Guest guest Posted November 22, 2005 Report Share Posted November 22, 2005 Sue- I understand your concern about too many drugs to detox. But the critical thing is whether the drugs she's taking are getting at everything. In the Cpn protocols, Flagyl/Tini is pulsed, usually for 5 days every 3-4 weeks. I have never heard of anyone having peripheral neuropathy problems used like this, and Stratton uses it on a continuous basis for up to a year without any concerns. Without it, as a following email said, the cryptic form (in Cpn) or the cystic form (in Lyme's) just stays as a reservoir for reinfection. Even more, in Cpn, the energy of the mitochondria is clearly drained off by the cryptic form and rebounds when it's killed. Take a look at the www.cpnhelp.org site for more. Jim Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 18:00:20 -0000 From: " jill1313 " <jenbooks13@...> Subject: Sue Re: dtr Flagyl is a tough drug and can cause permanent neuropathy. Already, looking at her regimen, I feel they're throwing too many drugs at her at once. She has to detox ALL those drugs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2005 Report Share Posted November 22, 2005 Jim, I know several people who got totally well from lyme just taking amoxicillin and a few other orals for years and they never used flagyl. I think it is a little bit dangerous to insist on flagyl or tini over the internet to someone just because ne fellow, Stratton, uses it for what he believes is chlamydia p. > > Sue- > I understand your concern about too many drugs to > detox. But the critical thing is whether the drugs > she's taking are getting at everything. In the Cpn > protocols, Flagyl/Tini is pulsed, usually for 5 days > every 3-4 weeks. I have never heard of anyone having > peripheral neuropathy problems used like this, and > Stratton uses it on a continuous basis for up to a > year without any concerns. > Without it, as a following email said, the cryptic > form (in Cpn) or the cystic form (in Lyme's) just > stays as a reservoir for reinfection. Even more, in > Cpn, the energy of the mitochondria is clearly drained > off by the cryptic form and rebounds when it's killed. > Take a look at the www.cpnhelp.org site for more. > Jim > > Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 18:00:20 -0000 > From: " jill1313 " <jenbooks13@h...> > Subject: Sue Re: dtr > > Flagyl is a tough drug and can cause permanent > neuropathy. Already, > looking at her regimen, I feel they're throwing too > many drugs at her > at once. She has to detox ALL those drugs. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2005 Report Share Posted November 22, 2005 Looking only at positives or at any other type of selected sample isnt informative. Several people have gotten totally well from CFS without using any strong treatment of any kind, but we all agree its very unlikely for a given person. Amoxicillin has caused many humans to die of anaphylactic shock. Abx have all got risks, its when you quantify the risks that youre getting somewhere. What percentage of people have penicillin anaphylaxis? What percentage of people get nitroimidazole neuropathy, and what percentage of those had it remain permanently after stopping nitroimidazoles? <jenbooks13@h...> wrote: > > Jim, I know several people who got totally well from lyme just taking > amoxicillin and a few other orals for years and they never used > flagyl. I think it is a little bit dangerous to insist on flagyl or > tini over the internet to someone just because ne fellow, Stratton, > uses it for what he believes is chlamydia p. > > > > > > Sue- > > I understand your concern about too many drugs to > > detox. But the critical thing is whether the drugs > > she's taking are getting at everything. In the Cpn > > protocols, Flagyl/Tini is pulsed, usually for 5 days > > every 3-4 weeks. I have never heard of anyone having > > peripheral neuropathy problems used like this, and > > Stratton uses it on a continuous basis for up to a > > year without any concerns. > > Without it, as a following email said, the cryptic > > form (in Cpn) or the cystic form (in Lyme's) just > > stays as a reservoir for reinfection. Even more, in > > Cpn, the energy of the mitochondria is clearly drained > > off by the cryptic form and rebounds when it's killed. > > Take a look at the www.cpnhelp.org site for more. > > Jim > > > > Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 18:00:20 -0000 > > From: " jill1313 " <jenbooks13@h...> > > Subject: Sue Re: dtr > > > > Flagyl is a tough drug and can cause permanent > > neuropathy. Already, > > looking at her regimen, I feel they're throwing too > > many drugs at her > > at once. She has to detox ALL those drugs. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 23, 2005 Report Share Posted November 23, 2005 Duh what? " Many humans " have died from anyphylactic shock from amoxicillin? Want to give me some #'s and citations. Its considered one of the least toxic abx. Not saying anyone else should take it but PLEASE, its well known that flagyl can cause permanent nerve damage. > > > > > > Sue- > > > I understand your concern about too many drugs to > > > detox. But the critical thing is whether the drugs > > > she's taking are getting at everything. In the Cpn > > > protocols, Flagyl/Tini is pulsed, usually for 5 days > > > every 3-4 weeks. I have never heard of anyone having > > > peripheral neuropathy problems used like this, and > > > Stratton uses it on a continuous basis for up to a > > > year without any concerns. > > > Without it, as a following email said, the cryptic > > > form (in Cpn) or the cystic form (in Lyme's) just > > > stays as a reservoir for reinfection. Even more, in > > > Cpn, the energy of the mitochondria is clearly drained > > > off by the cryptic form and rebounds when it's killed. > > > Take a look at the www.cpnhelp.org site for more. > > > Jim > > > > > > Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 18:00:20 -0000 > > > From: " jill1313 " <jenbooks13@h...> > > > Subject: Sue Re: dtr > > > > > > Flagyl is a tough drug and can cause permanent > > > neuropathy. Already, > > > looking at her regimen, I feel they're throwing too > > > many drugs at her > > > at once. She has to detox ALL those drugs. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 23, 2005 Report Share Posted November 23, 2005 Well, SUPPOSEDLY that's why we have Drs. tracking our cases. So anaphalytic shock can be avoided- blood/serum consentrations of drugs can be tracked - (but rarely are). SO can toxic symptoms- which rerely are either... almost everything is called a herx- when (as you all know) I have a problem with calling everything a herx. No 2 people are exactly the same - and I think since some people can die from a hornet sting- some can die of (TRUE) shock from abx (but if many do- you don't hear about it). Amoxy is the drug choise for children, because of it's safety record- but it should be noted that children (and the ELDERY - for those over 60 or so) respond differently to the " adult " dosage of drugs- so the dose is adjusted for them - something no one every really talks about here. And probably why LLMDs won't treat anyone under 18 (Do they have an OLD limit too??) I never took a fluroquinolone. But I took a ton of Hydroxychoroquine which has the parent molecular structure from which the " fluros " were designed... it's the 4-flouro molecule that's the problem (Hydroxy lacks it). It's chemistry folks- our drugs and our bodies, and the metabolism of everything that goes into the moouth (or liver). Barb > > > > > > > > Sue- > > > > I understand your concern about too many drugs to > > > > detox. But the critical thing is whether the drugs > > > > she's taking are getting at everything. In the Cpn > > > > protocols, Flagyl/Tini is pulsed, usually for 5 days > > > > every 3-4 weeks. I have never heard of anyone having > > > > peripheral neuropathy problems used like this, and > > > > Stratton uses it on a continuous basis for up to a > > > > year without any concerns. > > > > Without it, as a following email said, the cryptic > > > > form (in Cpn) or the cystic form (in Lyme's) just > > > > stays as a reservoir for reinfection. Even more, in > > > > Cpn, the energy of the mitochondria is clearly drained > > > > off by the cryptic form and rebounds when it's killed. > > > > Take a look at the www.cpnhelp.org site for more. > > > > Jim > > > > > > > > Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 18:00:20 -0000 > > > > From: " jill1313 " <jenbooks13@h...> > > > > Subject: Sue Re: dtr > > > > > > > > Flagyl is a tough drug and can cause permanent > > > > neuropathy. Already, > > > > looking at her regimen, I feel they're throwing too > > > > many drugs at her > > > > at once. She has to detox ALL those drugs. > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2005 Report Share Posted November 24, 2005 On Wednesday, November 23, 2005, at 05:27 PM, Barb Peck wrote: > No 2 people are exactly the same - and I think since some people can > die from a hornet sting- some can die of (TRUE) shock from abx (but > if many do- you don't hear about it). My daughter has a swollen and infected leg from a supposed spider bite. She's on Cephalexin and Benadryl and Ibuprofen. Very healthy kid but apparently sensitive to whatever was in the spider saliva. > I never took a fluroquinolone. But I took a ton of Hydroxychoroquine > which has the parent molecular structure from which the " fluros " were > designed... it's the 4-flouro molecule that's the problem (Hydroxy > lacks it). I'm still not convinced it's the 4-flouro molecule that's the problem, since that doesn't explain the people who have trouble with Samento. As you know, I'm not sure I can take Plaquenil either. But I know I got instant tendon problems from Samento. - Kate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2005 Report Share Posted November 24, 2005 I think it always comes down to individual metabolism. Cats Claw (Samento) is an unregulated substance- so every manufacturer will be different. It's 'similar' enough in molecular structure to the family of drugs so that it MAY cause problems in some people. I have read that the 4-fluoro molecules are the problem with the side effects- but I have not been able to raise any references with a quick search. SO the jury's out. The same goes for Hydroxychloroquine- while I can take alot of it, but I know of some people that can't take it at all. I had a TREMENDOUS problem with Zith (caused biliary sludge & liver pain in a short time) while others can take it daily for months. There's alot of drugs out there. There's no need to take anything anyone feels affects them adversely. Barb > > > No 2 people are exactly the same - and I think since some people can > > die from a hornet sting- some can die of (TRUE) shock from abx (but > > if many do- you don't hear about it). > > My daughter has a swollen and infected leg from a supposed spider bite. > She's on Cephalexin and Benadryl and Ibuprofen. Very healthy kid but > apparently sensitive to whatever was in the spider saliva. > > > I never took a fluroquinolone. But I took a ton of Hydroxychoroquine > > which has the parent molecular structure from which the " fluros " were > > designed... it's the 4-flouro molecule that's the problem (Hydroxy > > lacks it). > > I'm still not convinced it's the 4-flouro molecule that's the problem, > since that doesn't explain the people who have trouble with Samento. As > you know, I'm not sure I can take Plaquenil either. But I know I got > instant tendon problems from Samento. > > - Kate > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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