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Gloria..please do not unsubscribe...I much look forward to reading your

posts..and I very much like Canadian's and their humor, country, government,

etc...don't allow some to get under your skin..I do not know how the rest of the

group feels, but I will be bummed out if you leave..my e-mail is

daveliltoe@... you do leave you are welcome to mail me at anytime...I

think the group will lose out if you leave, but like said, you can mail me at

anytime, and write whatever you wish...peace, Dave

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 4:10:57 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Well Mac - it seems that you are hell bent on finding fault with anything I say,

thus, don't worry your head about it any longer. I'll just unsuscribe !!!

My whole message had nothing whatsoever to do with " Boat People " or your opinion

that I am defaming any sect, domination, colour or creed. That is absolutely not

who I am!!! I am so Canadian that the beliefs or the colour of one's skin just

does not make a hill of beans. My reference to " Boat People " wouldn't be much

different than the news we hear constantly about the numbers of your illegal

aliens. A great deal of those Boat People went on to become excellent citizens

of this country!!

How do you think you could possibly help me with my post on anything to do with

the Canadian Health Care??

So, as soon as I finish reading the other posts - I'll un-subscribe.

____________ _________ _________ __

Gloria,

I understand you are fustrated with your health care system. But I'm sorry, the

term " Boat People " I find a bit offensive. If you want to to talk about

Cirrhosis and liver disease as it relates to health care cool. But to disparage

people with terms like " boat people " is unacceptable in this group and forum.

This group is for advice and love and compassion. A place to share our stories

and gripes without offense. This group is for support not ridicule. Its for

helping others by sharing information not defaming.

I wish I could have helped with your post but you didn't specify a specific

problem but generalized the problems with your health care.

MaC

>

> LOL Doesn't matter what government or what section of the government they work

for either. I used to work for the Provincial Government when I was very young

and at the end, I was working for our Medical Services Plan. Lawd, the absolute

worst place to be if you've got any intelligence whatsoever. I quit that job and

took a big pay dive, just so that I could go home at night, feeling better about

myself.

>

> I believe that when a person applies for a job with the Canadian government

that your position will be delegated to you according to your intelligence

level. If you've got a little bit, they'll maybe give you a position behind the

scenes in the technology section. If you can just pass the intelligence test, lo

and behold you can get a job at Revenue Canada. However, if you fail the test

altogether, never fear - they'll give you a job in the GST section.

>

> The best one that I had to deal with to this day, was a sub-species of the

Immigration Board. Their phone system was certainly not designed for use by

anyone that didn't have a commanding level of intelligence and spoke English

clearly. When I was finally able to speak to a real person, the first thing I

said was " I'm so glad that I was born in this country to get through that

garbage " . The whole reason for my call was that a client who had been receiving

Canada Pension was turning 65 and due to apply for the Old Age benefit. However,

they'd decided to change some rule and she was supposed to prove the plane that

she flew to get here from Spain, actually landed in Montreal and that she had a

paper to prove that!!! I said, good lawd, she's been getting CPP for almost 5

years, of course she must have landed. But, nope, I had to send for another

stupid document to prove that... She had kept every passport that she'd ever

had, even the Spanish one

> that she had when she emigrated here. The only paper she'd probably ever

mislaid was the stupid Landing Document. So, another $35.00 and 4 months later,

we had the document to prove that the plane did indeed land!!!!

>

> I might understand all of that, if I thought for a moment that one of our

numerous boat people were trying to apply; but, they don't have to - once you

actually come ashore, the Canadians will give you Welfare and cover your medical

until you can get on your feet!!! This lady, her husband and four living

children could all prove without a shadow of doubt how hard they worked in

Canada and for how many years, just by checking their CPP. Thus, it seemed so

bureaucratic to have to go through all of that.

>

> Gloria

>

>

>

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

>

>

> Seems they don't change much no matter what government they're employed by,

huh?! :)

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: Gloria <gadamscanyahoo (DOT) ca>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 10:19:23 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> LOL I had the same experience today dealing with Revenue Canada on behalf of a

client. I had talked to one agent earlier last week about this fella's Corporate

Tax and she was giving me another 45 days to complete everything. Then I spoke

to a different agent; but, same office last week regarding his GST. Then I get

another call from an agent in a different location again about his GST. In the

meantime, he (the client) threw a kink into the whole thing by calling them

himself. So, I called the first lady back and had to tell her the whole

conversation we'd already had last week and this just confused her to no end!!!!

I hate dealing with government employees!!! !!!!

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

>

> Hello everyone..I haven't been on here much lately..I think I told you all my

endoscope was good, with several small varices, but not large enough for

banding...my MRI said I was to call 3 days after to get results, but I haven't

called them yet..I kind of figured if there was anything found my doc. would

eventually call...since he has not I'm assuming the results were good...tonite

when checking my mail I had three letters from social security administration.

..the first two I opened were from there center in land stating I was being

enrolled by them in a prescription drug plan chosen by them and would receive

generic scripts for $2:10 each and brand names for $3:10, because of my income

level...sounds really good, I thought...the 3rd letter was from social security

in Kansas City stating I made to much to receive prescription medicine help!

figure that one out..guess I will take the letters to local office to

decipher..I hope you are all doing as

> well as possible...have any of you all had letters like these? Kind of like

the left hand not knowing what the right hand is doing. I'm hoping the

difference will be Medicaid not helping with scripts, and Medicare helping, but

since all are from SSA who know's. I don't write much here, but I always read

comments, and much appreciate this chat line being available. peace, Dave

>

>

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Gloria,

That would be an overreaction.  There is no need to unsubscribe. I think you

have a lot to offer to the group. But please understand my point view.  This is

a discussion group after all. If you disagree with me that is fine. You don't

have to leave to prove that point. It just seemed to me that there was a tone or

label to illegal immigrants etc which can be perceived as inflammatory. That's

all.  Please don't take that personal.

For me the term Boat People or " FOB " Fresh Off The Boat, is derogatory and

condescending. Everyone deserves some type of respect.

 

Well Mac - it seems that you are hell bent on finding fault

with anything I say, thus, don't worry your head about it any longer. I'll just

unsuscribe !!!

My whole message had nothing whatsoever to do with " Boat People " or your opinion

that I am defaming any sect, domination, colour or creed. That is absolutely

not who I am!!! I am so Canadian that the beliefs or the colour of one's skin

just does not make a hill of beans. My reference to " Boat People " wouldn't be

much different than the news we hear constantly about the numbers of your

illegal aliens. A great deal of those Boat People went on to become excellent

citizens of this country!!

How do you think you could possibly help me with my post on anything to do with

the Canadian Health Care??

So, as soon as I finish reading the other posts - I'll un-subscribe.

____________ _________ _________ __

Gloria,

I understand you are fustrated with your health care system. But I'm sorry, the

term " Boat People " I find a bit offensive. If you want to to talk about

Cirrhosis and liver disease as it relates to health care cool. But to disparage

people with terms like " boat people " is unacceptable in this group and forum.

This group is for advice and love and compassion. A place to share our stories

and gripes without offense. This group is for support not ridicule. Its for

helping others by sharing information not defaming.

I wish I could have helped with your post but you didn't specify a specific

problem but generalized the problems with your health care.

MaC

>

> LOL Doesn't matter what government or what section of the government they

work for either. I used to work for the Provincial Government when I was very

young and at the end, I was working for our Medical Services Plan. Lawd, the

absolute worst place to be if you've got any intelligence whatsoever. I quit

that job and took a big pay dive, just so that I could go home at night, feeling

better about myself.

>

> I believe that when a person applies for a job with the Canadian government

that your position will be delegated to you according to your intelligence

level. If you've got a little bit, they'll maybe give you a position behind the

scenes in the technology section. If you can just pass the intelligence test,

lo and behold you can get a job at Revenue Canada. However, if you fail the

test altogether, never fear - they'll give you a job in the GST section.

>

> The best one that I had to deal with to this day, was a sub-species of the

Immigration Board. Their phone system was certainly not designed for use by

anyone that didn't have a commanding level of intelligence and spoke English

clearly. When I was finally able to speak to a real person, the first thing I

said was " I'm so glad that I was born in this country to get through that

garbage " . The whole reason for my call was that a client who had been receiving

Canada Pension was turning 65 and due to apply for the Old Age benefit.

However, they'd decided to change some rule and she was supposed to prove the

plane that she flew to get here from Spain, actually landed in Montreal and that

she had a paper to prove that!!! I said, good lawd, she's been getting CPP for

almost 5 years, of course she must have landed. But, nope, I had to send for

another stupid document to prove that... She had kept every passport that she'd

ever had, even the Spanish one

> that she had when she emigrated here. The only paper she'd probably ever

mislaid was the stupid Landing Document. So, another $35.00 and 4 months later,

we had the document to prove that the plane did indeed land!!!!

>

> I might understand all of that, if I thought for a moment that one of our

numerous boat people were trying to apply; but, they don't have to - once you

actually come ashore, the Canadians will give you Welfare and cover your medical

until you can get on your feet!!! This lady, her husband and four living

children could all prove without a shadow of doubt how hard they worked in

Canada and for how many years, just by checking their CPP. Thus, it seemed so

bureaucratic to have to go through all of that.

>

> Gloria

>

>

>

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

>

>

> Seems they don't change much no matter what government they're employed by,

huh?! :)

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: Gloria <gadamscanyahoo (DOT) ca>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 10:19:23 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> LOL I had the same experience today dealing with Revenue Canada on behalf of a

client. I had talked to one agent earlier last week about this fella's Corporate

Tax and she was giving me another 45 days to complete everything. Then I spoke

to a different agent; but, same office last week regarding his GST. Then I get

another call from an agent in a different location again about his GST. In the

meantime, he (the client) threw a kink into the whole thing by calling them

himself. So, I called the first lady back and had to tell her the whole

conversation we'd already had last week and this just confused her to no end!!!!

I hate dealing with government employees!!! !!!!

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

>

> Hello everyone..I haven't been on here much lately..I think I told you all my

endoscope was good, with several small varices, but not large enough for

banding...my MRI said I was to call 3 days after to get results, but I haven't

called them yet..I kind of figured if there was anything found my doc. would

eventually call...since he has not I'm assuming the results were good...tonite

when checking my mail I had three letters from social security administration.

..the first two I opened were from there center in land stating I was being

enrolled by them in a prescription drug plan chosen by them and would receive

generic scripts for $2:10 each and brand names for $3:10, because of my income

level...sounds really good, I thought...the 3rd letter was from social security

in Kansas City stating I made to much to receive prescription medicine help!

figure that one out..guess I will take the letters to local office to

decipher..I hope you are all doing as

> well as possible...have any of you all had letters like these? Kind of like

the left hand not knowing what the right hand is doing. I'm hoping the

difference will be Medicaid not helping with scripts, and Medicare helping, but

since all are from SSA who know's. I don't write much here, but I always read

comments, and much appreciate this chat line being available. peace, Dave

>

>

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No Mac - perceive it any way you would like !!! You managed to pick one phrase

out of my whole post and want to make some kind of big deal over it. However,

you have more power on this site than I do and I will not fall into having some

kind of public debate like someone who's begging, cause I have no where else to

go. You can just carry on and find fault with others peoples so called

inflammatory opinions, mine just will not be there to upset anyone.

My time is very limited because I too suffer from liver cirrhosis and currently

about 30 weeks into my second treatment, only this time it's the Trio. I also

still try to run my bookkeeping business about 30 hrs per week. So, I simply

don't need for you to criticize me so quickly !!! I am away to sensitive right

now and I don't see where you treated me with as much compassion as you do about

defending some perception of your own that I might be hurting somebody's

feelings. I am definitely not known to be one iota racist and if you actually

knew me you would know that instantly. So, I'm just as happy to stick to the

one group that doesn't seem to have such a problem with me and my babbling at

times.

Gloria

________________________________

Gloria,

That would be an overreaction. There is no need to unsubscribe. I think you

have a lot to offer to the group. But please understand my point view. This is

a discussion group after all. If you disagree with me that is fine. You don't

have to leave to prove that point. It just seemed to me that there was a tone or

label to illegal immigrants etc which can be perceived as inflammatory. That's

all. Please don't take that personal.

For me the term Boat People or " FOB " Fresh Off The Boat, is derogatory and

condescending. Everyone deserves some type of respect.

Well Mac - it seems that you are hell bent on finding fault with anything I say,

thus, don't worry your head about it any longer. I'll just unsuscribe !!!

My whole message had nothing whatsoever to do with " Boat People " or your opinion

that I am defaming any sect, domination, colour or creed. That is absolutely

not who I am!!! I am so Canadian that the beliefs or the colour of one's skin

just does not make a hill of beans. My reference to " Boat People " wouldn't be

much different than the news we hear constantly about the numbers of your

illegal aliens. A great deal of those Boat People went on to become excellent

citizens of this country!!

How do you think you could possibly help me with my post on anything to do with

the Canadian Health Care??

So, as soon as I finish reading the other posts - I'll un-subscribe.

____________ _________ _________ __

Gloria,

I understand you are fustrated with your health care system. But I'm sorry, the

term " Boat People " I find a bit offensive. If you want to to talk about

Cirrhosis and liver disease as it relates to health care cool. But to disparage

people with terms like " boat people " is unacceptable in this group and forum.

This group is for advice and love and compassion. A place to share our stories

and gripes without offense. This group is for support not ridicule. Its for

helping others by sharing information not defaming.

I wish I could have helped with your post but you didn't specify a specific

problem but generalized the problems with your health care.

MaC

>

> LOL Doesn't matter what government or what section of the government they

work for either. I used to work for the Provincial Government when I was very

young and at the end, I was working for our Medical Services Plan. Lawd, the

absolute worst place to be if you've got any intelligence whatsoever. I quit

that job and took a big pay dive, just so that I could go home at night, feeling

better about myself.

>

> I believe that when a person applies for a job with the Canadian government

that your position will be delegated to you according to your intelligence

level. If you've got a little bit, they'll maybe give you a position behind the

scenes in the technology section. If you can just pass the intelligence test,

lo and behold you can get a job at Revenue Canada. However, if you fail the

test altogether, never fear - they'll give you a job in the GST section.

>

> The best one that I had to deal with to this day, was a sub-species of the

Immigration Board. Their phone system was certainly not designed for use by

anyone that didn't have a commanding level of intelligence and spoke English

clearly. When I was finally able to speak to a real person, the first thing I

said was " I'm so glad that I was born in this country to get through that

garbage " . The whole reason for my call was that a client who had been receiving

Canada Pension was turning 65 and due to apply for the Old Age benefit.

However, they'd decided to change some rule and she was supposed to prove the

plane that she flew to get here from Spain, actually landed in Montreal and that

she had a paper to prove that!!! I said, good lawd, she's been getting CPP for

almost 5 years, of course she must have landed. But, nope, I had to send for

another stupid document to prove that... She had kept every passport that she'd

ever had, even the Spanish one

> that she had when she emigrated here. The only paper she'd probably ever

mislaid was the stupid Landing Document. So, another $35.00 and 4 months later,

we had the document to prove that the plane did indeed land!!!!

>

> I might understand all of that, if I thought for a moment that one of our

numerous boat people were trying to apply; but, they don't have to - once you

actually come ashore, the Canadians will give you Welfare and cover your medical

until you can get on your feet!!! This lady, her husband and four living

children could all prove without a shadow of doubt how hard they worked in

Canada and for how many years, just by checking their CPP. Thus, it seemed so

bureaucratic to have to go through all of that.

>

> Gloria

>

>

>

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

>

>

> Seems they don't change much no matter what government they're employed by,

huh?! :)

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: Gloria <gadamscanyahoo (DOT) ca>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 10:19:23 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> LOL I had the same experience today dealing with Revenue Canada on behalf of a

client. I had talked to one agent earlier last week about this fella's Corporate

Tax and she was giving me another 45 days to complete everything. Then I spoke

to a different agent; but, same office last week regarding his GST. Then I get

another call from an agent in a different location again about his GST. In the

meantime, he (the client) threw a kink into the whole thing by calling them

himself. So, I called the first lady back and had to tell her the whole

conversation we'd already had last week and this just confused her to no end!!!!

I hate dealing with government employees!!! !!!!

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

>

> Hello everyone..I haven't been on here much lately..I think I told you all my

endoscope was good, with several small varices, but not large enough for

banding...my MRI said I was to call 3 days after to get results, but I haven't

called them yet..I kind of figured if there was anything found my doc. would

eventually call...since he has not I'm assuming the results were good...tonite

when checking my mail I had three letters from social security administration.

..the first two I opened were from there center in land stating I was being

enrolled by them in a prescription drug plan chosen by them and would receive

generic scripts for $2:10 each and brand names for $3:10, because of my income

level...sounds really good, I thought...the 3rd letter was from social security

in Kansas City stating I made to much to receive prescription medicine help!

figure that one out..guess I will take the letters to local office to

decipher..I hope you are all doing as

> well as possible...have any of you all had letters like these? Kind of like

the left hand not knowing what the right hand is doing. I'm hoping the

difference will be Medicaid not helping with scripts, and Medicare helping, but

since all are from SSA who know's. I don't write much here, but I always read

comments, and much appreciate this chat line being available. peace, Dave

>

>

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Share on other sites

Phyllis...thank you very much for the reply..I'm not trained in any type of

public speaking, other than the norm, and my primary caregiver, my Great

Grandmother...she was almost full Osage Indian, and her last name was Speaker..I

love(d) here as much as she does (did) me..she was supreme at unconditional

love..something I did not find again until I was 28 and had my own baby..I have

always taken great pride and love from my relationship with her..listening to

her stories, indeed just watching her..a small woman with floor length raven

hair...enough of my ramblings; mainly wanted to tell Mac how difficult being

monitor of a group must be..I do not envy your task..I would not be able to

control my ramblings...I'm not trying to suck up to you, because you are a

monitor...for one I'm not sure you are one...my days of sucking up are over...I

am at the 'take me as I am, or stay the **** away stage'...Just hated to see

Gloria leave, as she was a

constant and dependable member.  Her responses were almost on as a daily

voice..I do not even know what your terms and conditions are anyhow..I figure

when I step over the line I will hear about it..good luck to you, Gloria,

Phyllis, etc. peace out,  Dave

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 3:09:30 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

DAVE, ARE YOU IN PUBLIC RELATIONS?  YOU'RE DAMN GOOD!

KUDOS!

____________ _________ _________ __

From: dave dodds <daveliltoeyahoo (DOT) com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 8:01:41 AM

Subject: (unknown)

 

Gloria,  I was not personally offended about your remark, and realize that is a

common term used in many countries attributed to immigrants that arrive in our

countries, and many others, by any means possible.... In their case often

unsafe, overloaded boats...I do understand how some may be offended...just so

happens most early immigrants arrived in just such a way...apparently some are

offended by the term, as is their right...I have found your entries here to be

very compassionate and caring...is the topic of immigrants related to health

care?  Very much so...so it must be the term found non-appropriate, and

hopefully not the effect that immigration has on the health system..my reason

for joining this group is to find a release, a better understanding, etc. from

those suffering with liver disease...much of the release for me involves writing

what is happening with myself, listening to others telling their own

circumstance, and very importantly and

paramount, comradery ...as one who is often offended easily, and often wrong in

perceived hurts, I must be vigilant in watching for justified and unjustified

wrongs...if I do that, 90 plus % are unjustified. ..peace

 Dave

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Dave, there is no user agreement to govern this group. The owner has left it up

to the three of us to moderate as best we can, and we have very very simple

rules which are mostly common sense. Posting links to any products, asking for

donations or other requests for money , which has actually happened, flaming

each other, which happens about twice a year, and discussing politics and other

divisive subjects usually gets a response from a moderator.

If one member offends another, it is usually brought to the attention of the

offender by the offendee, and apologies are exchanged, and that's usually the

end of it, no moderator needed. I hope Gloria does not quit. I hope that trying

to keep some kind of order here does not discourage people to post, but the

reality is that every month there are more and more people who find us on line

looking for support and answers. If this someone decides that things have gotten

too strict, they might want to check out other support groups, and they might

find one more laid back, but I have checked out many, and find almost all of

them to be much much more strict.

My wife joined a support group in 2002 after being diagnosed with Chiari

malformation. She actually joined several, and they all helped shape her course

of treatment. I toyed with the idea of starting my own group because our owner

here , being a sufferer of end stage liver disease herself was unable to tend to

this group when she was very ill, and there was grumbling among the members. One

member actually got fed up with things and started another liver cirrhosis

support group here at Yahoo.

I belonged to both for a while until she disappeared from the web like a puff of

smoke. My blackberry actually notifies me now in my own voice " some one just

posted on the OLD support group " , 24 hours a day. I never changed it. I think

about her when ever I get that notification. I am grateful to have been

nominated to me a moderator here.

This really is the best support group on the web in my opinion. I've tried a

bunch. But it isnt the moderators who make it so special, it's the people who

are the members! It's YOU, Barby, Jan, Abijann, ,Pamela,Lyncia, Penny,

Qoya,Sharon, ( she quit by the way), Tilly,

Phyliss, Jill , Maureen, ,MaC,, Gloria,,

,Debra,Debbie,, Crazy Girl, Kim, its all of YOU who make this the best

support group. They may have better graphics and features, but we have the

PEOPLE.

I dont make too many AA meetings these days because of the cigarette smoke and

the transportation issues, but I feel like this group is the service that we in

AA are encourage to do as a part of a program of sobriety. I know this does keep

me very busy.

Even if I dont post, I read evey singe one, even when I was in the hospital two

summers ago. My black berry is on 24 hours, and often gongs in the middle of the

night with Yahoo chat, and I end up having a conversation with someone I dont

even know until the sun comes up. It is very very interesting, and also very

rewarding. .

I am really glad that most of the people here really do get the idea of what is

appropriate, and what is not and it makes me sad any time someone quits. I was

sad that my friend quit two years ago and started her own group, and then just

disappeared. I am just really glad that we have a good mix here, my other

support groups were dismal. Everyone decompensated, no humor, mean people, you

name it.

As MaC always says, it's all about the love.

love, Bobby

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2009 11:51:08 AM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

Phyllis...thank you very much for the reply..I'm not trained in any type of

public speaking, other than the norm, and my primary caregiver, my Great

Grandmother. ..she was almost full Osage Indian, and her last name was

Speaker..I love(d) here as much as she does (did) me..she was supreme at

unconditional love..something I did not find again until I was 28 and had my own

baby..I have always taken great pride and love from my relationship with

her..listening to her stories, indeed just watching her..a small woman with

floor length raven hair...enough of my ramblings; mainly wanted to tell Mac how

difficult being monitor of a group must be..I do not envy your task..I would not

be able to control my ramblings... I'm not trying to suck up to you, because you

are a monitor...for one I'm not sure you are one...my days of sucking up are

over...I am at the 'take me as I am, or stay the **** away stage'...Just hated

to see Gloria leave, as she was a

constant and dependable member. Her responses were almost on as a daily

voice..I do not even know what your terms and conditions are anyhow..I figure

when I step over the line I will hear about it..good luck to you, Gloria,

Phyllis, etc. peace out, Dave

____________ _________ _________ __

From: Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 3:09:30 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

DAVE, ARE YOU IN PUBLIC RELATIONS? YOU'RE DAMN GOOD!

KUDOS!

____________ _________ _________ __

From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 8:01:41 AM

Subject: (unknown)

Gloria, I was not personally offended about your remark, and realize that is a

common term used in many countries attributed to immigrants that arrive in our

countries, and many others, by any means possible.... In their case often

unsafe, overloaded boats...I do understand how some may be offended...just so

happens most early immigrants arrived in just such a way...apparently some are

offended by the term, as is their right...I have found your entries here to be

very compassionate and caring...is the topic of immigrants related to health

care? Very much so...so it must be the term found non-appropriate, and

hopefully not the effect that immigration has on the health system..my reason

for joining this group is to find a release, a better understanding, etc. from

those suffering with liver disease...much of the release for me involves writing

what is happening with myself, listening to others telling their own

circumstance, and very importantly and

paramount, comradery ...as one who is often offended easily, and often wrong in

perceived hurts, I must be vigilant in watching for justified and unjustified

wrongs...if I do that, 90 plus % are unjustified. ..peace

Dave

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Share on other sites

Bobby - and everyone. I also belong to two heart support groups and a

kidney disease support group. There is frequently information which helps

me deal with those problems. So, I am grateful for them. But this group is

so different. I think it is the fact that it seems to be the concensus here

that liver disease not only is in the body, but changes the whole life of

the person who has it and the family and friends they have. And those

changes are also addressed and supportive suggestions given. We are

individuals here, but also family members. It is a real conundrum how I

feel about this group. So many of the messages are about problems, asking

for suggestions, asking for assurance that someone else had experienced the

same thing, a lot of sad things, but when I open my emails, I get excited to

see who has posted to here. Just like when I see something from one of my

kids. Gloria, I hope you will stay. I am part of management of a couple

adoption search and reunion groups. I hate it when some one decides to

leave. I keep wondering what we did wrong. I would like to send an email

asking why they quit. My co owner says don't worry about it, people just

come and go. Here, we lose too many the way it is. We were just notified

today that someone on our kidney group has died. I know when I went into

the hospital for my bypass last year, I was asked to name someone who could

update the people here on how I was doing. Just thought I would mention

that for those of you who don't have someone now who can access your yahoo

groups, it is a good idea to designate someone you can trust and give them

your codewords, etc. Jan H

On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM, Bob Aragon wrote:

> Dave, there is no user agreement to govern this group. The owner has left

> it up to the three of us to moderate as best we can, and we have very very

> simple rules which are mostly common sense. Posting links to any products,

> asking for donations or other requests for money , which has actually

> happened, flaming each other, which happens about twice a year, and

> discussing politics and other divisive subjects usually gets a response from

> a moderator.

>

> If one member offends another, it is usually brought to the attention of

> the offender by the offendee, and apologies are exchanged, and that's

> usually the end of it, no moderator needed. I hope Gloria does not quit. I

> hope that trying to keep some kind of order here does not discourage people

> to post, but the reality is that every month there are more and more people

> who find us on line looking for support and answers. If this someone decides

> that things have gotten too strict, they might want to check out other

> support groups, and they might find one more laid back, but I have checked

> out many, and find almost all of them to be much much more strict.

>

> My wife joined a support group in 2002 after being diagnosed with Chiari

> malformation. She actually joined several, and they all helped shape her

> course of treatment. I toyed with the idea of starting my own group because

> our owner here , being a sufferer of end stage liver disease herself was

> unable to tend to this group when she was very ill, and there was grumbling

> among the members. One member actually got fed up with things and started

> another liver cirrhosis support group here at Yahoo.

> I belonged to both for a while until she disappeared from the web like a

> puff of smoke. My blackberry actually notifies me now in my own voice " some

> one just posted on the OLD support group " , 24 hours a day. I never changed

> it. I think about her when ever I get that notification. I am grateful to

> have been nominated to me a moderator here.

> This really is the best support group on the web in my opinion. I've tried

> a bunch. But it isnt the moderators who make it so special, it's the people

> who are the members! It's YOU, Barby, Jan, Abijann, ,Pamela,Lyncia,

> Penny, Qoya,Sharon, ( she quit by the way), Tilly,

> Phyliss, Jill , Maureen, ,MaC,, Gloria,,

> ,Debra,Debbie,, Crazy Girl, Kim, its all of YOU who make this the

> best support group. They may have better graphics and features, but we have

> the PEOPLE.

> I dont make too many AA meetings these days because of the cigarette smoke

> and the transportation issues, but I feel like this group is the service

> that we in AA are encourage to do as a part of a program of sobriety. I know

> this does keep me very busy.

>

> Even if I dont post, I read evey singe one, even when I was in the hospital

> two summers ago. My black berry is on 24 hours, and often gongs in the

> middle of the night with Yahoo chat, and I end up having a conversation

> with someone I dont even know until the sun comes up. It is very very

> interesting, and also very rewarding. .

>

> I am really glad that most of the people here really do get the idea of

> what is appropriate, and what is not and it makes me sad any time someone

> quits. I was sad that my friend quit two years ago and started her own

> group, and then just disappeared. I am just really glad that we have a good

> mix here, my other support groups were dismal. Everyone decompensated, no

> humor, mean people, you name it.

> As MaC always says, it's all about the love.

>

> love, Bobby

>

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: livercirrhosissupport

> Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2009 11:51:08 AM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Phyllis...thank you very much for the reply..I'm not trained in any type of

> public speaking, other than the norm, and my primary caregiver, my Great

> Grandmother. ..she was almost full Osage Indian, and her last name was

> Speaker..I love(d) here as much as she does (did) me..she was supreme at

> unconditional love..something I did not find again until I was 28 and had my

> own baby..I have always taken great pride and love from my relationship with

> her..listening to her stories, indeed just watching her..a small woman with

> floor length raven hair...enough of my ramblings; mainly wanted to tell Mac

> how difficult being monitor of a group must be..I do not envy your task..I

> would not be able to control my ramblings... I'm not trying to suck up to

> you, because you are a monitor...for one I'm not sure you are one...my days

> of sucking up are over...I am at the 'take me as I am, or stay the **** away

> stage'...Just hated to see Gloria leave, as she was a

> constant and dependable member. Her responses were almost on as a daily

> voice..I do not even know what your terms and conditions are anyhow..I

> figure when I step over the line I will hear about it..good luck to you,

> Gloria, Phyllis, etc. peace out, Dave

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 3:09:30 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> DAVE, ARE YOU IN PUBLIC RELATIONS? YOU'RE DAMN GOOD!

> KUDOS!

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 8:01:41 AM

> Subject: (unknown)

>

>

> Gloria, I was not personally offended about your remark, and realize that

> is a common term used in many countries attributed to immigrants that arrive

> in our countries, and many others, by any means possible.... In their case

> often unsafe, overloaded boats...I do understand how some may be

> offended...just so happens most early immigrants arrived in just such a

> way...apparently some are offended by the term, as is their right...I have

> found your entries here to be very compassionate and caring...is the topic

> of immigrants related to health care? Very much so...so it must be the term

> found non-appropriate, and hopefully not the effect that immigration has on

> the health system..my reason for joining this group is to find a release, a

> better understanding, etc. from those suffering with liver disease...much of

> the release for me involves writing what is happening with myself, listening

> to others telling their own circumstance, and very importantly and

> paramount, comradery ...as one who is often offended easily, and often

> wrong in perceived hurts, I must be vigilant in watching for justified and

> unjustified wrongs...if I do that, 90 plus % are unjustified. ..peace

> Dave

>

>

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Share on other sites

Thank You all very much...

 

Bobby, my husband Dave was at Emory and was evaluate for a Liver Transplant but

was turn down because of me. What i didn't say early was that i;m a Quadriplegic

 with no support, no Family. just caregivers for myself since Dave took sick.

This is the hardest thing to Hear when someone has Care for me for over thirty

years. To know I'm to Blame because I can't physically Help. I;m manage to get

Hospice to ease up the Medications and what I'm doing now is trying to get him

home. I Have some good friends helping me fast track programs in order to

achieve this. Nurses have told me once he is home to detox him and Dave could

manage with a Attendant.. I Have recently learn i have Hep C also but this isn't

about me, it about Dave.

Dave hasn't had a liver biopsy yet and no one mention it lately but he no longer

has Ascites.

I Guess I'm looking for some Advise as what to expect Health wise or to be

warned of any more blocks from the Hospice System. I'm not sure how much more i

can take. I Need all the  knowledge i can get in order for me to help my

Husband.

 

Again Thank You All,

Bea

 

I;m still very new at posting or even to Chat's, but will catch on Quick. Please

bare with me.

 

 

 

Subject: Re: (unknown)

To: livercirrhosissupport

Date: Sunday, September 6, 2009, 3:45 AM

 

Dave, there is no user agreement to govern this group. The owner has left it up

to the three of us to moderate as best we can, and we have very very simple

rules which are mostly common sense. Posting links to any products, asking for

donations or other requests for money , which has actually happened, flaming

each other, which happens about twice a year, and discussing politics and other

divisive subjects usually gets a response from a moderator..

If one member offends another, it is usually brought to the attention of the

offender by the offendee, and apologies are exchanged, and that's usually the

end of it, no moderator needed. I hope Gloria does not quit. I hope that trying

to keep some kind of order here does not discourage people to post, but the

reality is that every month there are more and more people who find us on line

looking for support and answers. If this someone decides that things have gotten

too strict, they might want to check out other support groups, and they might

find one more laid back, but I have checked out many, and find almost all of

them to be much much more strict.

My wife joined a support group in 2002 after being diagnosed with Chiari

malformation. She actually joined several, and they all helped shape her course

of treatment. I toyed with the idea of starting my own group because our owner

here , being a sufferer of end stage liver disease herself was unable to tend to

this group when she was very ill, and there was grumbling among the members. One

member actually got fed up with things and started another liver cirrhosis

support group here at Yahoo.

I belonged to both for a while until she disappeared from the web like a puff of

smoke. My blackberry actually notifies me now in my own voice " some one just

posted on the OLD support group " , 24 hours a day. I never changed it. I think

about her when ever I get that notification. I am grateful to have been

nominated to me a moderator here.

This really is the best support group on the web in my opinion. I've tried a

bunch. But it isnt the moderators who make it so special, it's the people who

are the members! It's YOU, Barby, Jan, Abijann, ,Pamela, Lyncia, Penny,

Qoya,Sharon, ( she quit by the way), Tilly,

Phyliss, Jill , Maureen, ,MaC, , Gloria,, ,Debra,

Debbie,, Crazy Girl, Kim, its all of YOU who make this the best support

group. They may have better graphics and features, but we have the PEOPLE.

I dont make too many AA meetings these days because of the cigarette smoke and

the transportation issues, but I feel like this group is the service that we in

AA are encourage to do as a part of a program of sobriety. I know this does keep

me very busy.

Even if I dont post, I read evey singe one, even when I was in the hospital two

summers ago. My black berry is on 24 hours, and often gongs in the middle of the

night with Yahoo chat, and I end up having a conversation with someone I dont

even know until the sun comes up. It is very very interesting, and also very

rewarding. .

I am really glad that most of the people here really do get the idea of what is

appropriate, and what is not and it makes me sad any time someone quits. I was

sad that my friend quit two years ago and started her own group, and then just

disappeared. I am just really glad that we have a good mix here, my other

support groups were dismal. Everyone decompensated, no humor, mean people, you

name it.

As MaC always says, it's all about the love.

love, Bobby

____________ _________ _________ __

From: dave dodds <daveliltoeyahoo (DOT) com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2009 11:51:08 AM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

Phyllis...thank you very much for the reply..I'm not trained in any type of

public speaking, other than the norm, and my primary caregiver, my Great

Grandmother. ..she was almost full Osage Indian, and her last name was

Speaker..I love(d) here as much as she does (did) me..she was supreme at

unconditional love..something I did not find again until I was 28 and had my own

baby..I have always taken great pride and love from my relationship with

her...listening to her stories, indeed just watching her..a small woman with

floor length raven hair...enough of my ramblings; mainly wanted to tell Mac how

difficult being monitor of a group must be..I do not envy your task..I would not

be able to control my ramblings... I'm not trying to suck up to you, because you

are a monitor...for one I'm not sure you are one...my days of sucking up are

over...I am at the 'take me as I am, or stay the **** away stage'...Just hated

to see Gloria leave, as she was a

constant and dependable member. Her responses were almost on as a daily voice..I

do not even know what your terms and conditions are anyhow..I figure when I step

over the line I will hear about it..good luck to you, Gloria, Phyllis, etc.

peace out, Dave

____________ _________ _________ __

From: Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 3:09:30 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

DAVE, ARE YOU IN PUBLIC RELATIONS? YOU'RE DAMN GOOD!

KUDOS!

____________ _________ _________ __

From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 8:01:41 AM

Subject: (unknown)

Gloria, I was not personally offended about your remark, and realize that is a

common term used in many countries attributed to immigrants that arrive in our

countries, and many others, by any means possible.... In their case often

unsafe, overloaded boats...I do understand how some may be offended....just so

happens most early immigrants arrived in just such a way...apparently some are

offended by the term, as is their right...I have found your entries here to be

very compassionate and caring...is the topic of immigrants related to health

care? Very much so...so it must be the term found non-appropriate, and hopefully

not the effect that immigration has on the health system..my reason for joining

this group is to find a release, a better understanding, etc. from those

suffering with liver disease...much of the release for me involves writing what

is happening with myself, listening to others telling their own circumstance,

and very importantly and

paramount, comradery ...as one who is often offended easily, and often wrong in

perceived hurts, I must be vigilant in watching for justified and unjustified

wrongs...if I do that, 90 plus % are unjustified. ..peace

Dave

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Share on other sites

Thanks Dave,

This group is mostly self moderated and it doesn't take much work to actually

moderate. I hope Gloria stays and that she doesn't take this too seriously. I

can already see that her presence here has an impact and it would be sad to have

her go.

MaC

Subject: Re: (unknown)

To: livercirrhosissupport

Date: Saturday, September 5, 2009, 10:51 AM

 

Phyllis...thank you very much for the reply..I'm not trained

in any type of public speaking, other than the norm, and my primary caregiver,

my Great Grandmother. ..she was almost full Osage Indian, and her last name was

Speaker..I love(d) here as much as she does (did) me..she was supreme at

unconditional love..something I did not find again until I was 28 and had my own

baby..I have always taken great pride and love from my relationship with

her..listening to her stories, indeed just watching her..a small woman with

floor length raven hair...enough of my ramblings; mainly wanted to tell Mac how

difficult being monitor of a group must be..I do not envy your task..I would not

be able to control my ramblings... I'm not trying to suck up to you, because you

are a monitor...for one I'm not sure you are one...my days of sucking up are

over...I am at the 'take me as I am, or stay the **** away stage'...Just hated

to see Gloria leave,

as she was a

constant and dependable member.  Her responses were almost on as a daily

voice..I do not even know what your terms and conditions are anyhow..I figure

when I step over the line I will hear about it..good luck to you, Gloria,

Phyllis, etc. peace out,  Dave

____________ _________ _________ __

From: Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 3:09:30 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

DAVE, ARE YOU IN PUBLIC RELATIONS?  YOU'RE DAMN GOOD!

KUDOS!

____________ _________ _________ __

From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 8:01:41 AM

Subject: (unknown)

 

Gloria,  I was not personally offended about your remark, and realize that is a

common term used in many countries attributed to immigrants that arrive in our

countries, and many others, by any means possible.... In their case often

unsafe, overloaded boats...I do understand how some may be offended...just so

happens most early immigrants arrived in just such a way...apparently some are

offended by the term, as is their right...I have found your entries here to be

very compassionate and caring...is the topic of immigrants related to health

care?  Very much so...so it must be the term found non-appropriate, and

hopefully not the effect that immigration has on the health system..my reason

for joining this group is to find a release, a better understanding, etc. from

those suffering with liver disease...much of the release for me involves writing

what is happening with myself, listening to others telling their own

circumstance, and very importantly and

paramount, comradery ...as one who is often offended easily, and often wrong in

perceived hurts, I must be vigilant in watching for justified and unjustified

wrongs...if I do that, 90 plus % are unjustified. ..peace

 Dave

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Share on other sites

very well said bobby,you are the sweetest!!!! and speaking of AA you have a

birthday right around the corner dont you !!! i believe the 15th?! love you

bob-o!!!!

>

> Dave, there is no user agreement to govern this group. The owner has left it

up to the three of us to moderate as best we can, and we have very very simple

rules which are mostly common sense. Posting links to any products, asking for

donations or other requests for money , which has actually happened, flaming

each other, which happens about twice a year, and discussing politics and other

divisive subjects usually gets a response from a moderator.

>

> If one member offends another, it is usually brought to the attention of the

offender by the offendee, and apologies are exchanged, and that's usually the

end of it, no moderator needed. I hope Gloria does not quit. I hope that trying

to keep some kind of order here does not discourage people to post, but the

reality is that every month there are more and more people who find us on line

looking for support and answers. If this someone decides that things have gotten

too strict, they might want to check out other support groups, and they might

find one more laid back, but I have checked out many, and find almost all of

them to be much much more strict.

>

> My wife joined a support group in 2002 after being diagnosed with Chiari

malformation. She actually joined several, and they all helped shape her course

of treatment. I toyed with the idea of starting my own group because our owner

here , being a sufferer of end stage liver disease herself was unable to tend to

this group when she was very ill, and there was grumbling among the members. One

member actually got fed up with things and started another liver cirrhosis

support group here at Yahoo.

> I belonged to both for a while until she disappeared from the web like a puff

of smoke. My blackberry actually notifies me now in my own voice " some one just

posted on the OLD support group " , 24 hours a day. I never changed it. I think

about her when ever I get that notification. I am grateful to have been

nominated to me a moderator here.

> This really is the best support group on the web in my opinion. I've tried a

bunch. But it isnt the moderators who make it so special, it's the people who

are the members! It's YOU, Barby, Jan, Abijann, ,Pamela,Lyncia, Penny,

Qoya,Sharon, ( she quit by the way), Tilly,

> Phyliss, Jill , Maureen, ,MaC,, Gloria,,

,Debra,Debbie,, Crazy Girl, Kim, its all of YOU who make this the best

support group. They may have better graphics and features, but we have the

PEOPLE.

> I dont make too many AA meetings these days because of the cigarette smoke and

the transportation issues, but I feel like this group is the service that we in

AA are encourage to do as a part of a program of sobriety. I know this does keep

me very busy.

>

> Even if I dont post, I read evey singe one, even when I was in the hospital

two summers ago. My black berry is on 24 hours, and often gongs in the middle of

the night with Yahoo chat, and I end up having a conversation with someone I

dont even know until the sun comes up. It is very very interesting, and also

very rewarding. .

>

> I am really glad that most of the people here really do get the idea of what

is appropriate, and what is not and it makes me sad any time someone quits. I

was sad that my friend quit two years ago and started her own group, and then

just disappeared. I am just really glad that we have a good mix here, my other

support groups were dismal. Everyone decompensated, no humor, mean people, you

name it.

> As MaC always says, it's all about the love.

>

> love, Bobby

>

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: livercirrhosissupport

> Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2009 11:51:08 AM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Phyllis...thank you very much for the reply..I'm not trained in any type of

public speaking, other than the norm, and my primary caregiver, my Great

Grandmother. ..she was almost full Osage Indian, and her last name was

Speaker..I love(d) here as much as she does (did) me..she was supreme at

unconditional love..something I did not find again until I was 28 and had my own

baby..I have always taken great pride and love from my relationship with

her..listening to her stories, indeed just watching her..a small woman with

floor length raven hair...enough of my ramblings; mainly wanted to tell Mac how

difficult being monitor of a group must be..I do not envy your task..I would not

be able to control my ramblings... I'm not trying to suck up to you, because you

are a monitor...for one I'm not sure you are one...my days of sucking up are

over...I am at the 'take me as I am, or stay the **** away stage'...Just hated

to see Gloria leave, as she was a

> constant and dependable member. Her responses were almost on as a daily

voice..I do not even know what your terms and conditions are anyhow..I figure

when I step over the line I will hear about it..good luck to you, Gloria,

Phyllis, etc. peace out, Dave

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 3:09:30 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> DAVE, ARE YOU IN PUBLIC RELATIONS? YOU'RE DAMN GOOD!

> KUDOS!

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 8:01:41 AM

> Subject: (unknown)

>

>

> Gloria, I was not personally offended about your remark, and realize that is

a common term used in many countries attributed to immigrants that arrive in our

countries, and many others, by any means possible.... In their case often

unsafe, overloaded boats...I do understand how some may be offended...just so

happens most early immigrants arrived in just such a way...apparently some are

offended by the term, as is their right...I have found your entries here to be

very compassionate and caring...is the topic of immigrants related to health

care? Very much so...so it must be the term found non-appropriate, and

hopefully not the effect that immigration has on the health system..my reason

for joining this group is to find a release, a better understanding, etc. from

those suffering with liver disease...much of the release for me involves writing

what is happening with myself, listening to others telling their own

circumstance, and very importantly and

> paramount, comradery ...as one who is often offended easily, and often wrong

in perceived hurts, I must be vigilant in watching for justified and unjustified

wrongs...if I do that, 90 plus % are unjustified. ..peace

> Dave

>

>

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Share on other sites

You rock,Bobby!!

                                       

                                    Love,Jill

 

We don't remember days, we remember moments.

Life is not measured by the breaths we take,but by the moments that take our

breath away.

Subject: Re: (unknown)

To: livercirrhosissupport

Date: Saturday, September 5, 2009, 11:45 PM

 

Dave, there is no user agreement to govern this group. The owner has left it up

to the three of us to moderate as best we can, and we have very very simple

rules which are mostly common sense. Posting links to any products, asking for

donations or other requests for money , which has actually happened, flaming

each other, which happens about twice a year, and discussing politics and other

divisive subjects usually gets a response from a moderator.

If one member offends another, it is usually brought to the attention of the

offender by the offendee, and apologies are exchanged, and that's usually the

end of it, no moderator needed. I hope Gloria does not quit. I hope that trying

to keep some kind of order here does not discourage people to post, but the

reality is that every month there are more and more people who find us on line

looking for support and answers. If this someone decides that things have gotten

too strict, they might want to check out other support groups, and they might

find one more laid back, but I have checked out many, and find almost all of

them to be much much more strict.

My wife joined a support group in 2002 after being diagnosed with Chiari

malformation. She actually joined several, and they all helped shape her course

of treatment. I toyed with the idea of starting my own group because our owner

here , being a sufferer of end stage liver disease herself was unable to tend to

this group when she was very ill, and there was grumbling among the members. One

member actually got fed up with things and started another liver cirrhosis

support group here at Yahoo.

I belonged to both for a while until she disappeared from the web like a puff of

smoke. My blackberry actually notifies me now in my own voice " some one just

posted on the OLD support group " , 24 hours a day. I never changed it. I think

about her when ever I get that notification. I am grateful to have been

nominated to me a moderator here.

This really is the best support group on the web in my opinion. I've tried a

bunch. But it isnt the moderators who make it so special, it's the people who

are the members! It's YOU, Barby, Jan, Abijann, ,Pamela, Lyncia, Penny,

Qoya,Sharon, ( she quit by the way), Tilly,

Phyliss, Jill , Maureen, ,MaC, , Gloria,, ,Debra,

Debbie,, Crazy Girl, Kim, its all of YOU who make this the best support

group. They may have better graphics and features, but we have the PEOPLE.

I dont make too many AA meetings these days because of the cigarette smoke and

the transportation issues, but I feel like this group is the service that we in

AA are encourage to do as a part of a program of sobriety. I know this does keep

me very busy.

Even if I dont post, I read evey singe one, even when I was in the hospital two

summers ago. My black berry is on 24 hours, and often gongs in the middle of the

night with Yahoo chat, and I end up having a conversation with someone I dont

even know until the sun comes up. It is very very interesting, and also very

rewarding. .

I am really glad that most of the people here really do get the idea of what is

appropriate, and what is not and it makes me sad any time someone quits. I was

sad that my friend quit two years ago and started her own group, and then just

disappeared. I am just really glad that we have a good mix here, my other

support groups were dismal. Everyone decompensated, no humor, mean people, you

name it.

As MaC always says, it's all about the love.

love, Bobby

____________ _________ _________ __

From: dave dodds <daveliltoeyahoo (DOT) com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2009 11:51:08 AM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

Phyllis...thank you very much for the reply..I'm not trained in any type of

public speaking, other than the norm, and my primary caregiver, my Great

Grandmother. ..she was almost full Osage Indian, and her last name was

Speaker..I love(d) here as much as she does (did) me..she was supreme at

unconditional love..something I did not find again until I was 28 and had my own

baby..I have always taken great pride and love from my relationship with

her..listening to her stories, indeed just watching her..a small woman with

floor length raven hair...enough of my ramblings; mainly wanted to tell Mac how

difficult being monitor of a group must be..I do not envy your task..I would not

be able to control my ramblings... I'm not trying to suck up to you, because you

are a monitor...for one I'm not sure you are one...my days of sucking up are

over...I am at the 'take me as I am, or stay the **** away stage'...Just hated

to see Gloria leave, as she was a

constant and dependable member. Her responses were almost on as a daily voice..I

do not even know what your terms and conditions are anyhow..I figure when I step

over the line I will hear about it..good luck to you, Gloria, Phyllis, etc.

peace out, Dave

____________ _________ _________ __

From: Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 3:09:30 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

DAVE, ARE YOU IN PUBLIC RELATIONS? YOU'RE DAMN GOOD!

KUDOS!

____________ _________ _________ __

From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 8:01:41 AM

Subject: (unknown)

Gloria, I was not personally offended about your remark, and realize that is a

common term used in many countries attributed to immigrants that arrive in our

countries, and many others, by any means possible.... In their case often

unsafe, overloaded boats...I do understand how some may be offended...just so

happens most early immigrants arrived in just such a way...apparently some are

offended by the term, as is their right...I have found your entries here to be

very compassionate and caring...is the topic of immigrants related to health

care? Very much so...so it must be the term found non-appropriate, and hopefully

not the effect that immigration has on the health system..my reason for joining

this group is to find a release, a better understanding, etc. from those

suffering with liver disease...much of the release for me involves writing what

is happening with myself, listening to others telling their own circumstance,

and very importantly and

paramount, comradery ...as one who is often offended easily, and often wrong in

perceived hurts, I must be vigilant in watching for justified and unjustified

wrongs...if I do that, 90 plus % are unjustified. ..peace

Dave

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You are absolutely right. In fact, the scientists I read on the subject say that

exact thing. We are like the Mayfly. Here for such a short time. Love, Bobby

long life, old age, everything good-Apache prayer

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Monday, September 7, 2009 6:53:42 AM

Subject: Re: Re: (unknown)

Hey Bobby,

There is one thing I found about life. It's like the wind. If you're not

careful, it will blow right by. The one thing I'm glad for and most proud for

is that this anniversary blows right by as if it is just one more day. One day

at a time my friend! I am so proud of you, words can't express.

But!, The sunspot thing is a cycle thing which occurs within the life of the

sun. We've only been studying the Sun for roughly 50 years (with good

technology) and its about a 100 million years old (or more)or so... I wouldn't

jump to any conclusions about what its affect on us is just yet.

In my opinion, I haven't seen a change at all in the weather. Summer is hot,

Winter is cold. Hasn't it always been that way? :-)

Take care,

Love & Peace,

MaC

MaC

--- On Mon, 9/7/09, Bob Aragon

Thanks, Jan. This sure has been the wierdest of years. The sunspots are gone and

there is talk at NASA that they might never come back. It is having a huge

effect on the weather. They are calling this the year without summer. It rained

for two months solid in June and July, and has dried out a bit this month, but

we never did have real Denver summer heat. Just 'fall' like weather all summer.

The tourist season was ruined in New England, or so I have read on the news

wires. I gained 10 lbs and am so hopping mad. There was a problem in July with

the morphine not working, and now it is working again, so I can move about more,

but when it doesnt work, I have to stay ever so still or I get to thinking of

suicide because the liver ache drowns every thing else out. Of course I could

never ever do it, because of my renewed faith, Sharon, and this group. my pain

starts me to break out in a sweat, and cause me to snap at every one. How bad

has

your pain been,

Jan? Love, Bobby

long life, old age, everything good-Apache prayer

____________ _________ _________ __

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I try very hard to keep my sodium below 2000...I initially set my intake at

1000, thinking that way I'd be able to keep it under 2000...as we all know it is

near impossible to stay away from sodium...I was amazed how much we take in once

I started watching my diet...It is very hard, and I'm sure I do go over the 2000

max...

 Dave

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2009 5:35:33 PM

Subject: (unknown)

 

are you being strict with your sodium intake?

>

> I have a question ..I have had ascites for 3 yrs. now and take furosemide and

amiloride for it...my fluid retention has always been ascites,  but the last 5

days or so I have had the normal swelling in my stomach, but am now having a

great deal of swelling in my feet and ankles..have any of you all had this

progression?  Previously I have had very little edema, or none at all...guess

I should see my doc.  Was just wondering if any of you all had this apparent

progression?  Thanks, Dave

>

>

>

>

>

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Dave, I am so sorry.  Dealing with this disease wears so quickly on your nerves

and makes you so sad, so often.  Please know I am praying for you.  Do make that

call to your doctor tomorrow morning, especially since this is your first

experience with the swelling in your extremities.  Terry, my late husband, used

to swell so badly in his feet that he couldn't walk because his feet would

actually be rounded on the bottom and wouldn't flaten out, even when he was

fully weight-bearing.  I cannot say I know what you are going through from my

personal experience, but I do know from having been with Terry as he went

through it.  It is agonizing for you and for those who love you.  Again, I am so

sorry that this has infringed upon your weekend with your daughter and

grandson.  Please update us after you speak with your doctor.  My prayers are

with you.

 

Warm Hugs...........

 

Di

http://auntdisexperimentallife.blogspot.com/

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 11:59:08 AM

Subject: (unknown)

 

I'm sorry I only seem to come here when things are bad, but seems they are

mostly that way now...what has always been a great weekend when my daughter and

grandson come up was full of agony for most of my visit...my legs, feet, and

ankles swelled up so bad I could hardly walk, and my feet hurt very

bad...finally this noon the swelling has mostly gone down..but I wonder for how

long?  I should call my doc tomorrow, but I get weary of doc's...this is a first

in my journey of my feet and ankles swelling like this...I thought the ascites

was bad, but that is more horrific..walking is terrible and just laying with my

feet up to try and make the pain go away...and knowing things will, only

progress into being worse... 

 Dave

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Hety,Dave...I'm sorry to hear you're suffering so much. Cirrohsis really

stinks!  I hope your doctor can give yu some relief tomorrow.

                                       

                                    Love,Jill

 

We don't remember days, we remember moments.

Life is not measured by the breaths we take,but by the moments that take our

breath away.

Subject: Re: (unknown)

To: livercirrhosissupport

Date: Sunday, September 13, 2009, 5:42 PM

 

Dave, I am so sorry.  Dealing with this disease wears so quickly on your nerves

and makes you so sad, so often.  Please know I am praying for you.  Do make that

call to your doctor tomorrow morning, especially since this is your first

experience with the swelling in your extremities.  Terry, my late husband, used

to swell so badly in his feet that he couldn't walk because his feet would

actually be rounded on the bottom and wouldn't flaten out, even when he was

fully weight-bearing.  I cannot say I know what you are going through from my

personal experience, but I do know from having been with Terry as he went

through it.  It is agonizing for you and for those who love you.  Again, I am so

sorry that this has infringed upon your weekend with your daughter and

grandson.  Please update us after you speak with your doctor.  My prayers are

with you.

 

Warm Hugs........ ...

 

Di

http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

____________ _________ _________ __

From: dave dodds <daveliltoeyahoo (DOT) com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 11:59:08 AM

Subject: (unknown)

 

I'm sorry I only seem to come here when things are bad, but seems they are

mostly that way now...what has always been a great weekend when my daughter and

grandson come up was full of agony for most of my visit...my legs, feet, and

ankles swelled up so bad I could hardly walk, and my feet hurt very

bad...finally this noon the swelling has mostly gone down..but I wonder for how

long?  I should call my doc tomorrow, but I get weary of doc's...this is a first

in my journey of my feet and ankles swelling like this...I thought the ascites

was bad, but that is more horrific..walking is terrible and just laying with my

feet up to try and make the pain go away...and knowing things will, only

progress into being worse... 

 Dave

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Thank you Jill; thank you for understanding.  So many 'friends' have been so

eager to 'set me up' so I can 'go on with my life'.  I recently told my sisters

if one more well-meaning 'friend' offered to 'set me up' with someone, I was

going to just have a hissy fit!  Shoot, the LAST thing on my mind at ths

juncture is another man or another relationship!

 

Warm Hugs...........

 

Di

http://auntdisexperimentallife.blogspot.com/

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 6:03:44 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

One step at a time, dear Diane.  Only you can know when that time is right, if

ever. 

                                       

                                    Love,Jill

 

We don't remember days, we remember moments.

Life is not measured by the breaths we take,but by the moments that take our

breath away.

From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

Subject: Re: (unknown)

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Date: Sunday, September 13, 2009, 7:57 PM

 

Diane, thanks for the moral support, and for praying for me.  I guess you could

say, Lord knows I need it.  What you were saying about my grandson is very

true.  His Grandmother, my X, is very sick also.  He could easily lose out on

knowing either of us well.  He just turned two.  My circumstances are so much

better than some that it annoys me I get on so much self-pity.  I could, when

time comes, look into hospice.  I think hospice is for the last 6 months.  I may

be wrong, though.  I don't know how far away I am from needing a transplant

yet.  Several doc's gave me 5 yrs. a little less than 4 yrs. ago.  My liver doc

would not give me a length, saying he does nor forecast the future.  I

appreciated him for that answer, and the others for their honesty.  As they say

be careful what you ask.  I kind of wish now, when I asked, the other's would

not have told me.  I am sure they were going by percentage's giving my

symptoms.  If they

were correct I am about 16 months away.  As I have often thought, since their

prediction, very few really know how long they have or how they will go.   Dave

____________ _________ _________ __

From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:23:35 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Dave, you have in no way offended me.  To say that have faith, without

question, is certainly far from reality.  I have come to a place in my life

where I rarely allow myself to question God; that has not always been so...  I

struggled with my faith for many, many years through some terribly difficult

circumstances.  I hope I won't offend you by saying I will pray for you and ask

you not to give up on God.  He hasn't given up on you. 

That being said, I do honestly care about you and about what you are going

through.  Cirrhosis is hard, just plain HARD.  Every day is a journey into the

unknown and leads us down paths we never dreamed we would have to walk. 

Uncertainly and depression are familiar friends.  I do so hope your doctor can

help you with the edema.  BTW, I just wanted to add that you should give serious

consideration to that transplant.  Whether you do it or not, give it every

chance when deciding.  You have a beautiful grandson who would so desperately

miss his Grandpa, and I'd be willing to bet your daughter would sure miss you

too!  Sometimes, bad things happen to good people so they can reacess their

lives and make fresh starts. 

I'm praying for you Dave!

 

Warm Hugs........ ...

 

Di

http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

____________ _________ _________ __

From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:13:15 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Diane, this is one of my biggest problems.  I do not have a strong belief in the

here after, religion, etc.  I do not want to offend those that do.  I wish I

did, but I don't.  I see how much it helps people, but I have not been able to

grasp the concept.  I come from a family that both parents were strong believers

and they took me to church regularly.  I don't know why I have had such a hard

time with faith.  I am not of the belief that the world happened in a vacuum. 

There is a degree of spirituality in me.  I'm sure you don't want me to go into

the usual talk of why bad things happen to good people and good things happen to

bad people...  I just am unable to square the suffering people endure with the

idea of God having his hand on the throttle, so to speak.  I hope I have not

offended you or anyone.  I admire your ability to believe without question.  I

know there is a force of good in the universe, and certainly a evil in the

universe.  I know it would help me if I had your faith, but it avoids me or I

avoid it.  Whichever way it is, the outcome for me is the same, lack of faith

for which I, in the end, pay the price.     

 Dave

____________ _________ _________ __

From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:28:49 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Hi Dave,

No, Terry opted not to try for a transplant.  He had been at death's door a

couple of times prior to even knowing about his liver disease.  He felt much

more peaceful about death than dealing with life after a transplant.  Also, he

had a genetic disorder that predisposed him to liver disease.  He thought it

would be selfish of him to ask for a donor liver, knowing his body would begin

attacking it as soon as it was transplanted, when so few are available.  It was

so hard to sit by and watch him make that decision, but I had watched Momma die

of renal failure and had seen all she had gone through with the dialysis and

didn't want to emotionally force anything on Terry that he wasn't ready to deal

with.  I told him I would support him fully in whatever decision he made; if he

chose to go for the transplant, I would be there every step of the way but if

not, I would also help him live his life to the fullest until the time came for

him to go home

with the Lord.  As hard as it was to give him up, I did so knowing I had done

for him what his heart desired and loved him completely until Jesus came for

him.

Now that I have cirrhosis as well, I am much in the same boat as you.  Terry and

I had three children who never made it to this world.  I have two sisters and a

niece and four nephews who love me dearly.  However, I am not comfortable asking

them to take on the role of my caregiver as this disease progresses.  I know how

hard that is on the loved one and I don't want them to have to go through that. 

I have already started checking in to in-patient hospice care for when that time

comes.  Whether I will consider a transplant or not is something I haven't

really even thought about yet.  I pray about it and just ask the Lord to help me

make the right decision when the time comes.

Whatever decision you make, please know that I am praying for you.  I do not

look forward to dealing with this disease, but I also don't allow myself to

worry about it.  I simply leave it with the Lord and know He already has a plan

and all I have to do is submit myself to His will and plan for my life.  My

faith carries me through this, just as it has through so many other areas of my

life.

 

Warm Hugs........ ...

 

Di

http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

____________ _________ _________ __

From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:05:45 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Thanks for writing back Diane..And I am sorry you had to go through this with

your husband...I know from dealing with close friends and family how difficult a

progressive fatal disease is on the caregiver and others close..if I may ask,

did your husband have a transplant?  I am wrestling with that decision when it

comes, and whether to put myself and family through that.  I don't really have

someone I can move in with during the recovery process, and would not put that

burden on my daughter and her significant other.  For one there is not room in

her house, except a finished basement, and I don't see how someone could

negotiate the stairs in that condition.  For another reason her relationship is

fragile I believe, and that would certainly not help, and though we are civil,

we really don't care a lot for each other.  I know some go into medical centers

to recuperate and I'm fine with that option, since likely the progression either

way will put

me into one, but I still have a lot of soul searching to do about a

transplant.     Dave

____________ _________ _________ __

From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 4:42:49 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Dave, I am so sorry.  Dealing with this disease wears so quickly on your nerves

and makes you so sad, so often.  Please know I am praying for you.  Do make that

call to your doctor tomorrow morning, especially since this is your first

experience with the swelling in your extremities.  Terry, my late husband, used

to swell so badly in his feet that he couldn't walk because his feet would

actually be rounded on the bottom and wouldn't flaten out, even when he was

fully weight-bearing.  I cannot say I know what you are going through from my

personal experience, but I do know from having been with Terry as he went

through it.  It is agonizing for you and for those who love you.  Again, I am so

sorry that this has infringed upon your weekend with your daughter and

grandson.  Please update us after you speak with your doctor.  My prayers are

with you.

 

Warm Hugs........ ...

 

Di

http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

____________ _________ _________ __

From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 11:59:08 AM

Subject: (unknown)

 

I'm sorry I only seem to come here when things are bad, but seems they are

mostly that way now...what has always been a great weekend when my daughter and

grandson come up was full of agony for most of my visit...my legs, feet, and

ankles swelled up so bad I could hardly walk, and my feet hurt very

bad...finally this noon the swelling has mostly gone down..but I wonder for how

long?  I should call my doc tomorrow, but I get weary of doc's...this is a first

in my journey of my feet and ankles swelling like this...I thought the ascites

was bad, but that is more horrific..walking is terrible and just laying with my

feet up to try and make the pain go away...and knowing things will, only

progress into being worse... 

 Dave

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thx-I was just feeling sorry for myself-  we do have a good time together, even

with the things that are ahppening.  I did get a call back from the Dr office,

they instructed us to go for labwrk.  I rec'd a call abck aft they rec'd resilts

and he feels that increasing lactulose to 2-3 times a day will help eliminate

most of the problems he is having in a few days..  Continue with the

infusions.uggggggggggggh! didn't want to hear that!  I told him thta they will

hear from me agin on Thursday if nothing has changed!

Oh, and by the way, he is my husband, not my Dad, tho sometimes he acts like a

Dad.haha

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 2:22:11 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Phyllis - I understand, you are having a hard time. It never stops. You do

start wondering what next. When I left the nursing home they sent me to

after my CABG a year ago last April, I jokingly said " I wonder what is

going to happen next year. Some people got mad at me for saying it as if I

could actually cause something to happen by joking about it.

I don't even count the for me routine angioplasty and stent procedures.

But it seems that every winter/spring, some major medical problem happened.

The year before it had been pancreatitis ending in gall bladder surgery.

This year at least I didn't have to go into the hospital, except for two

angioplasties. But I did find out that my kidneys were in trouble. From

what you said, for you it is a daily problem.

I couldn't do what you caretakers do, I admire you all immensely. Every

time something happens, I am sure it is a disappointment. But, can you get

to a point where you no longer expect things to be good, no problems for a

day. For me, it isn't such a shock or disappointmnet when something new

happens because I don't expect for my body to miraculously heal itself.

Although, there are a lot of people who are praying for that very thing for

me. I hope you have some help with your dad, and that you can get out and

do something other taking care of him. And if you do, don't feel guilty for

having fun when he is so ill. And, I hope you will be able to find some

times when you can have a good time with your dad, regardless of how short

it may be. Those are the times to hold on to. Jan H

On Mon, Sep 14, 2009 at 2:52 PM, Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com>wrote:

> Thx Jan

> I try to not let it occupy our lives but it is there, every day, reminding

> us of our limitations.

> My husband is currently on a 12 hr home infusion of deferoxamine( remove

> excess iron) which I have to administer every other day. This is his sixth

> treatment and every day we encounter new issues, an infection on one of the

> injection sites. confusion, vision problems,vomiting, sleeps constanly,

> can't eat (tho his stomach is growling) etc, etc....One day he took

> medication and didn't know what he took, he came into the room with white

> powder residue on his mouth, I had to induce vomiting. I am awaiting a call

> back from Dr's office,we are not going to continue on ths course of

> treatment, he is worst instead of better. When he doesn't take the

> treatment he is back to normal eating, coherent, playing with dog, normal BP

> etc..

> He flooded bathroom yesterday, as he didn't know how to turn off faucet.

> Trying times, the mind is scrambled, unable to turn off this madness.

> Phyllis

>

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

>

> From: Jan Holman <janholmangmail (DOT) com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 11:40:31 AM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

> Phylllis - I know you asked the question of Diane, but I feel much the same

> way. Of course, I never forget that I have it, but it isn't the topmost

> thing on my mind. Some of the side effects are on my mind every day, the

> lack of energy, having to ration it to do what I want to do including

> reading all these emails and the emails from other sources. But, I think

> it is the acceptance of my medical problems, finding new ways of doing

> things that don't require so much energy, spacing activities, staying as

> active as possible. And my faith makes it so much easier to not become

> cirrhosis, cad, pad, kidney disease, peripheral neuropathy, hypothyroid

> disease, I haven't even bothered to find out what effects hasimotos disease

> has on me. I am not my medical problems. I am a child of God with a job to

> do here on earth. The most troublesome problem on a daily basis, and

> comparitively rather minor, is osteo arthritis. It keeps reminding you with

> pain. But when you know God is with you, that is so much more important

> than how you might leave this world, or what will happen to you while you

> are here. Now when I had an abcessed tooth that really flared up after my

> last angioplasty, hurt from the top of my head down the side of my neck,

> that was hard to keep out of my mind,[?] but I still continued to do as

> much

> as possible. Jan H

>

> On Mon, Sep 14, 2009 at 11:53 AM, Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com

> >wrote:

>

> > wow, you don't let cirrhosis occupy your mind much? Tell me how to

> > accomplish that?

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 10:10:30 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Yes, Dave, Hospice care is for the end-of-life and is something you

> > shouldn't consider until you have made your decision regarding

> > transplant. Give it much thought and consideration, both for yourself and

> > your grandson.

> >

> > None of us knows the number of our days. We walk about every day living

> > like we think we will live forever; but the truth is that any of us could

> go

> > within the next minute. I don't allow the thought that I have cirrhosis

> to

> > occupy too much of my time. I live my life and try my best to take care

> of

> > myself. When my time comes, it comes; end of story. I'm not a fatalist,

> > just a realist.

> >

> > I am always here if you need a friend or an ear to listen. I can't hide

> my

> > faith, but I won't shove it down your throat either. Good luck with the

> > call to your doctor tomorrow!

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:57:15 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Diane, thanks for the moral support, and for praying for me. I guess you

> > could say, Lord knows I need it. What you were saying about my grandson

> is

> > very true. His Grandmother, my X, is very sick also. He could easily lose

> > out on knowing either of us well. He just turned two. My circumstances

> are

> > so much better than some that it annoys me I get on so much self-pity. I

> > could, when time comes, look into hospice. I think hospice is for the

> last

> > 6 months. I may be wrong, though. I don't know how far away I am from

> > needing a transplant yet. Several doc's gave me 5 yrs. a little less than

> 4

> > yrs. ago. My liver doc would not give me a length, saying he does nor

> > forecast the future. I appreciated him for that answer, and the others

> for

> > their honesty. As they say be careful what you ask. I kind of wish now,

> > when I asked, the other's would not have told me. I am sure they were

> going

> > by percentage's giving my symptoms. If they

> > were correct I am about 16 months away. As I have often thought, since

> > their prediction, very few really know how long they have or how they

> will

> > go. Dave

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:23:35 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Dave, you have in no way offended me. To say that have faith, without

> > question, is certainly far from reality. I have come to a place in my

> life

> > where I rarely allow myself to question God; that has not always been so.

> I

> > struggled with my faith for many, many years through some terribly

> difficult

> > circumstances. I hope I won't offend you by saying I will pray for you

> and

> > ask you not to give up on God. He hasn't given up on you.

> >

> > That being said, I do honestly care about you and about what you are

> going

> > through. Cirrhosis is hard, just plain HARD. Every day is a journey into

> > the unknown and leads us down paths we never dreamed we would have to

> walk.

> > Uncertainly and depression are familiar friends. I do so hope your doctor

> > can help you with the edema. BTW, I just wanted to add that you should

> give

> > serious consideration to that transplant. Whether you do it or not, give

> it

> > every chance when deciding. You have a beautiful grandson who would so

> > desperately miss his Grandpa, and I'd be willing to bet your daughter

> would

> > sure miss you too! Sometimes, bad things happen to good people so they

> can

> > reacess their lives and make fresh starts.

> >

> > I'm praying for you Dave!

> >

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:13:15 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Diane, this is one of my biggest problems. I do not have a strong belief

> > in the here after, religion, etc. I do not want to offend those that do.

> I

> > wish I did, but I don't. I see how much it helps people, but I have not

> > been able to grasp the concept. I come from a family that both parents

> were

> > strong believers and they took me to church regularly. I don't know why I

> > have had such a hard time with faith. I am not of the belief that the

> world

> > happened in a vacuum. There is a degree of spirituality in me. I'm sure

> > you don't want me to go into the usual talk of why bad things happen to

> good

> > people and good things happen to bad people. I just am unable to square

> the

> > suffering people endure with the idea of God having his hand on the

> > throttle, so to speak. I hope I have not offended you or anyone. I admire

> > your ability to believe without question. I know there is a force of good

> > in the universe, and certainly a evil in the

> > universe. I know it would help me if I had your faith, but it avoids me

> or

> > I avoid it. Whichever way it is, the outcome for me is the same, lack of

> > faith for which I, in the end, pay the price.

> > Dave

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:28:49 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Hi Dave,

> >

> > No, Terry opted not to try for a transplant. He had been at death's door

> a

> > couple of times prior to even knowing about his liver disease. He felt

> much

> > more peaceful about death than dealing with life after a transplant.

> Also,

> > he had a genetic disorder that predisposed him to liver disease. He

> thought

> > it would be selfish of him to ask for a donor liver, knowing his body

> would

> > begin attacking it as soon as it was transplanted, when so few are

> > available. It was so hard to sit by and watch him make that decision, but

> I

> > had watched Momma die of renal failure and had seen all she had gone

> through

> > with the dialysis and didn't want to emotionally force anything on Terry

> > that he wasn't ready to deal with. I told him I would support him fully

> in

> > whatever decision he made; if he chose to go for the transplant, I would

> be

> > there every step of the way but if not, I would also help him live his

> life

> > to the fullest until the time came for him to go home

> > with the Lord. As hard as it was to give him up, I did so knowing I had

> > done for him what his heart desired and loved him completely until Jesus

> > came for him.

> >

> > Now that I have cirrhosis as well, I am much in the same boat as

> > you. Terry and I had three children who never made it to this world. I

> > have two sisters and a niece and four nephews who love me dearly.

> However,

> > I am not comfortable asking them to take on the role of my caregiver as

> this

> > disease progresses. I know how hard that is on the loved one and I don't

> > want them to have to go through that. I have already started checking in

> to

> > in-patient hospice care for when that time comes. Whether I will consider

> a

> > transplant or not is something I haven't really even thought about yet. I

> > pray about it and just ask the Lord to help me make the right decision

> when

> > the time comes.

> >

> > Whatever decision you make, please know that I am praying for you. I do

> > not look forward to dealing with this disease, but I also don't allow

> myself

> > to worry about it. I simply leave it with the Lord and know He already

> has

> > a plan and all I have to do is submit myself to His will and plan for my

> > life. My faith carries me through this, just as it has through so many

> > other areas of my life.

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:05:45 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Thanks for writing back Diane..And I am sorry you had to go through this

> > with your husband...I know from dealing with close friends and family how

> > difficult a progressive fatal disease is on the caregiver and others

> > close..if I may ask, did your husband have a transplant? I am wrestling

> > with that decision when it comes, and whether to put myself and family

> > through that. I don't really have someone I can move in with during the

> > recovery process, and would not put that burden on my daughter and her

> > significant other. For one there is not room in her house, except a

> > finished basement, and I don't see how someone could negotiate the stairs

> in

> > that condition. For another reason her relationship is fragile I believe,

> > and that would certainly not help, and though we are civil, we really

> don't

> > care a lot for each other. I know some go into medical centers to

> > recuperate and I'm fine with that option, since likely the progression

> > either way will put

> > me into one, but I still have a lot of soul searching to do about a

> > transplant. Dave

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 4:42:49 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Dave, I am so sorry. Dealing with this disease wears so quickly on your

> > nerves and makes you so sad, so often. Please know I am praying for you.

> > Do make that call to your doctor tomorrow morning, especially since this

> is

> > your first experience with the swelling in your extremities. Terry, my

> late

> > husband, used to swell so badly in his feet that he couldn't walk because

> > his feet would actually be rounded on the bottom and wouldn't flaten out,

> > even when he was fully weight-bearing. I cannot say I know what you are

> > going through from my personal experience, but I do know from having been

> > with Terry as he went through it. It is agonizing for you and for those

> who

> > love you. Again, I am so sorry that this has infringed upon your weekend

> > with your daughter and grandson. Please update us after you speak with

> your

> > doctor. My prayers are with you.

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 11:59:08 AM

> > Subject: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > I'm sorry I only seem to come here when things are bad, but seems they

> are

> > mostly that way now...what has always been a great weekend when my

> daughter

> > and grandson come up was full of agony for most of my visit...my legs,

> feet,

> > and ankles swelled up so bad I could hardly walk, and my feet hurt very

> > bad...finally this noon the swelling has mostly gone down..but I wonder

> for

> > how long? I should call my doc tomorrow, but I get weary of doc's...this

> is

> > a first in my journey of my feet and ankles swelling like this...I

> thought

> > the ascites was bad, but that is more horrific..walking is terrible and

> just

> > laying with my feet up to try and make the pain go away...and knowing

> things

> > will, only progress into being worse...

> > Dave

> >

> >

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Phil & I thank you.

Yes, one day at a time.

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 2:35:19 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Terry never had to deal with excess iron, so never dealt with these treatments. 

I know this does put an entirely new face on dealing with the disease.  The

other things you mentioned, we did deal with on a progressively worse basis as

time went by.  We just dealt with whatever was happening at the moment and then

moved on until the next hurdle presented itself.  I am praying for you and Ed. 

I know it is hard and the days and nights are long.

 

Warm Hugs........ ...

 

Di

http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

____________ _________ _________ __

From: Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 4:52:38 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Thx Jan

I try to not let it occupy our lives but it is there, every day, reminding us of

our limitations.

My husband is currently on a 12 hr home infusion of deferoxamine( remove excess

iron) which I have to administer every other day.  This is his sixth treatment

and every day we encounter new issues, an infection on one of the injection

sites. confusion, vision problems,vomiting, sleeps constanly, can't eat (tho his

stomach is growling) etc, etc....One day he took medication and didn't know what

he took, he came into the room with white powder residue on his mouth, I had to

induce vomiting.  I am awaiting a call back from Dr's office,we are not going to

continue on ths course of treatment, he is worst instead of better.  When he

doesn't take the treatment he is back to normal eating, coherent, playing with

dog, normal BP etc..

He flooded bathroom yesterday, as he didn't know how to turn off faucet. Trying

times, the mind is scrambled, unable to turn off this madness. 

Phyllis

 

____________ _________ _________ __

From: Jan Holman <janholmangmail (DOT) com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 11:40:31 AM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

Phylllis - I know you asked the question of Diane, but I feel much the same

way. Of course, I never forget that I have it, but it isn't the topmost

thing on my mind. Some of the side effects are on my mind every day, the

lack of energy, having to ration it to do what I want to do including

reading all these emails and the emails from other sources. But, I think

it is the acceptance of my medical problems, finding new ways of doing

things that don't require so much energy, spacing activities, staying as

active as possible. And my faith makes it so much easier to not become

cirrhosis, cad, pad, kidney disease, peripheral neuropathy, hypothyroid

disease, I haven't even bothered to find out what effects hasimotos disease

has on me. I am not my medical problems. I am a child of God with a job to

do here on earth. The most troublesome problem on a daily basis, and

comparitively rather minor, is osteo arthritis. It keeps reminding you with

pain. But when you know God is with you, that is so much more important

than how you might leave this world, or what will happen to you while you

are here. Now when I had an abcessed tooth that really flared up after my

last angioplasty, hurt from the top of my head down the side of my neck,

that was hard to keep out of my mind,[?] but I still continued to do as much

as possible. Jan H

On Mon, Sep 14, 2009 at 11:53 AM, Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com>wrote:

> wow, you don't let cirrhosis occupy your mind much? Tell me how to

> accomplish that?

>

>

>

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 10:10:30 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Yes, Dave, Hospice care is for the end-of-life and is something you

> shouldn't consider until you have made your decision regarding

> transplant. Give it much thought and consideration, both for yourself and

> your grandson.

>

> None of us knows the number of our days. We walk about every day living

> like we think we will live forever; but the truth is that any of us could go

> within the next minute. I don't allow the thought that I have cirrhosis to

> occupy too much of my time. I live my life and try my best to take care of

> myself. When my time comes, it comes; end of story. I'm not a fatalist,

> just a realist.

>

> I am always here if you need a friend or an ear to listen. I can't hide my

> faith, but I won't shove it down your throat either. Good luck with the

> call to your doctor tomorrow!

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:57:15 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Diane, thanks for the moral support, and for praying for me. I guess you

> could say, Lord knows I need it. What you were saying about my grandson is

> very true. His Grandmother, my X, is very sick also. He could easily lose

> out on knowing either of us well. He just turned two. My circumstances are

> so much better than some that it annoys me I get on so much self-pity. I

> could, when time comes, look into hospice. I think hospice is for the last

> 6 months. I may be wrong, though. I don't know how far away I am from

> needing a transplant yet. Several doc's gave me 5 yrs. a little less than 4

> yrs. ago. My liver doc would not give me a length, saying he does nor

> forecast the future. I appreciated him for that answer, and the others for

> their honesty. As they say be careful what you ask. I kind of wish now,

> when I asked, the other's would not have told me. I am sure they were going

> by percentage's giving my symptoms. If they

> were correct I am about 16 months away. As I have often thought, since

> their prediction, very few really know how long they have or how they will

> go. Dave

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:23:35 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Dave, you have in no way offended me. To say that have faith, without

> question, is certainly far from reality. I have come to a place in my life

> where I rarely allow myself to question God; that has not always been so. I

> struggled with my faith for many, many years through some terribly difficult

> circumstances. I hope I won't offend you by saying I will pray for you and

> ask you not to give up on God. He hasn't given up on you.

>

> That being said, I do honestly care about you and about what you are going

> through. Cirrhosis is hard, just plain HARD. Every day is a journey into

> the unknown and leads us down paths we never dreamed we would have to walk.

> Uncertainly and depression are familiar friends. I do so hope your doctor

> can help you with the edema. BTW, I just wanted to add that you should give

> serious consideration to that transplant. Whether you do it or not, give it

> every chance when deciding. You have a beautiful grandson who would so

> desperately miss his Grandpa, and I'd be willing to bet your daughter would

> sure miss you too! Sometimes, bad things happen to good people so they can

> reacess their lives and make fresh starts.

>

> I'm praying for you Dave!

>

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:13:15 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Diane, this is one of my biggest problems. I do not have a strong belief

> in the here after, religion, etc. I do not want to offend those that do. I

> wish I did, but I don't. I see how much it helps people, but I have not

> been able to grasp the concept. I come from a family that both parents were

> strong believers and they took me to church regularly. I don't know why I

> have had such a hard time with faith. I am not of the belief that the world

> happened in a vacuum. There is a degree of spirituality in me. I'm sure

> you don't want me to go into the usual talk of why bad things happen to good

> people and good things happen to bad people. I just am unable to square the

> suffering people endure with the idea of God having his hand on the

> throttle, so to speak. I hope I have not offended you or anyone. I admire

> your ability to believe without question. I know there is a force of good

> in the universe, and certainly a evil in the

> universe. I know it would help me if I had your faith, but it avoids me or

> I avoid it. Whichever way it is, the outcome for me is the same, lack of

> faith for which I, in the end, pay the price.

> Dave

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:28:49 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Hi Dave,

>

> No, Terry opted not to try for a transplant. He had been at death's door a

> couple of times prior to even knowing about his liver disease. He felt much

> more peaceful about death than dealing with life after a transplant. Also,

> he had a genetic disorder that predisposed him to liver disease. He thought

> it would be selfish of him to ask for a donor liver, knowing his body would

> begin attacking it as soon as it was transplanted, when so few are

> available. It was so hard to sit by and watch him make that decision, but I

> had watched Momma die of renal failure and had seen all she had gone through

> with the dialysis and didn't want to emotionally force anything on Terry

> that he wasn't ready to deal with. I told him I would support him fully in

> whatever decision he made; if he chose to go for the transplant, I would be

> there every step of the way but if not, I would also help him live his life

> to the fullest until the time came for him to go home

> with the Lord. As hard as it was to give him up, I did so knowing I had

> done for him what his heart desired and loved him completely until Jesus

> came for him.

>

> Now that I have cirrhosis as well, I am much in the same boat as

> you. Terry and I had three children who never made it to this world. I

> have two sisters and a niece and four nephews who love me dearly. However,

> I am not comfortable asking them to take on the role of my caregiver as this

> disease progresses. I know how hard that is on the loved one and I don't

> want them to have to go through that. I have already started checking in to

> in-patient hospice care for when that time comes. Whether I will consider a

> transplant or not is something I haven't really even thought about yet. I

> pray about it and just ask the Lord to help me make the right decision when

> the time comes.

>

> Whatever decision you make, please know that I am praying for you. I do

> not look forward to dealing with this disease, but I also don't allow myself

> to worry about it. I simply leave it with the Lord and know He already has

> a plan and all I have to do is submit myself to His will and plan for my

> life. My faith carries me through this, just as it has through so many

> other areas of my life.

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:05:45 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Thanks for writing back Diane..And I am sorry you had to go through this

> with your husband...I know from dealing with close friends and family how

> difficult a progressive fatal disease is on the caregiver and others

> close..if I may ask, did your husband have a transplant? I am wrestling

> with that decision when it comes, and whether to put myself and family

> through that. I don't really have someone I can move in with during the

> recovery process, and would not put that burden on my daughter and her

> significant other. For one there is not room in her house, except a

> finished basement, and I don't see how someone could negotiate the stairs in

> that condition. For another reason her relationship is fragile I believe,

> and that would certainly not help, and though we are civil, we really don't

> care a lot for each other. I know some go into medical centers to

> recuperate and I'm fine with that option, since likely the progression

> either way will put

> me into one, but I still have a lot of soul searching to do about a

> transplant. Dave

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 4:42:49 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Dave, I am so sorry. Dealing with this disease wears so quickly on your

> nerves and makes you so sad, so often. Please know I am praying for you.

> Do make that call to your doctor tomorrow morning, especially since this is

> your first experience with the swelling in your extremities. Terry, my late

> husband, used to swell so badly in his feet that he couldn't walk because

> his feet would actually be rounded on the bottom and wouldn't flaten out,

> even when he was fully weight-bearing. I cannot say I know what you are

> going through from my personal experience, but I do know from having been

> with Terry as he went through it. It is agonizing for you and for those who

> love you. Again, I am so sorry that this has infringed upon your weekend

> with your daughter and grandson. Please update us after you speak with your

> doctor. My prayers are with you.

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 11:59:08 AM

> Subject: (unknown)

>

>

> I'm sorry I only seem to come here when things are bad, but seems they are

> mostly that way now...what has always been a great weekend when my daughter

> and grandson come up was full of agony for most of my visit...my legs, feet,

> and ankles swelled up so bad I could hardly walk, and my feet hurt very

> bad...finally this noon the swelling has mostly gone down..but I wonder for

> how long? I should call my doc tomorrow, but I get weary of doc's...this is

> a first in my journey of my feet and ankles swelling like this...I thought

> the ascites was bad, but that is more horrific..walking is terrible and just

> laying with my feet up to try and make the pain go away...and knowing things

> will, only progress into being worse...

> Dave

>

>

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Phyllis, I am praying the increased lactulose will help clear things up a bit. 

And, as for the feeling sorry for youself, it's okay.  Caregiving is HARD WORK

and it takes a lot out of you.  Having a little pity party now and again is good

for the soul!  I know you don't live there and are working very hard to deal

with a monster in your lives.  Good for you for hanging tough with those

doctors; they need it sometimes!!!  Oh, and btw, husbands OFTEN act like

Daddies, in my experience!!!!  ;)  I'm praying for you guys!!!

 

Warm Hugs...........

 

Di

http://auntdisexperimentallife.blogspot.com/

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 7:00:06 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

thx-I was just feeling sorry for myself-  we do have a good time together, even

with the things that are ahppening.  I did get a call back from the Dr office,

they instructed us to go for labwrk.  I rec'd a call abck aft they rec'd resilts

and he feels that increasing lactulose to 2-3 times a day will help eliminate

most of the problems he is having in a few days..  Continue with the

infusions.ugggggggg ggggh! didn't want to hear that!  I told him thta they will

hear from me agin on Thursday if nothing has changed!

Oh, and by the way, he is my husband, not my Dad, tho sometimes he acts like a

Dad.haha

____________ _________ _________ __

From: Jan Holman <janholmangmail (DOT) com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 2:22:11 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Phyllis - I understand, you are having a hard time. It never stops. You do

start wondering what next. When I left the nursing home they sent me to

after my CABG a year ago last April, I jokingly said " I wonder what is

going to happen next year. Some people got mad at me for saying it as if I

could actually cause something to happen by joking about it.

I don't even count the for me routine angioplasty and stent procedures.

But it seems that every winter/spring, some major medical problem happened.

The year before it had been pancreatitis ending in gall bladder surgery.

This year at least I didn't have to go into the hospital, except for two

angioplasties. But I did find out that my kidneys were in trouble. From

what you said, for you it is a daily problem.

I couldn't do what you caretakers do, I admire you all immensely. Every

time something happens, I am sure it is a disappointment. But, can you get

to a point where you no longer expect things to be good, no problems for a

day. For me, it isn't such a shock or disappointmnet when something new

happens because I don't expect for my body to miraculously heal itself.

Although, there are a lot of people who are praying for that very thing for

me. I hope you have some help with your dad, and that you can get out and

do something other taking care of him. And if you do, don't feel guilty for

having fun when he is so ill. And, I hope you will be able to find some

times when you can have a good time with your dad, regardless of how short

it may be. Those are the times to hold on to. Jan H

On Mon, Sep 14, 2009 at 2:52 PM, Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com>wrote:

> Thx Jan

> I try to not let it occupy our lives but it is there, every day, reminding

> us of our limitations.

> My husband is currently on a 12 hr home infusion of deferoxamine( remove

> excess iron) which I have to administer every other day. This is his sixth

> treatment and every day we encounter new issues, an infection on one of the

> injection sites. confusion, vision problems,vomiting, sleeps constanly,

> can't eat (tho his stomach is growling) etc, etc....One day he took

> medication and didn't know what he took, he came into the room with white

> powder residue on his mouth, I had to induce vomiting. I am awaiting a call

> back from Dr's office,we are not going to continue on ths course of

> treatment, he is worst instead of better. When he doesn't take the

> treatment he is back to normal eating, coherent, playing with dog, normal BP

> etc..

> He flooded bathroom yesterday, as he didn't know how to turn off faucet.

> Trying times, the mind is scrambled, unable to turn off this madness.

> Phyllis

>

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

>

> From: Jan Holman <janholmangmail (DOT) com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 11:40:31 AM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

> Phylllis - I know you asked the question of Diane, but I feel much the same

> way. Of course, I never forget that I have it, but it isn't the topmost

> thing on my mind. Some of the side effects are on my mind every day, the

> lack of energy, having to ration it to do what I want to do including

> reading all these emails and the emails from other sources. But, I think

> it is the acceptance of my medical problems, finding new ways of doing

> things that don't require so much energy, spacing activities, staying as

> active as possible. And my faith makes it so much easier to not become

> cirrhosis, cad, pad, kidney disease, peripheral neuropathy, hypothyroid

> disease, I haven't even bothered to find out what effects hasimotos disease

> has on me. I am not my medical problems. I am a child of God with a job to

> do here on earth. The most troublesome problem on a daily basis, and

> comparitively rather minor, is osteo arthritis. It keeps reminding you with

> pain. But when you know God is with you, that is so much more important

> than how you might leave this world, or what will happen to you while you

> are here. Now when I had an abcessed tooth that really flared up after my

> last angioplasty, hurt from the top of my head down the side of my neck,

> that was hard to keep out of my mind,[?] but I still continued to do as

> much

> as possible. Jan H

>

> On Mon, Sep 14, 2009 at 11:53 AM, Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com

> >wrote:

>

> > wow, you don't let cirrhosis occupy your mind much? Tell me how to

> > accomplish that?

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 10:10:30 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Yes, Dave, Hospice care is for the end-of-life and is something you

> > shouldn't consider until you have made your decision regarding

> > transplant. Give it much thought and consideration, both for yourself and

> > your grandson.

> >

> > None of us knows the number of our days. We walk about every day living

> > like we think we will live forever; but the truth is that any of us could

> go

> > within the next minute. I don't allow the thought that I have cirrhosis

> to

> > occupy too much of my time. I live my life and try my best to take care

> of

> > myself. When my time comes, it comes; end of story. I'm not a fatalist,

> > just a realist.

> >

> > I am always here if you need a friend or an ear to listen. I can't hide

> my

> > faith, but I won't shove it down your throat either. Good luck with the

> > call to your doctor tomorrow!

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:57:15 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Diane, thanks for the moral support, and for praying for me. I guess you

> > could say, Lord knows I need it. What you were saying about my grandson

> is

> > very true. His Grandmother, my X, is very sick also. He could easily lose

> > out on knowing either of us well. He just turned two. My circumstances

> are

> > so much better than some that it annoys me I get on so much self-pity. I

> > could, when time comes, look into hospice. I think hospice is for the

> last

> > 6 months. I may be wrong, though. I don't know how far away I am from

> > needing a transplant yet. Several doc's gave me 5 yrs. a little less than

> 4

> > yrs. ago. My liver doc would not give me a length, saying he does nor

> > forecast the future. I appreciated him for that answer, and the others

> for

> > their honesty. As they say be careful what you ask. I kind of wish now,

> > when I asked, the other's would not have told me. I am sure they were

> going

> > by percentage's giving my symptoms. If they

> > were correct I am about 16 months away. As I have often thought, since

> > their prediction, very few really know how long they have or how they

> will

> > go. Dave

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:23:35 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Dave, you have in no way offended me. To say that have faith, without

> > question, is certainly far from reality. I have come to a place in my

> life

> > where I rarely allow myself to question God; that has not always been so.

> I

> > struggled with my faith for many, many years through some terribly

> difficult

> > circumstances. I hope I won't offend you by saying I will pray for you

> and

> > ask you not to give up on God. He hasn't given up on you.

> >

> > That being said, I do honestly care about you and about what you are

> going

> > through. Cirrhosis is hard, just plain HARD. Every day is a journey into

> > the unknown and leads us down paths we never dreamed we would have to

> walk.

> > Uncertainly and depression are familiar friends. I do so hope your doctor

> > can help you with the edema. BTW, I just wanted to add that you should

> give

> > serious consideration to that transplant. Whether you do it or not, give

> it

> > every chance when deciding. You have a beautiful grandson who would so

> > desperately miss his Grandpa, and I'd be willing to bet your daughter

> would

> > sure miss you too! Sometimes, bad things happen to good people so they

> can

> > reacess their lives and make fresh starts.

> >

> > I'm praying for you Dave!

> >

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:13:15 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Diane, this is one of my biggest problems. I do not have a strong belief

> > in the here after, religion, etc. I do not want to offend those that do.

> I

> > wish I did, but I don't. I see how much it helps people, but I have not

> > been able to grasp the concept. I come from a family that both parents

> were

> > strong believers and they took me to church regularly. I don't know why I

> > have had such a hard time with faith. I am not of the belief that the

> world

> > happened in a vacuum. There is a degree of spirituality in me. I'm sure

> > you don't want me to go into the usual talk of why bad things happen to

> good

> > people and good things happen to bad people. I just am unable to square

> the

> > suffering people endure with the idea of God having his hand on the

> > throttle, so to speak. I hope I have not offended you or anyone. I admire

> > your ability to believe without question. I know there is a force of good

> > in the universe, and certainly a evil in the

> > universe. I know it would help me if I had your faith, but it avoids me

> or

> > I avoid it. Whichever way it is, the outcome for me is the same, lack of

> > faith for which I, in the end, pay the price.

> > Dave

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:28:49 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Hi Dave,

> >

> > No, Terry opted not to try for a transplant. He had been at death's door

> a

> > couple of times prior to even knowing about his liver disease. He felt

> much

> > more peaceful about death than dealing with life after a transplant.

> Also,

> > he had a genetic disorder that predisposed him to liver disease. He

> thought

> > it would be selfish of him to ask for a donor liver, knowing his body

> would

> > begin attacking it as soon as it was transplanted, when so few are

> > available. It was so hard to sit by and watch him make that decision, but

> I

> > had watched Momma die of renal failure and had seen all she had gone

> through

> > with the dialysis and didn't want to emotionally force anything on Terry

> > that he wasn't ready to deal with. I told him I would support him fully

> in

> > whatever decision he made; if he chose to go for the transplant, I would

> be

> > there every step of the way but if not, I would also help him live his

> life

> > to the fullest until the time came for him to go home

> > with the Lord. As hard as it was to give him up, I did so knowing I had

> > done for him what his heart desired and loved him completely until Jesus

> > came for him.

> >

> > Now that I have cirrhosis as well, I am much in the same boat as

> > you. Terry and I had three children who never made it to this world. I

> > have two sisters and a niece and four nephews who love me dearly.

> However,

> > I am not comfortable asking them to take on the role of my caregiver as

> this

> > disease progresses. I know how hard that is on the loved one and I don't

> > want them to have to go through that. I have already started checking in

> to

> > in-patient hospice care for when that time comes. Whether I will consider

> a

> > transplant or not is something I haven't really even thought about yet. I

> > pray about it and just ask the Lord to help me make the right decision

> when

> > the time comes.

> >

> > Whatever decision you make, please know that I am praying for you. I do

> > not look forward to dealing with this disease, but I also don't allow

> myself

> > to worry about it. I simply leave it with the Lord and know He already

> has

> > a plan and all I have to do is submit myself to His will and plan for my

> > life. My faith carries me through this, just as it has through so many

> > other areas of my life.

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:05:45 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Thanks for writing back Diane..And I am sorry you had to go through this

> > with your husband...I know from dealing with close friends and family how

> > difficult a progressive fatal disease is on the caregiver and others

> > close..if I may ask, did your husband have a transplant? I am wrestling

> > with that decision when it comes, and whether to put myself and family

> > through that. I don't really have someone I can move in with during the

> > recovery process, and would not put that burden on my daughter and her

> > significant other. For one there is not room in her house, except a

> > finished basement, and I don't see how someone could negotiate the stairs

> in

> > that condition. For another reason her relationship is fragile I believe,

> > and that would certainly not help, and though we are civil, we really

> don't

> > care a lot for each other. I know some go into medical centers to

> > recuperate and I'm fine with that option, since likely the progression

> > either way will put

> > me into one, but I still have a lot of soul searching to do about a

> > transplant. Dave

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 4:42:49 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Dave, I am so sorry. Dealing with this disease wears so quickly on your

> > nerves and makes you so sad, so often. Please know I am praying for you.

> > Do make that call to your doctor tomorrow morning, especially since this

> is

> > your first experience with the swelling in your extremities. Terry, my

> late

> > husband, used to swell so badly in his feet that he couldn't walk because

> > his feet would actually be rounded on the bottom and wouldn't flaten out,

> > even when he was fully weight-bearing. I cannot say I know what you are

> > going through from my personal experience, but I do know from having been

> > with Terry as he went through it. It is agonizing for you and for those

> who

> > love you. Again, I am so sorry that this has infringed upon your weekend

> > with your daughter and grandson. Please update us after you speak with

> your

> > doctor. My prayers are with you.

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 11:59:08 AM

> > Subject: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > I'm sorry I only seem to come here when things are bad, but seems they

> are

> > mostly that way now...what has always been a great weekend when my

> daughter

> > and grandson come up was full of agony for most of my visit...my legs,

> feet,

> > and ankles swelled up so bad I could hardly walk, and my feet hurt very

> > bad...finally this noon the swelling has mostly gone down..but I wonder

> for

> > how long? I should call my doc tomorrow, but I get weary of doc's...this

> is

> > a first in my journey of my feet and ankles swelling like this...I

> thought

> > the ascites was bad, but that is more horrific..walking is terrible and

> just

> > laying with my feet up to try and make the pain go away...and knowing

> things

> > will, only progress into being worse...

> > Dave

> >

> >

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Phyllis, I am SO sorry!  I keep calling Phil the wrong name!  My mind is a mess

and I so apologize!  I suppose I must have had Jill's husband on my mind because

I have been exchanging emails with her as well.  Jill, I apologize to you as

well!  I may not know who I'm talking about, but the Lord does and I'm praying

for you all!

 

Warm Hugs...........

 

Di

http://auntdisexperimentallife.blogspot.com/

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 7:01:19 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Phil & I thank you.

Yes, one day at a time.

____________ _________ _________ __

From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 2:35:19 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Terry never had to deal with excess iron, so never dealt with these treatments. 

I know this does put an entirely new face on dealing with the disease.  The

other things you mentioned, we did deal with on a progressively worse basis as

time went by.  We just dealt with whatever was happening at the moment and then

moved on until the next hurdle presented itself.  I am praying for you and Ed. 

I know it is hard and the days and nights are long.

 

Warm Hugs........ ...

 

Di

http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

____________ _________ _________ __

From: Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 4:52:38 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Thx Jan

I try to not let it occupy our lives but it is there, every day, reminding us of

our limitations.

My husband is currently on a 12 hr home infusion of deferoxamine( remove excess

iron) which I have to administer every other day.  This is his sixth treatment

and every day we encounter new issues, an infection on one of the injection

sites. confusion, vision problems,vomiting, sleeps constanly, can't eat (tho his

stomach is growling) etc, etc....One day he took medication and didn't know what

he took, he came into the room with white powder residue on his mouth, I had to

induce vomiting.  I am awaiting a call back from Dr's office,we are not going to

continue on ths course of treatment, he is worst instead of better.  When he

doesn't take the treatment he is back to normal eating, coherent, playing with

dog, normal BP etc..

He flooded bathroom yesterday, as he didn't know how to turn off faucet. Trying

times, the mind is scrambled, unable to turn off this madness. 

Phyllis

 

____________ _________ _________ __

From: Jan Holman <janholmangmail (DOT) com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 11:40:31 AM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

Phylllis - I know you asked the question of Diane, but I feel much the same

way. Of course, I never forget that I have it, but it isn't the topmost

thing on my mind. Some of the side effects are on my mind every day, the

lack of energy, having to ration it to do what I want to do including

reading all these emails and the emails from other sources. But, I think

it is the acceptance of my medical problems, finding new ways of doing

things that don't require so much energy, spacing activities, staying as

active as possible. And my faith makes it so much easier to not become

cirrhosis, cad, pad, kidney disease, peripheral neuropathy, hypothyroid

disease, I haven't even bothered to find out what effects hasimotos disease

has on me. I am not my medical problems. I am a child of God with a job to

do here on earth. The most troublesome problem on a daily basis, and

comparitively rather minor, is osteo arthritis. It keeps reminding you with

pain. But when you know God is with you, that is so much more important

than how you might leave this world, or what will happen to you while you

are here. Now when I had an abcessed tooth that really flared up after my

last angioplasty, hurt from the top of my head down the side of my neck,

that was hard to keep out of my mind,[?] but I still continued to do as much

as possible. Jan H

On Mon, Sep 14, 2009 at 11:53 AM, Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com>wrote:

> wow, you don't let cirrhosis occupy your mind much? Tell me how to

> accomplish that?

>

>

>

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 10:10:30 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Yes, Dave, Hospice care is for the end-of-life and is something you

> shouldn't consider until you have made your decision regarding

> transplant. Give it much thought and consideration, both for yourself and

> your grandson.

>

> None of us knows the number of our days. We walk about every day living

> like we think we will live forever; but the truth is that any of us could go

> within the next minute. I don't allow the thought that I have cirrhosis to

> occupy too much of my time. I live my life and try my best to take care of

> myself. When my time comes, it comes; end of story. I'm not a fatalist,

> just a realist.

>

> I am always here if you need a friend or an ear to listen. I can't hide my

> faith, but I won't shove it down your throat either. Good luck with the

> call to your doctor tomorrow!

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:57:15 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Diane, thanks for the moral support, and for praying for me. I guess you

> could say, Lord knows I need it. What you were saying about my grandson is

> very true. His Grandmother, my X, is very sick also. He could easily lose

> out on knowing either of us well. He just turned two. My circumstances are

> so much better than some that it annoys me I get on so much self-pity. I

> could, when time comes, look into hospice. I think hospice is for the last

> 6 months. I may be wrong, though. I don't know how far away I am from

> needing a transplant yet. Several doc's gave me 5 yrs. a little less than 4

> yrs. ago. My liver doc would not give me a length, saying he does nor

> forecast the future. I appreciated him for that answer, and the others for

> their honesty. As they say be careful what you ask. I kind of wish now,

> when I asked, the other's would not have told me. I am sure they were going

> by percentage's giving my symptoms. If they

> were correct I am about 16 months away. As I have often thought, since

> their prediction, very few really know how long they have or how they will

> go. Dave

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:23:35 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Dave, you have in no way offended me. To say that have faith, without

> question, is certainly far from reality. I have come to a place in my life

> where I rarely allow myself to question God; that has not always been so. I

> struggled with my faith for many, many years through some terribly difficult

> circumstances. I hope I won't offend you by saying I will pray for you and

> ask you not to give up on God. He hasn't given up on you.

>

> That being said, I do honestly care about you and about what you are going

> through. Cirrhosis is hard, just plain HARD. Every day is a journey into

> the unknown and leads us down paths we never dreamed we would have to walk.

> Uncertainly and depression are familiar friends. I do so hope your doctor

> can help you with the edema. BTW, I just wanted to add that you should give

> serious consideration to that transplant. Whether you do it or not, give it

> every chance when deciding. You have a beautiful grandson who would so

> desperately miss his Grandpa, and I'd be willing to bet your daughter would

> sure miss you too! Sometimes, bad things happen to good people so they can

> reacess their lives and make fresh starts.

>

> I'm praying for you Dave!

>

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:13:15 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Diane, this is one of my biggest problems. I do not have a strong belief

> in the here after, religion, etc. I do not want to offend those that do. I

> wish I did, but I don't. I see how much it helps people, but I have not

> been able to grasp the concept. I come from a family that both parents were

> strong believers and they took me to church regularly. I don't know why I

> have had such a hard time with faith. I am not of the belief that the world

> happened in a vacuum. There is a degree of spirituality in me. I'm sure

> you don't want me to go into the usual talk of why bad things happen to good

> people and good things happen to bad people. I just am unable to square the

> suffering people endure with the idea of God having his hand on the

> throttle, so to speak. I hope I have not offended you or anyone. I admire

> your ability to believe without question. I know there is a force of good

> in the universe, and certainly a evil in the

> universe. I know it would help me if I had your faith, but it avoids me or

> I avoid it. Whichever way it is, the outcome for me is the same, lack of

> faith for which I, in the end, pay the price.

> Dave

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:28:49 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Hi Dave,

>

> No, Terry opted not to try for a transplant. He had been at death's door a

> couple of times prior to even knowing about his liver disease. He felt much

> more peaceful about death than dealing with life after a transplant. Also,

> he had a genetic disorder that predisposed him to liver disease. He thought

> it would be selfish of him to ask for a donor liver, knowing his body would

> begin attacking it as soon as it was transplanted, when so few are

> available. It was so hard to sit by and watch him make that decision, but I

> had watched Momma die of renal failure and had seen all she had gone through

> with the dialysis and didn't want to emotionally force anything on Terry

> that he wasn't ready to deal with. I told him I would support him fully in

> whatever decision he made; if he chose to go for the transplant, I would be

> there every step of the way but if not, I would also help him live his life

> to the fullest until the time came for him to go home

> with the Lord. As hard as it was to give him up, I did so knowing I had

> done for him what his heart desired and loved him completely until Jesus

> came for him.

>

> Now that I have cirrhosis as well, I am much in the same boat as

> you. Terry and I had three children who never made it to this world. I

> have two sisters and a niece and four nephews who love me dearly. However,

> I am not comfortable asking them to take on the role of my caregiver as this

> disease progresses. I know how hard that is on the loved one and I don't

> want them to have to go through that. I have already started checking in to

> in-patient hospice care for when that time comes. Whether I will consider a

> transplant or not is something I haven't really even thought about yet. I

> pray about it and just ask the Lord to help me make the right decision when

> the time comes.

>

> Whatever decision you make, please know that I am praying for you. I do

> not look forward to dealing with this disease, but I also don't allow myself

> to worry about it. I simply leave it with the Lord and know He already has

> a plan and all I have to do is submit myself to His will and plan for my

> life. My faith carries me through this, just as it has through so many

> other areas of my life.

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:05:45 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Thanks for writing back Diane..And I am sorry you had to go through this

> with your husband...I know from dealing with close friends and family how

> difficult a progressive fatal disease is on the caregiver and others

> close..if I may ask, did your husband have a transplant? I am wrestling

> with that decision when it comes, and whether to put myself and family

> through that. I don't really have someone I can move in with during the

> recovery process, and would not put that burden on my daughter and her

> significant other. For one there is not room in her house, except a

> finished basement, and I don't see how someone could negotiate the stairs in

> that condition. For another reason her relationship is fragile I believe,

> and that would certainly not help, and though we are civil, we really don't

> care a lot for each other. I know some go into medical centers to

> recuperate and I'm fine with that option, since likely the progression

> either way will put

> me into one, but I still have a lot of soul searching to do about a

> transplant. Dave

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 4:42:49 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Dave, I am so sorry. Dealing with this disease wears so quickly on your

> nerves and makes you so sad, so often. Please know I am praying for you.

> Do make that call to your doctor tomorrow morning, especially since this is

> your first experience with the swelling in your extremities. Terry, my late

> husband, used to swell so badly in his feet that he couldn't walk because

> his feet would actually be rounded on the bottom and wouldn't flaten out,

> even when he was fully weight-bearing. I cannot say I know what you are

> going through from my personal experience, but I do know from having been

> with Terry as he went through it. It is agonizing for you and for those who

> love you. Again, I am so sorry that this has infringed upon your weekend

> with your daughter and grandson. Please update us after you speak with your

> doctor. My prayers are with you.

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 11:59:08 AM

> Subject: (unknown)

>

>

> I'm sorry I only seem to come here when things are bad, but seems they are

> mostly that way now...what has always been a great weekend when my daughter

> and grandson come up was full of agony for most of my visit...my legs, feet,

> and ankles swelled up so bad I could hardly walk, and my feet hurt very

> bad...finally this noon the swelling has mostly gone down..but I wonder for

> how long? I should call my doc tomorrow, but I get weary of doc's...this is

> a first in my journey of my feet and ankles swelling like this...I thought

> the ascites was bad, but that is more horrific..walking is terrible and just

> laying with my feet up to try and make the pain go away...and knowing things

> will, only progress into being worse...

> Dave

>

>

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Praying for a safe journey Dave!  We'll be here when you get back!

 

Warm Hugs...........

 

Di

http://auntdisexperimentallife.blogspot.com/

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 7:20:49 PM

Subject: (unknown)

 

I have to go to St. Louis tomarrow for several days and will be away from my

computer..I send you all hopes of peace and comfort. 

 Dave

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i hear ya girl, i dont think i could ever love again after bobby glenn, it

would be wierd like he was up the watching me be naughty lol. i dont know what i

am gonna do when it all ends, i admire your strenghth!!! love you

>

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Date: Sunday, September 13, 2009, 7:57 PM

>

>  

>

> Diane, thanks for the moral support, and for praying for me.  I guess you

could say, Lord knows I need it.  What you were saying about my grandson is very

true.  His Grandmother, my X, is very sick also.  He could easily lose out on

knowing either of us well.  He just turned two.  My circumstances are so much

better than some that it annoys me I get on so much self-pity.  I could, when

time comes, look into hospice.  I think hospice is for the last 6 months.  I may

be wrong, though.  I don't know how far away I am from needing a transplant

yet.  Several doc's gave me 5 yrs. a little less than 4 yrs. ago.  My liver doc

would not give me a length, saying he does nor forecast the future.  I

appreciated him for that answer, and the others for their honesty.  As they say

be careful what you ask.  I kind of wish now, when I asked, the other's would

not have told me.  I am sure they were going by percentage's giving my

symptoms.  If they

> were correct I am about 16 months away.  As I have often thought, since their

prediction, very few really know how long they have or how they will go.   Dave

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:23:35 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>  

> Dave, you have in no way offended me.  To say that have faith, without

question, is certainly far from reality.  I have come to a place in my life

where I rarely allow myself to question God; that has not always been so...  I

struggled with my faith for many, many years through some terribly difficult

circumstances.  I hope I won't offend you by saying I will pray for you and ask

you not to give up on God.  He hasn't given up on you. 

>

> That being said, I do honestly care about you and about what you are going

through.  Cirrhosis is hard, just plain HARD.  Every day is a journey into the

unknown and leads us down paths we never dreamed we would have to walk. 

Uncertainly and depression are familiar friends.  I do so hope your doctor can

help you with the edema.  BTW, I just wanted to add that you should give serious

consideration to that transplant.  Whether you do it or not, give it every

chance when deciding.  You have a beautiful grandson who would so desperately

miss his Grandpa, and I'd be willing to bet your daughter would sure miss you

too!  Sometimes, bad things happen to good people so they can reacess their

lives and make fresh starts. 

>

> I'm praying for you Dave!

>

>  

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>  

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:13:15 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>  

> Diane, this is one of my biggest problems.  I do not have a strong belief in

the here after, religion, etc.  I do not want to offend those that do.  I wish I

did, but I don't.  I see how much it helps people, but I have not been able to

grasp the concept.  I come from a family that both parents were strong believers

and they took me to church regularly.  I don't know why I have had such a hard

time with faith.  I am not of the belief that the world happened in a vacuum. 

There is a degree of spirituality in me.  I'm sure you don't want me to go into

the usual talk of why bad things happen to good people and good things happen to

bad people...  I just am unable to square the suffering people endure with the

idea of God having his hand on the throttle, so to speak.  I hope I have not

offended you or anyone.  I admire your ability to believe without question.  I

know there is a force of good in the universe, and certainly a evil in the

> universe.  I know it would help me if I had your faith, but it avoids me or I

avoid it.  Whichever way it is, the outcome for me is the same, lack of faith

for which I, in the end, pay the price.     

>  Dave

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:28:49 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>  

> Hi Dave,

>

> No, Terry opted not to try for a transplant.  He had been at death's door a

couple of times prior to even knowing about his liver disease.  He felt much

more peaceful about death than dealing with life after a transplant.  Also, he

had a genetic disorder that predisposed him to liver disease.  He thought it

would be selfish of him to ask for a donor liver, knowing his body would begin

attacking it as soon as it was transplanted, when so few are available.  It was

so hard to sit by and watch him make that decision, but I had watched Momma die

of renal failure and had seen all she had gone through with the dialysis and

didn't want to emotionally force anything on Terry that he wasn't ready to deal

with.  I told him I would support him fully in whatever decision he made; if he

chose to go for the transplant, I would be there every step of the way but if

not, I would also help him live his life to the fullest until the time came for

him to go home

> with the Lord.  As hard as it was to give him up, I did so knowing I had done

for him what his heart desired and loved him completely until Jesus came for

him.

>

> Now that I have cirrhosis as well, I am much in the same boat as you.  Terry

and I had three children who never made it to this world.  I have two sisters

and a niece and four nephews who love me dearly.  However, I am not comfortable

asking them to take on the role of my caregiver as this disease progresses.  I

know how hard that is on the loved one and I don't want them to have to go

through that.  I have already started checking in to in-patient hospice care for

when that time comes.  Whether I will consider a transplant or not is something

I haven't really even thought about yet.  I pray about it and just ask the Lord

to help me make the right decision when the time comes.

>

> Whatever decision you make, please know that I am praying for you.  I do not

look forward to dealing with this disease, but I also don't allow myself to

worry about it.  I simply leave it with the Lord and know He already has a plan

and all I have to do is submit myself to His will and plan for my life.  My

faith carries me through this, just as it has through so many other areas of my

life.

>  

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>  

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:05:45 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>  

> Thanks for writing back Diane..And I am sorry you had to go through this with

your husband...I know from dealing with close friends and family how difficult a

progressive fatal disease is on the caregiver and others close..if I may ask,

did your husband have a transplant?  I am wrestling with that decision when it

comes, and whether to put myself and family through that.  I don't really have

someone I can move in with during the recovery process, and would not put that

burden on my daughter and her significant other.  For one there is not room in

her house, except a finished basement, and I don't see how someone could

negotiate the stairs in that condition.  For another reason her relationship is

fragile I believe, and that would certainly not help, and though we are civil,

we really don't care a lot for each other.  I know some go into medical centers

to recuperate and I'm fine with that option, since likely the progression either

way will put

> me into one, but I still have a lot of soul searching to do about a

transplant.     Dave

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 4:42:49 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>  

> Dave, I am so sorry.  Dealing with this disease wears so quickly on your

nerves and makes you so sad, so often.  Please know I am praying for you.  Do

make that call to your doctor tomorrow morning, especially since this is your

first experience with the swelling in your extremities.  Terry, my late husband,

used to swell so badly in his feet that he couldn't walk because his feet would

actually be rounded on the bottom and wouldn't flaten out, even when he was

fully weight-bearing.  I cannot say I know what you are going through from my

personal experience, but I do know from having been with Terry as he went

through it.  It is agonizing for you and for those who love you.  Again, I am so

sorry that this has infringed upon your weekend with your daughter and

grandson.  Please update us after you speak with your doctor.  My prayers are

with you.

>  

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>  

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 11:59:08 AM

> Subject: (unknown)

>

>  

> I'm sorry I only seem to come here when things are bad, but seems they are

mostly that way now...what has always been a great weekend when my daughter and

grandson come up was full of agony for most of my visit...my legs, feet, and

ankles swelled up so bad I could hardly walk, and my feet hurt very

bad...finally this noon the swelling has mostly gone down..but I wonder for how

long?  I should call my doc tomorrow, but I get weary of doc's...this is a first

in my journey of my feet and ankles swelling like this...I thought the ascites

was bad, but that is more horrific..walking is terrible and just laying with my

feet up to try and make the pain go away...and knowing things will, only

progress into being worse... 

>  Dave

>

>

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Dave

 

I have ESLD Stage 4 and it tood me over six months to be approved.  Just keep

that in mind.  I am waiting for a kidney/liver transplant.

Thanks be to God for he creates our tomorrows Love, Lyncia

 

 

>

> > Diane, thanks for the moral support, and for praying for me. I guess you

> > could say, Lord knows I need it. What you were saying about my grandson is

> > very true. His Grandmother, my X, is very sick also. He could easily lose

> > out on knowing either of us well. He just turned two. My circumstances are

> > so much better than some that it annoys me I get on so much self-pity. I

> > could, when time comes, look into hospice. I think hospice is for the last

> > 6 months. I may be wrong, though. I don't know how far away I am from

> > needing a transplant yet. Several doc's gave me 5 yrs. a little less than 4

> > yrs. ago. My liver doc would not give me a length, saying he does nor

> > forecast the future. I appreciated him for that answer, and the others for

> > their honesty. As they say be careful what you ask. I kind of wish now,

> > when I asked, the other's would not have told me. I am sure they were going

> > by percentage's giving my symptoms. If they

> > were correct I am about 16 months away. As I have often thought, since

> > their prediction, very few really know how long they have or how they will

> > go. Dave

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:23:35 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Dave, you have in no way offended me. To say that have faith, without

> > question, is certainly far from reality. I have come to a place in my life

> > where I rarely allow myself to question God; that has not always been so. I

> > struggled with my faith for many, many years through some terribly difficult

> > circumstances. I hope I won't offend you by saying I will pray for you and

> > ask you not to give up on God. He hasn't given up on you.

> >

> > That being said, I do honestly care about you and about what you are going

> > through. Cirrhosis is hard, just plain HARD. Every day is a journey into

> > the unknown and leads us down paths we never dreamed we would have to walk.

> > Uncertainly and depression are familiar friends. I do so hope your doctor

> > can help you with the edema. BTW, I just wanted to add that you should give

> > serious consideration to that transplant. Whether you do it or not, give it

> > every chance when deciding. You have a beautiful grandson who would so

> > desperately miss his Grandpa, and I'd be willing to bet your daughter would

> > sure miss you too! Sometimes, bad things happen to good people so they can

> > reacess their lives and make fresh starts.

> >

> > I'm praying for you Dave!

> >

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:13:15 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Diane, this is one of my biggest problems. I do not have a strong belief

> > in the here after, religion, etc. I do not want to offend those that do. I

> > wish I did, but I don't. I see how much it helps people, but I have not

> > been able to grasp the concept. I come from a family that both parents were

> > strong believers and they took me to church regularly. I don't know why I

> > have had such a hard time with faith. I am not of the belief that the world

> > happened in a vacuum. There is a degree of spirituality in me. I'm sure

> > you don't want me to go into the usual talk of why bad things happen to good

> > people and good things happen to bad people. I just am unable to square the

> > suffering people endure with the idea of God having his hand on the

> > throttle, so to speak. I hope I have not offended you or anyone. I admire

> > your ability to believe without question. I know there is a force of good

> > in the universe, and certainly a evil in the

> > universe. I know it would help me if I had your faith, but it avoids me or

> > I avoid it. Whichever way it is, the outcome for me is the same, lack of

> > faith for which I, in the end, pay the price.

> > Dave

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:28:49 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Hi Dave,

> >

> > No, Terry opted not to try for a transplant. He had been at death's door a

> > couple of times prior to even knowing about his liver disease. He felt much

> > more peaceful about death than dealing with life after a transplant. Also,

> > he had a genetic disorder that predisposed him to liver disease. He thought

> > it would be selfish of him to ask for a donor liver, knowing his body would

> > begin attacking it as soon as it was transplanted, when so few are

> > available. It was so hard to sit by and watch him make that decision, but I

> > had watched Momma die of renal failure and had seen all she had gone through

> > with the dialysis and didn't want to emotionally force anything on Terry

> > that he wasn't ready to deal with. I told him I would support him fully in

> > whatever decision he made; if he chose to go for the transplant, I would be

> > there every step of the way but if not, I would also help him live his life

> > to the fullest until the time came for him to go home

> > with the Lord. As hard as it was to give him up, I did so knowing I had

> > done for him what his heart desired and loved him completely until Jesus

> > came for him.

> >

> > Now that I have cirrhosis as well, I am much in the same boat as

> > you. Terry and I had three children who never made it to this world. I

> > have two sisters and a niece and four nephews who love me dearly. However,

> > I am not comfortable asking them to take on the role of my caregiver as this

> > disease progresses. I know how hard that is on the loved one and I don't

> > want them to have to go through that. I have already started checking in to

> > in-patient hospice care for when that time comes. Whether I will consider a

> > transplant or not is something I haven't really even thought about yet. I

> > pray about it and just ask the Lord to help me make the right decision when

> > the time comes.

> >

> > Whatever decision you make, please know that I am praying for you. I do

> > not look forward to dealing with this disease, but I also don't allow myself

> > to worry about it. I simply leave it with the Lord and know He already has

> > a plan and all I have to do is submit myself to His will and plan for my

> > life. My faith carries me through this, just as it has through so many

> > other areas of my life.

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:05:45 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Thanks for writing back Diane..And I am sorry you had to go through this

> > with your husband...I know from dealing with close friends and family how

> > difficult a progressive fatal disease is on the caregiver and others

> > close..if I may ask, did your husband have a transplant? I am wrestling

> > with that decision when it comes, and whether to put myself and family

> > through that. I don't really have someone I can move in with during the

> > recovery process, and would not put that burden on my daughter and her

> > significant other. For one there is not room in her house, except a

> > finished basement, and I don't see how someone could negotiate the stairs in

> > that condition. For another reason her relationship is fragile I believe,

> > and that would certainly not help, and though we are civil, we really don't

> > care a lot for each other. I know some go into medical centers to

> > recuperate and I'm fine with that option, since likely the progression

> > either way will put

> > me into one, but I still have a lot of soul searching to do about a

> > transplant. Dave

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 4:42:49 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Dave, I am so sorry. Dealing with this disease wears so quickly on your

> > nerves and makes you so sad, so often. Please know I am praying for you.

> > Do make that call to your doctor tomorrow morning, especially since this is

> > your first experience with the swelling in your extremities. Terry, my late

> > husband, used to swell so badly in his feet that he couldn't walk because

> > his feet would actually be rounded on the bottom and wouldn't flaten out,

> > even when he was fully weight-bearing. I cannot say I know what you are

> > going through from my personal experience, but I do know from having been

> > with Terry as he went through it. It is agonizing for you and for those who

> > love you. Again, I am so sorry that this has infringed upon your weekend

> > with your daughter and grandson. Please update us after you speak with your

> > doctor. My prayers are with you.

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 11:59:08 AM

> > Subject: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > I'm sorry I only seem to come here when things are bad, but seems they are

> > mostly that way now...what has always been a great weekend when my daughter

> > and grandson come up was full of agony for most of my visit...my legs, feet,

> > and ankles swelled up so bad I could hardly walk, and my feet hurt very

> > bad...finally this noon the swelling has mostly gone down..but I wonder for

> > how long? I should call my doc tomorrow, but I get weary of doc's...this is

> > a first in my journey of my feet and ankles swelling like this...I thought

> > the ascites was bad, but that is more horrific..walking is terrible and just

> > laying with my feet up to try and make the pain go away...and knowing things

> > will, only progress into being worse...

> > Dave

> >

> >

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Di,

 

I am so so tired of being alone but more scared to have a bad relationship;

Thanks be to God for he creates our tomorrows Love, Lyncia

 

 

From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

Subject: Re: (unknown)

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Date: Sunday, September 13, 2009, 7:57 PM

 

Diane, thanks for the moral support, and for praying for me.  I guess you could

say, Lord knows I need it.  What you were saying about my grandson is very

true.  His Grandmother, my X, is very sick also.  He could easily lose out on

knowing either of us well.  He just turned two.  My circumstances are so much

better than some that it annoys me I get on so much self-pity.  I could, when

time comes, look into hospice.  I think hospice is for the last 6 months.  I may

be wrong, though.  I don't know how far away I am from needing a transplant

yet.  Several doc's gave me 5 yrs. a little less than 4 yrs. ago.  My liver doc

would not give me a length, saying he does nor forecast the future.  I

appreciated him for that answer, and the others for their honesty.  As they say

be careful what you ask.  I kind of wish now, when I asked, the other's would

not have told me.  I am sure they were going by percentage's giving my

symptoms.  If they

were correct I am about 16 months away.  As I have often thought, since their

prediction, very few really know how long they have or how they will go.   Dave

____________ _________ _________ __

From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:23:35 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Dave, you have in no way offended me.  To say that have faith, without

question, is certainly far from reality.  I have come to a place in my life

where I rarely allow myself to question God; that has not always been so...  I

struggled with my faith for many, many years through some terribly difficult

circumstances.  I hope I won't offend you by saying I will pray for you and ask

you not to give up on God.  He hasn't given up on you. 

That being said, I do honestly care about you and about what you are going

through.  Cirrhosis is hard, just plain HARD.  Every day is a journey into the

unknown and leads us down paths we never dreamed we would have to walk. 

Uncertainly and depression are familiar friends.  I do so hope your doctor can

help you with the edema.  BTW, I just wanted to add that you should give serious

consideration to that transplant.  Whether you do it or not, give it every

chance when deciding.  You have a beautiful grandson who would so desperately

miss his Grandpa, and I'd be willing to bet your daughter would sure miss you

too!  Sometimes, bad things happen to good people so they can reacess their

lives and make fresh starts. 

I'm praying for you Dave!

 

Warm Hugs........ ...

 

Di

http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

____________ _________ _________ __

From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:13:15 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Diane, this is one of my biggest problems.  I do not have a strong belief in the

here after, religion, etc.  I do not want to offend those that do.  I wish I

did, but I don't.  I see how much it helps people, but I have not been able to

grasp the concept.  I come from a family that both parents were strong believers

and they took me to church regularly.  I don't know why I have had such a hard

time with faith.  I am not of the belief that the world happened in a vacuum. 

There is a degree of spirituality in me.  I'm sure you don't want me to go into

the usual talk of why bad things happen to good people and good things happen to

bad people...  I just am unable to square the suffering people endure with the

idea of God having his hand on the throttle, so to speak.  I hope I have not

offended you or anyone.  I admire your ability to believe without question.  I

know there is a force of good in the universe, and certainly a evil in the

universe.  I know it would help me if I had your faith, but it avoids me or I

avoid it.  Whichever way it is, the outcome for me is the same, lack of faith

for which I, in the end, pay the price.     

 Dave

____________ _________ _________ __

From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:28:49 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Hi Dave,

No, Terry opted not to try for a transplant.  He had been at death's door a

couple of times prior to even knowing about his liver disease.  He felt much

more peaceful about death than dealing with life after a transplant.  Also, he

had a genetic disorder that predisposed him to liver disease.  He thought it

would be selfish of him to ask for a donor liver, knowing his body would begin

attacking it as soon as it was transplanted, when so few are available.  It was

so hard to sit by and watch him make that decision, but I had watched Momma die

of renal failure and had seen all she had gone through with the dialysis and

didn't want to emotionally force anything on Terry that he wasn't ready to deal

with.  I told him I would support him fully in whatever decision he made; if he

chose to go for the transplant, I would be there every step of the way but if

not, I would also help him live his life to the fullest until the time came for

him to go home

with the Lord.  As hard as it was to give him up, I did so knowing I had done

for him what his heart desired and loved him completely until Jesus came for

him.

Now that I have cirrhosis as well, I am much in the same boat as you.  Terry and

I had three children who never made it to this world.  I have two sisters and a

niece and four nephews who love me dearly.  However, I am not comfortable asking

them to take on the role of my caregiver as this disease progresses.  I know how

hard that is on the loved one and I don't want them to have to go through that. 

I have already started checking in to in-patient hospice care for when that time

comes.  Whether I will consider a transplant or not is something I haven't

really even thought about yet.  I pray about it and just ask the Lord to help me

make the right decision when the time comes.

Whatever decision you make, please know that I am praying for you.  I do not

look forward to dealing with this disease, but I also don't allow myself to

worry about it.  I simply leave it with the Lord and know He already has a plan

and all I have to do is submit myself to His will and plan for my life.  My

faith carries me through this, just as it has through so many other areas of my

life.

 

Warm Hugs........ ...

 

Di

http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

____________ _________ _________ __

From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:05:45 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Thanks for writing back Diane..And I am sorry you had to go through this with

your husband...I know from dealing with close friends and family how difficult a

progressive fatal disease is on the caregiver and others close..if I may ask,

did your husband have a transplant?  I am wrestling with that decision when it

comes, and whether to put myself and family through that.  I don't really have

someone I can move in with during the recovery process, and would not put that

burden on my daughter and her significant other.  For one there is not room in

her house, except a finished basement, and I don't see how someone could

negotiate the stairs in that condition.  For another reason her relationship is

fragile I believe, and that would certainly not help, and though we are civil,

we really don't care a lot for each other.  I know some go into medical centers

to recuperate and I'm fine with that option, since likely the progression either

way will put

me into one, but I still have a lot of soul searching to do about a

transplant.     Dave

____________ _________ _________ __

From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 4:42:49 PM

Subject: Re: (unknown)

 

Dave, I am so sorry.  Dealing with this disease wears so quickly on your nerves

and makes you so sad, so often.  Please know I am praying for you.  Do make that

call to your doctor tomorrow morning, especially since this is your first

experience with the swelling in your extremities.  Terry, my late husband, used

to swell so badly in his feet that he couldn't walk because his feet would

actually be rounded on the bottom and wouldn't flaten out, even when he was

fully weight-bearing.  I cannot say I know what you are going through from my

personal experience, but I do know from having been with Terry as he went

through it.  It is agonizing for you and for those who love you.  Again, I am so

sorry that this has infringed upon your weekend with your daughter and

grandson.  Please update us after you speak with your doctor.  My prayers are

with you.

 

Warm Hugs........ ...

 

Di

http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

____________ _________ _________ __

From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 11:59:08 AM

Subject: (unknown)

 

I'm sorry I only seem to come here when things are bad, but seems they are

mostly that way now...what has always been a great weekend when my daughter and

grandson come up was full of agony for most of my visit...my legs, feet, and

ankles swelled up so bad I could hardly walk, and my feet hurt very

bad...finally this noon the swelling has mostly gone down..but I wonder for how

long?  I should call my doc tomorrow, but I get weary of doc's...this is a first

in my journey of my feet and ankles swelling like this...I thought the ascites

was bad, but that is more horrific..walking is terrible and just laying with my

feet up to try and make the pain go away...and knowing things will, only

progress into being worse... 

 Dave

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it's okay, i knew  who you were talking to!  LOL!!!!

                                       

                                    Love,Jill

 

We don't remember days, we remember moments.

Life is not measured by the breaths we take,but by the moments that take our

breath away.

> wow, you don't let cirrhosis occupy your mind much? Tell me how to

> accomplish that?

>

>

>

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 10:10:30 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Yes, Dave, Hospice care is for the end-of-life and is something you

> shouldn't consider until you have made your decision regarding

> transplant. Give it much thought and consideration, both for yourself and

> your grandson.

>

> None of us knows the number of our days. We walk about every day living

> like we think we will live forever; but the truth is that any of us could go

> within the next minute. I don't allow the thought that I have cirrhosis to

> occupy too much of my time. I live my life and try my best to take care of

> myself. When my time comes, it comes; end of story. I'm not a fatalist,

> just a realist.

>

> I am always here if you need a friend or an ear to listen. I can't hide my

> faith, but I won't shove it down your throat either. Good luck with the

> call to your doctor tomorrow!

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:57:15 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Diane, thanks for the moral support, and for praying for me. I guess you

> could say, Lord knows I need it. What you were saying about my grandson is

> very true. His Grandmother, my X, is very sick also. He could easily lose

> out on knowing either of us well. He just turned two. My circumstances are

> so much better than some that it annoys me I get on so much self-pity. I

> could, when time comes, look into hospice. I think hospice is for the last

> 6 months. I may be wrong, though. I don't know how far away I am from

> needing a transplant yet. Several doc's gave me 5 yrs. a little less than 4

> yrs. ago. My liver doc would not give me a length, saying he does nor

> forecast the future. I appreciated him for that answer, and the others for

> their honesty. As they say be careful what you ask. I kind of wish now,

> when I asked, the other's would not have told me. I am sure they were going

> by percentage's giving my symptoms. If they

> were correct I am about 16 months away. As I have often thought, since

> their prediction, very few really know how long they have or how they will

> go. Dave

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:23:35 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Dave, you have in no way offended me. To say that have faith, without

> question, is certainly far from reality. I have come to a place in my life

> where I rarely allow myself to question God; that has not always been so. I

> struggled with my faith for many, many years through some terribly difficult

> circumstances. I hope I won't offend you by saying I will pray for you and

> ask you not to give up on God. He hasn't given up on you.

>

> That being said, I do honestly care about you and about what you are going

> through. Cirrhosis is hard, just plain HARD. Every day is a journey into

> the unknown and leads us down paths we never dreamed we would have to walk.

> Uncertainly and depression are familiar friends. I do so hope your doctor

> can help you with the edema. BTW, I just wanted to add that you should give

> serious consideration to that transplant. Whether you do it or not, give it

> every chance when deciding. You have a beautiful grandson who would so

> desperately miss his Grandpa, and I'd be willing to bet your daughter would

> sure miss you too! Sometimes, bad things happen to good people so they can

> reacess their lives and make fresh starts.

>

> I'm praying for you Dave!

>

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:13:15 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Diane, this is one of my biggest problems. I do not have a strong belief

> in the here after, religion, etc. I do not want to offend those that do. I

> wish I did, but I don't. I see how much it helps people, but I have not

> been able to grasp the concept. I come from a family that both parents were

> strong believers and they took me to church regularly. I don't know why I

> have had such a hard time with faith. I am not of the belief that the world

> happened in a vacuum. There is a degree of spirituality in me. I'm sure

> you don't want me to go into the usual talk of why bad things happen to good

> people and good things happen to bad people. I just am unable to square the

> suffering people endure with the idea of God having his hand on the

> throttle, so to speak. I hope I have not offended you or anyone. I admire

> your ability to believe without question. I know there is a force of good

> in the universe, and certainly a evil in the

> universe. I know it would help me if I had your faith, but it avoids me or

> I avoid it. Whichever way it is, the outcome for me is the same, lack of

> faith for which I, in the end, pay the price.

> Dave

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:28:49 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Hi Dave,

>

> No, Terry opted not to try for a transplant. He had been at death's door a

> couple of times prior to even knowing about his liver disease. He felt much

> more peaceful about death than dealing with life after a transplant. Also,

> he had a genetic disorder that predisposed him to liver disease. He thought

> it would be selfish of him to ask for a donor liver, knowing his body would

> begin attacking it as soon as it was transplanted, when so few are

> available. It was so hard to sit by and watch him make that decision, but I

> had watched Momma die of renal failure and had seen all she had gone through

> with the dialysis and didn't want to emotionally force anything on Terry

> that he wasn't ready to deal with. I told him I would support him fully in

> whatever decision he made; if he chose to go for the transplant, I would be

> there every step of the way but if not, I would also help him live his life

> to the fullest until the time came for him to go home

> with the Lord. As hard as it was to give him up, I did so knowing I had

> done for him what his heart desired and loved him completely until Jesus

> came for him.

>

> Now that I have cirrhosis as well, I am much in the same boat as

> you. Terry and I had three children who never made it to this world. I

> have two sisters and a niece and four nephews who love me dearly. However,

> I am not comfortable asking them to take on the role of my caregiver as this

> disease progresses. I know how hard that is on the loved one and I don't

> want them to have to go through that. I have already started checking in to

> in-patient hospice care for when that time comes. Whether I will consider a

> transplant or not is something I haven't really even thought about yet. I

> pray about it and just ask the Lord to help me make the right decision when

> the time comes.

>

> Whatever decision you make, please know that I am praying for you. I do

> not look forward to dealing with this disease, but I also don't allow myself

> to worry about it. I simply leave it with the Lord and know He already has

> a plan and all I have to do is submit myself to His will and plan for my

> life. My faith carries me through this, just as it has through so many

> other areas of my life.

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:05:45 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Thanks for writing back Diane..And I am sorry you had to go through this

> with your husband...I know from dealing with close friends and family how

> difficult a progressive fatal disease is on the caregiver and others

> close..if I may ask, did your husband have a transplant? I am wrestling

> with that decision when it comes, and whether to put myself and family

> through that. I don't really have someone I can move in with during the

> recovery process, and would not put that burden on my daughter and her

> significant other. For one there is not room in her house, except a

> finished basement, and I don't see how someone could negotiate the stairs in

> that condition. For another reason her relationship is fragile I believe,

> and that would certainly not help, and though we are civil, we really don't

> care a lot for each other. I know some go into medical centers to

> recuperate and I'm fine with that option, since likely the progression

> either way will put

> me into one, but I still have a lot of soul searching to do about a

> transplant. Dave

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 4:42:49 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Dave, I am so sorry. Dealing with this disease wears so quickly on your

> nerves and makes you so sad, so often. Please know I am praying for you.

> Do make that call to your doctor tomorrow morning, especially since this is

> your first experience with the swelling in your extremities. Terry, my late

> husband, used to swell so badly in his feet that he couldn't walk because

> his feet would actually be rounded on the bottom and wouldn't flaten out,

> even when he was fully weight-bearing. I cannot say I know what you are

> going through from my personal experience, but I do know from having been

> with Terry as he went through it. It is agonizing for you and for those who

> love you. Again, I am so sorry that this has infringed upon your weekend

> with your daughter and grandson. Please update us after you speak with your

> doctor. My prayers are with you.

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 11:59:08 AM

> Subject: (unknown)

>

>

> I'm sorry I only seem to come here when things are bad, but seems they are

> mostly that way now...what has always been a great weekend when my daughter

> and grandson come up was full of agony for most of my visit...my legs, feet,

> and ankles swelled up so bad I could hardly walk, and my feet hurt very

> bad...finally this noon the swelling has mostly gone down..but I wonder for

> how long? I should call my doc tomorrow, but I get weary of doc's...this is

> a first in my journey of my feet and ankles swelling like this...I thought

> the ascites was bad, but that is more horrific..walking is terrible and just

> laying with my feet up to try and make the pain go away...and knowing things

> will, only progress into being worse...

> Dave

>

>

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Phyllis, I may be the one who referred to him as your dad. As far as I

know, I don't have hepatic encephalopathy, but I sure do get things mixed

up, and forget things. Jan H

On Mon, Sep 14, 2009 at 5:01 PM, Phyllis Delgado wrote:

> Phil & I thank you.

> Yes, one day at a time.

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: livercirrhosissupport

> Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 2:35:19 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Terry never had to deal with excess iron, so never dealt with these

> treatments. I know this does put an entirely new face on dealing with the

> disease. The other things you mentioned, we did deal with on a

> progressively worse basis as time went by. We just dealt with whatever was

> happening at the moment and then moved on until the next hurdle presented

> itself. I am praying for you and Ed. I know it is hard and the days and

> nights are long.

>

> Warm Hugs........ ...

>

> Di

> http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 4:52:38 PM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

>

> Thx Jan

> I try to not let it occupy our lives but it is there, every day, reminding

> us of our limitations.

> My husband is currently on a 12 hr home infusion of deferoxamine( remove

> excess iron) which I have to administer every other day. This is his sixth

> treatment and every day we encounter new issues, an infection on one of the

> injection sites. confusion, vision problems,vomiting, sleeps constanly,

> can't eat (tho his stomach is growling) etc, etc....One day he took

> medication and didn't know what he took, he came into the room with white

> powder residue on his mouth, I had to induce vomiting. I am awaiting a call

> back from Dr's office,we are not going to continue on ths course of

> treatment, he is worst instead of better. When he doesn't take the

> treatment he is back to normal eating, coherent, playing with dog, normal BP

> etc..

> He flooded bathroom yesterday, as he didn't know how to turn off faucet.

> Trying times, the mind is scrambled, unable to turn off this madness.

> Phyllis

>

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

>

> From: Jan Holman <janholmangmail (DOT) com>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 11:40:31 AM

> Subject: Re: (unknown)

>

> Phylllis - I know you asked the question of Diane, but I feel much the same

> way. Of course, I never forget that I have it, but it isn't the topmost

> thing on my mind. Some of the side effects are on my mind every day, the

> lack of energy, having to ration it to do what I want to do including

> reading all these emails and the emails from other sources. But, I think

> it is the acceptance of my medical problems, finding new ways of doing

> things that don't require so much energy, spacing activities, staying as

> active as possible. And my faith makes it so much easier to not become

> cirrhosis, cad, pad, kidney disease, peripheral neuropathy, hypothyroid

> disease, I haven't even bothered to find out what effects hasimotos disease

> has on me. I am not my medical problems. I am a child of God with a job to

> do here on earth. The most troublesome problem on a daily basis, and

> comparitively rather minor, is osteo arthritis. It keeps reminding you with

> pain. But when you know God is with you, that is so much more important

> than how you might leave this world, or what will happen to you while you

> are here. Now when I had an abcessed tooth that really flared up after my

> last angioplasty, hurt from the top of my head down the side of my neck,

> that was hard to keep out of my mind,[?] but I still continued to do as

> much

> as possible. Jan H

>

> On Mon, Sep 14, 2009 at 11:53 AM, Phyllis Delgado <pdelgado354@ yahoo.com

> >wrote:

>

> > wow, you don't let cirrhosis occupy your mind much? Tell me how to

> > accomplish that?

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 10:10:30 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Yes, Dave, Hospice care is for the end-of-life and is something you

> > shouldn't consider until you have made your decision regarding

> > transplant. Give it much thought and consideration, both for yourself and

> > your grandson.

> >

> > None of us knows the number of our days. We walk about every day living

> > like we think we will live forever; but the truth is that any of us could

> go

> > within the next minute. I don't allow the thought that I have cirrhosis

> to

> > occupy too much of my time. I live my life and try my best to take care

> of

> > myself. When my time comes, it comes; end of story. I'm not a fatalist,

> > just a realist.

> >

> > I am always here if you need a friend or an ear to listen. I can't hide

> my

> > faith, but I won't shove it down your throat either. Good luck with the

> > call to your doctor tomorrow!

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:57:15 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Diane, thanks for the moral support, and for praying for me. I guess you

> > could say, Lord knows I need it. What you were saying about my grandson

> is

> > very true. His Grandmother, my X, is very sick also. He could easily lose

> > out on knowing either of us well. He just turned two. My circumstances

> are

> > so much better than some that it annoys me I get on so much self-pity. I

> > could, when time comes, look into hospice. I think hospice is for the

> last

> > 6 months. I may be wrong, though. I don't know how far away I am from

> > needing a transplant yet. Several doc's gave me 5 yrs. a little less than

> 4

> > yrs. ago. My liver doc would not give me a length, saying he does nor

> > forecast the future. I appreciated him for that answer, and the others

> for

> > their honesty. As they say be careful what you ask. I kind of wish now,

> > when I asked, the other's would not have told me. I am sure they were

> going

> > by percentage's giving my symptoms. If they

> > were correct I am about 16 months away. As I have often thought, since

> > their prediction, very few really know how long they have or how they

> will

> > go. Dave

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:23:35 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Dave, you have in no way offended me. To say that have faith, without

> > question, is certainly far from reality. I have come to a place in my

> life

> > where I rarely allow myself to question God; that has not always been so.

> I

> > struggled with my faith for many, many years through some terribly

> difficult

> > circumstances. I hope I won't offend you by saying I will pray for you

> and

> > ask you not to give up on God. He hasn't given up on you.

> >

> > That being said, I do honestly care about you and about what you are

> going

> > through. Cirrhosis is hard, just plain HARD. Every day is a journey into

> > the unknown and leads us down paths we never dreamed we would have to

> walk.

> > Uncertainly and depression are familiar friends. I do so hope your doctor

> > can help you with the edema. BTW, I just wanted to add that you should

> give

> > serious consideration to that transplant. Whether you do it or not, give

> it

> > every chance when deciding. You have a beautiful grandson who would so

> > desperately miss his Grandpa, and I'd be willing to bet your daughter

> would

> > sure miss you too! Sometimes, bad things happen to good people so they

> can

> > reacess their lives and make fresh starts.

> >

> > I'm praying for you Dave!

> >

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 6:13:15 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Diane, this is one of my biggest problems. I do not have a strong belief

> > in the here after, religion, etc. I do not want to offend those that do.

> I

> > wish I did, but I don't. I see how much it helps people, but I have not

> > been able to grasp the concept. I come from a family that both parents

> were

> > strong believers and they took me to church regularly. I don't know why I

> > have had such a hard time with faith. I am not of the belief that the

> world

> > happened in a vacuum. There is a degree of spirituality in me. I'm sure

> > you don't want me to go into the usual talk of why bad things happen to

> good

> > people and good things happen to bad people. I just am unable to square

> the

> > suffering people endure with the idea of God having his hand on the

> > throttle, so to speak. I hope I have not offended you or anyone. I admire

> > your ability to believe without question. I know there is a force of good

> > in the universe, and certainly a evil in the

> > universe. I know it would help me if I had your faith, but it avoids me

> or

> > I avoid it. Whichever way it is, the outcome for me is the same, lack of

> > faith for which I, in the end, pay the price.

> > Dave

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:28:49 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Hi Dave,

> >

> > No, Terry opted not to try for a transplant. He had been at death's door

> a

> > couple of times prior to even knowing about his liver disease. He felt

> much

> > more peaceful about death than dealing with life after a transplant.

> Also,

> > he had a genetic disorder that predisposed him to liver disease. He

> thought

> > it would be selfish of him to ask for a donor liver, knowing his body

> would

> > begin attacking it as soon as it was transplanted, when so few are

> > available. It was so hard to sit by and watch him make that decision, but

> I

> > had watched Momma die of renal failure and had seen all she had gone

> through

> > with the dialysis and didn't want to emotionally force anything on Terry

> > that he wasn't ready to deal with. I told him I would support him fully

> in

> > whatever decision he made; if he chose to go for the transplant, I would

> be

> > there every step of the way but if not, I would also help him live his

> life

> > to the fullest until the time came for him to go home

> > with the Lord. As hard as it was to give him up, I did so knowing I had

> > done for him what his heart desired and loved him completely until Jesus

> > came for him.

> >

> > Now that I have cirrhosis as well, I am much in the same boat as

> > you. Terry and I had three children who never made it to this world. I

> > have two sisters and a niece and four nephews who love me dearly.

> However,

> > I am not comfortable asking them to take on the role of my caregiver as

> this

> > disease progresses. I know how hard that is on the loved one and I don't

> > want them to have to go through that. I have already started checking in

> to

> > in-patient hospice care for when that time comes. Whether I will consider

> a

> > transplant or not is something I haven't really even thought about yet. I

> > pray about it and just ask the Lord to help me make the right decision

> when

> > the time comes.

> >

> > Whatever decision you make, please know that I am praying for you. I do

> > not look forward to dealing with this disease, but I also don't allow

> myself

> > to worry about it. I simply leave it with the Lord and know He already

> has

> > a plan and all I have to do is submit myself to His will and plan for my

> > life. My faith carries me through this, just as it has through so many

> > other areas of my life.

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 5:05:45 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Thanks for writing back Diane..And I am sorry you had to go through this

> > with your husband...I know from dealing with close friends and family how

> > difficult a progressive fatal disease is on the caregiver and others

> > close..if I may ask, did your husband have a transplant? I am wrestling

> > with that decision when it comes, and whether to put myself and family

> > through that. I don't really have someone I can move in with during the

> > recovery process, and would not put that burden on my daughter and her

> > significant other. For one there is not room in her house, except a

> > finished basement, and I don't see how someone could negotiate the stairs

> in

> > that condition. For another reason her relationship is fragile I believe,

> > and that would certainly not help, and though we are civil, we really

> don't

> > care a lot for each other. I know some go into medical centers to

> > recuperate and I'm fine with that option, since likely the progression

> > either way will put

> > me into one, but I still have a lot of soul searching to do about a

> > transplant. Dave

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: diane chandler <dianechandler@ att.net>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 4:42:49 PM

> > Subject: Re: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > Dave, I am so sorry. Dealing with this disease wears so quickly on your

> > nerves and makes you so sad, so often. Please know I am praying for you.

> > Do make that call to your doctor tomorrow morning, especially since this

> is

> > your first experience with the swelling in your extremities. Terry, my

> late

> > husband, used to swell so badly in his feet that he couldn't walk because

> > his feet would actually be rounded on the bottom and wouldn't flaten out,

> > even when he was fully weight-bearing. I cannot say I know what you are

> > going through from my personal experience, but I do know from having been

> > with Terry as he went through it. It is agonizing for you and for those

> who

> > love you. Again, I am so sorry that this has infringed upon your weekend

> > with your daughter and grandson. Please update us after you speak with

> your

> > doctor. My prayers are with you.

> >

> > Warm Hugs........ ...

> >

> > Di

> > http://auntdisexper imentallife. blogspot. com/

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: dave dodds <daveliltoe@ yahoo. com>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 11:59:08 AM

> > Subject: (unknown)

> >

> >

> > I'm sorry I only seem to come here when things are bad, but seems they

> are

> > mostly that way now...what has always been a great weekend when my

> daughter

> > and grandson come up was full of agony for most of my visit...my legs,

> feet,

> > and ankles swelled up so bad I could hardly walk, and my feet hurt very

> > bad...finally this noon the swelling has mostly gone down..but I wonder

> for

> > how long? I should call my doc tomorrow, but I get weary of doc's...this

> is

> > a first in my journey of my feet and ankles swelling like this...I

> thought

> > the ascites was bad, but that is more horrific..walking is terrible and

> just

> > laying with my feet up to try and make the pain go away...and knowing

> things

> > will, only progress into being worse...

> > Dave

> >

> >

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