Re: Fw: That Lovely Orgaan the Pancreas

[Guest guest]

Earl Bookheimer wrote:

<< For 4 yrs prior to being diagnoised i had wwhat they call >PANCREATIC

DIAHRREA i had to always go diaahrea right after i ate. I had my gall

bladder removed in 86 so it was not that. I also had severe abdominal

cramping. I was put on a pancreatic medication i forget the name >>

Earl, can you get more information on this, plus what medication they gave

you? There must be another term for this condition. I did a web search using

AltaVista, and nowhere on the web is there a term " pancreatic diarrhea " . And

yet I have a sister I suspect of being diabetic who experiences this. And

chronic diarrhea was what propelled me to finally self-diagnose using urine

strips after my doctor missed the symptoms for years. (I knew I was very

ill, and then I read a magazine article by an ER surgeon that began:

" Patient was a 57-year-old woman whose only sign of diabetes was diarrhea

.... " )

Susie

[Guest guest]

Re: diarrhea a sign of diabetes

Susie -

This is the first time I have heard of this, but for me it would make a

lot of sense.

I have heart disease, some ginginvitis issues (getting better I believe

due to

improved BGs), etc. When they discovered my heart disease, it was noted

that I have 'a lot of collateral growth surrounding the left coronary

artery (tiny new capillaries that augment/supplement the weakened right

side of my heart). The doctor said that I had had heart disease for a

long time in order for these collaterals to be so well-developed. I was

haaving CHEST PAINS, NUMBNESS, AND DIAHRRHEA starting about 10 years

ago...this might indicate that it all (diabetes

and heart disease) started back then, which would make sense to me.

I'll try to find more info about this 'theory'. Thanks...as usual...for

sharing your wealth of knowledge, Susie!

[Guest guest]

if i eat a high carb lunch, i can hardly make it home to go the bathroom -

and if i eat sugar -- i have to get up during the night to urinate - and

sometimes ... i don't make it and soak the bed and my husband - i have

learned to be careful of the sugars - a new Friendly ice cream place just

opened - we went last night - while dh and the kids ate sundaes, i had a

delicious (?) salad with no dressing - and half a glass of water with lots

of lemon and a sweetnlow pac - it was ok and i behaved last night.

nancy

At 10:03 AM 9/4/99 -0400, you wrote:

>

>

> Masters wrote:

>

><< The doctor said that I had had heart disease for a long time in order for

>these collaterals to be so well-developed. I was having CHEST PAINS,

>NUMBNESS, AND DIAHRRHEA starting about 10 years ao...this might indicate

>that it all (diabetes and heart disease) started back then, which would make

>sense to me. >>

>

>I had two heart attacks (Apr. & Oct. '98), and the doctors think I grew

>collaterals as well. I thought the heart was acting up again this summer,

>but finally decided the chest pain was part of the injuries from the lawn

>tractor rollover. I feel fine now. I have thought that the diarrhea was just

>another way for our bodies to dump excess glucose when it spills over into

>the urine. My sister mentions she only gets the diarrhea on weekends, after

>she goes out to eat big restaurant meals with her women friends, so it makes

>sense if this is her body's way of dumping glucose. She is a carbaholic,

>naturally. And yes, she gets up at lot to pee at night as well. She seems to

>be in the hypoglycemic stage of early diabetes. And she describes things so

>funny! She said, " When I drink Coke, I ride my bicycle in bed. (restless leg

>syndrome, also caused by elevated glucose levels)

>

>Susie

>

>

>

>---------------------------

[Guest guest]

Masters wrote:

<< The doctor said that I had had heart disease for a long time in order for

these collaterals to be so well-developed. I was having CHEST PAINS,

NUMBNESS, AND DIAHRRHEA starting about 10 years ao...this might indicate

that it all (diabetes and heart disease) started back then, which would make

sense to me. >>

I had two heart attacks (Apr. & Oct. '98), and the doctors think I grew

collaterals as well. I thought the heart was acting up again this summer,

but finally decided the chest pain was part of the injuries from the lawn

tractor rollover. I feel fine now. I have thought that the diarrhea was just

another way for our bodies to dump excess glucose when it spills over into

the urine. My sister mentions she only gets the diarrhea on weekends, after

she goes out to eat big restaurant meals with her women friends, so it makes

sense if this is her body's way of dumping glucose. She is a carbaholic,

naturally. And yes, she gets up at lot to pee at night as well. She seems to

be in the hypoglycemic stage of early diabetes. And she describes things so

funny! She said, " When I drink Coke, I ride my bicycle in bed. (restless leg

syndrome, also caused by elevated glucose levels)

Susie

[Guest guest]

,

Wow, that would be real hard to just have a plain salad while the family was

having ice cream, whew. Give yourself a big pat on the back! = )

In addition to the wonderful salads I had yesterday at the fair I had prob.

1/4 tsp. of an Orange Merlino which is like a divine orange icee and 1 french

fry. I also had a Hawaiian Shaved ice, plain. Different, but ya gotta do

what ya gotta do! When I came home my bs was 95.

Meniowl@...

type 2, dx 7/99, d & water aerobics

In a message dated 09/04/1999 7:02:23 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

duffnb@... writes:

<< while dh and the kids ate sundaes, i had a

delicious (?) salad with no dressing - and half a glass of water with lots

of lemon and a sweetnlow pac - it was ok and i behaved last night.

>>

[Guest guest]

i blew it yesterday - we went school shopping and ... stopped a don pablos

for lunch - i had chicken tacos - last night my bs was 217 --

nancy hanging her head in shame

At 11:53 PM 9/4/99 -0400, you wrote:

>From: Meniowl@...

>

>,

>Wow, that would be real hard to just have a plain salad while the family was

>having ice cream, whew. Give yourself a big pat on the back! = )

>

>In addition to the wonderful salads I had yesterday at the fair I had prob.

>1/4 tsp. of an Orange Merlino which is like a divine orange icee and 1 french

>fry. I also had a Hawaiian Shaved ice, plain. Different, but ya gotta do

>what ya gotta do! When I came home my bs was 95.

>

>Meniowl@...

>type 2, dx 7/99, d & water aerobics

>

>

>In a message dated 09/04/1999 7:02:23 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

>duffnb@... writes:

>

><< while dh and the kids ate sundaes, i had a

> delicious (?) salad with no dressing - and half a glass of water with lots

> of lemon and a sweetnlow pac - it was ok and i behaved last night.

> >>

>

>---------------------------

[Guest guest]

It's OK , you can lift your head again. Just learn from your mistakes.

Next time you want those tacos, go ahead and have them. Just don't eat the

tortillas. Skip the beans and rice and have a salad with the tacos and/or

maybe even a chili rellano (chili stuffed with cheese and fried in egg

batter). I know that there is some flour in the batter but way better than

eating tortillas.

Try, try, try to not let those bs rise up like that. I know it is hard,

especially when you are not on any meds, but think of the long term results.

Did you ever go see those pictures of diabetic feet that Susie posted the

links to? Makes me shudder.

Meniowl@...

type 2, dx 7/99, d & water aerobics

In a message dated 09/05/1999 6:26:49 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

duffnb@... writes:

<< i blew it yesterday - we went school shopping and ... stopped a don pablos

for lunch - i had chicken tacos - last night my bs was 217 --

nancy hanging her head in shame

>>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 99-09-05 09:26:46 EDT, you write:

<< i blew it yesterday - we went school shopping and ... stopped a don pablos

for lunch - i had chicken tacos - last night my bs was 217 --

nancy hanging her head in shame

>>

Hi, , sorry you fell off the wagon...but we all do it now and then. Just

pick yourself up and move on ahead! Next time you maybe youcould eat the

filling only ? (Or better yet, skip it, of course) ... Vicki

[Guest guest]

----

If you will pick your head up, so will I. Went to my parents and didn't

even think about what I was putting on my plate. I looked down and had corn,

stuffing & a baked potato along with a pork chop and salad. I think my brain

left me for a few minutes. Ate one bite of the potato, 1/2 the stuffing I

had taken (mom really makes the best:( and just a couple bites of the corn.

I could not believe I even put all that on my plate!!! Even with realizing

that I shouldn't be eating this stuff and not eating it all, I was still

about 20 point higher after 2 hrs. than I like to be. Guess when Mom cooked

I just went into eating mode as usual at her house.

valpoos@...

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 99-09-05 20:16:48 EDT, you write:

<< and stay away from the Haagen Das in the fridge >>

Hooray for you staying away from the fridge and the pizza...but why is there

even Haagan Das in your house? I wouldn't DARE have it around!

Try doing other things when you start getting pizza cravings! Something fun

that doesn't have anything to do with food. Distract yourself! Well, I know

how hard it is to stop thinking about foods we used to be able to eat and now

can't...but that kind of thinking leads ya down the primrose path the wrong

way. You've heard the saying " make lemonade out of lemons " ('scuse the food

metaphor!) ...well, that's where we need to go.

Take care. Vicki

[Guest guest]

food is the best - i love it - i am so hungry now - want to order a pizza

with extra cheese - we do have peaches and plums - will eat one of those

and stay away from the Haagen Das in the fridge - i am so hungry ---

love

nancy

At 07:39 PM 9/5/99 -0400, you wrote:

>From: ValPoos@...

>

>----

>

> If you will pick your head up, so will I. Went to my parents and didn't

>e

[Guest guest]

I have learned that educating My Parents about Diet for my treatment

has been one of the more frustrating things to deal with at times. my Father

who is also a TypeII has no self control and has a carbo addiction that he

just can not believe is part of the problem , will not go into the morbid

details but suffice to say after a recent visit where i let him and his

family have my house while i moved in with my Grandmother during his visit I

needed to go through my Kitchen and remove things that i know from

experience and observation are unhealthy for me and countless other

diabetics concerned about long term health issues. now my mother on the

other hand after watching my sister Jeanne's diabetes KILL her only 2 months

ago has started to really pay attention when i say NO THANK YOU and will now

ask CAN YOU HAVE This i like this better than having to put myself in the

position of constantly telling my mom that something is not good for me so

now i see more salads and skinless chicken plus my mother who has always

been a good cook is taking this as a challenge to learn recipes to make

meals enjoyable and healthy for her whole family . I Place a good part of

the blame for my sisters death on the OUT dated notion about carbohydrates

and glycemic control as susie can tell you my sister was a carbo addict

and had readings in the high 200's only the week before her death and even

with my lectures and efforts she still placed her trust in the high

carbohydrate diet she was placed on as the best thing for her she was

getting as much as 400 grams a day and suffering i was eating as little as

25 grams a day and had bg readings that were fantastic . i sat down with

her one night and we tested at regular intervals and watched her

responses to her BG's at 180 she was so hungry after only four hours PP that

she felt like she could not continue with out a snack , this was 4 hours

after a meal that had more CH at 1 time than i had the whole week and she

argued that this was all in the Books her educator said she needed to follow

.. ok My weekly rant is almost done but i think that if anybody is still

out on the fence about constant testing and following a diet that has

RESULTS not just any diet that is said to be a fits anybody WOE then maybe

this will help some people and also if there are any diabetics that are

having a difficult time convincing their families and loved ones to learn

about how to help then please let them know that one of the last things my

sister told me before she died was that she HAD to be doing it right since

my Father ate the same way and he was controlling his Diabetes with Diet and

exercise only which is only the lie my Father tells so that he can live in

Denial . But worse much Worse my mother will go to her grave believing that

if she had learned more about this disease and proper diet and control of

it and not allowed my sister to eat whatever she wanted whenever she wanted

my sister would be alive RIGHT NOW and my mother would not have to be taking

care of my sisters 10 month OLD Baby Girl Ember ,How would any of your

family feel in this situation ?my mother was looking forward to playing

Grandmother.....Now she gets to spend these years having to just be " Mom "

My continued prayers for all Diabetics for peace and comfort from The

source of all peace and comfort our Savior Jesus Christ . Sunday September

5,1999 Callender

valpoos@... wrote))) . Guess

when Mom cooked

> I just went into eating mode as usual at her house.

>

>

> valpoos@...

>

> ---------------------------

[Guest guest]

Bill, it' so nice to see you posting. The emotions in your post made me weep

in shared sadness for the loss of Jeanne ... and for the loss of dreams for

your hard-working mom ... and for the emptiness you feel and the frustration

from dealing with your dad and Jeanne and Jeanne's wrong-headed health care

givers.

I was waiting in the checkout line today and picked up a " Diabetics' Recipe

Book, " and right away I was muttering and shaking my head, then violently

slamming the book back into the rack. There were recipes in there with 60-70

grams/serving of carbohydrates. Why don't they just shoot us and get it over

with quickly??? We need to start yelling at people. This insanity must stop.

Diabetics cannot eat anywhere near the typical American quantities of

carbohydrates and thrive.

Susie

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 99-09-05 22:20:33 EDT, you write:

<< There were recipes in there with 60-70

grams/serving of carbohydrates. Why don't they just shoot us and get it over

with quickly??? We need to start yelling at people. This insanity must stop.

>>

STARTING WITH THE AMERICAN DIABETIC ASSOCIATION!

On another subject, Susie, are ya getting all ready for your trip? Vicki

[Guest guest]

Vicki writes:

<< On another subject, Susie, are ya getting all ready for your trip? >>

Rob and I are both soooo nervous. We are still the same shy kids from the

Midwest we were 35 years ago. But yeah ... I'll be out there in days. Rob is

a great dancer, and we both love music. I'm so much looking forward to

walking around and holding hands with him and checking out the restaurants

and listening to a lot of good music. Rob has spent his life working hard

and taking care of others. I hope that from now on, he can finally live for

himself and relax.

On another note, earlier this morning I wrote a really long reply to Meniowl

and it vanished. Well, I will try again ...

Susie

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 99-09-06 09:49:44 EDT, you write:

<< But yeah ... I'll be out there in days. >>

Well, we'll all miss you while you're in N'Orleans with Rob...I won't ask how

it went after your return, assuming that it went simply wonderfully. So have

a lovely trip and when you get back you'll have hundreds of posts waiting for

you! Good luck! Vicki

[Guest guest]

---

Sorry if I came across like my mom doesn't help me with my diet. In fact

she is extremely supportive but I've told her that just because I can't have

something I don't want everyone to do without. She actually had greenbeans,

which is the choice **I** should have made and a beautiful salad. I should

have had greenbeans, a big salad, a lean pork chop and maybe just a taste of

the stuffing. It was me that went into eating mode

valpoos@...

[Guest guest]

Re: Fw: That Lovely Orgaan the Pancreas

> From: ValPoos@...

>

> ---

> Sorry if I came across like my mom doesn't help me with my diet. In

fact

Val I Am Sorry If I Sounded Like I was venting At You In Particular it Just

Seemed Like an Appropriate Place To Jump In With My Rant-A-Matic , It Has

Been A Very Long Couple Of Months And I Needed To Get That Off My Chest.

Heaven Knows I Am Not Perfect Myself . But I keep On Trying. I Have Been

Busy Trying to get My act together...am in the process of applying For SSI

and SSD Due To An On The Job Injury That My DR's tell Me Is Going To Be

Permanent, sort Of Like Nueropathy it is no fun at all ASK Susie for more

details I do not need to brag <EG> so i am filling out paperwork all day

long or on the phone calling DR's or Attorny's so my day is fun-filled from

Sun up To Sun Down. am really just another scared diabetic nothing more

please forgive me.

Callender-------------------------------------------------------------------

-----

[Guest guest]

Hello everyone,

My name is Mai Atas, I am a new member . 24 years old student from Israel

I AM GLAD THAT WE HAVE A WAY TO COMMUNICATE, AND " MEET " OVER THE INTERNET,

AFTER ALL, YOU DON'T JUST MEET DIABETIC PEOPLE WHEN YOU GO OUT.

I THINK IT'S NICE TO SHARE OUR EXPERIANCES AND FEARS.

CAN ANYONE TELL ME A LITTLE ABOUT HOW IS IT LIKE TO BE A DIABETIC IN THE

STATES? DO PEOPLE KNOW ENOUGH ABOUT IT? HOW IS THE SUGAR FREE FOOD?

THANKS,

MAI

[Guest guest]

Welcome MAI, I am Shelia from Texas USA, this list is wonderful and you will

learn a lot here. The people here are very informed. I look forward to

sharing with you!! The variety of sugar free foods here are very good,

however you have to watch the calories or ingredients in them. Some are just

as bad as eating the sugar. I will say this if you have a question about

this disease all you have to do is ask and someone here will get you a

answer. I have learned a lot about this disease since I joined this list.

Nice to meet you!! Hugs Shelia )

[Guest guest]

Mai Atas wrote:

<< ... CAN ANYONE TELL ME A LITTLE ABOUT HOW IS IT LIKE TO BE A DIABETIC IN

THE

STATES? DO PEOPLE KNOW ENOUGH ABOUT IT? HOW IS THE SUGAR FREE FOOD? >>

In the US, we have an epidemic of diabetes, especially among teens. We have

way too much eating in restaurants, picking up convenience foods at

drive-thru places, and the portions are too large. Also, for 20 years or so

we have been told that the only problem is too much fat in our diet. But

diabetics' main problem is the carbohydrates in their diet. When diabetics

are diagnosed, they are often sent to a dietitian. And most of the

dietitians tell diabetics to stop eating Simple carbohydrates (sweets) and

instead eat Healthy Complex Carbohydrates. But most of us discover through

self-experiments that *all* carbohydrates are a problem for us. Dietitians

also tell patients to eat no more than 30% fat, and no more than 1/3 of that

saturated fat. Also, in poorly-controlled diabetes, the kidneys can go bad,

and when they do, they leak protein. There is too much simplistic thinking

in this country. Because kidneys that are in trouble leak protein, it has

been presumed that if diabetics eat a LOW-protein diet, they will baby their

kidneys.

Our magazines and TV shows are filled with stories about weight loss and

Eating Healthy. But most of them recommend a diet that is 60-70% one thing

(carbohydrates), and the proteins and fats are crammed into the other

30-40%. And they call that " Balanced. " Many diabetics try to be " good

patients " and follow their recommendations, and their control is not very

good, and they develop complications, even though they take more and more

pills. Doctors have come to view diabetes as hopeless. They wind up just

worrying about " quality of life " for their patients during their remaining

years, like laser treatments for the bleeders in their eyes and

hospitalization for their sores that won't heal. When patients do report

high readings on their high-carbohydrate diet, some doctors and dietitians

call them " noncompliant, " assuming they are cheating and eating a lot of

junk food and fats, not realizing that fat doesn't spike your glucose

readings at all ... in fact, it mutes them but makes them last longer.

Some doctors and dietitians get mad when their patients go on

low-carbohydrate diets, thinking it is unhealthy and even dangerous. So some

diabetics don't even tell their health care providers what they are doing

until they can take in a chart showing how good their glucose readings are

and even how much weight they lost. But more and more doctors, seeing the

incredible improvements in their patients, are being won over. US average

daily consumption of carbohydrates is 300 grams. It's hard to order a

restaurant meal without getting loaded up with rolls, rice, potatoes, and

starchy cooked vegetables like carrots. Our buffets are mostly

carbohydrates, because they are considered " comfort foods " and they are

cheap to serve. They are " comfort foods " because people do not yet realize

that MOST people have a problem eating carbohydrates, especially

highly-processed grains. As they eat more and more carbohydrates in their

lives, their pancreases deteriorate, and they swing between high glucose

readings and low ones. When they are low, they feel depressed and very

hungry. And our bodies learn to demand the very foods that bring our glucose

readings back up the fastest ... in other words, they make us crave the

foods that are the worst for us.

For the past 10 years or so, doctors here have been told to use only fasting

glucose readings to look for diabetes. And many undiagnosed diabetics are

actually below normal when fasting, because they are in the hypoglycemic

phase, because they haven't eaten in maybe 14 hours. We aren't given glucose

tolerance tests until later - if at all. We have a combination of a lot of

people spending much of their lives being sedentary, at desk jobs, on

computers, and watching TV, we are offered large portions that are high in

problemmatic carbohydrates as well as high-fat, we are not given

postprandial blood tests or glucose tolerance tests to make an earlier

diagnosis, and when diagnosed are told to eat a lot of the very foods that

are a problem for us. So there are a lot of diabetics that don't do well

here.

Another problem is that we are an increasingly urban population. So more and

more, exercise is seen as something detached from our normal lives ...

something that requires one to put on a special outfit and go to a special

place like a health club to do. Very few people walk or ride a bicycle to

work, and most stores and employers make no provision for bicycle storage.

For awhile, we had a lot of commercially-prepared foods that were

Nutrasweetened, but then apparently some customers complained about the

" bitterness " of the foods and now many manufacturers still put the

" Nutrasweet " logo on their packages, but they have sneaked sugar back in, so

we really have to examine the nutrition labels on our familiar foods to see

if they are still okay to eat.

Our magazines are just recently focusing on the wave of diabetes, but much

of the emphasis is on teenagers, and unfortunately those stories tend to

emphasize the lack of physical activity plus the fat in diets.So they will

probably be told to eat even less fat. The American Heart Association,

however, has seen the light and is about to change its dietary

recommendations. So we are gradually seeing a change in focus.

Susie

[Guest guest]

Re: Fw: That Lovely Orgaan the Pancreas

>

>

>

>

> Hello everyone,

>

> My name is Mai Atas, I am a new member . 24 years old student from Israel

>

Welcome to the List Mai Sugar Free is such a loose term to use around here

many of us have learned the hard way about " other sugars like

manitol,sorbitol ETC. and those are usually the main ingredients in may of

the " Sugar Free " foods and snacks but it is improving and the choices are

better now than even a few years ago, but the need to balance what we eat

carefully with our total meal plan is still important. but it is nice to

have a treat like a nice Jell-O made with something sugar free now and

then. keep posting and reading this list is a great help for old-timers as

well as newcomers and family can also get lots of useful information as

well. Ok now someone will ask so it may as well be me are you Type I or

type II diabetic what treatment are you using what insulin dosage? are you

using or thinking about the pump Etc. Etc. we ask these questions they may

seem a little forward but in time you will see that this information helps

us understand your needs better as well as understanding your point of view

.. there will be many opportunities to learn how we help and support each

other here and the first is by at least having this much in common . I am a

type II Diabetic I was Diagnosed in September of 1998 My treatment is

Glucophage (an Oral Medication) Diet (most Success there) and exercise and

self testing (very important ) also education this list being a good

example. see that lets Folks now enough about me so they can give me advice

.. anyway once again Welcome . Callender