Guest guest Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 smacks anne with a very small trout* 10 bucks on the Auzzie! " wink " @ anne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 smacks anne with a very small trout* 10 bucks on the Auzzie! " wink " @ anne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 smacks anne with a very small trout* 10 bucks on the Auzzie! " wink " @ anne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 28, 2005 Report Share Posted September 28, 2005 Ya know what'd make it REALLY interesting and I just know that Ric would want front row seats?? ADD MUD! anne OT OK, but I get to sell popcorn and soda..... and I get to ring the bell to give you each a break and you will have to go to your own corners,, lol --- anne wrote: > Somebody beat me with a wet noodle. LOL > Love > Janet > > > Oh! Oh! Can I? Can I?? As long as you don't > backhand me with a trout 'k? > > > LOL!! > > Love > anne > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > Jackie It's a pleasure having you join in our conversations. We hope you have found the support you need with us. If you are using email for your posts, for easy access to our group, just click the link-- http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Hepatitis_C_Central/ Happy Posting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 28, 2005 Report Share Posted September 28, 2005 OI! *winds up for a haymaker with the wet noodle* LOL! anne Re: OT Okay you can sell the popcorn and soda. As long as the proceeds go to the Hepatitis_C_Central support a hepper fund. LOL *smacks anne with a very small trout* Jackie on wrote: OK, but I get to sell popcorn and soda..... and I get to ring the bell to give you each a break and you will have to go to your own corners,, lol --- anne wrote: > Somebody beat me with a wet noodle. LOL > Love > Janet > > > Oh! Oh! Can I? Can I?? As long as you don't > backhand me with a trout 'k? > > > LOL!! > > Love > anne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 1, 2011 Report Share Posted December 1, 2011 Her Choice to Heal is good.  I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion?  Thanks.  Steve Koob One More Soul   I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org " your cycles, your fertility, in your hands " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 this is mainly a pastoral issue (at least as far as Catholics are concerned after having received absolution in the sacrament of reconciliation), may involve scrupulosity and other temptations against faith. It needs a good priest and sometimes a rather strict yet kind spiritual director. Sincerely yours, Dominic M. Pedulla MD, FACC, CNFPMC, ABVM, ACPh Interventional Cardiologist, Endovascular Diplomate, Varicose Vein Specialist, Noncontraceptive Family Planning Consultant, Family Planning Researcher Medical Director, The Oklahoma Vein and Endovascular Center (www.noveinok.com, veininfo@...) Executive Director, The Edith Stein Foundation (www.theedithsteinfoundation.com) (office) (cell) (FAX) pedullad@... "...the people of Israel. Theirs is the adoption to sonship; theirs the divine glory, the covenants, the receiving of the law, the temple worship and the promises. 5"(Romans 9:3-5) Re: OT Her Choice to Heal is good. I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion? Thanks. Steve Koob One More Soul I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 Does Her Choice to Heal deal with contraception and sterilization, or only abortion--including the possibility of abortifacient action of "contraceptives"? To: nfpprofessionals From: 8rodriguezes@...Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2011 20:08:06 -0500Subject: Re: OT Her Choice to Heal is good. I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion? Thanks. Steve KoobOne More Soul I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 I see this as a wonderful opportunity for women who repent taking oral contraceptives assisting others, individually, who have suffered the same remorse and benefiting both. For me forgiveness is sustained in helping another who has suffered in similar kind, essentially the advice St. gave " Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of compassion and God of all encouragement, who encourages us in our every affliction, so that we may be able to encourage those who are in any affliction with the encouragement with which we ourselves are encouraged by God "  , 2 Cor. 3-4.  ( Italics mine ). Fr. Tom I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion?  Thanks.  Steve Koob One More Soul   I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 Testimonies of this kind of remorse, if honest and thorough, might really help.Sent from my iPhone I see this as a wonderful opportunity for women who repent taking oral contraceptives assisting others, individually, who have suffered the same remorse and benefiting both. For me forgiveness is sustained in helping another who has suffered in similar kind, essentially the advice St. gave "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of compassion and God of all encouragement, who encourages us in our every affliction, so that we may be able to encourage those who are in any affliction with the encouragement with which we ourselves are encouraged by God" , 2 Cor. 3-4. ( Italics mine ). Fr. Tom I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion? Thanks. Steve Koob One More Soul I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 I see, yes, it doesn't mention contraceptives. Would be good to have a book like Physicians Healed with stories of how couples healed from contraceptive use. I could ask my friend to write one..their story is neat.  Does Her Choice to Heal deal with contraception and sterilization, or only abortion--including the possibility of abortifacient action of " contraceptives " ? To: nfpprofessionals From: 8rodriguezes@...Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2011 20:08:06 -0500 Subject: Re: OT Her Choice to Heal is good.  I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion? Thanks. Steve KoobOne More Soul  I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org " your cycles, your fertility, in your hands " -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org " your cycles, your fertility, in your hands " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 We would be interested in collecting such stories. And even more interested in someone else collecting them and writing a book that we might publish. In our Sterilization Reversal, A Generous Act of Love (out of print but available to read for free, or download as a pdf, at www.OMSoul.com), 20 Catholic couples, at least one of which had been sterilized, tell their very personal stories of lost intimacy following sterilization, and marriage renewal after reversal. Thanks and blessings. Steve Koob, Director One More Soul www.omsoul.com To: nfpprofessionals From: 8rodriguezes@...Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 10:50:18 -0500Subject: Re: OT I see, yes, it doesn't mention contraceptives. Would be good to have a book like Physicians Healed with stories of how couples healed from contraceptive use. I could ask my friend to write one..their story is neat. Does Her Choice to Heal deal with contraception and sterilization, or only abortion--including the possibility of abortifacient action of "contraceptives"? To: nfpprofessionals From: 8rodriguezes@...Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2011 20:08:06 -0500Subject: Re: OT Her Choice to Heal is good. I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion? Thanks. Steve KoobOne More Soul I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 Actually my thoughts are actually the reverse. Far too few recognize contraception as the moral crime it is in itself, apart from any abortifacient aspects. Far too many seem to lament only the abortifacient aspect, which while not unimportant, isn't itself, directly or specifically, the moral crime of contraception. Sincerely yours, Dominic M. Pedulla MD, FACC, CNFPMC, ABVM, ACPh Interventional Cardiologist, Endovascular Diplomate, Varicose Vein Specialist, Noncontraceptive Family Planning Consultant, Family Planning Researcher Medical Director, The Oklahoma Vein and Endovascular Center (www.noveinok.com, veininfo@...) Executive Director, The Edith Stein Foundation (www.theedithsteinfoundation.com) (office) (cell) (FAX) pedullad@... "...the people of Israel. Theirs is the adoption to sonship; theirs the divine glory, the covenants, the receiving of the law, the temple worship and the promises. 5"(Romans 9:3-5) Re: OT Her Choice to Heal is good. I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion? Thanks. Steve Koob One More Soul I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 Thank you Fr Tom and Dr Dom. Blessings. Steve To: nfpprofessionals From: pedullad@...Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 10:27:17 -0500Subject: Re: OT Testimonies of this kind of remorse, if honest and thorough, might really help.Sent from my iPhone I see this as a wonderful opportunity for women who repent taking oral contraceptives assisting others, individually, who have suffered the same remorse and benefiting both. For me forgiveness is sustained in helping another who has suffered in similar kind, essentially the advice St. gave "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of compassion and God of all encouragement, who encourages us in our every affliction, so that we may be able to encourage those who are in any affliction with the encouragement with which we ourselves are encouraged by God" , 2 Cor. 3-4. ( Italics mine ). Fr. Tom I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion? Thanks. Steve KoobOne More Soul I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 Dr Dom, No arguement from me. I claim that contraception is a more grave/serious offense than abortion because: Abortion depopulates Earth; contraception depopulates Heaven and Earth. Contraception is direct disobedience of God's first words/command to the human race: "be fertile". It seems to me that contraception is an especially egregious/flagrant/serious offense against the First Great Commandment, and abortion is mostly an egregious/flagrant/serious offense against the Second Great Commandment. Discussion welcomed. Steve Koob To: nfpprofessionals From: pedullad@...Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 11:13:35 -0500Subject: Re: OT Actually my thoughts are actually the reverse. Far too few recognize contraception as the moral crime it is in itself, apart from any abortifacient aspects. Far too many seem to lament only the abortifacient aspect, which while not unimportant, isn't itself, directly or specifically, the moral crime of contraception. Sincerely yours, Dominic M. Pedulla MD, FACC, CNFPMC, ABVM, ACPhInterventional Cardiologist, Endovascular Diplomate, Varicose Vein Specialist, Noncontraceptive Family Planning Consultant, Family Planning ResearcherMedical Director, The Oklahoma Vein and Endovascular Center (www.noveinok.com, veininfo@...)Executive Director, The Edith Stein Foundation (www.theedithsteinfoundation.com) (office) (cell) (FAX)pedullad@... "...the people of Israel. Theirs is the adoption to sonship; theirs the divine glory, the covenants, the receiving of the law, the temple worship and the promises. 5"(Romans 9:3-5) Re: OT Her Choice to Heal is good. I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion? Thanks. Steve KoobOne More Soul I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 In papal encyclicals, the language used to prohibit contraception is very similar to that used to prohibit abortion. PJB. To: nfpprofessionals From: koob_8@...Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 11:46:33 -0500Subject: RE: OT Dr Dom, No arguement from me. I claim that contraception is a more grave/serious offense than abortion because: Abortion depopulates Earth; contraception depopulates Heaven and Earth. Contraception is direct disobedience of God's first words/command to the human race: "be fertile". It seems to me that contraception is an especially egregious/flagrant/serious offense against the First Great Commandment, and abortion is mostly an egregious/flagrant/serious offense against the Second Great Commandment. Discussion welcomed. Steve Koob To: nfpprofessionals From: pedullad@...Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 11:13:35 -0500Subject: Re: OT Actually my thoughts are actually the reverse. Far too few recognize contraception as the moral crime it is in itself, apart from any abortifacient aspects. Far too many seem to lament only the abortifacient aspect, which while not unimportant, isn't itself, directly or specifically, the moral crime of contraception. Sincerely yours, Dominic M. Pedulla MD, FACC, CNFPMC, ABVM, ACPhInterventional Cardiologist, Endovascular Diplomate, Varicose Vein Specialist, Noncontraceptive Family Planning Consultant, Family Planning ResearcherMedical Director, The Oklahoma Vein and Endovascular Center (www.noveinok.com, veininfo@...)Executive Director, The Edith Stein Foundation (www.theedithsteinfoundation.com) (office) (cell) (FAX)pedullad@... "...the people of Israel. Theirs is the adoption to sonship; theirs the divine glory, the covenants, the receiving of the law, the temple worship and the promises. 5"(Romans 9:3-5) Re: OT Her Choice to Heal is good. I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion? Thanks. Steve KoobOne More Soul I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 Evangelium Vitae--The Gospel of Life, by Pope II, http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/encyclicals/documents/hf_jp-ii_enc_25031995_evangelium-vitae_en.html 13. In order to facilitate the spread of abortion, enormous sums of money have been invested and continue to be invested in the production of pharmaceutical products which make it possible to kill the fetus in the mother's womb without recourse to medical assistance. On this point, scientific research itself seems to be almost exclusively preoccupied with developing products which are ever more simple and effective in suppressing life and which at the same time are capable of removing abortion from any kind of control or social responsibility. It is frequently asserted that contraception, if made safe and available to all, is the most effective remedy against abortion. The Catholic Church is then accused of actually promoting abortion, because she obstinately continues to teach the moral unlawfulness of contraception. When looked at carefully, this objection is clearly unfounded. It may be that many people use contraception with a view to excluding the subsequent temptation of abortion. But the negative values inherent in the "contraceptive mentality"-which is very different from responsible parenthood, lived in respect for the full truth of the conjugal act-are such that they in fact strengthen this temptation when an unwanted life is conceived. Indeed, the pro- abortion culture is especially strong precisely where the Church's teaching on contraception is rejected. Certainly, from the moral point of view contraception and abortion are specifically different evils: the former contradicts the full truth of the sexual act as the proper expression of conjugal love, while the latter destroys the life of a human being; the former is opposed to the virtue of chastity in marriage, the latter is opposed to the virtue of justice and directly violates the divine commandment "You shall not kill". But despite their differences of nature and moral gravity, contraception and abortion are often closely connected, as fruits of the same tree. It is true that in many cases contraception and even abortion are practised under the pressure of real- life difficulties, which nonetheless can never exonerate from striving to observe God's law fully. Still, in very many other instances such practices are rooted in a hedonistic mentality unwilling to accept responsibility in matters of sexuality, and they imply a self-centered concept of freedom, which regards procreation as an obstacle to personal fulfilment. The life which could result from a sexual encounter thus becomes an enemy to be avoided at all costs, and abortion becomes the only possible decisive response to failed contraception. The close connection which exists, in mentality, between the practice of contraception and that of abortion is becoming increasingly obvious. It is being demonstrated in an alarming way by the development of chemical products, intrauterine devices and vaccines which, distributed with the same ease as contraceptives, really act as abortifacients in the very early stages of the development of the life of the new human being. To: nfpprofessionals From: pjbaggot@...Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 09:52:56 -0800Subject: RE: OT In papal encyclicals, the language used to prohibit contraception is very similar to that used to prohibit abortion. PJB. To: nfpprofessionals From: koob_8@...Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 11:46:33 -0500Subject: RE: OT Dr Dom, No arguement from me. I claim that contraception is a more grave/serious offense than abortion because: Abortion depopulates Earth; contraception depopulates Heaven and Earth. Contraception is direct disobedience of God's first words/command to the human race: "be fertile". It seems to me that contraception is an especially egregious/flagrant/serious offense against the First Great Commandment, and abortion is mostly an egregious/flagrant/serious offense against the Second Great Commandment. Discussion welcomed. Steve Koob To: nfpprofessionals From: pedullad@...Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 11:13:35 -0500Subject: Re: OT Actually my thoughts are actually the reverse. Far too few recognize contraception as the moral crime it is in itself, apart from any abortifacient aspects. Far too many seem to lament only the abortifacient aspect, which while not unimportant, isn't itself, directly or specifically, the moral crime of contraception. Sincerely yours, Dominic M. Pedulla MD, FACC, CNFPMC, ABVM, ACPhInterventional Cardiologist, Endovascular Diplomate, Varicose Vein Specialist, Noncontraceptive Family Planning Consultant, Family Planning ResearcherMedical Director, The Oklahoma Vein and Endovascular Center (www.noveinok.com, veininfo@...)Executive Director, The Edith Stein Foundation (www.theedithsteinfoundation.com) (office) (cell) (FAX)pedullad@... "...the people of Israel. Theirs is the adoption to sonship; theirs the divine glory, the covenants, the receiving of the law, the temple worship and the promises. 5"(Romans 9:3-5) Re: OT Her Choice to Heal is good. I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion? Thanks. Steve KoobOne More Soul I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 I will volunteer for that project! I need to find a graduate project for Doctoral studies and have been wondering how I can tie it in with NFP. This would be an awesome way to accomplish both goals. I would like to include stories of how contraceptive use was explained or not explained to women/couples... and what feelings they had later....(Now for a DNP program that will accept this as my project!)Regardless, send the stories to me with contact information so I can obtain permission for their use with/without identifying information. Sandrock, CNM To: NFP Professionals <nfpprofessionals > Sent: Friday, December 2, 2011 10:12 AM Subject: RE: OT We would be interested in collecting such stories. And even more interested in someone else collecting them and writing a book that we might publish. In our Sterilization Reversal, A Generous Act of Love (out of print but available to read for free, or download as a pdf, at www.OMSoul.com), 20 Catholic couples, at least one of which had been sterilized, tell their very personal stories of lost intimacy following sterilization, and marriage renewal after reversal. Thanks and blessings. Steve Koob, Director One More Soul www.omsoul.com To: nfpprofessionals From: 8rodriguezes@...Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 10:50:18 -0500Subject: Re: OT I see, yes, it doesn't mention contraceptives. Would be good to have a book like Physicians Healed with stories of how couples healed from contraceptive use. I could ask my friend to write one..their story is neat. Does Her Choice to Heal deal with contraception and sterilization, or only abortion--including the possibility of abortifacient action of "contraceptives"? To: nfpprofessionals From: 8rodriguezes@...Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2011 20:08:06 -0500Subject: Re: OT Her Choice to Heal is good. I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion? Thanks. Steve KoobOne More Soul I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 JP II uses "gravity" in the text in such a way that the implied assumption is that murder (abortion) is more grave. Yet I have at times wondered about it myself.Sent from my iPhone Evangelium Vitae--The Gospel of Life, by Pope II, http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/encyclicals/documents/hf_jp-ii_enc_25031995_evangelium-vitae_en.html 13. In order to facilitate the spread of abortion, enormous sums of money have been invested and continue to be invested in the production of pharmaceutical products which make it possible to kill the fetus in the mother's womb without recourse to medical assistance. On this point, scientific research itself seems to be almost exclusively preoccupied with developing products which are ever more simple and effective in suppressing life and which at the same time are capable of removing abortion from any kind of control or social responsibility. It is frequently asserted that contraception, if made safe and available to all, is the most effective remedy against abortion. The Catholic Church is then accused of actually promoting abortion, because she obstinately continues to teach the moral unlawfulness of contraception. When looked at carefully, this objection is clearly unfounded. It may be that many people use contraception with a view to excluding the subsequent temptation of abortion. But the negative values inherent in the "contraceptive mentality"-which is very different from responsible parenthood, lived in respect for the full truth of the conjugal act-are such that they in fact strengthen this temptation when an unwanted life is conceived. Indeed, the pro- abortion culture is especially strong precisely where the Church's teaching on contraception is rejected. Certainly, from the moral point of view contraception and abortion are specifically different evils: the former contradicts the full truth of the sexual act as the proper expression of conjugal love, while the latter destroys the life of a human being; the former is opposed to the virtue of chastity in marriage, the latter is opposed to the virtue of justice and directly violates the divine commandment "You shall not kill". But despite their differences of nature and moral gravity, contraception and abortion are often closely connected, as fruits of the same tree. It is true that in many cases contraception and even abortion are practised under the pressure of real- life difficulties, which nonetheless can never exonerate from striving to observe God's law fully. Still, in very many other instances such practices are rooted in a hedonistic mentality unwilling to accept responsibility in matters of sexuality, and they imply a self-centered concept of freedom, which regards procreation as an obstacle to personal fulfilment. The life which could result from a sexual encounter thus becomes an enemy to be avoided at all costs, and abortion becomes the only possible decisive response to failed contraception. The close connection which exists, in mentality, between the practice of contraception and that of abortion is becoming increasingly obvious. It is being demonstrated in an alarming way by the development of chemical products, intrauterine devices and vaccines which, distributed with the same ease as contraceptives, really act as abortifacients in the very early stages of the development of the life of the new human being. To: nfpprofessionals From: pjbaggot@...Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 09:52:56 -0800Subject: RE: OT In papal encyclicals, the language used to prohibit contraception is very similar to that used to prohibit abortion. PJB. To: nfpprofessionals From: koob_8@...Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 11:46:33 -0500Subject: RE: OT Dr Dom, No arguement from me. I claim that contraception is a more grave/serious offense than abortion because: Abortion depopulates Earth; contraception depopulates Heaven and Earth. Contraception is direct disobedience of God's first words/command to the human race: "be fertile". It seems to me that contraception is an especially egregious/flagrant/serious offense against the First Great Commandment, and abortion is mostly an egregious/flagrant/serious offense against the Second Great Commandment. Discussion welcomed. Steve Koob To: nfpprofessionals From: pedullad@...Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 11:13:35 -0500Subject: Re: OT Actually my thoughts are actually the reverse. Far too few recognize contraception as the moral crime it is in itself, apart from any abortifacient aspects. Far too many seem to lament only the abortifacient aspect, which while not unimportant, isn't itself, directly or specifically, the moral crime of contraception. Sincerely yours, Dominic M. Pedulla MD, FACC, CNFPMC, ABVM, ACPhInterventional Cardiologist, Endovascular Diplomate, Varicose Vein Specialist, Noncontraceptive Family Planning Consultant, Family Planning ResearcherMedical Director, The Oklahoma Vein and Endovascular Center (www.noveinok.com, veininfo@...)Executive Director, The Edith Stein Foundation (www.theedithsteinfoundation.com) (office) (cell) (FAX)pedullad@... "...the people of Israel. Theirs is the adoption to sonship; theirs the divine glory, the covenants, the receiving of the law, the temple worship and the promises. 5"(Romans 9:3-5) Re: OT Her Choice to Heal is good. I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion? Thanks. Steve KoobOne More Soul I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" -- Therese , RN, FCP* *FertilityCare Practitioner www.potomacfertility.org "your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 2011 Report Share Posted December 3, 2011 The Church clearly believes that the murder of an innocent human person (abortion) is more grave than contraception (if the method does not cause abortion), although both are serious sins. I think we should not confuse people by stating otherwise. Jean Dec 2, 2011 09:03:11 PM, nfpprofessionals wrote: =========================================== JP II uses " gravity " in the text in such a way that the implied assumption is that murder (abortion) is more grave. Yet I have at times wondered about it myself. Sent from my iPhone Evangelium Vitae--The Gospel of Life, by Pope II, http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/encyclicals/documents/hf_jp-ii_en\ c_25031995_evangelium-vitae_en.html 13. In order to facilitate the spread of abortion, enormous sums of money have been invested and continue to be invested in the production of pharmaceutical products which make it possible to kill the fetus in the mother's womb without recourse to medical assistance. On this point, scientific research itself seems to be almost exclusively preoccupied with developing products which are ever more simple and effective in suppressing life and which at the same time are capable of removing abortion from any kind of control or social responsibility. It is frequently asserted that contraception, if made safe and available to all, is the most effective remedy against abortion. The Catholic Church is then accused of actually promoting abortion, because she obstinately continues to teach the moral unlawfulness of contraception. When looked at carefully, this objection is clearly unfounded. It may be that many people use contraception with a view to excluding the subsequent temptation of abortion. But the negative values inherent in the " contraceptive mentality " -which is very different from responsible parenthood, lived in respect for the full truth of the conjugal act-are such that they in fact strengthen this temptation when an unwanted life is conceived. Indeed, the pro- abortion culture is especially strong precisely where the Church's teaching on contraception is rejected. Certainly, from the moral point of view contraception and abortion are specifically different evils: the former contradicts the full truth of the sexual act as the proper expression of conjugal love, while the latter destroys the life of a human being; the former is opposed to the virtue of chastity in marriage, the latter is opposed to the virtue of justice and directly violates the divine commandment " You shall not kill " . But despite their differences of nature and moral gravity, contraception and abortion are often closely connected, as fruits of the same tree. It is true that in many cases contraception and even abortion are practised under the pressure of real- life difficulties, which nonetheless can never exonerate from striving to observe God's law fully. Still, in very many other instances such practices are rooted in a hedonistic mentality unwilling to accept responsibility in matters of sexuality, and they imply a self-centered concept of freedom, which regards procreation as an obstacle to personal fulfilment. The life which could result from a sexual encounter thus becomes an enemy to be avoided at all costs, and abortion becomes the only possible decisive response to failed contraception. The close connection which exists, in mentality, between the practice of contraception and that of abortion is becoming increasingly obvious. It is being demonstrated in an alarming way by the development of chemical products, intrauterine devices and vaccines which, distributed with the same ease as contraceptives, really act as abortifacients in the very early stages of the development of the life of the new human being. To: nfpprofessionals From: pjbaggot@... Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 09:52:56 -0800 Subject: RE: OT In papal encyclicals, the language used to prohibit contraception is very similar to that used to prohibit abortion. PJB. To: nfpprofessionals From: koob_8@... Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 11:46:33 -0500 Subject: RE: OT Dr Dom, No arguement from me. I claim that contraception is a more grave/serious offense than abortion because: Abortion depopulates Earth; contraception depopulates Heaven and Earth. Contraception is direct disobedience of God's first words/command to the human race: " be fertile " . It seems to me that contraception is an especially egregious/flagrant/serious offense against the First Great Commandment, and abortion is mostly an egregious/flagrant/serious offense against the Second Great Commandment. Discussion welcomed. Steve Koob To: nfpprofessionals From: pedullad@... Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 11:13:35 -0500 Subject: Re: OT Actually my thoughts are actually the reverse. Far too few recognize contraception as the moral crime it is in itself, apart from any abortifacient aspects. Far too many seem to lament only the abortifacient aspect, which while not unimportant, isn't itself, directly or specifically, the moral crime of contraception. Sincerely yours, Dominic M. Pedulla MD, FACC, CNFPMC, ABVM, ACPh Interventional Cardiologist, Endovascular Diplomate, Varicose Vein Specialist, Noncontraceptive Family Planning Consultant, Family Planning Researcher Medical Director, The Oklahoma Vein and Endovascular Center (www.noveinok.com, veininfo@...) Executive Director, The Edith Stein Foundation (www.theedithsteinfoundation.com) (office) (cell) (FAX) pedullad@... " ...the people of Israel. Theirs is the adoption to sonship; theirs the divine glory, the covenants, the receiving of the law, the temple worship and the promises. 5 " (Romans 9:3-5) Re: OT Her Choice to Heal is good. I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion? Thanks. Steve Koob One More Soul I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? -- Therese , RN, FCP**FertilityCare Practitionerwww.potomacfertility.org " your cycles, your fertility, in your hands " -- Therese , RN, FCP**FertilityCare Practitionerwww.potomacfertility.org " your cycles, your fertility, in your hands " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 2011 Report Share Posted December 3, 2011 I think that comparison is correct but am not aware of the question ever having come up in the Church's magisterium in an explicit way. Is anyone else?Sent from my iPhone The Church clearly believes that the murder of an innocent human person (abortion) is more grave than contraception (if the method does not cause abortion), although both are serious sins. I think we should not confuse people by stating otherwise. Jean Dec 2, 2011 09:03:11 PM, nfpprofessionals wrote: =========================================== JP II uses "gravity" in the text in such a way that the implied assumption is that murder (abortion) is more grave. Yet I have at times wondered about it myself. Sent from my iPhone Evangelium Vitae--The Gospel of Life, by Pope II, http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/encyclicals/documents/hf_jp-ii_enc_25031995_evangelium-vitae_en.html 13. In order to facilitate the spread of abortion, enormous sums of money have been invested and continue to be invested in the production of pharmaceutical products which make it possible to kill the fetus in the mother's womb without recourse to medical assistance. On this point, scientific research itself seems to be almost exclusively preoccupied with developing products which are ever more simple and effective in suppressing life and which at the same time are capable of removing abortion from any kind of control or social responsibility. It is frequently asserted that contraception, if made safe and available to all, is the most effective remedy against abortion. The Catholic Church is then accused of actually promoting abortion, because she obstinately continues to teach the moral unlawfulness of contraception. When looked at carefully, this objection is clearly unfounded. It may be that many people use contraception with a view to excluding the subsequent temptation of abortion. But the negative values inherent in the "contraceptive mentality"-which is very different from responsible parenthood, lived in respect for the full truth of the conjugal act-are such that they in fact strengthen this temptation when an unwanted life is conceived. Indeed, the pro- abortion culture is especially strong precisely where the Church's teaching on contraception is rejected. Certainly, from the moral point of view contraception and abortion are specifically different evils: the former contradicts the full truth of the sexual act as the proper expression of conjugal love, while the latter destroys the life of a human being; the former is opposed to the virtue of chastity in marriage, the latter is opposed to the virtue of justice and directly violates the divine commandment "You shall not kill". But despite their differences of nature and moral gravity, contraception and abortion are often closely connected, as fruits of the same tree. It is true that in many cases contraception and even abortion are practised under the pressure of real- life difficulties, which nonetheless can never exonerate from striving to observe God's law fully. Still, in very many other instances such practices are rooted in a hedonistic mentality unwilling to accept responsibility in matters of sexuality, and they imply a self-centered concept of freedom, which regards procreation as an obstacle to personal fulfilment. The life which could result from a sexual encounter thus becomes an enemy to be avoided at all costs, and abortion becomes the only possible decisive response to failed contraception. The close connection which exists, in mentality, between the practice of contraception and that of abortion is becoming increasingly obvious. It is being demonstrated in an alarming way by the development of chemical products, intrauterine devices and vaccines which, distributed with the same ease as contraceptives, really act as abortifacients in the very early stages of the development of the life of the new human being. To: nfpprofessionals From: pjbaggot@... Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 09:52:56 -0800 Subject: RE: OT In papal encyclicals, the language used to prohibit contraception is very similar to that used to prohibit abortion. PJB. To: nfpprofessionals From: koob_8@... Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 11:46:33 -0500 Subject: RE: OT Dr Dom, No arguement from me. I claim that contraception is a more grave/serious offense than abortion because: Abortion depopulates Earth; contraception depopulates Heaven and Earth. Contraception is direct disobedience of God's first words/command to the human race: "be fertile". It seems to me that contraception is an especially egregious/flagrant/serious offense against the First Great Commandment, and abortion is mostly an egregious/flagrant/serious offense against the Second Great Commandment. Discussion welcomed. Steve Koob To: nfpprofessionals From: pedullad@... Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2011 11:13:35 -0500 Subject: Re: OT Actually my thoughts are actually the reverse. Far too few recognize contraception as the moral crime it is in itself, apart from any abortifacient aspects. Far too many seem to lament only the abortifacient aspect, which while not unimportant, isn't itself, directly or specifically, the moral crime of contraception. Sincerely yours, Dominic M. Pedulla MD, FACC, CNFPMC, ABVM, ACPh Interventional Cardiologist, Endovascular Diplomate, Varicose Vein Specialist, Noncontraceptive Family Planning Consultant, Family Planning Researcher Medical Director, The Oklahoma Vein and Endovascular Center (www.noveinok.com, veininfo@...) Executive Director, The Edith Stein Foundation (www.theedithsteinfoundation.com) (office) (cell) (FAX) pedullad@... "...the people of Israel. Theirs is the adoption to sonship; theirs the divine glory, the covenants, the receiving of the law, the temple worship and the promises. 5"(Romans 9:3-5) Re: OT Her Choice to Heal is good. I received the following request today. Does anyone have a suggestion? Thanks. Steve Koob One More Soul I am looking for some resources to help women who call our local Project office, trying to forgive themselves years after taking the oral contraceptives. These are women usually past child-bearing years who have brought their sin to confession but are struggling with self-forgiveness. Many cannot/will not see a counselor. Are you aware of any resources that will aid these women in forgiving themselves? I do have a number of booklets such as Therese Burke's Contraception of Grief which is good but doesn't really aid in the process of forgiveness. Also, I have After Abortion by Burrin of The Word Among Us. All good resources but not quite the right fit. Any suggestions? -- Therese , RN, FCP**FertilityCare Practitionerwww.potomacfertility.org"your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" -- Therese , RN, FCP**FertilityCare Practitionerwww.potomacfertility.org"your cycles, your fertility, in your hands" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 , I am just as appalled at how those of us who pay taxes end up shouldering 53% of the burden while 47% live off the rest of us.  Believe me, I understand what you're saying. I sat in my gyn's office one day when she was called out. One-by-one, pregnant Mexican girls with their pants-on-the-ground and hats on backward boyfriends filed through (to see other docs). Invariably when they told their insurance, it was Medicaid. I'm betting there were some pretty nice cars and trucks in the parking lot. People have no skin in the game. Perhaps we have to be a little (or a lot) more hard-nosed. When I was a single student mother of a three-year old, I ran out of money one semester. I went to the bank and borrowed $300 and then tried to get food stamps. I was turned down because of my recent " income. "  At the time, I was living in a cellar with a dirt floor. How many on welfare today are living in a cellar? Val From: hyperaldosteronism [mailto:hyperaldosteronism ] On Behalf Of Bingham I know what incentives are, but don't believe they work or would work. Nor do I still think, if we structure it so " america " pays if your income is lower, that this is fair. Those that have $ - even barely enough to survive, then pay for THEIR own, and STILL pay for someone elses who doesn't have to pay for their own. If I decide to not work and live with family then is it acceptable to use food stamps and get my health care for free? Essentially I could I guess. Is there an incentive NOT to do so? That is no different than now. Francis, there is virtually no reason Medicaid (health care for the poor) cannot be structured with an HSA and catastrophic policy. The average family policy in 2010 ran $1,247 a month. Think of how much of a spending account and catastrophic policy one could have! The price of insurance is whatever it is regardless of one's income. If income is low enough, America provides.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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