Re: variances in TSH? So bizarre.

[Guest guest]

CVS carries Unithroid.Courtenay wrote:

I am really puzzled. When I had my TSH tested two weeks ago by my new, odd semi-naturopathic MD (who I may quit, long story), it came back as 7.1 with the usual reference range of .5-5.0 or so. And it "felt" like my TSH was really out of range; I had that terrible fatigue I always get during my menstrual cycle and I had severe hypo symptoms until four days after my cycle.A week later, I had my TSH/T4/T3 tested by my endocrinologist because the naturopath did not run T4/T3 tests. I just called in and got my latest TSH from Monday, and apparently, it has dropped to 3.1.Huh?The things that are different between the two tests are simple: I was on my period when my first test was run, and the first test was run by a different lab than the second test. For both tests, I was

off my medications when the blood was drawn, and I had not eaten anything.I also got my T4 results from the Monday tests. I came back at .9, reference range .9-1.9. I will be getting my free T3 results from that same test next monday.Can a TSH jump from a menstrual cycle? Or is there something funny going on between the two labs?Also, the doctor and I talked about the possibility of adding in synthetic T4, and we are looking at trying Unithroid. Is there any way to call the company that produces Unithroid and figure out which pharmacies carry their products?Best--Courtenay.__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

You are so kind. What does CVS stand for?

Courtenay.

CVS carries Unithroid.

Courtenay

wrote:

I am really puzzled. When

I had my TSH tested two weeks ago by my

new, odd semi-naturopathic MD (who I may quit, long story), it

came

back as 7.1 with the usual reference range of .5-5.0 or so. And

it

" felt " like my TSH was really out of range; I had that

terrible

fatigue I always get during my menstrual cycle and I had severe

hypo

symptoms until four days after my cycle.

A week later, I had my TSH/T4/T3 tested by my endocrinologist

because

the naturopath did not run T4/T3 tests. I just called in and got

my

latest TSH from Monday, and apparently, it has dropped to 3.1.

Huh?

The things that are different between the two tests are simple:

I

was on my period when my first test was run, and the first test

was

run by a different lab than the second test. For both tests, I

was

off my medications when the blood was drawn, and I had not eaten

anything.

I also got my T4 results from the Monday tests. I came back at

..9,

reference range .9-1.9. I will be getting my free T3 results

from

that same test next monday.

Can a TSH jump from a menstrual cycle? Or is there something

funny

going on between the two labs?

Also, the doctor and I talked about the possibility of adding in

synthetic T4, and we are looking at trying Unithroid. Is there

any

way to call the company that produces Unithroid and figure out

which

pharmacies carry their products?

Best--

Courtenay.

[Guest guest]

You are so kind. What does CVS stand for?

Courtenay.

CVS carries Unithroid.

Courtenay

wrote:

I am really puzzled. When

I had my TSH tested two weeks ago by my

new, odd semi-naturopathic MD (who I may quit, long story), it

came

back as 7.1 with the usual reference range of .5-5.0 or so. And

it

" felt " like my TSH was really out of range; I had that

terrible

fatigue I always get during my menstrual cycle and I had severe

hypo

symptoms until four days after my cycle.

A week later, I had my TSH/T4/T3 tested by my endocrinologist

because

the naturopath did not run T4/T3 tests. I just called in and got

my

latest TSH from Monday, and apparently, it has dropped to 3.1.

Huh?

The things that are different between the two tests are simple:

I

was on my period when my first test was run, and the first test

was

run by a different lab than the second test. For both tests, I

was

off my medications when the blood was drawn, and I had not eaten

anything.

I also got my T4 results from the Monday tests. I came back at

..9,

reference range .9-1.9. I will be getting my free T3 results

from

that same test next monday.

Can a TSH jump from a menstrual cycle? Or is there something

funny

going on between the two labs?

Also, the doctor and I talked about the possibility of adding in

synthetic T4, and we are looking at trying Unithroid. Is there

any

way to call the company that produces Unithroid and figure out

which

pharmacies carry their products?

Best--

Courtenay.

[Guest guest]

Thyroid function does vary depending on your cycle and demand can

be higher during your period. So, you TSH might have actually been

7.0 during that time. Labs also make mistakes and do slopy work.

That could explain it also. Then, you need to take into account that

thyroid status actually varies a lot and it could be just variation.

If you had a lot of stress a few days before the test or ate a lot

of goitergens, etc. This can raise TSH.

A TSH of 3.0 is still impaired thyroid function. Anything above 2.0

is impaired. A Free T4 at the bottom is definitely hypo. The ranges

are skewed toward hypothyroidism because they are determined by who

has the tests and the majority of those who have thyroid tests are

either sick of old, both of which makes thyroid function less than

optimal. You need to try and get numbers for Free T3 and Free T4

above the midline of the range. Some docs like to see patients in

the upper 1/3 of the range.

Tish

[Guest guest]

Thank you, Tish. You're a regular encyclopedia of useful

knowledge. Here's what I want to know, now-- is my thyroid going

to keep bouncing up and down like that every time I have a period?

This is the first occasion I have had to do two tests in such a short

span, and it verified my notion that my TSH was going up (and

T4/T3 were going down) during my menstrual cycle.

I am definitely still hypo. No doubts there.

Thyroid function does vary

depending on your cycle and demand can

be higher during your period. So, you TSH might have actually been

7.0 during that time. Labs also make mistakes and do slopy work.

That could explain it also. Then, you need to take into account

that

thyroid status actually varies a lot and it could be just

variation.

If you had a lot of stress a few days before the test or ate a lot

of goitergens, etc. This can raise TSH.

A TSH of 3.0 is still impaired thyroid function. Anything above

2.0

is impaired. A Free T4 at the bottom is definitely hypo. The

ranges

are skewed toward hypothyroidism because they are determined by

who

has the tests and the majority of those who have thyroid tests are

either sick of old, both of which makes thyroid function less than

optimal. You need to try and get numbers for Free T3 and Free T4

above the midline of the range. Some docs like to see patients in

the upper 1/3 of the range.

Tish

[Guest guest]

Thank you, Tish. You're a regular encyclopedia of useful

knowledge. Here's what I want to know, now-- is my thyroid going

to keep bouncing up and down like that every time I have a period?

This is the first occasion I have had to do two tests in such a short

span, and it verified my notion that my TSH was going up (and

T4/T3 were going down) during my menstrual cycle.

I am definitely still hypo. No doubts there.

Thyroid function does vary

depending on your cycle and demand can

be higher during your period. So, you TSH might have actually been

7.0 during that time. Labs also make mistakes and do slopy work.

That could explain it also. Then, you need to take into account

that

thyroid status actually varies a lot and it could be just

variation.

If you had a lot of stress a few days before the test or ate a lot

of goitergens, etc. This can raise TSH.

A TSH of 3.0 is still impaired thyroid function. Anything above

2.0

is impaired. A Free T4 at the bottom is definitely hypo. The

ranges

are skewed toward hypothyroidism because they are determined by

who

has the tests and the majority of those who have thyroid tests are

either sick of old, both of which makes thyroid function less than

optimal. You need to try and get numbers for Free T3 and Free T4

above the midline of the range. Some docs like to see patients in

the upper 1/3 of the range.

Tish

[Guest guest]

I think the amount of variation would really deminish if you were on

sufficient thyroid replacement. A TSH above 3.0 is considered

hypothyroid according to the new ranges set by the endos. These new

ranges were set about two years ago and are 0.5 to 3.0 instead of

0.5 to 5.0 and I have yet to see a US lab that has kept up with the

times and has adopted these. Any TSH above 2.0 is impaired thyroid

function and people who fit this category have higher rates of heart

disease and other conditions related to hypothyroidism. You really

need to be 1.0 or below for the best health.

TSH is really an indirect measure of thyroid function and for many

people on pills, it is overly low and not very useful for

determining actual thyroid status. When the pituitary has to put out

a lot of TSH for a long time, it eventually gets sort of burned out

and stops responding to low thyroid blood levels and then it will

always put out lower TSH than it should. Then if your doctor fixates

on it to adjust your thyroid dose, you will always be hypo. So, one

of the the best measures of thyroid status is Free T3 and Free T4.

Here, you need to be above the midline of the ranges and better yet

in the upper 1/3 of the ranges. This is because Free T4 and Free T3

tests are skewed toward hypothyroidism due to the ranges being

determined by the people who get tested. Most who get thyroid tests

are hypothyroid to some extent by the fact that they are either

sick, old, or hypothyroid and that is why they are having the test.

But, if you really want to know how you are doing, you need to use

the Broda Barne's Basal Body temperature test or go to Dr. Rind's

page and use these methods: http://www.drrind.com/tempgraph.asp

Body temperature is an actual measure of metabolic rate, which is

controlled by thyroid and adrenal. This is an excellent way to see

what is going on without tests. Tests have a lot of variation

depending on your cycle, what your diet is like, whether you have a

head cold or other sickness or if you have too much stress that day.

Taking your temps over a longer period gives a beter average of what

your status is. This is too time consuming for doctors and requires

they explain it and so it has fallen out of fashion, even though it

is an excellent method.

Anyway, I think that if you got your thyroid dose up higher, then

TSH would even out and not have so much variation and at the same

time you would feel better most of the month and not have so much

cyclic variation in how you feel. The reason that more thyroid is

needed during your period has in part to do with it being a stress

on the body, which causes a higher demand for cortisol. More

cortisol production means thyroid will be used up at a higher rate.

Your thyroid cannot keep up with the extra demand and so thyroid

hormone is depleted from the blood causing the brain to release more

TSH to try and stimulate more production from the thyroid. So, you

really need to provide more thyroid hromone in the form of pills so

the body can get what it needs as your thyroid can't. If you had

adequate levels of T4, then the body could convert more of it when

it needs it. T4 is like a storage cabinate that the body can use in

times of increased demand. It sits there inactive for the most part

until it is needed. Then it is converted to T3 for extra energy. So,

if T4 is too low, the body does not have much to convert and this

causes a big rise in TSH in response.

Before heavy use of the TSH test, which began around 1975, thyroid

doses averaged 3 to 5 grains. Synthroid doses were also much higher -

300 to 500 mcg. You cannot overdose on any dose less than your

healthy thyroid would make, which is about 4-1/2 to 5 grains a day.

This is because any amount you take less than that, the thyroid will

drop production by that much. So, if you take 1 grain, your

pituitary is supposed to drop production of TSH to tell your thyroid

to make 3-1/2 to 4 more to make the total 4-1/2 to 5 or some total

that is right for you. But, in reality, low dose thyroid therapy

sometimes causes the pituitary to not tell the thyroid to make

enough to get the total up to 4-1/2 or 5 or where you need it. In

this case, the thyroid dose needs to be higher to overcome the

problem. Anyway, your thyroid dose can go up a lot, at least to

about 4 grains without causing an overdose because of the pituitary

corrections made that keep things right. In the past, or 50 years

before the modern tests people just slowly raised their doses untill

they felt good and became normal. Thyroid patients lived long and

healthy lives. The first two patients that started their treatment

in the late 1800s lived to be 79 and 91 and were in good health most

of their lives.

You can have hyper symptoms on lower doses of thryoid than your

healthy thyroid would make if you have health issues that prevent

the body from being able to use it. These are adrenal fatigue,

anemia, low protein and caloric restriction, and vitamin and mineral

deficiencies.

My opinion is that your dose is not sufficient for you and that if

you got it up to where you felt good, many of the problems you are

having with your cycle would go away.

Tish

[Guest guest]

I think the amount of variation would really deminish if you were on

sufficient thyroid replacement. A TSH above 3.0 is considered

hypothyroid according to the new ranges set by the endos. These new

ranges were set about two years ago and are 0.5 to 3.0 instead of

0.5 to 5.0 and I have yet to see a US lab that has kept up with the

times and has adopted these. Any TSH above 2.0 is impaired thyroid

function and people who fit this category have higher rates of heart

disease and other conditions related to hypothyroidism. You really

need to be 1.0 or below for the best health.

TSH is really an indirect measure of thyroid function and for many

people on pills, it is overly low and not very useful for

determining actual thyroid status. When the pituitary has to put out

a lot of TSH for a long time, it eventually gets sort of burned out

and stops responding to low thyroid blood levels and then it will

always put out lower TSH than it should. Then if your doctor fixates

on it to adjust your thyroid dose, you will always be hypo. So, one

of the the best measures of thyroid status is Free T3 and Free T4.

Here, you need to be above the midline of the ranges and better yet

in the upper 1/3 of the ranges. This is because Free T4 and Free T3

tests are skewed toward hypothyroidism due to the ranges being

determined by the people who get tested. Most who get thyroid tests

are hypothyroid to some extent by the fact that they are either

sick, old, or hypothyroid and that is why they are having the test.

But, if you really want to know how you are doing, you need to use

the Broda Barne's Basal Body temperature test or go to Dr. Rind's

page and use these methods: http://www.drrind.com/tempgraph.asp

Body temperature is an actual measure of metabolic rate, which is

controlled by thyroid and adrenal. This is an excellent way to see

what is going on without tests. Tests have a lot of variation

depending on your cycle, what your diet is like, whether you have a

head cold or other sickness or if you have too much stress that day.

Taking your temps over a longer period gives a beter average of what

your status is. This is too time consuming for doctors and requires

they explain it and so it has fallen out of fashion, even though it

is an excellent method.

Anyway, I think that if you got your thyroid dose up higher, then

TSH would even out and not have so much variation and at the same

time you would feel better most of the month and not have so much

cyclic variation in how you feel. The reason that more thyroid is

needed during your period has in part to do with it being a stress

on the body, which causes a higher demand for cortisol. More

cortisol production means thyroid will be used up at a higher rate.

Your thyroid cannot keep up with the extra demand and so thyroid

hormone is depleted from the blood causing the brain to release more

TSH to try and stimulate more production from the thyroid. So, you

really need to provide more thyroid hromone in the form of pills so

the body can get what it needs as your thyroid can't. If you had

adequate levels of T4, then the body could convert more of it when

it needs it. T4 is like a storage cabinate that the body can use in

times of increased demand. It sits there inactive for the most part

until it is needed. Then it is converted to T3 for extra energy. So,

if T4 is too low, the body does not have much to convert and this

causes a big rise in TSH in response.

Before heavy use of the TSH test, which began around 1975, thyroid

doses averaged 3 to 5 grains. Synthroid doses were also much higher -

300 to 500 mcg. You cannot overdose on any dose less than your

healthy thyroid would make, which is about 4-1/2 to 5 grains a day.

This is because any amount you take less than that, the thyroid will

drop production by that much. So, if you take 1 grain, your

pituitary is supposed to drop production of TSH to tell your thyroid

to make 3-1/2 to 4 more to make the total 4-1/2 to 5 or some total

that is right for you. But, in reality, low dose thyroid therapy

sometimes causes the pituitary to not tell the thyroid to make

enough to get the total up to 4-1/2 or 5 or where you need it. In

this case, the thyroid dose needs to be higher to overcome the

problem. Anyway, your thyroid dose can go up a lot, at least to

about 4 grains without causing an overdose because of the pituitary

corrections made that keep things right. In the past, or 50 years

before the modern tests people just slowly raised their doses untill

they felt good and became normal. Thyroid patients lived long and

healthy lives. The first two patients that started their treatment

in the late 1800s lived to be 79 and 91 and were in good health most

of their lives.

You can have hyper symptoms on lower doses of thryoid than your

healthy thyroid would make if you have health issues that prevent

the body from being able to use it. These are adrenal fatigue,

anemia, low protein and caloric restriction, and vitamin and mineral

deficiencies.

My opinion is that your dose is not sufficient for you and that if

you got it up to where you felt good, many of the problems you are

having with your cycle would go away.

Tish

[Guest guest]

I think the amount of variation would really deminish if you were on

sufficient thyroid replacement. A TSH above 3.0 is considered

hypothyroid according to the new ranges set by the endos. These new

ranges were set about two years ago and are 0.5 to 3.0 instead of

0.5 to 5.0 and I have yet to see a US lab that has kept up with the

times and has adopted these. Any TSH above 2.0 is impaired thyroid

function and people who fit this category have higher rates of heart

disease and other conditions related to hypothyroidism. You really

need to be 1.0 or below for the best health.

TSH is really an indirect measure of thyroid function and for many

people on pills, it is overly low and not very useful for

determining actual thyroid status. When the pituitary has to put out

a lot of TSH for a long time, it eventually gets sort of burned out

and stops responding to low thyroid blood levels and then it will

always put out lower TSH than it should. Then if your doctor fixates

on it to adjust your thyroid dose, you will always be hypo. So, one

of the the best measures of thyroid status is Free T3 and Free T4.

Here, you need to be above the midline of the ranges and better yet

in the upper 1/3 of the ranges. This is because Free T4 and Free T3

tests are skewed toward hypothyroidism due to the ranges being

determined by the people who get tested. Most who get thyroid tests

are hypothyroid to some extent by the fact that they are either

sick, old, or hypothyroid and that is why they are having the test.

But, if you really want to know how you are doing, you need to use

the Broda Barne's Basal Body temperature test or go to Dr. Rind's

page and use these methods: http://www.drrind.com/tempgraph.asp

Body temperature is an actual measure of metabolic rate, which is

controlled by thyroid and adrenal. This is an excellent way to see

what is going on without tests. Tests have a lot of variation

depending on your cycle, what your diet is like, whether you have a

head cold or other sickness or if you have too much stress that day.

Taking your temps over a longer period gives a beter average of what

your status is. This is too time consuming for doctors and requires

they explain it and so it has fallen out of fashion, even though it

is an excellent method.

Anyway, I think that if you got your thyroid dose up higher, then

TSH would even out and not have so much variation and at the same

time you would feel better most of the month and not have so much

cyclic variation in how you feel. The reason that more thyroid is

needed during your period has in part to do with it being a stress

on the body, which causes a higher demand for cortisol. More

cortisol production means thyroid will be used up at a higher rate.

Your thyroid cannot keep up with the extra demand and so thyroid

hormone is depleted from the blood causing the brain to release more

TSH to try and stimulate more production from the thyroid. So, you

really need to provide more thyroid hromone in the form of pills so

the body can get what it needs as your thyroid can't. If you had

adequate levels of T4, then the body could convert more of it when

it needs it. T4 is like a storage cabinate that the body can use in

times of increased demand. It sits there inactive for the most part

until it is needed. Then it is converted to T3 for extra energy. So,

if T4 is too low, the body does not have much to convert and this

causes a big rise in TSH in response.

Before heavy use of the TSH test, which began around 1975, thyroid

doses averaged 3 to 5 grains. Synthroid doses were also much higher -

300 to 500 mcg. You cannot overdose on any dose less than your

healthy thyroid would make, which is about 4-1/2 to 5 grains a day.

This is because any amount you take less than that, the thyroid will

drop production by that much. So, if you take 1 grain, your

pituitary is supposed to drop production of TSH to tell your thyroid

to make 3-1/2 to 4 more to make the total 4-1/2 to 5 or some total

that is right for you. But, in reality, low dose thyroid therapy

sometimes causes the pituitary to not tell the thyroid to make

enough to get the total up to 4-1/2 or 5 or where you need it. In

this case, the thyroid dose needs to be higher to overcome the

problem. Anyway, your thyroid dose can go up a lot, at least to

about 4 grains without causing an overdose because of the pituitary

corrections made that keep things right. In the past, or 50 years

before the modern tests people just slowly raised their doses untill

they felt good and became normal. Thyroid patients lived long and

healthy lives. The first two patients that started their treatment

in the late 1800s lived to be 79 and 91 and were in good health most

of their lives.

You can have hyper symptoms on lower doses of thryoid than your

healthy thyroid would make if you have health issues that prevent

the body from being able to use it. These are adrenal fatigue,

anemia, low protein and caloric restriction, and vitamin and mineral

deficiencies.

My opinion is that your dose is not sufficient for you and that if

you got it up to where you felt good, many of the problems you are

having with your cycle would go away.

Tish

[Guest guest]

I am so grateful for your braininess. I wish you were

writing thyroid manuals-- your descriptions make much more sense than

some of the voodoo I've read.

I have one more question:

When I was first diagnosed, my T4 was at the middle of the range,

and My T3 was through the floor. My TSH at the time, was around

9.1. Why did the doctor on duty treat me with T4, instead

of straight T3?

It totally messed up my T4 levels and my T3 levels both.

I think the amount of variation would

really deminish if you were on

sufficient thyroid replacement. A TSH above 3.0 is considered

hypothyroid according to the new ranges set by the endos. These

new

ranges were set about two years ago and are 0.5 to 3.0 instead of

0.5 to 5.0 and I have yet to see a US lab that has kept up with

the

times and has adopted these. Any TSH above 2.0 is impaired thyroid

function and people who fit this category have higher rates of

heart

disease and other conditions related to hypothyroidism. You

really

need to be 1.0 or below for the best

health.

[Guest guest]

I am so grateful for your braininess. I wish you were

writing thyroid manuals-- your descriptions make much more sense than

some of the voodoo I've read.

I have one more question:

When I was first diagnosed, my T4 was at the middle of the range,

and My T3 was through the floor. My TSH at the time, was around

9.1. Why did the doctor on duty treat me with T4, instead

of straight T3?

It totally messed up my T4 levels and my T3 levels both.

I think the amount of variation would

really deminish if you were on

sufficient thyroid replacement. A TSH above 3.0 is considered

hypothyroid according to the new ranges set by the endos. These

new

ranges were set about two years ago and are 0.5 to 3.0 instead of

0.5 to 5.0 and I have yet to see a US lab that has kept up with

the

times and has adopted these. Any TSH above 2.0 is impaired thyroid

function and people who fit this category have higher rates of

heart

disease and other conditions related to hypothyroidism. You

really

need to be 1.0 or below for the best

health.

[Guest guest]

I am so grateful for your braininess. I wish you were

writing thyroid manuals-- your descriptions make much more sense than

some of the voodoo I've read.

I have one more question:

When I was first diagnosed, my T4 was at the middle of the range,

and My T3 was through the floor. My TSH at the time, was around

9.1. Why did the doctor on duty treat me with T4, instead

of straight T3?

It totally messed up my T4 levels and my T3 levels both.

I think the amount of variation would

really deminish if you were on

sufficient thyroid replacement. A TSH above 3.0 is considered

hypothyroid according to the new ranges set by the endos. These

new

ranges were set about two years ago and are 0.5 to 3.0 instead of

0.5 to 5.0 and I have yet to see a US lab that has kept up with

the

times and has adopted these. Any TSH above 2.0 is impaired thyroid

function and people who fit this category have higher rates of

heart

disease and other conditions related to hypothyroidism. You

really

need to be 1.0 or below for the best

health.

[Guest guest]

> When I was first diagnosed, my T4 was at the middle of the range,

and

> My T3 was through the floor. My TSH at the time, was around 9.1.

> Why did the doctor on duty treat me with T4, instead of straight

T3?

______________

Doctors have been so propagandized by the major drug manufacturers

that the vast majority of them really do not know of any other

medication. The ones that do know about Armour and all T3 or Cytomel

treatment have been trained in med school that these medications are

either dangerous or of poor quality. For instance, you will hear

from these doctors upon mention of Armour, that Armour is unstable

and doses vary in the pills. Believe it or not, Armour is in fact

more stable and of better quality overall than Synthroid. This was

the first big propaganda project of the Synthroid manufacturers to

sell their new product back in the early 1960s and it has gotten

into the medical lore. This is because big drug companies now figure

prominently is medical textbook writing and this is the info that

doctors get in medical school. A very long time ago, there was one

batch of Armour that had almost no thyroid in it. This was because

testing methods were not very good and Thyroid was measured by

measuring Iodine levels. This meant that you could have no thyroid

in the pills, but enough iodine to make you think it was fine.

Anyway, today testing is very good and Armour is of excellent

quality. Synthroid has been written up by the FDA numberous times

for quality and potency problems and it has a short shelf life

compared to Armour, which can last well over a year if properly

stored.

The big drug companies also used as their marketing program the

notion that T3 was dangerous to the heart and therfore Armour was

risky to give to patients. Their sales pitch was that Synthroid

would never cause any overstimulation problems and thus was safer.

his then went on to cause an overall fear of giving a patient any T3

dispite the fact that some people have used only T3 for their whole

lives and that the body requires most of all T3 for metabolic

activity and we would die if we could not make it. T4 is pretty

inactive. Children born in the 50s without thryoids have been on all

T3 for their entire lives.

It is obvious that you have a conversion problem with T4. There are

some auto-immune and other thryoid conditions that can cause this.

Insufficient selenium, chromium, and protien can prevent the

reaction in the cells that create T3. Also, blood sugar problems can

inhibit the reaction. Auto-immune attack on any part of the enzyme

system that converts T4 to T3 can also prevent conversion.

You might consider seeing a 's thyroid doctor and going on all

T3. Usually, patients are allowed to adjust the T3 up as high as

neccessary to feel well and there are many people in the US who are

on all T3 and do best on that. To find a 's doc, go to their

site at: http://www.wilsonssyndrome.com/ and check out their doctor

list. 's doctors are more likely to be open to other options

and are not afraid of T3. They usually use time released compunded

T3 which is a very good delivery system to get even doses all day.

So, anyway, the big answer to your question is total ignorance and

propaganda by the big drug companies.

Tish

[Guest guest]

> When I was first diagnosed, my T4 was at the middle of the range,

and

> My T3 was through the floor. My TSH at the time, was around 9.1.

> Why did the doctor on duty treat me with T4, instead of straight

T3?

______________

Doctors have been so propagandized by the major drug manufacturers

that the vast majority of them really do not know of any other

medication. The ones that do know about Armour and all T3 or Cytomel

treatment have been trained in med school that these medications are

either dangerous or of poor quality. For instance, you will hear

from these doctors upon mention of Armour, that Armour is unstable

and doses vary in the pills. Believe it or not, Armour is in fact

more stable and of better quality overall than Synthroid. This was

the first big propaganda project of the Synthroid manufacturers to

sell their new product back in the early 1960s and it has gotten

into the medical lore. This is because big drug companies now figure

prominently is medical textbook writing and this is the info that

doctors get in medical school. A very long time ago, there was one

batch of Armour that had almost no thyroid in it. This was because

testing methods were not very good and Thyroid was measured by

measuring Iodine levels. This meant that you could have no thyroid

in the pills, but enough iodine to make you think it was fine.

Anyway, today testing is very good and Armour is of excellent

quality. Synthroid has been written up by the FDA numberous times

for quality and potency problems and it has a short shelf life

compared to Armour, which can last well over a year if properly

stored.

The big drug companies also used as their marketing program the

notion that T3 was dangerous to the heart and therfore Armour was

risky to give to patients. Their sales pitch was that Synthroid

would never cause any overstimulation problems and thus was safer.

his then went on to cause an overall fear of giving a patient any T3

dispite the fact that some people have used only T3 for their whole

lives and that the body requires most of all T3 for metabolic

activity and we would die if we could not make it. T4 is pretty

inactive. Children born in the 50s without thryoids have been on all

T3 for their entire lives.

It is obvious that you have a conversion problem with T4. There are

some auto-immune and other thryoid conditions that can cause this.

Insufficient selenium, chromium, and protien can prevent the

reaction in the cells that create T3. Also, blood sugar problems can

inhibit the reaction. Auto-immune attack on any part of the enzyme

system that converts T4 to T3 can also prevent conversion.

You might consider seeing a 's thyroid doctor and going on all

T3. Usually, patients are allowed to adjust the T3 up as high as

neccessary to feel well and there are many people in the US who are

on all T3 and do best on that. To find a 's doc, go to their

site at: http://www.wilsonssyndrome.com/ and check out their doctor

list. 's doctors are more likely to be open to other options

and are not afraid of T3. They usually use time released compunded

T3 which is a very good delivery system to get even doses all day.

So, anyway, the big answer to your question is total ignorance and

propaganda by the big drug companies.

Tish

[Guest guest]

> When I was first diagnosed, my T4 was at the middle of the range,

and

> My T3 was through the floor. My TSH at the time, was around 9.1.

> Why did the doctor on duty treat me with T4, instead of straight

T3?

______________

Doctors have been so propagandized by the major drug manufacturers

that the vast majority of them really do not know of any other

medication. The ones that do know about Armour and all T3 or Cytomel

treatment have been trained in med school that these medications are

either dangerous or of poor quality. For instance, you will hear

from these doctors upon mention of Armour, that Armour is unstable

and doses vary in the pills. Believe it or not, Armour is in fact

more stable and of better quality overall than Synthroid. This was

the first big propaganda project of the Synthroid manufacturers to

sell their new product back in the early 1960s and it has gotten

into the medical lore. This is because big drug companies now figure

prominently is medical textbook writing and this is the info that

doctors get in medical school. A very long time ago, there was one

batch of Armour that had almost no thyroid in it. This was because

testing methods were not very good and Thyroid was measured by

measuring Iodine levels. This meant that you could have no thyroid

in the pills, but enough iodine to make you think it was fine.

Anyway, today testing is very good and Armour is of excellent

quality. Synthroid has been written up by the FDA numberous times

for quality and potency problems and it has a short shelf life

compared to Armour, which can last well over a year if properly

stored.

The big drug companies also used as their marketing program the

notion that T3 was dangerous to the heart and therfore Armour was

risky to give to patients. Their sales pitch was that Synthroid

would never cause any overstimulation problems and thus was safer.

his then went on to cause an overall fear of giving a patient any T3

dispite the fact that some people have used only T3 for their whole

lives and that the body requires most of all T3 for metabolic

activity and we would die if we could not make it. T4 is pretty

inactive. Children born in the 50s without thryoids have been on all

T3 for their entire lives.

It is obvious that you have a conversion problem with T4. There are

some auto-immune and other thryoid conditions that can cause this.

Insufficient selenium, chromium, and protien can prevent the

reaction in the cells that create T3. Also, blood sugar problems can

inhibit the reaction. Auto-immune attack on any part of the enzyme

system that converts T4 to T3 can also prevent conversion.

You might consider seeing a 's thyroid doctor and going on all

T3. Usually, patients are allowed to adjust the T3 up as high as

neccessary to feel well and there are many people in the US who are

on all T3 and do best on that. To find a 's doc, go to their

site at: http://www.wilsonssyndrome.com/ and check out their doctor

list. 's doctors are more likely to be open to other options

and are not afraid of T3. They usually use time released compunded

T3 which is a very good delivery system to get even doses all day.

So, anyway, the big answer to your question is total ignorance and

propaganda by the big drug companies.

Tish

[Guest guest]

It's something I only considered in the last few days, as I

didn't even know that condition existed. The problem now is

that, with all those medications fooling around with my body, my T4

levels are now completely messed up.

If I don't start seeing some distinct improvements in the next

six months, I may HAVE to jump ship and go find me a 's protocol

doctor. Eva found one here, in San .

At the moment, I am on Armour. When I tried Cytomel, I

actually became worse, right away. So I don't know if Cytomel

will be a good option for me. (I know himself uses

time-release T3.)

But, my T4 was at the bottom of the range as of last Monday.

What in the world are these medicines doing to my thyroid anyway?

Aaaaaaargh.

Courtenay.

______________

You might consider seeing a 's thyroid doctor and going on

all

T3. Usually, patients are allowed to adjust the T3 up as high as

neccessary to feel well and there are many people in the US who

are

on all T3 and do best on that. To find a 's doc, go to their

site at: http://www.wilsonssyndrome.com/ and check out

their doctor

list. 's doctors are more likely to be open to other options

and are not afraid of T3. They usually use time released compunded

T3 which is a very good delivery system to get even doses all day.

So, anyway, the big answer to your question is total ignorance and

propaganda by the big drug companies.

Tish

[Guest guest]

It's something I only considered in the last few days, as I

didn't even know that condition existed. The problem now is

that, with all those medications fooling around with my body, my T4

levels are now completely messed up.

If I don't start seeing some distinct improvements in the next

six months, I may HAVE to jump ship and go find me a 's protocol

doctor. Eva found one here, in San .

At the moment, I am on Armour. When I tried Cytomel, I

actually became worse, right away. So I don't know if Cytomel

will be a good option for me. (I know himself uses

time-release T3.)

But, my T4 was at the bottom of the range as of last Monday.

What in the world are these medicines doing to my thyroid anyway?

Aaaaaaargh.

Courtenay.

______________

You might consider seeing a 's thyroid doctor and going on

all

T3. Usually, patients are allowed to adjust the T3 up as high as

neccessary to feel well and there are many people in the US who

are

on all T3 and do best on that. To find a 's doc, go to their

site at: http://www.wilsonssyndrome.com/ and check out

their doctor

list. 's doctors are more likely to be open to other options

and are not afraid of T3. They usually use time released compunded

T3 which is a very good delivery system to get even doses all day.

So, anyway, the big answer to your question is total ignorance and

propaganda by the big drug companies.

Tish

[Guest guest]

The problem with the Cytomel was most likely adrenal. Cytomel is

hard on them if you dose at one time. If you had time released, you

would probably have much fewer problems, just from my own experience

with it.

Tish

[Guest guest]

The problem with the Cytomel was most likely adrenal. Cytomel is

hard on them if you dose at one time. If you had time released, you

would probably have much fewer problems, just from my own experience

with it.

Tish

[Guest guest]

Courtenay,

Please refresh my struggling memory -- do you have elevated

antibodies, as in Hashimoto's? If so, your blood test results could

swing up and down like crazy. And also, how often are they testing

you? Sounds like once a week or so! Maybe wait 6-8 weeks to 3

months after a dose increase to retest. Also, don't forget that an

insufficient amount of thyroid hormone can hinder your own thyroid

function even more.

> But, my T4 was at the bottom of the range as of last Monday. What

in

> the world are these medicines doing to my thyroid anyway?

Aaaaaaargh.

>

> Courtenay.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Courtenay,

Please refresh my struggling memory -- do you have elevated

antibodies, as in Hashimoto's? If so, your blood test results could

swing up and down like crazy. And also, how often are they testing

you? Sounds like once a week or so! Maybe wait 6-8 weeks to 3

months after a dose increase to retest. Also, don't forget that an

insufficient amount of thyroid hormone can hinder your own thyroid

function even more.

> But, my T4 was at the bottom of the range as of last Monday. What

in

> the world are these medicines doing to my thyroid anyway?

Aaaaaaargh.

>

> Courtenay.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dear --

Thank you for responding, as I am going through one of those

frustrating days.

We finally got smart (the doctor and I), and we are only testing

every eight to ten weeks. I did not test out for Hashimotos

(grateful for small miracles). The only reason that I had my

blood run twice in two weeks is that the naturopath I was seeing ONLY

ran a TSH. So, the endo and I had to do the whole shebang over

again.

Courtenay.

Courtenay,

Please refresh my struggling memory -- do you have elevated

antibodies, as in Hashimoto's? If so, your blood test results

could

swing up and down like crazy. And also, how often are they

testing

you? Sounds like once a week or so! Maybe wait 6-8 weeks

to 3

months after a dose increase to retest. Also, don't forget that

an

insufficient amount of thyroid hormone can hinder your own thyroid

function even more.