Re: Common Sense/Respect for All

[Guest guest]

Hello Trad Foodies:

The number one reason I enjoy this Traditional Foods Community and chat group is

to connect with others who have interest in traditional healthy foods IN SPITE

OF their political or religious beliefs. The common connection, as I have posted

before, is our interest in the most nourishing foods grown in sustainable ways.

The resources this group has shown me have been wonderful-Pat Z's yummy birds,

Will's fabulous hams, Mesko's unbeatable burgers, to name a few. The

organic grapefruit that Alvin comes through with in winter is awesome! And I am

looking forward to August when its Rocky Mountain Peach season again! I am

grateful to be a part of this community.

I personally do not drink real milk. I don't drink milk at all. Those of us

familiar with Chek may not drink any milk at all - did the Cave Man drink

milk?

That is what works for me. If real or cooked milk works for you, I say drink it!

But I don't wish to be judged by some on this group who think if you don't drink

real milk you shouldn't even be here.

These are strange times indeed. We are a polarized nation. We are either for

something or against it. There is no finding common ground anymore, no room for

debate, no compromise -just look at congress!

God bless the Hartmans. I truly believe their intentions are only for the good.

But the fact is they were once in the co-ops and were booted out due to quality

control issues and then they lost their dairy license. The fact is also that

they have had many many satisfied real milk customers in subsequent years.

The other fact is that there is a very ill child out there and government

agencies, supported by the media , are looking to put the Hartmans up on the

cross for this child's illness.

It is a sad situation for all parties, IMHO. We all have an agenda here. Except

the sick child.

And while I find most of Glen Beck's opinions to not be relevant for me, I wish

to thank Amy for finding a Glen Beck quote I can agree with!

-Sue

>

>  I do not agree with Tipper or Angie's point of view on the raw milk/MOM's

Dairy issue.  I believe that those of us that are supporting Hartman's and are

" against " the government have nothing to fear from what Tipper or anyone else

has to say.  The truth will come out in the end.  They do have a right to their

own thoughts and opinions. 

>

> I want to quote from Glen Beck's Common Sense book, " I sincerely believe that

no discussion or debate is unAmerican. I agree with the Founding Fathers that it

is only on the battlefield of ideas that the best ones can be recognized and

ultimately prevail.  Only those afraid of the truth seek to silence debate,

intimidate those with whom they disagree, or slander their ideological

counterparts.  Those who know they are right have no reason to stifle debate

because they realize that all opposing arguments will ultimately be overcome by

fact.  Yet those who champion...do not seem to understand that.  If science is

on their side, then why should they care who's against them?  " The debate is

over " is a line that's used only by those who realiz they would never win a

debate.

>

> In my opinion, raw milk will win in the end because it is truth.

>

> Just for your info, we drink exclusively raw milk. 

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Number one post of the day - IMO - two thumbs up!

Anne

> The number one reason I enjoy this Traditional Foods Community and chat group

is to connect with others who have interest in traditional healthy foods IN

SPITE OF their political or religious beliefs. The common connection, as I have

posted before, is our interest in the most nourishing foods grown in sustainable

ways. The resources this group has shown me have been wonderful-Pat Z's yummy

birds, Will's fabulous hams, Mesko's unbeatable burgers, to name a few. The

organic grapefruit that Alvin comes through with in winter is awesome! And I am

looking forward to August when its Rocky Mountain Peach season again! I am

grateful to be a part of this community.

> That is what works for me. If real or cooked milk works for you, I say drink

it! But I don't wish to be judged by some on this group who think if you don't

drink real milk you shouldn't even be here.

> These are strange times indeed. We are a polarized nation. We are either for

something or against it. There is no finding common ground anymore, no room for

debate, no compromise -just look at congress!

>

> God bless the Hartmans. I truly believe their intentions are only for the

good.

>

> But the fact is they were once in the co-ops and were booted out due to

quality control issues and then they lost their dairy license. The fact is also

that they have had many many satisfied real milk customers in subsequent years.

>

> The other fact is that there is a very ill child out there and government

agencies, supported by the media , are looking to put the Hartmans up on the

cross for this child's illness.

>

> It is a sad situation for all parties, IMHO. We all have an agenda here.

Except the sick child.

>

> And while I find most of Glen Beck's opinions to not be relevant for me, I

wish to thank Amy for finding a Glen Beck quote I can agree with!

>

> -Sue

>

>

[Guest guest]

After reading the copious emails today on the raw milk issue/Hartmann's, etc.,

my reply is: " United we stand; divided we fall. " As I see it, America and her

people are being attacked with divide and conquer tactics at every level. Our

freedom and liberty is being assailed by those who want to rule over us and they

seek to take from us our right to self-determination and our free will to run

our own lives as we choose. The issue can be the right to choose raw milk, or

to raise our children without government interference, or property rights, or

how we choose to spend our money, or any other issue.

Let's hang in there together for if we don't we will hang separately, as one of

the early America patriots said.

[Guest guest]

There is another thing to remember when we hear that Hartmans used to deliver to

co-ops and lost his dairy license for unsanitary conditions. What the health

dept stated was that there were chickens in the milking parlor. This is the

place where the cows come in, are hooked up to the milking machines and stand

there eating and pooping until they're done and let back out to pasture. Cows

will poop when they're relaxed and they need to be relaxed to be milked. After

the cows are gone, the farmer has to clean out the milking parlor. It will

never be pristine, it's not suppose to and the health dept does not except it

to. If anyone has free range chickens, they go everywhere. Only confinement

chickens stay where they're suppose to.

Important terms to know/understand:

Milking parlor= place where comes come to get milked, a part of the barn.

Milk Room= Room where the milk is stored in the bulk tank. It is generally in

a room next to the milking parlor. No animals allowed.

Creamery= A separate building where the milk is processed, bottled, cheese,

yogurt, ice cream made.

The last I knew, Hartman's milk is stored in the milkroom and brought by an

enclosed pipeline to his creamery. There has never been any statements by the

state about his milkroom or creamery.

Mike lost/gave up his dairy license because of his political views. It's the

same reason why he no longer has USDA organic certification. He's beyond

organic and finds no need for possibly worthless piece of paper (there's lots of

cheating going on over organic in Calif as well as what gets imported). Since

he no longer had a license, he could not sell in a retail establishment, but

then he didn't need to or want to. He'd rather have the direct farm to consumer

connection.

Lynn

[Guest guest]

> But the fact is they were once in the co-ops and were booted out due to

quality control issues and then they lost their dairy license. The fact is also

that they have had many many satisfied real milk customers in subsequent years.

>

>

Mike Hartman doesn't seem to me the kind of person who would endear himself to

an inspector. My dad never wanted to sell grade A milk (you get paid more for

it) because he would have to deal with inspectors, and our dairy farm was clean.

I think he was a little like Mike. Many farmers are, in my experience.

Chickens in the milking parlor - right in the middle of the cows urinating and

defacating in the gutter. What horrors! For the chickens, that is. I would

like to see the Tribune do a story on Salatin.