Feelings but not thoughts

[Guest guest]

I'm wondering how I can deal with feelings that are not directly

connected to thoughts. That is, I feel the feeling of fear but I

haven't thought any fearful thoughts, at least not yet. I know we are

supposed to accept our feelings but that's hard to do when all I feel

is fear at that moment. This happens to me every morning before I

even get out of bed and it's a heck of a way to start the day.

Of course, then comes the problem of fearing the fear, or fearing the

morning for the fearful feelings.

Do you find that accepting the feeling is helpful? I do still go on

with my day, I'm going towards what I think is important, such as

getting to work. But it's such a struggle. I know my struggle switch

is on but when I wake up with it on, it's hard to deal with.

Thanks,

Bruce

[Guest guest]

Bruce

thank you for your post. I struggle with exactly with the same thing. The fear and anxiety is there even before I get out of bed and even before I seem to have thoughts--I have been struggling with this for quite a while now. I do my best to be mindful and accept the feelings and get on with my day but like you said it is very difficult to fully accept and be mindful of the fear and anxiety. I also am looking for some advise from some one who has been able to work through this successfully

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Subject: Feelings but not thoughtsTo: ACT_for_the_Public Date: Wednesday, November 4, 2037, 10:52 AM

I'm wondering how I can deal with feelings that are not directly connected to thoughts. That is, I feel the feeling of fear but I haven't thought any fearful thoughts, at least not yet. I know we are supposed to accept our feelings but that's hard to do when all I feel is fear at that moment. This happens to me every morning before I even get out of bed and it's a heck of a way to start the day.Of course, then comes the problem of fearing the fear, or fearing the morning for the fearful feelings.Do you find that accepting the feeling is helpful? I do still go on with my day, I'm going towards what I think is important, such as getting to work. But it's such a struggle. I know my struggle switch is on but when I wake up with it on, it's hard to deal with.Thanks,Bruce

[Guest guest]

billboy can you talk some more about not clinging

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From: Bruce Carlson <onebnzcomcast (DOT) net>Subject: [ACT_for_the_ Public] Feelings but not thoughtsTo: ACT_for_the_ Public@yahoogrou ps.comDate: Wednesday, November 4, 2037, 10:52 AM

I'm wondering how I can deal with feelings that are not directly connected to thoughts. That is, I feel the feeling of fear but I haven't thought any fearful thoughts, at least not yet. I know we are supposed to accept our feelings but that's hard to do when all I feel is fear at that moment. This happens to me every morning before I even get out of bed and it's a heck of a way to start the day.Of course, then comes the problem of fearing the fear, or fearing the morning for the fearful feelings.Do you find that accepting the feeling is helpful? I do still go on with my day, I'm going towards what I think is important, such as getting to work. But it's such a struggle. I know my struggle switch is on but when I wake up with it on, it's hard to deal with.Thanks,Bruce

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[Guest guest]

>

> I'm wondering how I can deal with feelings that are not directly

> connected to thoughts. That is, I feel the feeling of fear but I

> haven't thought any fearful thoughts, at least not yet. I know we are

> supposed to accept our feelings but that's hard to do when all I feel

> is fear at that moment. This happens to me every morning before I

> even get out of bed and it's a heck of a way to start the day.

Bruce,

I used to suffer from major panic attacks, that would appear out of no

where. They would leave me shaking and drenched in sweat. I was able

to make it a non-issue by realizing the following.

As the fear and panic starts, any attempt in my mind to run from it,

make it go away, or to have thoughts about it made it worse. To think

such thoughts as " this is terrible, am I going to die, am I losing

control, etc, etc " would only make it worse. I learned to place my

attention on the body sensations so intently that I would

just stop thinking about it. I would just feel the sensations.

After doing the above a few times, I realized that although the

physical sensations were very, very intense, they were not painful and

there was nothing to be afraid about, and they would die out after awhile.

Now you say " feelings of fear. " From my own experience, I would say

the feelings are there, to be sure, but your thoughts are labeling it

as fear, which then in turn, causes your body to react with more

feeling, which then your thoughts label as more fear, and so it goes

down hill from there. The trick is to learn not to think at all, just

feel. If you do not entertain thoughts when its happening, then you

are not adding fuel to the fire, and it will disapate from there.

The general assumption is that we protect ourselves in such situations

by retreating into thought. And I am saying that retreating into

thought at such times, makes it worse, makes it a living hell.

You don't need to wait until the next episode happens to practice

this. The next time you get an itch, just stop, feel it completely,

don't think about how bad it is, how you want to scratch it. Just

feel it. It might get very intense, but its no big deal, and it will

die out after awhile.

Also, IMHO, all meditation traditions are exercises in stopping thought.

Hope this helps.

Greg , CCHt.

http://www.SanDiegoHypnosisClinic.com

[Guest guest]

how do you not scratch when you are itching very badly practically 24/7? this is what i need to learn to do. im usually successful at combating my panic in a similar fashion as you described, but i've been in this bout of unrelenting anxiety/anticipatory anxiety that i find it very hard to know what to do. any suggestions would be greatly appreciated Subject: Re: Feelings but not thoughtsTo: ACT_for_the_Public Date: Saturday, November 8, 2008, 10:12 PM

>

> I'm wondering how I can deal with feelings that are not directly

> connected to thoughts. That is, I feel the feeling of fear but I

> haven't thought any fearful thoughts, at least not yet. I know we are

> supposed to accept our feelings but that's hard to do when all I feel

> is fear at that moment. This happens to me every morning before I

> even get out of bed and it's a heck of a way to start the day.

Bruce,

I used to suffer from major panic attacks, that would appear out of no

where. They would leave me shaking and drenched in sweat. I was able

to make it a non-issue by realizing the following.

As the fear and panic starts, any attempt in my mind to run from it,

make it go away, or to have thoughts about it made it worse. To think

such thoughts as "this is terrible, am I going to die, am I losing

control, etc, etc" would only make it worse. I learned to place my

attention on the body sensations so intently that I would

just stop thinking about it. I would just feel the sensations.

After doing the above a few times, I realized that although the

physical sensations were very, very intense, they were not painful and

there was nothing to be afraid about, and they would die out after awhile.

Now you say "feelings of fear." From my own experience, I would say

the feelings are there, to be sure, but your thoughts are labeling it

as fear, which then in turn, causes your body to react with more

feeling, which then your thoughts label as more fear, and so it goes

down hill from there. The trick is to learn not to think at all, just

feel. If you do not entertain thoughts when its happening, then you

are not adding fuel to the fire, and it will disapate from there.

The general assumption is that we protect ourselves in such situations

by retreating into thought. And I am saying that retreating into

thought at such times, makes it worse, makes it a living hell.

You don't need to wait until the next episode happens to practice

this. The next time you get an itch, just stop, feel it completely,

don't think about how bad it is, how you want to scratch it. Just

feel it. It might get very intense, but its no big deal, and it will

die out after awhile.

Also, IMHO, all meditation traditions are exercises in stopping thought.

Hope this helps.

Greg , CCHt.

http://www.SanDiego HypnosisClinic. com

[Guest guest]

>

> how do you not scratch when you are itching very badly practically

24/7? this is what i need to learn to do. im usually successful at

combating my panic in a similar fashion as you described, but i've

been in this bout of unrelenting anxiety/anticipatory anxiety that i

find it very hard to know what to do. any suggestions would be greatly

appreciated

russ,

The conditions you describe both can have a medical cause, so what I

am about to write in no way suggests that you should not seek medical

attention and I will assume that you have done so already, to rule out

a medical cause.

We all, always, are using words to describe reality to ourselves. And

we take our verbal descriptions of reality to be truth and then react

to that verbal description instead of reacting to reality.

This accounts for how it is possible for many people to give different

descriptions of the same event. It also accounts for how it is

possible for someone to under go major dental work with no anesthesia

- just reacting to their verbal descriptions of peace and comfort.

Now, if you were in front of me in my office I would ask questions of

you designed to illicit the differences for you between reality and

your descriptions of it in a manner that is much more sensitive than I

can get across by writing in a message. So please know that what I am

about to ask and suggest is done with the utmost consideration for you.

You say you are itching badly practically 24/7. Is this really true?

For if it were true, how then do you sleep? I am suggesting by this

that your distress is a reaction to your description of what's going

on rather than to what is actually happening. I would also ask if the

itching is happening to every single square inch of your body? Is

there no area of your body where there is no itching? I would have

you focus your mind more and more on those times and places where

there is no itching.

Secondly, you say that you have unrelenting anxiety/anticipatory

anxiety. Is this really true? And again, if it were true how do you

sleep? And if it were unrelenting, then how do you know it at all?

The only way a fish can know he is in water, is if he knows what its

like to be out of water. So, the only way for you to know unrelenting

anxiety/anticipatory anxiety is to also know the opposite of that.

Focus on those times when you do not feel anxiety.

Many, many moons ago I wrote in this group about the benefits of

reading and applying the lessons in the book, " The Open-Focus Brain "

by Les Fehmi. Search the archives to see what was written. This

books explains how you keep your self in these states, and how to

release yourself and is a wonderful adjunct to ACT.

For what it is worth, you have achieved something which many people in

the personal change work professions want. And that is state control.

Given that most want to control states other than unrelenting anxiety

or itching, once you learn how to release yourself from this, you

probably could make a mint teaching people how to do state control,

but with positive states.

Hope this helps.

Greg , CCHt.

http://www.SanDiegoHypnosisClinic.com