Guest guest Posted March 6, 2006 Report Share Posted March 6, 2006 Dear JG, welcome to the work! The turnaround is a new perspective. It's your directions you are listening to. You are right, in so far as it is for you to hear the advice you want to give other's. As in: if they don't listen to what you say, who does it leave? The work meets you where you are. If your position is one of demand, you will realize that you can demand as much as you want, but in the end you will only get what someone is willing to give. So, if no one is there to fulfill your need, you are the last instance you can refer to. And if your need is to get (openness, for instance, but get clear what that is for you, how it looks like, how it makes you feel, etc.) and you are not willing to give it, don't expect anyone else to. Some turnarounds may just ring AS true as the original thought. You get out what you put in. Love, --- jangio12 schrieb: > Hi. I'm new to the Work, and would be grateful if > someone would > comment on the following doubts that I have : > When we turn around a criticism about someone else > (for instance, " he > should be more open " becomes " I should be more > open " ,) isn't this yet > another 'should' and therefore NOT loving what is? > As I tend to be > very self critical and believe others are 'worthier' > than me, I feel I > need to work on accepting myself rather than telling > myself 'I should' > or 'shouldn't do '.... > Looking forward to your answers, as this is a major > stumbling block > for me. > JG ___________________________________________________________ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 6, 2006 Report Share Posted March 6, 2006 Hello JG. Some thoughts on yours... > Hi. I'm new to the Work, and would be grateful if someone would > comment on the following doubts that I have : When we turn around a > criticism about someone else (for instance, " he should be more open " > becomes " I should be more open " ,) isn't this yet another 'should' > and therefore NOT loving what is? *****A very tricky area, eh? " Shoulds " as in imperatives; and " loving " what is...as in loving rapists, murderers, pedophiles. " Loving " them?!? When I first joined " the club, " and posted here regularly, I found a more appropriate terminology for " Loving What Is. " That didn't sit right with me and I asked the group if it could be thought of as similar to " Accepting What Is. " Most agreed with the substitution. Perhaps that might help you? This " Acceptance " that is pointed to is Absolute. There are times that I can't " accept " something (feeling loving towards an act of brutality), But, stepping back a pace, I can at least " accept " that that is how I am feeling. This overarching Acceptance validates the feeling that I can't accept something. This type of perspective turns me back onto myself (which is all there is). The notions of " shoulds " and " LOVING what is " are things that I've worked with for years. Welcome to the club. :-)) > As I tend to be very self critical ***** " Nobody Hurts You Harder Than Yourself " -- Graham :-)) > and believe others are 'worthier' > than me, I feel I need to work on accepting myself rather than > telling myself 'I should' or 'shouldn't do '.... *****You may want to explore, in thought and non-thought, the underlying beliefs that give rise to " others are 'worthier' than me. " To hold such a belief there must be a host of other thoughts prior to that which you are accepting as True. For example, you must have at some earlier point set up a hierarchy of less worthy - more worthy - most worthy and then attached to that schema some guidelines as to how a person (including yourself) gets " placed " in that hierarchy. All this probably took place unconsciously, usually at a very early age before the ability to differentiate and discriminate among thoughts occurs. So, as a youngster, you took it as The Truth, This Is The Way The World Is. Unable to See this happening, the young person simply gets programmed to think, believe, and actually SEE the world in this way (we see the " external " world through our thoughts; we never see it directly, as if perception were 100% objective recording of facts; thought is always an intermediary between what we see and What Is). At some point in your Work, you may begin to discover that all of your concerns are a creation, a mental fabrication, not necessarily " real. " Thoughts - loving and critical - are just that: thoughts...biochemical energy arising in the brain, born out of the individual's innate conditioning-in-the-moment. As that programming changes, thoughts change. The Work, which basically directs the deconstruction of thought, is one potential tool for seeing that what we take for " real " are, at their foundation, thoughts. Very powerful, very convincing, very enchanting thoughts. But thoughts just the same. Even what you initially experience as a " stumbling block " may be, in Fact, an opportunity to drop some misconceptions. And if you are able to....be patient. The programming you are becoming conscious of didn't take place in a day. It is the accumulated debris of years of wiring and rewiring. It will probably not disappear in an instant, and you may find it resisting close examination since it may experience inquiry as a threat to its dominion. Just be patient and gentle with yourself. You can only operate on your own, individual timetable. If you can, proceed with affection towards yourself and all others. It makes the Journey far more serene and sane. Both for you and for all sentient beings. You don't have to beat up yourself (or anyone else) to get where you think you want to go. Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 6, 2006 Report Share Posted March 6, 2006 very simple: whenever a turnaround feels stressfull, you can investigate it. so your turnaround was: I should be more open. Is it true? set yourself free. love Philip > > Hi. I'm new to the Work, and would be grateful if someone would > comment on the following doubts that I have : > When we turn around a criticism about someone else (for instance, " he > should be more open " becomes " I should be more open " ,) isn't this yet > another 'should' and therefore NOT loving what is? As I tend to be > very self critical and believe others are 'worthier' than me, I feel I > need to work on accepting myself rather than telling myself 'I should' > or 'shouldn't do '.... > Looking forward to your answers, as this is a major stumbling block > for me. > JG > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 6, 2006 Report Share Posted March 6, 2006 > Hi. I'm new to the Work, and would be grateful if someone would > comment on the following doubts that I have : When we turn around a > criticism about someone else (for instance, " he should be more open " > becomes " I should be more open " ,) isn't this yet another 'should' > and therefore NOT loving what is? Hi I loved your question The work doesn't tell you to live the turn around's! The turn around is just another story. If it is stressful you may as well do the work on it Love, T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 6, 2006 Report Share Posted March 6, 2006 Hi JG, welcome to the group! When we turn a should around, it doesn´t mean that we SHOULD change. Because the Work is never about guilt and shame. And we won´t chage until we change anyway, and it might has nothing to do with the Work anyway:). Doing the Work is all about finding out for yourself what is really true for you. So when you get the TA " I should be more open " , go inside and just see if that is as true or truer that your original statement. When do you shut down? Maybe it is in the minute you think that " he should be more open " ? How open are you then to his closness? How does it feel inside of you when you have this thought? Are you open to your love for him? For yourself? This is just a way to see that we are everything we see in others. They are always a projection of our stories about them. Imagine that you are walking through a big hall of mirrors. In every mirror you see different people. Some look happy, others sad. Some look angry and some scornful. Some of them you like, and some you don´t like at all. And all of a sudden your vision change and you see clearly that it´s you in every mirror. This is the purpouse with the TA´s. They are meant to bring you back home to you. If you haven´t done it yet, I highly recommend that you pay a visit to s home page, www.thework.org Under Resources you will find a section called Streaming audio and video. There is a video clip with doing the Work with a woman, called " Open Heart Surgery " . It is just about this issue you have. I think it could be very useful for you to look at it! Love and all the best, > > Hi. I'm new to the Work, and would be grateful if someone would > comment on the following doubts that I have : > When we turn around a criticism about someone else (for instance, " he > should be more open " becomes " I should be more open " ,) isn't this yet > another 'should' and therefore NOT loving what is? As I tend to be > very self critical and believe others are 'worthier' than me, I feel I > need to work on accepting myself rather than telling myself 'I should' > or 'shouldn't do '.... > Looking forward to your answers, as this is a major stumbling block > for me. > JG > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 8, 2006 Report Share Posted March 8, 2006 Dear T Thankyou! I really hadn't thought of that - that the turnaround is just another story. So basically, the Work is about 'neutralising' all these 'shoulds' in our head, whether they are directed to others or to ourselves ? Love JG > > > Hi. I'm new to the Work, and would be grateful if someone would > > comment on the following doubts that I have : When we turn around a > > criticism about someone else (for instance, " he should be more open " > > becomes " I should be more open " ,) isn't this yet another 'should' > > and therefore NOT loving what is? > > > Hi > > I loved your question > > The work doesn't tell you to live the turn around's! > The turn around is just another story. > > If it is stressful you may as well do the work on it > > Love, T > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 8, 2006 Report Share Posted March 8, 2006 Dear Andy Thankyou for your reply. So perhaps the Work is about accepting our stressful thoughts as well? Or perhaps it's ultimately about realizing that no thought is true and we are free to react as it's best for us at the time? Love JG > > Hello JG. Some thoughts on yours... > > > > Hi. I'm new to the Work, and would be grateful if someone would > > comment on the following doubts that I have : When we turn around a > > criticism about someone else (for instance, " he should be more open " > > becomes " I should be more open " ,) isn't this yet another 'should' > > and therefore NOT loving what is? > > > *****A very tricky area, eh? " Shoulds " as in imperatives; > and " loving " what is...as in loving rapists, murderers, > pedophiles. " Loving " them?!? > > When I first joined " the club, " and posted here regularly, I found a > more appropriate terminology for " Loving What Is. " That didn't sit > right with me and I asked the group if it could be thought of as > similar to " Accepting What Is. " Most agreed with the substitution. > Perhaps that might help you? > > This " Acceptance " that is pointed to is Absolute. There are times > that I can't " accept " something (feeling loving towards an act of > brutality), But, stepping back a pace, I can at least " accept " that > that is how I am feeling. This overarching Acceptance validates the > feeling that I can't accept something. This type of perspective turns > me back onto myself (which is all there is). > > The notions of " shoulds " and " LOVING what is " are things that I've > worked with for years. Welcome to the club. :-)) > > > > As I tend to be very self critical > > > ***** " Nobody Hurts You Harder Than Yourself " -- Graham :-)) > > > and believe others are 'worthier' > > than me, I feel I need to work on accepting myself rather than > > telling myself 'I should' or 'shouldn't do '.... > > > *****You may want to explore, in thought and non-thought, the > underlying beliefs that give rise to " others are 'worthier' than me. " > > To hold such a belief there must be a host of other thoughts prior to > that which you are accepting as True. > > For example, you must have at some earlier point set up a hierarchy of > less worthy - more worthy - most worthy and then attached to that > schema some guidelines as to how a person (including yourself) > gets " placed " in that hierarchy. > > All this probably took place unconsciously, usually at a very early > age before the ability to differentiate and discriminate among > thoughts occurs. So, as a youngster, you took it as The Truth, This > Is The Way The World Is. Unable to See this happening, the young > person simply gets programmed to think, believe, and actually SEE the > world in this way (we see the " external " world through our thoughts; > we never see it directly, as if perception were 100% objective > recording of facts; thought is always an intermediary between what we > see and What Is). > > At some point in your Work, you may begin to discover that all of your > concerns are a creation, a mental fabrication, not > necessarily " real. " Thoughts - loving and critical - are just that: > thoughts...biochemical energy arising in the brain, born out of the > individual's innate conditioning-in-the-moment. As that programming > changes, thoughts change. The Work, which basically directs the > deconstruction of thought, is one potential tool for seeing that what > we take for " real " are, at their foundation, thoughts. Very powerful, > very convincing, very enchanting thoughts. But thoughts just the same. > > Even what you initially experience as a " stumbling block " may be, in > Fact, an opportunity to drop some misconceptions. > > And if you are able to....be patient. The programming you are > becoming conscious of didn't take place in a day. It is the > accumulated debris of years of wiring and rewiring. It will probably > not disappear in an instant, and you may find it resisting close > examination since it may experience inquiry as a threat to its > dominion. Just be patient and gentle with yourself. You can only > operate on your own, individual timetable. If you can, proceed with > affection towards yourself and all others. It makes the Journey far > more serene and sane. Both for you and for all sentient beings. You > don't have to beat up yourself (or anyone else) to get where you think > you want to go. > > Cheers! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 8, 2006 Report Share Posted March 8, 2006 Dear Philip I loved your reply. It's very liberating. Thankyou. Love JG > > > > Hi. I'm new to the Work, and would be grateful if someone would > > comment on the following doubts that I have : > > When we turn around a criticism about someone else (for instance, " he > > should be more open " becomes " I should be more open " ,) isn't this yet > > another 'should' and therefore NOT loving what is? As I tend to be > > very self critical and believe others are 'worthier' than me, I feel I > > need to work on accepting myself rather than telling myself 'I should' > > or 'shouldn't do '.... > > Looking forward to your answers, as this is a major stumbling block > > for me. > > JG > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 8, 2006 Report Share Posted March 8, 2006 Dear . Thankyou for your insights. So the Work is about staying in MY business (and staying out of other's). And the answer to self-criticism is to question it? i.e. is it true that I SHOULD be ..... ? But if your neighbour shouldn't be doing anything different from what he's doing, and you neither - this means that everything is OK as it is ? Love JG > > Dear JG, > > welcome to the work! > > The turnaround is a new perspective. It's your > directions you are listening to. > > You are right, in so far as it is for you to hear the > advice you want to give other's. > > As in: if they don't listen to what you say, who does > it leave? > > The work meets you where you are. If your position is > one of demand, you will realize that you can demand as > much as you want, but in the end you will only get > what someone is willing to give. > > So, if no one is there to fulfill your need, you are > the last instance you can refer to. And if your need > is to get (openness, for instance, but get clear what > that is for you, how it looks like, how it makes you > feel, etc.) and you are not willing to give it, don't > expect anyone else to. > > Some turnarounds may just ring AS true as the original > thought. > > You get out what you put in. > > Love, > > > --- jangio12 schrieb: > > > Hi. I'm new to the Work, and would be grateful if > > someone would > > comment on the following doubts that I have : > > When we turn around a criticism about someone else > > (for instance, " he > > should be more open " becomes " I should be more > > open " ,) isn't this yet > > another 'should' and therefore NOT loving what is? > > As I tend to be > > very self critical and believe others are 'worthier' > > than me, I feel I > > need to work on accepting myself rather than telling > > myself 'I should' > > or 'shouldn't do '.... > > Looking forward to your answers, as this is a major > > stumbling block > > for me. > > JG > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 8, 2006 Report Share Posted March 8, 2006 Dear , thankyou for taking time to give me such a detailed reply. Intellectually I understand that the Work isn't about guilt or forcing oneself to change, but I admit I find it difficult to direct the turn arounds to myself, as I'm longing to believe, for once and for all, that I'm OK just the way I am, and in any case, no worse than others. Obviously there's a lot of baggage here from my childhood. But anyway, the big issue for me is really that of self- acceptance and approval. Perhaps by accepting others or life as it is, is a first step in accepting myself ? Love JG > > Hi JG, > welcome to the group! > When we turn a should around, it doesn´t mean that we SHOULD change. > Because the Work is never about guilt and shame. And we won´t chage > until we change anyway, and it might has nothing to do with the Work > anyway:). Doing the Work is all about finding out for yourself what is > really true for you. So when you get the TA " I should be more open " , > go inside and just see if that is as true or truer that your original > statement. When do you shut down? Maybe it is in the minute you think > that " he should be more open " ? How open are you then to his closness? > How does it feel inside of you when you have this thought? Are you > open to your love for him? For yourself? > > This is just a way to see that we are everything we see in others. > They are always a projection of our stories about them. Imagine that > you are walking through a big hall of mirrors. In every mirror you see > different people. Some look happy, others sad. Some look angry and > some scornful. Some of them you like, and some you don´t like at all. > And all of a sudden your vision change and you see clearly that it´s > you in every mirror. This is the purpouse with the TA´s. They are > meant to bring you back home to you. > > If you haven´t done it yet, I highly recommend that you pay a visit to > s home page, www.thework.org > Under Resources you will find a section called Streaming audio and > video. There is a video clip with doing the Work with a woman, > called " Open Heart Surgery " . It is just about this issue you have. I > think it could be very useful for you to look at it! > > Love and all the best, > > > > > > > > Hi. I'm new to the Work, and would be grateful if someone would > > comment on the following doubts that I have : > > When we turn around a criticism about someone else (for > instance, " he > > should be more open " becomes " I should be more open " ,) isn't this > yet > > another 'should' and therefore NOT loving what is? As I tend to be > > very self critical and believe others are 'worthier' than me, I feel > I > > need to work on accepting myself rather than telling myself 'I > should' > > or 'shouldn't do '.... > > Looking forward to your answers, as this is a major stumbling block > > for me. > > JG > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 8, 2006 Report Share Posted March 8, 2006 Nope. It's not OK. It's better! Scary, huh? Love, --- jangio12 schrieb: > Dear . Thankyou for your insights. So the > Work is about > staying in MY business (and staying out of other's). > And the answer > to self-criticism is to question it? i.e. is it true > that I SHOULD > be ..... ? But if your neighbour shouldn't be > doing anything > different from what he's doing, and you neither - > this means that > everything is OK as it is ? > Love JG > > > > > > Dear JG, > > > > welcome to the work! > > > > The turnaround is a new perspective. It's your > > directions you are listening to. > > > > You are right, in so far as it is for you to hear > the > > advice you want to give other's. > > > > As in: if they don't listen to what you say, who > does > > it leave? > > > > The work meets you where you are. If your position > is > > one of demand, you will realize that you can > demand as > > much as you want, but in the end you will only get > > what someone is willing to give. > > > > So, if no one is there to fulfill your need, you > are > > the last instance you can refer to. And if your > need > > is to get (openness, for instance, but get clear > what > > that is for you, how it looks like, how it makes > you > > feel, etc.) and you are not willing to give it, > don't > > expect anyone else to. > > > > Some turnarounds may just ring AS true as the > original > > thought. > > > > You get out what you put in. > > > > Love, > > > > > > --- jangio12 schrieb: > > > > > Hi. I'm new to the Work, and would be grateful > if > > > someone would > > > comment on the following doubts that I have : > > > When we turn around a criticism about someone > else > > > (for instance, " he > > > should be more open " becomes " I should be more > > > open " ,) isn't this yet > > > another 'should' and therefore NOT loving what > is? > > > As I tend to be > > > very self critical and believe others are > 'worthier' > > > than me, I feel I > > > need to work on accepting myself rather than > telling > > > myself 'I should' > > > or 'shouldn't do '.... > > > Looking forward to your answers, as this is a > major > > > stumbling block > > > for me. > > > JG > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: > http://messenger.yahoo.de > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 8, 2006 Report Share Posted March 8, 2006 > > > > Hi JG, > > welcome to the group! > > When we turn a should around, it doesn´t mean that we SHOULD > change. > > Because the Work is never about guilt and shame. And we won´t > chage > > until we change anyway, and it might has nothing to do with the > Work > > anyway:). Doing the Work is all about finding out for yourself > what is > > really true for you. So when you get the TA " I should be more > open " , > > go inside and just see if that is as true or truer that your > original > > statement. When do you shut down? Maybe it is in the minute you > think > > that " he should be more open " ? How open are you then to his > closness? > > How does it feel inside of you when you have this thought? Are you > > open to your love for him? For yourself? > > > > This is just a way to see that we are everything we see in others. > > They are always a projection of our stories about them. Imagine > that > > you are walking through a big hall of mirrors. In every mirror you > see > > different people. Some look happy, others sad. Some look angry and > > some scornful. Some of them you like, and some you don´t like at > all. > > And all of a sudden your vision change and you see clearly that > it´s > > you in every mirror. This is the purpouse with the TA´s. They are > > meant to bring you back home to you. > > > > If you haven´t done it yet, I highly recommend that you pay a > visit to > > s home page, www.thework.org > > Under Resources you will find a section called Streaming audio and > > video. There is a video clip with doing the Work with a > woman, > > called " Open Heart Surgery " . It is just about this issue you have. > I > > think it could be very useful for you to look at it! > > > > Love and all the best, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi. I'm new to the Work, and would be grateful if someone would > > > comment on the following doubts that I have : > > > When we turn around a criticism about someone else (for > > instance, " he > > > should be more open " becomes " I should be more open " ,) isn't > this > > yet > > > another 'should' and therefore NOT loving what is? As I tend to > be > > > very self critical and believe others are 'worthier' than me, I > feel > > I > > > need to work on accepting myself rather than telling myself 'I > > should' > > > or 'shouldn't do '.... > > > Looking forward to your answers, as this is a major stumbling > block > > > for me. > > > JG > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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