Guest guest Posted May 28, 2006 Report Share Posted May 28, 2006 Big surprise there. Another person gets banned for asking a reasonable question. Like my doctor says, 'you should never be punished for asking questions or seeing other doctors...It's your life and no one else is going to care about it as much as you.' (I knew there was a reason I liked him). These ongoing events remind me of communism. Rebel against the old system, then become more controlling and close minded than the regime you replace. penny Colourbleu <colourbleu@...> wrote: Begin forwarded message:> From: "Graham Chiu" > Date: 28 May 2006 02:47:34 GMT+02:00>>> To resolve some basic science about this treatment protocol, I asked a> few questions on their user board .. and after 6 posts found myself> banned!!>> This doesn't bode well when a forum is not open to discussion about> the underlying scientific principles of a treatment protocol.>> --> Dr Graham Chiu> http://www.compkarori.com/forum> Arthritis Help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2006 Report Share Posted May 28, 2006 , I have a question for you. I was checking into this nobel prize winner, Zinkernagel, and came across some interesting stuff he's done on Perforin and Fas and killer T cells. Here's a link to one of his papers: In vitro Selection of Lymphocytic Choriomeningitis Virus Escape Mutants by Cytotoxic T Lymphocytes http://www.pnas.org/cgi/content/abstract/88/24/11047 What caught my eye was the mention of asparagine, because my SpectraCell test results said I was very deficient in asparagine. First time I'd ever even heard of this "non essential" amino acid. I did a little more digging and found the following which also mention asparagine: Autoimmune Lymphoproliferative Syndrome and Perforin (can't access full text) http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/extract/352/3/306 In vitro Selection of Lymphocytic Choriomeningitis Virus Escape Mutants by Cytotoxic T Lymphocytes http://www.pnas.org/cgi/content/abstract/88/24/11047 L-Asparaginase Induced Durable Remission of Relapsed Nasal NK/T-Cell Lymphoma After Autologous Peripheral Blood Stem Cell Transplantation http://cardenjennings.metapress.com/(uhoye0adlmmosw45i00ymwvw)/app/home/contribution.asp?referrer=parent & backto=issue,13,23;journal,44,51;linkingpublicationresults,1:106944,1 Enzyme-induced asparagine and glutamine depletion and immune system function http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/37/6/1025 Plasmodium falciparum: the immune response in rabbits to the clustered asparagine-rich protein (CARP) after immunization in Freund's adjuvant or immunostimulating complexes (ISCOMs). http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=PubMed & cmd=Retrieve & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=8454022 So do you see anything that would suggest an asparagine deficiency making sense as an illness factor? I was going to try supplementing with it, but my health food store only had some kind of asparagine precursor. (I can't remember what it was called). I took a chance and bought some but when I got home and read about it, decided it was not the same thing and too risky to mess around with. I vaguely recall some connection to it aiding the survival of leukemia cells. So I stepped back from the unknown product. But the fact that my testing showed that I was very low in aspargine is interesting, especially reading some of the above articles. I'm trying to decide whether I want to revisit supplementing with it. Oh, and back to the Porferin gene mutation; this is an interesting aticle: Severe and progressive encephalitis as a presenting manifestation of a novel missense perforin mutation and impaired cytolytic activity http://www.bloodjournal.org/cgi/content/abstract/105/7/2658 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2006 Report Share Posted May 28, 2006 Asparagine is one of the 20 amino acids commonly used by all life forms to make proteins. Proteins are strings of amino acids, just as DNA is a string of A, G, C, and T bases. None of the amino acids are really rare in our proteins... and most of our proteins are at least hundreds of amino acids in length, so most proteins have at least some of every amino acid. " Nonessential " means that its not essential to eat it, as the body can synthesize it from other molecules (at least in normals - I guess disease could conceivably affect this). There are about 10 amino acids that you cant synthesize, so you will die unless you ingest them. > In vitro Selection of Lymphocytic Choriomeningitis Virus Escape Mutants by Cytotoxic T Lymphocytes > > http://www.pnas.org/cgi/content/abstract/88/24/11047 > > What caught my eye was the mention of asparagine, because my SpectraCell test results said I was very deficient in asparagine. First time I'd ever even heard of this " non essential " amino acid. This is a mutation in the virus... it normally has some other amino acid in a certain protein, and here its been shifted so that asparagine is used instead at that particular spot in the protein. Specific immunity raised against the normal virus is not effective against the mutant. Thus the mutant type " escapes " and proliferates, at least until specific immunity catches on to the change. > Autoimmune Lymphoproliferative Syndrome and Perforin (can't access full text) > > http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/extract/352/3/306 This is a mutation from serine to asparagine in a particular protein. This person has unfortunate mutations in genes essential to regulating lymphocyte populations. Basically I think their lymphocytes grow out of control, causing bad autoimmunity. > L-Asparaginase Induced Durable Remission of Relapsed Nasal NK/T- Cell Lymphoma After Autologous Peripheral Blood Stem Cell Transplantation > > http://cardenjennings.metapress.com/ (uhoye0adlmmosw45i00ymwvw)/app/home/contribution.asp? referrer=parent & backto=issue,13,23;journal,44,51;linkingpublicationres ults,1:106944,1 They induced a specific amino acid deficiency in this person by injecting them with an enzyme that destroys one or a few amino acids. Those amino acid(s) are still present at low levels despite this treatment, so she didnt die. But the deficiency probably harmed her proliferating lymphocytes especially much because they are so metabolically active. For her this is great because she had lymphoma, a lymphocyte cancer. > Enzyme-induced asparagine and glutamine depletion and immune system function > > http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/37/6/1025 THis one says asparaginase from E coli destroys both asparagine and glutamine and is immunosuppressive. Asparaginase from a Vibrio destroys only asparagine and is not immunosuppressive. This could be because asparagine deficiency doesnt effect immunity and glutamine deficiency does (their belief), but other explanations could be possible. I can send it to you if you want to see their discussion of why they think what they think. > Plasmodium falciparum: the immune response in rabbits to the clustered asparagine-rich protein (CARP) after immunization in Freund's adjuvant or immunostimulating complexes (ISCOMs). > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi? db=PubMed & cmd=Retrieve & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=8454022 This is a malarial protein that has a lot of asparagine in it, hence its name. > So do you see anything that would suggest an asparagine deficiency making sense as an illness factor? I was going to try supplementing with it, but my health food store only had some kind of asparagine precursor. (I can't remember what it was called). I took a chance and bought some but when I got home and read about it, decided it was not the same thing and too risky to mess around with. I vaguely recall some connection to it aiding the survival of leukemia cells. So I stepped back from the unknown product. But the fact that my testing showed that I was very low in aspargine is interesting, especially reading some of the above articles. I'm trying to decide whether I want to revisit supplementing with it. I'm not sure... not sure what their definition of deficiency is ... and I dont know what levels of naturally-occuring asparagine deficiency, if any, are accepted or well-evidenced as a cause of disease. Our enzyme systems are generally pretty well feedback- regulated so that we have the right levels of metabolites... but some problems do occur (gout). I'm not much good at this metabolism stuff. Maybe Rich would have some thoughts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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