Christmas with an Aspie

November 29, 2009

samcmaster@... wrote:

<< Gift giving....I love to receive considerate gifts. The forethought,

preparation and evidence of being thought of means a lot to me. Gifts

and quality time are my two top love languages for those who have read

that book. My husband is not one to notice what I like or what I could

use. Yet i feel bossy if I just straight up tell him what I want for

Christmas. It almost doesn't feel like a gift if I had to tell him what

to do. Can any others spouses relate to what I'm saying? Can anyone

with Aspergers speak to this issue? >>

I can totally relate to what you are saying. FWIW, this problem affects

NTs just as often as it affects Aspies.

I did not have this problem with my spouse while he was still living.

Yet it remains a problem with most friends, to the extent that I have

dispensed with gift exchanges entirely. Given the economy, people

understand. And I'm hoping that now that the habit is broken, there's

less incentive on the part of everyone to return to the habits of the past.

With respect to gifts, it's been said that " it's the thought that

counts " . If that's the case, I would respectfully encourage others to

" think harder " .

IMX, very few people put a lot of effort into gifting. If they are not

regifting or stockpiling generic gifts for future giving, they are

dashing out at the last minute to buy something, often something they

would like to have themselves. Gee thanks, I love receiving yet another

sci-fi novel, especially since you know that I don't care for sci-fi...

or novels.

My circle also contains a lot of 'crafty' people. Seriously, how many

knitted scarves and mittens do I really need, especially living in a

climate where the temperature rarely drops below 50 degrees? I know

that it makes *them* happy to knit away, but shouldn't the gift really

be about giving joy to the recipient?

Don't even get me started about the woman who once made me a life-sized

sheep plushie for my birthday, complete with internal wire frame. Yes,

the woolly creature could indeed stand up on its own power. And its

creator expected me to display it prominently in my tiny apartment,

where space was already at a premium. Sigh.

Given the state of affairs, I would much prefer no gifts rather than

thoughtless gifts. Which is why I avoid gift exchanges whenever possible.

On second thought, a thoughtful gift of the person's time would be the

best gift of all. How about doing an extra special favor for the

recipient? Or perhaps creating a special outing that the recipient

might enjoy at a later date?

<< Parties... Social engagements are at their peek during the month of

December. If I could, I would go to every single event I could find,

but my hubby would be most content to spend every night and weekend at

home doing nearly nothing. And while I try to respect our differences

and not push him out of his comfort zone too much, sometimes I feel like

I have to be less who I am. Any thoughts on holiday events and how you

and your spouse cope with those during the holidays? >>

Other than making compromises where neither spouse ends up happy, the

only thing I can suggest is to maintain separate groups of friends in

addition to mutual friends that you enjoy as a couple.

My late husband and I did this for years, as we each had many interests

that often bored the other to tears. I am also more into parties, where

he was practically claustrophobic in large groups.

In some marriages, doing everything together is the only way to preserve

peace in the valley. That usually requires each spouse to give up

special interests that their spouse does not share, which I find sad.

Having different groups of friends for certain types of activities is

relatively common with couples, at least in my experience. I also

believe it's healthy for couples not to be " joined at the hip " , but

instead to have individual experiences to bring home to share with their

spouse. Provided the relationship is strong, it can be a wonderful gift

of love to encourage a spouse to develop other interests apart from

those shared as a couple.

Best,

~CJ

November 29, 2009

I give my husband and children an extra long list of things that I

would like for gifts and then they choose whichever they wish to give.

I'm happy and they are happy too. It works for us. I also encourage

them to give me a list of things that they would like and choose some

to buy for them. The list also gives us ideas for other presents that

are not on the list so we give a surprise present or two also... but

not always.

And social events at Christmas... I go to them on my own or with a

friend and would not expect my husband to go. I am fine with this

situation now and so is he. We have his work dinner to go to together

but he will be very stressed throughout the whole evening so it won't

be the easiest of evenings. We also will have our own evenings out just

the two of us which we both enjoy.

Good luck finding ways to make your celebrations fun for both of you.

Delyth

November 29, 2009

To: aspires-relationships Sent: Sun, November 29, 2009 1:36:32 PMSubject: Re: Christmas with an Aspie

>This is interesting. Growing up we always did Christmas and Birthday lists.

>I thought that was the normal way to do things. You mean it's not?>Most of the time I got some things on the list and a few things not on the list. I believe that my mom

>is AS also so I wonder if this was her way of coping with not knowing who us kids were. I believe my mom was AS as well, but she often got us things that were not on our lists, and she was very often right. I had confidence that she had a really good idea about what we liked. She would ask us in March what we liked, get one on sale, and save it till Christmas. We were told that we could search the house and ruin the surprise, but that it would still ruin the surprise. We (at least I) never did- she would tell me where not to go, and I wanted to be surprised, so I did not look. I knew it would be a nice surprise. I think that figuring out what we wanted for holidays and birthdays was a special interest of my mother's- she was really good at this!>Never bothered me at all that a person went out and got me something on my list, in fact I viewed that as being >loving because they actually

took the effort to get me what I wanted. Me, neither : ~ )>It was annoying when people bought me stuff that had nothing to do with who I was. That's how I finally learned to show appreciation for people's idea of giving me a gift, when they really had no clue. I thought they just did not know how to ask me what my list was- or ask my mom <g>.>Or one time my older sister showed me something in the store and asked me which my other

>sister would like so I told her what my sister would like and then she bought it and gave it to me!! Boy was I >upset!! If I had known she wanted to know what I wanted I would not have chosen that one. Of course she >couldn't have known that I had matured beyond just picking what I would like for someone else. I was only >about 5 at the time.That is annoying! My sister did this to me in a different way: she called me up, told me she was doing a survey for a class, and asked me my favorite color at the time. I had no clue! (BTW, my sister is definitely NS)

>Also I really like what CJ said about it's the thought that counts and some folk need to think more!! I agree! So >many people look at gift giving like a trial they have to endure. What a waste of time. If that's all it is just

>give cash and be done with it. Sheesh. But those kind of people, it's all about them thus they can't just give cash >because they think that looks like they don't know the person... which they don't so instead they inflict some >stupid gift on others and expect them to act like they like it. My children would agree with you here. (Unless they can make a list.)>My MIL does this. Also I find it annoying when people give a gift and then expect the person to put it on display >regardless if they like it or it fits their decor. I give gifts and then what the other person does with it is their >decision! In fact I pay attention to what they are still using years later what not so I can adjust my ideas about >what to get them.That's really sweet! I remember my parents' taking out that old whatsis and displaying it quickly, since the person who gave it to them was coming over, so they thought

it was rude to have it hidden away. I have whatsies I have no room for, and have not quite figured out how to deal with the people who gave them to me- ideas would be welcome!

>I happen to like giving gifts and view it as a challenge to get people something that they will really like. I am not >at all offended if someone doesn't like what I gave them, rather I assume that I failed to really

>understand who they are and then I try to do better the next time.I feel that way, too.

>I have no problem with giving my husband a list of things because I figure

>he can't read my mind. But when I did that he promptly didn't buy a single

>thing on it. In fact that was one way to make sure I didn't get something.

>He had this idea that if he got something on the list that it didn't really

>count as a gift, yet he wouldn't take the time to think about who I am and

>actually get me something I wanted or needed. In fact he would go out and

>get me things he totally knew I was not interested in. (Because I had said

>so previously) Or worse yet buy me flowers that I have an allergy to, even

>though he knew I had an allergy to them. He would claim he 'forgot'. So then

>I was always in this trap of do I be nice and applaud him for his effort

>while getting headaches and snotty nose or do I throw the flowers out and

>offend him. No matter what I did I lost. Gifts became a horrible trial.As the card says, "Many happy returns!" One more thing- put flowers on your list! (I may be AS, but I am learning <g>)

>Now my kids, they give really neat gifts so that is always fun. I wonder why can children with just a couple bucks >give neater presents than an adult?! I think it's because kids don't have some stupid idea of looking good with the

>gift they give, they just honestly give what they can and what they think the person will like. There's no social >politics. They aren't embarrassed to buy me something at a garage sale, which I am totally happy with.I wish my kids were like that! They were when they were younger- now, I have two adults and one late teenager, so things are kind of different...

>So I don't really have an answer... I guess if my husband would actually buy something off a list I would consider >that a loving act. Though it would be nice if he on occasion put some thought into it and got me something he

>thought up himself.My dad was pretty good at thinking of cool gifts, too. Of the two, my mother was far better. My ex did not mind lists- and would willingly make his own. I like to be surprised, but I can totally relate to the flowers story- I would hate it if someone got me something I could not use.

>Jennie AS AS

November 30, 2009

Hi, I'd like to share my experiences and feelings about this. I enjoy giving gifts, much more than receiving them which was a good trait to have in my marriage, although, I have to admit that I was disappointed in the lack of thought or seemingly careless attitude I felt from my husband. I certainly wouldn't feel good asking for a gift from him, but it would have been nice to at least sometimes at Christmas or on my birthday to have a nice surprise that meant that he cared enough about me to go to the trouble of giving me something. I would scrimp and save to buy him really nice gifts that I knew he wanted or could use, such as an expensive tool chest for his tools, a nice leather jacket etc....and he would usually say he had forgotten my birthday and run out that evening and just grab something off the shelf, he would readily admit

that's what he had done. And thats only if I reminded him that it was my birthday, otherwise he wouldn't even acknowledge it and probably really did forget. I know holidays were uncomfortable for him, especially Christmas and after we got married i found out from his Mother that almost every year he would end up sick on Christmas day, sit wrapped in a blanket feeling awful while the gift exchange was going on. Thinking back, I guess I think the sickness every year was brought on by the stress and dread of dealing with it all. One thing that perplexes me though is that before we got married, for my birthday he went out and bought me a huge bag of clothes. I had mentioned a dress I wanted and he had gotten that, then went on to buy a whole lot more. He had no idea at that time what size I wore and we hadn't known each other long enough yet so he would have had any way of finding out, so he just guessed. To

my surprise, everything fit perfectly. So in that sense, he was capable of buying appropriate gifts, but after marriage that all stopped. wonder if it was just that he felt he didn't have to??? There was one time I came home and he had brought me a dozen roses - this was after we were married for about 3 years. I thanked him and told him how much that meant to me and his response was, you'd better enjoy them because I don't usually just go out and buy flowers unless you've done something really great. That put the excitement out of it for me. He was saying I had to earn gifts from him if I interpreted it correctly.But, with all that said, many times my gift was seeing him enjoy the gifts I had picked out for him.

samcmasterjuno (DOT) com wrote:

<< Gift giving....I love to receive considerate gifts. The forethought,

preparation and evidence of being thought of means a lot to me. Gifts

and quality time are my two top love languages for those who have read

that book. My husband is not one to notice what I like or what I could

use. Yet i feel bossy if I just straight up tell him what I want for

Christmas. It almost doesn't feel like a gift if I had to tell him what

to do. Can any others spouses relate to what I'm saying? Can anyone

with Aspergers speak to this issue? >>

November 30, 2009

Jennie Unknown wrote:

<< I happen to like giving gifts and view it as a challenge to get

people something that they will really like. I am not at all offended if

someone doesn't like what I gave them, rather I assume that I failed to

really understand who they are and then I try to do better the next time. >>

I'm much like you in this way, Jennie. It really makes me happy to see

the person happy.

Yet after so many years of not receiving a similar level of care from

others, I've chosen to opt out on gift exchanges entirely. The lack of

reciprocation in kind is just too painful.

<< I have no problem with giving my husband a list of things because I

figure he can't read my mind. But when I did that he promptly didn't buy

a single thing on it. In fact that was one way to make sure I didn't get

something. He had this idea that if he got something on the list that it

didn't really count as a gift, yet he wouldn't take the time to think

about who I am and actually get me something I wanted or needed. In fact

he would go out and get me things he totally knew I was not interested

in. (Because I had said so previously) Or worse yet buy me flowers that

I have an allergy to, even though he knew I had an allergy to them. He

would claim he 'forgot'. >>

I have no personal experience with this sort of thing myself, as my

(late) husband was the poster child for considerate and appropriate giving.

However, I have known women to speak of partners whose gifting behavior

is similar to that of your husband. With them, the husband's behavior

usually turned out to be some sort of passive-aggressive acting out

toward his wife, using the gift issue as a vehicle for pent-up hostility

regarding one thing or another.

<< Now my kids, they give really neat gifts so that is always fun. I

wonder why can children with just a couple bucks give neater presents

than an adult?! I think it's because kids don't have some stupid idea of

looking good with the gift they give, they just honestly give what they

can and what they think the person will like. There's no social

politics. They aren't embarrassed to buy me something at a garage sale,

which I am totally happy with. >>

That feels so good, doesn't it? A pure heart and the absence of an agenda.

Best,

~CJ

November 30, 2009

This comment some how has made me realize that this issue goes back farther than

my conflict with my husband. This has been a touchy issue between me and my

mother as well. My house is splattered with items she gave me that are not

quite my taste. She always taught us to accept and show gratitude for gifts

whether we like them or not. And while she loves to give gifts, she is not

particularly good at choosing something that appeals to the recipient. She

usually gives what she likes.

She's the same way about food. If she brings a dish to pass to our home, VERY

often it is something she adores and can not perceive how my boys (there are

four) might not like it. She is extremely sensitive about this as well. She

does not allow each of us to have our own preferences and really puts on a

strong guilt trip over it. Perhaps she has theory of mind issues as well. One

time I had had enough of this pressure and I intentionally prepared an entire

meal that I knew she would NOT like when she came to visit us....medium rare

steak and and nice big bowl of cooked spinach. Was that awful?

I hope that I do not sound like a horrible ungrateful materialistic person.

____________________________________________________________

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Princess wrote:

<< I remember my parents' taking out that old whatsis and displaying it

quickly, since the person who gave it to them was coming over, so they

thought it was rude to have it hidden away. I have whatsies I have no

room for, and have not quite figured out how to deal with the people who

gave them to me- ideas would be welcome! >>

I think it depends on the relationship the recipient has with the giver.

If the giver is part of your inner circle, you would probably want to be

extra careful about their feelings when speaking of the white elephant.

What troubles me about your parents' predicament is that the memory of

the old whatsis lives on to continue to cause them stress, year after

year, every time they are faced with having to bring it out of hiding.

As I see it, continuing to display the item for the giver only causes

stress for the receiver, and reinforces the 'appropriateness' of the

giver's choice. How long does the receiver plan to carry out this

charade, I wonder?

Personally, while I think that telling someone that their gift is ugly

would be overkill, I don't believe it is 'rude' to opt out on displaying

it either.

Most well-mannered people would never dream of asking about the item's

whereabouts, thereby putting the recipient on the spot.

Those that do... well, perhaps they deserve to hear some lame answer

about the item being " in the wash " .

Of course, the approach should be tailored to one's relationship with

the giver. I would definitely put more effort into preserving my

sister's feelings than those of a casual acquaintance or third cousin.

Best,

~CJ

November 30, 2009

I think I would be fine going without him, but I don't think he would be fine

with it. Nearly every time I leave the house without him I come home to a

disaster. Even if I have said straight up " I would feel appreciated if you

cleaned up after dinner, had the children pick up and put them to bed on time. "

There have been plenty of times he just flat out didn't do it. For years I

would try to convince myself to just be happy that I got out and the children

are alive and then proceed to pick up everything left undone while he sat on the

couch watching television. It is hard for me to resist the urge to become

bitter. Sometimes it feels like he thinks I am simply here to be in service to

him and not the vice versa. I think part of it is that he wishes I would light

up when I talk to him the same way I do when I talk with my friends.

____________________________________________________________

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I give my husband and children an extra long list of things that I

would like for gifts and then they choose whichever they wish to give.

I'm happy and they are happy too. It works for us. I also encourage

them to give me a list of things that they would like and choose some

to buy for them. The list also gives us ideas for other presents that

are not on the list so we give a surprise present or two also... but

not always.

And social events at Christmas... I go to them on my own or with a

friend and would not expect my husband to go. I am fine with this

situation now and so is he. We have his work dinner to go to together

but he will be very stressed throughout the whole evening so it won't

be the easiest of evenings. We also will have our own evenings out just

the two of us which we both enjoy.

Good luck finding ways to make your celebrations fun for both of you.

Delyth

November 30, 2009

You don't sound like a horrible ungrateful materialistic person, but you do sound like someone who has at times allowed things to take control over your life and your actions, that probably you should not have given power to. And it is good that you realize you've repeated the pattern with your mother, with your husband. We don't need to psychoanalyze here but I come from the perspective that only you can give someone the power to hurt you (I mean, other than physically, I mean emotionally) and if you choose to let someone's inappropriate gift choices hurt you, that is something in your control that you need not do.

Of course, this is much easier said than done, and don't expect years of life patterns to go away overnight. I haven't always been successful either but I don't let things hurt me the way they did years ago, I no longer take it as a reflection of my husband's lack of love ==> my self worth. After finding out 6,7 years ago that he might have Aspergers I put it in a different place and it doesn't affect me. I don't expect gifts from my husband or anyone else. If I want to buy for him and often I do, I just do it. For years (like over a decade) he bought me nothing and then recently he started again. We sort of do whatever we feel motivated for, which, since I have told him I want to be separated after our daughter goes to college, surprisingly to me still results in our buying each other things from time to time.

In case you feel like you are the only one that makes mistakes, a few years back my husband bought me a very expensive gold ring with diamond chips and a center emerald (my birthstone) for Christmas. He bought it out of the blue, in a year when times were tough financially and he and I had expressly agreed "no presents" as between us, so we didn't have to cut back much for our daughter. It boggled my mind that he would do that after we expressly agreed not to do it. I was grateful but I didn't understand why he would do it after we had actually talked the issue over, and I felt bad that I had not gotten him anything. He at first said it was okay, because we had agreed no gifts, but then later he got drunk and almost ruined Christmas dinner shouting and saying I was an ingrate because I hadn't gotten him anything, which again I didn't understand at all. I got angry myself because it wasn't just between us, now it was his family there and the kids and I took him aside and took the ring off and gave it back to him and told him I didn't want it. Which I later realized, was probably what he was hoping I would do, because he had spent money and I hadn't. He blows up and becomes a bully to manipulate things, that has always been his M.). Anyway, he put the ring back in its box on his dresser, but didn't return it. A few months later, I decided to put it on and see if he said anything. I told myself at the time it was my reward for staying married to him for so many years <g>. He has never said another word about it to this day (almost four years later) even though I know he's seen it on my hand a gazillion times.

..

Re: Christmas with an Aspie

This comment some how has made me realize that this issue goes back farther than my conflict with my husband. This has been a touchy issue between me and my mother as well. My house is splattered with items she gave me that are not quite my taste. She always taught us to accept and show gratitude for gifts whether we like them or not. And while she loves to give gifts, she is not particularly good at choosing something that appeals to the recipient. She usually gives what she likes. She's the same way about food. If she brings a dish to pass to our home, VERY often it is something she adores and can not perceive how my boys (there are four) might not like it. She is extremely sensitive about this as well. She does not allow each of us to have our own preferences and really puts on a strong guilt trip over it. Perhaps she has theory of mind issues as well. One time I had had enough of this pressure and I intentionally prepared an entire meal that I knew she would NOT like when she came to visit us....medium rare steak and and nice big bowl of cooked spinach. Was that awful?I hope that I do not sound like a horrible ungrateful materialistic person.__________________________________________________________Top Psychology DegreesFind schools offering psychology programs online. 3 easy steps!http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=H1u_uxyvSZhyCgNQXaoJIgAAJ1AQz4KnhT56NOX4odalbYuZAAQAAAAFAAAAAAjvWD4AAAMlAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZmkwAAAAA=

November 30, 2009

You're right . All of this is really helping me to sort things out and

get my heart back in the right place before the holidays. Thanks so much

everyone!

____________________________________________________________

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You don't sound like a horrible ungrateful materialistic person, but you do sound like someone who has at times allowed things to take control over your life and your actions, that probably you should not have given power to. And it is good that you realize you've repeated the pattern with your mother, with your husband. We don't need to psychoanalyze here but I come from the perspective that only you can give someone the power to hurt you (I mean, other than physically, I mean emotionally) and if you choose to let someone's inappropriate gift choices hurt you, that is something in your control that you need not do.

Of course, this is much easier said than done, and don't expect years of life patterns to go away overnight. I haven't always been successful either but I don't let things hurt me the way they did years ago, I no longer take it as a reflection of my husband's lack of love ==> my self worth. After finding out 6,7 years ago that he might have Aspergers I put it in a different place and it doesn't affect me. I don't expect gifts from my husband or anyone else. If I want to buy for him and often I do, I just do it. For years (like over a decade) he bought me nothing and then recently he started again. We sort of do whatever we feel motivated for, which, since I have told him I want to be separated after our daughter goes to college, surprisingly to me still results in our buying each other things from time to time.

In case you feel like you are the only one that makes mistakes, a few years back my husband bought me a very expensive gold ring with diamond chips and a center emerald (my birthstone) for Christmas. He bought it out of the blue, in a year when times were tough financially and he and I had expressly agreed "no presents" as between us, so we didn't have to cut back much for our daughter. It boggled my mind that he would do that after we expressly agreed not to do it. I was grateful but I didn't understand why he would do it after we had actually talked the issue over, and I felt bad that I had not gotten him anything. He at first said it was okay, because we had agreed no gifts, but then later he got drunk and almost ruined Christmas dinner shouting and saying I was an ingrate because I hadn't gotten him anything, which again I didn't understand at all. I got angry myself because it wasn't just between us, now it was his family there and the kids and I took him aside and took the ring off and gave it back to him and told him I didn't want it. Which I later realized, was probably what he was hoping I would do, because he had spent money and I hadn't. He blows up and becomes a bully to manipulate things, that has always been his M.). Anyway, he put the ring back in its box on his dresser, but didn't return it. A few months later, I decided to put it on and see if he said anything. I told myself at the time it was my reward for staying married to him for so many years <g>. He has never said another word about it to this day (almost four years later) even though I know he's seen it on my hand a gazillion times.

..

Re: Christmas with an Aspie

This comment some how has made me realize that this issue goes back farther than my conflict with my husband. This has been a touchy issue between me and my mother as well. My house is splattered with items she gave me that are not quite my taste. She always taught us to accept and show gratitude for gifts whether we like them or not. And while she loves to give gifts, she is not particularly good at choosing something that appeals to the recipient. She usually gives what she likes. She's the same way about food. If she brings a dish to pass to our home, VERY often it is something she adores and can not perceive how my boys (there are four) might not like it. She is extremely sensitive about this as well. She does not allow each of us to have our own preferences and really puts on a strong guilt trip over it. Perhaps she has theory of mind issues as well. One time I had had enough of this pressure and I intentionally prepared an entire meal that I knew she would NOT like when she came to visit us....medium rare steak and and nice big bowl of cooked spinach. Was that awful?I hope that I do not sound like a horrible ungrateful materialistic person.__________________________________________________________Top Psychology DegreesFind schools offering psychology programs online. 3 easy steps!http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=H1u_uxyvSZhyCgNQXaoJIgAAJ1AQz4KnhT56NOX4odalbYuZAAQAAAAFAAAAAAjvWD4AAAMlAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZmkwAAAAA=

November 30, 2009

samcmaster@... wrote:

<< One time I had had enough of this pressure and I intentionally

prepared an entire meal that I knew she would NOT like when she came to

visit us....medium rare steak and and nice big bowl of cooked spinach.

Was that awful? >>

No, it wasn't awful. Yet it wasn't particularly constructive either.

And it probably won't solve your problem.

I'm not a big fan of passive-aggressive and tit-for-tat games. They

really don't resolve anything, and the momentary sadistic pleasure is so

very fleeting.

Your mother seems like a difficult person to have around unless she can

control a situation. While a challenge, I would much rather see you

work on the problem with your mother instead of simply allowing

resentments to mount due to her boorish behavior.

Is there any way that you can take control and explicitly tell her what

to bring for dinner to complement the meal? It's your home, she's a

guest, and you call the shots as to the menu. Pick something that both

she and the kids can eat, then instruct her to bring that item only.

You can also do the same thing with gifts. Give her a list containing

items that the kids will enjoy. Ask her explicitly (no hinting!) to

pick something from the list, rather than give the kids what she wants

them to have.

It's not easy to change habits (especially bad ones) and she will

probably resist you. She might even make a scene and attempt to make

you feel guilty. Don't play the game. Stand your ground calmly, and

repeat yourself. Do not let her control you in your own home.

<< I hope that I do not sound like a horrible ungrateful materialistic

person. >>

You sound like nothing of the kind. However, I do think it would

empower you to find a way to deal with your mother's controlling

behavior, especially while a guest in your home.

Each of us teaches others how we expect to be treated, and your mother

has learned that it's acceptable to call the shots with respect to

family occasions in which she is a participant. Unless you reverse

course and blaze a new trail, do not expect her to divert from hers.

Best,

~CJ

November 30, 2009

I see your point. You are right. I think she does want to be in control. She

needs to be in charge. I am not exaggerating when I say that she even pulled

out the dictionary to look up the word matriarch and show it to my son when she

disagreed with the place he would sit at the table for Thanksgiving. My husband

usually sits at the head of the table. My son usually sits at the opposite end.

She felt that she should sit there. It is difficult for me to stand my ground

with her because she is my mother. She has always been very authoritarian.

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samcmasterjuno wrote:

<< One time I had had enough of this pressure and I intentionally

prepared an entire meal that I knew she would NOT like when she came to

visit us....medium rare steak and and nice big bowl of cooked spinach.

Was that awful? >>

No, it wasn't awful. Yet it wasn't particularly constructive either.

And it probably won't solve your problem.

I'm not a big fan of passive-aggressive and tit-for-tat games. They

really don't resolve anything, and the momentary sadistic pleasure is so

very fleeting.

Your mother seems like a difficult person to have around unless she can

control a situation. While a challenge, I would much rather see you

work on the problem with your mother instead of simply allowing

resentments to mount due to her boorish behavior.

Is there any way that you can take control and explicitly tell her what

to bring for dinner to complement the meal? It's your home, she's a

guest, and you call the shots as to the menu. Pick something that both

she and the kids can eat, then instruct her to bring that item only.

You can also do the same thing with gifts. Give her a list containing

items that the kids will enjoy. Ask her explicitly (no hinting!) to

pick something from the list, rather than give the kids what she wants

them to have.

It's not easy to change habits (especially bad ones) and she will

probably resist you. She might even make a scene and attempt to make

you feel guilty. Don't play the game. Stand your ground calmly, and

repeat yourself. Do not let her control you in your own home.

<< I hope that I do not sound like a horrible ungrateful materialistic

person. >>

You sound like nothing of the kind. However, I do think it would

empower you to find a way to deal with your mother's controlling

behavior, especially while a guest in your home.

Each of us teaches others how we expect to be treated, and your mother

has learned that it's acceptable to call the shots with respect to

family occasions in which she is a participant. Unless you reverse

course and blaze a new trail, do not expect her to divert from hers.

Best,

~CJ

November 30, 2009

Hello,Thus far the only Christmas I spent with an aspie was myself. My two youngest daughters are aspies, but not diagnosed yet.I almost spent a Christmas with a family of aspies. Mom & the son were aspies, and the daughter was ADHD.I lived there 6 months in Connecticut, and had a great time the first 4 months. Then somehow everything changed, and the other family members called me many derrogatory names daily to hasten my leaving.I would have enjoyed being with another family for the holidays!This year I am doing Saint Day for my 3 daughters and my granddaughter. Christmas will be just a family visiting day as I give out all thfts as Saint on december 5/6!I wish everyone a safe and peaceful holiday season!!!Terry KlasekSaint Louis,

MissouriSubject: Re: Christmas with an AspieTo: aspires-relationships Date: Monday, November 30, 2009, 11:36 AM

I see your point. You are right. I think she does want to be in control. She needs to be in charge. I am not exaggerating when I say that she even pulled out the dictionary to look up the word matriarch and show it to my son when she disagreed with the place he would sit at the table for Thanksgiving. My husband usually sits at the head of the table. My son usually sits at the opposite end. She felt that she should sit there. It is difficult for me to stand my ground with her because she is my mother. She has always been very authoritarian.

____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _

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November 30, 2009

My mother is very controlling in her own way also. I learned to stand up to

her some years ago. Some things just aren't acceptable behavior no matter

who does them. I'm not quite sure I understand why many in my parents

generation think they have the right to control their kids. I have seen this

over and over, it drives me nuts. It also bugs me because most often these

people will treat other people from their kid's generation with respect and

then alienate their children. My mother is doing this right now. She's

gotten it so only one of her kids (out of six) will go visit her or even

call her on a regular basis. I've been through this with my husband's family

also who are even more nuts. Some things I wish I had known going into it...

I wish I had known to just say what I wanted to say clearly and factually

laying down the RULES of the relationship and then let them throw their fit.

Instead I worked around the edges hoping they would be decent enough to get

the point. They weren't and they didn't and it caused WAY more problems in

the end. I think that probably at least some of the relationships might

still exist if we (husband and I) had been more blunt and straight to the

point in just telling them this is how it's going to be. Like CJ said,

decide on the menu and just say " This is what I need you to bring, I'll be

cooking the rest of the meal. " or something like that. Don't use words that

leave loop holes. Don't sound uncertain. If she throws a fit, just tell her

when she's done she can call you back, good bye. If she says she won't come

tell her you'd all love to see her and if she changes her mind, feel free to

call and let you know she's changed her mind. By being agreeable and yet

firm you take away her power. This I have learned the hard way from two sets

of crazy parents!

Jennie

Re: Christmas with an Aspie

>I see your point. You are right. I think she does want to be in control.

>She needs to be in charge. I am not exaggerating when I say that she even

>pulled out the dictionary to look up the word matriarch and show it to my

>son when she disagreed with the place he would sit at the table for

>Thanksgiving. My husband usually sits at the head of the table. My son

>usually sits at the opposite end. She felt that she should sit there. It

>is difficult for me to stand my ground with her because she is my mother.

>She has always been very authoritarian.

>

> ____________________________________________________________

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> Find schools offering psychology programs online. 3 easy steps!

>

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>

> ------------------------------------

>

> " We each have our own way of living in the world, together we

> are like a symphony.

> Some are the melody, some are the rhythm, some are the harmony

> It all blends together, we are like a symphony, and each part is crucial.

> We all contribute to the song of life. "

> ...Sondra

>

> We might not always agree; but TOGETHER we will make a difference.

>

> ASPIRES is a closed, confidential, moderated list.

> Responsibility for posts to ASPIRES lies entirely with the original

> author.

> Do NOT post mail off-list without the author's permission.

> When in doubt, please refer to our list rules at:

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> ASPIRES ~ Climbing the mountain TOGETHER

> http://www.aspires-relationships.com

>

November 30, 2009

This again is TRUE. I need to work on being firm. My fear has always been that

she will feel dishonored or disrespected. By the way, my husband ended up

giving her his seat. I need to ask him about that. I even wonder if it felt

worth it in the end for her. I think my husband preferred to give up his seat

rather than force my Aspie 13 year old to give up his because he really dislikes

sitting anywhere else other than where he usually sits (the whole adapting to

change issue). My husband can be a peace maker.

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