Re: Limits on video games?

[Guest guest]

Are the video games interfering with school work and his other obligations?

Is he socializing as much as you think he should? Friends come over?

Having his age would be helpful because a 13 year old is different from a 17

year old.

My big worry is he isolating?

I don't think there is a magic number. I'm sure your pediatrician would say

gaming only on the weekend (as if!)

So.. If everything is good, school, home life, outside obligations, I'd let it

be.

What you rather him be doing?

Nanci

[Guest guest]

> I am looking for ideas on how to place limits on hours of video game time per

day. My teen aged son was diagnosed with AS 2 years ago. His special interest is

computer and video games. I support him playing video games and occasionally I

play them with him.

>

> I understand that when parenting an AS person it is better to think about

putting another activity in place of the special interest rather than taking

away the person's special interest.

>

> I am also curious to hear what might be reasonable limits for amount of

computer game time per day.

I have two kids. My 15 year old doesn't play video/computer games, but my 10

year old does.

For both kids, work comes before play. So my son can't play games until his

homework and a chore are done -- then he gets an hour of entertainment time on

the computer.

For your son, I'd use a similar rule: homework, chores and some family (social)

time need to be placed before solitary entertainment. I wouldn't place time

limits on a teenager though, they will find ways around any rule that doesn't

make sense to them.

I'd also be hesitant to call *playing* games an AS special interest. Yes, I know

anything can be a special interest, but I'd cut a lot more slack to a kid who

was building games (game design/programming) than to just playing them. [Hmm ...

maybe I should declare reading e-mail as a special interest <grin>]

One final thought ... well, two.

First, if these games have a social component, even if just online, it may be

worth giving your son more time on them. The social contact is good -- I know of

a married couple who met through gaming, and still game together, on a specially

built computer table for two.

Second, where is the computer/gaming system located? If you are very worried, it

should be in a public part of your house, not in your son's bedroom.

--Liz

[Guest guest]

My 13 yr old daughter is high functioning (undiagnosed) and she is on her

computer way more than I think she should be but she maintains an A grade

average, at school. She has taught herself programming and web design in the

past two years. She has absolutely no social interaction with other kids and

hates crowds. She refuses to go to church youth group. She goes to school and

that's IT! None of the kids at school call and she does not call them. She

doesn't like talking on the phone. I have taken her to two psychiatrists and one

university research testing center that specializes in autistic diagnosis(where

they did only a free personality and observation test.) I have been told she is

introverted. She can smile and pretend she is having fun if she makes an effort

but it does cause her to have headaches later so she rarely does. I can tell she

hates making the effort but she will need to get on with her life soon.

I have no idea what to do with this child. She is a sweet girl most of the time,

often forgetful but so what? She is rigid when it comes to her routine and hates

to vary it. She just spends all her time in her room and doesn't want to go

outside ever. I don't want to be her best friend and be the only person she does

anything with. Two other teens on my husband's side of the family are very

similar to her in personality and they are both in their twenties now, neither

drives and they do not have jobs. One went to college but the mother had to move

to the city where the college is and rent a house so she could attend.

She refuses to entertain the idea that anything is wrong with er, especially

since experts have agreed with her that there is not. What can i do?

[Guest guest]

Sounds like me when I was 13!

Except there were no computers then ... but my family moved across the country

when I was almost 13, and I had *nothing* in common with the kids in my school.

[i was a geeky, intelligent girl with no interest in sports, clothing or

romance, in a mostly working-class neighborhood where few kids went to college

and most were married with kids by age 21. Good kids, just nothing like me.] I

spent lots of time alone in my room -- my parents called me The Hermit.

It's very hard for an extrovert to understand how little social interaction an

introvert needs. But too much is as stressful for an introvert as seclusion

would be for an extrovert. Your daughter may *need* several hours of down time

after a day at school.

Still, unlike the other young people you mention, your daughter needs to learn

how to function in the world. By college age, she should be able to function

more or less independently. At 13, she should be able to go a couple miles from

home (if you are in a safe area) and buy something inexpensive from a store

without help. Is there a used book store or game shop close to your house? Can

you send her on an errand to get a quart of milk? If she freaks over things like

this, you may want to look into a short course of therapy.

Then, work up from there ... before college, she should be able to take public

transportation, go shopping at the mall (even if she has to lie down for an hour

afterwards), have a " small talk " conversation with a stranger. [There are other

tasks too, but laundry and managing a bank account are not special problems for

an introvert.]

--Liz

> My 13 yr old daughter is high functioning (undiagnosed) and she is on her

computer way more than I think she should be but she maintains an A grade

average, at school. She has taught herself programming and web design in the

past two years. She has absolutely no social interaction with other kids and

hates crowds. She refuses to go to church youth group. She goes to school and

that's IT! None of the kids at school call and she does not call them. She

doesn't like talking on the phone. I have taken her to two psychiatrists and one

university research testing center that specializes in autistic diagnosis(where

they did only a free personality and observation test.) I have been told she is

introverted. She can smile and pretend she is having fun if she makes an effort

but it does cause her to have headaches later so she rarely does. I can tell she

hates making the effort but she will need to get on with her life soon.

>

> I have no idea what to do with this child. She is a sweet girl most of the

time, often forgetful but so what? She is rigid when it comes to her routine and

hates to vary it. She just spends all her time in her room and doesn't want to

go outside ever. I don't want to be her best friend and be the only person she

does anything with. Two other teens on my husband's side of the family are very

similar to her in personality and they are both in their twenties now, neither

drives and they do not have jobs. One went to college but the mother had to move

to the city where the college is and rent a house so she could attend.

>

> She refuses to entertain the idea that anything is wrong with er, especially

since experts have agreed with her that there is not. What can i do?

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

> " We each have our own way of living in the world, together we are

like a symphony.

> Some are the melody, some are the rhythm, some are the harmony

> It all blends together, we are like a symphony, and each part is crucial.

> We all contribute to the song of life. "

> ...Sondra

>

> We might not always agree; but TOGETHER we will make a difference.

>

> ASPIRES is a closed, confidential, moderated list.

> Responsibility for posts to ASPIRES lies entirely with the original author.

> Do NOT post mail off-list without the author's permission.

> When in doubt, please refer to our list rules at:

> http://www.aspires-relationships.com/info_rules.htm

> ASPIRES ~ Climbing the mountain TOGETHER

> http://www.aspires-relationships.com

>

[Guest guest]

I can tell you what NOT to do. Don’t force her into doing things that YOU think a “normal” 13 year old girl should like. My mother did that to me and it ruined my relationship with her. She forced me to join girl scouts, 4-H, youth group, band… she signed me up for school plays, choir, basketball, CHEERLEADING! And every time she did, I not only was not successful, but I resented her more and more. The way I saw it, I wasn’t good enough for her. I wasn’t the daughter she wanted, so she was trying to force me into this preconceived mold for how a daughter should be. It made me feel unloved, rejected and unwanted. Not once did she ever try to understand MY interests. You guys sometimes make things more complicated than they need to be. My mom never thought to sit down and ask me what I needed from her. What would make you happy? If she had, I would have said, well first you can stop trying to force me to like what you like. Then maybe you can sit down and I’ll show you this cool web site I just designed or this cool game I’ve been playing. After that, maybe we can go to the mall because you know what mom, I like hanging out with you. Whereas I hate being around other people, whom I feel like I have to keep up an act to impress, hanging out with my mom is relaxing. Let’s go get a pedicure or walk around the mall and window shop or go to a concert. I think the most important thing to remember is just because YOU think something is important doesn’t mean that we do. Try to get out of thinking in your way and try to get into thinking in her way. It might help you understand her better. And if all else fails, just ask her. She’s probably more than willing to share with you what might work better for her. From: aspires-relationships [mailto:aspires-relationships ] On Behalf Of Liz CademySent: Wednesday, March 23, 2011 9:19 AMTo: aspires-relationships Subject: Re: Re: Limits on video games? Sounds like me when I was 13!Except there were no computers then ... but my family moved across the country when I was almost 13, and I had *nothing* in common with the kids in my school. [i was a geeky, intelligent girl with no interest in sports, clothing or romance, in a mostly working-class neighborhood where few kids went to college and most were married with kids by age 21. Good kids, just nothing like me.] I spent lots of time alone in my room -- my parents called me The Hermit.It's very hard for an extrovert to understand how little social interaction an introvert needs. But too much is as stressful for an introvert as seclusion would be for an extrovert. Your daughter may *need* several hours of down time after a day at school.Still, unlike the other young people you mention, your daughter needs to learn how to function in the world. By college age, she should be able to function more or less independently. At 13, she should be able to go a couple miles from home (if you are in a safe area) and buy something inexpensive from a store without help. Is there a used book store or game shop close to your house? Can you send her on an errand to get a quart of milk? If she freaks over things like this, you may want to look into a short course of therapy.Then, work up from there ... before college, she should be able to take public transportation, go shopping at the mall (even if she has to lie down for an hour afterwards), have a " small talk " conversation with a stranger. [There are other tasks too, but laundry and managing a bank account are not special problems for an introvert.] --Liz> My 13 yr old daughter is high functioning (undiagnosed) and she is on her computer way more than I think she should be but she maintains an A grade average, at school. She has taught herself programming and web design in the past two years. She has absolutely no social interaction with other kids and hates crowds. She refuses to go to church youth group. She goes to school and that's IT! None of the kids at school call and she does not call them. She doesn't like talking on the phone. I have taken her to two psychiatrists and one university research testing center that specializes in autistic diagnosis(where they did only a free personality and observation test.) I have been told she is introverted. She can smile and pretend she is having fun if she makes an effort but it does cause her to have headaches later so she rarely does. I can tell she hates making the effort but she will need to get on with her life soon. > > I have no idea what to do with this child. She is a sweet girl most of the time, often forgetful but so what? She is rigid when it comes to her routine and hates to vary it. She just spends all her time in her room and doesn't want to go outside ever. I don't want to be her best friend and be the only person she does anything with. Two other teens on my husband's side of the family are very similar to her in personality and they are both in their twenties now, neither drives and they do not have jobs. One went to college but the mother had to move to the city where the college is and rent a house so she could attend.> > She refuses to entertain the idea that anything is wrong with er, especially since experts have agreed with her that there is not. What can i do?> > > > ------------------------------------> > " We each have our own way of living in the world, together we are like a symphony.> Some are the melody, some are the rhythm, some are the harmony > It all blends together, we are like a symphony, and each part is crucial.> We all contribute to the song of life. " > ...Sondra > > We might not always agree; but TOGETHER we will make a difference.> > ASPIRES is a closed, confidential, moderated list.> Responsibility for posts to ASPIRES lies entirely with the original author.> Do NOT post mail off-list without the author's permission.> When in doubt, please refer to our list rules at:> http://www.aspires-relationships.com/info_rules.htm> ASPIRES ~ Climbing the mountain TOGETHER> http://www.aspires-relationships.com>

[Guest guest]

This suggestion is from a person with a 17 year Aspie boy (not me).

Her son has absolutely no social skills. He wasn't diagnosed until last year.

It's okay to be introverted. No one says everyone has to be Brittany Spears and

swing from the light fixtures naked.

And being a 13 year old girl just blows. I remember junior high (*shudder*).

The mom told her son, " You have to learn to be comfortable around people. No one

says you have to enjoy it, but everything in our culture is based around

interaction. "

(As opposed to the Finns who can eat an entire 5 course dinner with no chit

chat, and no one sees that as a problem

He had to pick one thing that would get him out of the house for a few (1-2

hours) per month. His choice. She didn't suggested peer level stuff because his

anxiety would off the charts.

There is a little gaming group in his area. They play things like D & D, Car Wars,

non computer games. All the people are above 30, so he didn't feel like he was

being judged. The pizza and pop, mostly men. They don't care about the usual guy

stuff.

(Sports, sports and sports)

Also our school district does required community service, where you must

interact with people. (No stuffing envelopes at home). Her son damn near melted

down at the thought. What her therapist suggested was the local retirement home

was looking for extra cribbage and bridge players. He has a brilliant mind, and

learned both games.

Twice a month he goes the center to play. He enjoys it as 1) the people are

thrilled he's there. 2) per him " talk about interest topics " -one gentleman is a

retired NASA engineer. Sometimes he's not needed for the games, and he just sets

up the coffee and snacks. Lately, he still stays to chit chat even if he isn't

needed playing.

Her son still has a hard time with peer related activities, but at least he is

more comfortable just being around people.

We give our children roots and wings. The roots are the easy part. Wings is how

to function on their own without us. My husband's family never gave him wings.

At 50, he's diagnosed with AS. If I drop dead tomorrow, he would mostly likely

wind up in a group home, and my family would get our daughter. He functions at a

12 year old level emotionally. He could not pass a cold call interview to save

his life. His activities of daily living are minimal. He does not know how to

run the dishwasher/clothes washer/vacuum (no he's not playing stupid). He wants

to work over the internet, which is fine, but you still need to sell yourself

and your product. He can design and program the most wonderful, intricate

websites, but what holds him back is his utter lack of social skills.

I would have her pick something/anything she wants. Humane society/local (not

school based) chess club, Scrabble club, computer club/our city has a robotic

club. Anything that let's her practice social skills.

Nanci

Wife to Jay (Aspie)

[Guest guest]

I was uncomfortable with my son's gaming. He is 20, and Aspie, as well as

bipolar and Juvenile rheumatoid, so pushing him to go out was painful

physically, and sometimes dangerous. He joined an online game, and I came to

understand that this *is* socialization. There are all the personalities,

cooperation to a goal, time management, egos, hierarchies, and consequences. He

does not have to read expressions (but must read tones), and he gets to walk

away easier, but these are the only short cuts. I have watched as he has had to

deal with the consequences of outbursts, failure to live up to expectations, etc

and find a way to mature. And he is maturing in this world. He cares about it

deeply, and has found and maintained friends. In fact, we just put one on the

plane back home. He carries some of the lessons learned there (holding his

temper and not blurting out what he is thinking, for instance) into real life.

There was an author on the Colbert Report who has a new book out about what

online gaming *does* teach kids, and she makes a good point about maybe it isn't

all that bad.

Jane McGonigal

Episode: #07020

Jane McGonigal says 10 years of scientific research show that playing video

games is actually the most productive thing we can do. (05:22)

Tags: interviews, books, kids, men/women, culture, growing up, video

games, Africa, D & D, nerd alert, Jane McGonigal

Aired: 02/03/2011

you can watch the interview online, if you wish

|

Certainly it has been a way to reach out and learn social skills for my son.

Maybe in a different way than other kids, but then, my son is a different way

expert to begin with.

You have already gotten good advice about seeing if gaming is taking over your

son's life. Now, take a step back, try to look at it dispassionately. See it

as maybe not what you would do, but possibly acceptable if done right.

Anything, even the neurotypical stuff, can be done obsessively.

You also now have a carrot for behavioral modification, a reward system to help

your child learn to do the stuff she does not want to do and be rewarded by what

she does want to do, as has been mentioned.

And remember, tastes change with maturity--she may outgrow her fascination when

she has gotten all she wants out of it, unless you make it an absolute tug of

war now.

[Guest guest]

Something struck me about this note. Isee a different dynamic between the posts from NT and AS people on thelist.It seems that the NT folk ask more questions when people send a note to get input or help with a topic.The AS folk seem to jump straight tosolutioning rather than requesting more information. I may be wrong but from what I readon this list that seems to be a striking difference. Just my ownobservations.Greg DX AS at 53To: aspires-relationships Date: 23/03/2011 03:38 PMSubject: Re: Limits on video games?Sent by: aspires-relationships Are the video games interfering with school work and hisother obligations? Is he socializing as much as you think he should? Friends come over? Having his age would be helpful because a 13 year old is different froma 17 year old.My big worry is he isolating? I don't think there is a magic number. I'm sure your pediatrician wouldsay gaming only on the weekend (as if!)So.. If everything is good, school, home life, outside obligations, I'dlet it be.What you rather him be doing? Nanci

[Guest guest]

Just my 2 cents worth.AS excel at goal directed activitiesaligned with their obsessive interests. The interests themselvesare not so bad it is the obsessiveness that accompanies it which needsto be controlled.Perhaps developing a structured calendarbased framework to create an ordered list of activities may be useful. Getting the AS person involved in constructing it is the first stage. Reinforcing everyday through a review process what is planned etcwould keep the momentum going. They need to have tangible evidenceand reinforcement to progress. Hope you succeed at what you are doing.Greg dx AS at 53To: aspires-relationships Date: 23/03/2011 03:16 PMSubject: Limits on video games?Sent by: aspires-relationships I am looking for ideas on how to place limits on hoursof video game time per day. My teen aged son was diagnosed with AS 2 yearsago. His special interest is computer and video games. I support him playingvideo games and occasionally I play them with him. I understand that when parenting an AS person it is better to think aboutputting another activity in place of the special interest rather than takingaway the person's special interest. I am also curious to hear what might be reasonable limits for amount ofcomputer game time per day. Thanks for your inputs.

[Guest guest]

Well, need for more information is because I work in Pediatrics. How you

motivate/set limits on a 13 year is different from an almost legal adult 17 year

old.

Also, in a previous life, I was a research chemist. Almost all our project were

" group related " and you were expect to ask questions. Questions-->solution made

our head honcho happy. Solution without it being raked over the coals first--->a

free shredding session similar to defending a thesis.

Finally, I'm an artist who works with clients. It is ALWAYS a game of 20

questions.

Client: I want this matted with a brown frame and gray matt.

Me: *head to desk in my mind--100 variations of brown frames and gray matts, and

does he want the matt beveled? Glass or Plexiglass?*

Then break out the samples. Interestingly this is what sunk at work Jay. People

said he gave solutions or did things directly opposite of what they want.

Graphic designer wants web page colors to be blech green and gag brown because

those colors are trendy. Designer has degree from big deal university.

Jay does a more pleasing color scheme. He has no degree. Designer gets mad,

makes Jay change it.

Jay is furious because he knows he is right.

I tell him some people's taste is all in their mouths.

Greg, you are probably on to something. Jay (AS) hates questioning because it

equals having to deal with people longer, which he loathes. I'm just used to it

because of my jobs.

Nanci

Wife to Jay (AS)

[Guest guest]

Nanci,Thanks for your response. Thismay feed into AS folk not getting all the information and that resultsin outcomes like you refer to.The key here is that Jay may have feltintimidated in questioning further and arbitrarily decided hiw way wasbetter. The consequences of that choice need to be explained andonce he can logically connect them he should be fine. The problemis that NTs do this before the fact while AS tend to be hit with the consequencesafter the fact and then the damage is done.An ounce of Prevention is worth a poundof cure as they say.Greg dx AS at 53To: aspires-relationships Date: 24/03/2011 01:04 PMSubject: Re: Limits on video games?Sent by: aspires-relationships Well, need for more information is because I work in Pediatrics.How you motivate/set limits on a 13 year is different from an almost legaladult 17 year old. Also, in a previous life, I was a research chemist. Almost all our projectwere " group related " and you were expect to ask questions. Questions-->solutionmade our head honcho happy. Solution without it being raked over the coalsfirst--->a free shredding session similar to defending a thesis. Finally, I'm an artist who works with clients. It is ALWAYS a game of 20questions. Client: I want this matted with a brown frame and gray matt. Me: *head to desk in my mind--100 variations of brown frames and gray matts,and does he want the matt beveled? Glass or Plexiglass?* Then break out the samples. Interestingly this is what sunk at work Jay.People said he gave solutions or did things directly opposite of what theywant. Graphic designer wants web page colors to be blech green and gag brownbecause those colors are trendy. Designer has degree from big deal university.Jay does a more pleasing color scheme. He has no degree. Designer getsmad, makes Jay change it. Jay is furious because he knows he is right. I tell him some people's taste is all in their mouths. Greg, you are probably on to something. Jay (AS) hates questioning becauseit equals having to deal with people longer, which he loathes. I'm justused to it because of my jobs. Nanci Wife to Jay (AS)

[Guest guest]

Thanks you and the other gals who made me think about what it's like to

be in my daughter's shoes. I realize I need to challenge her but I can take it

slow. You are so right about the school probably being so stressful that she

needs to shut herself away afterwards. I will talk to her calmly and explain

that she needs to find one activity outside the house. I will let her choose

what it is and just specify that it must involve at least one other person that

is not a family member.

I wish she would go to the mall-- but she hates crowds and she hates

buying clothes and she cannot stand the thought of public dressing rooms either

so we go shopping once a year.

She is an awesome web designer though- she has done several art sites for me.

Thanks again for all your support and suggestions.