Update

[Guest guest]

Hi all,

I just got back from a three day trip to go to the SF Landscape show and

also I saw the dentist I had chosen to do the almalgam replacement.....and

even though I am sure I asked this question of the receptionist when

scheduling my appointment....this dentist does not have an alternative air

source available during the drilling.....is open to my providing such a

thing....doesn't even provide protection for herself......and I have appts

scheduled out every 3 weeks for 9 wks in advance (to coordinate with

another dr. that I'll be getting an IV of Vit C from........

I went ahead and let them take X-rays.....saying I would research the

question.....What types of alternative air apparatus have others seen.

I m almost thinking that I should change dentists.....what do you think?

I hate to be a guinea pig.

also saw the myo-pain therapist again (this is about visit 5, about two

weeks apart)

and I think he is really helping my pain levels in my body.....it is

changing....I have less pain in the facia layer.....that kind that locks

you up from moving.....still have the deeper kind....and having more

trouble with my back since being more active.

also saw a dr. who specializes in Fibro....and while I don't know whether

to trust him or not, yet.....he seemed to have a lot of experience with

both almalgam removal and with different techniques in reference to FMS.

very opinionated about different peoples work or opinions....but he's done

this for a long time.

he did give me a urine challenge test for mercury and while Im unsure about

believing that this is a good idea before almalgam removal, I am very

interested to find out what the numbers are.

I m just glad that I am moving in directions that hopefully will lead to

significant improvements.

This syndrome is so difficult because there are so many puzzle pieces and

everyone seems to have differing opinions.

love, jaen

Jaen Treesinger

Bengals from the RainForest

........amazingly smart, incredibly fast and just gorgeous!

Check out new pictures on our website at: http://www.bengal-cat.com

[Guest guest]

Jaen-

>What types of alternative air apparatus have others seen.

my dentist has a suction device to take out the bad air and an oxygen mask

for himeself, the assistant, and me. I still had a bad reaction when he

took one big honker of an amalgam out last week.

>I m almost thinking that I should change dentists.....what do you think?

Yes, definitely. This is not a job for amateurs.

Your fibro doctor sounds like mine. I have some reservations. Can you

email me privately and we can discuss?

Roseanna

roastzanna@...

_________________________________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

I fell into the 60s drug culture, first self medication and

later prescription (legal) instead of learning to manage my

personality type in other ways.

Why does a Type-A have to manage a personality???? I was a type-A also, and that used to be a good thing, we were the people who got stuff done. Now they label it a mental illness to be medicated. I'm still a Type-A for the four good hours a day that I have. LOL

Blind Reason

a novel of espionage and pharmaceutical intrigue

Think your antidepressant is safe? Think again.

[Guest guest]

Yargh, Terry!!! Jealous as h*ll over your ability to sleep. I'm still

fighting that war! God for you. I think as you heal your emotions

will come back. hang in there. janet

[Guest guest]

> Yargh, Terry!!! Jealous as h*ll over your ability to sleep. I'm

still

> fighting that war! God for you. I think as you heal your emotions

> will come back. hang in there. janet

Janet...yeah, I thought twice about not putting that in there b/c I

know sleep is a BIG DEAL to most everyone here and it has been for me

for YEARS. But, it is nice even though I have reservations about how

long it will really last. It is a brutal war............

Terry

[Guest guest]

Terry, hang in there, it will get better. You said 'if you get your

feelings back, you don't want the anxiety, too' You will get the

feelings back, no doubt about that, takes time to allow your brain to

heal.... if and when you get an anxiety, let us know, there are

things you can do to help with this, just have faith that you will

get better. Ten years is a very long time to have abused your body,

give it time..... each time you feel lousy, just repeat - - -it is

the drugs - - - you will make it hugs

> Here is an update on my withdrawal from the 25 or so drugs I have

> been taking over 10 years (last being trazedone and lorazepam). I

> went off cold turkey over Xmas and had horrible headaches and

> vomiting. Per advice, I went back on for one day (25 mg traz, I

had

> already weaned down to this over the last year). Then dropped back

> off again. This was just over 2 weeks ago.

>

> Negatives now: Brain drain is horrible. NO FEELINGS whatsoever.

No

> feelings of happy, sad, compassion, NOTHING. It is really WEIRD. I

> am doing things b/c I know they need to be done. Attenion span is

> really bad (nothing after noon) and fatigue is bad.

>

> Positives: I AM SLEEPING!!! HOORAY HOORAY HOORAY HOORAY!!!!!!!

For

> the first time since going on these drugs. I am just totally

> enjoying this and am terrified if I start taking these again, I

will

> stop. By sleeping I mean that I fall asleep withing 30 minutes and

> wake anywhere from 3 to 6 times a night. The difference is that I

> now fall BACK asleep instead of being up all night. I attribute

this

> to NO FEELINGS and NO ANXIETY to keep me awake. I am loving the NO

> ANXIETY part. But, I do eventually want to be able to laugh at a

> joke again or something. If I get my feelings back, I dont' want

the

> anxiety back. This is what caused a lot of my problems to start

with.

>

> I still have not gotten the total body stuff in the mail. I am

going

> to try it for 30 days.

> Terry

[Guest guest]

> Terry, hang in there, it will get better. You said 'if you get your

> feelings back, you don't want the anxiety, too' You will get the

> feelings back, no doubt about that, takes time to allow your brain

to

> heal.... if and when you get an anxiety, let us know, there are

> things you can do to help with this, just have faith that you will

> get better. Ten years is a very long time to have abused your body,

> give it time..... each time you feel lousy, just repeat - - -it is

> the drugs - - - you will make it hugs

Thanks ...and I DO plan to search out something for the anxiety

if it comes back that is NOT a prescription drug. The SAD THING is

that I never EVER EVER had severe anxiety attacks BEFORE the drugs.

I am a very wired and hyper person and a type A since birth (in the

womb). I fell into the 60s drug culture, first self medication and

later prescription (legal) instead of learning to manage my

personality type in other ways.

I am NOT going to become a doped up brainwashed senior citizen. In

some ways I am enjoying the new laid back tired me. I have never

before been able to " stop and smell the roses " b/c I had to GO!!! I

guess this is one " good? " thing about brain drain. Now I AM nuts!!!!

Terry

[Guest guest]

I used to be very creative and spontaneous (a

free spirit) before all the drugs. I didn't go into it above, but I

was always told I was "too hyper" or "too loud" or too this or too

that. I had a lot of fun.

Oh, boy. Here comes my rant. The shrink who put me on Paxil insisted that I had been manic my entire life, and it was obvious by the kind of life I led. For two years I was bi-coastal, flying between my home in NY and apartment in LA twice a month, working 70 hours a week producing videos, riding my bike a hundred miles a week at the beach. In my particular circle of friends, this was just NORMAL! But this g.d. psychiatric nurse said to me one day, "That's mania. You should be on Lithium. Normal people don't do the things you describe." To which I screamed at her, "I'm NOT a normal person. I'm a high achiever. I love what I do. Are you telling me that when Spielberg works 80 hours a week on a movie that he's really MANIC?" I was so livid. Here was this totally ORDINARY person, with no insight into working on projects that cost thousand of dollars A MINUTE with very tight deadlines, telling me that I was mentally ill because I could actually MEET those deadlines, no matter what!!! That whole scenario was what was really insane. How else do things get done if not by people like ME???? And you??? And God forbid you should actually LOVE what you do -- that's a mental illness as well. The same person told me that my enthusiasm for my career was not normal or healthy. Who the hell ARE these people????? LOL

Blind Reason

a novel of espionage and pharmaceutical intrigue

Think your antidepressant is safe? Think again.

[Guest guest]

, you wrote:

>

> ** I'm sorry this is so difficult. Heartache and I are old

friends so

> I know what you're saying.

>

>

> Would you want to consider a Bach Essence for this (the

> anxiety/relationship issue)? Have you taken any Aconitum?

>

>

I said before i didn't wanna take anything, but now its getting

rediculous, im so obsessed about this one thing, that i couldn't

get to sleep last nite until 4:00 AM and then i woke at 9:00 AM. I

can feel my heart beating heavily and i hate this feeling. Im bound

to see the person once in awhile now that school has started. I

don't know how im gonna deal with this. I try to control my

thoughts and put them on other things, but if I see this girl or

talk to her it seems to disrupt my life for a few days. I was

wondering about some of those things the Bach Essence or possiblly

Inosital. I would take the dull drowsiness of prozac over this any

day. thanks joe.

-joe

[Guest guest]

> In a message dated 1/12/04 11:30:57 AM Mountain Standard Time,

> TWSno@c... writes:

>

>

> > I fell into the 60s drug culture, first self medication and

> > later prescription (legal) instead of learning to manage my

> > personality type in other ways.

> >

> >

>

> Why does a Type-A have to manage a personality???? I was a type-A

also, and

> that used to be a good thing, we were the people who got stuff

done. Now they

> label it a mental illness to be medicated. I'm still a Type-A for

the four

> good hours a day that I have. LOL

Yes, Exactly my point. I used to be very creative and spontaneous (a

free spirit) before all the drugs. I didn't go into it above, but I

was always told I was " too hyper " or " too loud " or too this or too

that. I had a lot of fun. Well, now I am now a nice compliant one

track mind with no feelings who sits most of the day.

I do belive that they are medicating some people who WOULD have

invented some things that would make our lives better. Once

medicated, creativity is gone gone gone.

Terry

[Guest guest]

Hi Terry,

<<Here is an update on my withdrawal from the 25 or so drugs I have

been taking over 10 years (last being trazedone and lorazepam). I

went off cold turkey over Xmas and had horrible headaches and

vomiting. Per advice, I went back on for one day (25 mg traz, I had

already weaned down to this over the last year). Then dropped back

off again. This was just over 2 weeks ago. >>

***What made you to decide to drop the trazodone

again after going back on it for one day? My experience

has been that cold turkey is much harder to recover from

than a gradual withdrawal. I hate to see anyone suffer more

than they have to suffer.

<<Negatives now: Brain drain is horrible. NO FEELINGS whatsoever. No

feelings of happy, sad, compassion, NOTHING. It is really WEIRD. I

am doing things b/c I know they need to be done. Attenion span is

really bad (nothing after noon) and fatigue is bad.>>

***These are all totally normal symptoms of withdrawal.

I am sorry the drugs have put you through this. My experience

has been that all of these symptoms improve over time. It

takes different amounts of time for different people, but for

everyone, this process is an exercise in patience.

It sounds like you are doing really well at keeping things

in perspective and keeping yourself going. You are to

be congratulated for remaining so matter-of-fact in the face

of these symptoms. This attitude will take you a long,

long way!

<<Positives: I AM SLEEPING!!! HOORAY HOORAY

HOORAY HOORAY!!!!!!! For

the first time since going on these drugs. I am just totally

enjoying this and am terrified if I start taking these again, I will

stop. By sleeping I mean that I fall asleep withing 30 minutes and

wake anywhere from 3 to 6 times a night. The difference is that I

now fall BACK asleep instead of being up all night. I attribute this

to NO FEELINGS and NO ANXIETY to keep me awake...

***This is great news. I assume that this is why you have

decided to stay off the trazodone. Isn't it interesting that

you sleep much better WITHOUT the drug that was prescribed

to help you sleep.

<< I am loving the NO

ANXIETY part. But, I do eventually want to be able to laugh at a

joke again or something. If I get my feelings back, I dont' want the

anxiety back. This is what caused a lot of my problems to start with.>>

***You will get your feelings back. If the anxiety comes back,

we will work on dealing with it. You will be armed with the

information that the anxiety is a byproduct of the drugs, and

not something wrong with YOU. If it happens, it will be manageable.

<<I still have not gotten the total body stuff in the mail. I am going

to try it for 30 days.>>

***Great news! It's great stuff. Let us know how you make out

with it.

Hugs,

Kim

[Guest guest]

> Hi Terry,

> ***What made you to decide to drop the trazodone

> again after going back on it for one day? My experience

> has been that cold turkey is much harder to recover from

> than a gradual withdrawal. I hate to see anyone suffer more

> than they have to suffer.

Because I am stubborn and hard headed and not convinced that going

off 25 mg of traz is worse than tapering off some more.

> ***This is great news. I assume that this is why you have

> decided to stay off the trazodone.

EXACTLY!!!!! I will do ANYTHING for sleep. (almost anything)

Terry

[Guest guest]

Hi again, Terry,

<< In some ways I am enjoying the new

laid back tired me. I have never

before been able to " stop and smell the

roses " b/c I had to GO!!! I

guess this is one " good? " thing about brain

drain. Now I AM nuts!!!!>>

***What the heck, take the good with the bad.

If a byproduct of this withdrawal happens to be a

new understanding of what it means to slow down

and appreciate the moment, then Hallelujah!

Everything happens for a reason. I am not saying

that this is the sole reason for your having to go

through this whole experience, but it is GREAT

when you can see little benefits amid the turmoil.

More power to you!

Kim

[Guest guest]

Hi Joe,

I am sorry you're having such a hard time. You

sound like you are keeping an excellent perspective

on it, and you deserve to give yourself some big

pats on the back for that!

Many people on this list have gotten significant relief

from acute anxiety with the homeopathic remedy

aconitum nappellus. and have both

discussed this remedy. I will try to find something about

it and re-post.

I am sure will have more thoughts

on this subject. Hang in there, we're here for you!

Warmly,

Kim

<<I said before i didn't wanna take anything, but now its getting

rediculous, im so obsessed about this one thing, that i couldn't

get to sleep last nite until 4:00 AM and then i woke at 9:00 AM. I

can feel my heart beating heavily and i hate this feeling. Im bound

to see the person once in awhile now that school has started. I

don't know how im gonna deal with this. I try to control my

thoughts and put them on other things, but if I see this girl or

talk to her it seems to disrupt my life for a few days. I was

wondering about some of those things the Bach Essence or possiblly

Inosital. I would take the dull drowsiness of prozac over this any

day. >>

[Guest guest]

<<Oh, boy. Here comes my rant. The shrink who

put me on Paxil insisted that I had been manic

my entire life, and it was obvious by the kind of

life I led. For two years I was bi-coastal, flying

between my home in NY and apartment in LA

twice a month, working 70 hours a week producing

videos, riding my bike a hundred miles a week at

the beach. In my particular circle of friends, this

was just NORMAL! But this g.d. psychiatric nurse

said to me one day, " That's mania. You should be

on Lithium. Normal people don't do the things you

describe. " >>

***I just wish I could be that abnormal!

We are all enriched by the " different " folks

around us. What a shame that those in the mainstream

fear anything that diverges from their safe little

worlds.

Your enthusiasm, rage, and clear-sighted analysis

are magnificent. I am so glad nobody managed

to drug it out of you!

K

[Guest guest]

<<Because I am stubborn and hard headed and not convinced that going

off 25 mg of traz is worse than tapering off some more.>>

LOL!! All hail to the stubborn and hard-headed!

It will be your salvation!

You wouldn't be an Aries, would you?

K

[Guest guest]

> <<Because I am stubborn and hard headed and not convinced that

going

> off 25 mg of traz is worse than tapering off some more.>>

>

>

> LOL!! All hail to the stubborn and hard-headed!

> It will be your salvation!

>

>

> You wouldn't be an Aries, would you?

>

> K

OH HELL YES...I was born April 14...LOL!!!

Terry

[Guest guest]

Dear Terry,

Kim said:

<<You will get your feelings back. If the anxiety comes back,

we will work on dealing with it. You will be armed with the

information that the anxiety is a byproduct of the drugs, and

not something wrong with YOU. If it happens, it will be manageable.>>

** I wanted to echo this (and everything else she said).

Hang in there, Terry. You're doing great!

Regards,

[Guest guest]

Dear Kim,

You said:

<<LOL!! All hail to the stubborn and hard-headed!

It will be your salvation!

You wouldn't be an Aries, would you?>>

** Ahem...are you insinuating that Aries are " stubborn and hard-headed " ?

<g>

C

[Guest guest]

> >

> > ** I'm sorry this is so difficult. Heartache and I are old

> friends so

> > I know what you're saying.

>

>

> Joe replied:

>

>

>

> << Would you want to consider a Bach Essence for this (the

> anxiety/relationship issue)? Have you taken any Aconitum?>>

>

>

> ** I've taken Aconite under a few different conditions -

>

> 1) plain old anxiety or panic attack type stuff

>

> 2) inflammation

>

> 3) any illness that comes on really rapidly.

>

>

> If your anxiety is associated with the relationship I don't see

Aconite

> as being appropriate.

>

>

> You said:

>

> <<I said before i didn't wanna take anything, but now its getting

> rediculous, im so obsessed about this one thing, that i couldn't

> get to sleep last nite until 4:00 AM and then i woke at 9:00 AM. I

> can feel my heart beating heavily and i hate this feeling. Im bound

> to see the person once in awhile now that school has started. I

> don't know how im gonna deal with this. I try to control my

> thoughts and put them on other things, but if I see this girl or

> talk to her it seems to disrupt my life for a few days. I was

> wondering about some of those things the Bach Essence or possiblly

> Inosital. I would take the dull drowsiness of prozac over this any

> day. >>

>

>

>

> ** The key symptoms that jump out at me here are:

>

> worry

> obsessing

> anxiety

> insomnia

>

>

> I think a Bach remedy would be appropriate but there is too

littel

> information for an appropriate remedy to become clear. Your

responses to

> the questions below will clarify this.

>

>

> Can you tell me a little more about what happened?

Ok, this was someone who i met in September at work. From the first

time i saw her i was attracted to her and could tell she was

attracted to me. but while i was there i never bothered to talk to

her figuring that it wasn't a good idea just coming off prozac. So

after i got fired i decided to go back and see if i could get her

number. and so she saw me and was and actually asked me for my

number. but yeh i called her she didn't call back. i decided to go

back cuz it was also where i was buying organic foods before i found

another store. now she told me that she was confused about her life

and i should have listened.

I talked to her about 2 times for about 2 hours each before we went

out.

I told her about the prozac thing and she told me she had to leave

her mom and live with her dad to get away from a bad relationship and

get off MDMA. shes been clean for a year and a half of both the

drug and the guy. anyway somehow i thought i could relate to this

becuase of the prozac thing. She was on seroquel and the day we hung

out she had stopped taking wellbutrin cold turkey. oh yeh did i

mention shes' bi polar. but i couldn't really notice any problem

talking with her or when i was around her.

We hung out one night and had a good time. However nothing physical

happened. It was weird cuz i was really nervous afterwords, but not

in that fun exited way, and then still the next morning.

So i called her maybe more than i should, cuz i liked her, and cuz i

know you shouldn't go off wellbutrin cold turkey and i was hoping she

didn't have a stroke or something. When i did get her she told me

she would call me back but she had to finish reading a book first.

cuz apparently she couldn't do this when she was on drugs and she

said its kind of addictive. so she didn't but its not like i even

waited a week. so i called her. i basically asked her what was up.

She said despite being physically attracted to me, she didn't want a

relationship with me, she wants time alone. and she told me she was

still in love with her ex from a year and a half ago. or in love

with his image. and she told me she usually ends up liking guys who

are assholes (which im not) and that we should still be friends, but

she had to go to read another book and couldn't keep talking, but she

said she would call soon. This was on my birthday Dec 15.

W

ell anyway it took me about 1 week and a half to get over it. i had

anxiety all down my back and chest.

but, lol, i didn't close the book.

So i went to regester for classes at community college last week, i

saw her there and i just talked to her for about a second, friendly

and went and registered. while on the outside i seemed happy i was

nervous and was wondering whether or not i would see her later on and

went to the library using the excuse that i was going to use the

computer. i didn't see her but the next day she called. i was

thinking that because i was so causal that she liked me again. i was

so worried about wether i should call and 3 days later i called(last

nite) and got her dad and left a message. i was hoping if i talked

to her i would get some relief. but instead im wondering all night

whats going to happen despite my best efforts to control my brain. i

think i've realized that its not worth it, but i just don't know how

i'll act or feel when i see her. right now its starting to calm

down. but i don't want to keep going through this.

Yes i put alot of hope into this, cuz it was something that would let

me feel which i haven't been able to. it wasn't serious, but in my

mind it was. and thinking about it before it went where ever it is

now made me feel good. yes i think that it does interfere with me

thinking about it rationally. the pre withdrawal me wouldn't have

been so desperate to have a relationship or have been so hurt by it.

thanks so much for reading this incredibly long boring story.

sincerely,

joe

[Guest guest]

Dear Kim,

You said:

<<This Leo just loves Aries folks!>>

** That's better ;-)

C

[Guest guest]

Dear Janet,

You said:

<<They love us at the other end too -- the low achieer, to quiet too slow

too subcued. That don't leave much of anybody when you look at who is

being drugged these days. the houseful of teenage boys across the street

and they are all on depakote and various ad's and mood stabilizers.

kinda scarey over here when i think about it as i am a single female.>>

** I have it on good authority that you know exactly what they need and

never need to say a word to accomplish this. You are perfectly safe there.

Regards,

[Guest guest]

Dear Glitter,

You said:

<<They tried. But my type-A personality came with a nickname in

Hollywood -- Pit Bull With Lipstick. LOL>>

** I love this! ROFL!

Regards,

[Guest guest]

Dear Joe,

You said:

<<Yes i put alot of hope into this, cuz it was something that would let

me feel which i haven't been able to. it wasn't serious, but in my

mind it was. and thinking about it before it went where ever it is

now made me feel good. yes i think that it does interfere with me

thinking about it rationally. the pre withdrawal me wouldn't have

been so desperate to have a relationship or have been so hurt by it.

thanks so much for reading this incredibly long boring story.>>

** Not boring at all. It helped to bring out the proper remedy for you.

I'm going to send you a blend of White Chestnut and Cherry Plum. I have

your address from the envelope I received from you today (thank you very

much for this. You are quite generous).

Regards,

[Guest guest]

<< Ahem...are you insinuating that Aries are " stubborn and hard-headed " ?

<g>>>

No, I'm not insinuating....I KNOW it to be true!

(In a very good way, of course, LOL)

--K