Guest guest Posted April 5, 2005 Report Share Posted April 5, 2005 Wow , You certainl have a lot going on. Have you talked in length to her peditrician? Explaining everything as you just did? My daughter who has classic autism had surgery last summer. Tonsils and adnoids. It was outpaient and did great. We did a social story so she knew just what to expect even that her throat would hurt. She went home the same day. That does not compare to what you have before you. I wish I had a neat little package that you can go with to accomplish this. I don't. Just please know that I will pray a solution will come for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 5, 2005 Report Share Posted April 5, 2005 Wow , You certainl have a lot going on. Have you talked in length to her peditrician? Explaining everything as you just did? My daughter who has classic autism had surgery last summer. Tonsils and adnoids. It was outpaient and did great. We did a social story so she knew just what to expect even that her throat would hurt. She went home the same day. That does not compare to what you have before you. I wish I had a neat little package that you can go with to accomplish this. I don't. Just please know that I will pray a solution will come for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 5, 2005 Report Share Posted April 5, 2005 Wow , You certainl have a lot going on. Have you talked in length to her peditrician? Explaining everything as you just did? My daughter who has classic autism had surgery last summer. Tonsils and adnoids. It was outpaient and did great. We did a social story so she knew just what to expect even that her throat would hurt. She went home the same day. That does not compare to what you have before you. I wish I had a neat little package that you can go with to accomplish this. I don't. Just please know that I will pray a solution will come for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 5, 2005 Report Share Posted April 5, 2005 , It's so hard to really know what to say...My heart goes out to you. In my layman's opinion, I really think that you might regret more not taking her to the hospital even if you have to physically force her. What if the worst happened at home, (i.e., heart failure from undernourishment or something terrible like that)? I think you would forever wish you had forced the issue and made her go inpatient. I think if you have any family that can come and stay with the other kids so you can be with her, it's really imperative now to get them at your house right away. You may have to spend most of your time with your daughter and your husband has to work. If family is available, don't stand on formalities, use them! It's tough to even know which issue to address first, but, I think the undernourishment physically is the first thing I'd address and then work from there. Especially since she can't seem to stop from exercising in this undernourished state. This is a dangerous combo. Of course, I'm not a doctor of any sort. Just my opinion. Please get help if you have any and take care of yourself also. The family doesn't need you to get sick from stress overload now. My prayers are with you and your family. Please let us know how your'e coping. Diane hospitalization Has anyone dealt with hospitalization of their AS/NLD/OCD daughter? My almost 13 yr old has an eating disorder (I may have posted this earlier-am usually a lurker though) that she only eats what her big sister eats. This has caused her to be unable to gain weight. She lost weight prior to the onset of this ritual from two months of flu, and a health/nutrition focus about amonth prior to that. When she needed to gain she adopted this " safe, just right " ritual which I attribute to OCD (2 other of my children have ocd also, but not the aspergers/AS qualities). So ever since (several months now) her weight has hovered at a dangerously low level, and over time she has taken on some anorexic qualities-thinking she looks fat-which was never an issue before. (She always ate well, but was slender, before this weight loss, and we have never pushed any diets or appearance stuff in the home.. but did push hard fo her to gain weght after her flus). She did terribly with an overnight hospitalization to assess her medically for anorexia, she was incoherent, screaming, and unable to communicate or cooperate after several hours (it was overnight since the admission took place finally at 10 pm, we could not get her to the hospital without physical force). She could not sleep there, there are windows/lights into the room facing the nurses station etc, plus no chance to be alone (had to always be 'sitter' with her-mostly it was me, but I had to leave to see my 2 yr old at home who still nurses) and she could not do her showering routine and stuff which calms her. Most of the staff did not understand the extent of her sensory defensiveness, the bright lighting problems, being questioned persistently, physical exams so on. Upon her return home (she was released as stable, with orders to seek outpatient treatment, but her BMI is only around 13-and the local outpatient center won't take her if she cannot eat some meals with the clinic) she had flashbacks of screaming " they won't stop touching me " , the first one initially lasted two hours. It took her awhile to return to normal routines withhout frequent panicky meltdowns. She cannot have any sedating medications until she gains weight (plus she had severe reaction to zoloft a year ago) and I cannot get her to see a doctor now due to her fear (she feels betrayed by our doctor and our the p-doc who admitted her to hospital). Fortunately she is eating OK lately but I have to get my 16 yr old to eat more, which is not fair to her, and it is still not enough for my 13 yr old to gain weight to a level I feel safe with. We have not been able to break this ritual-have tried gradual exposures (eating two bites more, eating separately etc) but the effects are minimal, though I want to keep working at trying to increase the exposures. My daughter claims the ritual will just " fall away " when it is no longer needed by her, as has often been the case with other rituals and hyper-focuses she has adopted in the past, but I have my doubts- after a certain amt of weight loss, there seems to be an addictive quality to maintaining the low weight, and she is excercizing more- The anorexia is biochemically triggered somehow by the weight loss. I am hoping possibly to distract her from the ritualized eating, and increase her positive feelings by allowing her to foster orphan kittens with a rescue group-she and her younger sister have done this once before with a neighbor's litter (round the clock bottle feeding) and she was very good at it-she has two cats of her own she is devoted to. I'm hoping with some weight gain, if we can achieve it, her brain biocemistry wil return to pre-anorexic-IOW she'll be able to go back to normal eating gain, with out fears. In the meantime I have been thinking of just setting up a preadmission to the hospital and we will have to be ready to take her if she loses weight (if my older daughter travels, or gets sick, or if she gets sick). But this is my dilemma- I think the hopsital could do as much harm as good. She needs to be transferred to an inpatient unit for eating disorders over two hours away, there is nothing local to handle this. I have 6 kids, several with milder neuro-differences (and a 2 yr old) and it would be hard for me to be away (understatement) but I could not leave my 13 year old alone in another city either. It would be hard for my husband too, who has little finesse with accepting the neuro- problems, much less the every day normalities of large family and my homeschooling. He gets frustrated easily- but he works hard and sucessfully at supporting us. My sister could come out if needed. But I also fear my daughter regressing seriously in a hospital setting, moreover at her low weight sedatives or medications which could calm her are contraindicated, if she has low blood pressure and low heart rate, she has to gain weight first. I wonder how they would be able to relax her. Since she will not eat without her sister/ritual she will have to go on an NG tube, is my educated guess, and that too will be a sensory nightmare for her. How can I calm my fears about her being hospitalized so I can take the right steps to protect her health (even getting her to pediatrician is hard) but yet at the same time to protect her health, in my mind, puts her mental status at serious risk, I am afraid she could just go totally off and not return to herself for a long time...and we both have worked so hard at keeping her stable and functioning. Maybe I am catastrophizing, or maybe the hospital would deal with this better than I expect... There is also the matter of getting her to a hospital, it takes physical force-she will fight and scratch which is very stressful in her weakened state. I felt horrible having to forcefully push her into the van screaming (for the overnight admission) and shut the door on her, no seatbelt, as she sat on the floor screaming. I feel like the hospital would need to combine approaches for the eating disorder, the OCD, and the autistic qualities (which only come out when she is way from her home and routine-othwerwise people don't much see it). Can a teen inpatient unit for anorexics handle her? She is not the typical anorexic-she should really be on an autistic ward if there is such a thing. It is hard to tell if she actually fears weight gain (b/c she WILL eat high calorie food, desserts etc, IF her sister does, and she does not weigh herself but looks in the mirror alot). She has an obsession to look " just right " like her sister (who is not thin and has her own ocd/tics/trich spectrums-but IS amore carefree person than my 13 yr old). She has copied her sister more generally in many respects, but never toally obsessive like this. So getting her to eat will be a matter of undoing this ritual/obsession/safe eating compulsion. Can it be undone simply by force feeding, or should I keep trying gradually to work on it at home? She is not very compliant now about restricting her exercize, in fact gets panicky about it now, but she CAN eat quite a bit, if her sister does (I make Ensure laced smoothies every day and secretly doctor up my 13 yr old's with alot more calories) stil she is only maintaining-not gaining, which keeps me on constant alert for a decline, and I fear if she should have a medical emergncy-will I be liable (as in under suspicion as a homeschooler -but we are pretty active homeschoolers, not isolated- however my youngest is unvaccinated) for not seeking the inpatient care? So, has anyone dealt with eating disorders, and has anyone dealt with hospitalization? Thanks for 'listening', nancy Autism_in_Girls-subscribe ------------------------ Autism_in_Girls-unsubscribe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 5, 2005 Report Share Posted April 5, 2005 , It's so hard to really know what to say...My heart goes out to you. In my layman's opinion, I really think that you might regret more not taking her to the hospital even if you have to physically force her. What if the worst happened at home, (i.e., heart failure from undernourishment or something terrible like that)? I think you would forever wish you had forced the issue and made her go inpatient. I think if you have any family that can come and stay with the other kids so you can be with her, it's really imperative now to get them at your house right away. You may have to spend most of your time with your daughter and your husband has to work. If family is available, don't stand on formalities, use them! It's tough to even know which issue to address first, but, I think the undernourishment physically is the first thing I'd address and then work from there. Especially since she can't seem to stop from exercising in this undernourished state. This is a dangerous combo. Of course, I'm not a doctor of any sort. Just my opinion. Please get help if you have any and take care of yourself also. The family doesn't need you to get sick from stress overload now. My prayers are with you and your family. Please let us know how your'e coping. Diane hospitalization Has anyone dealt with hospitalization of their AS/NLD/OCD daughter? My almost 13 yr old has an eating disorder (I may have posted this earlier-am usually a lurker though) that she only eats what her big sister eats. This has caused her to be unable to gain weight. She lost weight prior to the onset of this ritual from two months of flu, and a health/nutrition focus about amonth prior to that. When she needed to gain she adopted this " safe, just right " ritual which I attribute to OCD (2 other of my children have ocd also, but not the aspergers/AS qualities). So ever since (several months now) her weight has hovered at a dangerously low level, and over time she has taken on some anorexic qualities-thinking she looks fat-which was never an issue before. (She always ate well, but was slender, before this weight loss, and we have never pushed any diets or appearance stuff in the home.. but did push hard fo her to gain weght after her flus). She did terribly with an overnight hospitalization to assess her medically for anorexia, she was incoherent, screaming, and unable to communicate or cooperate after several hours (it was overnight since the admission took place finally at 10 pm, we could not get her to the hospital without physical force). She could not sleep there, there are windows/lights into the room facing the nurses station etc, plus no chance to be alone (had to always be 'sitter' with her-mostly it was me, but I had to leave to see my 2 yr old at home who still nurses) and she could not do her showering routine and stuff which calms her. Most of the staff did not understand the extent of her sensory defensiveness, the bright lighting problems, being questioned persistently, physical exams so on. Upon her return home (she was released as stable, with orders to seek outpatient treatment, but her BMI is only around 13-and the local outpatient center won't take her if she cannot eat some meals with the clinic) she had flashbacks of screaming " they won't stop touching me " , the first one initially lasted two hours. It took her awhile to return to normal routines withhout frequent panicky meltdowns. She cannot have any sedating medications until she gains weight (plus she had severe reaction to zoloft a year ago) and I cannot get her to see a doctor now due to her fear (she feels betrayed by our doctor and our the p-doc who admitted her to hospital). Fortunately she is eating OK lately but I have to get my 16 yr old to eat more, which is not fair to her, and it is still not enough for my 13 yr old to gain weight to a level I feel safe with. We have not been able to break this ritual-have tried gradual exposures (eating two bites more, eating separately etc) but the effects are minimal, though I want to keep working at trying to increase the exposures. My daughter claims the ritual will just " fall away " when it is no longer needed by her, as has often been the case with other rituals and hyper-focuses she has adopted in the past, but I have my doubts- after a certain amt of weight loss, there seems to be an addictive quality to maintaining the low weight, and she is excercizing more- The anorexia is biochemically triggered somehow by the weight loss. I am hoping possibly to distract her from the ritualized eating, and increase her positive feelings by allowing her to foster orphan kittens with a rescue group-she and her younger sister have done this once before with a neighbor's litter (round the clock bottle feeding) and she was very good at it-she has two cats of her own she is devoted to. I'm hoping with some weight gain, if we can achieve it, her brain biocemistry wil return to pre-anorexic-IOW she'll be able to go back to normal eating gain, with out fears. In the meantime I have been thinking of just setting up a preadmission to the hospital and we will have to be ready to take her if she loses weight (if my older daughter travels, or gets sick, or if she gets sick). But this is my dilemma- I think the hopsital could do as much harm as good. She needs to be transferred to an inpatient unit for eating disorders over two hours away, there is nothing local to handle this. I have 6 kids, several with milder neuro-differences (and a 2 yr old) and it would be hard for me to be away (understatement) but I could not leave my 13 year old alone in another city either. It would be hard for my husband too, who has little finesse with accepting the neuro- problems, much less the every day normalities of large family and my homeschooling. He gets frustrated easily- but he works hard and sucessfully at supporting us. My sister could come out if needed. But I also fear my daughter regressing seriously in a hospital setting, moreover at her low weight sedatives or medications which could calm her are contraindicated, if she has low blood pressure and low heart rate, she has to gain weight first. I wonder how they would be able to relax her. Since she will not eat without her sister/ritual she will have to go on an NG tube, is my educated guess, and that too will be a sensory nightmare for her. How can I calm my fears about her being hospitalized so I can take the right steps to protect her health (even getting her to pediatrician is hard) but yet at the same time to protect her health, in my mind, puts her mental status at serious risk, I am afraid she could just go totally off and not return to herself for a long time...and we both have worked so hard at keeping her stable and functioning. Maybe I am catastrophizing, or maybe the hospital would deal with this better than I expect... There is also the matter of getting her to a hospital, it takes physical force-she will fight and scratch which is very stressful in her weakened state. I felt horrible having to forcefully push her into the van screaming (for the overnight admission) and shut the door on her, no seatbelt, as she sat on the floor screaming. I feel like the hospital would need to combine approaches for the eating disorder, the OCD, and the autistic qualities (which only come out when she is way from her home and routine-othwerwise people don't much see it). Can a teen inpatient unit for anorexics handle her? She is not the typical anorexic-she should really be on an autistic ward if there is such a thing. It is hard to tell if she actually fears weight gain (b/c she WILL eat high calorie food, desserts etc, IF her sister does, and she does not weigh herself but looks in the mirror alot). She has an obsession to look " just right " like her sister (who is not thin and has her own ocd/tics/trich spectrums-but IS amore carefree person than my 13 yr old). She has copied her sister more generally in many respects, but never toally obsessive like this. So getting her to eat will be a matter of undoing this ritual/obsession/safe eating compulsion. Can it be undone simply by force feeding, or should I keep trying gradually to work on it at home? She is not very compliant now about restricting her exercize, in fact gets panicky about it now, but she CAN eat quite a bit, if her sister does (I make Ensure laced smoothies every day and secretly doctor up my 13 yr old's with alot more calories) stil she is only maintaining-not gaining, which keeps me on constant alert for a decline, and I fear if she should have a medical emergncy-will I be liable (as in under suspicion as a homeschooler -but we are pretty active homeschoolers, not isolated- however my youngest is unvaccinated) for not seeking the inpatient care? So, has anyone dealt with eating disorders, and has anyone dealt with hospitalization? Thanks for 'listening', nancy Autism_in_Girls-subscribe ------------------------ Autism_in_Girls-unsubscribe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 5, 2005 Report Share Posted April 5, 2005 , first of all I'm so sorry for all your heartache. My then 4 yr old was hospitalized for 2 days for dehydration. She was miserable and had to be sedated to keep from pulling out her IV. After we got home for a few wks I found a Curious Goes to The Hospital DVD for $6 at a Walmart bin. Allie LOVES this DVD and watched it over and over. I noticed shortly after when we had to go for a GI scope she wasn't nearly so combative. The last time we were at the doctor she didn't even seem nervous and this is NOT normal for Allie! I really think it was that Curious DVD, I heard her rehearsing some of the lines. I'm just glad she didn't find a wheelchair, lol. (Curious steals a wheelchair and crashes into a huge food cart.) Another thing I wanted to tell you is at this website: http://www.speakingofspeech.com/PDFs/Hospital_1.pdf;$sessionid$CX2XADAAAACURTZEN\ UGJPQWPERWRJPX0 http://www.speakingofspeech.com/PDFs/Hospital_2.pdf;$sessionid$CX2XADAAAACURTZEN\ UGJPQWPERWRJPX0 there are 2 different full-color PECS sheet to help people with autism show how they feel and what hurts. I like them so much I'm gonna ask our local ASA chapter to print and laminate a bunch to distribute to all the nurses' stations of our Children's Hospital. That way when a kid with autism has to stay they can have the chart to help find how the child is feeling. Maybe this will help your daughter feel better about expressing herself? HTH, Debi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 5, 2005 Report Share Posted April 5, 2005 , first of all I'm so sorry for all your heartache. My then 4 yr old was hospitalized for 2 days for dehydration. She was miserable and had to be sedated to keep from pulling out her IV. After we got home for a few wks I found a Curious Goes to The Hospital DVD for $6 at a Walmart bin. Allie LOVES this DVD and watched it over and over. I noticed shortly after when we had to go for a GI scope she wasn't nearly so combative. The last time we were at the doctor she didn't even seem nervous and this is NOT normal for Allie! I really think it was that Curious DVD, I heard her rehearsing some of the lines. I'm just glad she didn't find a wheelchair, lol. (Curious steals a wheelchair and crashes into a huge food cart.) Another thing I wanted to tell you is at this website: http://www.speakingofspeech.com/PDFs/Hospital_1.pdf;$sessionid$CX2XADAAAACURTZEN\ UGJPQWPERWRJPX0 http://www.speakingofspeech.com/PDFs/Hospital_2.pdf;$sessionid$CX2XADAAAACURTZEN\ UGJPQWPERWRJPX0 there are 2 different full-color PECS sheet to help people with autism show how they feel and what hurts. I like them so much I'm gonna ask our local ASA chapter to print and laminate a bunch to distribute to all the nurses' stations of our Children's Hospital. That way when a kid with autism has to stay they can have the chart to help find how the child is feeling. Maybe this will help your daughter feel better about expressing herself? HTH, Debi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 5, 2005 Report Share Posted April 5, 2005 , first of all I'm so sorry for all your heartache. My then 4 yr old was hospitalized for 2 days for dehydration. She was miserable and had to be sedated to keep from pulling out her IV. After we got home for a few wks I found a Curious Goes to The Hospital DVD for $6 at a Walmart bin. Allie LOVES this DVD and watched it over and over. I noticed shortly after when we had to go for a GI scope she wasn't nearly so combative. The last time we were at the doctor she didn't even seem nervous and this is NOT normal for Allie! I really think it was that Curious DVD, I heard her rehearsing some of the lines. I'm just glad she didn't find a wheelchair, lol. (Curious steals a wheelchair and crashes into a huge food cart.) Another thing I wanted to tell you is at this website: http://www.speakingofspeech.com/PDFs/Hospital_1.pdf;$sessionid$CX2XADAAAACURTZEN\ UGJPQWPERWRJPX0 http://www.speakingofspeech.com/PDFs/Hospital_2.pdf;$sessionid$CX2XADAAAACURTZEN\ UGJPQWPERWRJPX0 there are 2 different full-color PECS sheet to help people with autism show how they feel and what hurts. I like them so much I'm gonna ask our local ASA chapter to print and laminate a bunch to distribute to all the nurses' stations of our Children's Hospital. That way when a kid with autism has to stay they can have the chart to help find how the child is feeling. Maybe this will help your daughter feel better about expressing herself? HTH, Debi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 6, 2005 Report Share Posted April 6, 2005 Thanks and all who responded. I am going to see our psychiatrist in the morning and maybe she'll have some is ideas for me, I just cannot get rid of my gut feeling that the severe behavioral health unit (I found out she cannot go to the teen ED unit b/c they don't do forced feeding or restraints/seclusion etc) will somehow destroy her mentally and she will be there for months on end, not just a week or two. She is utterly resistant to eating away from her ritual/sister/home. I am wondering if she does become very faint or weakened and lethargic (I have learned from others that fainting/passing out can precede heart symptoms by a fairly lengthy time) then she will end her denial and willingly accept treatment, or I will simply take her in without force b/c she will be too weak to resist. Could be she will continue to remain stable medically(as she was found to be by Children's hospital) b/c she does eat daily, she just has a very low BMI, however she was consistently slender to begin with, she only had to lose 10 lbs to drop to below 5th percentile. Maybe the hospital here can make some type special accomodations so she can be a patient close to home and I can help her too, rather than choosing between leaving her alone or being with my other children. On the other hand every time I give her weight I get a comment from the doctors or therapists - " she must be admitted! " That is very unnerving, and I feel cionstantly worried, yet she has been living a basically normal life at this low weight for 3 months now, doing her regular schooling and activities. A couple times we have been in crisis b/c she does not eat for a day or two, then those times I was ready to take her to the local emergency room, it has just taken such a toll to see and deal with this daily. I appreciate the prayers and warm thoughts. nancy > > Wow , > > You certainl have a lot going on. Have you talked in length to her > peditrician? Explaining everything as you just did? > > My daughter who has classic autism had surgery last summer. Tonsils > and adnoids. It was outpaient and did great. We did a social story > so she knew just what to expect even that her throat would hurt. > > She went home the same day. > > That does not compare to what you have before you. I wish I had a > neat little package that you can go with to accomplish this. I don't. > > Just please know that I will pray a solution will come for you. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 6, 2005 Report Share Posted April 6, 2005 Hi , I have not dealt with my children being anorexic or not eating. But I myself have been anerexic when I was young and still face the mental challenges of it, even though I have stopped the actual behaviors of it. I have some questions for you and some advise that worked for me, but without knowing the whole story or the answers to some of the questions my advice may not pertain to your daughters situation. how tall is your 13 yr old and what does she weigh? What weight does she look good at, or healthy? Does she go to public shcool where peers may be affecting her? Do you, your 16 yr old or your husband ever complain about being too fat yourself? Or do any of you, or maybe granparents, cousins, or friends do that or diet all the time? Does anyone in the family make judgemental comments about others, including movie stars, T.V. show hosts or actors, etc? Do you guys have to control almost everything she does? Or is she able to have a lot of choices and do ok on her own? Do you know her firends? Or does she have any? Are they skinny? Or overweight complaining that they want to be skinny? You don't have to answer these questions to me, if you don't feel comfortable, but at least ask them to yourself and your spouse and see if they pertain. I was anerexic from 11yrs to 17yrs. It wasn't until I met my husband at 17 when he started noticing my behaviors and problems and helped me get over it and go to doctors and get help. It has caused me many problems with my health and know weight issues, because of it, and is very dangerous not just for health reasons the longer you wait, but for emotional health as well. I was anerexic mostly because of my dad. He always made comments during movies or TV or while looking at magazines about how ugly or fat people were. When I was 11 he took me aside and told me I was starting to get too fat, and chubby. He said you don't want to look like your mom do you? And yet my mom was only 150 lbs and was 5'9 " so not really FAT by any means. Any time I would want seconds or more, he would say, no you don't need it, but he would let my other sisters who were slimmer and more flat chested than I eat whatever they wanted. Needless to say, I was only 75lbs was already 5'5 " which is my height now, and already wore a B bra, so not really fat or heavy at all. I was at a BMI of 7 and my PE teachers told me I needed to gain or eat more. But who do you listen to? the people who you love, admire, or want their approval. I wanted my dad's and to this day have never gotten it for anything. My mom and grandma's were all always on diets and all my friends were too. Now they were not nearly as slender as I was, but I didn't see that as an 11yr old. I just saw that that was what everyone else was doing and I wanted to be normal or accepted as they were. But I often never was, because they were jealous of me being so skinny. So my friends wouldn't hang out with me. So I thought I must need to loose more or try harder to be skinny in order to fit in. Which made them dislike me even more or tell me there was something wrong with me. But they never said what they would just say " your not like us or you don't fit in " , and I thought I still wasn't skinny enough or pretty enough. My mom was all messed up emotionally herself, starving herself and working too hard, because of also wanting my dad's approval and admiration. So she didn't pay any attention to me and my problems at all, except that she was jealous of me and would always say she wished she looked like me. And of course my dad still thought I was too fat, so they didn't take me in to anyone for help. I passed out at least 5 times a year or so, because my dad made me work so hard on farms and outside etc. But He would just say get back to work when I came too. Finally when I was sixteen my mom started noticing that I would go days without eating or drinking a thing. She tried to force me to eat, and that just made it worse, cuz I thought in my irrational way of thinking that she just wanted me to be fat, so she wouldn't be jealous any more. She forced me to eat a Bagel one day, before she would let me go to a dance and I threw up everywhere and my dad said leave her alone, she'll eat if she's hungry, she looks great. That's when my mom started realizing I had a problem. I was still only 96lbs at age 16 and now wore a double C bra, so extremely skinny everywhere else. I had guys after me all the time, so I thought I must be perfect and beautiful, but I hurt all the time and was not emotionally well at all. So for me the biggest factor was pleasing people and wanting to fit in. I never worried about light or low fat stuff, just that less of anything is better. And when I did eat it was things I liked like Pizza or candy bars, but because I was not eating healthy or on a regular basis I would throw up or it would all come through my system so quickly, that I could not even hardly digest it, and got no substance or fat from it. I had three friends that got so anerexic that they had to be hospitalized for months and one of them over a year. But unfortunately, the hospital only helps force you to gain weight it doesn't usually correct the mental or emotional cause of the problem. Kids just learn what they need to say to get out, and then are even more sneaky about it. So my advice to you for now, is find the root of the problem. Until you know the root of it, forcing often makes things worse, because the girl feels like she is being controlled in everything she does, including what she eats, and her way of being independant is by choosing not to eat even if it means lying. I know she is Autistic, but depending on how far behind, it may be helpful for you to have her watch some movies about other girls who became anerexic and had very negative effects. I saw one on TV my 1st year of college and it made me very scared when I first actually realized that I was anerexic and was like the girl in the movie and that she almost died. It gave me a wake up call. And then my friend, now husband, watching me eat and making sure he was with me at nearly every meal, so that I couldn't lie to him really did help because I thought he was cool and wanted his admiration now more than my dad's. So I listened to him and changed. But I am a lucky case many kids have to change very young or they never will. I am not trying to scare you, just letting you know that I have taken Phsycology classes on Anerexia and Bulemia and have gone to counceling etc. and most people who become this way have many outside factors that make them feel this way, and unfortunately sometimes it can either be us as parents or our childrens close friends or even their friends mom or a relative or sibbling that is either too controlling and so the child chooses that as their method of having choice, or because they feel like someone they admire or want to be like is really skinny or tells them they need to be. So first try and figure out what that factor could be, even taking a good look at yourself and talk to your daughter about it and ask her about her feelings. Maybe who she admires or looks up to most. See what kind of movies she likes most or magazines she looks at. If all the girls are twigs who talk about being skinnier, that could be a source too. Just don't be too pushy demanding, controling or forceful. And if she keeps being this way and you are too concerned let her see on of the those movies about anerexic people's lives and ask her if she wants that. If she won't change and you feel you need to take her in for help at the hospital, give her one more chance before she goes. Say " I know you don't like the doctors, but you are not eating enough and you are getting sick. The doctors are there to help you, even if it has to hurt sometimes. Now if you think you can change and eat more, everything that we ask you to, you can have one more chance before we have to take you there. But if you still can't gain weight we may need to take you in, to see if their is something wrong with your body that we can get fixed " . Of course in your own words and at her level, but you see what I mean. If she is afraid enough of the doctors, maybe she'll try harder, but don't try to scare her, because she may have to go to them. I sure hope this can help and I hope that You guys can get this worked out and taken care of while she is still young. If you have any questions for me, pretty much nothing is too personal, I've become very open over the years, in order to help myself and help others. I'd love to help in any way possible, and hope that this applies somewhat to your daughter, so you can help her. Sincerely, Esther --- wrote: > > Has anyone dealt with hospitalization of their > AS/NLD/OCD daughter? > > My almost 13 yr old has an eating disorder (I may > have posted this > earlier-am usually a lurker though) that she only > eats what her big > sister eats. This has caused her to be unable to > gain weight. She > lost weight prior to the onset of this ritual from > two months of flu, > and a health/nutrition focus about amonth prior to > that. When she > needed to gain she adopted this " safe, just right " > ritual which I > attribute to OCD (2 other of my children have ocd > also, but not the > aspergers/AS qualities). > > So ever since (several months now) her weight has > hovered at a > dangerously low level, and over time she has taken > on some anorexic > qualities-thinking she looks fat-which was never an > issue before. > (She always ate well, but was slender, before this > weight loss, and > we have never pushed any diets or appearance stuff > in the home.. but > did push hard fo her to gain weght after her flus). > > She did terribly with an overnight hospitalization > to assess her > medically for anorexia, she was incoherent, > screaming, and unable to > communicate or cooperate after several hours (it was > overnight since > the admission took place finally at 10 pm, we could > not get her to > the hospital without physical force). She could not > sleep there, > there are windows/lights into the room facing the > nurses station etc, > plus no chance to be alone (had to always be > 'sitter' with her-mostly > it was me, but I had to leave to see my 2 yr old at > home who still > nurses) and she could not do her showering routine > and stuff which > calms her. > > Most of the staff did not understand the extent of > her sensory > defensiveness, the bright lighting problems, being > questioned > persistently, physical exams so on. Upon her return > home (she was > released as stable, with orders to seek outpatient > treatment, but her > BMI is only around 13-and the local outpatient > center won't take her > if she cannot eat some meals with the clinic) she > had flashbacks of > screaming " they won't stop touching me " , the first > one initially > lasted two hours. It took her awhile to return to > normal routines > withhout frequent panicky meltdowns. She cannot have > any sedating > medications until she gains weight (plus she had > severe reaction to > zoloft a year ago) and I cannot get her to see a > doctor now due to > her fear (she feels betrayed by our doctor and our > the p-doc who > admitted her to hospital). > > Fortunately she is eating OK lately but I have to > get my 16 yr old > to eat more, which is not fair to her, and it is > still not enough for > my 13 yr old to gain weight to a level I feel safe > with. We have not > been able to break this ritual-have tried gradual > exposures (eating > two bites more, eating separately etc) but the > effects are minimal, > though I want to keep working at trying to increase > the exposures. > > My daughter claims the ritual will just " fall away " > when it is no > longer needed by her, as has often been the case > with other rituals > and hyper-focuses she has adopted in the past, but I > have my doubts- > after a certain amt of weight loss, there seems to > be an addictive > quality to maintaining the low weight, and she is > excercizing more- > The anorexia is biochemically triggered somehow by > the weight loss. > > I am hoping possibly to distract her from the > ritualized eating, and > increase her positive feelings by allowing her to > foster orphan > kittens with a rescue group-she and her younger > sister have done this > once before with a neighbor's litter (round the > clock bottle feeding) > and she was very good at it-she has two cats of her > own she is > devoted to. I'm hoping with some weight gain, if we > can achieve it, > her brain biocemistry wil return to pre-anorexic-IOW > she'll be able > to go back to normal eating gain, with out fears. > > In the meantime I have been thinking of just setting > up a > preadmission to the hospital and we will have to be > ready to take her > if she loses weight (if my older daughter travels, > or gets sick, or > if she gets sick). But this is my dilemma- I think > the hopsital could > do as much harm as good. > > She needs to be transferred to an inpatient unit for > eating disorders > over two hours away, there is nothing local to > handle this. I have 6 > kids, several with milder neuro-differences (and a 2 > yr old) and it > would be hard for me to be away (understatement) but > I could not > leave my 13 year old alone in another city either. > It would be hard > for my husband too, who has little finesse with > accepting the neuro- > problems, much less the every day normalities of > large family and my > homeschooling. He gets frustrated easily- but he > works hard and > sucessfully at supporting us. My sister could come > out if needed. > > But I also fear my daughter regressing seriously in > a hospital > setting, moreover at her low weight sedatives or > medications which > could calm her are contraindicated, if she has low > blood pressure and > low heart rate, she has to gain weight first. I > wonder how they would > be able to relax her. Since she will not eat without > her > sister/ritual she will have to go on an NG tube, is > my educated > guess, and that too will be a sensory nightmare for > her. > > How can I calm my fears about her being hospitalized > so I can take > the right steps to protect her health (even getting > her to > pediatrician is hard) but yet at the same time to > protect her health, > in my mind, puts her mental status at serious risk, > I am afraid she > could just go totally off and not return to herself > for a long > time...and we both have worked so hard at keeping > her stable and > functioning. Maybe I am catastrophizing, or maybe > the hospital would > deal with this better than I expect... > > There is also the matter of getting her to a > hospital, it takes > physical force-she will fight and scratch which is > very stressful in > her weakened state. I felt horrible having to > forcefully push her > into the van screaming (for the overnight admission) > and shut the > door on her, no seatbelt, as she sat on the floor > screaming. > > I feel like the hospital would need to combine > approaches for the > eating disorder, the OCD, and the autistic qualities > (which only come > out when she is way from her home and > routine-othwerwise people don't > much see it). Can a teen inpatient unit for > anorexics handle her? She > is not the typical anorexic-she should really be on > an autistic ward > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 6, 2005 Report Share Posted April 6, 2005 Hi , I have not dealt with my children being anorexic or not eating. But I myself have been anerexic when I was young and still face the mental challenges of it, even though I have stopped the actual behaviors of it. I have some questions for you and some advise that worked for me, but without knowing the whole story or the answers to some of the questions my advice may not pertain to your daughters situation. how tall is your 13 yr old and what does she weigh? What weight does she look good at, or healthy? Does she go to public shcool where peers may be affecting her? Do you, your 16 yr old or your husband ever complain about being too fat yourself? Or do any of you, or maybe granparents, cousins, or friends do that or diet all the time? Does anyone in the family make judgemental comments about others, including movie stars, T.V. show hosts or actors, etc? Do you guys have to control almost everything she does? Or is she able to have a lot of choices and do ok on her own? Do you know her firends? Or does she have any? Are they skinny? Or overweight complaining that they want to be skinny? You don't have to answer these questions to me, if you don't feel comfortable, but at least ask them to yourself and your spouse and see if they pertain. I was anerexic from 11yrs to 17yrs. It wasn't until I met my husband at 17 when he started noticing my behaviors and problems and helped me get over it and go to doctors and get help. It has caused me many problems with my health and know weight issues, because of it, and is very dangerous not just for health reasons the longer you wait, but for emotional health as well. I was anerexic mostly because of my dad. He always made comments during movies or TV or while looking at magazines about how ugly or fat people were. When I was 11 he took me aside and told me I was starting to get too fat, and chubby. He said you don't want to look like your mom do you? And yet my mom was only 150 lbs and was 5'9 " so not really FAT by any means. Any time I would want seconds or more, he would say, no you don't need it, but he would let my other sisters who were slimmer and more flat chested than I eat whatever they wanted. Needless to say, I was only 75lbs was already 5'5 " which is my height now, and already wore a B bra, so not really fat or heavy at all. I was at a BMI of 7 and my PE teachers told me I needed to gain or eat more. But who do you listen to? the people who you love, admire, or want their approval. I wanted my dad's and to this day have never gotten it for anything. My mom and grandma's were all always on diets and all my friends were too. Now they were not nearly as slender as I was, but I didn't see that as an 11yr old. I just saw that that was what everyone else was doing and I wanted to be normal or accepted as they were. But I often never was, because they were jealous of me being so skinny. So my friends wouldn't hang out with me. So I thought I must need to loose more or try harder to be skinny in order to fit in. Which made them dislike me even more or tell me there was something wrong with me. But they never said what they would just say " your not like us or you don't fit in " , and I thought I still wasn't skinny enough or pretty enough. My mom was all messed up emotionally herself, starving herself and working too hard, because of also wanting my dad's approval and admiration. So she didn't pay any attention to me and my problems at all, except that she was jealous of me and would always say she wished she looked like me. And of course my dad still thought I was too fat, so they didn't take me in to anyone for help. I passed out at least 5 times a year or so, because my dad made me work so hard on farms and outside etc. But He would just say get back to work when I came too. Finally when I was sixteen my mom started noticing that I would go days without eating or drinking a thing. She tried to force me to eat, and that just made it worse, cuz I thought in my irrational way of thinking that she just wanted me to be fat, so she wouldn't be jealous any more. She forced me to eat a Bagel one day, before she would let me go to a dance and I threw up everywhere and my dad said leave her alone, she'll eat if she's hungry, she looks great. That's when my mom started realizing I had a problem. I was still only 96lbs at age 16 and now wore a double C bra, so extremely skinny everywhere else. I had guys after me all the time, so I thought I must be perfect and beautiful, but I hurt all the time and was not emotionally well at all. So for me the biggest factor was pleasing people and wanting to fit in. I never worried about light or low fat stuff, just that less of anything is better. And when I did eat it was things I liked like Pizza or candy bars, but because I was not eating healthy or on a regular basis I would throw up or it would all come through my system so quickly, that I could not even hardly digest it, and got no substance or fat from it. I had three friends that got so anerexic that they had to be hospitalized for months and one of them over a year. But unfortunately, the hospital only helps force you to gain weight it doesn't usually correct the mental or emotional cause of the problem. Kids just learn what they need to say to get out, and then are even more sneaky about it. So my advice to you for now, is find the root of the problem. Until you know the root of it, forcing often makes things worse, because the girl feels like she is being controlled in everything she does, including what she eats, and her way of being independant is by choosing not to eat even if it means lying. I know she is Autistic, but depending on how far behind, it may be helpful for you to have her watch some movies about other girls who became anerexic and had very negative effects. I saw one on TV my 1st year of college and it made me very scared when I first actually realized that I was anerexic and was like the girl in the movie and that she almost died. It gave me a wake up call. And then my friend, now husband, watching me eat and making sure he was with me at nearly every meal, so that I couldn't lie to him really did help because I thought he was cool and wanted his admiration now more than my dad's. So I listened to him and changed. But I am a lucky case many kids have to change very young or they never will. I am not trying to scare you, just letting you know that I have taken Phsycology classes on Anerexia and Bulemia and have gone to counceling etc. and most people who become this way have many outside factors that make them feel this way, and unfortunately sometimes it can either be us as parents or our childrens close friends or even their friends mom or a relative or sibbling that is either too controlling and so the child chooses that as their method of having choice, or because they feel like someone they admire or want to be like is really skinny or tells them they need to be. So first try and figure out what that factor could be, even taking a good look at yourself and talk to your daughter about it and ask her about her feelings. Maybe who she admires or looks up to most. See what kind of movies she likes most or magazines she looks at. If all the girls are twigs who talk about being skinnier, that could be a source too. Just don't be too pushy demanding, controling or forceful. And if she keeps being this way and you are too concerned let her see on of the those movies about anerexic people's lives and ask her if she wants that. If she won't change and you feel you need to take her in for help at the hospital, give her one more chance before she goes. Say " I know you don't like the doctors, but you are not eating enough and you are getting sick. The doctors are there to help you, even if it has to hurt sometimes. Now if you think you can change and eat more, everything that we ask you to, you can have one more chance before we have to take you there. But if you still can't gain weight we may need to take you in, to see if their is something wrong with your body that we can get fixed " . Of course in your own words and at her level, but you see what I mean. If she is afraid enough of the doctors, maybe she'll try harder, but don't try to scare her, because she may have to go to them. I sure hope this can help and I hope that You guys can get this worked out and taken care of while she is still young. If you have any questions for me, pretty much nothing is too personal, I've become very open over the years, in order to help myself and help others. I'd love to help in any way possible, and hope that this applies somewhat to your daughter, so you can help her. Sincerely, Esther --- wrote: > > Has anyone dealt with hospitalization of their > AS/NLD/OCD daughter? > > My almost 13 yr old has an eating disorder (I may > have posted this > earlier-am usually a lurker though) that she only > eats what her big > sister eats. This has caused her to be unable to > gain weight. She > lost weight prior to the onset of this ritual from > two months of flu, > and a health/nutrition focus about amonth prior to > that. When she > needed to gain she adopted this " safe, just right " > ritual which I > attribute to OCD (2 other of my children have ocd > also, but not the > aspergers/AS qualities). > > So ever since (several months now) her weight has > hovered at a > dangerously low level, and over time she has taken > on some anorexic > qualities-thinking she looks fat-which was never an > issue before. > (She always ate well, but was slender, before this > weight loss, and > we have never pushed any diets or appearance stuff > in the home.. but > did push hard fo her to gain weght after her flus). > > She did terribly with an overnight hospitalization > to assess her > medically for anorexia, she was incoherent, > screaming, and unable to > communicate or cooperate after several hours (it was > overnight since > the admission took place finally at 10 pm, we could > not get her to > the hospital without physical force). She could not > sleep there, > there are windows/lights into the room facing the > nurses station etc, > plus no chance to be alone (had to always be > 'sitter' with her-mostly > it was me, but I had to leave to see my 2 yr old at > home who still > nurses) and she could not do her showering routine > and stuff which > calms her. > > Most of the staff did not understand the extent of > her sensory > defensiveness, the bright lighting problems, being > questioned > persistently, physical exams so on. Upon her return > home (she was > released as stable, with orders to seek outpatient > treatment, but her > BMI is only around 13-and the local outpatient > center won't take her > if she cannot eat some meals with the clinic) she > had flashbacks of > screaming " they won't stop touching me " , the first > one initially > lasted two hours. It took her awhile to return to > normal routines > withhout frequent panicky meltdowns. She cannot have > any sedating > medications until she gains weight (plus she had > severe reaction to > zoloft a year ago) and I cannot get her to see a > doctor now due to > her fear (she feels betrayed by our doctor and our > the p-doc who > admitted her to hospital). > > Fortunately she is eating OK lately but I have to > get my 16 yr old > to eat more, which is not fair to her, and it is > still not enough for > my 13 yr old to gain weight to a level I feel safe > with. We have not > been able to break this ritual-have tried gradual > exposures (eating > two bites more, eating separately etc) but the > effects are minimal, > though I want to keep working at trying to increase > the exposures. > > My daughter claims the ritual will just " fall away " > when it is no > longer needed by her, as has often been the case > with other rituals > and hyper-focuses she has adopted in the past, but I > have my doubts- > after a certain amt of weight loss, there seems to > be an addictive > quality to maintaining the low weight, and she is > excercizing more- > The anorexia is biochemically triggered somehow by > the weight loss. > > I am hoping possibly to distract her from the > ritualized eating, and > increase her positive feelings by allowing her to > foster orphan > kittens with a rescue group-she and her younger > sister have done this > once before with a neighbor's litter (round the > clock bottle feeding) > and she was very good at it-she has two cats of her > own she is > devoted to. I'm hoping with some weight gain, if we > can achieve it, > her brain biocemistry wil return to pre-anorexic-IOW > she'll be able > to go back to normal eating gain, with out fears. > > In the meantime I have been thinking of just setting > up a > preadmission to the hospital and we will have to be > ready to take her > if she loses weight (if my older daughter travels, > or gets sick, or > if she gets sick). But this is my dilemma- I think > the hopsital could > do as much harm as good. > > She needs to be transferred to an inpatient unit for > eating disorders > over two hours away, there is nothing local to > handle this. I have 6 > kids, several with milder neuro-differences (and a 2 > yr old) and it > would be hard for me to be away (understatement) but > I could not > leave my 13 year old alone in another city either. > It would be hard > for my husband too, who has little finesse with > accepting the neuro- > problems, much less the every day normalities of > large family and my > homeschooling. He gets frustrated easily- but he > works hard and > sucessfully at supporting us. My sister could come > out if needed. > > But I also fear my daughter regressing seriously in > a hospital > setting, moreover at her low weight sedatives or > medications which > could calm her are contraindicated, if she has low > blood pressure and > low heart rate, she has to gain weight first. I > wonder how they would > be able to relax her. Since she will not eat without > her > sister/ritual she will have to go on an NG tube, is > my educated > guess, and that too will be a sensory nightmare for > her. > > How can I calm my fears about her being hospitalized > so I can take > the right steps to protect her health (even getting > her to > pediatrician is hard) but yet at the same time to > protect her health, > in my mind, puts her mental status at serious risk, > I am afraid she > could just go totally off and not return to herself > for a long > time...and we both have worked so hard at keeping > her stable and > functioning. Maybe I am catastrophizing, or maybe > the hospital would > deal with this better than I expect... > > There is also the matter of getting her to a > hospital, it takes > physical force-she will fight and scratch which is > very stressful in > her weakened state. I felt horrible having to > forcefully push her > into the van screaming (for the overnight admission) > and shut the > door on her, no seatbelt, as she sat on the floor > screaming. > > I feel like the hospital would need to combine > approaches for the > eating disorder, the OCD, and the autistic qualities > (which only come > out when she is way from her home and > routine-othwerwise people don't > much see it). Can a teen inpatient unit for > anorexics handle her? She > is not the typical anorexic-she should really be on > an autistic ward > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2005 Report Share Posted April 7, 2005 What a great sharing! Why do people feel the need to comment on one's weight? I have an aunt who has belittled my weight my entire life, along with my mother and grandmothers. I mean, I don't say to my aunt every time, " Well, how much liquor have you drank this week? " or my mother, " How many people have you cursed out? You know, you've got such a pretty face... " . Looking back at my pics, I was rarely heavy. But now I am, greatly because of obsessing on my weight. I never, ever make comments about fat people or skinny people, it's just not something I wish to have come out of my mouth. My eldest NT daughter is a little over weight, her BMI is around 24 and she's 8 yrs old. She complains about her appearance and I constantly tell her she's beautiful and that she needs to focus on being healthy and looking like her, not someone else. When she was four yrs old she saw a pic of a model in a swimsuit and said, " I want my belly to be flat like that. " How scary is that. debi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2005 Report Share Posted April 7, 2005 What a great sharing! Why do people feel the need to comment on one's weight? I have an aunt who has belittled my weight my entire life, along with my mother and grandmothers. I mean, I don't say to my aunt every time, " Well, how much liquor have you drank this week? " or my mother, " How many people have you cursed out? You know, you've got such a pretty face... " . Looking back at my pics, I was rarely heavy. But now I am, greatly because of obsessing on my weight. I never, ever make comments about fat people or skinny people, it's just not something I wish to have come out of my mouth. My eldest NT daughter is a little over weight, her BMI is around 24 and she's 8 yrs old. She complains about her appearance and I constantly tell her she's beautiful and that she needs to focus on being healthy and looking like her, not someone else. When she was four yrs old she saw a pic of a model in a swimsuit and said, " I want my belly to be flat like that. " How scary is that. debi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2005 Report Share Posted April 7, 2005 What a great sharing! Why do people feel the need to comment on one's weight? I have an aunt who has belittled my weight my entire life, along with my mother and grandmothers. I mean, I don't say to my aunt every time, " Well, how much liquor have you drank this week? " or my mother, " How many people have you cursed out? You know, you've got such a pretty face... " . Looking back at my pics, I was rarely heavy. But now I am, greatly because of obsessing on my weight. I never, ever make comments about fat people or skinny people, it's just not something I wish to have come out of my mouth. My eldest NT daughter is a little over weight, her BMI is around 24 and she's 8 yrs old. She complains about her appearance and I constantly tell her she's beautiful and that she needs to focus on being healthy and looking like her, not someone else. When she was four yrs old she saw a pic of a model in a swimsuit and said, " I want my belly to be flat like that. " How scary is that. debi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2005 Report Share Posted April 7, 2005 I am sorry that children, and adults too, are ever made to suffer so much for their weight. Esther's story is an example of severe emotional abuse in my opinion. Our society with it's materialism and status seeking adds to these appearance obsessions, but I think anorexia is triggered as much by predisposing biochemisty/anxiety as by environment. Rapid weight loss due to reasons other than dieting can also result in anorexia-a biochemical change takes place. Someone predisposed to obsessive anxiety can be triggered into anorexia by preoccupation with weight and nutrition coming from family etc, just as someone predisposed to obsessive anxiety can be triggered into cleanliness/washing obsessions by constantly being reminded of germs and contaminants. I don't think the unaware unthinking remarks can be fully blamed. With ocd, I just think it is going to manifest one way or another, if it is genetically present. So I would like to point out that that anorexia is not always a consequence of mothers (or dads) who diet and are totally into fashion or who make critical remarks about appearance or who hold their child to perfectionistic standards. This has been a little hard for me to deal with (but actually least of my concerns) i.e the assumptions that I must be overbearing or controlling somehow (or neglectful/not loving enough?) and into weight control. I have 6 kids and home school and most of my kids have problems in the neuro-psychological spectrum. My 13 yr old and 16 yr old are most severely affected, but only my 13 yr old has the autie or aspie qualities. Weight is the least of our concerns-we just try to get everyone fed regularly and with some degree of organization. One of the most prominent symptoms I deal with in this family is OCD (husband and I both shadow syndrome OCD-ers, with more severely affected siblings) and with a combo of OCD and aspergers like my daughter has, you never know what focus or concern is going to morph into a rigid obsession with compulsions. She was triggered by a nutrition focus with her best friend across the street (also homeschooled, and understands my daughter b/c this girl has a brother with OCD and sensory defensiveness). This girl was trying to help her dad lose a bit of weight for his insurance physical and my daughter was in on the discussions/plans for his diet. Father/daughter were also jogging lightly together and began inviting my daughter along. At first I thought this was great b/c my daughter had to wear athletic pants and sneakers-she who has never worn anything but flowing long skirts. It seemed pretty harmless, she had always eaten well-and enjoyed whatever I served,but was slender- never a big appetite. But for my daughter such focuses can become hyper-focuses and can then turn into obsessions. (Prior to the nutrition obsession she was obsessed with papillon dogs and pestered relentlesly and tearfully daily to get one- brought books, contacted beeders etc-this was after holding one just once in the pet store). Her more severe weight loss occurred with the 2 severe flus in succesion-and this triggered ME into fear and pushing for her to GAIN weight. I did not realize all was falling into place, in a sense, for anorexia to blossom. My fears translated in my daughter's mind to a need to eat " safely " -which was accomplished by copying her sister- who must know how to eat well since she looks healthy (not thin) and does not worry about food/weight. My 13 yr old actually is not afraid of being fat (or was not initially, but her self-perceptions gradually began to distort) but is deathly afraid if she changes her ritual (copying precisely what her sister eats) she will face some terrible consequence, such as not ever being able to eat again. She actually WANTS to eat, and suffers when my older daughter misses a meal, but is restricted by the OCD. It is very maddening. My p-doc has suggested zyprexa and I am looking int the side effects etc b/c my daughter had severe reaction to zoloft (for panic) a year ago and I wanted never to try meds again. (Anyone have experience with zyprexa?) nancy > > What a great sharing! Why do people feel the need to comment on one's > weight? I have an aunt who has belittled my weight my entire life, > along with my mother and grandmothers. I mean, I don't say to my aunt > every time, " Well, how much liquor have you drank this week? " or my > mother, " How many people have you cursed out? You know, you've got > such a pretty face... " . Looking back at my pics, I was rarely heavy. > But now I am, greatly because of obsessing on my weight. I never, ever > make comments about fat people or skinny people, it's just not > something I wish to have come out of my mouth. > > My eldest NT daughter is a little over weight, her BMI is around 24 > and she's 8 yrs old. She complains about her appearance and I > constantly tell her she's beautiful and that she needs to focus on > being healthy and looking like her, not someone else. When she was > four yrs old she saw a pic of a model in a swimsuit and said, " I want > my belly to be flat like that. " How scary is that. > > debi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2005 Report Share Posted April 7, 2005 I am sorry that children, and adults too, are ever made to suffer so much for their weight. Esther's story is an example of severe emotional abuse in my opinion. Our society with it's materialism and status seeking adds to these appearance obsessions, but I think anorexia is triggered as much by predisposing biochemisty/anxiety as by environment. Rapid weight loss due to reasons other than dieting can also result in anorexia-a biochemical change takes place. Someone predisposed to obsessive anxiety can be triggered into anorexia by preoccupation with weight and nutrition coming from family etc, just as someone predisposed to obsessive anxiety can be triggered into cleanliness/washing obsessions by constantly being reminded of germs and contaminants. I don't think the unaware unthinking remarks can be fully blamed. With ocd, I just think it is going to manifest one way or another, if it is genetically present. So I would like to point out that that anorexia is not always a consequence of mothers (or dads) who diet and are totally into fashion or who make critical remarks about appearance or who hold their child to perfectionistic standards. This has been a little hard for me to deal with (but actually least of my concerns) i.e the assumptions that I must be overbearing or controlling somehow (or neglectful/not loving enough?) and into weight control. I have 6 kids and home school and most of my kids have problems in the neuro-psychological spectrum. My 13 yr old and 16 yr old are most severely affected, but only my 13 yr old has the autie or aspie qualities. Weight is the least of our concerns-we just try to get everyone fed regularly and with some degree of organization. One of the most prominent symptoms I deal with in this family is OCD (husband and I both shadow syndrome OCD-ers, with more severely affected siblings) and with a combo of OCD and aspergers like my daughter has, you never know what focus or concern is going to morph into a rigid obsession with compulsions. She was triggered by a nutrition focus with her best friend across the street (also homeschooled, and understands my daughter b/c this girl has a brother with OCD and sensory defensiveness). This girl was trying to help her dad lose a bit of weight for his insurance physical and my daughter was in on the discussions/plans for his diet. Father/daughter were also jogging lightly together and began inviting my daughter along. At first I thought this was great b/c my daughter had to wear athletic pants and sneakers-she who has never worn anything but flowing long skirts. It seemed pretty harmless, she had always eaten well-and enjoyed whatever I served,but was slender- never a big appetite. But for my daughter such focuses can become hyper-focuses and can then turn into obsessions. (Prior to the nutrition obsession she was obsessed with papillon dogs and pestered relentlesly and tearfully daily to get one- brought books, contacted beeders etc-this was after holding one just once in the pet store). Her more severe weight loss occurred with the 2 severe flus in succesion-and this triggered ME into fear and pushing for her to GAIN weight. I did not realize all was falling into place, in a sense, for anorexia to blossom. My fears translated in my daughter's mind to a need to eat " safely " -which was accomplished by copying her sister- who must know how to eat well since she looks healthy (not thin) and does not worry about food/weight. My 13 yr old actually is not afraid of being fat (or was not initially, but her self-perceptions gradually began to distort) but is deathly afraid if she changes her ritual (copying precisely what her sister eats) she will face some terrible consequence, such as not ever being able to eat again. She actually WANTS to eat, and suffers when my older daughter misses a meal, but is restricted by the OCD. It is very maddening. My p-doc has suggested zyprexa and I am looking int the side effects etc b/c my daughter had severe reaction to zoloft (for panic) a year ago and I wanted never to try meds again. (Anyone have experience with zyprexa?) nancy > > What a great sharing! Why do people feel the need to comment on one's > weight? I have an aunt who has belittled my weight my entire life, > along with my mother and grandmothers. I mean, I don't say to my aunt > every time, " Well, how much liquor have you drank this week? " or my > mother, " How many people have you cursed out? You know, you've got > such a pretty face... " . Looking back at my pics, I was rarely heavy. > But now I am, greatly because of obsessing on my weight. I never, ever > make comments about fat people or skinny people, it's just not > something I wish to have come out of my mouth. > > My eldest NT daughter is a little over weight, her BMI is around 24 > and she's 8 yrs old. She complains about her appearance and I > constantly tell her she's beautiful and that she needs to focus on > being healthy and looking like her, not someone else. When she was > four yrs old she saw a pic of a model in a swimsuit and said, " I want > my belly to be flat like that. " How scary is that. > > debi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2005 Report Share Posted April 7, 2005 I am sorry that children, and adults too, are ever made to suffer so much for their weight. Esther's story is an example of severe emotional abuse in my opinion. Our society with it's materialism and status seeking adds to these appearance obsessions, but I think anorexia is triggered as much by predisposing biochemisty/anxiety as by environment. Rapid weight loss due to reasons other than dieting can also result in anorexia-a biochemical change takes place. Someone predisposed to obsessive anxiety can be triggered into anorexia by preoccupation with weight and nutrition coming from family etc, just as someone predisposed to obsessive anxiety can be triggered into cleanliness/washing obsessions by constantly being reminded of germs and contaminants. I don't think the unaware unthinking remarks can be fully blamed. With ocd, I just think it is going to manifest one way or another, if it is genetically present. So I would like to point out that that anorexia is not always a consequence of mothers (or dads) who diet and are totally into fashion or who make critical remarks about appearance or who hold their child to perfectionistic standards. This has been a little hard for me to deal with (but actually least of my concerns) i.e the assumptions that I must be overbearing or controlling somehow (or neglectful/not loving enough?) and into weight control. I have 6 kids and home school and most of my kids have problems in the neuro-psychological spectrum. My 13 yr old and 16 yr old are most severely affected, but only my 13 yr old has the autie or aspie qualities. Weight is the least of our concerns-we just try to get everyone fed regularly and with some degree of organization. One of the most prominent symptoms I deal with in this family is OCD (husband and I both shadow syndrome OCD-ers, with more severely affected siblings) and with a combo of OCD and aspergers like my daughter has, you never know what focus or concern is going to morph into a rigid obsession with compulsions. She was triggered by a nutrition focus with her best friend across the street (also homeschooled, and understands my daughter b/c this girl has a brother with OCD and sensory defensiveness). This girl was trying to help her dad lose a bit of weight for his insurance physical and my daughter was in on the discussions/plans for his diet. Father/daughter were also jogging lightly together and began inviting my daughter along. At first I thought this was great b/c my daughter had to wear athletic pants and sneakers-she who has never worn anything but flowing long skirts. It seemed pretty harmless, she had always eaten well-and enjoyed whatever I served,but was slender- never a big appetite. But for my daughter such focuses can become hyper-focuses and can then turn into obsessions. (Prior to the nutrition obsession she was obsessed with papillon dogs and pestered relentlesly and tearfully daily to get one- brought books, contacted beeders etc-this was after holding one just once in the pet store). Her more severe weight loss occurred with the 2 severe flus in succesion-and this triggered ME into fear and pushing for her to GAIN weight. I did not realize all was falling into place, in a sense, for anorexia to blossom. My fears translated in my daughter's mind to a need to eat " safely " -which was accomplished by copying her sister- who must know how to eat well since she looks healthy (not thin) and does not worry about food/weight. My 13 yr old actually is not afraid of being fat (or was not initially, but her self-perceptions gradually began to distort) but is deathly afraid if she changes her ritual (copying precisely what her sister eats) she will face some terrible consequence, such as not ever being able to eat again. She actually WANTS to eat, and suffers when my older daughter misses a meal, but is restricted by the OCD. It is very maddening. My p-doc has suggested zyprexa and I am looking int the side effects etc b/c my daughter had severe reaction to zoloft (for panic) a year ago and I wanted never to try meds again. (Anyone have experience with zyprexa?) nancy > > What a great sharing! Why do people feel the need to comment on one's > weight? I have an aunt who has belittled my weight my entire life, > along with my mother and grandmothers. I mean, I don't say to my aunt > every time, " Well, how much liquor have you drank this week? " or my > mother, " How many people have you cursed out? You know, you've got > such a pretty face... " . Looking back at my pics, I was rarely heavy. > But now I am, greatly because of obsessing on my weight. I never, ever > make comments about fat people or skinny people, it's just not > something I wish to have come out of my mouth. > > My eldest NT daughter is a little over weight, her BMI is around 24 > and she's 8 yrs old. She complains about her appearance and I > constantly tell her she's beautiful and that she needs to focus on > being healthy and looking like her, not someone else. When she was > four yrs old she saw a pic of a model in a swimsuit and said, " I want > my belly to be flat like that. " How scary is that. > > debi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2005 Report Share Posted July 18, 2005 Would it be possible to enlist your older daughter's help in getting her to the hospital? Would she go if big sis went along with her? It's a lot to ask of her, but if she would go through the basics of a physical in front of Theresa, maybe it would make it easier. In the long run, if Theresa gets help, your older daughter's life will get better too, so maybe that will motivate her to help out. Also, with the meds, maybe get a similar looking vitamin or candy your older daughter can take, to allow the meds into her ritual? I know you don't want to lose trust by tricking her, but maybe if she got the meds in her a little while, the rituals might ease up to the point where she is able to take them with out your older daughter around. Amnesty > > , I'm so sorry for your struggles, I remember your previous > > postings. Have you ever tried medication for her anxiety/ocd? I know > > meds are never a good first-option, but she has such extreme issues > it > > might help bridge the gap to calm her enough to begin to comprehend > > the dangers she's putting her body in. > > > > Have you contacted any anorexia support groups? I'm thinking perhaps > > they can help on the hospitalization issue, since they've been there- > > done that sorta thing. Really anorexia is both mental and physical, > I > > don't understand what's wrong with these idiot professionals who put > > kids' lives in danger. > > > > Debi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2005 Report Share Posted July 18, 2005 Would it be possible to enlist your older daughter's help in getting her to the hospital? Would she go if big sis went along with her? It's a lot to ask of her, but if she would go through the basics of a physical in front of Theresa, maybe it would make it easier. In the long run, if Theresa gets help, your older daughter's life will get better too, so maybe that will motivate her to help out. Also, with the meds, maybe get a similar looking vitamin or candy your older daughter can take, to allow the meds into her ritual? I know you don't want to lose trust by tricking her, but maybe if she got the meds in her a little while, the rituals might ease up to the point where she is able to take them with out your older daughter around. Amnesty > > , I'm so sorry for your struggles, I remember your previous > > postings. Have you ever tried medication for her anxiety/ocd? I know > > meds are never a good first-option, but she has such extreme issues > it > > might help bridge the gap to calm her enough to begin to comprehend > > the dangers she's putting her body in. > > > > Have you contacted any anorexia support groups? I'm thinking perhaps > > they can help on the hospitalization issue, since they've been there- > > done that sorta thing. Really anorexia is both mental and physical, > I > > don't understand what's wrong with these idiot professionals who put > > kids' lives in danger. > > > > Debi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2005 Report Share Posted July 18, 2005 Would it be possible to enlist your older daughter's help in getting her to the hospital? Would she go if big sis went along with her? It's a lot to ask of her, but if she would go through the basics of a physical in front of Theresa, maybe it would make it easier. In the long run, if Theresa gets help, your older daughter's life will get better too, so maybe that will motivate her to help out. Also, with the meds, maybe get a similar looking vitamin or candy your older daughter can take, to allow the meds into her ritual? I know you don't want to lose trust by tricking her, but maybe if she got the meds in her a little while, the rituals might ease up to the point where she is able to take them with out your older daughter around. Amnesty > > , I'm so sorry for your struggles, I remember your previous > > postings. Have you ever tried medication for her anxiety/ocd? I know > > meds are never a good first-option, but she has such extreme issues > it > > might help bridge the gap to calm her enough to begin to comprehend > > the dangers she's putting her body in. > > > > Have you contacted any anorexia support groups? I'm thinking perhaps > > they can help on the hospitalization issue, since they've been there- > > done that sorta thing. Really anorexia is both mental and physical, > I > > don't understand what's wrong with these idiot professionals who put > > kids' lives in danger. > > > > Debi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2005 Report Share Posted July 19, 2005 When reading your post I got to thinking about the idea of giving sis some sugar pill and getting med for your Theresa compounded to look like it. Maybe then she'd start? I feel for you, such a difficult situation... Debi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2005 Report Share Posted July 19, 2005 When reading your post I got to thinking about the idea of giving sis some sugar pill and getting med for your Theresa compounded to look like it. Maybe then she'd start? I feel for you, such a difficult situation... Debi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2005 Report Share Posted July 19, 2005 What's the reasoning? I say if you don't feel right, I'd strongly consider not doing it. Debi > Any girls on Valproic? > Ellas nero wants her to start asap...I dont1 > Aimee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2005 Report Share Posted July 19, 2005 What's the reasoning? I say if you don't feel right, I'd strongly consider not doing it. Debi > Any girls on Valproic? > Ellas nero wants her to start asap...I dont1 > Aimee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2005 Report Share Posted July 19, 2005 What's the reasoning? I say if you don't feel right, I'd strongly consider not doing it. Debi > Any girls on Valproic? > Ellas nero wants her to start asap...I dont1 > Aimee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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