fix it, " dads of all sorts often want to play

repair-man, so he would probably be more comfortable if you could give

him some way of helping you. So for right now, you might reply very

simply that you are alive/ok but right now the only help you need is

time for yourself & ask him to respect that, and for him not to expect

any answers right now. Then you will have several days to think about

it with less pressure, sleep on it, & talk to your therapist about it.

When I went NC with my Fada, I never actually told Fada I wanted no

contact with him. I told my mother, and that I was sorry this would

affect my relationship with her. I also told her that from now on I

wouldn't help her in any way that would benefit my Fada, and that I

wouldn't be returning to their house unless A)he was in therapy, B)he

was no longer living there, either if they divorce or he died.

I still talk to my mother, thou I avoid talking with my mother about

Fada as much as possible. I only call her cell phone, and I don't

answer calls from their house. She understands my grounds, and we've

both made our choices, and as long as she is not trying to drag me

back to a relationship with Fada, I am more than happy to have a

relationship with her alone. Your relationship with " dishrag " may or

may not be able to be separate from Nada, and you may or may not want

to explore that option. There is nothing wrong with wanting space for

a while, and if he can't accept that, that's all the more reason I'd

say you need to give yourself that space.

>

> Ok, I'm week 2 of NC with my parents. The only reason I gave for the

> NC was one email that said " I'm done with the cycles of abuse. " I

> have not mentioned BPD or nada. I was waiting to talk to my therapist

> on Saturday to get more guidance.

>

> His replies are getting more desperate and urgent. This email below

> seseems rational to me, even if one-sided.

>

> I was thinking of just sending a link to the Understanding the

> Borderline Mother book, or to bpdcentral, so that he knows it's not

> totally him.

>

> I don't want to manipulate. I don't want to play games. I'm not 100%

> sure about NC with dishrag. I know I need to protect myself. I know

> dishrag and nada are not my responsibility.

>

> Help!

>

> a

>

>

> ~~~~~

>

> a,

>

> Please open a communications path. This isn't fair. If I've done

> something wrong please let me know so that I can either fix it or make

> amends. I have always supported you and volunteered help, sometimes

> even

> when you didn't ask.

>

> Love,

>

> Dad

>

> PS. Please copy my home email as well.

>

[Guest guest]

It sounds like your trying to disarm a bomb before it explodes. Just

think about the worst thing that could happen if you take some time

off, visualize your nada sending out her flying monkies to fetch you

and her spinning holes in the floor of her house with rage. That's the

worst that could happen, your gonna be OK, just don't answer your

phone and stay NC with your dad until she has cast you out. Then go to

father if it makes YOU feel better. This is the hardest it gets, but

in a few weeks your gonna feel a million times better. Ask these guys,

I feel down the darkest path I've ever known for at yeast a month.

In WTOAdultChildren1 , G wrote:

>

> a,

>

> Could you have a relationship with your dad that had boundaries

around it, such as:

>

> - not discussing nada at all in any way, shape of form.

> - time spent is away, just the two of you.

>

> Do you want to have a relationship with your dad that is

independent of your nada? Is he capable of having such a

relationship? Does he validate your need to separate from your nada

or is he trying to pull you all together? Unfortunately, there is no

right or wrong answer; only assessing behavior and assessing what you

want and what he wants.

>

> Greg.

>

> baast2play wrote:

> Ok, I'm week 2 of NC with my parents. The only reason I

gave for the

> NC was one email that said " I'm done with the cycles of abuse. " I

> have not mentioned BPD or nada. I was waiting to talk to my therapist

> on Saturday to get more guidance.

>

> His replies are getting more desperate and urgent. This email below

> seseems rational to me, even if one-sided.

>

> I was thinking of just sending a link to the Understanding the

> Borderline Mother book, or to bpdcentral, so that he knows it's not

> totally him.

>

> I don't want to manipulate. I don't want to play games. I'm not 100%

> sure about NC with dishrag. I know I need to protect myself. I know

> dishrag and nada are not my responsibility.

>

> Help!

>

> a

>

> ~~~~~

>

> a,

>

> Please open a communications path. This isn't fair. If I've done

> something wrong please let me know so that I can either fix it or make

> amends. I have always supported you and volunteered help, sometimes

> even

> when you didn't ask.

>

> Love,

>

> Dad

>

> PS. Please copy my home email as well.

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

> Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and

30+ countries) for 2¢/min or less.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you all. I appreciate your insights. It's so hard to see our

own forrest amidst the trees.

I decided that what would help me to feel best was to send back an

email statement, " I need space. "

You are right. The email is about him. Both of my parents are

narcisitic. Even when it's about helping us, it's about THEM

helping us. I caught that in the email too.

Greg you bring up some great questions!! Ones I've been thinking

about and ones that I don't have answers to. Hence my therapy appt

on Saturday.

My dad has a separate, secret, life from nada. He has often snuck

$$ gifts to me while keeping it a secret from nada. He often does

stuff or goes places without nada's permission or knowledge. He

lies to her.

He's a recovered alcoholic and he allowed the abuse (emotional and

verbal) to happen to BP sis and I. He allows nada and BP sis to

abuse him. He thinks taking it is a sign of love and strength. My

nada triangulated us when I was five and I played the therapist and

lawyer to get him to see the error of his ways (nada's view) for 20

years. I have some real anger at nada for doing that to me. For

taking my dad away from me, making him " our enemy, " and for making

me her caregiver.

I don't know if he can separate from nada enough to have a

relationship with me and I don't know how he would feel having

partial access to my son without nada being involved. Taking my son

away from Nada will PISS her off and she will be embarassed because

she no longer can show off her grandson to all her " friends. " The

QUEEN may try to have some heads rolling.

I like to help people, not hurt them. That's what has kept me

engaged in the FOO drama for so long (I'm going to be 35 in

January). FOO has made it clear that whenever I set a boundary or

say no, I am hurting them. I've decided over the years that that is

a load of crap. They just can't handle their emotions.

I'm so done with this FOO drama. I pray that I can get enough

clarity and stregth around my dad to make the right decision for the

best menal health for all involved.

a

[Guest guest]

You know, it was the flying monkeys that freaked me out the most in

the Wizard of Oz!

Thanks for the laugh and the light.

This is part II for me. Nada made me NC for two years and I dealt a

lot with the cut off and my lack of individuation. It was actually a

relief, those two years! In fact she didn't come to my wedding and it

was a blessing!!! I had the BEST ritual/event I have ever had - the

best day of my life. Everything before that, every ritual of

individuation and growing up always included Nada based drama.

She came back into my life after I got married, I know realize for the

potential of a grandkid. I'm kicking myself a bit for taking her back

especially since I didn't ask her to take responsibility for the past.

We both just ignored it and didn't talk about the NC.

This is the first time I'm choosing to cut it off.

, let's keep each other in the light as we work through this

darkness. I had my college graduation ring engraved with a saying

that I think is important for us KO's " Don't curse the Darkness.

Light a Candle. "

Here's to the light.

a

> > Ok, I'm week 2 of NC with my parents. The only reason I

> gave for the

> > NC was one email that said " I'm done with the cycles of abuse. " I

> > have not mentioned BPD or nada. I was waiting to talk to my therapist

> > on Saturday to get more guidance.

> >

> > His replies are getting more desperate and urgent. This email below

> > seseems rational to me, even if one-sided.

> >

> > I was thinking of just sending a link to the Understanding the

> > Borderline Mother book, or to bpdcentral, so that he knows it's not

> > totally him.

> >

> > I don't want to manipulate. I don't want to play games. I'm not 100%

> > sure about NC with dishrag. I know I need to protect myself. I know

> > dishrag and nada are not my responsibility.

> >

> > Help!

> >

> > a

> >

> > ~~~~~

> >

> > a,

> >

> > Please open a communications path. This isn't fair. If I've done

> > something wrong please let me know so that I can either fix it or make

> > amends. I have always supported you and volunteered help, sometimes

> > even

> > when you didn't ask.

> >

> > Love,

> >

> > Dad

> >

> > PS. Please copy my home email as well.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ---------------------------------

> > Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and

> 30+ countries) for 2¢/min or less.

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

a, just wanted to say good for you for taking this time to take care of

yourself physically and focus on getting yourself into shape!

It's a wonderful, positive, healing thing to do -- and the exercise is going to

make you feel better emotionally and give you more strength and confidence in

handling the changes you're making in going NC.

When I first diagnosed my nada, although I haven't gone NC, I had an immediate

reaction to start caring for myself more physically. It was like I was suddenly

providing all the compassion and basic care needs she never gave me when I was

growing up -- I started a new habit of eating a very nutritious diet and began

exercising every day -- I must've lost 20 pounds these past few months, without

even trying! (I call it the " diagnose your nada " diet.)

For me, it was a natural result of the emotional detachment, because I just

started loving myself more. I'm seeing benefits in other ways, too -- but I

think caring for yourself physically is SO important and such an integral part

of learning to put yourself first (for a change).

My dishrag's an alcoholic, too -- sadly not in recovery -- and I think

alcoholics are very good at making others feel responsible for them and that

they're somehow " too weak " to handle normal things like giving people space and

boundaries. I'm proud of you for standing your ground and putting yourself

first where he's concerned!

Shana

Re: Help, please. I'm unsure of myself...

To: WTOAdultChildren1

> Thank you all. I appreciate your insights. It's so hard to see

> our

> own forrest amidst the trees.

>

> I decided that what would help me to feel best was to send back

> an

> email statement, " I need space. "

>

> You are right. The email is about him. Both of my parents are

> narcisitic. Even when it's about helping us, it's about THEM

> helping us. I caught that in the email too.

>

> Greg you bring up some great questions!! Ones I've been

> thinking

> about and ones that I don't have answers to. Hence my therapy

> appt

> on Saturday.

>

> My dad has a separate, secret, life from nada. He has often

> snuck

> $$ gifts to me while keeping it a secret from nada. He often

> does

> stuff or goes places without nada's permission or knowledge. He

> lies to her.

>

> He's a recovered alcoholic and he allowed the abuse (emotional

> and

> verbal) to happen to BP sis and I. He allows nada and BP sis to

> abuse him. He thinks taking it is a sign of love and strength.

> My

> nada triangulated us when I was five and I played the therapist

> and

> lawyer to get him to see the error of his ways (nada's view) for

> 20

> years. I have some real anger at nada for doing that to me.

> For

> taking my dad away from me, making him " our enemy, " and for

> making

> me her caregiver.

>

> I don't know if he can separate from nada enough to have a

> relationship with me and I don't know how he would feel having

> partial access to my son without nada being involved. Taking my

> son

> away from Nada will PISS her off and she will be embarassed

> because

> she no longer can show off her grandson to all her " friends. "

> The

> QUEEN may try to have some heads rolling.

>

> I like to help people, not hurt them. That's what has kept me

> engaged in the FOO drama for so long (I'm going to be 35 in

> January). FOO has made it clear that whenever I set a boundary

> or

> say no, I am hurting them. I've decided over the years that

> that is

> a load of crap. They just can't handle their emotions.

>

> I'm so done with this FOO drama. I pray that I can get enough

> clarity and stregth around my dad to make the right decision for

> the

> best menal health for all involved.

>

> a

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

a -- this sounds similar to the tone taken by my own dada. They

seem to want to boil it down to one incident so they can give an

excuse or apology for it, and carry on as usual.

Your declaration of being " done with the cycles of abuse " is more

general, and therefore, more scary to him.

Same with my fada -- keeps trying to make it that I'm mad about a

particular recent incident or something. Makes it about me so that

he can say, basically, " Whatever's wrong with you right now, please

know that all we've ever done is love you -- we just can't figure

out what we've done that could be so awful as to sever this

relationship, blah blah blah... "

They seem to like to paint us as petulant children, when we've had

a " lightbulb moment " about the entire " big picture " . If they can

keep us mired in " this incident " or " that incident " , then they can

keep the blame game going, and they're safe from being called on a

lifetime of behavior.

Don't know if that makes sense, but it seems to be their game.....

Keep on keeping on -- don't let them tie you down to some timetable

they've worked out. You have the right to all the time and space

you need to chart the course of your life and your relationships,

and you don't owe anybody any explanation.

-Kyla

>

> Ok, I'm week 2 of NC with my parents. The only reason I gave for

the

> NC was one email that said " I'm done with the cycles of abuse. " I

> have not mentioned BPD or nada. I was waiting to talk to my

therapist

> on Saturday to get more guidance.

>

> His replies are getting more desperate and urgent. This email

below

> seseems rational to me, even if one-sided.

>

> I was thinking of just sending a link to the Understanding the

> Borderline Mother book, or to bpdcentral, so that he knows it's

not

> totally him.

>

> I don't want to manipulate. I don't want to play games. I'm not

100%

> sure about NC with dishrag. I know I need to protect myself. I

know

> dishrag and nada are not my responsibility.

>

> Help!

>

> a

>

>

> ~~~~~

>

> a,

>

> Please open a communications path. This isn't fair. If I've done

> something wrong please let me know so that I can either fix it or

make

> amends. I have always supported you and volunteered help,

sometimes

> even

> when you didn't ask.

>

> Love,

>

> Dad

>

> PS. Please copy my home email as well.

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you, Kyla, for reminding me about the space. I think you are

right on about one incident vs a lifetime. I haven't brought up the

lifetime discussion yet, and I know they don't want to talk about

it. I think my dad is feeling pressured by nada for " screwing up

again " when it's really her. I can't level with him yet until I

have a plan. We can't protect each other from nada, only ourselves.

a

> >

> > Ok, I'm week 2 of NC with my parents. The only reason I gave

for

> the

> > NC was one email that said " I'm done with the cycles of abuse. "

I

> > have not mentioned BPD or nada. I was waiting to talk to my

> therapist

> > on Saturday to get more guidance.

> >

> > His replies are getting more desperate and urgent. This email

> below

> > seseems rational to me, even if one-sided.

> >

> > I was thinking of just sending a link to the Understanding the

> > Borderline Mother book, or to bpdcentral, so that he knows it's

> not

> > totally him.

> >

> > I don't want to manipulate. I don't want to play games. I'm

not

> 100%

> > sure about NC with dishrag. I know I need to protect myself. I

> know

> > dishrag and nada are not my responsibility.

> >

> > Help!

> >

> > a

> >

> >

> > ~~~~~

> >

> > a,

> >

> > Please open a communications path. This isn't fair. If I've done

> > something wrong please let me know so that I can either fix it

or

> make

> > amends. I have always supported you and volunteered help,

> sometimes

> > even

> > when you didn't ask.

> >

> > Love,

> >

> > Dad

> >

> > PS. Please copy my home email as well.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Kyla,

Wow, I agree 100% about the " incidents " versus the big picture. And

you put it so clearly too, thanks. A lot of times I will have some

idea vaguely rattling around...and then someone else will say it so

clearly, and it's such a relief to hear it spelled out.

Nadas definitely like to focus on incidents. Every relationship has

its unpleasant incidents, and any one incident can be put to rest.

It's the big picture that they don't get. Are there three such

incidents in the relationship, or three thousand? Are the incidents

exceptions to the rule, or are they the rule?

But when the focus is on each " little " thing, then if we are " still

upset, " we can be portrayed as petty. But it's not petty. When we are

" still upset " it is because our context is one in which 2,999 (not 2)

other such incidents have also occurred. If there were only a few such

incidents, we could let them go and focus on the bigger picture of a

valuable, workable relationship. When there are many such incidents,

each one is just a small symptom of a bigger disease...

I like how you put it, Kyla:

> They seem to like to paint us as petulant children.

That fits my parents to a T. Drove me up the freaking wall!!!!!!!!!!

You know, this might also be why it is hard to explain to " outsiders "

just what is so wrong with our parents. If you give any one example,

most everyone can think of some troubling incident with their parents

as well. And thus sometimes from outsiders, we get the same puzzled

reaction " Just let it go " or " It's your mother of course she loves

you " blah blah... But the difference is in the big picture.

Janie

[Guest guest]

Honestly, it helps me, too. I'm shaken up by my own n/c with my

parents, and I see it in your posts. It really helps to know we're

not going it alone, doesn't it?

-Kyla

> > >

> > > Ok, I'm week 2 of NC with my parents. The only reason I gave

> for

> > the

> > > NC was one email that said " I'm done with the cycles of

abuse. "

> I

> > > have not mentioned BPD or nada. I was waiting to talk to my

> > therapist

> > > on Saturday to get more guidance.

> > >

> > > His replies are getting more desperate and urgent. This email

> > below

> > > seseems rational to me, even if one-sided.

> > >

> > > I was thinking of just sending a link to the Understanding the

> > > Borderline Mother book, or to bpdcentral, so that he knows

it's

> > not

> > > totally him.

> > >

> > > I don't want to manipulate. I don't want to play games. I'm

> not

> > 100%

> > > sure about NC with dishrag. I know I need to protect myself.

I

> > know

> > > dishrag and nada are not my responsibility.

> > >

> > > Help!

> > >

> > > a

> > >

> > >

> > > ~~~~~

> > >

> > > a,

> > >

> > > Please open a communications path. This isn't fair. If I've

done

> > > something wrong please let me know so that I can either fix it

> or

> > make

> > > amends. I have always supported you and volunteered help,

> > sometimes

> > > even

> > > when you didn't ask.

> > >

> > > Love,

> > >

> > > Dad

> > >

> > > PS. Please copy my home email as well.

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Great post! I can't tell you how many times I've tried to explain

it to close friends or family, and the words just won't come out.

Or I'll mangle it! Maybe we need to start a thread on canned

phrases to use when people ask " What's the deal with you and your

mom/dad? "

My Dad likes to excuse my nada's outrageous behavior with " I know

your mother does such-and-such, but that's just the way she is. "

Well, you could excuse a lot of evil that way.

-Kyla

>

> Kyla,

> Wow, I agree 100% about the " incidents " versus the big picture. And

> you put it so clearly too, thanks. A lot of times I will have some

> idea vaguely rattling around...and then someone else will say it so

> clearly, and it's such a relief to hear it spelled out.

>

> Nadas definitely like to focus on incidents. Every relationship has

> its unpleasant incidents, and any one incident can be put to rest.

> It's the big picture that they don't get. Are there three such

> incidents in the relationship, or three thousand? Are the incidents

> exceptions to the rule, or are they the rule?

>

> But when the focus is on each " little " thing, then if we are " still

> upset, " we can be portrayed as petty. But it's not petty. When we

are

> " still upset " it is because our context is one in which 2,999 (not

2)

> other such incidents have also occurred. If there were only a few

such

> incidents, we could let them go and focus on the bigger picture of

a

> valuable, workable relationship. When there are many such

incidents,

> each one is just a small symptom of a bigger disease...

>

> I like how you put it, Kyla:

> > They seem to like to paint us as petulant children.

>

> That fits my parents to a T. Drove me up the freaking

wall!!!!!!!!!!

>

> You know, this might also be why it is hard to explain

to " outsiders "

> just what is so wrong with our parents. If you give any one

example,

> most everyone can think of some troubling incident with their

parents

> as well. And thus sometimes from outsiders, we get the same puzzled

> reaction " Just let it go " or " It's your mother of course she loves

> you " blah blah... But the difference is in the big picture.

>

> Janie

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks, Shana. Congrats on your exercise diet love myself plan. I

was a life coach for awhile and I worked with another life coach who

pointed out the fallacy in puttin others first, " If you're looking out

for you, and I'm looking out for you, who's looking out for me? " That

really hit me in the stomach! My hubby is fonding of saying, " You

can't be a life guard if you can't swim. "

Time to accept all the love for ourselves and be extra kind to our

little kids inside.

a

[Guest guest]

yes, you can, too, be a life guard if you can't swim...you just pay somebody to

do it for you, while you tan, get a mani/pedi, etc. a, you need to explain

these things to him or he will never get ahead in today's culture. ;o)

greg.

baast2play wrote:

Thanks, Shana. Congrats on your exercise diet love myself plan. I

was a life coach for awhile and I worked with another life coach who

pointed out the fallacy in puttin others first, " If you're looking out

for you, and I'm looking out for you, who's looking out for me? " That

really hit me in the stomach! My hubby is fonding of saying, " You

can't be a life guard if you can't swim. "

Time to accept all the love for ourselves and be extra kind to our

little kids inside.

a

---------------------------------

Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+

countries) for 2¢/min or less.

[Guest guest]

Thanks for the reminder.

Oh, my husband and I dance to the rhythm of our own djembe! I'm

fond of being a " life guard " (personal development interest) and

that was his way of saying to practice extreme self care (the

coaching term for take care of yourself first).

> Thanks, Shana. Congrats on your exercise diet love

myself plan. I

> was a life coach for awhile and I worked with another life coach

who

> pointed out the fallacy in puttin others first, " If you're looking

out

> for you, and I'm looking out for you, who's looking out for me? "

That

> really hit me in the stomach! My hubby is fonding of saying, " You

> can't be a life guard if you can't swim. "

>

> Time to accept all the love for ourselves and be extra kind to our

> little kids inside.

>

> a

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

> Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and

30+ countries) for 2¢/min or less.

>

>

[Guest guest]

It totally does! BPD isn't as well know as drug addictions, etc.

It's true that people outside of a BPD family don't really get it.

It's nice to have some people in the trenches here with me to

understand the thoughts and level of feeling.

a

> > > >

> > > > Ok, I'm week 2 of NC with my parents. The only reason I gave

> > for

> > > the

> > > > NC was one email that said " I'm done with the cycles of

> abuse. "

> > I

> > > > have not mentioned BPD or nada. I was waiting to talk to my

> > > therapist

> > > > on Saturday to get more guidance.

> > > >

> > > > His replies are getting more desperate and urgent. This email

> > > below

> > > > seseems rational to me, even if one-sided.

> > > >

> > > > I was thinking of just sending a link to the Understanding the

> > > > Borderline Mother book, or to bpdcentral, so that he knows

> it's

> > > not

> > > > totally him.

> > > >

> > > > I don't want to manipulate. I don't want to play games. I'm

> > not

> > > 100%

> > > > sure about NC with dishrag. I know I need to protect myself.

> I

> > > know

> > > > dishrag and nada are not my responsibility.

> > > >

> > > > Help!

> > > >

> > > > a

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ~~~~~

> > > >

> > > > a,

> > > >

> > > > Please open a communications path. This isn't fair. If I've

> done

> > > > something wrong please let me know so that I can either fix it

> > or

> > > make

> > > > amends. I have always supported you and volunteered help,

> > > sometimes

> > > > even

> > > > when you didn't ask.

> > > >

> > > > Love,

> > > >

> > > > Dad

> > > >

> > > > PS. Please copy my home email as well.

> > > >

> > >

> >

>