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Posted
Posted

Hi

 

I am on the transplant list for a kidney and liver.  I have never been given

morphine for any pain in the hospital.  I was given something (that did not

work) but don't remember the name of it.

Thanks for this day and for our tomorrows

 

Love, Lyncia 

 

 

Subject: Question about morphine treatments ...

To: livercirrhosissupport

Date: Wednesday, January 13, 2010, 6:31 PM

 

Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

are both patients and caregivers.

My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

(47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

for an evaluation for the transplant list.

He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

" hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can you

share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

Thanks for your input!

in Virginia

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Posted
Posted

, I am very sorry to hear about your uncle; but, is he ever blessed with

lots of family that really care!!

Also, I am a recovering alcoholic; but, 23-1/2 yrs sober now!! Prescription

drug abuse is very easy to transfer too because of the addictive nature of the

person. Actually, even non-alcoholics can be addicted to prescription drugs and

many are!!

It would be impossible for me personally to know whether your uncle is actually

in pain or abusing the morphine. In fact, I doubt that the Drs will know for

sure. Personally, as a recovering alcoholic, I have always believed in full

disclosure to my primary care Dr. It makes it a little tricky when they need to

prescribe a narcotic; but, once I've shown them that I have no desire to abuse

my medications, they don't give me the look so much.

Probably your aunt should have a private chat with his primary care Dr. and see

what he thinks, when he looks at the records. It appears that there must be a

very good reason that the Dr's have not just given him a script for the morphine

- that's why he has to go to the hospital to get it. Morphine has been a

commonly used pain prescription for many, many years!! It has very little to do

with the hospital.. There are several such medications, my favourite being the

Methadone.

However, I had 1st stage cirrhosis last January and have just completed a Hep C

treatment. Personally I have never had pain from my liver!! I developed

Fibromyalgia several years ago and it is very painfully some days. However, I

will get medical marijuana before heavy duty pain meds and I never liked the

stuff. Luckily, I live in Canada and even the Province that probably supplies

the most pot that crosses the boarder, plus, medical pot is not nearly as

frowned on in this Province.

Gloria

________________________________

Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

are both patients and caregivers.

My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

(47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

for an evaluation for the transplant list.

He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

" hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can you

share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

Thanks for your input!

in Virginia

__________________________________________________________________

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Posted
Posted

Hi, . I am Bobby, a 46 year old recovering alcoholic with end stage liver

disease. I was diagnosed in 2006 after a hellish summer of severe pain in my

liver. My pain was so bad that I could not eat and led to me losing 100 lbs! I

was never able to lose weight after a lifetime of struggling to do so, and this

shocked my doctor. The pain is in my upper right and upper left quadrants. My

spleen is shown on CT scan to be enlarged from a normal size of 11 cm to 16 cm.

20 cm is when they consider removing it out of fear of rupturing it.I also have

pain in my right upper quadrant. My liver doctor says that there is no way to

know for sure what exactly is causing the pain( the liver is the biggest

suspect, but several other explanations exist), but suggested that I see a pain

doctor. I was put on morphine after trials with other opiates failed. Pure

opiates are non toxic to the liver while almost every other sort of pain

reliever is toxic to the liver.

Despite that, many people I know who have liver disease are taking the more

toxic medicine, even though it is known to cause further harm to the liver. This

is mainly because schedule three narcotics are easier for a doctor to prescribe

because of added tylenol which limits how much a person can safely take, while

schedule two drugs require jumping through many hoops, and most have no upper

limits, and can be abused more easily. I was very much against taking any kind

of pills my entire life and was very very reluctant to seek pain treatment. I

have learned a lot and found out that I was wrong in my attitude, and sadly, the

bias against opioids is tremendous, and a person in true pain will have many

obstacles to getting treatment, not just from the medical community,but also

from friends and family and society as a whole. This insanity has led to some

countries to totally banning the use of morphine even for the terminally ill and

severe cancer patients!

I take the same dose every day exactly as prescribed, and have not sought any

further escalation out of fear of the slippery slope. My life has improved, but

I still disabled by my many complications. I attend 12 step meetings, and have a

sponsor. This is the only was a reputable pain doctor would trust a patient with

a past history of substance abuse, though current treatment guidelines do not

exclude a person from getting pain treatment just because of a past history.

There is simply no way of knowing if your cousin is in pain or not, however if

he has transferred his addiction to opiates (morphine) he has surely entered in

to a new hell. Morphine will sometimes produce a euphoric feeling, but after a

week or so, these feeling disappear forever. Only a larger dose or different

type will re-create these feelings. This is how addicts become addicts. To

purposely seek out this feeling is a very very dangerous thing. It will lead a

person to total ruin.

With alcohol or any other drug, once the phenomenon or craving starts, then the

person will need daily doses just to not be very very ill.

I strongly suggest alanon for any one directly involved in this mans life. to

not do so will ensure a co-dependency which can ruin the co-dependent's life

just as thoroughly as the addict or alcoholic will ruin his.

good luck, I hope I have provided you with some answeres to your questions.

Love, Bobby

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Wed, January 13, 2010 5:31:29 PM

Subject: Question about morphine treatments ...

Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

are both patients and caregivers.

My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

(47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

for an evaluation for the transplant list.

He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

" hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can you

share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

Thanks for your input!

in Virginia

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Posted
Posted

Hi . Welcome to the group although I'm sorry you have reason to be here. By

your post I'm assuming that your cousin has told you that he asks for pain meds

even when he's not in pain? I'm guessing that he must be quite ill since they

don't just easily admit someone to the hospital and I'm guessing that the

physician must have reason to BELIEVE that he is in pain since they don't easily

dole out morphine. He may or may not be in pain but being given morphine for a

few days every few weeks is not going to cause a physical addiction to it. He

may already be psychologically addicted to it that's true and it's not uncommon

at all for someone with an addictive personality to " switch " addictions.

Personally, I wouldn't worry about it until and unless he's given a prescription

for an addictive substance. I know his mom and yourself must be quite worried

about him. Have you tried talking to him ? However things are I wish your family

well.~~~Best wishes, Debbie

>

> Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

> type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

> are both patients and caregivers.

>

> My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

> (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

> until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

> for an evaluation for the transplant list.

>

> He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

> goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

> even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

> without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

> that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

>

> My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

> appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

> on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

> can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

> patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

> " hospital-administered " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can you

> share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

>

> If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

> has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

>

> Thanks for your input!

>

> in Virginia

>

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Posted
Posted

Hi,

 

I have really been having migraine headaches...........Does this go with the

cirrhosis or I just have a headache?

 

Also pain mgmt doctor put me on Norco 5/325 t PO TID prn pain????????

 

Can someone answer these questions:

Thanks for this day and for our tomorrows

 

Love, Lyncia 

 

 

Subject: Re: Question about morphine treatments ...

To: livercirrhosissupport

Date: Thursday, January 14, 2010, 7:30 AM

 

Hi . Welcome to the group although I'm sorry you have reason to be here. By

your post I'm assuming that your cousin has told you that he asks for pain meds

even when he's not in pain? I'm guessing that he must be quite ill since they

don't just easily admit someone to the hospital and I'm guessing that the

physician must have reason to BELIEVE that he is in pain since they don't easily

dole out morphine. He may or may not be in pain but being given morphine for a

few days every few weeks is not going to cause a physical addiction to it. He

may already be psychologically addicted to it that's true and it's not uncommon

at all for someone with an addictive personality to " switch " addictions.

Personally, I wouldn't worry about it until and unless he's given a prescription

for an addictive substance. I know his mom and yourself must be quite worried

about him. Have you tried talking to him ? However things are I wish your family

well.~~~Best wishes,

Debbie

>

> Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

> type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

> are both patients and caregivers.

>

> My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

> (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

> until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

> for an evaluation for the transplant list.

>

> He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

> goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

> even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

> without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

> that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

>

> My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

> appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

> on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

> can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

> patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

> " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can you

> share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

>

> If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

> has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

>

> Thanks for your input!

>

> in Virginia

>

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Posted
Posted

Hi ,

They gave me morphine while in the hospital and I liked it because it

made what I was going through bareable. They didn't keep giving it to

me though. I can't imagine him just wanting to go back to hospital

just for the morphine. I never wanted to go back there again. Sorry,

I'm not much help. I only got morphine 2 or 3 times in hospital. I

imagine it could be very addictive.

Roni

> Hi

>

> I am on the transplant list for a kidney and liver. I have never

> been given morphine for any pain in the hospital. I was given

> something (that did not work) but don't remember the name of it.

>

> Thanks for this day and for our tomorrows

>

> Love, Lyncia

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Subject: Question about morphine

> treatments ...

> To: livercirrhosissupport

> Date: Wednesday, January 13, 2010, 6:31 PM

>

>

>

> Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can

> gain some

> type of support for our family and get some questions answered by

> people who

> are both patients and caregivers.

>

> My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a

> year ago

> (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen

> years

> until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be

> considered

> for an evaluation for the transplant list.

>

> He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple

> of

> weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more.

> When he

> goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in

> pain --

> even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot

> last long

> without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the

> conclusion

> that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

>

> My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes

> for his

> appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some

> light

> on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a

> caregiver

> can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it

> common for

> patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it

> become a

> " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these

> questions, can you

> share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

>

> If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it

> and it

> has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

>

> Thanks for your input!

>

> in Virginia

>

>

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Posted
Posted

welcome karen, i am sorry to learn about your cousin. i cant clinically answer

your question, but i do feel some people will tranpose one addiction for

another, but that might not be the case with your cousin honey.he might be in

such great pain its needed, only the drs. can say i guess. morphine makes my

husband sick the moment it gets into his blood stream, causes profuse

vomiting,so i dont know much about morphine except he cant take it. i will keep

you your cousin and your family in my prayers. i hope you find the answers you

seek, you have come to a wonderful place for support and knowledge,much love

barby

>

> Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

> type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

> are both patients and caregivers.

>

> My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

> (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

> until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

> for an evaluation for the transplant list.

>

> He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

> goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

> even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

> without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

> that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

>

> My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

> appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

> on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

> can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

> patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

> " hospital-administered " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can you

> share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

>

> If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

> has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

>

> Thanks for your input!

>

> in Virginia

>

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Posted
Posted

hi lyncia,bobby glenn gets the headaches, not nearly like the ones when he was

on the treatment, but still gets them,had one yesterday.i have heard norco is a

locet without the asprin but i am not really sure if that is a fact or

fiction,hope your headache gets better girl ,much love barby

> >

> > Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

> > type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

> > are both patients and caregivers.

> >

> > My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

> > (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

> > until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

> > for an evaluation for the transplant list.

> >

> > He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> > weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

> > goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

> > even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> > morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

> > without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

> > that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

> >

> > My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

> > appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

> > on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

> > can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

> > patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

> > " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can

you

> > share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

> >

> > If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

> > has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

> >

> > Thanks for your input!

> >

> > in Virginia

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

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Posted
Posted

Barby

 

If morphine makes him sick request zofram first.  It will settle his stomach

for the morphine.

Thanks for this day and for our tomorrows

 

Love, Lyncia 

 

 

Subject: Re: Question about morphine treatments ...

To: livercirrhosissupport

Date: Thursday, January 14, 2010, 9:56 AM

 

welcome karen, i am sorry to learn about your cousin. i cant clinically answer

your question, but i do feel some people will tranpose one addiction for

another, but that might not be the case with your cousin honey.he might be in

such great pain its needed, only the drs. can say i guess. morphine makes my

husband sick the moment it gets into his blood stream, causes profuse

vomiting,so i dont know much about morphine except he cant take it. i will keep

you your cousin and your family in my prayers. i hope you find the answers you

seek, you have come to a wonderful place for support and knowledge,much love

barby

>

> Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

> type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

> are both patients and caregivers.

>

> My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

> (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

> until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

> for an evaluation for the transplant list.

>

> He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

> goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

> even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

> without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

> that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

>

> My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

> appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

> on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

> can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

> patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

> " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can you

> share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

>

> If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

> has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

>

> Thanks for your input!

>

> in Virginia

>

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Posted
Posted

Thanks so much!

Thanks for this day and for our tomorrows

 

Love, Lyncia 

 

 

Subject: Re: Question about morphine treatments ...

To: livercirrhosissupport

Date: Thursday, January 14, 2010, 10:04 AM

 

hi lyncia,bobby glenn gets the headaches, not nearly like the ones when he was

on the treatment, but still gets them,had one yesterday.i have heard norco is a

locet without the asprin but i am not really sure if that is a fact or

fiction,hope your headache gets better girl ,much love barby

> >

> > Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

> > type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

> > are both patients and caregivers.

> >

> > My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

> > (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

> > until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

> > for an evaluation for the transplant list.

> >

> > He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> > weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

> > goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

> > even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> > morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

> > without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

> > that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

> >

> > My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

> > appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

> > on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

> > can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

> > patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

> > " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can

you

> > share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

> >

> > If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

> > has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

> >

> > Thanks for your input!

> >

> > in Virginia

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

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Posted
Posted

An extremely well written piece about addiction, whether it be to alcohol or

drugs!!

There was a time, just before I moved in with an alcoholic/drug addict, that I

could only afford to go out to where the action was every other weekend.

However, little did I know that the phenomenon of that craving did not start

with the 6th or 10th drink. It actually started with the very first one!!

Also, I taught my son all he could stand about additiction. Thus, thank

heavens, he was able to pull away from a drug addiction by the time he was about

19. Always told him this " If you need some substance to change the way you

think and feel, chances are you could get addicted " . Sure, I take

anti-depressants at the moment and even a happy pill; but, not only am I aware

of the mine field that I am treading - so is my Dr.

Gloria

________________________________

Hi, . I am Bobby, a 46 year old recovering alcoholic with end stage liver

disease. I was diagnosed in 2006 after a hellish summer of severe pain in my

liver. My pain was so bad that I could not eat and led to me losing 100 lbs! I

was never able to lose weight after a lifetime of struggling to do so, and this

shocked my doctor. The pain is in my upper right and upper left quadrants. My

spleen is shown on CT scan to be enlarged from a normal size of 11 cm to 16 cm.

20 cm is when they consider removing it out of fear of rupturing it.I also have

pain in my right upper quadrant. My liver doctor says that there is no way to

know for sure what exactly is causing the pain( the liver is the biggest

suspect, but several other explanations exist), but suggested that I see a pain

doctor. I was put on morphine after trials with other opiates failed. Pure

opiates are non toxic to the liver while almost every other sort of pain

reliever is toxic to the liver.

Despite that, many people I know who have liver disease are taking the more

toxic medicine, even though it is known to cause further harm to the liver. This

is mainly because schedule three narcotics are easier for a doctor to prescribe

because of added tylenol which limits how much a person can safely take, while

schedule two drugs require jumping through many hoops, and most have no upper

limits, and can be abused more easily. I was very much against taking any kind

of pills my entire life and was very very reluctant to seek pain treatment. I

have learned a lot and found out that I was wrong in my attitude, and sadly, the

bias against opioids is tremendous, and a person in true pain will have many

obstacles to getting treatment, not just from the medical community,but also

from friends and family and society as a whole. This insanity has led to some

countries to totally banning the use of morphine even for the terminally ill and

severe cancer patients!

I take the same dose every day exactly as prescribed, and have not sought any

further escalation out of fear of the slippery slope. My life has improved, but

I still disabled by my many complications. I attend 12 step meetings, and have a

sponsor. This is the only was a reputable pain doctor would trust a patient with

a past history of substance abuse, though current treatment guidelines do not

exclude a person from getting pain treatment just because of a past history.

There is simply no way of knowing if your cousin is in pain or not, however if

he has transferred his addiction to opiates (morphine) he has surely entered in

to a new hell. Morphine will sometimes produce a euphoric feeling, but after a

week or so, these feeling disappear forever. Only a larger dose or different

type will re-create these feelings. This is how addicts become addicts. To

purposely seek out this feeling is a very very dangerous thing. It will lead a

person to total ruin.

With alcohol or any other drug, once the phenomenon or craving starts, then the

person will need daily doses just to not be very very ill.

I strongly suggest alanon for any one directly involved in this mans life. to

not do so will ensure a co-dependency which can ruin the co-dependent' s life

just as thoroughly as the addict or alcoholic will ruin his.

good luck, I hope I have provided you with some answeres to your questions.

Love, Bobby

____________ _________ _________ __

From: -Dooley <kwdooleycomcast (DOT) net>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Wed, January 13, 2010 5:31:29 PM

Subject: Question about morphine treatments ...

Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

are both patients and caregivers.

My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

(47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

for an evaluation for the transplant list.

He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

" hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can you

share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

Thanks for your input!

in Virginia

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Posted
Posted

Hi Lyncia,

I've had migraines for years. I don't think I had anymore when I had cirrhosis

than normal. You never had migraines before this?

Penny

> >

> > Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

> > type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

> > are both patients and caregivers.

> >

> > My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

> > (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

> > until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

> > for an evaluation for the transplant list.

> >

> > He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> > weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

> > goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

> > even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> > morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

> > without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

> > that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

> >

> > My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

> > appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

> > on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

> > can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

> > patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

> > " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can

you

> > share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

> >

> > If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

> > has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

> >

> > Thanks for your input!

> >

> > in Virginia

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

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Posted
Posted

Hi ,

I was in hospital a bunch of times last year with cirrhosis and they did give me

morphine, I used to ask for it at night to help me sleep (ok, and the buzz). I

don't think I ever took enough or had it strong enough to get addicted though.

I'm not sure a hospital would give anyone enough to get addicted to it. I could

be wrong though.

Dilaudid on the other hand is fiendishly addictive being 5 times stronger than

heroin. When I was in real pain, dilaudid was the only thing that worked for me.

I'd be surprised if a hospital kept giving him morphine, they are pretty astute

when someone is trying to work the system.

Anyway, good luck.

Craig

>

> An extremely well written piece about addiction, whether it be to alcohol or

drugs!!

>

> There was a time, just before I moved in with an alcoholic/drug addict, that I

could only afford to go out to where the action was every other weekend.

However, little did I know that the phenomenon of that craving did not start

with the 6th or 10th drink. It actually started with the very first one!!

>

> Also, I taught my son all he could stand about additiction. Thus, thank

heavens, he was able to pull away from a drug addiction by the time he was about

19. Always told him this " If you need some substance to change the way you

think and feel, chances are you could get addicted " . Sure, I take

anti-depressants at the moment and even a happy pill; but, not only am I aware

of the mine field that I am treading - so is my Dr.

>

> Gloria

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

>

> Hi, . I am Bobby, a 46 year old recovering alcoholic with end stage liver

disease. I was diagnosed in 2006 after a hellish summer of severe pain in my

liver. My pain was so bad that I could not eat and led to me losing 100 lbs! I

was never able to lose weight after a lifetime of struggling to do so, and this

shocked my doctor. The pain is in my upper right and upper left quadrants. My

spleen is shown on CT scan to be enlarged from a normal size of 11 cm to 16 cm.

20 cm is when they consider removing it out of fear of rupturing it.I also have

pain in my right upper quadrant. My liver doctor says that there is no way to

know for sure what exactly is causing the pain( the liver is the biggest

suspect, but several other explanations exist), but suggested that I see a pain

doctor. I was put on morphine after trials with other opiates failed. Pure

opiates are non toxic to the liver while almost every other sort of pain

reliever is toxic to the liver.

> Despite that, many people I know who have liver disease are taking the more

toxic medicine, even though it is known to cause further harm to the liver. This

is mainly because schedule three narcotics are easier for a doctor to prescribe

because of added tylenol which limits how much a person can safely take, while

schedule two drugs require jumping through many hoops, and most have no upper

limits, and can be abused more easily. I was very much against taking any kind

of pills my entire life and was very very reluctant to seek pain treatment. I

have learned a lot and found out that I was wrong in my attitude, and sadly, the

bias against opioids is tremendous, and a person in true pain will have many

obstacles to getting treatment, not just from the medical community,but also

from friends and family and society as a whole. This insanity has led to some

countries to totally banning the use of morphine even for the terminally ill and

severe cancer patients!

>

> I take the same dose every day exactly as prescribed, and have not sought any

further escalation out of fear of the slippery slope. My life has improved, but

I still disabled by my many complications. I attend 12 step meetings, and have a

sponsor. This is the only was a reputable pain doctor would trust a patient with

a past history of substance abuse, though current treatment guidelines do not

exclude a person from getting pain treatment just because of a past history.

There is simply no way of knowing if your cousin is in pain or not, however if

he has transferred his addiction to opiates (morphine) he has surely entered in

to a new hell. Morphine will sometimes produce a euphoric feeling, but after a

week or so, these feeling disappear forever. Only a larger dose or different

type will re-create these feelings. This is how addicts become addicts. To

purposely seek out this feeling is a very very dangerous thing. It will lead a

person to total ruin.

> With alcohol or any other drug, once the phenomenon or craving starts, then

the person will need daily doses just to not be very very ill.

> I strongly suggest alanon for any one directly involved in this mans life. to

not do so will ensure a co-dependency which can ruin the co-dependent' s life

just as thoroughly as the addict or alcoholic will ruin his.

> good luck, I hope I have provided you with some answeres to your questions.

Love, Bobby

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: -Dooley <kwdooleycomcast (DOT) net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Wed, January 13, 2010 5:31:29 PM

> Subject: Question about morphine treatments ...

>

> Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

> type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

> are both patients and caregivers.

>

> My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

> (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

> until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

> for an evaluation for the transplant list.

>

> He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

> goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

> even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

> without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

> that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

>

> My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

> appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

> on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

> can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

> patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

> " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can you

> share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

>

> If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

> has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

>

> Thanks for your input!

>

> in Virginia

>

>

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Posted
Posted

These are the first ones that I have ever had......

Thanks for this day and for our tomorrows

 

Love, Lyncia 

 

 

Subject: Re: Question about morphine treatments ...

To: livercirrhosissupport

Date: Friday, January 15, 2010, 12:00 AM

 

Hi Lyncia,

I've had migraines for years. I don't think I had anymore when I had cirrhosis

than normal. You never had migraines before this?

Penny

> >

> > Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

> > type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

> > are both patients and caregivers.

> >

> > My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

> > (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

> > until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

> > for an evaluation for the transplant list.

> >

> > He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> > weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

> > goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

> > even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> > morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

> > without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

> > that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

> >

> > My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

> > appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

> > on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

> > can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

> > patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

> > " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can

you

> > share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

> >

> > If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

> > has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

> >

> > Thanks for your input!

> >

> > in Virginia

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

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Posted
Posted

Lyncia,you know I am listed also,and go to pain managment. has your team given

you any bad responce for you taking the Norco? Just seems like that might work

for my back,just curious.Hugs,

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 4:17:08 AM

Subject: Re: Re: Question about morphine treatments

....

These are the first ones that I have ever had......

Thanks for this day and for our tomorrows

 

Love, Lyncia 

 

 

Subject: Re: Question about morphine treatments ...

To: livercirrhosissupport

Date: Friday, January 15, 2010, 12:00 AM

 

Hi Lyncia,

I've had migraines for years. I don't think I had anymore when I had cirrhosis

than normal. You never had migraines before this?

Penny

> >

> > Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

> > type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

> > are both patients and caregivers.

> >

> > My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

> > (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

> > until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

> > for an evaluation for the transplant list.

> >

> > He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> > weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

> > goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

> > even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> > morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

> > without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

> > that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

> >

> > My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

> > appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

> > on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

> > can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

> > patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

> > " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can

you

> > share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

> >

> > If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

> > has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

> >

> > Thanks for your input!

> >

> > in Virginia

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

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Posted
Posted

Have any of you tried a tens (transcutaneous Electrical Nerve Stimulator)

unit. My pain management doctor prescribed one for me because my pain isn't

confined to one area. Depending on how I move or what i do, it moves

around. Constant is pain in my neck and lower spine. Neck pain is the

most troublesome right now because my neck is weak and after sitting here or

reading or playing my keyboard for only short periods, my neck doesn't want

to hold my head up. Anyway, it was delivered yesterday, but I have to wait

until Tuesday so I can go to the closest physical therapy department to find

out how to use it. I have heard that people with neuropathy sometimes get

relief from the pain when using one, but other have no relief. Jan H

On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 11:38 AM, wendy miller wrote:

> Lyncia,you know I am listed also,and go to pain managment. has your team

> given you any bad responce for you taking the Norco? Just seems like that

> might work for my back,just curious.Hugs,

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: livercirrhosissupport

> Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 4:17:08 AM

> Subject: Re: Re: Question about morphine

> treatments ...

>

> These are the first ones that I have ever had......

>

>

>

> Thanks for this day and for our tomorrows

>

> Love, Lyncia

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Subject: Re: Question about morphine treatments

> ...

> To: livercirrhosissupport

> Date: Friday, January 15, 2010, 12:00 AM

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Hi Lyncia,

>

> I've had migraines for years. I don't think I had anymore when I had

> cirrhosis than normal. You never had migraines before this?

>

> Penny

>

>

> > >

> > > Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain

> some

> > > type of support for our family and get some questions answered by

> people who

> > > are both patients and caregivers.

> > >

> > > My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a

> year ago

> > > (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen

> years

> > > until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be

> considered

> > > for an evaluation for the transplant list.

> > >

> > > He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> > > weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When

> he

> > > goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in

> pain --

> > > even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> > > morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last

> long

> > > without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the

> conclusion

> > > that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

> > >

> > > My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes

> for his

> > > appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some

> light

> > > on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a

> caregiver

> > > can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common

> for

> > > patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it

> become a

> > > " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions,

> can you

> > > share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

> > >

> > > If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and

> it

> > > has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

> > >

> > > Thanks for your input!

> > >

> > > in Virginia

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

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Posted
Posted

I just gt the approval to take the norco 5/325 mg.  It seems to be hydrocodone

with 325 tylenoe in it.  Haven't tried it yet.  Wanted the kristolose to work

first..

Thanks for this day and for our tomorrows

 

Love, Lyncia 

 

 

From: Penny <preciouspenny3@ yahoo.com>

Subject: Re: Question about morphine treatments ...

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Date: Friday, January 15, 2010, 12:00 AM

 

Hi Lyncia,

I've had migraines for years. I don't think I had anymore when I had cirrhosis

than normal. You never had migraines before this?

Penny

> >

> > Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

> > type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

> > are both patients and caregivers.

> >

> > My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

> > (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

> > until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

> > for an evaluation for the transplant list.

> >

> > He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> > weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

> > goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

> > even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> > morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

> > without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

> > that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

> >

> > My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

> > appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

> > on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

> > can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

> > patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

> > " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can

you

> > share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

> >

> > If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

> > has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

> >

> > Thanks for your input!

> >

> > in Virginia

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

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Share on other sites
Guest guest

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Posted
Posted

I have one but it hasn't helped whrre my pain is.

Thanks for this day and for our tomorrows

 

Love, Lyncia 

 

 

>

>

> From: Penny <preciouspenny3@ yahoo.com>

> Subject: Re: Question about morphine treatments

> ...

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Date: Friday, January 15, 2010, 12:00 AM

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Hi Lyncia,

>

> I've had migraines for years. I don't think I had anymore when I had

> cirrhosis than normal. You never had migraines before this?

>

> Penny

>

>

> > >

> > > Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain

> some

> > > type of support for our family and get some questions answered by

> people who

> > > are both patients and caregivers.

> > >

> > > My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a

> year ago

> > > (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen

> years

> > > until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be

> considered

> > > for an evaluation for the transplant list.

> > >

> > > He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> > > weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When

> he

> > > goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in

> pain --

> > > even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> > > morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last

> long

> > > without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the

> conclusion

> > > that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

> > >

> > > My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes

> for his

> > > appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some

> light

> > > on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a

> caregiver

> > > can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common

> for

> > > patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it

> become a

> > > " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions,

> can you

> > > share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

> > >

> > > If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and

> it

> > > has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

> > >

> > > Thanks for your input!

> > >

> > > in Virginia

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

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Posted
Posted

Thanks, Gloria. I am glad you and your doctor are both aware that it is a

minefield for you. I liken it to riding on the back of a great dragon. If I keep

my body behind his teeth, I am ok. Do my program every single day, especially

step 10. That is how I have been able so far to stay behind the head of the

dragon. Them's some big teeth. Love, Bobby

(saadn'leelt- da ya day- n'zho)

long life, old age, everything good-Apache prayer

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Thu, January 14, 2010 8:58:39 PM

Subject: Re: Question about morphine treatments ...

An extremely well written piece about addiction, whether it be to alcohol or

drugs!!

There was a time, just before I moved in with an alcoholic/drug addict, that I

could only afford to go out to where the action was every other weekend.

However, little did I know that the phenomenon of that craving did not start

with the 6th or 10th drink. It actually started with the very first one!!

Also, I taught my son all he could stand about additiction. Thus, thank

heavens, he was able to pull away from a drug addiction by the time he was about

19. Always told him this " If you need some substance to change the way you

think and feel, chances are you could get addicted " . Sure, I take

anti-depressants at the moment and even a happy pill; but, not only am I aware

of the mine field that I am treading - so is my Dr.

Gloria

____________ _________ _________ __

Hi, . I am Bobby, a 46 year old recovering alcoholic with end stage liver

disease. I was diagnosed in 2006 after a hellish summer of severe pain in my

liver. My pain was so bad that I could not eat and led to me losing 100 lbs! I

was never able to lose weight after a lifetime of struggling to do so, and this

shocked my doctor. The pain is in my upper right and upper left quadrants. My

spleen is shown on CT scan to be enlarged from a normal size of 11 cm to 16 cm.

20 cm is when they consider removing it out of fear of rupturing it.I also have

pain in my right upper quadrant. My liver doctor says that there is no way to

know for sure what exactly is causing the pain( the liver is the biggest

suspect, but several other explanations exist), but suggested that I see a pain

doctor. I was put on morphine after trials with other opiates failed. Pure

opiates are non toxic to the liver while almost every other sort of pain

reliever is toxic to the liver.

Despite that, many people I know who have liver disease are taking the more

toxic medicine, even though it is known to cause further harm to the liver. This

is mainly because schedule three narcotics are easier for a doctor to prescribe

because of added tylenol which limits how much a person can safely take, while

schedule two drugs require jumping through many hoops, and most have no upper

limits, and can be abused more easily. I was very much against taking any kind

of pills my entire life and was very very reluctant to seek pain treatment. I

have learned a lot and found out that I was wrong in my attitude, and sadly, the

bias against opioids is tremendous, and a person in true pain will have many

obstacles to getting treatment, not just from the medical community,but also

from friends and family and society as a whole. This insanity has led to some

countries to totally banning the use of morphine even for the terminally ill and

severe cancer patients!

I take the same dose every day exactly as prescribed, and have not sought any

further escalation out of fear of the slippery slope. My life has improved, but

I still disabled by my many complications. I attend 12 step meetings, and have a

sponsor. This is the only was a reputable pain doctor would trust a patient with

a past history of substance abuse, though current treatment guidelines do not

exclude a person from getting pain treatment just because of a past history.

There is simply no way of knowing if your cousin is in pain or not, however if

he has transferred his addiction to opiates (morphine) he has surely entered in

to a new hell. Morphine will sometimes produce a euphoric feeling, but after a

week or so, these feeling disappear forever. Only a larger dose or different

type will re-create these feelings. This is how addicts become addicts. To

purposely seek out this feeling is a very very dangerous thing. It will lead a

person to total ruin.

With alcohol or any other drug, once the phenomenon or craving starts, then the

person will need daily doses just to not be very very ill.

I strongly suggest alanon for any one directly involved in this mans life. to

not do so will ensure a co-dependency which can ruin the co-dependent' s life

just as thoroughly as the addict or alcoholic will ruin his.

good luck, I hope I have provided you with some answeres to your questions.

Love, Bobby

____________ _________ _________ __

From: -Dooley <kwdooleycomcast (DOT) net>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Wed, January 13, 2010 5:31:29 PM

Subject: Question about morphine treatments ...

Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

are both patients and caregivers.

My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

(47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

for an evaluation for the transplant list.

He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

" hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can you

share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

Thanks for your input!

in Virginia

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Guest guest

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Posted
Posted

I have a TENS unit I use for pain management.....I use it mostly for my back

and spine problems,but my orthopedic surgeon ahs told me to use it on both

knees for unrelenting pain there also.  It does help,....interrupts the nerve

pathways. 

 

                                       

                                    Love,Jill

 

We don't remember days, we remember moments.

Life is not measured by the breaths we take,but by the moments that take our

breath away.

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 1:51:34 PM

Subject: Re: Re: Question about morphine treatments

....

 

Have any of you tried a tens (transcutaneous Electrical Nerve Stimulator)

unit. My pain management doctor prescribed one for me because my pain isn't

confined to one area. Depending on how I move or what i do, it moves

around. Constant is pain in my neck and lower spine. Neck pain is the

most troublesome right now because my neck is weak and after sitting here or

reading or playing my keyboard for only short periods, my neck doesn't want

to hold my head up. Anyway, it was delivered yesterday, but I have to wait

until Tuesday so I can go to the closest physical therapy department to find

out how to use it. I have heard that people with neuropathy sometimes get

relief from the pain when using one, but other have no relief. Jan H

On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 11:38 AM, wendy miller <italybell69@ yahoo.com>wrote:

> Lyncia,you know I am listed also,and go to pain managment. has your team

> given you any bad responce for you taking the Norco? Just seems like that

> might work for my back,just curious.Hugs,

>

>

>

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: Lyncia <lmlangdonyahoo (DOT) com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 4:17:08 AM

> Subject: Re: Re: Question about morphine

> treatments ...

>

> These are the first ones that I have ever had......

>

>

>

> Thanks for this day and for our tomorrows

>

> Love, Lyncia

>

>

>

>

>

>

> From: Penny <preciouspenny3@ yahoo.com>

> Subject: Re: Question about morphine treatments

> ...

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Date: Friday, January 15, 2010, 12:00 AM

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Hi Lyncia,

>

> I've had migraines for years. I don't think I had anymore when I had

> cirrhosis than normal. You never had migraines before this?

>

> Penny

>

>

> > >

> > > Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain

> some

> > > type of support for our family and get some questions answered by

> people who

> > > are both patients and caregivers.

> > >

> > > My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a

> year ago

> > > (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen

> years

> > > until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be

> considered

> > > for an evaluation for the transplant list.

> > >

> > > He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> > > weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When

> he

> > > goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in

> pain --

> > > even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> > > morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last

> long

> > > without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the

> conclusion

> > > that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

> > >

> > > My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes

> for his

> > > appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some

> light

> > > on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a

> caregiver

> > > can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common

> for

> > > patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it

> become a

> > > " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions,

> can you

> > > share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

> > >

> > > If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and

> it

> > > has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

> > >

> > > Thanks for your input!

> > >

> > > in Virginia

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

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Posted
Posted

Thanks, I had electric shock therapy in a physical therapy setting, and it

was great. Hoping this will do as much. They only gave me four sticky

patches for the leads, will I have to get more? I will be instructed how

to use it on Tuesday when I have a dr. appt in the same town the PT is

located. Seems like the pain is bothering me since they delivered it

yesterday, but figure that is all in my mind since I know it is sitting

here. I plan to use it on my knees and feet and hands as well as on my

spine. Jan H

On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 6:09 PM, Jill wrote:

> I have a TENS unit I use for pain management.....I use it mostly for my

> back and spine problems,but my orthopedic surgeon ahs told me to use it

> on both knees for unrelenting pain there also. It does help,....interrupts

> the nerve pathways.

>

>

> Love,Jill

>

> We don't remember days, we remember moments.

> Life is not measured by the breaths we take,but by the moments that take

> our breath away.

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: livercirrhosissupport

> Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 1:51:34 PM

> Subject: Re: Re: Question about morphine

> treatments ...

>

>

> Have any of you tried a tens (transcutaneous Electrical Nerve Stimulator)

> unit. My pain management doctor prescribed one for me because my pain isn't

> confined to one area. Depending on how I move or what i do, it moves

> around. Constant is pain in my neck and lower spine. Neck pain is the

> most troublesome right now because my neck is weak and after sitting here

> or

> reading or playing my keyboard for only short periods, my neck doesn't want

> to hold my head up. Anyway, it was delivered yesterday, but I have to wait

> until Tuesday so I can go to the closest physical therapy department to

> find

> out how to use it. I have heard that people with neuropathy sometimes get

> relief from the pain when using one, but other have no relief. Jan H

>

> On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 11:38 AM, wendy miller <italybell69@ yahoo.com

> >wrote:

>

> > Lyncia,you know I am listed also,and go to pain managment. has your team

> > given you any bad responce for you taking the Norco? Just seems like that

> > might work for my back,just curious.Hugs,

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: Lyncia <lmlangdonyahoo (DOT) com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 4:17:08 AM

> > Subject: Re: Re: Question about morphine

> > treatments ...

> >

> > These are the first ones that I have ever had......

> >

> >

> >

> > Thanks for this day and for our tomorrows

> >

> > Love, Lyncia

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > From: Penny <preciouspenny3@ yahoo.com>

> > Subject: Re: Question about morphine treatments

> > ...

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Date: Friday, January 15, 2010, 12:00 AM

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Hi Lyncia,

> >

> > I've had migraines for years. I don't think I had anymore when I had

> > cirrhosis than normal. You never had migraines before this?

> >

> > Penny

> >

> >

> > > >

> > > > Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can

> gain

> > some

> > > > type of support for our family and get some questions answered by

> > people who

> > > > are both patients and caregivers.

> > > >

> > > > My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a

> > year ago

> > > > (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen

> > years

> > > > until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be

> > considered

> > > > for an evaluation for the transplant list.

> > > >

> > > > He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple

> of

> > > > weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more.

> When

> > he

> > > > goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in

> > pain --

> > > > even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give

> him

> > > > morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last

> > long

> > > > without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the

> > conclusion

> > > > that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

> > > >

> > > > My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes

> > for his

> > > > appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some

> > light

> > > > on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a

> > caregiver

> > > > can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common

> > for

> > > > patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it

> > become a

> > > > " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions,

> > can you

> > > > share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

> > > >

> > > > If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it

> and

> > it

> > > > has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

> > > >

> > > > Thanks for your input!

> > > >

> > > > in Virginia

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

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Posted
Posted

 Yes, you'll have to get a perscription for more pads. They don't

last forever! Check with your doc avbbout using it other places on your body

before you

do.                                   

                                    Love,Jill

 

We don't remember days, we remember moments.

Life is not measured by the breaths we take,but by the moments that take our

breath away.

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 6:23:54 PM

Subject: Re: Re: Question about morphine treatments

....

 

Thanks, I had electric shock therapy in a physical therapy setting, and it

was great. Hoping this will do as much. They only gave me four sticky

patches for the leads, will I have to get more? I will be instructed how

to use it on Tuesday when I have a dr. appt in the same town the PT is

located. Seems like the pain is bothering me since they delivered it

yesterday, but figure that is all in my mind since I know it is sitting

here. I plan to use it on my knees and feet and hands as well as on my

spine. Jan H

On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 6:09 PM, Jill <jillkstewart@ yahoo.com>wrote:

> I have a TENS unit I use for pain management.. ...I use it mostly for my

> back and spine problems,but my orthopedic surgeon ahs told me to use it

> on both knees for unrelenting pain there also. It does help,....interrupts

> the nerve pathways.

>

>

> Love,Jill

>

> We don't remember days, we remember moments.

> Life is not measured by the breaths we take,but by the moments that take

> our breath away.

>

>

>

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: Jan Holman <janholmangmail (DOT) com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 1:51:34 PM

> Subject: Re: Re: Question about morphine

> treatments ...

>

>

> Have any of you tried a tens (transcutaneous Electrical Nerve Stimulator)

> unit. My pain management doctor prescribed one for me because my pain isn't

> confined to one area. Depending on how I move or what i do, it moves

> around. Constant is pain in my neck and lower spine. Neck pain is the

> most troublesome right now because my neck is weak and after sitting here

> or

> reading or playing my keyboard for only short periods, my neck doesn't want

> to hold my head up. Anyway, it was delivered yesterday, but I have to wait

> until Tuesday so I can go to the closest physical therapy department to

> find

> out how to use it. I have heard that people with neuropathy sometimes get

> relief from the pain when using one, but other have no relief. Jan H

>

> On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 11:38 AM, wendy miller <italybell69@ yahoo.com

> >wrote:

>

> > Lyncia,you know I am listed also,and go to pain managment. has your team

> > given you any bad responce for you taking the Norco? Just seems like that

> > might work for my back,just curious.Hugs,

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: Lyncia <lmlangdonyahoo (DOT) com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 4:17:08 AM

> > Subject: Re: Re: Question about morphine

> > treatments ...

> >

> > These are the first ones that I have ever had......

> >

> >

> >

> > Thanks for this day and for our tomorrows

> >

> > Love, Lyncia

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > From: Penny <preciouspenny3@ yahoo.com>

> > Subject: Re: Question about morphine treatments

> > ...

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Date: Friday, January 15, 2010, 12:00 AM

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Hi Lyncia,

> >

> > I've had migraines for years. I don't think I had anymore when I had

> > cirrhosis than normal. You never had migraines before this?

> >

> > Penny

> >

> >

> > > >

> > > > Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can

> gain

> > some

> > > > type of support for our family and get some questions answered by

> > people who

> > > > are both patients and caregivers.

> > > >

> > > > My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a

> > year ago

> > > > (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen

> > years

> > > > until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be

> > considered

> > > > for an evaluation for the transplant list.

> > > >

> > > > He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple

> of

> > > > weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more.

> When

> > he

> > > > goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in

> > pain --

> > > > even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give

> him

> > > > morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last

> > long

> > > > without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the

> > conclusion

> > > > that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

> > > >

> > > > My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes

> > for his

> > > > appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some

> > light

> > > > on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a

> > caregiver

> > > > can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common

> > for

> > > > patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it

> > become a

> > > > " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions,

> > can you

> > > > share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

> > > >

> > > > If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it

> and

> > it

> > > > has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

> > > >

> > > > Thanks for your input!

> > > >

> > > > in Virginia

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

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Guest guest

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Posted
Posted

I had to google this to know what it was, but I think this is the type of thing

my chiropractor used to use on me in the 90's for migraine headaches, and it was

great!

Penny

> > > >

> > > > Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain

> > some

> > > > type of support for our family and get some questions answered by

> > people who

> > > > are both patients and caregivers.

> > > >

> > > > My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a

> > year ago

> > > > (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen

> > years

> > > > until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be

> > considered

> > > > for an evaluation for the transplant list.

> > > >

> > > > He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

> > > > weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When

> > he

> > > > goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in

> > pain --

> > > > even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

> > > > morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last

> > long

> > > > without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the

> > conclusion

> > > > that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

> > > >

> > > > My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes

> > for his

> > > > appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some

> > light

> > > > on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a

> > caregiver

> > > > can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common

> > for

> > > > patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it

> > become a

> > > > " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions,

> > can you

> > > > share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

> > > >

> > > > If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and

> > it

> > > > has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

> > > >

> > > > Thanks for your input!

> > > >

> > > > in Virginia

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

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Share on other sites
Guest guest

Guest guest

Posted
Posted

I have already talked to the doctor about it. she said to use it wherever

it helps. Hope it helps all over. Jan H

On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 9:18 PM, Jill wrote:

> Yes, you'll have to get a perscription for more pads. They don't

> last forever! Check with your doc avbbout using it other places on your body

> before you do.

> Love,Jill

>

> We don't remember days, we remember moments.

> Life is not measured by the breaths we take,but by the moments that take

> our breath away.

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: livercirrhosissupport

> Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 6:23:54 PM

> Subject: Re: Re: Question about morphine

> treatments ...

>

>

> Thanks, I had electric shock therapy in a physical therapy setting, and it

> was great. Hoping this will do as much. They only gave me four sticky

> patches for the leads, will I have to get more? I will be instructed how

> to use it on Tuesday when I have a dr. appt in the same town the PT is

> located. Seems like the pain is bothering me since they delivered it

> yesterday, but figure that is all in my mind since I know it is sitting

> here. I plan to use it on my knees and feet and hands as well as on my

> spine. Jan H

> On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 6:09 PM, Jill <jillkstewart@ yahoo.com

> >wrote:

>

> > I have a TENS unit I use for pain management.. ...I use it mostly for my

> > back and spine problems,but my orthopedic surgeon ahs told me to use it

> > on both knees for unrelenting pain there also. It does

> help,....interrupts

> > the nerve pathways.

> >

> >

> > Love,Jill

> >

> > We don't remember days, we remember moments.

> > Life is not measured by the breaths we take,but by the moments that take

> > our breath away.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: Jan Holman <janholmangmail (DOT) com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 1:51:34 PM

> > Subject: Re: Re: Question about morphine

> > treatments ...

> >

> >

> > Have any of you tried a tens (transcutaneous Electrical Nerve Stimulator)

> > unit. My pain management doctor prescribed one for me because my pain

> isn't

> > confined to one area. Depending on how I move or what i do, it moves

> > around. Constant is pain in my neck and lower spine. Neck pain is the

> > most troublesome right now because my neck is weak and after sitting here

> > or

> > reading or playing my keyboard for only short periods, my neck doesn't

> want

> > to hold my head up. Anyway, it was delivered yesterday, but I have to

> wait

> > until Tuesday so I can go to the closest physical therapy department to

> > find

> > out how to use it. I have heard that people with neuropathy sometimes get

> > relief from the pain when using one, but other have no relief. Jan H

> >

> > On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 11:38 AM, wendy miller <italybell69@ yahoo.com

> > >wrote:

> >

> > > Lyncia,you know I am listed also,and go to pain managment. has your

> team

> > > given you any bad responce for you taking the Norco? Just seems like

> that

> > > might work for my back,just curious.Hugs,

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > > From: Lyncia <lmlangdonyahoo (DOT) com>

> > > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > > Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 4:17:08 AM

> > > Subject: Re: Re: Question about morphine

> > > treatments ...

> > >

> > > These are the first ones that I have ever had......

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Thanks for this day and for our tomorrows

> > >

> > > Love, Lyncia

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > From: Penny <preciouspenny3@ yahoo.com>

> > > Subject: Re: Question about morphine

> treatments

> > > ...

> > > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > > Date: Friday, January 15, 2010, 12:00 AM

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Hi Lyncia,

> > >

> > > I've had migraines for years. I don't think I had anymore when I had

> > > cirrhosis than normal. You never had migraines before this?

> > >

> > > Penny

> > >

> > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can

> > gain

> > > some

> > > > > type of support for our family and get some questions answered by

> > > people who

> > > > > are both patients and caregivers.

> > > > >

> > > > > My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a

> > > year ago

> > > > > (47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen

> > > years

> > > > > until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be

> > > considered

> > > > > for an evaluation for the transplant list.

> > > > >

> > > > > He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every

> couple

> > of

> > > > > weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more.

> > When

> > > he

> > > > > goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is

> in

> > > pain --

> > > > > even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give

> > him

> > > > > morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot

> last

> > > long

> > > > > without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the

> > > conclusion

> > > > > that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

> > > > >

> > > > > My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he

> goes

> > > for his

> > > > > appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed

> some

> > > light

> > > > > on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a

> > > caregiver

> > > > > can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it

> common

> > > for

> > > > > patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it

> > > become a

> > > > > " hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these

> questions,

> > > can you

> > > > > share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

> > > > >

> > > > > If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it

> > and

> > > it

> > > > > has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks for your input!

> > > > >

> > > > > in Virginia

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

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Posted
Posted

I love the analogy I see here!!! A lot of us refer to the Hep C virus as the

" dragon " . So, I'm picturing myself on that dragon for these last 8 years and

tucked right up behind it's ears!!

Truly, I don't believe that I could have gone through two treatments without my

12 step program to fall back on!! Some days have been better than others; but,

at least those steps were constantly creeping back inside my head.

Gloria

________________________________

Thanks, Gloria. I am glad you and your doctor are both aware that it is a

minefield for you. I liken it to riding on the back of a great dragon. If I keep

my body behind his teeth, I am ok. Do my program every single day, especially

step 10. That is how I have been able so far to stay behind the head of the

dragon. Them's some big teeth. Love, Bobby

(saadn'leelt- da ya day- n'zho)

long life, old age, everything good-Apache prayer

____________ _________ _________ __

From: Gloria <gadamscanyahoo (DOT) ca>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Thu, January 14, 2010 8:58:39 PM

Subject: Re: Question about morphine treatments ...

An extremely well written piece about addiction, whether it be to alcohol or

drugs!!

There was a time, just before I moved in with an alcoholic/drug addict, that I

could only afford to go out to where the action was every other weekend.

However, little did I know that the phenomenon of that craving did not start

with the 6th or 10th drink. It actually started with the very first one!!

Also, I taught my son all he could stand about additiction. Thus, thank

heavens, he was able to pull away from a drug addiction by the time he was about

19. Always told him this " If you need some substance to change the way you

think and feel, chances are you could get addicted " . Sure, I take

anti-depressants at the moment and even a happy pill; but, not only am I aware

of the mine field that I am treading - so is my Dr.

Gloria

____________ _________ _________ __

Hi, . I am Bobby, a 46 year old recovering alcoholic with end stage liver

disease. I was diagnosed in 2006 after a hellish summer of severe pain in my

liver. My pain was so bad that I could not eat and led to me losing 100 lbs! I

was never able to lose weight after a lifetime of struggling to do so, and this

shocked my doctor. The pain is in my upper right and upper left quadrants. My

spleen is shown on CT scan to be enlarged from a normal size of 11 cm to 16 cm.

20 cm is when they consider removing it out of fear of rupturing it.I also have

pain in my right upper quadrant. My liver doctor says that there is no way to

know for sure what exactly is causing the pain( the liver is the biggest

suspect, but several other explanations exist), but suggested that I see a pain

doctor. I was put on morphine after trials with other opiates failed. Pure

opiates are non toxic to the liver while almost every other sort of pain

reliever is toxic to the liver.

Despite that, many people I know who have liver disease are taking the more

toxic medicine, even though it is known to cause further harm to the liver. This

is mainly because schedule three narcotics are easier for a doctor to prescribe

because of added tylenol which limits how much a person can safely take, while

schedule two drugs require jumping through many hoops, and most have no upper

limits, and can be abused more easily. I was very much against taking any kind

of pills my entire life and was very very reluctant to seek pain treatment. I

have learned a lot and found out that I was wrong in my attitude, and sadly, the

bias against opioids is tremendous, and a person in true pain will have many

obstacles to getting treatment, not just from the medical community,but also

from friends and family and society as a whole. This insanity has led to some

countries to totally banning the use of morphine even for the terminally ill and

severe cancer patients!

I take the same dose every day exactly as prescribed, and have not sought any

further escalation out of fear of the slippery slope. My life has improved, but

I still disabled by my many complications. I attend 12 step meetings, and have a

sponsor. This is the only was a reputable pain doctor would trust a patient with

a past history of substance abuse, though current treatment guidelines do not

exclude a person from getting pain treatment just because of a past history.

There is simply no way of knowing if your cousin is in pain or not, however if

he has transferred his addiction to opiates (morphine) he has surely entered in

to a new hell. Morphine will sometimes produce a euphoric feeling, but after a

week or so, these feeling disappear forever. Only a larger dose or different

type will re-create these feelings. This is how addicts become addicts. To

purposely seek out this feeling is a very very dangerous thing. It will lead a

person to total ruin.

With alcohol or any other drug, once the phenomenon or craving starts, then the

person will need daily doses just to not be very very ill.

I strongly suggest alanon for any one directly involved in this mans life. to

not do so will ensure a co-dependency which can ruin the co-dependent' s life

just as thoroughly as the addict or alcoholic will ruin his.

good luck, I hope I have provided you with some answeres to your questions.

Love, Bobby

____________ _________ _________ __

From: -Dooley <kwdooleycomcast (DOT) net>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Wed, January 13, 2010 5:31:29 PM

Subject: Question about morphine treatments ...

Hello! I am , a new member here with the group, hoping I can gain some

type of support for our family and get some questions answered by people who

are both patients and caregivers.

My cousin was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver approximately a year ago

(47 years old). He is an alcoholic and drank heavily from his teen years

until six months ago when he finally stopped in order to even be considered

for an evaluation for the transplant list.

He has been in and out of the hospital very frequently (every couple of

weeks) for several days at a time for the past six months or more. When he

goes to the hospital, they give him morphine. He tells them he is in pain --

even when he is not in pain, he tells them he is so they will give him

morphine. Sadly, when he comes home from the hospital, he cannot last long

without needing to go back for more morphine. We have come to the conclusion

that he has transferred his addiction from alcohol to morphine.

My aunt is going to talk to the doctor later this month when he goes for his

appointment. In the meantime, I am wondering if anyone can shed some light

on this thing with the morphine. If you as a patient or you as a caregiver

can help, my family and I would certainly appreciate it. Is it common for

patients to receive morphine regularly for pain management? Has it become a

" hospital-administe red " addiction? If yes to any of these questions, can you

share how it is being or was dealt with and what we can expect?

If he needs the morphine, that's one thing. If he does not need it and it

has become a transferred addiction, that is another thing.

Thanks for your input!

in Virginia

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