RE: Re: update - vitamins, blood vessels

[Guest guest]

I want to talk with your doctor about

reducing serotonin because the overabundance of it causes nerve damage and

burning by restricting the blood vessels. This is also part of why your

heart races.I would also like to suggest to your doctor that you be placed

on Alprazolam (Xanax here, I don't know what you call it there) 0.25 mg

twice a day for a short time. This is a very low dose but also seems to

relax blood vessels.

AAAARRRGGGGGHHH!!!! ! I STILL have the racing heart thing. It's like having an alien in my chest, as Rob would say. It was so bad a few years ago that when my GP listened to my heart he pronounced that I had aortic stenosis and ordered an emergency echocardiogram, which, of course, came out perfectly normal and the cardiologist said that my heart was fine, beautiful in fact. So I've lived with the racing heart, taking Inositol and at various times .125 mgs of xanax, but I have not taken any xanax now in months and months and months. But I noticed the other day while sitting here quietly that my heart started to race. I took some inositol, did some breathing exercises, and tried not to freak out. It eventually calmed down but it's been a constant and periodic problem for me since I took Paxil 7 years ago. I never ever ever had anything like this until I took that damn drug. What say you????? I'm actually going to the doctor next week -- haven't been in nearly 3 years, and I'm wondering if I should get a script of xanax just for emergency purposes.

"Blind Reason"

a novel of pharmaceutical intrigue

Think your antidepressant is safe? Think again. It's

Unsafe At Any Dose

[Guest guest]

& years and your heart is still racing?

Yes. Sometimes it's worse than other times, somedays it doesn't happen at all, and sometimes it happens out of the blue. Lovely, eh?

"Blind Reason"

a novel of pharmaceutical intrigue

Think your antidepressant is safe? Think again. It's

Unsafe At Any Dose

[Guest guest]

I shall get some Aconitum Napellus 30c and see if this helps with the panic then.

Many Thanks

Re: update - vitamins, blood vessels

Dear Jan, You said:<<Wouldn't Rescue Remedy be a good resource whenpanic starts to emerge from the heart racing???Just wonderin' .... >> ** A much better resource is Aconitum Napellus 30C. Whenever it'spanic, it's Aconite. You can't beat the response you get with it. RR isnot truly indicated for the type of situation described above.Regards,To subscribe to the off-topic list go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/socialWandR/

[Guest guest]

Glitter is amazzing i dont' know how she deals with all

that paxil did to her. I don't know how she stays in such a great

mood.

What's my choice? Do I have choices? Is it suicide? Is it wallowing in a pool of self-pity and anger? Or is it carrying on and doing the best I can with what's left of my brain. And I'm not always in a good mood. Au contraire. I have truly rotten days, and days when I have to kick myself in the butt to get out of my negative thinking pattern, and just go on with life, and appreciate the good things that I have like living in a beautiful place, in a darling house, surrounded by beautiful nature, and I get to grow things like orchids and oranges and lemons and my veggie and herb garden, in a place that gets 300+ years of sunshine, with few neighbors or noise or congestion, where the air is clean and my water comes from a well fed by the Rocky MOuntains. Oh, and I have a wonderful husband who's stuck by me through the worst of all of this and who loves me even if I AM a mess. Those are things for which to be truly grateful. Of course, I miss my other life, but there is more to life than what I was doing back then which was having as much fun as I possible could. I did most of the things I always dreamed of doing, so I don't have many regrets, and I've found that there are so many different things in life to inspire you, and sometimes those things come to us when we least expect it or through circumstances which we would not have chosen. I have a lot of anger toward Big Pharma and the corrupt FDA and the stupid doctor who convinced me Paxil was the answer to my problems. They'll have to kill me before I give up on bringing them all to accountability. Our lives don't always turn out the way we planned, and if I didn't love the sheer act of just being alive so very much, I probably would've whacked myself during the worst of my Paxil experience. But just this morning, four deer were right outside my window, less than 3 feet away from me. My white orchid that smells like lemons and vanilla has three huge blossoms on it. Two other orchids are getting ready to bloom, too. So I just marvel at all of this and thank God I'm not in worse shape.

"Blind Reason"

a novel of pharmaceutical intrigue

Think your antidepressant is safe? Think again. It's

Unsafe At Any Dose

[Guest guest]

Sounds like you live in such a wonderful place Glitter. But I'm sorry I still reckon you are pretty amazing.

That's sweet, kiddo. I'm just trying to inspire others NOT to give up, even if your life changes drastically. I'm know you'll make it through this experience, because that's all there really is in the end, and the only way you can get to where you're supposed to be. As the saying goes, When you're going through hell, DON'T STOP!!!

"Blind Reason"

a novel of pharmaceutical intrigue

Think your antidepressant is safe? Think again. It's

Unsafe At Any Dose

[Guest guest]

Sounds like you live in such a wonderful place Glitter. But I'm sorry I still reckon you are pretty amazing.

Re: Re: update - vitamins, blood vessels

Glitter is amazzing i dont' know how she deals with all that paxil did to her. I don't know how she stays in such a great mood.What's my choice? Do I have choices? Is it suicide? Is it wallowing in a pool of self-pity and anger? Or is it carrying on and doing the best I can with what's left of my brain. And I'm not always in a good mood. Au contraire. I have truly rotten days, and days when I have to kick myself in the butt to get out of my negative thinking pattern, and just go on with life, and appreciate the good things that I have like living in a beautiful place, in a darling house, surrounded by beautiful nature, and I get to grow things like orchids and oranges and lemons and my veggie and herb garden, in a place that gets 300+ years of sunshine, with few neighbors or noise or congestion, where the air is clean and my water comes from a well fed by the Rocky MOuntains. Oh, and I have a wonderful husband who's stuck by me through the worst of all of this and who loves me even if I AM a mess. Those are things for which to be truly grateful. Of course, I miss my other life, but there is more to life than what I was doing back then which was having as much fun as I possible could. I did most of the things I always dreamed of doing, so I don't have many regrets, and I've found that there are so many different things in life to inspire you, and sometimes those things come to us when we least expect it or through circumstances which we would not have chosen. I have a lot of anger toward Big Pharma and the corrupt FDA and the stupid doctor who convinced me Paxil was the answer to my problems. They'll have to kill me before I give up on bringing them all to accountability. Our lives don't always turn out the way we planned, and if I didn't love the sheer act of just being alive so very much, I probably would've whacked myself during the worst of my Paxil experience. But just this morning, four deer were right outside my window, less than 3 feet away from me. My white orchid that smells like lemons and vanilla has three huge blossoms on it. Two other orchids are getting ready to bloom, too. So I just marvel at all of this and thank God I'm not in worse shape.

"Blind Reason" a novel of pharmaceutical intrigueThink your antidepressant is safe? Think again. It'sUnsafe At Any DoseTo subscribe to the off-topic list go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/socialWandR/

[Guest guest]

catherine,

thank you. i am also having such problems with the foot pain, mostly, but

also alot of other joint and muscle pains. From what you said, it appears

that staying away from caffiene would be a good thing, would it not?

also the doc prescribed xanax for me when i told him i was dropping paxil

but was afraid of the withdrawals, but after reading about the increased

possibility of seizures, and since my whole realization of ads equals bad

came from a seizure triggered by wellbutrin, well. i never filled it.

i don't seem to have the racing heart, is there something else that

" relaxes " the blood vessels? I'm already taking gingko, ala, magnesium,

horse chestnut. (with the fish oil and glucosomine/MSM) and still have

trouble with any pressure on my feet.

susan

Re: update - vitamins, blood vessels

Dear List Members,

has given me permission to post a private email exchange we had.

I have a strong preference for doing as much communicating on the list as

possible because this way, more than one person has the potential to

benefit.

Thanks, !

Re: update - vitamins, blood vessels

Dear ,

You said:

<<Thanks for your reply and all your information. I did give my GP your E

mail address on Friday, I can only hope she uses it. I do not think she is

to confident using computers because she said she would rather speak on the

telephone, but I told her you were in the US.

OK, I am slightly confused by your Email , probably information overload for

my small brain! I thought Solgar was a good brand that's why I went for that

one and it is the one uses to, I shall look at the link you give

now.>>

** Sorry, I did say Solgar was a good brand. I didn't know they were

selling oyster shell calcium. I do believe that my article in the files on

calcium gives some recommendations.

You said:

<< I am a bit confused over this :

I had said:

" Alot of the pain you're feeling is from the damage to blood vessels caused

by diabetes as well as serotonin. " I want to talk with your doctor about

reducing serotonin because the overabundance of it causes nerve damage and

burning by restricting the blood vessels. This is also part of why your

heart races.I would also like to suggest to your doctor that you be placed

on Alprazolam (Xanax here, I don't know what you call it there) 0.25 mg

twice a day for a short time. This is a very low dose but also seems to

relax blood vessels. What drugs, if any, are you taking right now? " >>

You () replied:

<<You are right I have been diagonosed with type 2 diabetes, but I do

regularly test my sugars three times a day and they are never high, never

above 7 and usually 5.6 after 2hrs after food. I thought the diabetes was

only a problem if the sugars were uncontrolled? >>

** Well, not quite. Nerve damage is likely due to a combination of

factors:

-- metabolic factors, such as high blood glucose, long duration of diabetes,

possibly low levels of insulin, and abnormal blood fat levels

-- neurovascular factors, leading to damage to the blood vessels that carry

oxygen and nutrients to the nerves

-- autoimmune factors that cause inflammation in nerves

-- mechanical injury to nerves, such as carpal tunnel syndrome

-- inherited traits that increase susceptibility to nerve disease

-- lifestyle factors such as smoking or alcohol use

Considering that you have diabetes at such a young age I can't discount

the possiblity of nervous system damage from it. Do you take any medication

for the diabetes?

You said:

<<How does one reduce serotonin? I know this is wrong now but I was told

that the anti depressants increased serotonin levels and that is why they

made you feel better. >>

** You're right. They increase the amount of serotonin in the synapses

by inhibiting reuptake. This delivers more serotonin to the receptors than

your brain would ever do on its own. In order to protect itself, the brain

kills off some receptors and slows down its production of serotonin.

There is also some evidence that serotonin production is increased but

the drug companies will not admit to this.

When you stop taking an SSRI your production and assimilation of serotonin

is not working properly. As time goes on, some people have too much

serotonin they can't assimilate while others seem to have too little. The

former is much more common than the latter. This can be identified by

certain symptoms people report.

Excess serotonin damages blood vessels. It constricts them, too. This is

at least part of what is happining to you. If it wasn't happening prior to

the taking of the SSSRI or the reduction of the SSRI you can pretty much be

assured that it is the SSRI reduction/discontinuation that is causing this.

..

Another thing SSRIs do is damage the hypothalamus-pituitary-adrenal axis

(HPAA). This causes cortisol to fluctuate wildly. Most people cannot get

readings of high cortisol because of these fluctuations. Prior to SSRIs, it

was unusual to see fluctuations. If cortisol was high or low it remained

that way.

Phosphatidylserine (PS) decreases serotonin. It is a naturally

occurring, phospholipid nutrient needed by all the cells but most

concentrated in the brain. Its relative abundance in this organ reflects

its proven involvement in an assortment of nerve cell functions, including

nerve transmitter release and synaptic activity. Phosphatidylserine also

down-regulates cortisol release. This is a very simple view of PS. It is

quite complex.

Considering the elevated liver enzymes I would also suggest

phosphatidylcholine (PC) which improves enzymatic and other biochemical

actions of the cell membranes in the liver.

You said:-

<<The heart really pounds all the time, the doctor says it is because I am

so unfit. What is Alprazolam? , why did I feel none of this when I

was on the cipromil?>>

** It did at first, didn't it, until changes occurred to accommodate the

drugs. Now, your heart pounds for many reasons having to do with serotonin

and damage to your blood vessels and HPAA which governs the autonomic

nervous system, which in turn, governs all smooth muscles. The heart is a

smooth muscle.

Alprazolam is Xanax, a benzodiazepine. It wouldn't necessarily have to be

alprazolam, it could be diazepam which is Valium, also a benzodiazepine. If

you were to take this I would keep the dose at 2.5 mg. 2x a day. This way,

it will not be so difficult to discontinue.

You said:

<<Do you still want me to start taking the gingko and ala??>>

** Yes.

You said:

<< I am not taking any drugs at the moment, the feet have been awful today

so I wonder if the celebrex did help slightly, although I didn't take it

yesterday and they weren't to bad?>>

** At this point I'd stay away from the Celebrex. It may have its own

set of problems. Drugs like this should never be tried until all other

avenues have been exhausted. We're far from that.

You said:

<< At the moment, I am taking Magnesium but no calcium, fish oils, and the

horse chestnut. I do believe what you say about God, I keep praying to Him

asking him to show me the way to go, I just get so scared. I am trying to

understand everything you tell me , I really am. >>

** I know you're trying. Add the ginkgo to this and the ALA. Then, I

want you to begin taking Hawthorn herbal tincture or extract (it's the same

thing).. It's used for increased coronary and myocardial circulatory

perfusion, reduction in peripheral vascular resistance. In cases of cardiac

insufficiency it resulted in an increase in cardiac work tolerance, increase

in ejection fraction and rise in anaerobic threshold.

It is also indicated where ordinary physical activity results in fatigue,

palpitation, dyspnea, or anginal pain.

You said:

<<I really hope my doctor Emails you soon , I am so scared my heart

will give out and I will have a heart attack, I guess then at least I will

be with God and safe. >>

** Please feel free to pass all emails on to your doctor. I would hope

that if she has any questions she would ask them.

You're not going to have a heart attack, hon, but what is happening to

you is not from being unfit. A former athlete your age cannot be that unfit

for this to happen. This is happening because of the SSRI. There are some

people who should never take these. You are one of them. If I had a dollar

for every person in the past 17 years who has told me about their heart

pounding after discontinuing a psychotropic drug I would be a very rich

woman today.

I would also recommend the PS and PC mentioned above.

You said:

<<Thankyou for everything .>>

** You're welcome, .

BTW, may I post this to the list? There are others out there who would

benefit from it. I can delete certain info if you want (name, whatever

else).

Regards,

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