Guest guest Posted July 23, 1997 Report Share Posted July 23, 1997 > " ...SNF management will really have to sharpen their pencils in making the > buy or build > decisions. " With an oversupply of therapists on the horizon, and policy pretty clearly against contracting (See: PL 92-603 ss 251.c - Salary Equivalency) I think that in 3 years there'll be some rural areas in which they will continue to contract because they can't get a full time salaried therapist to move there, but facilities will be seeking an employee, full or part time. Dick Hillyer admin@... ---- Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... -- Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 21, 1998 Report Share Posted July 21, 1998 Yes, TKapusta, we were providing therapy services in these SNFs prior to them falling under PPS. Any advice? Thanks Kathy Shields Professional Therapy Providers ---- Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... -- Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 21, 1998 Report Share Posted July 21, 1998 Were you providing ancillary therapy services to these SNFs prior to their going to PPS or did you sign them up as part of their transition to PPS? > Rehab Svcs in PPS SNFs > >We are a rehab agency contracting with 9 SNFS currently under PPS. In >some >cases, the SNF's facility rate is now lower than the per diem rate they >were >receiving for Part A patients. Is anybody receiving feedback from SNFs >that >therapists should only provide close to the minimum amount of therapy >or not >provide a discipline under the RUGs classification assigned to the >patient >because of the cost? If so, how are you addressing this? > >Thanks for any feedback. > >Kathy Shields >Professional Therapy Providers > > >---- >Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ >To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... >To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... >-- >Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! ---- Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... -- Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 21, 1998 Report Share Posted July 21, 1998 Kathy, We are a rehab agency who has 12 of the 14 homes on PPS in Oklahoma. The answers to your questions depend on how you are being reimbursed. By the hour, the mod, the minute, or a percentage of the RUG therapy reimbursement? It really should not matter what, or how many disciplines see the patient as long as you do go over the allotted minutes. The flip side to this is if you are being reimbursed a percentage of the RUG, your reimbursement is capped, so knock yourself out on the minutes! Randy Titony, PTA Executive Director, RehabSource KShie31054@... wrote: > We are a rehab agency contracting with 9 SNFS currently under PPS. In some > cases, the SNF's facility rate is now lower than the per diem rate they were > receiving for Part A patients. Is anybody receiving feedback from SNFs that > therapists should only provide close to the minimum amount of therapy or not > provide a discipline under the RUGs classification assigned to the patient > because of the cost? If so, how are you addressing this? > > Thanks for any feedback. > > Kathy Shields > Professional Therapy Providers > > ---- > Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ > To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... > To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... > -- > Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! ---- Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... -- Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 21, 1998 Report Share Posted July 21, 1998 We are facing the same issue within our hospital based skilled facility. Year 1 of the 4-yr phase in period shows that we come closer to breaking even by providing less services. Problem is it reduces the nursing unit's revenue which is an issue for them. But do we increase their's at our expense (i.e., increase our departmental cost to provide more intensive services?) That is still being debated. What is becoming clearer however, is that we most likely will have to minimally staff on Sundays and Holidays to address any need for new evaluations because of transfers or direct admissions on those days. And then the biggest question of all, what is the right thing to do ethically? >>> 07/21 9:28 AM >>> We are a rehab agency contracting with 9 SNFS currently under PPS. In some cases, the SNF's facility rate is now lower than the per diem rate they were receiving for Part A patients. Is anybody receiving feedback from SNFs that therapists should only provide close to the minimum amount of therapy or not provide a discipline under the RUGs classification assigned to the patient because of the cost? If so, how are you addressing this? Thanks for any feedback. Kathy Shields Professional Therapy Providers ---- Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... ! ---- Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... -- Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 21, 1998 Report Share Posted July 21, 1998 Make sure the MDS is accurately and timely completed and submitted. > Re: Rehab Svcs in PPS SNFs > >Yes, TKapusta, we were providing therapy services in these SNFs prior >to them >falling under PPS. Any advice? > >Thanks >Kathy Shields >Professional Therapy Providers > > >---- >Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ >To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... >To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... >-- >Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! ---- Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... -- Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 22, 1998 Report Share Posted July 22, 1998 What is your feeling on the future of contracted services on SNF's? I recently read an article (I can't remember where, but was in one of the rehab management journals) where the author postulated that facilities, especially nursing homes, would not be able to afford contract agencies when they go under PPS. This author's theory was that they instead would hire in-house staff and pay them an hourly wage. Have you seen any repercussions yet in your industry? Mark Dwyer, MHA, PT Kansas City, Kansas mdwyer1@... ---- Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... -- Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 1998 Report Share Posted July 23, 1998 There certainly has been repercussions. For example, look what happened to Vencor's stock price when it announced that the new SNF PPS would adversely affect its ancillary vending services. While there will still be room for ancillary service providers to vend services to SNFs, their margins will decrease significantly. From the SNF, SNF management will really have to sharpen their pencils in making the buy or build decisions. J. Kapusta, J.D. LL.M. The Murer Group http://www.murer.com tkapusta@... > Rehab Svcs in PPS SNFs > >What is your feeling on the future of contracted services on SNF's? I >recently read an article (I can't remember where, but was in one of the >rehab management journals) where the author postulated that facilities, >especially nursing homes, would not be able to afford contract agencies >when they go under PPS. This author's theory was that they instead >would >hire in-house staff and pay them an hourly wage. > >Have you seen any repercussions yet in your industry? > >Mark Dwyer, MHA, PT >Kansas City, Kansas >mdwyer1@... > > >---- >Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ >To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... >To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... >-- >Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! ---- Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... -- Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 1998 Report Share Posted July 23, 1998 One contracting company in our area has already laid-off a large number of licensed staff. Our hospital has hired a couple of them. I have also heard that the utilization of contract therapists in on the decline... significantly. Also, we now have 5-10 applicants for an open position... we used to search for 1-2!!! We have been mandated at our hospital to no longer use contract therapists. We have hired some Float therapists and some " 0.1 FTEs " to fill the void. It has been successful. SNFs under PPS will NOT be able to afford contract therapists... maybe not even staff therapists. Tina Indpls, IN Rehab Svcs in PPS SNFs What is your feeling on the future of contracted services on SNF's? I recently read an article (I can't remember where, but was in one of the rehab management journals) where the author postulated that facilities, especially nursing homes, would not be able to afford contract agencies when they go under PPS. This author's theory was that they instead would hire in-house staff and pay them an hourly wage. Have you seen any repercussions yet in your industry? Mark Dwyer, MHA, PT Kansas City, Kansas mdwyer1@... ---- Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... -- Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! ---- Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... -- Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 26, 1998 Report Share Posted July 26, 1998 Tina, > SNFs under PPS will NOT be able to afford contract therapists... maybe not > even staff therapists.< That's the scariest line of your reply, and not only for us but for our patients also. Mark Dwyer, MHA, PT Kansas City, Kansas mdwyer1@... ---- Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... -- Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 1, 1998 Report Share Posted August 1, 1998 I find that so interesting, I was pondering the same issue, because all of our facilities has in-house therapist, and on July 1, everyone is now considered external, although within the same corporation. Rehab Svcs in PPS SNFs What is your feeling on the future of contracted services on SNF's? I recently read an article (I can't remember where, but was in one of the rehab management journals) where the author postulated that facilities, especially nursing homes, would not be able to afford contract agencies when they go under PPS. This author's theory was that they instead would hire in-house staff and pay them an hourly wage. Have you seen any repercussions yet in your industry? Mark Dwyer, MHA, PT Kansas City, Kansas mdwyer1@... ---- Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... -- Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! ---- Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/ptmanager/ To unsubscribe, email to ptmanager-unsubscribe@... To subscribe, email to ptmanager-subscribe@... -- Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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