Re: Forms of Estradiol: all mgs aren't the same?

[Guest guest]

Olive Oil E, which I prefer for

convenience, cost and product purity, seems to be about half the strength of

Oestrogel or the creams.

Anybody else noticed this? Lynne

Yes, Lynne I

have. I used 12mg E cream, and now use 20 mg OOE. I’m currently experimenting

using the OO sublingually and think I feel it better that way.

nne

[Guest guest]

Leah Morton has made it clear to me that every time they change delivery systems of the estradiol and progesterone with what I shall call 'her version of the Wiley program,' the amounts have to be changed. She explained to me the delivery systems are VERY important in determining how much we need to use.

Forms of Estradiol: all mgs aren't the same?

I've noticed that it's very hard for us to compare dosing regimens because a 1 mg patch differs from 1 mg estradiol cream or gel which differs in its potency from 1 mg estradiol in Olive Oil.

By potency, I mean what we absorb and can feel working.

Olive Oil E, which I prefer for convenience, cost and product purity, seems to be about half the strength of Oestrogel or the creams.

Anybody else noticed this?

Lynne

[Guest guest]

Oh ABSOLUTELY. This is what I've been screaming for months now. I

can't get balanced because of this problem. It's why our doctors

when they hear " 8 mgs a day " they go bonkers. Some " 8 mgs " are only

equal to 2 mg! But I can't " prove " this with a damned study!

>

> I've noticed that it's very hard for us to compare dosing regimens

because a

> 1 mg patch differs from 1 mg estradiol cream or gel which differs

in its

> potency from 1 mg estradiol in Olive Oil.

>

> By potency, I mean what we absorb and can feel working.

>

> Olive Oil E, which I prefer for convenience, cost and product

purity, seems

> to be about half the strength of Oestrogel or the creams.

>

> Anybody else noticed this?

>

> Lynne

>

[Guest guest]

You think someone would tell us about this? In all of those books,

I don't think this topic has ever been mentioned.

>

>

>

> Olive Oil E, which I prefer for convenience, cost and product

purity, seems

> to be about half the strength of Oestrogel or the creams.

>

> Anybody else noticed this? Lynne

>

>

>

> Yes, Lynne I have. I used 12mg E cream, and now use 20 mg OOE. I'm

currently

> experimenting using the OO sublingually and think I feel it better

that way.

>

>

> nne

>

>

>

>

>

> _____

>

> size=2 width=500 style='width:375.0pt' align=left>

>

[Guest guest]

I’m currently experimenting using the OO sublingually and think I feel it better that way.

nne

nne, PLEASE let me know how your next labs come out, SHBG ect.....if that is up, it will lower your free Test too, thanks

[Guest guest]

It just seems that doctors are assuming that these creams have the

same strength as pills and patches! No way!

>

> As far as I know, there are no double-blind studies on compounded

hormones,

> like OOE. From the studies, we can figure out what to expect from

hormones

> like Estrace or Oestrogel, but there is nothing similar with the

compounded

> hormones.

> Val

>

> -----Original Message-----

>

[Guest guest]

Yes the P cream is in us but doesn't show up I know that. It's how

we FEEL that sucks! But it doesn't do its job either!! The P cream

did NOTHING to help with my heavy bleeds (meaning it wasn't

balancing properly). Only when I used the crinone did it do some

good. But the E cream is the real problem. I apply and apply and it

doesn't register in blood serum. I'm getting to be less and less a

fan of cream. OO was the same for me. Didn't help with my

flashes. And you got a 45 using prometrium?? That is ridiculous!

>

>

> In a message dated 4/7/2006 1:26:52 PM Pacific Standard Time,

> merryr@... writes:

>

> But I have often said that the cream strengths vary from place to

> place because I would get zero E readings using them.

>

>

>

>

>

>

> on transdermal P cream even on double P during WP,

> my P reading only got up to 7.7.

> BUT on 100mgs. Prometrium, I got 45 !!!!!!! The P cream is

stuck in my

> body,

> God only knows where, I know I cannot tolerate ANY P now

though.

> My body knows to avoid the transdermal P for now, maybe for

ever. The

> oral P made me

> dizzy, and comalike, depressed and heavylegged.

> OH and really cold....was told I have all the P overdose

symptoms, and

> since I have no

> uterus to avoid it ))) So that P cream is in us, just NOT

seen in our

> BLOOD

> (((

>

[Guest guest]

Wowee, wow wow. You must have been a zombie in pain. Like I would

be. The thing is, how did you get it to actually show up in blood

serum? My P never showed up - even on Wiley!

>

>

> In a message dated 4/10/2006 9:40:46 AM Pacific Standard Time,

> merryr@... writes:

>

> you got a 45 using prometrium?? That is ridiculous!

>

>

>

>

>

> YES............you can imagine how BAD I felt, I only did that for

a short

> time, was too dizzy, and depressed, as well as all my no E

symptoms ((((

>

>

[Guest guest]

Well transdermal P we know DOES do something ! We know this by how

we felt. But doctors never believe it's enough because it doesn't

show in the blood tests. But neither does my E! So creams are in

my opinion not that good at doing their job!

>

>

> In a message dated 4/11/2006 4:16:28 PM Pacific Standard Time,

> mcilhaneys@... writes:

>

> From: __ (mailto:merryr@...)

> To: _rhythmicliving _

(mailto:rhythmicliving )

>

> Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2006 1:32 PM

> Subject: Re: Forms of Estradiol: all mgs aren't

the same?

>

>

> Wowee, wow wow. You must have been a zombie in pain. Like I

would

> be. The thing is, how did you get it to actually show up in

blood

> serum? My P never showed up - even on Wiley!

>

>

>

>

>

> , the point for me was that in my body all that HRT cream P

stored in my

> fat and organs, so it was not free in my blood and didn't show up

in labs.

> Transdermal P metabolizes funny. BUT when I took ORAL P is WAS in

my blood,

> and did show up in my labs. I had done many day 21 labs with P

creams and even

> on WP P + 4 lines ONLY got blood levels up to 7.7..........but we

know that

> 900mgs. of P had to be in there somewhere.

>

[Guest guest]

And this is exactly what we mean when we say we need to TREAT BY

SYMPTOMS. Who cares about blood tests anyway? It's all about how

we FEEL. But doctors hang on to the tests like a dog with a bone!

It does not show up in the blood!

> In a message dated 4/11/2006 4:16:28 PM Pacific Standard

Time, mcilhaneys@... writes:

> So are you all saying that the blood test I am getting

tomorrow for P may not mean anything?

>

>

>

>

>

> Please let us know what your labs look like, are you on HRT

cream with the P? What have you got on you're other day 21's???? OH

are you putting it on your thin skin, like shins?? We were told to

put it on our fat, ackkkkkkkkkk (((( Maybe you will see it if you

put it where you can see veins, so it will be less able to grab on

to and stick to your fat??? OH I like the larger pica ))))

>

>

> click here for our webpage http://rhythmicliving.com/

>

> **The group conversation is informational in nature and is not

intended as medical advice.**

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Agreed. I think we and THEY are too caught up in numbers. I'm more

interested in FEELING well!!

mary

> > In a message dated 4/11/2006 4:16:28 PM Pacific Standard

> Time, mcilhaneys@ writes:

> > So are you all saying that the blood test I am getting

> tomorrow for P may not mean anything?

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Please let us know what your labs look like, are you on HRT

> cream with the P? What have you got on you're other day 21's????

OH

> are you putting it on your thin skin, like shins?? We were told to

> put it on our fat, ackkkkkkkkkk (((( Maybe you will see it if

you

> put it where you can see veins, so it will be less able to grab on

> to and stick to your fat??? OH I like the larger pica ))))

> >

> >

> > click here for our webpage http://rhythmicliving.com/

> >

> > **The group conversation is informational in nature and is not

> intended as medical advice.**

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

>

> That is exactly what I am trying to do, and I cannot imagine doing it

any other way, but then I don't get along well with most doctors for

the reasons you describe her. The nurse on my doctor's staff who

facilitates the program emphasized to me to call her if I notice ANY

LITTLE thing that didn't seem right or normal.

__________________________________________

: I can't believe they told you to call them if you noticed

any little change! Most responses are " see you in 6 weeks! "