Re: New here, looking for info

[Guest guest]

Welcome Stef, Thanks for sharing your story in your intro.  There are lots of people who read who still aren't feeling ready to post about their own stories or challenges.  Whenever someone else posts it helps another person get a bit closer to introducing herself.  I haven't gone thru menopause, but what you are describing reminds me of post partum time for me when I had untreated hypo thyroid disease, low b12 (likely thyroid related deficiency) and b-6, low estrogen, low zinc, and erratic (high and low) adrenals.  Can you get your doctor to order blood tests for you or would you rather order on your own thru a place like lef.org?  It would be helpful to get blood tests to start.  Some people prefer saliva tests.  Depending on the test and my level of interest, I sometimes look at both.    I've found it helps to learn to understand the tests myself so that I'm clear about why I'm doing them and to make sure I have clarity about the context of each test.  I just got tested this morning and I took notes about how I was feeling and when I last took any hormones.   It is also helpful to pick a lab and then use the same one (as much as possible).  I'm not test happy, but if it were me and I could go back and redo on anything -- I start with a good round of tests.  LaurelHello all, my name is Stefanie, I moved to a sparsely populatedpart of NE Montana recently, so must rely on the Internet formost info.I hope someone here can shed a bit of light. I am 53,menopausal, haven't had a period in well over a year now. Nohot flashes or any of the more well-known symptoms, just a lossof libido. However, about 2 years ago I began having stiffnessand pain in the joints, lower body. Arthritis was ruled out aswell as fibromyalgia. Severe pain and stiffness in the AM, andstiffness after sitting more than 15 minutes. Worst of all isedema in the ankles, extending half way up to my knees. I have so puffiness in the morning, making my rings tight butthat is gone by mid-day. I had noticed a pattern with theedema, it seemed to lessen at times and that would have beenwhen I would have a period. gradually as menopause progressedand the monthly spotting stopped, the edema got worse, and nowit is all the time with very little relief.I have read that edema cn be tied to levels of progesterone butall my previous doctors blew me off. I'll be needing to go to agynocologist because the last cat scan I had showed aparavaginal cyst. Need to find out more about what that is, aswell.The only thing my docs offered me was stockings, which due tothe stiffness I couldn't reach far enough to put on, and thefew times I was able to, they pinched and hurt so badly I hadto get them off quickly. I'm almost completely crippled with this and don't know whereto turn for help. I would be most grateful for any info thatcan point me in the right direction.Thanks,Stef

[Guest guest]

Stefanie, I tried to email you private but it bounced.

Could you email me private with your email address?

I have some info for you.

Sam

(thyroid-less and Armour-ized)

k9gang@...

www.stopthethyroidmadness.com

http://www.altsupportthyroid.org/dt.php

New here, looking for info

Hello all, my name is Stefanie, I moved to a sparsely populated

part of NE Montana recently, so must rely on the Internet for

most info.

[Guest guest]

--- Laurel wrote:

>

> I haven't gone thru menopause, but what you are describing

> reminds me

> of post partum time for me when I had untreated hypo thyroid

> disease,

> low b12 (likely thyroid related deficiency) and b-6, low

> estrogen,

> low zinc, and erratic (high and low) adrenals.

I fit the symptoms for the thyroid deficiency, too. The

thinning hair is the most upsetting. I did get one doc to run

the test but she said I was normal and didn't do any further

tests. I have read that the standard test does not always show

the needed info.

> Can you get your doctor to order blood tests for you or would

> you

> rather order on your own thru a place like lef.org? It would

> be

> helpful to get blood tests to start.

Trying to find cooperative doctors is a challenge. More so

here, the eastern side of Montana is so sparsely populated that

almost anything I was used to is tough to find here.

My intention is to do as much research as I can and try to find

someone willing to do the tests needed. I'll have to look at

lef.org, maybe I can work something out there. I would prefer

to get this done so my insurance will cover since $$$ are

pretty tight.

I've probably had the thyroid thing since my 20s, that's when

my hair began to thin. Never could get much help for it from

the mainstream docs. My focus now is on this edema, I can't

walk or sit, and sure can't spend my days lying down. That's

why I'm trying to nail down some info on hormones, esp

progesterone, since the new symptoms began during menopause.

Armed with the info, I have a better chance of getting a doctor

to listen. What I truly don't understand is that at 53 I'm

hobbling around like I'm 95 and all the docs do is shrug? Hand

me stockings I'm too stiff to put on, and tell me to have

someone put them on for me.... Are we supposed to lie down &

die once we hit 40 or 50? Well, heck, there are still things I

want to do. Not quite ready for a rocking chair in a corner

somewhere. LOL!

Judging from the reading list, esp the link to the Suzanne

Somers article, it seems that my sentiments above are not

unique. What is frustrating is the more I read the more I see

the costs of staying healthy escalating.

Thanks for listening,

Stef

[Guest guest]

The hobbling thing has got to go.  You can climb over this with information and determination.  This website might be a place to start your search.http://www.thyroid-info.com/chklst.htmA listing of doctors in Montanahttp://www.thyroid-info.com/topdrs/montana.htmFor a more radical approach there is http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/These gals are on a mission!   If you can't get thyroid they will help you. If you are low thyroid then your B-12 will likely be terrible.  His site addresses low b-12 http://www.johndommissemd.com/About the progesterone.  Are you thinking that progesterone will help with your legs?  It might for some, but in my experience... I needed thyroid and estrogen.  An appropriate balance of progesterone helps some women too.  Estrogen goes down with menopause as well as thyroid for many women.  Progesterone too, of course.  I'm making this point because there are so many sites selling progesterone cream as if it will fix all.  It doesn't.  Maybe for some, but I haven't known anyone personally that has had long term success with P cream without estrogen.  It depends on the woman.  I really needed the hormones.  It seems Charlotte is doing better with an approach that is more like a whisper (see her posts).  Charlotte and I have very different body types.  I need lots of estrogen and progesterone is hard on me, but it might be that I've had too much progesterone all my life?   I want to stress that we aren't all exactly the same so it is important for you to develop skills to hear your body and how you respond.  And , it helps to gather a bigger picture of your hormone history.  Do you know if you felt better in the first two weeks of your cycles or the last two weeks?  If you don't want to spend a lot of money then you need to become knowledgeable.  There are ways to keep the costs down and get the vitality up.  But I remember a farmer (raised grass fed cattle in Texas) telling me that people used to spend much more of their income on food.  Now people spend less money on good food and more on healthcare.  It seems there isn't just one thing to do.  Getting well is a whole big lifestyle change - at least it was for me and anyone I know who is doing well.  Hang in there!  You can get well.  Laurel--- Laurel <laurelrhythmicliving> wrote:> > I haven't gone thru menopause, but what you are describing> reminds me > of post partum time for me when I had untreated hypo thyroid> disease, > low b12 (likely thyroid related deficiency) and b-6, low> estrogen, > low zinc, and erratic (high and low) adrenals.I fit the symptoms for the thyroid deficiency, too. Thethinning hair is the most upsetting. I did get one doc to runthe test but she said I was normal and didn't do any furthertests. I have read that the standard test does not always showthe needed info. > Can you get your doctor to order blood tests for you or would> you > rather order on your own thru a place like lef.org? It would> be > helpful to get blood tests to start. Trying to find cooperative doctors is a challenge. More sohere, the eastern side of Montana is so sparsely populated thatalmost anything I was used to is tough to find here. My intention is to do as much research as I can and try to findsomeone willing to do the tests needed. I'll have to look atlef.org, maybe I can work something out there. I would preferto get this done so my insurance will cover since $$$ arepretty tight. I've probably had the thyroid thing since my 20s, that's whenmy hair began to thin. Never could get much help for it fromthe mainstream docs. My focus now is on this edema, I can'twalk or sit, and sure can't spend my days lying down. That'swhy I'm trying to nail down some info on hormones, espprogesterone, since the new symptoms began during menopause.Armed with the info, I have a better chance of getting a doctorto listen. What I truly don't understand is that at 53 I'mhobbling around like I'm 95 and all the docs do is shrug? Handme stockings I'm too stiff to put on, and tell me to havesomeone put them on for me.... Are we supposed to lie down & die once we hit 40 or 50? Well, heck, there are still things Iwant to do. Not quite ready for a rocking chair in a cornersomewhere. LOL!Judging from the reading list, esp the link to the SuzanneSomers article, it seems that my sentiments above are notunique. What is frustrating is the more I read the more I seethe costs of staying healthy escalating.Thanks for listening,Stef

[Guest guest]

-- Laurel wrote:

> The hobbling thing has got to go. You can climb over this

> with

> information and determination.

Thanks! I went for the thyroid test after reading about the

1953 " Simon " nuclear bomb test which caused a hot spot. Born

Dec '52 in Albany, I was 4 months old at the time, and who

knows if I was out in that rain.

quote:

One of the better known hot spots occurred in Albany, New York

after the " Simon " test in April, 1953. After a heavy rainstorm,

students in a college radiochemistry class noticed that their

Geiger counters were showing readings as high as 1,000 times

above normal.(8) Measurements taken of roofs, puddles,

buildings, and foliage around town showed similar elevated

readings. In a 1954 report, the AEC described this incident as

" an interesting example of a small area of very intense

fallout. " end quote.

Interesting, my foot. Never mind the rain, the milk and produce

were contaminated. These tests went on for years affecting

millions.

> About the progesterone. Are you thinking that progesterone

> will help

> with your legs?

Since this is recent and seemed to come & go with my cycle I'm

thinking it might be a player in this mess. Testing my theory

and seeing if there is a change will at least give me a clue.

What do the creams do?

I also see from the sites that the docs are endocrinologists,

why my doc didn't send me to one is beyond me. The ones

recommended on the sites are all at least 5-6 hours away. There

should be someone closer--it is not unusual to drive 100 mi to

the nearnest WallyMart. There is a clinic in town, about 30 mi.

I'll start there.

> And , it helps to gather a bigger picture of your hormone

> history.

> Do you know if you felt better in the first two weeks of your

> cycles

> or the last two weeks?

Hard to say, I never had much problem, got fed up with the pill

and had my tubes tied in my late 30s. If it wasn't for the

skipped periods I wouldn't have even know I was in menopause.

When the swelling first began my doc attributed it to overwork

and pre-existing conditions. I had been in an accident that

really mangles things up when I was 19. I went to have a vein

removed that they thought might be causing this last year but

it kept getting worse. Now here I am, and far away from a good

choice of doctors.

But I remember a farmer (raised grass fed

> cattle in

> Texas) telling me that people used to spend much more of

> their income

> on food. Now people spend less money on good food and more

> on

> healthcare.

> ---big lifestyle change

I (silly me) thought I was moving out to where they raise

all this wonderful grass fed beef. hehe, there are no

processors here, it's all shipped out. To get good meat you buy

a 1/4 or half from a rancher and if you don't have one or 2

freezers you're outta luck. Chicken arrives prepackaged and

frozen at the store. yuk. People who want good fresh chicken go

to one of the Hutterite colonies. One of the few specialty meat

shops 70mi away has some veal, $15 lb. Forget lamb, and fresh

produce unless you raise it or find someone who does. The

market has nothing but the very basics. Not one native here has

ever seen or tasted fresh ocean fish. You can't even get it

frozen.

So those of you back in civilization buy some swiss chard, kale

and all that is so good for you and be grateful you have it.

I'm fortunate to have been able to get a DSL line, and some

time to get the info I need. And that's a good thing.

Stef

[Guest guest]

-- Laurel wrote:

> The hobbling thing has got to go. You can climb over this

> with

> information and determination.

Thanks! I went for the thyroid test after reading about the

1953 " Simon " nuclear bomb test which caused a hot spot. Born

Dec '52 in Albany, I was 4 months old at the time, and who

knows if I was out in that rain.

quote:

One of the better known hot spots occurred in Albany, New York

after the " Simon " test in April, 1953. After a heavy rainstorm,

students in a college radiochemistry class noticed that their

Geiger counters were showing readings as high as 1,000 times

above normal.(8) Measurements taken of roofs, puddles,

buildings, and foliage around town showed similar elevated

readings. In a 1954 report, the AEC described this incident as

" an interesting example of a small area of very intense

fallout. " end quote.

Interesting, my foot. Never mind the rain, the milk and produce

were contaminated. These tests went on for years affecting

millions.

> About the progesterone. Are you thinking that progesterone

> will help

> with your legs?

Since this is recent and seemed to come & go with my cycle I'm

thinking it might be a player in this mess. Testing my theory

and seeing if there is a change will at least give me a clue.

What do the creams do?

I also see from the sites that the docs are endocrinologists,

why my doc didn't send me to one is beyond me. The ones

recommended on the sites are all at least 5-6 hours away. There

should be someone closer--it is not unusual to drive 100 mi to

the nearnest WallyMart. There is a clinic in town, about 30 mi.

I'll start there.

> And , it helps to gather a bigger picture of your hormone

> history.

> Do you know if you felt better in the first two weeks of your

> cycles

> or the last two weeks?

Hard to say, I never had much problem, got fed up with the pill

and had my tubes tied in my late 30s. If it wasn't for the

skipped periods I wouldn't have even know I was in menopause.

When the swelling first began my doc attributed it to overwork

and pre-existing conditions. I had been in an accident that

really mangles things up when I was 19. I went to have a vein

removed that they thought might be causing this last year but

it kept getting worse. Now here I am, and far away from a good

choice of doctors.

But I remember a farmer (raised grass fed

> cattle in

> Texas) telling me that people used to spend much more of

> their income

> on food. Now people spend less money on good food and more

> on

> healthcare.

> ---big lifestyle change

I (silly me) thought I was moving out to where they raise

all this wonderful grass fed beef. hehe, there are no

processors here, it's all shipped out. To get good meat you buy

a 1/4 or half from a rancher and if you don't have one or 2

freezers you're outta luck. Chicken arrives prepackaged and

frozen at the store. yuk. People who want good fresh chicken go

to one of the Hutterite colonies. One of the few specialty meat

shops 70mi away has some veal, $15 lb. Forget lamb, and fresh

produce unless you raise it or find someone who does. The

market has nothing but the very basics. Not one native here has

ever seen or tasted fresh ocean fish. You can't even get it

frozen.

So those of you back in civilization buy some swiss chard, kale

and all that is so good for you and be grateful you have it.

I'm fortunate to have been able to get a DSL line, and some

time to get the info I need. And that's a good thing.

Stef

[Guest guest]

Dr. Vliet said she mostly saw women with ultra low E during the luteal phase rather than high E and low P.  She is a blood testing manic (I know - I've paid for them at her Dallas office!!) and so when she says that she sees this I believe that she really is testing testing testing.  So Dr. Lee saw low P and too much E and Dr. Vliet saw low E and more P.  I was one of the ones that tested as menopausal levels of E and fertile myrtle levels of P.    In me low thyroid or low E (with too much P) makes my legs swell with edema.  E is the universal fixer for me, but I'm always trying to find other things that would support that.  It seems you'll need to figure what type you are.  Good luck in the good food challenge zone.  I headed to Port Townsend Washington.  Lots of great growers here.   Wild salmon down at the dock.  Laurel-- Laurel <laurelrhythmicliving> wrote:> The hobbling thing has got to go. You can climb over this> with > information and determination.Thanks! I went for the thyroid test after reading about the1953 "Simon" nuclear bomb test which caused a hot spot. BornDec '52 in Albany, I was 4 months old at the time, and whoknows if I was out in that rain. quote:One of the better known hot spots occurred in Albany, New Yorkafter the "Simon" test in April, 1953. After a heavy rainstorm,students in a college radiochemistry class noticed that theirGeiger counters were showing readings as high as 1,000 timesabove normal.(8) Measurements taken of roofs, puddles,buildings, and foliage around town showed similar elevatedreadings. In a 1954 report, the AEC described this incident as"an interesting example of a small area of very intensefallout." end quote.Interesting, my foot. Never mind the rain, the milk and producewere contaminated. These tests went on for years affectingmillions.> About the progesterone. Are you thinking that progesterone> will help > with your legs?Since this is recent and seemed to come & go with my cycle I'mthinking it might be a player in this mess. Testing my theoryand seeing if there is a change will at least give me a clue.What do the creams do?I also see from the sites that the docs are endocrinologists,why my doc didn't send me to one is beyond me. The onesrecommended on the sites are all at least 5-6 hours away. Thereshould be someone closer--it is not unusual to drive 100 mi tothe nearnest WallyMart. There is a clinic in town, about 30 mi.I'll start there.> And , it helps to gather a bigger picture of your hormone> history. > Do you know if you felt better in the first two weeks of your> cycles . 

[Guest guest]

Dr. Vliet said she mostly saw women with ultra low E during the luteal phase rather than high E and low P.  She is a blood testing manic (I know - I've paid for them at her Dallas office!!) and so when she says that she sees this I believe that she really is testing testing testing.  So Dr. Lee saw low P and too much E and Dr. Vliet saw low E and more P.  I was one of the ones that tested as menopausal levels of E and fertile myrtle levels of P.    In me low thyroid or low E (with too much P) makes my legs swell with edema.  E is the universal fixer for me, but I'm always trying to find other things that would support that.  It seems you'll need to figure what type you are.  Good luck in the good food challenge zone.  I headed to Port Townsend Washington.  Lots of great growers here.   Wild salmon down at the dock.  Laurel-- Laurel <laurelrhythmicliving> wrote:> The hobbling thing has got to go. You can climb over this> with > information and determination.Thanks! I went for the thyroid test after reading about the1953 "Simon" nuclear bomb test which caused a hot spot. BornDec '52 in Albany, I was 4 months old at the time, and whoknows if I was out in that rain. quote:One of the better known hot spots occurred in Albany, New Yorkafter the "Simon" test in April, 1953. After a heavy rainstorm,students in a college radiochemistry class noticed that theirGeiger counters were showing readings as high as 1,000 timesabove normal.(8) Measurements taken of roofs, puddles,buildings, and foliage around town showed similar elevatedreadings. In a 1954 report, the AEC described this incident as"an interesting example of a small area of very intensefallout." end quote.Interesting, my foot. Never mind the rain, the milk and producewere contaminated. These tests went on for years affectingmillions.> About the progesterone. Are you thinking that progesterone> will help > with your legs?Since this is recent and seemed to come & go with my cycle I'mthinking it might be a player in this mess. Testing my theoryand seeing if there is a change will at least give me a clue.What do the creams do?I also see from the sites that the docs are endocrinologists,why my doc didn't send me to one is beyond me. The onesrecommended on the sites are all at least 5-6 hours away. Thereshould be someone closer--it is not unusual to drive 100 mi tothe nearnest WallyMart. There is a clinic in town, about 30 mi.I'll start there.> And , it helps to gather a bigger picture of your hormone> history. > Do you know if you felt better in the first two weeks of your> cycles . 

[Guest guest]

--- Laurel wrote:

>

> In me low thyroid or low E (with too much P) makes my legs

> swell with

> edema. E is the universal fixer for me, but I'm always

> trying to

> find other things that would support that.

>

> It seems you'll need to figure what type you are.

That does sound like me. I've made a bit progress, I found a

doc on the Armourthyroid site that is about 70 mi away. That's

doable. He's a gynocologist so I hope he'll address the other

concerns. I don't see why not.

> Good luck in the good food challenge zone. I headed to Port

> Townsend

> Washington. Lots of great growers here. Wild salmon down

> at the dock.

You have the population to support it. Traditional retail

distribution methods don't work here. Trade off for country

living.

Stef