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Hello ,

I do not speak Russian (unfortunately) so I cannot help you with the

translation, but I think the difference between " advanced " and " late " as far

as cancer is concerned, refers to no scientific conclusion, it is more a

distinction between a stage when the illness is bad, but there is still hope

(advanced), and a stage when you have to give up, in other words, " late "

would refer to the ultimate stage before loosing the patient. Moreover, I

think thet " late stage " will be used after the death of the patient, and

" advanced " before.

My two cents worth of sunday morning wisdom, maybe the English native

speakers will confirm/infirm my theory? Any taker?

Hope it helps you a little bit...

Anne Brandsma-Gayon

abg@...

Tel: 1

Fax: 1

ILS, LLC

Advanced cancer

> Dear weekend workers,

>

> I have problem translating (Eng>Rus) the term " advanced cancer " in a

series

> of abstracts from reputable journals.

>

> This term is used independently of conventional stages (I to IV) defined

as

> the extent of growth, presence/absence of metastases, etc. (e.g., " locally

> advanced inoperable non-small-cell lung cancer " or " locally advanced

> cervical cancer " ).

>

>

> Because in some papers on lung cancer the term *advanced* referred to

stage

> IIIB (pleural effusion) or IV , I translated *advanced* as equivalent to

> *late stage* utill I found both in the same text, where these terms

referred

> to different stages:

>

> " The potentiation of cisplatin's activity by batimastat was dose dependent

> and was observed in the treatment of both advanced (7 days after tumor

> inoculation) and late-stage (20 days after inoculation) tumor. "

>

> This occurred only once in a pack of about 20 abstracts and refers to an

> experimental paradigm, but I'm afraid there may be a clinically

significant

> distinction between these conditions.

>

> I talked to a few Russian oncologists and got an impression that they do

not

> use such a system of notation.

>

> I'll be grateful for ( a link to ) explanation of *advanced cancer* and

> *late stage* of cancer.

>

> Thanks in advance,

>

>

> S. Sosnovsky, M.D.

> Biomedical Translation & Editing

> asosnov@...

> Tel. +7

>

>

>

>

> URL: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/medical_translation

>

> To unsubscribe, please send an *empty* message to

> medical_translation-UNSUBSCRIBE

>

>

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At 10:08 29-04-01 -0400, you wrote:

>Hello ,

>

>I do not speak Russian (unfortunately) so I cannot help you with the

>translation, but I think the difference between " advanced " and " late " as far

>as cancer is concerned, refers to no scientific conclusion, it is more a

>distinction between a stage when the illness is bad, but there is still hope

>(advanced), and a stage when you have to give up, in other words, " late "

>would refer to the ultimate stage before loosing the patient.

This is my impression also.

>Moreover, I

>think thet " late stage " will be used after the death of the patient, and

> " advanced " before.

Not convinced of this. Mind you, it is less likely that surgery will be

performed on a patient who is in the terminal stages, so perhaps

histopathology will not be possible until after death in these cases.

My impression - which I unfortunately cannot guarantee with certainty - is

that should translate the terms " advanced " and " late (stage) "

directly, if he cannot find exact equivalents already established in Russian.

Best regards

Coilín.

Coilín ÓhAiseadha. da>en no>en translator

Aa-Tchoo! Entertainments Translations: www.aatchoo.com

Tsentsak Medical Translations: tsentsak@...

+45 3616 5666 / 2192 5666

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Guest guest

Dear colleagues,

I am sorry that I have been so busy that I did not read all the threads on this

subject, however, I think I may have something to add. I would also like to

point out that I am in the US and the terms may be different or not from the

English is translating.

" Late " stage is NOT used AFTER the death. The fact that in English we use

" Late " to refer to a person who has died, is not evidence of using " Late " in

a medical context in the same way. If the logic for thinking that " late " is

used to describe the state after the patient dies, this is not correct. I have

never

ever heard this terminology used after the death of a patient. Once the patient

dies, he may be described (in life) as having died of late stage (end stage)

cancer, but it does not describe his present state but the state he was in at

the time of his death (while he was still alive).

In the US we use the term " END STAGE " for the last stage of cancer and other

serious illnesses (i.e., end stage renal failure, end stage cirrhosis

hepatica), could this be the equivalent of 'late stage'? At any rate this is

the last stage and the terminology used for it here in the US.

If I have gotten something wrong, I am sure you will all let me know! ;-)

FWIW,

4/29/01 10:10:20 PM, " Aa-Tchoo! Translations " wrote:

>At 10:08 29-04-01 -0400, you wrote:

>>Hello ,

>>

>>I do not speak Russian (unfortunately) so I cannot help you with the

>>translation, but I think the difference between " advanced " and " late " as far

>>as cancer is concerned, refers to no scientific conclusion, it is more a

>>distinction between a stage when the illness is bad, but there is still hope

>>(advanced), and a stage when you have to give up, in other words, " late "

>>would refer to the ultimate stage before loosing the patient.

>

>This is my impression also.

>

>

>>Moreover, I

>>think thet " late stage " will be used after the death of the patient, and

>> " advanced " before.

>

>Not convinced of this. Mind you, it is less likely that surgery will be

>performed on a patient who is in the terminal stages, so perhaps

>histopathology will not be possible until after death in these cases.

>

>

>My impression - which I unfortunately cannot guarantee with certainty - is

>that should translate the terms " advanced " and " late (stage) "

>directly, if he cannot find exact equivalents already established in Russian.

>

>Best regards

>Coilín.

>

>Coilín ÓhAiseadha. da>en no>en translator

>Aa-Tchoo! Entertainments Translations: www.aatchoo.com

>Tsentsak Medical Translations: tsentsak@...

>+45 3616 5666 / 2192 5666

>

>

>

>URL: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/medical_translation

>

>To unsubscribe, please send an *empty* message to

>medical_translation-UNSUBSCRIBE

>

>

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At 12:08 29-04-01 -0700, you wrote:

>Dear colleagues,

>

>I am sorry that I have been so busy that I did not read all the threads on

>this subject, however, I think I may have something to add. I would also

>like to

>point out that I am in the US and the terms may be different or not from

>the English is translating.

>

> " Late " stage is NOT used AFTER the death. The fact that in English we use

> " Late " to refer to a person who has died, is not evidence of using " Late " in

>a medical context in the same way. If the logic for thinking that " late "

>is used to describe the state after the patient dies, this is not

>correct. I have never

>ever heard this terminology used after the death of a patient. Once the

>patient dies, he may be described (in life) as having died of late stage

>(end stage)

>cancer, but it does not describe his present state but the state he was in

>at the time of his death (while he was still alive).

>

>In the US we use the term " END STAGE " for the last stage of cancer and

>other serious illnesses (i.e., end stage renal failure, end stage cirrhosis

>hepatica), could this be the equivalent of 'late stage'? At any rate this

>is the last stage and the terminology used for it here in the US.

>

>If I have gotten something wrong, I am sure you will all let me know! ;-)

We would - if we knew for sure! ;)

What you have written sounds sensible to me. I hadn't thought of that

meaning for " late " . I thought Anne was referring to the findings on

postmortem histopathology.

Sorry that I don't have time right now to go looking through the hits for

" late stage cancer " and advanced cancer I found in Google, but there were a

number where both terms appeared in close association, without clear

definition of either phrase, and this very _lack_ of definitions may be

relevant.

Regards

Coilín.

Coilín ÓhAiseadha. da>en no>en translator

Aa-Tchoo! Entertainments Translations: www.aatchoo.com

Tsentsak Medical Translations: tsentsak@...

+45 3616 5666 / 2192 5666

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Guest guest

Dear Anne, , and Coilin,

Thank you for the fruitful discussion.

My actual problem is that the Russian word used as an equivalent of

*Advanced* is not applicable to such a sad event; rather, it means something

that is better than the preceding stage (e.g. advanced research).

Stages IIIb-IV are called late, and this caused some confusion in my

translation (although in only one abstract).

English is not my native language, but this problem seems to me similar to

the usage of *enhanced*. For example, I would never write *enhahced loss* ,

although in some other contexts (*enhanced support*) this is a synonym of

*increased*.

Kind regards,

S. Sosnovsky, M.D.

Biomedical Translation & Editing

asosnov@...

Tel. +7

Advanced cancer

>

>

> > Dear weekend workers,

> >

> > I have problem translating (Eng>Rus) the term " advanced cancer " in a

> series

> > of abstracts from reputable journals.

> >

> > This term is used independently of conventional stages (I to IV)

defined

> as

> > the extent of growth, presence/absence of metastases, etc. (e.g.,

" locally

> > advanced inoperable non-small-cell lung cancer " or " locally advanced

> > cervical cancer " ).

> >

> >

> > Because in some papers on lung cancer the term *advanced* referred to

> stage

> > IIIB (pleural effusion) or IV , I translated *advanced* as equivalent to

> > *late stage* utill I found both in the same text, where these terms

> referred

> > to different stages:

> >

> > " The potentiation of cisplatin's activity by batimastat was dose

dependent

> > and was observed in the treatment of both advanced (7 days after tumor

> > inoculation) and late-stage (20 days after inoculation) tumor. "

> >

> > This occurred only once in a pack of about 20 abstracts and refers to an

> > experimental paradigm, but I'm afraid there may be a clinically

> significant

> > distinction between these conditions.

> >

> > I talked to a few Russian oncologists and got an impression that they do

> not

> > use such a system of notation.

> >

> > I'll be grateful for ( a link to ) explanation of *advanced cancer* and

> > *late stage* of cancer.

> >

> > Thanks in advance,

> >

> >

> > S. Sosnovsky, M.D.

> > Biomedical Translation & Editing

> > asosnov@...

> > Tel. +7

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > URL: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/medical_translation

> >

> > To unsubscribe, please send an *empty* message to

> > medical_translation-UNSUBSCRIBE

> >

> >

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At 08:48 30-04-01 +0400, you wrote:

>Dear Anne, , and Coilin,

>

>Thank you for the fruitful discussion.

>

>My actual problem is that the Russian word used as an equivalent of

>*Advanced* is not applicable to such a sad event; rather, it means something

>that is better than the preceding stage (e.g. advanced research).

How about something based on the concept of disease _progress_?

>Stages IIIb-IV are called late, and this caused some confusion in my

>translation (although in only one abstract).

>

>English is not my native language, but this problem seems to me similar to

>the usage of *enhanced*. For example, I would never write *enhahced loss* ,

>although in some other contexts (*enhanced support*) this is a synonym of

>*increased*.

Fwiw, enhanced means improved, not necessarily increased. But I think you

know that.

Best regards,

Coilín.

Coilín ÓhAiseadha. da>en no>en translator

Aa-Tchoo! Entertainments Translations: www.aatchoo.com

Tsentsak Medical Translations: tsentsak@...

+45 3616 5666 / 2192 5666

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Guest guest

,

Why don't you just say:

ðÒÏÇÒÅÓÓÉÒÕÀÝÉÅ ÓÔÁÄÉÉ ÚÁÂÏÌÅ×ÁÎÉÑ

(progressiruyuschie stadii zabolevania)

Alla

Advanced cancer

> >

> >

> > > Dear weekend workers,

> > >

> > > I have problem translating (Eng>Rus) the term " advanced cancer " in a

> > series

> > > of abstracts from reputable journals.

> > >

> > > This term is used independently of conventional stages (I to IV)

> defined

> > as

> > > the extent of growth, presence/absence of metastases, etc. (e.g.,

> " locally

> > > advanced inoperable non-small-cell lung cancer " or " locally advanced

> > > cervical cancer " ).

> > >

> > >

> > > Because in some papers on lung cancer the term *advanced* referred to

> > stage

> > > IIIB (pleural effusion) or IV , I translated *advanced* as equivalent

to

> > > *late stage* utill I found both in the same text, where these terms

> > referred

> > > to different stages:

> > >

> > > " The potentiation of cisplatin's activity by batimastat was dose

> dependent

> > > and was observed in the treatment of both advanced (7 days after tumor

> > > inoculation) and late-stage (20 days after inoculation) tumor. "

> > >

> > > This occurred only once in a pack of about 20 abstracts and refers to

an

> > > experimental paradigm, but I'm afraid there may be a clinically

> > significant

> > > distinction between these conditions.

> > >

> > > I talked to a few Russian oncologists and got an impression that they

do

> > not

> > > use such a system of notation.

> > >

> > > I'll be grateful for ( a link to ) explanation of *advanced cancer*

and

> > > *late stage* of cancer.

> > >

> > > Thanks in advance,

> > >

> > >

> > > S. Sosnovsky, M.D.

> > > Biomedical Translation & Editing

> > > asosnov@...

> > > Tel. +7

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > URL: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/medical_translation

> > >

> > > To unsubscribe, please send an *empty* message to

> > > medical_translation-UNSUBSCRIBE

> > >

> > >

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Guest guest

Dear ,

In my understanding late-, advanced- and end-stage cancer is

basically used in the same clinical context; i.e. the occurence of

metastasis and/or involvement of lymphatic nodes. There is no

accurate definition of this terms as to a distinct clinical picture.

It generally implies an pallitative therapeutic approach, that means

often no curative measures are taken.

Hope that helps,

Dr. Fritz Aicher

med.trans@...

> Dear weekend workers,

>

> I have problem translating (Eng>Rus) the term " advanced cancer " in

a series

> of abstracts from reputable journals.

>

> This term is used independently of conventional stages (I to IV)

defined as

> the extent of growth, presence/absence of metastases, etc.

(e.g., " locally

> advanced inoperable non-small-cell lung cancer " or " locally advanced

> cervical cancer " ).

>

>

> Because in some papers on lung cancer the term *advanced* referred

to stage

> IIIB (pleural effusion) or IV , I translated *advanced* as

equivalent to

> *late stage* utill I found both in the same text, where these terms

referred

> to different stages:

>

> " The potentiation of cisplatin's activity by batimastat was dose

dependent

> and was observed in the treatment of both advanced (7 days after

tumor

> inoculation) and late-stage (20 days after inoculation) tumor. "

>

> This occurred only once in a pack of about 20 abstracts and refers

to an

> experimental paradigm, but I'm afraid there may be a clinically

significant

> distinction between these conditions.

>

> I talked to a few Russian oncologists and got an impression that

they do not

> use such a system of notation.

>

> I'll be grateful for ( a link to ) explanation of *advanced cancer*

and

> *late stage* of cancer.

>

> Thanks in advance,

>

>

> S. Sosnovsky, M.D.

> Biomedical Translation & Editing

> asosnov@o...

> Tel. +7

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Guest guest

Dear translators,

Thank you again for your suggestions.

I opted to use the Russian equivalent of " late " . I wrote a note about this

to my client (with reference to our group URL), and he is fully satisfied.

I Don't think that " progress " is any better because, as far as I' informed,

untreated cancer progresses at any stage :-(.

Best regards,

S. Sosnovsky, M.D.

Biomedical Translation & Editing

asosnov@...

Tel. +7

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