Re: Should I STOP TAKING MEDS?

[Guest guest]

I think you would find if you stop taking your meds your gain will be even more and faster. There is NO way thyroid meds can make you gain weight unless your appetite increases and you eat more then of course you would gain weight. It is more likely that your weigh gain just signifies you are undermedicated. Possibly your thyroid was in the process of failing worse when you were first treated and now you need even more meds.

*Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WVFat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid catshttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/

[Guest guest]

I think you would find if you stop taking your meds your gain will be even more and faster. There is NO way thyroid meds can make you gain weight unless your appetite increases and you eat more then of course you would gain weight. It is more likely that your weigh gain just signifies you are undermedicated. Possibly your thyroid was in the process of failing worse when you were first treated and now you need even more meds.

*Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WVFat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid catshttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/

[Guest guest]

Post your lab numbers together with the reference ranges and the exact name of each test, and what dose of which meds you were on before those tests.kschroen wrote:

I was diagnosed 2 years ago and have GAINED 35lbs since. I looked much better before. . . I am considering getting off thyroid meds totally to help me lose weight. What are your thoughts?__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Post your lab numbers together with the reference ranges and the exact name of each test, and what dose of which meds you were on before those tests.kschroen wrote:

I was diagnosed 2 years ago and have GAINED 35lbs since. I looked much better before. . . I am considering getting off thyroid meds totally to help me lose weight. What are your thoughts?__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

This is a big mistake. It is your thyroid disease that is progressing, this

is why the weight gain and all other symptoms. I don't have much to say

about synthetic T4, as I've stated my case against it many times. This

comes from someone who was on them for 10 yrs before seeking other info on

the natural thyroid.

Should I STOP TAKING MEDS?

> I was diagnosed 2 years ago and have GAINED 35lbs since. I looked

> much better before. . . I am considering getting off thyroid meds

> totally to help me lose weight. What are your thoughts?

[Guest guest]

It is not medication, rather the progression of the thyroid disease that does this, plus other chemical changes, caused by the thyroid disease. One thing connected to another. It doesn't progress for a few months then totally stop. It's always there, and must be treated with vigilance. I've had it diagnosed for over 11 yrs, but had it before that, and it only got worse in the last 4 yrs or so, with some of the worst changes starting around 18 months ago. The switch to the Armour has helped, but then there are antibodies, and ya know what that means. It's hard to learn to accept that we have a permanent disease, that we will always have to work on.

Re: Should I STOP TAKING MEDS?

Good Lord. I thought I wrote that. That is exactly what happened to me. Twenty pounds in one year, baby. And my weight had been stable for eight years before meds. I'll be interested to see how people respond. You may want to post your labs/meds, etc. It is SO depressing, right?

[Guest guest]

> I was diagnosed 2 years ago and have GAINED 35lbs since. I looked

> much better before. . . I am considering getting off thyroid meds

> totally to help me lose weight. What are your thoughts?

_____________________

The problem lies with your pituitary and your doctor

underprescribing thyroid meds. Low dose thyroid replacement causes

the thyroid to shut down for many people according to Dr.

Derry. The result is that you become more hypothyroid on small doses

of thyroid than before treatment. The pituitary of many people is

very sensitive to thyroid meds and when you take low doses, it

causes the pituitary output of TSH to drop too low.

The thyroid makes 4-1/2 to 5 grains of thyroid a day or about 333 to

370 mcg of synthroid equivelent. In a perfect world, if you were to

take one grain of armour or 100 mcg of synthroid. your pituitary

would sense this and tell your thyroid, via TSH output, to make the

remainder needed for health. This would be 3-1/2 to 4 grains of

Armour or 233 to 270 mcg of synthroid. But, it doesn't work that way

for most people and small doses of thyroid overly suppress TSH and

the result is that your thyroid doesn't make up the difference to

give you thyroid blood levels high enough for health. Boom, you

become more hypothryoid than before you started meds.

The solution is to get thyroid doses up high enough to overcome the

problem. Since most doctors are idiots and just look at TSH, they

usually don't have a clue about this. TSH is really an indirect

measure of thryroid status, anyway. T3 and T4 levels can very hugely

in healthy people, but dumb doctors try to peg everybody right in

the middle of ranges. Ranges themselves are skewed toward

hypothryoidism since ranges are determined by who takes the tests.

Most who take thyroid tests are hypo to some small extent, either

because they are sick or old. So, people need to be in the upper end

of the T3 ranges minimum usually.

According to the old research papers before the TSH test thyroid

doses have dropped to 1/3 of what they were for 83 years prior to

heavy use of this test. Before agbout 1975, thyroid doses were

averaging 3-5 grains of Armour and 300 to 400 mcg of synthroid.

Doses for 83 years were adjusted by how the patient felt and by

physical observations of temperature, muscle reflex, pulse and

appearance of the patient. So, falling hair would warrent a thyroid

increase.

So, you might be better off without any thyroid, but you will be at

a greater risk of cardiac disease and cancer and many health

problems because you will still be low thyroid. Maybe not by as much

as you are now, but it is still a health risk. The solution is to

get your thyroid dose up high enough to get your health back. Dr.

Derry has written that most people don't feel good untill they get

up to 3 grains of Armour minimum. This probalby overcomes the

pituitary problem. It sure did for me. I was worse off like you on

low doses of thyroid.

Your options for the best health are: Try and find another doctor

who will allow you to adjust your dose up to where you are healthy.

It would also be good to find a doctor who prescribes Armour or

natural thyroid as this will eliminate the possible problem that you

have a conversion problem with synthroid. You can also treat

yourself and slowly raise your thryoid dose untill you feel good and

body temps average 98.6. If you want to do this, just write back

here for instructions. This is what I do.

Try to find a doc at one of these sites and maybe call ahead and ask

about what the doctor dose for patients:

http://www.thyroid.about.com/ (top doc list. Check Armour doc list)

http://www.armourthyroid.com/ (Armour site. Lists Armour prescribing

docs)

http://www.wilsonssyndrome.com/ ('s thyroid site. These docs

tend to be more open minded.)

Tish

[Guest guest]

This is something that I haven't talked about, for myself, at least. During the time that I became severely hypo last yr, my first lab showed a fasting glucose of 110, for the first time EVER. I had been on synthetic T4 for almost 10 yrs at that time. I had just made the switch to Armour a couple of wks before that testing. I had never had Free testing done, so I did it all myself, including all the blood chemistries along with it. The next testing I had done, and from then on out, have been glucoses of 84 to 94, consistently. This has been on Armour. So I think that it is wrong treatment/undertreatment that causes the glucose problems, unless one does have Type I diabetes, which is autoimmune. They say that Type II isn't but I think they're going to be proven wrong on that one, one day. I'm calling my 110 glucose a beginning problem with insulin resistance, but, so far, on the Armour, it's been consistently down on every test since I made the change. Yes, the T3 treatment would cause glucose challenges, but so could hypothyroidism's skewed body chemistries, so I'll opt for the Armour still.

Should I STOP TAKING MEDS?

Also, is your glucose above 110? 110 to 126 is considered "pre-diabetic"...usually this is the "insulin resistance" stage. Thyroid meds can elevate a person's glucose (it does mine...last tests, I was off meds for 4 days...instead of being around 129 as it usually is, it was 110) Prior to starting meds, mine was 112...four months later (after starting thyroid meds) it was 129. This is all on synthetic T4...I don't know if Armour does the same thing.

Faye

[Guest guest]

If you are undertreated for hypothyroidism, this will slow adrenal

output and the result can be glucose handling problems. Without

sufficient cortisol, you cannot use glucose and will get symptoms of

hypoglycemia even though your glucose levels are high. Low adrenal

over long periods can cause insulin insensitiviy, also.

So, I think that undertreated hypothyroidism can lead to glucose

handling problems.

Tish

[Guest guest]

If you are undertreated for hypothyroidism, this will slow adrenal

output and the result can be glucose handling problems. Without

sufficient cortisol, you cannot use glucose and will get symptoms of

hypoglycemia even though your glucose levels are high. Low adrenal

over long periods can cause insulin insensitiviy, also.

So, I think that undertreated hypothyroidism can lead to glucose

handling problems.

Tish

[Guest guest]

If you are undertreated for hypothyroidism, this will slow adrenal

output and the result can be glucose handling problems. Without

sufficient cortisol, you cannot use glucose and will get symptoms of

hypoglycemia even though your glucose levels are high. Low adrenal

over long periods can cause insulin insensitiviy, also.

So, I think that undertreated hypothyroidism can lead to glucose

handling problems.

Tish

[Guest guest]

Oh! Well, that would explain all of my hypoglycemic

symptoms before I started taking thyroid meds. I was just

talking to an ex-boyfriend last night that had found out I was sick

from a friend, and even HE still remembered that I had to eat very

frequently or I'd start slurring and getting the thousand-yard stare.

The man cannot remember some of the more salient points of our

relationship, but he remembers the eating problem....

And even then I couldn't get a doctor to test my glucose levels.

Best--

Courtenay.

If you are undertreated for

hypothyroidism, this will slow adrenal

output and the result can be glucose handling problems. Without

sufficient cortisol, you cannot use glucose and will get symptoms

of

hypoglycemia even though your glucose levels are high. Low adrenal

over long periods can cause insulin insensitiviy, also.

So, I think that undertreated hypothyroidism can lead to glucose

handling problems.

Tish

[Guest guest]

Mid-range Free Ts are not optimal for everyone. Some folks need one or both of them much higher in their ranges. a few folks need them to be above the top of their ranges. This makes the docs very nervous. . . .

Once you are on meds, the TSH becomes less and less relevant. There is all kinds of environmental cr*p that can displace the iodine in thyroid hormone and/or lower the TSH without giving any benefit in return. Chlorinated hydrocarbons and other halide compounds are endocrine disruptors in great abundance in Texas. Boyzandgirlz, can you spell F-L-U-O-R-I-D-E? How 'bout D-I-O-X-I-N? Would you believe Clorox?

Then we can talk about anti-bodies which can make all of your tests a little or a lot off.

I am saying that the tests are not all that good by themselves.

In your case, I would say the next thing to try would be a higher dose of your current medication. At some point you might want to add some Armour or Cytomel. Even though your conversion is pretty good, you may benefit from some direct T3.

And there are some folks who feel better on straight Armour, even though their Free T4 is in the basement and their Free T3 through the roof.

Oh, and the first weight goal for the hypothyroid patient is just not to gain any weight. And the longer you were hypothyroid and untreated or undertreated, the longer it is going to take to get to the next phase where you actually lose some weight. Cummings wrote:

Faye, regarding this statement that you made..."On .100 Unithroid, my TSH can be as low as .84, my Free T4 as high as 1.6 (w/high range of 1.8) but my Free T3 is about 2.5-2.6 with a low range of 2.3. You would think my Free T3 would be much greater (and it should be), with such a low TSH and high Free T4....and I have a difficult time losing any weight."do I fit in that category? I gained 17 pounds over 4 months while on .050 of Levoxyl with a TSH of 4.6. Now that I'm on .075 (for the last 5 months) the weight gain has stopped but I haven't lost an ounce. I am starting a diet, but I just want to make sure the food deprivation and suffering I am about to endure (a little drama) is not going to be sabotaged by a sluggish metabolism due to low T3. Here are my numbers as of this month:

FT3 3.3 (midrange 3.25)

FT4 1.29 (midrange 1.18)

TSH .18

What do you think?

Faye Reynolds wrote:

I have several trains of thought here.

First, as Jan said, post you labs here ... you may be undermedicated. IF your dosage is less than what you own body was making, then you WILL gain weight. Thyroid meds do the same that the actual hormone does...it signals the Pituitary that it is getting enough therefore, the thyroid itself slows or stops producing hormone. You may be getting enough through your meds to basically "put your thyroid to sleep" but it may not be enough to be sufficient for your body. If you were put on them, you obviously had tests indicating a problem however, one dosage level does not "fit all".

What are your Free levels? You CAN have a good Free T4 level but be really low in Free T3...which is the one that regulates your metabolism. You could have a binding issue (where most of your T3 is bound to proteins, leaving little to be "Free") or you may be making Reverse T3 (inactive form) instead of the active form of the hormone. You may also not be converting T4 to T3 very well. On .100 Unithroid, my TSH can be as low as .84, my Free T4 as high as 1.6 (w/high range of 1.8) but my Free T3 is about 2.5-2.6 with a low range of 2.3. You would think my Free T3 would be much greater (and it should be), with such a low TSH and high Free T4....and I have a difficult time losing any weight.

Also, Adrenals should be ruled out, if your TT3 or Free T3 is much lower than your TT4 or Free T4. If your hormone level is high and your adrenals are weak, they can't handle the overload of thyroid hormone...the end result is that the adrenals will cause the body to make Reverse T3 ...in other words, it isn't getting converted to the active form.

Also, is your glucose above 110? 110 to 126 is considered "pre-diabetic"...usually this is the "insulin resistance" stage. Thyroid meds can elevate a person's glucose (it does mine...last tests, I was off meds for 4 days...instead of being around 129 as it usually is, it was 110) Prior to starting meds, mine was 112...four months later (after starting thyroid meds) it was 129. This is all on synthetic T4...I don't know if Armour does the same thing.

Hope this gives you some thought as to what might be happening.

Fayekschroen wrote:

I was diagnosed 2 years ago and have GAINED 35lbs since. I looked much better before. . . I am considering getting off thyroid meds totally to help me lose weight. What are your thoughts?__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Ya know, sometimes I'm thinking that some doctors are just downright lazy and don't want to do stuff "in the moment" because they just don't want to. Glucose testing is so common, why wouldn't they want to do this? Mental illness of the profession or just downright lazy and mean.

Re: Should I STOP TAKING MEDS?

Oh! Well, that would explain all of my hypoglycemic symptoms before I started taking thyroid meds. I was just talking to an ex-boyfriend last night that had found out I was sick from a friend, and even HE still remembered that I had to eat very frequently or I'd start slurring and getting the thousand-yard stare.

The man cannot remember some of the more salient points of our relationship, but he remembers the eating problem....

And even then I couldn't get a doctor to test my glucose levels.

Best--

Courtenay.

[Guest guest]

They were real toads about it. I would go in with an

unrelated complaint, like the flu, and I would always bring up the

eating/lightheadedness problem, and the responses I got ranged from

nothing to " you should just eat more. " What I should

do, is sue their sorry a---es.

What kills me about it all, is that I HAD INSURANCE at the time.

It would have cost them nothing to do it.

Best--

Courtenay.

Ya know,

sometimes I'm thinking that some doctors are just downright lazy and

don't want to do stuff " in the moment " because they just

don't want to. Glucose testing is so common, why wouldn't they

want to do this? Mental illness of the profession or just

downright lazy and mean.

[Guest guest]

They were real toads about it. I would go in with an

unrelated complaint, like the flu, and I would always bring up the

eating/lightheadedness problem, and the responses I got ranged from

nothing to " you should just eat more. " What I should

do, is sue their sorry a---es.

What kills me about it all, is that I HAD INSURANCE at the time.

It would have cost them nothing to do it.

Best--

Courtenay.

Ya know,

sometimes I'm thinking that some doctors are just downright lazy and

don't want to do stuff " in the moment " because they just

don't want to. Glucose testing is so common, why wouldn't they

want to do this? Mental illness of the profession or just

downright lazy and mean.