Guest guest Posted January 21, 2003 Report Share Posted January 21, 2003 I will be very interested to see replies to this. Would you mind sharing what specific problems you are experiencing? I would like to compare notes! >From: " drac1017 <lars@...> " <lars@...> >Reply- > >Subject: ssri >Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 15:14:25 -0000 > >Has anyone had success without the use of a ssri? We are having such >a hard time finding the right one. Our son has more " autistic >symptoms " now than he ever did.Thanks in advance for your response. >Diane > > _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 21, 2003 Report Share Posted January 21, 2003 SSRI's are definitely tricky. had more autistic symptoms on Paxil (much worse than before starting treatment -- we barely recognized him!), and right now we're holding our breath waiting for him to adjust to Zoloft. What SSRI's have you tried so far? In the " conference " area of Dr. G's website, he discusses the possibility of using non-SSRI's with positive results, such as Wellbutrin. I'd love to hear from anyone using non-SSRI antidepressants with their child. Donna ssri >Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 15:14:25 -0000 > >Has anyone had success without the use of a ssri? We are having such >a hard time finding the right one. Our son has more " autistic >symptoms " now than he ever did.Thanks in advance for your response. >Diane > > _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the opinion of the Research Institute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 21, 2003 Report Share Posted January 21, 2003 we have the same thoughts about the ssri's. we were doing really well on the valtrex and nizoral but we have tried paxil and now zoloft and our son does not seem to be as sharp as before. We discussed it with Dr. G and he wants us to be patient. we were on a small dosage and he increased it. ssri >Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 15:14:25 -0000 > >Has anyone had success without the use of a ssri? We are having such >a hard time finding the right one. Our son has more " autistic >symptoms " now than he ever did.Thanks in advance for your response. >Diane > > _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the opinion of the Research Institute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 21, 2003 Report Share Posted January 21, 2003 Hi, We are using Welbutrin, and Celexa together with very good results. We just recently added effexor to this and he is doing great. Much brighter, focused, responsive. On a personal note, I use effexor and use to use prozac. I have found effexor to be a life savor for myself. I too am much more focused and able to get through the " hard " times. We have not not used an SSRI with Josh, but maybe a combination of meds might help. ssri > >Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 15:14:25 -0000 > > > >Has anyone had success without the use of a ssri? We are having such > >a hard time finding the right one. Our son has more " autistic > >symptoms " now than he ever did.Thanks in advance for your response. > >Diane > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail > > > > Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with > the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the > opinion of the Research Institute. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 21, 2003 Report Share Posted January 21, 2003 good to hear but curious why the three different drugs?how is each helping? > Hi, > We are using Welbutrin, and Celexa together with very good results. We just > recently added effexor to this and he is doing great. Much brighter, > focused, responsive. On a personal note, I use effexor and use to use > prozac. I have found effexor to be a life savor for myself. I too am much > more focused and able to get through the " hard " times. > We have not not used an SSRI with Josh, but maybe a combination of meds > might help. > *************************** Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the opinion of the Research Institute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 21, 2003 Report Share Posted January 21, 2003 We've tried Zoloft which was a nightmare, and paxil which isn't much better. Dr. G added Welbutrin and cut back the dose on the paxil yesterday.Every increase in the zoloft and paxil made much more autistic,with behaviors he never had before. Diane ----- Original Message ----- From: Donnaaron SSRI's are definitely tricky. had more autistic symptoms on Paxil (much worse than before starting treatment -- we barely recognized him!), and right now we're holding our breath waiting for him to adjust to Zoloft. What SSRI's have you tried so far? In the " conference " area of Dr. G's website, he discusses the possibility of using non-SSRI's with positive results, such as Wellbutrin. I'd love to hear from anyone using non-SSRI antidepressants with their child. Donna ======================== ----- Original Message ----- From: Alison O'Malley I will be very interested to see replies to this. Would you mind sharing what specific problems you are experiencing? I would like to compare notes! ========================= >From: " drac1017 <lars@...> " <lars@...> >Has anyone had success without the use of a ssri? We are having such >a hard time finding the right one. Our son has more " autistic >symptoms " now than he ever did.Thanks in advance for your response. >Diane _________________________________________________________________ Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the opinion of the Research Institute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 22, 2003 Report Share Posted January 22, 2003 My son never benefited from medications. In fact, they seem to exacerbate the problems we were trying to eliminate. MT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 22, 2003 Report Share Posted January 22, 2003 From everyone's posts, it is clear that different SSRI's perform differently in this treatment, and that some children tolerate higher doses with excellent results while others do not get to a high dose at all. We have seen improvement by adding Wellbutrin to low dose Celexa (after trailing everything else) and, further improvement by switching from Celexa to Zoloft with Wellbutrin recently - esp. in eye contact, attention and verbal output. We have some Effexor on standby, so are very interested to hear of some encouraging results! To try an answer a couple of questions raised, SSRI's as most of us know include Prozac and Paxil (which are chemically similar), Celexa and Zoloft. Wellbutrin is an antidepressant that is of the aminoketone class and is chemically unrelated to SSRI's. The literature says it is a " weak inhibitor of the neuronal uptake of norepinephrine, serotonin and dopamine " . Dr G has explained to us that he prescribes this in conjunction with a low dose SSRI where there has been some benefit of an SSRI like Celexa or Zoloft but a limit to efficacy when SSRI doses are increased, yet are still not at what Dr G considers the optimum dosage. An un-even blood perfusion (some areas low, some areas high) as depicted by a neurospect also aids Dr G in deciding to prescribe an SSRI and Wellbutrin. Effexor XR is yet another anti-depressant that is chemically different from SSRi's and Wellbutrin. Effexor is a " potent inhibitor of neuronal serotonin and norepinephrine reuptake and a weak inhibitor of dopamine reuptake " according to the medicine literature. I guess to answer Barb's question - it is a matter of a fine tuning the process, and Dr G studying closely various agents to find what suits best. Re: Re: ssri >Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 18:59:16 -0800 (PST) > >Yes, how did you ever come to this combinination? >Barb > >--- " sue1jeff2001 <jeffb@...> " wrote: > > > > good to hear but curious why the three different > > drugs?how is each > > helping? > > > > > > > Hi, > > > We are using Welbutrin, and Celexa together with > > very good > > results. We just > > > recently added effexor to this and he is doing > > great. Much > > brighter, > > > focused, responsive. On a personal note, I use > > effexor and use to > > use > > > prozac. I have found effexor to be a life savor > > for myself. I too > > am much > > > more focused and able to get through the " hard " > > times. > > > We have not not used an SSRI with Josh, but maybe > > a combination of > > meds > > > might help. > > > >************************************** > > Responsibility for the content of this message lies > > strictly with the original author, and is not > > necessarily endorsed by or the opinion of the > > Research Institute. > _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the opinion of the Research Institute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 22, 2003 Report Share Posted January 22, 2003 Has anyone's child been put on only Wellbutrin or Efflexor and not an ssri? Does Dr. G always insist on using an ssri? Gaylen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 22, 2003 Report Share Posted January 22, 2003 In a message dated 1/21/03 7:08:36 PM Central Standard Time, lars@... writes: > We've tried Zoloft which was a nightmare, and paxil which isn't much better. > Dr. G added Welbutrin and cut back the dose on the paxil yesterday.Every > increase in the zoloft and paxil made much more autistic,with > behaviors he never had before. > I am curious to know more about your child and any others who have not handled any of the ssris well, if folks don't mind sharing. What were his greatest challenges prior to starting the Zoloft? I'm really uncomfortable with the idea of trying the ssris on my son. Not because I don't think they help some kids but I just feel in my gut that he's not going to handle them well and his symptoms really fit more with those Wellbutrin and Efflexor help. Now, the doc did say that often a temporal lob dysfunction can spill over and knock out the frontal lobe so that could be the case with my son but I dont' know. I'm hoping I can talk the doc into starting with those and then if he insists on an ssri maybe doing it much later. I could be wrong here but my gut is just screaming that the ssris will be a disaster for him. We've come so far, I'd really hate to go backward even for a few months. Gaylen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 22, 2003 Report Share Posted January 22, 2003 Hi All so sorry to off topic here, but i spoke to Marcia Hinds Last night and she would like everybody to know that she has lost all her address book and well everything!! she is try ing to retrieve it BUt if you do not hear from her in the cnext couple of days she is not ignoring everybody or people who wrote to her but her internet is down, due to trying to install a package. If she does not respont in the next few days email her as she hasd probably could not retrieve the names or address. Rifat ************************************* Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the opinion of the Research Institute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 22, 2003 Report Share Posted January 22, 2003 The doctor just prescribed Prozac for my five year old son to get rid of OCD behaviors. Anyone else tried Prozzac for such a young child and if so what were the results. La Toya Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 22, 2003 Report Share Posted January 22, 2003 In a message dated 1/22/03 5:56:01 PM Central Standard Time, barbkatsaros@... writes: > (11), who has similarities to Curtis, from > when we talked, will very likely go on Effexor. At > least, that is what Dr. G said when we saw him. That sounds good. He did mention Efflexor and Wellbutrin while we were there but also said he'd want to put him on an ssri as well. I'm ok with trying ssris later but want to do one of the other two first. >> said that that would help his dopamine or was it the > epinephrine? They work with both. > Are you to be starting ssri's soon? Not sure. Our first phone consult is Monday and Curt seems to be doing fine on Valtrex so he'll probably want to move on to the next thing. Although the past two days Curt has been a real pain in the butt. Not sure if this is normal pre-teen angst just coming out or something with the Valtrex but he has been so rude and uncooperative -- so unusual for him. It is possible it's a lingering reaction to the processed peanut butter we tried last week but hard to imagine it would last this long. Then again, the last time he tried even a tiny bit of orange juice years ago, he was totally lost for 2-1/2 weeks. He can be so sensative at times . Gaylen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 23, 2003 Report Share Posted January 23, 2003 Share after you watch it, please. Chaia's 4 and Skyler's 2 1/2 and the SSRI's bother me too. Shona Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 23, 2003 Report Share Posted January 23, 2003 Here is a partial e-mail I received from a doctor here in the Indianapolis area regarding the SSRI question: .... " there is increasing clinical evidence that many children with ASD have co-morbid mood regulation difficulties, and that the SSRI's do in fact cause 'cycling' (mood shifts), marked irritability, and disinhibition in individuals with mood disorders. On page 47 of " The Bipolar Child " (Papolos, 2002), he states " There is a high-potential risk for inducing increased cycling or switching in a child who may have both an autistic spectrum disorder as well a bipolar vulnerability " . Jack's diagnosis of ASD and his responses to all of the SSRI's that have been prescribed (Zoloft, Paxil, and Celexa), do place him in that bipolar vulnerability category. His responses to these medications are consistent with the difficulties described by Papolos and are similar to those difficulties I (and my colleagues) see in our practice. We are very cautious in our use of SSRI's for children with ASD and mood difficulties. We have been very impressed by the effectiveness of the atypical antipsychotics (Risperdal and Zyprexa) in helping decrease anxiety and regulate mood, and may augment these medications with the shorter acting benzodiazepams (Klonopin and Ativan) for managing anxiety. These medications are generally well tolerated and do not activate or worsen mood. " Just thought I would throw this into the mix. >From: M. Taché <mtache@...> >Reply- >< > >Subject: Re: ssri >Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 16:51:02 -0800 > >My son never benefited from medications. In fact, they seem to exacerbate >the problems we were trying to eliminate. > >MT > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2003 Report Share Posted January 25, 2003 Diane and Anita, If the child is doing better at home but not at school, the problem might not be the SSRI. In fact they may be more in tune with the rejection that sometimes comes from other kids and teachers. They may actually be improving and realize what is lacking at school. I would become the class helper, check on the lunch situation and sit on the edge of the playgroud to see how your child is interacting. Usually when wasn't doing well at school, we needed to adjust something in his program to solve the problem. Marcia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2003 Report Share Posted August 21, 2003 Diane, Last I talked with you, your son was doing better with the celexa. Did this change? is on celexa, up to a 15/20 mg. rotation and I am not really seeing significant improvement. Barb --- jon larson <lars@...> wrote: > Shirley, > We were on Zoloft for 5 weeks, paxil for 8 weeks, > and on celexa since March. I'm glad your grandson > has done well with his ssri. Unfortunately, that's > not the case for some of us. > Diane //thread truncated// ______________________________ `````````````````````````````` Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the opinion of the Research Institute. ``````````````````````````````````````` Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2003 Report Share Posted August 21, 2003 Gaylen, We recently switched to paxil cr for a brief time and the same thing happened that happened with paxil before. becomes hyper and spacey, and has garbled speech at times. Lots of rocking and humming along with this. Dr. G put him back on celexa so in a way, we're back where we started. We switched off celexa because of the rocking and humming and perseveration. Diane Re: ssri I am pretty new to this and cannot speak for Dr. Goldberg and his decisions but can tell you that he told us that he would switch SSRIs if he saw an increase in hyperness in my son. That was the main thing he said to watch out for as a sign that it was not the right SSRI for him. He did say that during the adjustment period some spaciness was a good sign that it was working so I'd think if there is no obvious change, he would want to move on to another one. We recently had a discussion about how each one affects different people differently and sometimes you can see good things with one but even better things without the negatives with another. Has the move to another SSRI been considered for your child? Gaylen ______________________________ `````````````````````````````` Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the opinion of the Research Institute. ``````````````````````````````````````` Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2003 Report Share Posted August 21, 2003 Diane, sometimes it takes time. Our sone could only tolerate the smallest doses during the first 2.5 years of treatment -and yes we tried them all, including prozac - and at least twice. However with improvements in his immune system over the past 12 months, and the introduction of Wellbutrin after a Neurospect which showed a lot of disequilibrium in blood flow between left and right temporal lobes and some areas of higher perfusion in other areas of the brain, he has been able to tolerate higher doses of SSRi. He is currently on Zoloft at almost the therapeutic dose for his weight, and 6 weeks ago we introduced Effexor into the mix which has really helped even more. These medicines are very tricky in dose and selection, and some kids take a lot longer to be able to tolerate them. Hang in there, ssri Has anyone had their child, who was being treated by Dr. G, taken off ssris completely? We have gone through zoloft,paxil, and celexa with no improvements or horrible experiences. Dr. G has not mentioned prozac to us. We're ready for a break from these ssris.We've been with Dr. G for almost a year. Thanks. Diane Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the opinion of the Research Institute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2003 Report Share Posted August 21, 2003 In a message dated 8/21/03 1:29:06 PM Central Daylight Time, lars@... writes: << We recently switched to paxil cr for a brief time and the same thing happened that happened with paxil before. becomes hyper and spacey, and has garbled speech at times. >> Interesting that you mention the garbled speech. Curtis has been mumbling when we read together for the past few days but then will speak clearly if I tell him to. I wonder if this is a symptom of the Paxil CR or just a period he's mumbling. So hard to know sometimes. He was a bit spacey earlier in the week and has been very lethargic for a few weeks though much better today with the lethargy. Overall, he seems to be doing slightly better on the CR version though and he says he feels better on it than the regular Paxil. Gaylen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2003 Report Share Posted August 21, 2003 , What are Wellbutrin and Effexor, and what are they used for? Thanks > Diane, > sometimes it takes time. Our sone could only tolerate the smallest doses > during the first 2.5 years of treatment -and yes we tried them all, > including prozac - and at least twice. However with improvements in his > immune system over the past 12 months, and the introduction of Wellbutrin > after a Neurospect which showed a lot of disequilibrium in blood flow > between left and right temporal lobes and some areas of higher perfusion in > other areas of the brain, he has been able to tolerate higher doses of SSRi. > He is currently on Zoloft at almost the therapeutic dose for his weight, and > 6 weeks ago we introduced Effexor into the mix which has really helped even > more. These medicines are very tricky in dose and selection, and some kids > take a lot longer to be able to tolerate them. > Hang in there, > > > Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with > the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the > opinion of the Research Institute. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 22, 2003 Report Share Posted August 22, 2003 Thanks to all who responded. Your support helps. Diane RE: ssri Diane, sometimes it takes time. Our sone could only tolerate the smallest doses during the first 2.5 years of treatment -and yes we tried them all, including prozac - and at least twice. However with improvements in his immune system over the past 12 months, and the introduction of Wellbutrin after a Neurospect which showed a lot of disequilibrium in blood flow between left and right temporal lobes and some areas of higher perfusion in other areas of the brain, he has been able to tolerate higher doses of SSRi. He is currently on Zoloft at almost the therapeutic dose for his weight, and 6 weeks ago we introduced Effexor into the mix which has really helped even more. These medicines are very tricky in dose and selection, and some kids take a lot longer to be able to tolerate them. Hang in there, //thread truncated// ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the opinion of the Research Institute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 23, 2003 Report Share Posted August 23, 2003 , Am I understanding correctly that your child is taking Wellbutrin and Effexor? I thought Dr. G usually only used one or the other. I've never heard of both being used. How is he doing on them? Gaylen ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the opinion of the Research Institute. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 23, 2003 Report Share Posted August 23, 2003 When I mentioned that Dr. G said to watch out for an increase in hyperactivity, I should have clarified that my son was a hyper kid prior to starting any SSRIs so we were wanting something to calm him down a bit so he could focus better. Gaylen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 26, 2003 Report Share Posted August 26, 2003 Dr. G has used both effexor and wellbutrin on for quite a while now. The wellbutrin is in a very small dose, however. Barb --- R M <rmwilson@...> wrote: > At present yes. We introduced effexor about 6 weeks > ago. Hope to reduce the > Wellbutrin in time. > His speech therapsit has been on holidays for three > weeks - today was the > her first day back - the sessions was one of her > best - and that's after he > nicked some of his sisters " full of gluten, milk, > chocolate, and eggs " > birthday cake on the weekend and had been a bit off! Re: ssri > , > Am I understanding correctly that your child is > taking Wellbutrin and > Effexor? I thought Dr. G usually only used one or > the other. I've never > heard of > both being used. How is he doing on them? > Gaylen ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the opinion of the Research Institute. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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