Re: Ritalin prescribed by OK teachers

[Guest guest]

nah wrote:

> One of my husband's co-workers, who is from Oklahoma, told my husband

> that in Oklahoma, a TEACHER can prescribe Ritalin and if the teacher

> prescribes it, the parents are mandated BY LAW to medicate the child

> with Ritalin.

>

> How could this be?

I think your husband's co-worker is misinformed.

[Guest guest]

sounds like the guy either is or knows a parent whose being snowed and

doesn't knwo their rights...

Klein wrote:

> nah wrote:

>

> > One of my husband's co-workers, who is from Oklahoma, told my husband

> > that in Oklahoma, a TEACHER can prescribe Ritalin and if the teacher

> > prescribes it, the parents are mandated BY LAW to medicate the child

> > with Ritalin.

> >

> > How could this be?

>

> I think your husband's co-worker is misinformed.

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

The coworker is mistaken. Only a doctor can prescribe Ritalin, and to

get a medication court mandate takes alot of appeals and junk.

Kassiane

who is tired of this medicating kids into submission stuff thats not

even true...

< Ritalin prescribed by OK teachers

One of my husband's co-workers, who is from Oklahoma, told my husband

that in Oklahoma, a TEACHER can prescribe Ritalin and if the teacher

prescribes it, the parents are mandated BY LAW to medicate the child

with Ritalin.

How could this be? I was the only student in my school on Ritalin, so I

know it didn't used to be the case. How can a teacher diagnose ADHD? I

was (mis)diagnosed with ADHD and Ritalin had no real effect on me,

except to put my liver in danger. Normal children become hyper when on

Ritalin. Epileptic children can die if they are put on Ritalin. I

can't believe people could be so careless with a drug that is so legally

regulated due to its similarity to cocaine that one cannot get a

prescription with refills, a doctor cannot call it into the pharmacy; my

doctor always had to mail us a fresh prescription every month due to the

regulations, so how can a TEACHER prescribe a medication like this?

I think it's crazy.

[Guest guest]

It IS crazy. If a teacher doesn't like a student, they will prescribe it to get

them to " calm down " or whatever. This is gross neglegence, and I would think

the doctors in OK would be very upset about this. It's all about Big Pharma

making money no matter what, and NTs maintaining their comfort.

Jeanette

Ritalin prescribed by OK teachers

One of my husband's co-workers, who is from Oklahoma, told my husband that in

Oklahoma, a TEACHER can prescribe Ritalin and if the teacher prescribes it, the

parents are mandated BY LAW to medicate the child with Ritalin.

How could this be? I was the only student in my school on Ritalin, so I know

it didn't used to be the case. How can a teacher diagnose ADHD? I was

(mis)diagnosed with ADHD and Ritalin had no real effect on me, except to put my

liver in danger. Normal children become hyper when on Ritalin. Epileptic

children can die if they are put on Ritalin. I can't believe people could be so

careless with a drug that is so legally regulated due to its similarity to

cocaine that one cannot get a prescription with refills, a doctor cannot call it

into the pharmacy; my doctor always had to mail us a fresh prescription every

month due to the regulations, so how can a TEACHER prescribe a medication like

this?

I think it's crazy.

[Guest guest]

> The coworker is mistaken. Only a doctor can prescribe Ritalin, and >

to get a medication court mandate takes alot of appeals and junk.

>

> Kassiane

> who is tired of this medicating kids into submission stuff thats

> not even true...

What *is* true is that there have been schools that have mandated that

a kid be on meds before they go to class, and possibly had it backed

up in court.

[Guest guest]

< Re: Ritalin prescribed by OK teachers

> The coworker is mistaken. Only a doctor can prescribe Ritalin, and >

to get a medication court mandate takes alot of appeals and junk.

>

> Kassiane

> who is tired of this medicating kids into submission stuff thats

> not even true...

What *is* true is that there have been schools that have mandated that

a kid be on meds before they go to class, and possibly had it backed

up in court.

I am not denying that sort of thing has happened (and I dont think it

should happen either). But no kid has ever gone home with an rx for

ritalin from a teacher with an associated note saying they cant come to

school until they take it. Only MDs can prescribe.

Kassiane

_______________________________________________________________

Get the FREE email that has everyone talking at

http://www.mail2world.com

[Guest guest]

no way anywhere could a teacher prescribe ritalin. some teachers pressure

parents to get a ritalin prescription for the child. some parents put immense

pressure on teachers to fill out the adhd assessment form in a manner that will

get a prescription. I have had that experience several times from people who

did not want to cope with a lively active child and who hoped ritalin would make

them more placid.

no pharmacist would fill a prescription written by the teacher because people

who can prescribe have a government code so that prescriptions can be monitored.

teachers do not qualify.

: 13

Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2003 15:48:59 -0700

Subject: Re: Ritalin prescribed by OK teachers

nah wrote:

> One of my husband's co-workers, who is from Oklahoma, told my husband

> that in Oklahoma, a TEACHER can prescribe Ritalin and if the teacher

> prescribes it, the parents are mandated BY LAW to medicate the child

> with Ritalin.

>

> How could this be?

I think your husband's co-worker is misinformed.

__________________________________________________________________

McAfee VirusScan Online from the Netscape Network.

Comprehensive protection for your entire computer. Get your free trial today!

http://channels.netscape.com/ns/computing/mcafee/index.jsp?promo=393397

Get AOL Instant Messenger 5.1 free of charge. Download Now!

http://aim.aol.com/aimnew/Aim/register.adp?promo=380455

[Guest guest]

The co-worker is from Oklahoma and he told my husband that this law is the

reason he sent his children to private schools. I can't imagine he'd send his

kids to private schools for a reason that doesn't exist. Maybe he was told one

of his kids would be put on Ritalin or something and that's why. Maybe he is

lying. It didn't make any sense to me, which is why I said I thought it sounded

crazy.

I know how tightly regulared Ritalin is, having been on it 15 years of my

childhood and adolescence. It made no sense and that's one reason I posted

about it.

gprobertson@... wrote:

no way anywhere could a teacher prescribe ritalin. some teachers pressure

parents to get a ritalin prescription for the child. some parents put immense

pressure on teachers to fill out the adhd assessment form in a manner that will

get a prescription. I have had that experience several times from people who did

not want to cope with a lively active child and who hoped ritalin would make

them more placid.

no pharmacist would fill a prescription written by the teacher because people

who can prescribe have a government code so that prescriptions can be monitored.

teachers do not qualify.

My mother was pressured into having me take Ritalin. She didn't want me on any

medication that would make me someone else, because she loved who I was. But

they convinced her that Ritalin only affects a person in the short-term, for a

few hours, and that, at home, I would still be me. She would take me off

Ritalin during the summers (I was grossly overdosed during the school year...90

mg in the mornings, half that in the afternoons, for several years....) They

told her it was " cruel " to expect me to behave without medication, that she was

being " unfair " to me to not let me take a med that would help me so much.

It makes me wonder what argument they used to convince her I should take Haldol.

I also remember the complete lack of privacy...in first grade, it was written on

the chalkboard, " nah, do not forget to take your Ritalin! " It was in case

I forgot to go to the office to get my noon pills. Even though I almost never

forgot.

I am somewhat bitter about my time on Ritalin, and it worries me that a lot of

other kids that won't benefit from even gross overdoses like the one I was

on...basically, they put me on Cocaine to make me behave, a high dose because a

low dose didn't do much. I worry about so many kids being given this serious

drug when they should not be. If this is true...it's just ridiculous. I hope

you are right about the man being misinformed, but because he had children in

the Oklahoma public school system, and pulled them out to send them to private

school...there MUST have been a reason. Since he gives this reason, I believed

him at first, but now I do realize, this is either the truth, or he is lying to

cover up the truth, or he someone was misinformed.

: 13

Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2003 15:48:59 -0700

From: Klein

Subject: Re: Ritalin prescribed by OK teachers

nah wrote:

> One of my husband's co-workers, who is from Oklahoma, told my husband

> that in Oklahoma, a TEACHER can prescribe Ritalin and if the teacher

> prescribes it, the parents are mandated BY LAW to medicate the child

> with Ritalin.

>

> How could this be?

I think your husband's co-worker is misinformed.

[Guest guest]

Kassiane Yelbis wrote:

< Re: Ritalin prescribed by OK teachers

> The coworker is mistaken. Only a doctor can prescribe Ritalin, and >

to get a medication court mandate takes alot of appeals and junk.

>

> Kassiane

> who is tired of this medicating kids into submission stuff thats

> not even true...

What *is* true is that there have been schools that have mandated that

a kid be on meds before they go to class, and possibly had it backed

up in court.

I am not denying that sort of thing has happened (and I dont think it

should happen either). But no kid has ever gone home with an rx for

ritalin from a teacher with an associated note saying they cant come to

school until they take it. Only MDs can prescribe.

Kassiane

An NP could prescribe it. (Nurse Practicioner). If the school nurse were an NP

then they kid COULD come home with such an RX with a note. And if the parents

refused, it COULD get court ordered. I was confused because he said it was the

TEACHERS that could prescribe it, but now I see other things he might have

meant, such as, if the teacher suspects ADHD, they can do an assessment and the

kid can get diagnosed based on this assessment, and then there is the

possibility of a court order if the parents refuse to medicate their child.

Which reminds me, a completely normal child on Ritalin will become hyper/act

like they are on cocaine. This usually leads to the kid being taken off the

medication. But if the kid has something similar to ADHD that is not ADHD, then

the kid will not become hyper, and then they will just keep increasing the

dosage because the lower dose isn't doing much of anything. I think this is

what happened to me, because I was put on a very high overdose for several years

(90 mg/morning, 45 mg/noon). Combination of 5's and 10's. Greenish-yellow

five's and white 10's. I think maybe there were 20's at the beginning. I can't

remember anymore. They taste so bitter if they touch your tongue so I always

put them under my tongue. I used a shot glass of ginger ale to take them during

the first few years, then I decided I hated ginger ale so I took them with

water. I took my Prozac in juice. Half a 20 mg capsule. We opened the capsule

and sprinkled half of it into juice. Ugg! Very bitter.

But it wasn't so bad in passion fruit juice, but HORRID in Pepsi. Some weird

chemical reaction.

Anyway, though...I think a normal kid of Ritalin will soon be taken off Ritalin.

But a kid with atypical neurology may not react to ritalin as a normal child

does (since ADHD is a neurological difference). If autism contains the same

neurological difference, plus additional differences, then a whole lot of

Spectrum kids are probably misdiagnosed and mismedicated like I was.

When my mom found out about AS, the first thing she said was, " What do they

prescribe for it? " She'd been conditioned by then to medicate everything

(partly due to her job, I think, and partly due to me). When she was told,

" There really isn't anything, " it was a relief to me, because now she will

FINALLY stop badgering me to take SSRI's. I was on them for 10 years, thanks,

and they made me suicidal. I don't want them ever again.

[Guest guest]

Maybe all of your " numerous " med problems, (them not working and whatnot) was

from taking them with PEPSI, JUICES and crap that any medicine is not

supposed to be taken with?!? Even tylenol should be taken ONLY WITH 8 OZ. OF

WATER.

No citric acid juices or carbanated colas or ginger ales!!!!!!!!

[Guest guest]

<-----Original Message----->

An NP could prescribe it. (Nurse Practicioner). If the school nurse

were an NP then they kid COULD come home with such an RX with a note.

And if the parents refused, it COULD get court ordered. I was confused

because he said it was the TEACHERS that could prescribe it, but now I

see other things he might have meant, such as, if the teacher suspects

ADHD, they can do an assessment and the kid can get diagnosed based on

this assessment, and then there is the possibility of a court order if

the parents refuse to medicate their child.

Which reminds me, a completely normal child on Ritalin will become

hyper/act like they are on cocaine. This usually leads to the kid being

taken off the medication. >>

Actually, a typical kid wont have much response at all. A bipolar child,

it will make raging manic (speaking from experience, a similar

medication had me convinced people were breathing loudly at me to kill

me), but a typical child won't respond much at all.

<<But if the kid has something similar to ADHD that is not ADHD, then

the kid will not become hyper, and then they will just keep increasing

the dosage because the lower dose isn't doing much of anything. I think

this is what happened to me, because I was put on a very high overdose

for several years (90 mg/morning, 45 mg/noon). Combination of 5's and

10's. Greenish-yellow five's and white 10's. I think maybe there were

20's at the beginning. I can't remember anymore. They taste so bitter

if they touch your tongue so I always put them under my tongue. I used

a shot glass of ginger ale to take them during the first few years, then

I decided I hated ginger ale so I took them with water. I took my

Prozac in juice. Half a 20 mg capsule. We opened the capsul e and

sprinkled half of it into juice. Ugg! Very bitter.

But it wasn't so bad in passion fruit juice, but HORRID in Pepsi. Some

weird chemical reaction. >>

Sounds gross. But a typical kid is less likely to become hyper than a

kid with another condition (ie bipolar, i guess some autie kids

too)..and of course there is the seizure factor, and all those

personality traits that dont respond at ALL because they arent in that

part of the brain.

<<Anyway, though...I think a normal kid of Ritalin will soon be taken

off Ritalin. But a kid with atypical neurology may not react to ritalin

as a normal child does (since ADHD is a neurological difference). If

autism contains the same neurological difference, plus additional

differences, then a whole lot of Spectrum kids are probably misdiagnosed

and mismedicated like I was.>>

I was misdiagnosed (ADHD rather than a lovely autism/bipolar mix) and

mismediacated-and we found out REAL quick that stimulants are not for

me.

<<When my mom found out about AS, the first thing she said was, " What do

they prescribe for it? " She'd been conditioned by then to medicate

everything (partly due to her job, I think, and partly due to me). When

she was told, " There really isn't anything, " it was a relief to me,

because now she will FINALLY stop badgering me to take SSRI's. I was on

them for 10 years, thanks, and they made me suicidal. I don't want them

ever again. >>

I cant take those either. Anything that even looks at my serotonin makes

me batty.

Kassiane

_______________________________________________________________

Get the FREE email that has everyone talking at

http://www.mail2world.com

[Guest guest]

They didn't say to take them with water. And there was no way TO take the

Prozac except in juice because it was in powder form. Of course it was only

taken in juice half the time, the other half of the time it was taken in a

capsule. At home I took my 90 mg of Ritalin with ginger ale but at school at

lunch time I took the 45 mg with water. I only took Ritalin with ginger ale at

home for the first year or two of the 15 years I was on it. I only took it with

Pepsi once. I hate Pepsi but we were out of juice so I had to take it in

*something* and my dad's Pepsi was the only thing we had but there was a

horrible reaction and I couldn't take it. I never took it in any other type of

soda, either. My psychiatrist knew we took Prozac in juice and it was not a

problem. Sometimes, we'd get empty capsules from the pharmacy, and I'd

re-package the Prozac, half in the Prozac capsule and half in the empty capsule.

The problem was that they did not make 10 mg. doses and I was on a 10 mg.

dose. Now I think they made 10 mg and 20 mg doses but back then only 20 mg.

And it's not that it didn't work; it's that, over time, the long-term

side-effects made me suicidal. I know it was the Prozac that did it because

when I stopped taking it I stopped being suicidal. And the Haldol I took also

worked; I experienced all the side-effects expected with Haldol so I know it

worked. I just talked to my mom today and she told me there was a substancial

difference when I took that 90mg/ritalin in the morning and 45 mg/ritalin in the

afternoon. So it's not that it didn't work; it's that I shouldn't have been

taking it, period, regardless of whether it was with ginger ale or juice or milk

or water (and I took it with each of those things at various points in my life).

beanstalk733@... wrote:Maybe all of your " numerous " med problems, (them not

working and whatnot) was

from taking them with PEPSI, JUICES and crap that any medicine is not

supposed to be taken with?!? Even tylenol should be taken ONLY WITH 8 OZ. OF

WATER.

No citric acid juices or carbanated colas or ginger ales!!!!!!!!

[Guest guest]

same deal for me, but altho the SSRI antidepressants actually make me

mroe manic and homicidal thatn suicidal - in fact I still take them (in

small doses for a few days at a ttime only) to manage the worst of my

crashes...

dani

Kassiane Yelbis wrote:

>

>

> <-----Original Message----->

>

>

>

>

> An NP could prescribe it. (Nurse Practicioner). If the school nurse

> were an NP then they kid COULD come home with such an RX with a note.

> And if the parents refused, it COULD get court ordered. I was confused

> because he said it was the TEACHERS that could prescribe it, but now I

> see other things he might have meant, such as, if the teacher suspects

> ADHD, they can do an assessment and the kid can get diagnosed based on

> this assessment, and then there is the possibility of a court order if

> the parents refuse to medicate their child.

>

> Which reminds me, a completely normal child on Ritalin will become

> hyper/act like they are on cocaine. This usually leads to the kid being

> taken off the medication. >>

>

> Actually, a typical kid wont have much response at all. A bipolar child,

> it will make raging manic (speaking from experience, a similar

> medication had me convinced people were breathing loudly at me to kill

> me), but a typical child won't respond much at all.

>

> <<But if the kid has something similar to ADHD that is not ADHD, then

> the kid will not become hyper, and then they will just keep increasing

> the dosage because the lower dose isn't doing much of anything. I think

> this is what happened to me, because I was put on a very high overdose

> for several years (90 mg/morning, 45 mg/noon). Combination of 5's and

> 10's. Greenish-yellow five's and white 10's. I think maybe there were

> 20's at the beginning. I can't remember anymore. They taste so bitter

> if they touch your tongue so I always put them under my tongue. I used

> a shot glass of ginger ale to take them during the first few years, then

> I decided I hated ginger ale so I took them with water. I took my

> Prozac in juice. Half a 20 mg capsule. We opened the capsul e and

> sprinkled half of it into juice. Ugg! Very bitter.

> But it wasn't so bad in passion fruit juice, but HORRID in Pepsi. Some

> weird chemical reaction. >>

>

> Sounds gross. But a typical kid is less likely to become hyper than a

> kid with another condition (ie bipolar, i guess some autie kids

> too)..and of course there is the seizure factor, and all those

> personality traits that dont respond at ALL because they arent in that

> part of the brain.

>

> <<Anyway, though...I think a normal kid of Ritalin will soon be taken

> off Ritalin. But a kid with atypical neurology may not react to ritalin

> as a normal child does (since ADHD is a neurological difference). If

> autism contains the same neurological difference, plus additional

> differences, then a whole lot of Spectrum kids are probably misdiagnosed

> and mismedicated like I was.>>

>

> I was misdiagnosed (ADHD rather than a lovely autism/bipolar mix) and

> mismediacated-and we found out REAL quick that stimulants are not for

> me.

>

> <<When my mom found out about AS, the first thing she said was, " What do

> they prescribe for it? " She'd been conditioned by then to medicate

> everything (partly due to her job, I think, and partly due to me). When

> she was told, " There really isn't anything, " it was a relief to me,

> because now she will FINALLY stop badgering me to take SSRI's. I was on

> them for 10 years, thanks, and they made me suicidal. I don't want them

> ever again. >>

>

> I cant take those either. Anything that even looks at my serotonin makes

> me batty.

>

> Kassiane

>

>

> _______________________________________________________________

> Get the FREE email that has everyone talking at

> http://www.mail2world.com

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

<< Actually, a typical kid wont have much response at all. >>

If that were true, then a kid I knew with ADHD wouldn't have made so

much money selling his Ritalin to neurotypical kids, and an NT addict

I knew wouldn't have faked ADD to get the stuff. It's a stimulant, so

it acts like any other stimulant of its class in most NT people, which

probably includes a variation of responses, but I don't think " no

response " is a common one to that sort of drug.

Similarly, while caffeine affects most people in predictable ways, I

knew a junior high kid who took Ritalin normally, but if he forgot it,

he drank a *whole* lot of colas so he could stay calm and focused.

Whereas in my case, both caffeine and Ritalin (as well as other drugs

in that general category) can often have a *terrible* effect on me

(racing heart, so hyper I end up slamming into walls and bashing my

head on things just to get rid of some of the energy, etc), although I

did manage a fair caffeine addiction at one point despite this (I

think after building up a tolerance slowly it doesn't affect me quite

as badly). I don't think stimulants and I get along.

But then I have rarely met a psychoactive drug I didn't either

overreact, underreact, or have a relatively unusual or reverse

reaction to, and I have been prescribed many. Antidepressants destroy

my impulse control but rarely touch my emotions. Neuroleptics range

from seriously incapacitating me to (without intervention) killing me,

and can make me hallucinate as well as causing most of the standard

side-effects. Stimulants make me way more hyper than they do most

people. It can take a huge amount of any minor tranquilizer (like

Ativan) to do much to me at all. Anticonvulsants, for the most part,

do weird things to my senses (like one destroyed my sense of pitch)

and in one case made me delirious. Even the illicit drugs I

experimented with as a teenager didn't act normal -- LSD made me

calmer and improved my motor and sensory skills (such that while off

it people thought I was on it and while on it people thought I was off

it), and marijuana was like throwing a sledgehammer at my sensory

integration and whatever rudimentary sense of time I had while making

my heart race and my head spin and bizarre hallucinations flash in

front of me.

And none of that is counting all the drugs that *aren't* supposed to

be psychoactive that have an effect on me.

So I'm definitely well into the neuro-atypical range, and that can be

ascertained just by putting chemicals into my system and watching my

reaction (although I'd rather not do any more ascertaining of that

variety). Having a standard reaction seems to be nearly impossible.

(This is one reason why I always warn parents to be incredibly careful

about anything that's psychoactive when it comes to autistic children

-- there is *no possible way* they can know what it will do to their

kid, because even when it has a standard and studied range of effects,

autistic people are *very* likely to fall outside of it, and we don't

even all have the 'courtesy' to fall outside of it in the same ways.

I recently (publicly) witnessed a mother who decided, *along with* her

nearly-18-year-old son, to try a small dose of a neuroleptic and an

antidepressant on him to combat exposure anxiety, and he had an

akathisia reaction so strong he got violent and was eventually locked

in a psych ward while they got him off the drugs (but before this,

they didn't even know what akathisia was so they didn't know what the

reaction was). :-( )

[Guest guest]

< Re: Ritalin prescribed by OK teachers

<< Actually, a typical kid wont have much response at all. >>

If that were true, then a kid I knew with ADHD wouldn't have made so

much money selling his Ritalin to neurotypical kids, and an NT addict

I knew wouldn't have faked ADD to get the stuff. It's a stimulant, so

it acts like any other stimulant of its class in most NT people, which

probably includes a variation of responses, but I don't think " no

response " is a common one to that sort of drug.>>

Hm. Go figure. Learn somethin' new every day.

Whereas in my case, both caffeine and Ritalin (as well as other drugs

in that general category) can often have a *terrible* effect on me

(racing heart, so hyper I end up slamming into walls and bashing my

head on things just to get rid of some of the energy, etc), although I

did manage a fair caffeine addiction at one point despite this (I

think after building up a tolerance slowly it doesn't affect me quite

as badly). I don't think stimulants and I get along. >>

I react similarly to stimulants, only add psychosis.

So I'm definitely well into the neuro-atypical range, and that can be

ascertained just by putting chemicals into my system and watching my

reaction (although I'd rather not do any more ascertaining of that

variety). Having a standard reaction seems to be nearly impossible.

(This is one reason why I always warn parents to be incredibly careful

about anything that's psychoactive when it comes to autistic children

-- there is *no possible way* they can know what it will do to their

kid, because even when it has a standard and studied range of effects,

autistic people are *very* likely to fall outside of it, and we don't

even all have the 'courtesy' to fall outside of it in the same ways.

I recently (publicly) witnessed a mother who decided, *along with* her

nearly-18-year-old son, to try a small dose of a neuroleptic and an

antidepressant on him to combat exposure anxiety, and he had an

akathisia reaction so strong he got violent and was eventually locked

in a psych ward while they got him off the drugs (but before this,

they didn't even know what akathisia was so they didn't know what the

reaction was). :-( )

The above situation annoys me, because they should know all the possible

effects, from typical to very rare, and really they 1. shouldnt try 2

things at the same time and 2. i dont think they should use

antipsychotics for people who arent indeed psychotic.

Kassiane

*whos doctor will not start her at any more than 1/4 the childs starting

dose on ANYTHING*

_______________________________________________________________

Get the FREE email that has everyone talking at

http://www.mail2world.com

[Guest guest]

<-----Original Message----->

<< Actually, a typical kid wont have much response at all. >>

If that were true, then a kid I knew with ADHD wouldn't have made so

much money selling his Ritalin to neurotypical kids, and an NT addict

I knew wouldn't have faked ADD to get the stuff. It's a stimulant, so

it acts like any other stimulant of its class in most NT people, which

probably includes a variation of responses, but I don't think " no

response " is a common one to that sort of drug.>>

Hm. Go figure. Learn somethin' new every day.

Whereas in my case, both caffeine and Ritalin (as well as other drugs

in that general category) can often have a *terrible* effect on me

(racing heart, so hyper I end up slamming into walls and bashing my

head on things just to get rid of some of the energy, etc), although I

did manage a fair caffeine addiction at one point despite this (I

think after building up a tolerance slowly it doesn't affect me quite

as badly). I don't think stimulants and I get along. >>

I react similarly to stimulants, only add psychosis.

So I'm definitely well into the neuro-atypical range, and that can be

ascertained just by putting chemicals into my system and watching my

reaction (although I'd rather not do any more ascertaining of that

variety). Having a standard reaction seems to be nearly impossible.

(This is one reason why I always warn parents to be incredibly careful

about anything that's psychoactive when it comes to autistic children

-- there is *no possible way* they can know what it will do to their

kid, because even when it has a standard and studied range of effects,

autistic people are *very* likely to fall outside of it, and we don't

even all have the 'courtesy' to fall outside of it in the same ways.

I recently (publicly) witnessed a mother who decided, *along with* her

nearly-18-year-old son, to try a small dose of a neuroleptic and an

antidepressant on him to combat exposure anxiety, and he had an

akathisia reaction so strong he got violent and was eventually locked

in a psych ward while they got him off the drugs (but before this,

they didn't even know what akathisia was so they didn't know what the

reaction was). :-( )

The above situation annoys me, because they should know all the possible

effects, from typical to very rare, and really they 1. shouldnt try 2

things at the same time and 2. i dont think they should use

antipsychotics for people who arent indeed psychotic.

Kassiane

*whos doctor will not start her at any more than 1/4 the childs starting

dose on ANYTHING*

_______________________________________________________________

Get the FREE email that has everyone talking at

http://www.mail2world.com

[Guest guest]

22 months ago I agreed to start a course of venlafaxin and was assured it

had no side effects. After six weeks it kicked in and was sleeping an extra

2 hours a day. While it did a calm me a bit, I felt like a zombie. I've been

off it for over 15 months now, but I've still recovered my former levels of

activity.

As always the UK follows in America's footsteps. Big pharma and Big Mac rule

supreme. Only middle class (read upper middle class if you're American)

snobs eat healthy food. Why should we need to take antidepressent to cope

with an increasingly deceptive world? Wouldn't making society more honest

and harmonious be a better option for everyone.Oh, sorry forgotr that

entrepreneurs have to watch their bottom line.

Neil

Re: Ritalin prescribed by OK teachers

> same deal for me, but altho the SSRI antidepressants actually make me

> mroe manic and homicidal thatn suicidal - in fact I still take them (in

> small doses for a few days at a ttime only) to manage the worst of my

> crashes...

>

> dani

>

>

> Kassiane Yelbis wrote:

>

> >

> >

> > <-----Original Message----->

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > An NP could prescribe it. (Nurse Practicioner). If the school nurse

> > were an NP then they kid COULD come home with such an RX with a note.

> > And if the parents refused, it COULD get court ordered. I was confused

> > because he said it was the TEACHERS that could prescribe it, but now I

> > see other things he might have meant, such as, if the teacher suspects

> > ADHD, they can do an assessment and the kid can get diagnosed based on

> > this assessment, and then there is the possibility of a court order if

> > the parents refuse to medicate their child.

> >

> > Which reminds me, a completely normal child on Ritalin will become

> > hyper/act like they are on cocaine. This usually leads to the kid being

> > taken off the medication. >>

> >

> > Actually, a typical kid wont have much response at all. A bipolar child,

> > it will make raging manic (speaking from experience, a similar

> > medication had me convinced people were breathing loudly at me to kill

> > me), but a typical child won't respond much at all.

> >

> > <<But if the kid has something similar to ADHD that is not ADHD, then

> > the kid will not become hyper, and then they will just keep increasing

> > the dosage because the lower dose isn't doing much of anything. I think

> > this is what happened to me, because I was put on a very high overdose

> > for several years (90 mg/morning, 45 mg/noon). Combination of 5's and

> > 10's. Greenish-yellow five's and white 10's. I think maybe there were

> > 20's at the beginning. I can't remember anymore. They taste so bitter

> > if they touch your tongue so I always put them under my tongue. I used

> > a shot glass of ginger ale to take them during the first few years, then

> > I decided I hated ginger ale so I took them with water. I took my

> > Prozac in juice. Half a 20 mg capsule. We opened the capsul e and

> > sprinkled half of it into juice. Ugg! Very bitter.

> > But it wasn't so bad in passion fruit juice, but HORRID in Pepsi. Some

> > weird chemical reaction. >>

> >

> > Sounds gross. But a typical kid is less likely to become hyper than a

> > kid with another condition (ie bipolar, i guess some autie kids

> > too)..and of course there is the seizure factor, and all those

> > personality traits that dont respond at ALL because they arent in that

> > part of the brain.

> >

> > <<Anyway, though...I think a normal kid of Ritalin will soon be taken

> > off Ritalin. But a kid with atypical neurology may not react to ritalin

> > as a normal child does (since ADHD is a neurological difference). If

> > autism contains the same neurological difference, plus additional

> > differences, then a whole lot of Spectrum kids are probably misdiagnosed

> > and mismedicated like I was.>>

> >

> > I was misdiagnosed (ADHD rather than a lovely autism/bipolar mix) and

> > mismediacated-and we found out REAL quick that stimulants are not for

> > me.

> >

> > <<When my mom found out about AS, the first thing she said was, " What do

> > they prescribe for it? " She'd been conditioned by then to medicate

> > everything (partly due to her job, I think, and partly due to me). When

> > she was told, " There really isn't anything, " it was a relief to me,

> > because now she will FINALLY stop badgering me to take SSRI's. I was on

> > them for 10 years, thanks, and they made me suicidal. I don't want them

> > ever again. >>

> >

> > I cant take those either. Anything that even looks at my serotonin makes

> > me batty.

> >

> > Kassiane

> >

> >

> > _______________________________________________________________

> > Get the FREE email that has everyone talking at

> > http://www.mail2world.com

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Wow. Venlafaxine provides a bit of an energy boost with me. Must be the

slight dopamine reuptake inhibition effect.

Trust me, though, the stuff has side-effects. I actually have

hallucinations from time to time. When I first started, the stuff was like

MDMA on my system - colors got brighter, I got happy-huggy, and the world

was a strange and fitful dream. After a few weeks, though, my body

normalized and I stopped " tripping " on it.

But, yeah... the self-deception mechanisms are what keep most NT people

" saner " then autistics. As T. S. Eliot said, " The human mind cannot bear

too much reality. "

Re: Ritalin prescribed by OK teachers

> 22 months ago I agreed to start a course of venlafaxin and was assured it

> had no side effects. After six weeks it kicked in and was sleeping an

extra

> 2 hours a day. While it did a calm me a bit, I felt like a zombie. I've

been

> off it for over 15 months now, but I've still recovered my former levels

of

> activity.

[Guest guest]

> 22 months ago I agreed to start a course of venlafaxin and was

> assured it had no side effects. After six weeks it kicked in and

> was sleeping an extra 2 hours a day. While it did a calm me a bit,

> I felt like a zombie. I've been off it for over 15 months now, but

> I've still recovered my former levels of activity.

Anyone who tells you that any drug has no side-effects is either

misinformed or lying. There's no such thing as a drug with no side-

effects, just such a thing as a drug which has a low statistical risk

of certain side-effects, or a drug that has benefits that outweigh

the side-effects, or a drug with primarily mild side-effects.

Of course what is a " side-effect " and what is simply an " effect "

depends entirely on what the drug is being *used* for. When a drug

is being used to control the behavior of inmates of an institution,

for example, I have a lot of trouble with the concept that they

really view things like " psychomotor retardation " as a *side*-effect -

- it sounds more like the effect they're *going* for. When the same

drug is used to control nausea in someone undergoing chemotherapy,

that becomes a side-effect because the intended effect is altogether

different.

[Guest guest]

I didn't pull the things I said about Ritalin out of my ass. (*gasp* nah

said the A-word!) Although my sources are not always perfect, I know that when

they put a kid on ritalin, if it makes the kid hyper, they assume the kid didn't

actually have ADD. My psychiatrist (the source of my info) told my mother that

I was " wired backwards " in my brain so that stimulants calm me. I have noted

that caffine either has no effect on me or makes me tired, similar to Ritalin,

which DID have a calming effect on me but also killed parts of my personality

(because I was *too* calm). Autistic spectrum individuals often react

differently to psychoactive drugs. Haldol gave me some really severe symptoms;

I had bald spots on my head from picking at my scalp while I was on Haldol. I

had the usual " massive weight gain " while I was on it, and it made my stim

behaviors much more obvious so that I was diagnosed with Tourette's! I am lucky

I didn't have a more severe reaction. I was on that

stuff 2 years before they figured out it was causing the problems and then I

was tapered off and switched the the low dose of Prozac that caused me to become

extremely depressed and, over time, suicidal (and I was on prozac for nearly 10

years before they switched me to Zoloft, and after 9 months of Zoloft I decided

on my own to stop taking these meds because if I'm suicidal on an

anti-depressant it is obviously not working). Thankfully, the SSRI was the

problem so as soon as it got out of my system I did much better. I took Ritalin

*sometimes* for the next few years but then my husband convinced me that I

didn't need that stuff and I believed him so I quit taking it which is just as

well because I do better without it (except my metabolism became dependant on it

so now I have to starve myself to not gain weight and I can't lose weight at

all, which sucks because by the time I figured out how to stop gaining weight I

was already at 220, and now I'm stuck here).

Kassiane Yelbis wrote:

< Re: Ritalin prescribed by OK teachers

<< Actually, a typical kid wont have much response at all. >>

If that were true, then a kid I knew with ADHD wouldn't have made so

much money selling his Ritalin to neurotypical kids, and an NT addict

I knew wouldn't have faked ADD to get the stuff. It's a stimulant, so

it acts like any other stimulant of its class in most NT people, which

probably includes a variation of responses, but I don't think " no

response " is a common one to that sort of drug.>>

Hm. Go figure. Learn somethin' new every day.

Whereas in my case, both caffeine and Ritalin (as well as other drugs

in that general category) can often have a *terrible* effect on me

(racing heart, so hyper I end up slamming into walls and bashing my

head on things just to get rid of some of the energy, etc), although I

did manage a fair caffeine addiction at one point despite this (I

think after building up a tolerance slowly it doesn't affect me quite

as badly). I don't think stimulants and I get along. >>

I react similarly to stimulants, only add psychosis.

So I'm definitely well into the neuro-atypical range, and that can be

ascertained just by putting chemicals into my system and watching my

reaction (although I'd rather not do any more ascertaining of that

variety). Having a standard reaction seems to be nearly impossible.

(This is one reason why I always warn parents to be incredibly careful

about anything that's psychoactive when it comes to autistic children

-- there is *no possible way* they can know what it will do to their

kid, because even when it has a standard and studied range of effects,

autistic people are *very* likely to fall outside of it, and we don't

even all have the 'courtesy' to fall outside of it in the same ways.

I recently (publicly) witnessed a mother who decided, *along with* her

nearly-18-year-old son, to try a small dose of a neuroleptic and an

antidepressant on him to combat exposure anxiety, and he had an

akathisia reaction so strong he got violent and was eventually locked

in a psych ward while they got him off the drugs (but before this,

they didn't even know what akathisia was so they didn't know what the

reaction was). :-( )

The above situation annoys me, because they should know all the possible

effects, from typical to very rare, and really they 1. shouldnt try 2

things at the same time and 2. i dont think they should use

antipsychotics for people who arent indeed psychotic.

Kassiane

*whos doctor will not start her at any more than 1/4 the childs starting

dose on ANYTHING*

[Guest guest]

< Re: Ritalin prescribed by OK teachers

<< Actually, a typical kid wont have much response at all. >>

If that were true, then a kid I knew with ADHD wouldn't have made so

much money selling his Ritalin to neurotypical kids, and an NT addict

I knew wouldn't have faked ADD to get the stuff. It's a stimulant, so

it acts like any other stimulant of its class in most NT people, which

probably includes a variation of responses, but I don't think " no

response " is a common one to that sort of drug.>>

Hm. Go figure. Learn somethin' new every day.

Whereas in my case, both caffeine and Ritalin (as well as other drugs

in that general category) can often have a *terrible* effect on me

(racing heart, so hyper I end up slamming into walls and bashing my

head on things just to get rid of some of the energy, etc), although I

did manage a fair caffeine addiction at one point despite this (I

think after building up a tolerance slowly it doesn't affect me quite

as badly). I don't think stimulants and I get along. >>

I react similarly to stimulants, only add psychosis.

So I'm definitely well into the neuro-atypical range, and that can be

ascertained just by putting chemicals into my system and watching my

reaction (although I'd rather not do any more ascertaining of that

variety). Having a standard reaction seems to be nearly impossible.

(This is one reason why I always warn parents to be incredibly careful

about anything that's psychoactive when it comes to autistic children

-- there is *no possible way* they can know what it will do to their

kid, because even when it has a standard and studied range of effects,

autistic people are *very* likely to fall outside of it, and we don't

even all have the 'courtesy' to fall outside of it in the same ways.

I recently (publicly) witnessed a mother who decided, *along with* her

nearly-18-year-old son, to try a small dose of a neuroleptic and an

antidepressant on him to combat exposure anxiety, and he had an

akathisia reaction so strong he got violent and was eventually locked

in a psych ward while they got him off the drugs (but before this,

they didn't even know what akathisia was so they didn't know what the

reaction was). :-( )

The above situation annoys me, because they should know all the possible

effects, from typical to very rare, and really they 1. shouldnt try 2

things at the same time and 2. i dont think they should use

antipsychotics for people who arent indeed psychotic.

Kassiane

*whos doctor will not start her at any more than 1/4 the childs starting

dose on ANYTHING*

[Guest guest]

There is certainly a lot of misinformation out there, I do agree. One thing I

meant to say but forgot to: my mother would always take the first pill of any

prescription I had. She was " testing " it on herself, figuring that she'd rather

suffer the side-effects than have me suffer them (which makes only limited

sense, is a warped form of logic especially since I only have half her DNA, and

is illegal). When she took Ritalin, she was " climbing the walls, " she said.

She couldn't stop cleaning, was extremely hyper...I'm surprised she had me take

it at all after that reaction! I am sure not all normal people react this way

to Ritalin, but some certainly do! Years later, a friend was reading about

Ritalin in a textbook for a paper she was writing, she looked up at me, and

said, " Did you know that Ritalin can make a normal kid hyper? " I replied, " Yes,

and it can kill an epileptic kid. " They had to test me for epilepsy before

putting me on Ritalin because of this. My sources, as I

said, aren't perfect, but I don't say things with nothing to back them up,

unless I qualify they are my opinion or I say, " I think, " or, " I heard, " rather

than stating them as facts.

I find it so interesting that my psychiatrist said my brain was " wired

backwards. " He was more right than he knew!

Kassiane Yelbis wrote:

< Re: Ritalin prescribed by OK teachers

I didn't pull the things I said about Ritalin out of my ass. (*gasp*

nah said the A-word!) Although my sources are not always perfect,

I know that when they put a kid on ritalin, if it makes the kid hyper,

they assume the kid didn't actually have ADD. >>

I never said you pulled anything out of your ass. I happen to know,

however, that there is aLOT of misinformation out there, and as my *NOT

ADD* brother took my ADHD brother's Dexedrine one time, thinking it was

his vitamin, and no one knew till R. couldn't find his morning pill 2

hours later (twas a Saturday), the stuff Ive read that says little to no

effect made more sense.

My psychiatrist (the source of my info) told my mother that I was " wired

backwards " in my brain so that stimulants calm me. I have noted that

caffine either has no effect on me or makes me tired, similar to

Ritalin, which DID have a calming effect on me but also killed parts of

my personality (because I was *too* calm). Autistic spectrum

individuals often react differently to psychoactive drugs. Haldol gave

me some really severe symptoms; I had bald spots on my head from picking

at my scalp while I was on Haldol. I had the usual " massive weight

gain " while I was on it, and it made my stim behaviors much more obvious

so that I was diagnosed with Tourette's! I am luc ky I didn't have a

more severe reaction. I was on that

stuff 2 years before they figured out it was causing the problems and

then I was tapered off and switched the the low dose of Prozac that

caused me to become extremely depressed and, over time, suicidal (and I

was on prozac for nearly 10 years before they switched me to Zoloft, and

after 9 months of Zoloft I decided on my own to stop taking these meds

because if I'm suicidal on an anti-depressant it is obviously not

working). Thankfully, the SSRI was the problem so as soon as it got out

of my system I did much better. I took Ritalin *sometimes* for the next

few years but then my husband convinced me that I didn't need that stuff

and I believed him so I quit taking it which is just as well because I

do better without it (except my metabolism became dependant on it so now

I have to starve myself to not gain weight and I can't lose weight at

all, which sucks because by the time I figured out how to stop gaining

weight I was already at 220, and now I'm stuck here). >>

That is really icky. Im sorry that they screwed up so bad with your meds

=(

I feel really lucky in that most of the " pros " I saw were too confused

to medicate me, so I only had one bad reaction (manic on Adderall).

Kassiane

[Guest guest]

Paxil made my mom into a zombie, too. It's not just spectrum people that SSRIs

can effect in this way. Though, I went over the AS criteria and determined mom

mom *barely* fits the criteria but might be on the spectrum. But she reacted

normally to Ritalin, which makes me think she probably isn't. It's just

difficult to say.

Neil Gardner wrote:22 months ago I agreed to start

a course of venlafaxin and was assured it

had no side effects. After six weeks it kicked in and was sleeping an extra

2 hours a day. While it did a calm me a bit, I felt like a zombie. I've been

off it for over 15 months now, but I've still recovered my former levels of

activity.

As always the UK follows in America's footsteps. Big pharma and Big Mac rule

supreme. Only middle class (read upper middle class if you're American)

snobs eat healthy food. Why should we need to take antidepressent to cope

with an increasingly deceptive world? Wouldn't making society more honest

and harmonious be a better option for everyone.Oh, sorry forgotr that

entrepreneurs have to watch their bottom line.

Neil

[Guest guest]

That is easy to sidestep: all you have to do is claim religious reasons. Which,

you can do the same with Ritalin, I'd think. My chiropractor, for instance (not

the one I see now) got around the immunization law by telling the school board

it was " againist his beliefs " to vaccinate his kids. Fortunately this worked

for him. It however does not always work and some parents have had their

children forcable vaccinated and then were charged with neglect for not having

them vaccinated themselves. My source for this info was a pamplet on vaccines I

picked up at that chiropractor's office so I cannot be 100% certain of the truth

of the matter but I know that the reason I was vaccinated was because my parents

didn't think they had any choice (plus my dad had polio when he was a child

which messed up his abdominal muscles but didn't paralyze him, but he missed an

entire year of school because of the polio and he now has Multiple Sclorosis

which is likely related because polio attacks the

myelin sheath and MS is scarring on the myelin sheath). I don't blame them for

it, but I certainly wish it hadn't been done to me.

danielle strom wrote:many parents are also convinced that

they willnot be allowed to send and

unimmunized child to school, but I haven't found it much of a problem to

sidestep the issue... many parents are scared of teachers and

disconnected from what is good for their kids... it is sad... I am so

glad I understand J's issues from the inside so I can explain it to the

professionals...