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Nelly

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Thanks Stania, it's good to know you're always here sending caring and

intelligent messages. Let us know of your progress too.

Nelly

Re: Nelly

>

> Hi Nelly,

> thanks for your input and please, keep us informed. I keep fingers

crossed -

> wish you would improve soon.

> Take care

> Stania

>

>

>

> This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

>

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  • 5 years later...
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Nelly

I've been barred from the cfsexperimenmtal so I'm waiting for a repeat

post here. If you paid attention to the other poster and his/her

mother she was colonised badly and died from a staph infection. This

commonsense discussion with your doctors is missing in many people's

search for the truth.Plus you would be familiar with many attempts at

fixing babesia and some of the other co infections that have not

benefitted most patients.Plus when cfs fibro people fill out survey's

and the thing that stands out like a sore thumb from such a survey was

previous antibiotic use prior to falling ill, it should not be palmed

off cause it doesn't fit the exotic writing of lida mattman or

nicholson labs.

tony

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> Plus when cfs fibro people fill out survey's

> and the thing that stands out like a sore thumb from such a survey

was

> previous antibiotic use prior to falling ill, it should not be

palmed

> off cause it doesn't fit the exotic writing of lida mattman or

> nicholson labs.

> tony

Wheres this data tabulated in any formal or informal way that

someone can read? I got sick in 2003 but I'm pretty sure I hadnt

taken abx since at the latest 1997, and probably not even then.

Admittedly I did take a lot as a kid for recurrent strep throat, in

the 80s and early 90s.

On the other hand we have lots and lots of people taking long-term

abx for acne and no increase in CFS/etc has come to light there as

far as I know (I have not looked very hard).

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I wasn’t going to comment on this,

but I also would welcome some documentation. My own experience was that I had

very few times in my entire life where I used any antibiotics. Only had

penicillin twice as a child. My onset of cfs doesn’t seem related to

antibiotics at all. It does seem related to insect bites preceeding each

escalation of symptoms.

I might add that I never had a quinolone

in my life until after I had Lyme disease for at least 8 years. I developed

severe tendon pain and weakness within two weeks of taking Levaquin. This was

an entirely new symptom in a different part of my body that any Lyme symptom I

had ever had. I also developed anxiety attacks which I had never had, ever, in

my life before.

a

> Plus when cfs fibro people fill out survey's

> and the thing that stands out like a sore thumb from such a survey

was

> previous antibiotic use prior to falling ill, it should not be

palmed

> off cause it doesn't fit the exotic writing of lida mattman or

> nicholson labs.

> tony

Wheres this data tabulated in any formal or informal way that

someone can read? I got sick in 2003 but I'm pretty sure I hadnt

taken abx since at the latest 1997, and probably not even then.

Admittedly I did take a lot as a kid for recurrent strep throat, in

the 80s and early 90s.

On the other hand we have lots and lots of people taking long-term

abx for acne and no increase in CFS/etc has come to light there as

far as I know (I have not looked very hard).

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You know a commonsense is a wonderfull thing and it applies to

science and health just as much as everything else. If you have 4

times as many woman diagnosed with autoimmune ilnesses and you have

men that are lumberjacks, hunters and campers possably 4 times as

many men than woman- why do you accept that tick borne vector ilness

is the only ilness and nothing else matters.basically doesn't add up.

> >

> > I wasn't going to comment on this, but I also would welcome some

> > documentation. My own experience was that I had very few times

in

> my entire

> > life where I used any antibiotics. Only had penicillin twice as

a

> child. My

> > onset of cfs doesn't seem related to antibiotics at all. It does

> seem

> > related to insect bites preceeding each escalation of symptoms.

> >

> >

> >

> > I might add that I never had a quinolone in my life until after

I

> had Lyme

> > disease for at least 8 years. I developed severe tendon pain and

> weakness

> > within two weeks of taking Levaquin. This was an entirely new

> symptom in a

> > different part of my body that any Lyme symptom I had ever had.

I

> also

> > developed anxiety attacks which I had never had, ever, in my

life

> before.

> >

> >

> >

> > a

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > > Plus when cfs fibro people fill out survey's

> > > and the thing that stands out like a sore thumb from such a

> survey

> > was

> > > previous antibiotic use prior to falling ill, it should not be

> > palmed

> > > off cause it doesn't fit the exotic writing of lida mattman or

> > > nicholson labs.

> > > tony

> >

> >

> > Wheres this data tabulated in any formal or informal way that

> > someone can read? I got sick in 2003 but I'm pretty sure I hadnt

> > taken abx since at the latest 1997, and probably not even then.

> > Admittedly I did take a lot as a kid for recurrent strep throat,

> in

> > the 80s and early 90s.

> >

> > On the other hand we have lots and lots of people taking long-

term

> > abx for acne and no increase in CFS/etc has come to light there

as

> > far as I know (I have not looked very hard).

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > _____

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

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Staying ill or not having an infection seen to is IMO more at the

heart of these studies showing increased cancer risks.When you take

cardiovascular issues seriously as we all should- your on track if

your doing therapy as opposed to being a sitting duck and doing

nothing.

tony

>

>

> > The tricky thing might be chicken or egg. Do folks with high

> antibiotic

> > usage already have longstanding infection problems that show up

> in various

> > health issues including cancer?

>

> This is indeed possible. Even if not, it doesnt mean abx use

> necessarily tends to increase the pathogenicity of bacteria, tho

> that is also possible. A third possibility is that abx simply

> increase the rate of cancer by causing mutation or interrupting

the

> bodys actions against mutations and tumors.

>

> Theres a paper on this in our files. I havent read in over a year,

> but I just re-read the abstract, and the fact that they show the

> phenomenon to increase with dose is quite impressive IMO. Anyway

it

> seems to be a modest association (~2x) based on this study, and

the

> association does not prove causition of the cancer by abx (see

> above). Also, LA is soon due to report, I hear, on some

amount

> of excess rates of cancer and heart disease and suicide in CFS;

> successful abx treatment of CFS may (or may not) reduce these

excess

> risks (assuming they are well-demonstrated by s study and do

in

> fact exist) - and may or may not thus compensate at least in part

> for any excess cancer risk from abx use.

>

> (Anyway, quality of life while Im living is infinitely more

> important to me than these minor alterations in risks for heart

> disease / cancer, however they may all total up.)

>

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Dear paula

No one tests for Rickettsia in Australia on a regular basis

I had to send my blood to Jadin pere in Belgium where I was positive to virtually all strains by Jadin's micro-aglutination assay.

Regards

Windsor

RE: [infections] Re: Nelly

Tony, you did know that there are twice as many cases of cfs in rural areas as city, at least in the US. Don’t you have a lot of rickettsia in Australia? I suspect we have many cases in the southeastern US, but no one tests for it. They assume it is a severe rapid onset infection that either kills you or you get antibiotics and are fine. I doubt that.

As to my cause of borrelia I strongly suspect I got it from multiple flea bites from fleas on a dog with severe arthritis in 1972 – that was my first exposure and the time when I developed arthritis. Years later I had a classic tick bite with a bull’s eye rash. And then there was the mycoplasma – who knows were I got that.

a

aMy thought process covers a vast majority of people over the net and I like your home grown observation. Unfortunately it's hard to talk commonsense when many people in cfs forums are lining up to write books on tickborne ilness.The city I live in has just as many cases per head of population that occur in every other big city, and the likely culprits that you indeed feel strongly may have caused your ilness don't exist in my neck of the woods. It's also pretty scary that you have a chorus of billions of organisms thru exposure responding to climate/environment change...These buggers ain't hiding they're there just waiting to fire up and run there processes. They also don't carry on like slow replicaters or stealth pathogens they just pump you full of toxins in harmony and are switched on and off easily. just walk into any moldy environment and tell us how you go. >> Tony,> > Add this to your thought processing. Three of us in my family are infected> with borrelia. I am the one who became seriously ill. My husband and son> look to be quite healthy, although they have symptoms - at times serious.> It's not that men are not infected or that the disease is something other,> but that women get obvious symptoms more often. BTW, I don't mean to imply> that ticks are the only way people get these infections. After all,> mycoplasmas are airborne.> > > > a> > > > You know a commonsense is a wonderfull thing and it applies to > science and health just as much as everything else. If you have 4 > times as many woman diagnosed with autoimmune ilnesses and you have > men that are lumberjacks, hunters and campers possably 4 times as > many men than woman- why do you accept that tick borne vector ilness > is the only ilness and nothing else matters.basically doesn't add up.> > > > > _____>

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There may be several reasons why women show the effects of chronic infection (esp borellia)  more. It does seem that when we hear of dual infection in households, it is often the man that is still able to function better, or who refuses to admit he's sick....- KateOn Jun 1, 2006, at 9:14 PM, a Carnes wrote:Add this to your thought processing. Three of us in my family are infected with borrelia. I am the one who became seriously ill. My husband and son look to be quite healthy, although they have symptoms – at times serious. It’s not that men are not infected or that the disease is something other, but that women get obvious symptoms more often. BTW, I don’t mean to imply that ticks are the only way people get these infections. After all, mycoplasmas are airborne.

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That has been exactly my thinking from the moment of my illness (in the

late 70's) and into the future.

And since time marches on - my decisions (risk assessments) include

where I am along the path of life (i.e.age). I may take something now

that I wouldn't have 15 years ago (and visa versa)

Barb

wrote:

> (Anyway, quality of life while Im living is infinitely more

> important to me than these minor alterations in risks for heart

> disease / cancer, however they may all total up.)

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The same 60/40 split is evident with yeast infections very much a cause of CFS. The leading argument to explain the imbalance is that fungal metabolites can mimic hormones , it's possible that this is yet another defence mechanism to avoid the immune system ,,Women being particularly sensitive to hormonal changes ..It's interesting that hormones are being blamed for the reduction in numbers of fish in UK rivers .Hormones from the contraceptive birth pill find their way into the river systems via sewage treatment plants affecting fish also insect life and in turn birds ect;along the waterways .. search "molecular mimicry"

http://www.main.nc.us/SERAMBO/BControl/PEpstein.html

-----Original Message-----From: infections [mailto:infections ]On Behalf Of KateSent: 02 June 2006 17:49infections Subject: Re: [infections] Re: Nelly

There may be several reasons why women show the effects of chronic infection (esp borellia) more. It does seem that when we hear of dual infection in households, it is often the man that is still able to function better, or who refuses to admit he's sick....

- Kate

On Jun 1, 2006, at 9:14 PM, a Carnes wrote:

Add this to your thought processing. Three of us in my family are infected with borrelia. I am the one who became seriously ill. My husband and son look to be quite healthy, although they have symptoms – at times serious. It’s not that men are not infected or that the disease is something other, but that women get obvious symptoms more often. BTW, I don’t mean to imply that ticks are the only way people get these infections. After all, mycoplasmas are airborne.

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