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In a message dated 1/7/01 12:56:46 PM Pacific Standard Time,

rxlb@... writes:

<< tt>

Hi I am a 48 year old female who has been recently diagnosed with MS, I have

had symptoms for years, nothing horrid just some odd things that would

happen to me , and I thought it was 'just me & quot;. One of the things and I

find

this very distressing is that it feels like I have at times, electric shocks

going through my entire head, face etc.

It makes me dizzy and it will be constant when I have a bout of this, I have

noticed nothing that is a common factor it simply hapens and goes away on

its own.

I was just curious about others regarding this odd occirance.

Thanks

Elaine

>>

Elaine,

I get the same thing, but it's pretty isolated. I mean, I'll have that all

day sometimes - just those sharp 'jolts' periodically through the day, and

then it will go away for weeks or even months. But, I've gotten these all my

life, or at least all my adult life - long before I got MS. I DO think it's

a nerve thing, though.

Carol

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In a message dated 1/7/01 4:04:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, Cah819@...

writes:

> << tt>

> Hi I am a 48 year old female who has been recently diagnosed with MS, I

> have

> had symptoms for years, nothing horrid just some odd things that would

> happen to me , and I thought it was 'just me & quot;. One of the things and

I

>

> find

> this very distressing is that it feels like I have at times, electric

> shocks

> going through my entire head, face etc.

> It makes me dizzy and it will be constant when I have a bout of this, I

> have

> noticed nothing that is a common factor it simply hapens and goes away on

> its own.

> I was just curious about others regarding this odd occirance.

> Thanks

> Elaine

> >>

> Elaine,

> I get the same thing, but it's pretty isolated. I mean, I'll have that

all

> day sometimes - just those sharp 'jolts' periodically through the day, and

> then it will go away for weeks or even months. But, I've gotten these all

> my

> life, or at least all my adult life - long before I got MS. I DO think

it's

>

> a nerve thing, though.

> Carol

>

> .

>Hi,

What you are describing sound s like typical trigeminal neuralgia. or tic

dela rue ( not the right spelling)or L'hermites Sharp lightning bolt pain. I

have had a constant type which is called atypical TN. Part of MS ???

sometimes. Or maybe from injury or some other thing-----????????

Kaye

>

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In a message dated 1/7/01 1:31:42 PM Pacific Standard Time, kayeelder@...

writes:

<< What you are describing sound s like typical trigeminal neuralgia. or tic

dela rue ( not the right spelling)or L'hermites Sharp lightning bolt pain. I

have had a constant type which is called atypical TN. Part of MS ???

sometimes. Or maybe from injury or some other thing-----????????

Kaye >>

Kaye,

It's not L'hermites. From what I've read, that is triggered by bending the

neck as if to put ones chin on your chest, and the people I know who have it,

say it's not really painful. I thought trigeminal neuralgia was constant

pain and over a larger surface. I don't know what the other one is that you

mentioned. What I get is the sharpest paid I've ever had. It literally

jolts my body, because of the pain, but the pain is localized to the

particular point it hits on the head. And I've only had it on the back of

the head, never on the face. Typically it will be just a little ways behind

the ear. I know several MSers who have the same thing as me. We call it

" The pencil guy. " (A friend said it felt like a guy with a sharp pencil was

occasionally jabbing her with it.)

Carol

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In a message dated 1/7/01 4:18:09 PM Pacific Standard Time,

elaineannkelly@... writes:

<< <tt>

I ued to get this, I AM type B BLOOD GROUP, SINCE GIVING UP CHICKEN

ALSO A THEAT TO AB BLOOD GROUPS,i AM A LOT BETTER. >>

So am I. I gave up chicken for a year or so, but I can't remember if it made

those 'jabs' go away or not. How do you deal with no chicken? I got so I

didn't want to eat at all, because I won't eat beef (saturated fat, for one),

got sick to death of dry white turkey breast, don't like fish enough to eat

it every day and can't stomach venison, rabbit or lamb. And, of course, I

can't eat dairy on my diet and I'm allergic to milk. I pretty much had to

drop the blood type diet, or at least most of it, because I have too many

other restrictions on my diet already. As it is, chicken is my main meat and

I eat fish here and there.

Carol

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While we are comparing symptoms, I have a question for the group. I was

diagnosed with MS a year ago. My symptoms are numbness in my right hand that

changes in intensity according to what I eat. At one point the numbness

spread up my arm across my chest and into my other hand. Mostly it is just

on the right side, but has never gone away completely since September 1999.

My questions:

1. Does anyone else have numbness that changes according to your diet?

2. Does the fact that my symptoms started in September of 99 and haven't

disappeared completely necessarily mean anything (like I have primary

progressive)?

I have loads of other questions, but these are my top two. Any input would

be greatly appreciated.

Thanks. Margie

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GREAT to hear someone else knows of this besides me, now do you or your

doctors feel that this is MS related? What do you do for this if anything?

thanks for answering me!!

Elaine

PS I am sorry that YOU have this it is just nice to hear that someomne knows

of it and can relate , NOT happy you have it!!!

> In a message dated 1/7/01 12:56:46 PM Pacific Standard Time,

> rxlb@... writes:

>

> << tt>

> Hi I am a 48 year old female who has been recently diagnosed with MS, I

have

> had symptoms for years, nothing horrid just some odd things that would

> happen to me , and I thought it was 'just me & quot;. One of the things and

I

> find

> this very distressing is that it feels like I have at times, electric

shocks

> going through my entire head, face etc.

> It makes me dizzy and it will be constant when I have a bout of this, I

have

> noticed nothing that is a common factor it simply hapens and goes away on

> its own.

> I was just curious about others regarding this odd occirance.

> Thanks

> Elaine

> >>

> Elaine,

> I get the same thing, but it's pretty isolated. I mean, I'll have that

all

> day sometimes - just those sharp 'jolts' periodically through the day, and

> then it will go away for weeks or even months. But, I've gotten these all

my

> life, or at least all my adult life - long before I got MS. I DO think

it's

> a nerve thing, though.

> Carol

>

> .

>

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Elaine,

I have never told a doctor about it. I never even think about it to tell one, I guess because it's so long between 'attacks' of it, and I've never been having them near the time I have seen a doctor. Mine are only sudden quick jolts, that happen maybe 6 times in a day and then I don't have them again for quite awhile. They are very painful and jolting, but so fast to disappear, it doesn't seem worth it to do anything about them. I don't think there is much that can be done, unless you wanted to be quite drugged all the time.

Carol

GREAT to hear someone else knows of this besides me, now do you or yourdoctors feel that this is MS related? What do you do for this if anything?thanks for answering me!!ElainePS I am sorry that YOU have this it is just nice to hear that someomne knowsof it and can relate , NOT happy you have it!!!> >> << tt>> Hi I am a 48 year old female who has been recently diagnosed with MS, Ihave> had symptoms for years, nothing horrid just some odd things that would> happen to me , and I thought it was 'just me & quot;. One of the things andI> find> this very distressing is that it feels like I have at times, electricshocks> going through my entire head, face etc.> It makes me dizzy and it will be constant when I have a bout of this, Ihave> noticed nothing that is a common factor it simply hapens and goes away on> its own.> I was just curious about others regarding this odd occirance.> Thanks> Elaine> >>> Elaine,> I get the same thing, but it's pretty isolated. I mean, I'll have thatall> day sometimes - just those sharp 'jolts' periodically through the day, and> then it will go away for weeks or even months. But, I've gotten these allmy> life, or at least all my adult life - long before I got MS. I DO thinkit's> a nerve thing, though.> Carol>> .>

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> Hi I am a 48 year old female who has been recently diagnosed with MS, I have

> had symptoms for years, nothing horrid just some odd things that would

> happen to me , and I thought it was 'just me " . One of the things and I find

> this very distressing is that it feels like I have at times, electric shocks

> going through my entire head, face etc.

> It makes me dizzy and it will be constant when I have a bout of this, I have

> noticed nothing that is a common factor it simply hapens and goes away on

> its own.

> I was just curious about others regarding this odd occirance.

> Thanks

> Elaine

>

>

> .

>

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I ued to get this, I AM type B BLOOD GROUP, SINCE GIVING UP CHICKEN

ALSO A THEAT TO AB BLOOD GROUPS,i AM A LOT BETTER.

It also helps to avoid synthetic clothes and bedding!

Elaine K.

see EAT RIGHT DIET BY Dr.D,Adamo,CENTURY BOOKS , WOLDWIDE DISTribution

<www.d,adamo.com>

>From: Cah819@...

>Reply-To: mscuredegroups

>To: mscuredegroups

>Subject: Re: does anyone else have this??

>Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2001 16:02:49 EST

>

>In a message dated 1/7/01 12:56:46 PM Pacific Standard Time,

>rxlb@... writes:

>

><< tt>

> Hi I am a 48 year old female who has been recently diagnosed with MS, I

>have

> had symptoms for years, nothing horrid just some odd things that would

> happen to me , and I thought it was 'just me & quot;. One of the things and

>I

>find

> this very distressing is that it feels like I have at times, electric

>shocks

> going through my entire head, face etc.

> It makes me dizzy and it will be constant when I have a bout of this, I

>have

> noticed nothing that is a common factor it simply hapens and goes away on

> its own.

> I was just curious about others regarding this odd occirance.

> Thanks

> Elaine

> >>

>Elaine,

>I get the same thing, but it's pretty isolated. I mean, I'll have that all

>day sometimes - just those sharp 'jolts' periodically through the day, and

>then it will go away for weeks or even months. But, I've gotten these all

>my

>life, or at least all my adult life - long before I got MS. I DO think

>it's

>a nerve thing, though.

>Carol

_________________________________________________________________________

Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

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Grrrr, if I give up chicken I will starve as I have krones and chicken is

one of the few things I can tollerate!!

Catch 22!! Thanks for the info and the advice on this.

Elaine

>

> << <tt>

> I ued to get this, I AM type B BLOOD GROUP, SINCE GIVING UP CHICKEN

> ALSO A THEAT TO AB BLOOD GROUPS,i AM A LOT BETTER. >>

>

> So am I. I gave up chicken for a year or so, but I can't remember if it

made

> those 'jabs' go away or not. How do you deal with no chicken? I got so I

> didn't want to eat at all, because I won't eat beef (saturated fat, for

one),

> got sick to death of dry white turkey breast, don't like fish enough to

eat

> it every day and can't stomach venison, rabbit or lamb. And, of course, I

> can't eat dairy on my diet and I'm allergic to milk. I pretty much had to

> drop the blood type diet, or at least most of it, because I have too many

> other restrictions on my diet already. As it is, chicken is my main meat

and

> I eat fish here and there.

> Carol

>

> .

>

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Ajay used to have this - she found that taking cat's claw helped a lot.

In a message dated Sun, 7 Jan 2001 4:11:17 PM Eastern Standard Time,

" Elaine " writes:

<< Hi I am a 48 year old female who has been recently diagnosed with MS, I

have

had symptoms for years, nothing horrid just some odd things that would

happen to me , and I thought it was 'just me " . One of the things and I find

this very distressing is that it feels like I have at times, electric shocks

going through my entire head, face etc.

It makes me dizzy and it will be constant when I have a bout of this, I have

noticed nothing that is a common factor it simply hapens and goes away on

its own.

I was just curious about others regarding this odd occirance.

Thanks

Elaine

..

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In a message dated 1/7/01 5:10:45 PM Eastern Standard Time, Cah819@...

writes:

> Kaye,

> It's not L'hermites. From what I've read, that is triggered by bending

the

> neck as if to put ones chin on your chest, and the people I know who have

it,

>

> say it's not really painful. I thought trigeminal neuralgia was constant

> pain and over a larger surface. I don't know what the other one is that

you

>

> mentioned.

Fancy name for TN

What I get is the sharpest paid I've ever had. It literally

> jolts my body, because of the pain, but the pain is localized to the

> particular point it hits on the head. And I've only had it on the back of

> the head, never on the face. Typically it will be just a little ways

behind

>

> the ear. I know several MSers who have the same thing as me. We call it

> " The pencil guy. " (A friend said it felt like a guy with a sharp pencil

was

>

> occasionally jabbing her with it.)

> Carol

>

> Carol,

Boy, I wish I just had the pencil guy. Mine is constant,like you described -

on the right side of my face,neck,eye. But that is not considered typical TN

,, It is atypical. Another man in my church had what you describe for years.

which I understand to be " typical TN " " !@# Labels ! Stabing unexpected jolts.

He had a surgery that was successful this year in releaving the pain. He went

to U of VA to a surgeon there. I'll fnd out what it was if you are

interested.

Kaye

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In a message dated 1/8/01 4:03:33 PM Pacific Standard Time,

lupo1965@... writes:

<< the doctor compares it

to spasms but it looks and feels like much worse.

>>

Spasms can be excruciating - one of the worst pains there is and can cause

your foot/leg/whatever to curl on it's own. There isn't much worse. Are you

sure you're not thinking of tics?

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hi elaine, my husband has exactly what you describe. his pain is on

the right side of his face and i thought it was TN. we went to the

neuro. and after an mri was done he said that my husband had an MS

plaque at the bottom of his brain stem that was causing the nerves in

his face to twitch. just touching his face or wiping it with a tissue

would put him in great pain. he was put on neurontin 300 mg. four

times a day. it helped tremendously but occasionally he still has the

pain and the right side of his face contorts. the doctor compares it

to spasms but it looks and feels like much worse.

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hi, no my husband's doctor said spasm's in the face which are caused

by an ms plaque at the bottom of his brain stem. by looking worse i

meant that it looked like the pain he was in was like someone was

jabbing him with a knife that is how bad it feels and looks. i am

aware of what spasms are because my husband has them not only in his

legs but has full body spasms too. he is on medication for them also.

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Dear Carol,

If you cannot manage without Chicken, it may be helpful to only eat

it on one day in Seven, one portion .

Icould not believe that it could affect Me, then one day,AFTER a

Chicken curry, I was seized by a spasm which gripped my whole body, really

painful too!

Since that day I have not touched Chicken at all,memory is also

returning.

sOMEWHERE on rhe blood type diet, Iseem to remember that if you

suffer from auto-immune disease,even on the B diet,milk should be

cut back!

Eggs are allowed,so are fish,-fish and chips, a couple of times a

week, are wery tasty,as are sardines in olive oil,-sunflower oil, is listed

as not being very good either-.

Some diets say that you can eat things which do not really

suit, once a week,so I HAVE A CORNISH PASTY , ONCE A WEEK,this is supposed

to give your system time to recover, before you eat the next one!

Baked potatoes are good with a beked bean stuffing,and I COULD LIVE

on soya fruit yoghurts!-not very nourishing 'naghty but nice!' -

when I EAT so many.

Elaine.

u.k.

>From: Cah819@...

>Reply-To: mscuredegroups

>To: mscuredegroups

>Subject: Re: does anyone else have this??

>Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2001 19:44:04 EST

>

>In a message dated 1/7/01 4:18:09 PM Pacific Standard Time,

>elaineannkelly@... writes:

>

><< <tt>

> I ued to get this, I AM type B BLOOD GROUP, SINCE GIVING UP CHICKEN

> ALSO A THEAT TO AB BLOOD GROUPS,i AM A LOT BETTER. >>

>

>So am I. I gave up chicken for a year or so, but I can't remember if it

>made

>those 'jabs' go away or not. How do you deal with no chicken? I got so I

>didn't want to eat at all, because I won't eat beef (saturated fat, for

>one),

>got sick to death of dry white turkey breast, don't like fish enough to eat

>it every day and can't stomach venison, rabbit or lamb. And, of course, I

>can't eat dairy on my diet and I'm allergic to milk. I pretty much had to

>drop the blood type diet, or at least most of it, because I have too many

>other restrictions on my diet already. As it is, chicken is my main meat

>and

>I eat fish here and there.

>Carol

_________________________________________________________________________

Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

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In a message dated 1/9/01 10:12:41 PM Eastern Standard Time,

Knightmls@... writes:

> 1. Does anyone else have numbness that changes according to your diet?

>

Margie,

Yes, I do. I've never said much about this to a doctor as I feel they'd think

I am nuts. But what I eat really affects the symptoms I have.

I have been diagnosed 2.5 years. But I have known this for years. I am

thinking part of it may be an internal swelling that increases pressure on

nerves. Just a guess

Kaye

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In a message dated 1/10/01 1:31:39 PM Pacific Standard Time,

kayeelder@... writes:

<< Yes, I do. I've never said much about this to a doctor as I feel they'd

think

I am nuts. But what I eat really affects the symptoms I have.

I have been diagnosed 2.5 years. But I have known this for years. I am

thinking part of it may be an internal swelling that increases pressure on

nerves. Just a guess

>>

Kay,

That sounds like my experience. I've noticed the effect of sugar on my body

since I was in my twenties. It causes inflammation for me. That

inflammation DOES put pressure on the nerves - I have read that for sure.

That is why a hot bath bothers us too. The swelling of our tissues from the

hot water also puts pressure on the nerves and that is why we feel so stiff

after a hot bath.

Carol

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Dear Kathy,

Our library has the archives of Dr. Hans Nieper. I recall that

someone asked him what could be done for muscle spasms and he spoke about

the use of magnesium to prevent or treat spasms.

On page 119 of a book we have here in the library, Dr. Atkin's

Vita-Nutrient Solution, Dr. Atkins says, "More than three hundred different

enzymes in the body depend on the mineral (magnesium), yet some 80 percent

of all Americans fail to consume as much as they need." Dr. Atkins

goes on to talk about a specific test for the mineral's concentration within

red blood cells. He says, "I've found that the optimum dosage for

magnesium-related health problems typically brings the red blood cell reading

to a point slightly above the middle of the "normal" range (in this particular

test). For most people this usually translates into a daily dosage

of 400 to 1000 mg. He says his favorite compound is magnesium orotate,

but other good forms are magnesium taurate, magnesium glycinate or magnesium

aspartate. "As an alternative, go soak your feet--and the rest of

your body. Epsom salts are known chemically as magnesium sulfate,

and your skin will absorb as much of the mineral as you need. Drawing

a bath and pouring in some Epsom salts can be as nourishing as it is relaxing."

One place magnesium orotate and magnesium aspartate are sold is the

company whose products were formulated by Dr. Nieper, Nutrient rs:

1- or 7153.

Another product carried there and used by Dr. Nieper for MS patients

with spasms is called, 2-AEP Magnesium. This would be just one part

of the Calcium AEP or EAP protocol, of course.

I hope this information proves to be helpful. If it does, please

let all of us know.

Lillian Hanke

Librarian

Kathy wrote:

hi, no my husband's doctor said spasm's in the

face which are caused

by an ms plaque at the bottom of his brain stem. by looking worse

i

meant that it looked like the pain he was in was like someone was

jabbing him with a knife that is how bad it feels and looks.

i am

aware of what spasms are because my husband has them not only in

his

legs but has full body spasms too. he is on medication for

them also.

..

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In a message dated 1/10/01 6:38:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, Cah819@...

writes:

> That sounds like my experience. I've noticed the effect of sugar on my

body

> since I was in my twenties. It causes inflammation for me. That

> inflammation DOES put pressure on the nerves - I have read that for sure.

> That is why a hot bath bothers us too. The swelling of our tissues from

the

>

> hot water also puts pressure on the nerves and that is why we feel so stiff

> after a hot bath.

> Carol

Carol,

The sugar thing is the same for me. I used to notice it especially in

combination with flour-like cake would really cause me pain, so I never ate

it. That was 30 years ago. Now!!! What a mess. I used to think it was

candita and have lived by that diet forever. Of course dairy doesn't work

either. We will figure out how to fix us soon , God willing .:)

Kaye

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In a message dated 1/10/01 9:42:02 PM Pacific Standard Time,

kayeelder@... writes:

<< Carol,

The sugar thing is the same for me. I used to notice it especially in

combination with flour-like cake would really cause me pain, so I never ate

it. That was 30 years ago. Now!!! What a mess. I used to think it was

candita and have lived by that diet forever. Of course dairy doesn't work

either. We will figure out how to fix us soon , God willing .:)

Kaye >>

Kaye,

Or, the worst combination for me was sugar, flour and dairy. I'm sure

candida is involved too, as well as leaky gut. Since I have put all those

things together and worked on them, I am SO much better.

Carol

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In a message dated 1/11/01 8:31:28 AM Eastern Standard Time,

elaineannkelly@... writes:

> Could not believe that it could affect Me, then one day,AFTER a

> Chicken curry, I was seized by a spasm which gripped my whole body, really

> painful too!

Hi Elaine,

Excuse my butting in . The chicken thing is really interesting. I go to a

Korean accupuncturist who always tells us " no chickey,no pork no cold no

spicey " I finally understood what he was saying re the chicken. He said it

causes " swell " . Swelling I guess. He tells me i should eat " lice (rice)and

beef " " little bit " vegtables. I suspect i am an O blood type . I need to find

out . He tells my husband no meat (and he is a vegitarian). He seems to know

alot just looking at us.

Kaye

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In a message dated 1/11/01 10:43:22 AM Pacific Standard Time,

rxlb@... writes:

<< I have not been eating muchof anything but I notice nothing when I et

cheese. I am a huge cheese lover, oh no does this mean I must not eat

that?? the only thing i like!!!

Elaine >>

Elaine,

Hate to tell you this, but cheese is super high in saturated fat, and a big

no-no on my diet. I'm not allergic to cheese, but still never eat it,

because of that.

Carol

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In a message dated 1/11/01 2:19:20 PM Eastern Standard Time,

rxlb@... writes:

> another thing, how on earth can my doctor make a statement that he feels

> this condition will NOT debilitate me?? I have other issues besides this,

> heart, rheumatic fever twice and left me with a problem there and cronic

> depression, he feels that will be more debilitating to me than MS,,,grr,

all

> so unclear to me.

Hi Elaine,

He's just giving you an educated guess. Each thing seems to build on the

other. Depression could be as a result of it all being a downer, or a

chemical depression, or part of the MS or as a result of adrenal fatigue from

all of this.

Have you been given solumedrol? IT energizes most people. But others (like

me) react the opposite way. Depression, fatigue adrenal failure. I know of

others who responded the same way. My adrenals were too weak to begin with.

But I didn't know it. I would never recommend it to you.

You can get stronger. Most Drs. just are trained to treat symptoms not get

you well.

Your DR is just telling you what he is familiar with. There are other

opinions!

Kaye

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