Re: Re: my newest low dose E experiment-- G.

[Guest guest]

Hi Kathy. You are correct that 1ml or 10 lines on the 3cc syringe represents 3mg. I know that the prescription reads 3% sorry for the confusion. The P is in 1cc syringes and is at 25mg per 1 full line. On the 1cc syringe it is easy to cut 1 line in half so I can divide the 1 line in half if need be. I am applying to thin skin only. Inside arm from wrist to forearm only and wrist for the P. I will also apply to my upper chest area and neck area. I am avoiding my inner thighs as I feel that they have been over saturated after several months on the WP. I am not 100% yet but feeling more like myself every day. Started WP in 8/04 and let's just say it was a very long winter. I hope this helps in some way................. G Kathy wrote:

**I meant to type Bi-est not tri-est below.> Hi G:> > G: "I have the cream concentrated at 3% so you need to use more> cream. For me a straight 10% cream (which is what we have all been> using) zooms in and out too quickly." > > ---The Wiley Protocol E cream we are/were using is a 1% cream, i.e. 10> mg per 10 lines/1 ml. I guess your cream is .3% cream? (i.e. 3 mg per> 1 ml)> > The P cream was 25% cream, a whopping 250 mg per ml. Just the> mathmatician in me...LOL> > Thanks for the info re reverse **tri-est option.> > So you feel that using more cream, .5 ml, giving you 1.5 mg Estradiol,> delays the absorption of the E? Whereas, we were using a

dab of cream> .1 ml for 1 mg of E.> > I would be interested in learning where you are applying your E and> your P for that matter. > > Thanks.> > Be well.> > Kathy> Long Island> > > >By concentrating it down I use 1/2 ml on a 3cc syringe versus 1 of> the smaller lines. 1/2 ml equates to 5 lines instead of 1. Each 5> lines gives me 1.2 of Estradiol and 0.3 of estriol. It has made a big> difference in that I feel steady all day. I hope I am making sense> here!!! I am finding a comfort zone somewhere between 1/2 ml and 1ml> bid Again this equates to 1.2 to 2.4 of Estradiol bid. I am also> finding now that my body is requiring daily> > anywhere from 12 to 25 mg of P bid. Hope this is helps in some> way.................. G>

>click here for our webpage http://rhythmicliving.com/**The group conversation is informational in nature and is not intended as medical advice.** __________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

It is a very fine line and a difficult one to find. I had completely backed off of the P about 1 solid month ago. Since January I had been pulling back some on it. I was as high as double E to try and tolerate the P. I had gained a good solid 25 lbs. What made me begin to notice that it was too much E was when I would appply my nightime dose. I would get wired. This was when the light bulb went off in my head that it was too much E as well. When I started the WP my very first month I had difficulty making the move from 4mg to 6 mg. When I hit the 6 mg I was wired. I started the WP in 8/04 and remained on it for several months. It was this month that I noticed without the use of any P at all I felt like I required more E. The strange thing was when I added more E I would not feel well. I would then add 25 mg of P and would feel much better and could reduce my E. It's as if the small

amount of P balances the E it would also help with the water retention. I had spoken yesterday with my compounder to discuss this latest discovery. He is of the belief that women make small amounts of P every day although the P is more dominant in the second half of the cycle we do make some on days 1-14. So I am trying to find a comfort zone. It looks to be any where from 1-2 mg of E with 25mg of P, both hormones bid. Do you think the linea negra could come from unopposed E??? Has anyone heard of that?? I had brown shading all over my face and neck area. It seems to be subsiding now. Hope this helps in some way. G Lynn Razaitis wrote:

Hi ,So do you think you're not holding P anymore???? I sure would like toknow why we're all so different...muscle type, fat type, metabolismgenetics, what the heck is it....?????For me I can't tell with the E right now. Feels like I could beneeding way less E and am holding water when I up it now. But I'vestill got linea negra and black outlined nipples. Plus if I let the Ego too low my breasts start hurting. Feel like I'm getting like Madeleen...it's this very fine line.Lynn> > Hi G:> > > > G: "I have the cream concentrated at 3% so you need to use more> > cream. For me a straight 10% cream (which is what we have all been> > using) zooms in

and out too quickly." > > > > ---The Wiley Protocol E cream we are/were using is a 1% cream, i.e. 10> > mg per 10 lines/1 ml. I guess your cream is .3% cream? (i.e. 3 mg per> > 1 ml)> > > > The P cream was 25% cream, a whopping 250 mg per ml. Just the> > mathmatician in me...LOL> > > > Thanks for the info re reverse **tri-est option.> > > > So you feel that using more cream, .5 ml, giving you 1.5 mg Estradiol,> > delays the absorption of the E? Whereas, we were using a dab of cream> > .1 ml for 1 mg of E.> > > > I would be interested in learning where you are applying your E and> > your P for that matter. > > > > Thanks.> > > > Be well.> > > > Kathy> > Long Island> > > > > > >By concentrating it down

I use 1/2 ml on a 3cc syringe versus 1 of> > the smaller lines. 1/2 ml equates to 5 lines instead of 1. Each 5> > lines gives me 1.2 of Estradiol and 0.3 of estriol. It has made a big> > difference in that I feel steady all day. I hope I am making sense> > here!!! I am finding a comfort zone somewhere between 1/2 ml and 1ml> > bid Again this equates to 1.2 to 2.4 of Estradiol bid. I am also> > finding now that my body is requiring daily> > > anywhere from 12 to 25 mg of P bid. Hope this is helps in some> > way.................. G> > >> > > > > click here for our webpage http://rhythmicliving.com/> > **The group conversation is informational in nature and is notintended as medical advice.** > > > >

--------------------------------->

[Guest guest]

Humm. Now that I think back when I was on a very low dosed sublingual tablet and taking no P at all I had some brown shading. Not as pronounced as when on the WP but there none the less. As I have no organs at that time I was on E only. Actually stayed on E only for several years. Here's the kicker, about 1 year to 2 years after my hyster I was never able to find a right dose of E. Went from sublingual biest, to transermal biest to transdermal triest. It was like the new dose would work for a while and then it would not work any more. Maybe, just maybe I need that little bit of P for the E to work. Also since adding the P the very pronounced dermatitis on my hand is gone. Again keep in mind I'm talking like 2mg of E with 25mg of P. Just an observation I'm throwing out. I wonder if there are any research studied that might validate this???? G astrodiana

wrote:

Do you think the linea negra could come from unopposed E??? Has anyone heard of that?? I had brown shading all over my face and neck area. It seems to be subsiding now. Hope this helps in some way. G I have also wondered if the discoloration of various places and the brown nipples could be high amounts of E....because this is when it happened to me...my breasts were huge and nipples were twice their size and brown this happned during the high E phase of my first month of WP...if I spread my legs, that whole area (not usually visible) front front to back, was brown rather than pink. I know I used to get the melasma (or whatever the dark discoloration is when it appears on your face - pregnancy mask) on

the BC pill...but I never had any of these things while pregnant. Because it happened to me during the E only phase, I wondered.click here for our webpage http://rhythmicliving.com/**The group conversation is informational in nature and is not intended as medical advice.**

Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football

[Guest guest]

I have also wondered if the discoloration of various places and the brown nipples could be high amounts of E....

I hope this is true, I'm off P for 5 weeks, still stripped, but on much less E, afraid to add any P for awhile yet.....

[Guest guest]

I believe that Uzzi never likes to give unopposed estrogen. Perhaps this is why. I did however use a triest transdmermal that was compounded per his specifications in his book. Although at the time I was not using P I think the amount of E2 in his formulation was too low for me. It was then I tried to add P ended up gaining weight so backed off the P. Can't remember what the transdermal P dose was though. Should have kept better notes. Who would have thought. At any rate I am thinking of having my compounder make up a 5% P cream. This would allow an easy application of 5-25mg. Maybe use 10 bid daily and then for 14 days use 25mg bid. Don't know yet. Still trying to feel my way. A wrong tweak in either direction is enough to completely through us off. Then it's a guessing game as to too much E not enough P or too much P and not enough E. The symptoms from both are at time

similar. Thanks for your input................. Gastrodiana wrote:

Actually stayed on E only for several years. Here's the kicker, about 1 year to 2 years after my hyster I was never able to find a right dose of E. Went from sublingual biest, to transermal biest to transdermal triest. It was like the new dose would work for a while and then it would not work any more. Maybe, just maybe I need that little bit of P for the E to work. Also since adding the P the very pronounced dermatitis on my hand is gone. Again keep in mind I'm talking like 2mg of E with 25mg of P. Just an observation I'm throwing out. I wonder if there are any research studied that might validate this???? G > > I believe women need a certain amount of P, whether natural or

supplemented to create E receptors - now, I am not sure what I "know" to be fact or "believe" to be true, or where to draw the line anymore!...but I think when you become deficient in P you do need a certain amount of it so your E is not un-opposed. I think Dr. Lee and Uzzi have both stated this.click here for our webpage http://rhythmicliving.com/**The group conversation is informational in nature and is not intended as medical advice.** __________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

That would explain my erratic endocrine functions as well as flair up of dermatitis when I do not use P............ Gastrodiana wrote:

but I think when you become deficient in P you do need a > certain amount of it so your E is not un-opposed. I think Dr. Lee and > Uzzi have both stated this.I wanted to add that unopposed E is not usable and so it just sits there and causes symptoms we don't want.click here for our webpage http://rhythmicliving.com/**The group conversation is informational in nature and is not intended as medical advice.**

Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football

[Guest guest]

This may sort of fit in with this conversation, and I've been meaning

to get it out there.

Just before menopause I got skin problems around my nose-sort of like

acne but w/scales. I have

never had skin problems in my life. So, imbalance of my hormones

caused it.(which ones?) Now, with

BHRT it seems that during the first part of my cycle, the E phase,

this skin problem shows up (on a very small scale),

and after P is added, it clears up!

marty

>

> Actually stayed on E only for several years.  Here's the kicker, about

> 1 year to 2 years after my hyster I was never able to find a right dose

> of E.  Went from sublingual biest, to transermal biest to transdermal

> triest.  It was like the new dose would work for a while and then it

> would not work any more.  Maybe, just maybe I need that little bit of P

> for the E to work. Also since adding the P the very pronounced

> dermatitis on my hand is gone. Again keep in mind I'm talking like 2mg

> of E with 25mg of P.  Just an observation I'm throwing out.  I wonder

> if there are any research studied that might validate this????  

> G

> >

> >

> I believe women need a certain amount of P, whether natural or

> supplemented to create E receptors - now, I am not sure what I " know "  

> to be fact or " believe " to be true, or where to draw the line

> anymore!...but I think when you become deficient in P you do need a

> certain amount of it so your E is not un-opposed. I think Dr. Lee and

> Uzzi have both stated this.

>

>

>

>

>

>

> click here for our webpage http://rhythmicliving.com/

>

> **The group conversation is informational in nature and is not

> intended as medical advice.**

>

>

<image.tiff>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Just like the rash on the top part of my hand. E only major bumps and itching add the P and it goes away. There is a definant connection here somewhere. I thing we are getting close.

Gmarty wrote:

This may sort of fit in with this conversation, and I've been meaning to get it out there.Just before menopause I got skin problems around my nose-sort of like acne but w/scales. I havenever had skin problems in my life. So, imbalance of my hormones caused it.(which ones?) Now, withBHRT it seems that during the first part of my cycle, the E phase, this skin problem shows up (on a very small scale),and after P is added, it clears up!marty> > Actually stayed on E only for several years. Here's the kicker, about> 1 year to 2 years after my hyster I was never able to find a right dose> of E. Went from sublingual biest, to transermal biest to transdermal>

triest. It was like the new dose would work for a while and then it> would not work any more. Maybe, just maybe I need that little bit of P> for the E to work. Also since adding the P the very pronounced> dermatitis on my hand is gone. Again keep in mind I'm talking like 2mg> of E with 25mg of P. Just an observation I'm throwing out. I wonder> if there are any research studied that might validate this???? > G> >> >> I believe women need a certain amount of P, whether natural or> supplemented to create E receptors - now, I am not sure what I "know" > to be fact or "believe" to be true, or where to draw the line> anymore!...but I think when you become deficient in P you do need a> certain amount of it so your E is not un-opposed. I think Dr. Lee and> Uzzi have both stated this.>>

>>>>> click here for our webpage http://rhythmicliving.com/>> **The group conversation is informational in nature and is not > intended as medical advice.**>>>>

[Guest guest]

Hi . My compounder makes his own base which is safe for vaginal use as well. He does not use the standard PCCA base cream. I think for me too much unopposed E makes my cortisol whacky and then it causes me to have dermatitis. Just a theory mind you... G wrote:

Re Dermatitis: I was under the impression that the dermatitis was caused by the bad ingredients in the PCCA cream. ??? --------------------------------------------------------> That would explain my erratic endocrine functions as well as flair up of dermatitis when I do not use P............ Gclick here for our webpage http://rhythmicliving.com/**The group conversation is informational in nature and is not intended as medical advice.** __________________________________________________