Re: Bordeline and physically handicapped?

[Guest guest]

Hi dame,

Wow, I haven't been on this board in a long time. My nada also has physical and

mental

disabilities that she wallows in to no end. It's so odd, because she'll do her

best to put on

a strong front when she's feeling physical pain (I think?) but the pain she

describes is

awful, horrible pain (a great majority of which is my fault, for being born and

giving her

sciatica, of course). I think she generally has this negative, fragile view of

herself and

constantly thinks she's falling apart. And yet somehow when she's too weak and

in pain to

get her own food and medication and take a shower, she will always find a way to

go

(physically) get the newspaper so at least she's entertained and informed while

she wastes

away.

I think most nadas have had some form of great difficulty in their lives. Which

makes it

hard not to give in to the guilt/pity party thing, because they may genuinely be

suffering.

I'm not sure if there's a book on this topic, but one of the books, i think

UBM, has a

chapter on the Waif, which I think comes closest to what you're talking about.

Melany

>

> Hello,

>

> I have been reading SWOE and have found that my mother, who is also

> psysically handicapped, has many of the borderline traits described

> in the book. The worst part is that her illness/handicap is well

> tangled in with her traits. For example, as soon as someone falls on

> her " bad " side, she harasses them in her borderline rage and when

> they dont want to speak to her anymore, she says its because they

> cant stand her being handicapped. She also has " pity parties " with

> her friends, where she complains about all of her social and physical

> problems. She even speaks in a weaker voice than normal! When shes

> done with one, she calls the others one at a time and tells them the

> exact same story, as if the first one didnt help at all. She also

> uses her health as a manipulation tool, for example a few times

> already, I found her sobbing and saying she just wants to stop taking

> her meds and let herself die because the world is so cruel to her.

> Then she tells me that Im the only person that could give her hope by

> calling this person that she pissed off and convincing them of her

> point of view.

>

> Is there anybody out there whose parent has BPD traits and also uses

> their illnesses or handicap for manipulation. Do you know of any

> books that address this double issue?

>

> Thank you

>

[Guest guest]

" Is there anybody out there whose parent has BPD traits and also uses their

illnesses or handicap for manipulation. " ??

My mother tore up her knee when I was 5 yrs. Old; and she went through 3

surgeries; first one for the knee cap; second two they took pieces of her

chin bone out to relieve pressure. Of course I had no idea that she was

addicted to pain meds for the next 20 years after that; but it was a pretty

long lonely life as a single kid for me. Most of the time during her

surgeries she was pretty nice to me; it's when she healed that she became

mean; she let me run the streets until I was 15 and then all the rules

changed. And in the mean time, I guess all you have to do is read some of

the posts I've sent to everyone; especially Becky. Gotta go for now take

care!

Bordeline and physically handicapped?

Hello,

I have been reading SWOE and have found that my mother, who is also

psysically handicapped, has many of the borderline traits described

in the book. The worst part is that her illness/handicap is well

tangled in with her traits. For example, as soon as someone falls on

her " bad " side, she harasses them in her borderline rage and when

they dont want to speak to her anymore, she says its because they

cant stand her being handicapped. She also has " pity parties " with

her friends, where she complains about all of her social and physical

problems. She even speaks in a weaker voice than normal! When shes

done with one, she calls the others one at a time and tells them the

exact same story, as if the first one didnt help at all. She also

uses her health as a manipulation tool, for example a few times

already, I found her sobbing and saying she just wants to stop taking

her meds and let herself die because the world is so cruel to her.

Then she tells me that Im the only person that could give her hope by

calling this person that she pissed off and convincing them of her

point of view.

Is there anybody out there whose parent has BPD traits and also uses

their illnesses or handicap for manipulation. Do you know of any

books that address this double issue?

Thank you

[Guest guest]

Great question.

My nada has not only used her disability but I suspect she may even

create illnesses that are harder to see when she needs to get more

sympathy from others in order to keep her " magic " world in order.

She hasn't always done this but as my brothers and I got older and

more independent, I think she needed stronger tools to keep us tied

to her.

For most of our lives my oldest brother was the all bad child, the

difficult one because he didn't go along with her crap. One time

when she was upset by his lack of contact with her, she tried to put

together an FOO Christmas get away. She of course wanted everyone to

come. My oldest brother wanted nothing to do with it so she gave up

on him but in order to assure that my other brother and I came, she

played this whole " I am so depressed about the situation with your

oldest brother not seeing us that I had to go on

antidepressants...poor me, poor me...and to top it off I didn't feel

I could tell your father that I went on anti-depressants because he

would just make fun of me or tell someone that I don't want him to

tell or... " She of course was using this " son induced depression " to

evoke our pity so we couldn't say no to her invitation. Well the

trip sucked. My son was sick and didn't sleep. She also later used

an incident that happened with one of my brother's kids against he

and his wife. My brother and I just put this all together a couple

years after the trip when we were reminiscing about how wierd the

whole thing felt.

Sorry for the long story but I wanted to give an example of how she

uses her " illnesses " to get the response and submission that she

wants. She also has these other less visible diagnoses - myalgias

and the like. They come and go. After using one of them for about

10 yrs I asked her what her doctor said because the average course of

that diagnosis is only 3-5 years at the most with treatment. She

didn't say much but she has used that one less and works another

diagnosis more now.

She is currently going through " daughter induced alopicia (hair

loss) " since my NC decision. I swear she is putting Nair on her

head! Just kidding but I also wouldn't put it past her. She

had " son induced alopicia " several years ago too.

The illnesses she has/claims to have are very serious illnesses so I

don't mean to belittle anyone else's suffering. I am just pretty

sure nada uses them to her full advantage whenever necessary.

patinage

>

>

> " Is there anybody out there whose parent has BPD traits and also

uses their

> illnesses or handicap for manipulation. " ??

>

> My mother tore up her knee when I was 5 yrs. Old; and she went

through 3

> surgeries; first one for the knee cap; second two they took pieces

of her

> chin bone out to relieve pressure. Of course I had no idea that

she was

> addicted to pain meds for the next 20 years after that; but it was

a pretty

> long lonely life as a single kid for me. Most of the time during her

> surgeries she was pretty nice to me; it's when she healed that she

became

> mean; she let me run the streets until I was 15 and then all the

rules

> changed. And in the mean time, I guess all you have to do is read

some of

> the posts I've sent to everyone; especially Becky. Gotta go for

now take

> care!

> Bordeline and physically handicapped?

>

> Hello,

>

> I have been reading SWOE and have found that my mother, who is also

> psysically handicapped, has many of the borderline traits described

> in the book. The worst part is that her illness/handicap is well

> tangled in with her traits. For example, as soon as someone falls

on

> her " bad " side, she harasses them in her borderline rage and when

> they dont want to speak to her anymore, she says its because they

> cant stand her being handicapped. She also has " pity parties " with

> her friends, where she complains about all of her social and

physical

> problems. She even speaks in a weaker voice than normal! When shes

> done with one, she calls the others one at a time and tells them

the

> exact same story, as if the first one didnt help at all. She also

> uses her health as a manipulation tool, for example a few times

> already, I found her sobbing and saying she just wants to stop

taking

> her meds and let herself die because the world is so cruel to her.

> Then she tells me that Im the only person that could give her hope

by

> calling this person that she pissed off and convincing them of her

> point of view.

>

> Is there anybody out there whose parent has BPD traits and also

uses

> their illnesses or handicap for manipulation. Do you know of any

> books that address this double issue?

>

> Thank you

>

[Guest guest]

This reminded me of a couple things. With the illnesses, when your

mind/spirit is miserable, it tends to show up in your body. I've had

two periods since going NC (sorry to the dudes on this group!) and the

last one was almost pain-free. I've also been working with a chiro

doing NSA, but I think standing up for myself and getting away from

that negativity has helped me, even though I DO have a disease

(enodmetriosis). Doctors don't know what causes it or how to fix it,

but here I am having mental changes, and my body changes too.

So I guess I'm saying if your mom is miserable in the head, it makes

sense that she would have so many problems. I'm not saying she didn't

USE that to her advantage though. Or that she didn't exaggerate.

Also, I've read KO's tend to suffer from autoimmune diseases, like

fibromyalgia. Recently, endometriosis is being thought of as an

autoimmune disease too.

Also the " I can't tell my husband I'm on medication. " Someone

reminded me that 8 years ago, when he and I were closer, I complained

about my family an awful lot, but the surprising thing is, he said I

complained mostly about my dad. Then he said " something about killing

the dog. " And I was like, yeah that was just one incident though.

Anyway, the point I'm getting to is that a family doesn't usually have

just *one* dysfunctional member. I have been remembering how my dad

would yell at my nada and treat her like she was stupid on a fairly

regular basis. He did it to me too, but not as much the stupid thing.

Then of course, she would yell at me too when she was having a bad

day. I had an easy time seeing my mother as the victim of my father.

And she was. I guess in the end, she " let " him treat her that way.

It seems like I have, in my life, been so focused on some of the

obvious things, that I missed the smaller things. I always thought

their marriage sucked, and knew I didn't want a husband who would yell

at me. My dad had a lot of great qualities. He was trustworthy and

paid the bills on time and worked hard. But emotionally, totally shut

down. Anger was the only emotion he felt free to express.

I'm usually pretty articulate, but oh how I babble on this site!

-Deanna

>

> Great question.

>

> My nada has not only used her disability but I suspect she may even

> create illnesses that are harder to see when she needs to get more

> sympathy from others in order to keep her " magic " world in order.

> She hasn't always done this but as my brothers and I got older and

> more independent, I think she needed stronger tools to keep us tied

> to her.

>

> For most of our lives my oldest brother was the all bad child, the

> difficult one because he didn't go along with her crap. One time

> when she was upset by his lack of contact with her, she tried to put

> together an FOO Christmas get away. She of course wanted everyone to

> come. My oldest brother wanted nothing to do with it so she gave up

> on him but in order to assure that my other brother and I came, she

> played this whole " I am so depressed about the situation with your

> oldest brother not seeing us that I had to go on

> antidepressants...poor me, poor me...and to top it off I didn't feel

> I could tell your father that I went on anti-depressants because he

> would just make fun of me or tell someone that I don't want him to

> tell or... " She of course was using this " son induced depression " to

> evoke our pity so we couldn't say no to her invitation. Well the

> trip sucked. My son was sick and didn't sleep. She also later used

> an incident that happened with one of my brother's kids against he

> and his wife. My brother and I just put this all together a couple

> years after the trip when we were reminiscing about how wierd the

> whole thing felt.

>

> Sorry for the long story but I wanted to give an example of how she

> uses her " illnesses " to get the response and submission that she

> wants. She also has these other less visible diagnoses - myalgias

> and the like. They come and go. After using one of them for about

> 10 yrs I asked her what her doctor said because the average course of

> that diagnosis is only 3-5 years at the most with treatment. She

> didn't say much but she has used that one less and works another

> diagnosis more now.

>

> She is currently going through " daughter induced alopicia (hair

> loss) " since my NC decision. I swear she is putting Nair on her

> head! Just kidding but I also wouldn't put it past her. She

> had " son induced alopicia " several years ago too.

>

> The illnesses she has/claims to have are very serious illnesses so I

> don't mean to belittle anyone else's suffering. I am just pretty

> sure nada uses them to her full advantage whenever necessary.

>

> patinage

[Guest guest]

I have definitely wondered about the connection between mental health

and autoimmune diseases. The autoimmune diseases definitely run

heavy on my nada's side of the family. I am a full believer in the

mind-body connection too. I haven't felt any different or better

since going NC but I am taking better care of myself. That is

awesome that you are already feeling better since NC in such concrete

physical ways. More validation that it is the right thing to do even

though at first it feels so hard and awkward.

patinage

> >

> > Great question.

> >

> > My nada has not only used her disability but I suspect she may

even

> > create illnesses that are harder to see when she needs to get

more

> > sympathy from others in order to keep her " magic " world in

order.

> > She hasn't always done this but as my brothers and I got older

and

> > more independent, I think she needed stronger tools to keep us

tied

> > to her.

> >

> > For most of our lives my oldest brother was the all bad child,

the

> > difficult one because he didn't go along with her crap. One time

> > when she was upset by his lack of contact with her, she tried to

put

> > together an FOO Christmas get away. She of course wanted

everyone to

> > come. My oldest brother wanted nothing to do with it so she gave

up

> > on him but in order to assure that my other brother and I came,

she

> > played this whole " I am so depressed about the situation with

your

> > oldest brother not seeing us that I had to go on

> > antidepressants...poor me, poor me...and to top it off I didn't

feel

> > I could tell your father that I went on anti-depressants because

he

> > would just make fun of me or tell someone that I don't want him

to

> > tell or... " She of course was using this " son induced

depression " to

> > evoke our pity so we couldn't say no to her invitation. Well the

> > trip sucked. My son was sick and didn't sleep. She also later

used

> > an incident that happened with one of my brother's kids against

he

> > and his wife. My brother and I just put this all together a

couple

> > years after the trip when we were reminiscing about how wierd the

> > whole thing felt.

> >

> > Sorry for the long story but I wanted to give an example of how

she

> > uses her " illnesses " to get the response and submission that she

> > wants. She also has these other less visible diagnoses -

myalgias

> > and the like. They come and go. After using one of them for

about

> > 10 yrs I asked her what her doctor said because the average

course of

> > that diagnosis is only 3-5 years at the most with treatment. She

> > didn't say much but she has used that one less and works another

> > diagnosis more now.

> >

> > She is currently going through " daughter induced alopicia (hair

> > loss) " since my NC decision. I swear she is putting Nair on her

> > head! Just kidding but I also wouldn't put it past her. She

> > had " son induced alopicia " several years ago too.

> >

> > The illnesses she has/claims to have are very serious illnesses

so I

> > don't mean to belittle anyone else's suffering. I am just pretty

> > sure nada uses them to her full advantage whenever necessary.

> >

> > patinage

>

[Guest guest]

Hi and thank you for the great question!

I hadn't made this connection before, but wow. My nada has been

falling apart for years - and she's only 43! She has advanced

osteoarthritis, supposedly with the " bones of an 80-year old " ; has

had " unbearable " daily headaches since I was about 5 years old; has

more " accidents " (sprained this, broken that, spider bites, you name

it) than anyone I know; she had a cold when I was 11 that she

refused to treat, which developed into severe pneumonia that darn

near killed her, and guess who had to call the ambulance and take

care of her!

And she NEVER hesitates to use these things to her advantage,

especially with me. It seems like any time I had a gripe with her,

she would counter it with a " how dare you say that to me when I just

found out I have ______. " The most notable of these was when (after

promising she'd call me at least once a week and failing to call for

about a month) I was crying, asking her why she wouldn't call her

daughter, and she dropped the bomb that she had a blood clot that

could kill her if it moved, and she couldn't believe how I could be

so upset with her when she could die at any second!

The more I think about it, the more this makes sense. Nada always

has some kind of cold, infection, allergy, or other autoimmune dis-

ease, and the major stuff only started happening when I moved away.

In other words, when she felt abandoned and I couldn't be physically

present to acll her bluff.

Oh, and every case she has is " the worst the doctor's ever seen, "

or " if it had been a fraction of an inch to the left, I would have

died. " Even though she's a good 20+ years from even being

a " senior, " she is already " dying, " if you ask her. I can only

imagine this is going to get exponentially worse as the years go by,

and given that we are newly NC, I'd bet on a REALLY bad illness

to be coming up the pipeline soon. So, thanks for the heads up.

Two ironies to the situation (and there are many):

1)She always said she never wanted to get old and fall apart, so I

have always been told to just " take me behind the barn and shoot "

her if she ever got " sick like an old lady. "

2)She is CONVINCED that her older and more perfect sister (whose

family has had a tremendous spell of legit bad medical issues) has

Munschausen's (SP). Can anyone say " projecting? "

Thank you again for your post; you have opened my eyes and probably

saved me a lot of grief in the future. I really wish I had answers

to share, but I hope it helps hearing that others are manipulated

with illness, too.

*hugs*

>

> Hello,

>

> I have been reading SWOE and have found that my mother, who is

also

> psysically handicapped, has many of the borderline traits

described

> in the book. The worst part is that her illness/handicap is well

> tangled in with her traits. For example, as soon as someone falls

on

> her " bad " side, she harasses them in her borderline rage and when

> they dont want to speak to her anymore, she says its because they

> cant stand her being handicapped. She also has " pity parties "

with

> her friends, where she complains about all of her social and

physical

> problems. She even speaks in a weaker voice than normal! When

shes

> done with one, she calls the others one at a time and tells them

the

> exact same story, as if the first one didnt help at all. She also

> uses her health as a manipulation tool, for example a few times

> already, I found her sobbing and saying she just wants to stop

taking

> her meds and let herself die because the world is so cruel to

her.

> Then she tells me that Im the only person that could give her hope

by

> calling this person that she pissed off and convincing them of her

> point of view.

>

> Is there anybody out there whose parent has BPD traits and also

uses

> their illnesses or handicap for manipulation. Do you know of any

> books that address this double issue?

>

> Thank you

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you, Sweetie!

-Deanna

> > >

> > > Great question.

> > >

> > > My nada has not only used her disability but I suspect she may

> even

> > > create illnesses that are harder to see when she needs to get

> more

> > > sympathy from others in order to keep her " magic " world in

> order.

> > > She hasn't always done this but as my brothers and I got older

> and

> > > more independent, I think she needed stronger tools to keep us

> tied

> > > to her.

> > >

> > > For most of our lives my oldest brother was the all bad child,

> the

> > > difficult one because he didn't go along with her crap. One time

> > > when she was upset by his lack of contact with her, she tried to

> put

> > > together an FOO Christmas get away. She of course wanted

> everyone to

> > > come. My oldest brother wanted nothing to do with it so she gave

> up

> > > on him but in order to assure that my other brother and I came,

> she

> > > played this whole " I am so depressed about the situation with

> your

> > > oldest brother not seeing us that I had to go on

> > > antidepressants...poor me, poor me...and to top it off I didn't

> feel

> > > I could tell your father that I went on anti-depressants because

> he

> > > would just make fun of me or tell someone that I don't want him

> to

> > > tell or... " She of course was using this " son induced

> depression " to

> > > evoke our pity so we couldn't say no to her invitation. Well the

> > > trip sucked. My son was sick and didn't sleep. She also later

> used

> > > an incident that happened with one of my brother's kids against

> he

> > > and his wife. My brother and I just put this all together a

> couple

> > > years after the trip when we were reminiscing about how wierd the

> > > whole thing felt.

> > >

> > > Sorry for the long story but I wanted to give an example of how

> she

> > > uses her " illnesses " to get the response and submission that she

> > > wants. She also has these other less visible diagnoses -

> myalgias

> > > and the like. They come and go. After using one of them for

> about

> > > 10 yrs I asked her what her doctor said because the average

> course of

> > > that diagnosis is only 3-5 years at the most with treatment. She

> > > didn't say much but she has used that one less and works another

> > > diagnosis more now.

> > >

> > > She is currently going through " daughter induced alopicia (hair

> > > loss) " since my NC decision. I swear she is putting Nair on her

> > > head! Just kidding but I also wouldn't put it past her. She

> > > had " son induced alopicia " several years ago too.

> > >

> > > The illnesses she has/claims to have are very serious illnesses

> so I

> > > don't mean to belittle anyone else's suffering. I am just pretty

> > > sure nada uses them to her full advantage whenever necessary.

> > >

> > > patinage

> >

>

[Guest guest]

<<My nada has not only used her disability but I suspect she may even

create illnesses that are harder to see when she needs to get more

sympathy from others in order to keep her " magic " world in order.

She hasn't always done this but as my brothers and I got older and

more independent, I think she needed stronger tools to keep us tied

to her.>>

Oh yes.

My smother recently had " bleeding ulcers " - because I confronted her

on some past events, of course. But what do you know when she went

to the dr he said it wasn't ulcers at all but just regular old acid

reflux.

Then she told me, and I quote " But I think I really did have bleeding

ulcers and they just healed before he saw them. "

Uh yeah, right. Don't you think he would have mentioned that if

that's what he saw?

[Guest guest]

My nada was very good at inventing illness to the point the doctor I went to as

a kid ignored my real problems and chalked them up to I was making them up or

she was making them up. Wan'st until I changed doctors that I got the help I'd

needed for 10 years. She also has used her health to get attention. She's

" had " about every possible infectious disease that comes up and when she does

have a problem she makes a mountain out of a molehill.

I don't believe that she really has a disability it's in her head.

MC

L D wrote:

<<My nada has not only used her disability but I suspect she may even

create illnesses that are harder to see when she needs to get more

sympathy from others in order to keep her " magic " world in order.

She hasn't always done this but as my brothers and I got older and

more independent, I think she needed stronger tools to keep us tied

to her.>>

Oh yes.

My smother recently had " bleeding ulcers " - because I confronted her

on some past events, of course. But what do you know when she went

to the dr he said it wasn't ulcers at all but just regular old acid

reflux.

Then she told me, and I quote " But I think I really did have bleeding

ulcers and they just healed before he saw them. "

Uh yeah, right. Don't you think he would have mentioned that if

that's what he saw?

[Guest guest]

Yes. Did I say yes? YES. It's usually a way to get people to do things

for her, that if she had done them for herself, she probably wouldn't

be in the pickle she's in currently. Queen/witch, I guess.

<snip>

> Is there anybody out there whose parent has BPD traits and also uses

> their illnesses or handicap for manipulation. Do you know of any

> books that address this double issue?

>

> Thank you

>

[Guest guest]

Oh, wow, you described my experience to a " T! My sister and I hated

our pediatrician, which I think my mother rather enjoyed - she loved

to threaten us with going to see him if we even hinted at feeling ill!

> <<My nada has not only used her disability but I suspect

she may even

> create illnesses that are harder to see when she needs to get more

> sympathy from others in order to keep her " magic " world in order.

> She hasn't always done this but as my brothers and I got older and

> more independent, I think she needed stronger tools to keep us tied

> to her.>>

>

> Oh yes.

>

> My smother recently had " bleeding ulcers " - because I confronted her

> on some past events, of course. But what do you know when she went

> to the dr he said it wasn't ulcers at all but just regular old acid

> reflux.

>

> Then she told me, and I quote " But I think I really did have bleeding

> ulcers and they just healed before he saw them. "

>

> Uh yeah, right. Don't you think he would have mentioned that if

> that's what he saw?

>

>

>