Re: the FOO goes kabloey. Heeelp, please

August 29, 2006

I would suggest that you say that you feel anxious hearing about family

drama and that you don't care to feel anxious so you don't want to hear

about family drama anymore. Its not anything new, you can't help them, and

it only causes you emotional upset so you don't want to hear it. Sometimes

I read the news or current events to give me subjects to change the subject

too. I state that I do not want to dicuss Nadas current grievance. Or if

she complains that she can't talk to me or we don't talk I calmly ask if

there some things she would like to discuss- perhaps a bood she has read

recently or some current events. The news can be good sometimes because it

allows an oportunity to talk about someone elses misery- like how horrible

it would be to be trapped in a burning plane and gee aren't we all glad that

we are not in that situation and that no one we know is?

I have also made it known that I am emotionally unavailable. I can't

provide that emotional support she needs and I don't want to try. I also

make it clear that I am perfectly fine with being hearltess and selfish and

whatever else I happen to be at the moment. After all, if I am selfish

these relevations shouldn't come as such a shock. The message I try to get

accross is that I'm sorry, but we have no bananas today. Maybe I can

interest her in an orange or a cherry- but there are no bananas. She will

have to go elsewhere for that.

-Ata

>

> Oh you guys, being the anxious and anxiety-ridden person I am, I tend

> to imagine the worst and worry about my FOO with their crazy and

> self-destructive behavior. But now, it's actually happened--I hate

> when my fears get validated KWIM? The sick part about all of this is

> that I am up to date on the drama and I am not even on the same

> CONTINENT! I feel like I'm allowing the FOO drama to distract me and

> hover me.

>

> I will make a long story short-er and say that my split black

> brother(29) and my un-separated, split-good brother(24) have been

> living with my parents for way too long. Split black brother was out

> for a while and came back because he lost his job due to some

> KO-related issues at work(his manager reminded him of nada). My baby

> brother has treated my parent's home like his own personal frat house

> since he was 18. My parents fluctuate from encouraging the parties

> and hanging out to get attention to smoldering quietly over the messes

> to raging--but they have no concept of boundaries, so nothing ever

> changes. To add fuel to the fire, baby brother collects bimbos and

> sometimes brings them over for a one night stand, or even to live with

> my parents(they are usually freaky and unstable). My mom tends to love

> these girls at first and then think they are the devil. Curent

> girlfriend=devil.

>

> Recently my brothers had a party while my parents were away and my mom

> basically told me over the phone that she was going to rage at them

> soon because they had girls at the party this time--and because of

> this, it was unthinkable that the house would be such a mess. (please

> validate my sense of disgust when my nada thinks it's ok for my bros

> to party and trash the house, but that if they invite girls over, the

> girls should initiate cleaning--I grew up with that, so unfair). The

> whole thing culminated in a " Jerry Springer Moment. " Nada raged and

> said she didn't like baby brother's girlfriend, baby brother raged

> back and moved out. Nada, freaked out because she never wants baby

> brother to leave and claims that split black brother has " destroyed

> the family " just like she " knew he would. " Another classic FOO

> tale--feels like Christmas.

>

> I'm tired of the drama. I'm angry at the stupidity of the whole FOO.

> I'm sad because my " family " sucks--an extra helping of sad actually.

> My split black brother is greiving his impending NC with the foo and

> that's making me relive my grief at not having a real family, I think.

> I'm also on the verge of forbiding them to mention any of this or any

> other drama to me ever again--which may cause me to be NC instead of

> RC because refusing to listen to drama really pisses them off for some

> reason. So now as I see a new boundary I need to put up in sight, I

> begin to anticipate the crap that will rain down on me when I do it.

> I'm tired of worrying about how nada will react to boundaries.

>

> Please send kind thoughts and any ideas on how best to script my

> refusal of drama statement to my nada the next time we talk(Sunday--or

> later if I really think I can't handle it).

>

> grrrrr(in lower case because I'm too exhausted to really growl)

>

> Trish

>

August 29, 2006

Aw, Trish, what a long-distance mess!

It seems to me that you kinda have two things going on here --

Thing #1 is figuring out how to deal with your FOO and their attempts

to drag you into their drama.

Thing #2 is how to disentangle yourself emotionally.

I wonder if it might help you to remind yourself that you FOO has

ABSOLUTELY ZERO CONTROL over Thing #2. They cannot stop you from

moving on with your process of personal growth and healing.

It also seems to me that part of the reason that Thing #1 is horrible

and confusing for you is that you are not separating it clearly from

Thing #2. And what I learned when I was still dealing with my FOO

(I'm an only KO and both parents are now deceased, so life is

simpler) is that if I put my mind and heart to work on Thing #2, then

Thing #1 suddenly got a lot easier. On the other hand, if I put my

mind and heart to work on Thing #1, then it tended to sabotage Thing

#2. Because, I couldn't work on separating myself emotionally from

these people while I was making coping with THEIR emotions a

priority...KWIM?

But as far as dealing with them goes, from my perspective it seems to

me that they are all, in one way or another, trying to co-opt you

into helping them avoid dealing with the natural consequences of

their own actions. And in the 12-step world, helping someone avoid

the consequences of their actions is called " enabling " , because it

helps them stay sick. And this is true far beyond the 12-step

world, and anyway, the most economical yet accurate description of BP

I have ever heard in my life is " addition to drama " . Sounds like

your FOO is pretty hard-core, eh?

And, yeah, refusing to enable often creates additional drama in the

short term, but like you said, you're not even on the same

continent... :-)

Hugs,

>

> Oh you guys, being the anxious and anxiety-ridden person I am, I

tend

> to imagine the worst and worry about my FOO with their crazy and

> self-destructive behavior. But now, it's actually happened--I hate

> when my fears get validated KWIM? The sick part about all of this is

> that I am up to date on the drama and I am not even on the same

> CONTINENT! I feel like I'm allowing the FOO drama to distract me

and

> hover me.

>

> I will make a long story short-er and say that my split black

> brother(29) and my un-separated, split-good brother(24) have been

> living with my parents for way too long. Split black brother was

out

> for a while and came back because he lost his job due to some

> KO-related issues at work(his manager reminded him of nada). My

baby

> brother has treated my parent's home like his own personal frat

house

> since he was 18. My parents fluctuate from encouraging the parties

> and hanging out to get attention to smoldering quietly over the

messes

> to raging--but they have no concept of boundaries, so nothing ever

> changes. To add fuel to the fire, baby brother collects bimbos and

> sometimes brings them over for a one night stand, or even to live

with

> my parents(they are usually freaky and unstable). My mom tends to

love

> these girls at first and then think they are the devil. Curent

> girlfriend=devil.

>

> Recently my brothers had a party while my parents were away and my

mom

> basically told me over the phone that she was going to rage at them

> soon because they had girls at the party this time--and because of

> this, it was unthinkable that the house would be such a mess.

(please

> validate my sense of disgust when my nada thinks it's ok for my bros

> to party and trash the house, but that if they invite girls over,

the

> girls should initiate cleaning--I grew up with that, so unfair).

The

> whole thing culminated in a " Jerry Springer Moment. " Nada raged and

> said she didn't like baby brother's girlfriend, baby brother raged

> back and moved out. Nada, freaked out because she never wants baby

> brother to leave and claims that split black brother has " destroyed

> the family " just like she " knew he would. " Another classic FOO

> tale--feels like Christmas.

>

> I'm tired of the drama. I'm angry at the stupidity of the whole

FOO.

> I'm sad because my " family " sucks--an extra helping of sad

actually.

> My split black brother is greiving his impending NC with the foo and

> that's making me relive my grief at not having a real family, I

think.

> I'm also on the verge of forbiding them to mention any of this or

any

> other drama to me ever again--which may cause me to be NC instead of

> RC because refusing to listen to drama really pisses them off for

some

> reason. So now as I see a new boundary I need to put up in sight, I

> begin to anticipate the crap that will rain down on me when I do

it.

> I'm tired of worrying about how nada will react to boundaries.

>

> Please send kind thoughts and any ideas on how best to script my

> refusal of drama statement to my nada the next time we talk(Sunday--

or

> later if I really think I can't handle it).

>

> grrrrr(in lower case because I'm too exhausted to really growl)

>

> Trish

>

August 29, 2006

MMM, right off the top of my head Trish ... is that 'none of this is your

problem'. If your parents choose to reinforce this behavior from THEIR sons,

then what can you possibly do about it?

Yup, this is crazymaking stuff. Hugs, Carol

In a message dated 8/29/2006 3:35:49 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

tlblack2006@... writes:

Oh you guys, being the anxious and anxiety-ridden person I am, I tend

to imagine the worst and worry about my FOO with their crazy and

self-destructive behavior. But now, it's actually happened--I hate

when my fears get validated KWIM? The sick part about all of this is

that I am up to date on the drama and I am not even on the same

CONTINENT! I feel like I'm allowing the FOO drama to distract me and

hover me.

I will make a long story short-er and say that my split black

brother(29) and my un-separated, split-good brother(24) have been

living with my parents for way too long. Split black brother was out

for a while and came back because he lost his job due to some

KO-related issues at work(his manager reminded him of nada). My baby

brother has treated my parent's home like his own personal frat house

since he was 18. My parents fluctuate from encouraging the parties

and hanging out to get attention to smoldering quietly over the messes

to raging--but they have no concept of boundaries, so nothing ever

changes. To add fuel to the fire, baby brother collects bimbos and

sometimes brings them over for a one night stand, or even to live with

my parents(they are usually freaky and unstable). My mom tends to love

these girls at first and then think they are the devil. Curent

girlfriend=devil.

Recently my brothers had a party while my parents were away and my mom

basically told me over the phone that she was going to rage at them

soon because they had girls at the party this time--and because of

this, it was unthinkable that the house would be such a mess. (please

validate my sense of disgust when my nada thinks it's ok for my bros

to party and trash the house, but that if they invite girls over, the

girls should initiate cleaning--I grew up with that, so unfair). The

whole thing culminated in a " Jerry Springer Moment. " Nada raged and

said she didn't like baby brother's girlfriend, baby brother raged

back and moved out. Nada, freaked out because she never wants baby

brother to leave and claims that split black brother has " destroyed

the family " just like she " knew he would. " Another classic FOO

tale--feels like Christmas.

I'm tired of the drama. I'm angry at the stupidity of the whole FOO.

I'm sad because my " family " sucks--an extra helping of sad actually.

My split black brother is greiving his impending NC with the foo and

that's making me relive my grief at not having a real family, I think.

I'm also on the verge of forbiding them to mention any of this or any

other drama to me ever again--which may cause me to be NC instead of

RC because refusing to listen to drama really pisses them off for some

reason. So now as I see a new boundary I need to put up in sight, I

begin to anticipate the crap that will rain down on me when I do it.

I'm tired of worrying about how nada will react to boundaries.

Please send kind thoughts and any ideas on how best to script my

refusal of drama statement to my nada the next time we talk(Sunday--or

later if I really think I can't handle it).

grrrrr(in lower case because I'm too exhausted to really growl)

Trish

August 29, 2006

Oh Wow, KW, YOU are a strong one. Good for you; you can see the reality.

You are being FOGGED, big time. Your nada is GOOD at 'it'. She has your

extended family so intimidated (terrified of pissing her off - having her wrath

directed toward them) that they parrot her 'theme'...that she is perfect ...

and you are an evil child.

Haha, I say; you are the winner here. You are five steps ahead of your

nada. You already know what her next move is; she will do ANYTHING to salvage

her 'perfect mother' persona; even at the cost of alienating her daughter.

Stay 'no contact'. It is your own private, calm, sane place. Sister hug,

Carol

In a message dated 8/29/2006 10:05:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

Willette2003@... writes:

Hi everyone !! I'm going to try and get some support tonight.

My mother called today after 1 month of NC. I actually thought it was my

dad because she used his cell phone. I was immediately triggered when I

heard her voice. I calmly told her that I was on the other line and I would

call back. She called (total phone) three times in 1/2 time frame while I

talked to my friend. I did not answer but called back when I finished my

conversation.

After 1 month of no talking she asks, " You father and I are going to be in

the neighborhood, can we come by? " (I'm thinking, WHAT ? ARE YOU OUT OF

YOUR FRICKIN MIND?) I said, " No. I would rather you not come by. I'm

very

angry with you and I'm not ready to make nice right now. " She went on to

tell me how much I'm killing her and how much she has done for me. You all

know the routine. I said, " Ya, I know. But if I'm making you so unhappy,

it is better that we not talk. I'm done with this. You have a disorder (I

made the mistake last year of telling her I knew her little secret) that you

need help for. If you really want to make things right, get help and call

me. For right now, I'm angry and I'm done. " She closed this wonderful

conversation by saying, " You're playing with fire " I asked, " Is this a

threat? " She then hung up on me.

Since then, my aunt, her sister, has called and basically told me I'm a

horrible and awful person for treating my own mother this way. My mother

has nothing but love for me....you know the speech. I politely said, " I

appreciate your concern, but you need to stay out of this one. I'm doing

this for me and not my mother. " She said, " Well I hope you can live with

yourself if she hurts herself. I'm really worried about her. " I said, " Then

she really needs to see someone. "

I'm sitting here crying hearing the toon Bah Bah Black Sheep (because that

is what I am now). Proud of myself for protecting myself and finally

standing up for myself but yet hating myself for doing it. ANYONE out there

tonight?

KW

August 30, 2006

, thank you for helping me organize my concerns! It's true, I

don't want to get sucked in, but my emotional progress and well-being

is totally separate and that's my responsability right now.

Also, you are dead-on about the enabling. I was thinking last night

before bed about how just listening to nada drone on and give her

incorrect account of how nothing is her fault, it's all my bad,

split-black brother is only allowing her to continue in her delusions

and even reinforcing her behavior. My dad does this all the time and

it makes me mad. And yes, I am on another continent so I don't have

to worry so much!

Trish

August 30, 2006

Charlie, thank you, it does help. You are absolutely right. The

family is not ruined as my nada says--well, I mean, how could it be

any more ruined than it was before? And to add to what you say,

nobody died, nobody got a divorce--so honestly, nothing is exceptional

here--they are all just doing the same old song and dance and seemt to

want me to be surprised about it! Hah! Yes, being accross the pond

is really good.

Trish

August 30, 2006

Hey((((((Trish)))))), First off I am sorry you are feeling stressed

and bad right now. I hope things get better for you. Second I think

many of the people on the board really were right with all they said

I really agree with them. You live on the other side of the world

and these are not your choices they are your foo's choices and hence

not your problems but your foo's problems. You don't have to listen

to the drama you can set a boundary if you want to, but you only

have to if you want to. I am sorry that it means you will probly end

up going n/c. That hurts but it will hurt you more if they continue

to hover you in. It is your heart first that you need to think

about. And if you do end up going n/c with them all you will still

have us that you can talk to. Personally I find this more family

like than I ever found between my mother, father and sister but that

is just me. Good luck and you have all my love and Prayer and happy

thoughts coming your way! Lizzy

>

> Oh you guys, being the anxious and anxiety-ridden person I am, I

tend

> to imagine the worst and worry about my FOO with their crazy and

> self-destructive behavior. But now, it's actually happened--I hate

> when my fears get validated KWIM? The sick part about all of this

is

> that I am up to date on the drama and I am not even on the same

> CONTINENT! I feel like I'm allowing the FOO drama to distract me

and

> hover me.

>

> I will make a long story short-er and say that my split black

> brother(29) and my un-separated, split-good brother(24) have been

> living with my parents for way too long. Split black brother was

out

> for a while and came back because he lost his job due to some

> KO-related issues at work(his manager reminded him of nada). My

baby

> brother has treated my parent's home like his own personal frat

house

> since he was 18. My parents fluctuate from encouraging the parties

> and hanging out to get attention to smoldering quietly over the

messes

> to raging--but they have no concept of boundaries, so nothing ever

> changes. To add fuel to the fire, baby brother collects bimbos and

> sometimes brings them over for a one night stand, or even to live

with

> my parents(they are usually freaky and unstable). My mom tends to

love

> these girls at first and then think they are the devil. Curent

> girlfriend=devil.

>

> Recently my brothers had a party while my parents were away and my

mom

> basically told me over the phone that she was going to rage at them

> soon because they had girls at the party this time--and because of

> this, it was unthinkable that the house would be such a mess.

(please

> validate my sense of disgust when my nada thinks it's ok for my

bros

> to party and trash the house, but that if they invite girls over,

the

> girls should initiate cleaning--I grew up with that, so unfair).

The

> whole thing culminated in a " Jerry Springer Moment. " Nada raged

and

> said she didn't like baby brother's girlfriend, baby brother raged

> back and moved out. Nada, freaked out because she never wants baby

> brother to leave and claims that split black brother has " destroyed

> the family " just like she " knew he would. " Another classic FOO

> tale--feels like Christmas.

>

> I'm tired of the drama. I'm angry at the stupidity of the whole

FOO.

> I'm sad because my " family " sucks--an extra helping of sad

actually.

> My split black brother is greiving his impending NC with the foo

and

> that's making me relive my grief at not having a real family, I

think.

> I'm also on the verge of forbiding them to mention any of this or

any

> other drama to me ever again--which may cause me to be NC instead

of

> RC because refusing to listen to drama really pisses them off for

some

> reason. So now as I see a new boundary I need to put up in sight, I

> begin to anticipate the crap that will rain down on me when I do

it.

> I'm tired of worrying about how nada will react to boundaries.

>

> Please send kind thoughts and any ideas on how best to script my

> refusal of drama statement to my nada the next time we talk(Sunday-

-or

> later if I really think I can't handle it).

>

> grrrrr(in lower case because I'm too exhausted to really growl)

>

> Trish

>

August 30, 2006

Trish,

I thought you went NC?

Greg.

charlottehoneychurch wrote:

Hey Trish,

I don't know if it helps any to hear this, but I can affirm for you that they

are certainly

making much ado about nothing! Come, ON, Trish's FOO. I mean, noone is sick

here.

Noone is in trouble with the law. Noone is getting divorced. There aren't any

young

children involved. (They are all *acting* like children though.) I can

definitely give you an

outside-view affirmation that they are drama and crazy-making. I hate to see you

upset

over it!

I know though that you are concerned for your split-black brother and how hard

this must

be for him. Remember that it's his choice to stay at home, and you can't make

the choice

for him. Nonetheless I do hope things get better for him soon.

As far as how to keep in touch with them without sharing the drama, I wish I

could be of

more assistance. Maybe if you insist on never taking sides, they might stop

unloading on

you? I for one am so glad you are across the pond!

Best,

Charlie