Guest guest Posted December 29, 2006 Report Share Posted December 29, 2006 So it seems that research supports the notion that exercise will not correct posture. What types of exercise? What is the exercise protocol? Furthermore, if all the evidence suggests that " corrective exercise " is not effective, then what is? How do we correct postural dysfunction? Changing ergonomics? Biofeedback mechanisms? Aren't these means of exercise in a way? Personally, I cannot understand how making a muscle stronger will not effect the mechanics of a joint. If poor posture is a product of poor joint alignment what effects this more than muscles? Obviously gravity has a serious effect, but to say that corrective exercise in in effective as a means to correct posture seems to be a sweeping generalization. Cowell Raleigh, NC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 30, 2006 Report Share Posted December 30, 2006 In a message dated 12/30/2006 7:08:08 AM Central Standard Time, john@... writes: <<<Obviously gravity has a serious effect, but to say that corrective exercise in in effective as a means to correct posture seems to be a sweeping generalization.>>> **** Mel noted the following back in '02 in a post entitled: " Spinal Models Need Remodeling. " After all, structural and functional asymmetries, " muscle imbalances " and " spinal dysfunctions " are ubiquitous and not necessarily accompanied by impaired motor skill in the healthy individual. These alleged problems usually are quite competently and automatically managed by ongoing neuromuscular compensations. Moreover, none of these theories has been confirmed in the complex dynamic and explosive world of sport where one cannot simply extrapolate what is learned from static, very slow or highly constrained linear movements in a laboratory setting. Ken Jakalski Lisle HS Lisle, Illinois Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 31, 2006 Report Share Posted December 31, 2006 , The RIGHT type of exercises CAN and DO change posture. The biggest improvement is the increasing of the lordotic curves in the neck and lower back. The posture that is harder to change is the posture from the A.P. alignment. In the " POSTURE " magazine....I do not have the specific volume or issue, spoke of how increasing the curvatures in the low back and neck actually helpled (not completely correct) the scoliosis. The specifics of which,what,when,how, and why has been and always be will of the highest debate. I have seen the biggest improvements in posture with fulcrum training. It MUST however be done consistently for it to hold. Also the types of other exercises done in combination can either aid or hurt the goal itself. Lastly, I am sure there is some genetic factor that influences how much one can improve, but as of yet, that to my knowledge has not been examinded or studied to any large degree. Forbes Director of Player Development Athletic Spinal Fitness Institute Ridgefield, Wa > > So it seems that research supports the notion that exercise will not > correct posture. What types of exercise? What is the exercise > protocol? Furthermore, if all the evidence suggests that " corrective > exercise " is not effective, then what is? How do we correct postural > dysfunction? Changing ergonomics? Biofeedback mechanisms? Aren't > these means of exercise in a way? > > Personally, I cannot understand how making a muscle stronger will not > effect the mechanics of a joint. If poor posture is a product of > poor joint alignment what effects this more than muscles? Obviously > gravity has a serious effect, but to say that corrective exercise in > in effective as a means to correct posture seems to be a sweeping > generalization. > > Cowell > Raleigh, NC > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 1, 2007 Report Share Posted January 1, 2007 Interestingly, there has been little success in achieving changes in posture with exercise in a research setting. This could be for a number of reasons. i.e. perhaps not using the appropriate exercises, intensity and/or duration. In addition, however, physical therapy research seems to be plagued by the use of tests that suffer from a severe lack of validity and reliability. Thus, some papers have reported small changes in posture with exercise training using tests that may not actually measured what they are supposed to measure. Also, these small changes are often within the day-to-day measurement variabiliy making it difficult to evaluate the efficacy of exercise on posture. For those interested, a colleague and I wrote a review paper a few years ago attempting to highlight these issues: Hrysomallis & Goodman (2001) A review of resistance exercise and posture realignment. J Strength Cond Res. 15(3):385-90. Best Regards, Craig Goodman PhD School of Human Movement, Recreation and Performance Centre for Ageing, Rehabilitation, Exercise and Sport University PO Box 14428 MCMC Melbourne, Australia, 8001 http://www.staff.vu.edu.au/craiggoodman/ ________________________________ From: Supertraining on behalf of Forbes Sent: Mon 1/01/2007 6:09 AM To: Supertraining Subject: Re: Posture and Strength? , The RIGHT type of exercises CAN and DO change posture. The biggest improvement is the increasing of the lordotic curves in the neck and lower back. The posture that is harder to change is the posture from the A.P. alignment. In the " POSTURE " magazine....I do not have the specific volume or issue, spoke of how increasing the curvatures in the low back and neck actually helpled (not completely correct) the scoliosis. The specifics of which,what,when,how, and why has been and always be will of the highest debate. I have seen the biggest improvements in posture with fulcrum training. It MUST however be done consistently for it to hold. Also the types of other exercises done in combination can either aid or hurt the goal itself. Lastly, I am sure there is some genetic factor that influences how much one can improve, but as of yet, that to my knowledge has not been examinded or studied to any large degree. Forbes Director of Player Development Athletic Spinal Fitness Institute Ridgefield, Wa > > So it seems that research supports the notion that exercise will not > correct posture. What types of exercise? What is the exercise > protocol? Furthermore, if all the evidence suggests that " corrective > exercise " is not effective, then what is? How do we correct postural > dysfunction? Changing ergonomics? Biofeedback mechanisms? Aren't > these means of exercise in a way? > > Personally, I cannot understand how making a muscle stronger will not > effect the mechanics of a joint. If poor posture is a product of > poor joint alignment what effects this more than muscles? Obviously > gravity has a serious effect, but to say that corrective exercise in > in effective as a means to correct posture seems to be a sweeping > generalization. > > Cowell > Raleigh, NC > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 3, 2007 Report Share Posted January 3, 2007 I posted the article mentioned (J Strength Cond Res, 2001) on what I think to be a very evidenced-based physical therapy web blog (myphysicaltherapyspace.com). The recent holidays might have limited the number of responses it received, however, others were of the same contention, that strengthening alone is probably not going to do a lot for static spinal posture in most individuals. What we are ultimately looking at in terms of clinical outcomes is decreased pain and increased functionality. In my experience, for example with the upper extremity in (recreational) lifters, I have seen poor posture have some effects on scapular mechanics/shoulder impingement and subsequent shoulder pain. I have been informed that studies exist linking scapular/ shoulder posture to pain, but I do not have references at this time. To an extent, I instruct the patient to stretch the tight (antagonist) muscles (i.e. pects) and activate the agonists (i.e. scapular retractors/depressors). I try to do more repetitions, longer hold times, or make them do other dynamic tasks (with small dumbbells, t-band, etc) while holding the appropriate posture. I also try to stress lifestyle change and frequent awareness of their positioning. I learned from a neuro PT a while back that it takes something like 10,000-30,000 reps to develop a movement pattern to the autonomous stage of learning (little conscious attention to the task)! I have described this concept to patients, and have suggested that maybe the few hundred reps they get in during their time with me might get their nervous systems on the right track, providing they are doing the movements correctly, of course:) Sometimes, if the patient is truly interested in putting forth the effort, this approach works subjectively (the pt feels they have better posture), even if I don't have good objective markers (other then functional outcomes). During the course of becoming involved in this topic, I learned that the overhead squat (with dumbbells, etc) can be an effective, whole body, functional activity to work on these scapular mechanics (as well as spinal posture, I believe). Great idea! I will need to incorporate this more with my patients. Thanks to all who keep these posts something to look forward to everyday. Rita Chorba, MS, PT, CSCS Athletic Training Student University of Findlay, Ohio > > Interestingly, there has been little success in achieving changes in posture with exercise in a research setting. > This could be for a number of reasons. i.e. perhaps not using the appropriate exercises, intensity and/or duration. In addition, however, physical therapy research seems to be plagued by the use of tests that suffer from a severe lack of validity and reliability. Thus, some papers have reported small changes in posture with exercise training using tests that may not actually measured what they are supposed to measure. Also, these small changes are often within the day-to-day measurement variabiliy making it difficult to evaluate the efficacy of exercise on posture. For those interested, a colleague and I wrote a review paper a few years ago attempting to highlight these issues: > Hrysomallis & Goodman (2001) A review of resistance exercise and posture realignment. J Strength Cond Res. 15(3):385-90. > > Best Regards, > Craig Goodman PhD > School of Human Movement, Recreation and Performance > Centre for Ageing, Rehabilitation, Exercise and Sport > University > PO Box 14428 MCMC > Melbourne, Australia, 8001 > http://www.staff.vu.edu.au/craiggoodman/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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