Re: anyone, but basically eric (also barb)

[Guest guest]

This has been around for quite a while

I researched it in 2002 when I was looking for a Babs treatment.

It was avaialble as a weed killer (commercially) for a long time when

some Chinese researchers found it was effective on one strain of

Malaria... before that it was used as an abx.

Here's what I have in my file.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?

cmd=Retrieve & db=PubMed & list_uids=2085981 & dopt=Abstract

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?

cmd=Retrieve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=3309810 & query_hl=19

http://www.iupac.org/publications/pac/1996/pdf/6804x0907.pdf

And I just did a search on Pub med.. here's the page.. and there's

alot on it from the 19080's

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?

db=pubmed & cmd=Display & dopt=pubmed_pubmed & from_uid=2085981 & tool=Externa

lSearch

Jill- you gotta learn to use PubMed.

This took me 5 minutes.

Barb

> http://biocyc.org/ECOLI/new-image?type=COMPOUND & object=CPD0-441

>

> This works on malaria and some gram-negative.

> I'm still trying to get the Krause article I emailed you

about--

> which supposedly details the differences btw malaria and babs. I

> can't find much info about that yet and its frustrating because I

> want to understand those differences before deciding my course of

> action. if you *do* go the library this weekend can you get it for

> me, as Krause has not yet responded to me.

>

> I wonder if this would work on babs and what else it would work on,

> but would it also cause me fungal problems if its an antibiotic as

> well. WOuld it have any effects on SLYME.

>

> THe reason I ask is, I think one lesson I can take from my history

> which is so uncanny and in some ways typical but some ways not, is

> never again to ignore my inner promptings. They've just been right

so

> many times. And though I am " reasoning " my way through waht to

take,

> ie arthemos/artemisinin and somethign else--barb did tetracycline,

> and riamet contains an analogue of larium--you can't just do art.

> alone as you apparently won't get the extraerythrocytic stage...but

> anyway, in spite of what my brain is telling me, every time i look

at

> the word " fosmidomycin " something in me strongly says, YES! TAKE

> THAT! THAT'S THE ONE! Even before I even read anything about it.

[Guest guest]

..org/publications/pac/1996/pdf/6804x0907.pdf

> Jill- you gotta learn to use PubMed.

> This took me 5 minutes.

> Barb

>

I use it all the time. I usually go from the abstracts, through my

proxy university server, to the paper itself.

[Guest guest]

Also, Barb, just because a drug works on malaria (as you know) does

not mean it works on babesia. I surprisingly got a call from

Krause today, which was unexpected, I'd wanted a copy of the paper on

the diffeerences btw malaria and babesia.

He did confirm it goes into the red blood cell to use iron--probably--

so in such case arthemeter should be good.

He also generally only gave (gives) 7-10 days of mepron/zith in

babesia and then says it clears over the next 6 months.

I have to go read his papers--this one was not available online

(malaria babesia) but the others probably are.

He also doesn't think babesia nests inthe liver but who knows. He says

much is unknown about the organism at this point.

[Guest guest]

Yes. Literature indicates what works on Malaria may not work on Babs.

And what Krause told you I have read in the literature.

Interesting he uses 7-10 days of Mepron when on Lymnet you read of

people doing 3 rounds of several months and say they still have

symptoms.

I did 5 days of b-arthemether (Artemos mixed with Doxy) and my

symptoms (fever and night sweats, anemia and too many young

RBCsremember) were gone after that and have not returned (and it's been

2 years). And I don't have a spleen.

So either the people using several rounds of Mepron are attributing

their symtpoms to Babs - and it's really something else - or Krause is

wrong (I don't think he's wrong).... all I know is my symptoms are

gone.

My $35.00 -5 day treatment worked on what ever it was (uncomplicated

malaria? or Babs?)

Barb

> Also, Barb, just because a drug works on malaria (as you know) does

> not mean it works on babesia. I surprisingly got a call from

> Krause today, which was unexpected, I'd wanted a copy of the paper on

> the diffeerences btw malaria and babesia.

>

> He did confirm it goes into the red blood cell to use iron--probably--

> so in such case arthemeter should be good.

>

> He also generally only gave (gives) 7-10 days of mepron/zith in

> babesia and then says it clears over the next 6 months.

>

> I have to go read his papers--this one was not available online

> (malaria babesia) but the others probably are.

>

> He also doesn't think babesia nests inthe liver but who knows. He

says

> much is unknown about the organism at this point.

[Guest guest]

Yes, now he was not looking at very many coinfected, so I suspect

there may be downregulation of immunity in borrelia, ie a kind of

acquired immune defect, that makes it harder to get rid of babesia.

But in any case, he said that those treated for 7-10 days took up to

six months to clear the organism (pcr testing), while untreated took

longer. Yet I just read a very good paper by him, in Am. J. Trop.

Med. Hyg., 68(4), 2003, pp. 431-436; anyway, it basically points out

how epidemic babesia is and even mild infections can be difficult.

However he did correctly point out that you can't sterilize a person

with antibiotics (my paraphrase), that you knock back #'s and then

the immune system must take over. Maybe people could/should do a

short course of mepron and then wait 6 mos to a year to really see if

it goes away. Maybe they're overdoing what's necessary.

Yet I'm on the phone right now with someone whose babesia-specific

symptoms (bruising, breathlessness, chills, etc) go away on malarone

and artemisinin, and come back when she goes off. Then she goes back

on and herxes and then gets better.

SO either its specifically related to the acquired immune defect

initiated by chronic borrelia infection...or you could speculate that

as you supress the babesia, the immune system begins to handle the

borrelia. Who knows.

I am so conservatively minded for drugs anyway as I'm so

hypersensitive. I'm always amazed that people can take years of

antibiotics at high doses.

> > Also, Barb, just because a drug works on malaria (as you know)

does

> > not mean it works on babesia. I surprisingly got a call from

> > Krause today, which was unexpected, I'd wanted a copy of the

paper on

> > the diffeerences btw malaria and babesia.

> >

> > He did confirm it goes into the red blood cell to use iron--

probably--

> > so in such case arthemeter should be good.

> >

> > He also generally only gave (gives) 7-10 days of mepron/zith in

> > babesia and then says it clears over the next 6 months.

> >

> > I have to go read his papers--this one was not available online

> > (malaria babesia) but the others probably are.

> >

> > He also doesn't think babesia nests inthe liver but who knows. He

> says

> > much is unknown about the organism at this point.

[Guest guest]

>So either the people using several rounds of Mepron are attributing >their symtpoms to Babs - and it's really something else

Barb,

.... yes, but it could well be that that "something else" is sensitive to mepron and other antiprotozoal treatments and to nothing else.

Although I had a + PCR test for Babesia from MDLs and most of what are described as babesia symptoms I have never claimed to be certain I had/have Babesia. I also had other non-specific signs incl some RBC fragments floating about in serum, eosinophilia, high RBC turnover.

Nelly

[Guest guest]

Nelly, all those who are REALLY sick with " lyme " seem to me to have

babesia too. I don't know if babesia is the bad one on its own or its

the combo that is bad.

I noticed rifampin is antimalarial thus probably antibabesial and

people think they're taking that for bart.

What did you take for babesia? I feel discouraged when people on

lymenet report months and months of treatment.

> >So either the people using several rounds of Mepron are attributing

> >their symtpoms to Babs - and it's really something else

>

> Barb,

>

> ... yes, but it could well be that that " something else " is

sensitive to mepron and other antiprotozoal treatments and to nothing

else.

>

> Although I had a + PCR test for Babesia from MDLs and most of what

are described as babesia symptoms I have never claimed to be certain I

had/have Babesia. I also had other non-specific signs incl some RBC

fragments floating about in serum, eosinophilia, high RBC turnover.

>

> Nelly

[Guest guest]

Jill,

I started writing it all up and then I thought: "I don't think Jill will want to know!)"

I have used everything possible incl Lariam which I am finding the most effective and I am still on it (tried to go off twice, this is my 3rd round, about 9 months each first two rounds, and I am into my 3rd month this time, awfull symptoms crept up again every time I stopped anti-protozoan treatments, incl severe vertigo, heart/malaisey feelings and plenty more).

I found all these anti-babesial treatments VERY hard to take at first (first few months each time, nearly going round the bend)

Nelly

[infections] Re: anyone, but basically eric (also barb)

Nelly, all those who are REALLY sick with "lyme" seem to me to have babesia too. I don't know if babesia is the bad one on its own or its the combo that is bad.I noticed rifampin is antimalarial thus probably antibabesial and people think they're taking that for bart.What did you take for babesia? I feel discouraged when people on lymenet report months and months of treatment.> >So either the people using several rounds of Mepron are attributing > >their symtpoms to Babs - and it's really something else > > Barb,> > ... yes, but it could well be that that "something else" is sensitive to mepron and other antiprotozoal treatments and to nothing else.> > Although I had a + PCR test for Babesia from MDLs and most of what are described as babesia symptoms I have never claimed to be certain I had/have Babesia. I also had other non-specific signs incl some RBC fragments floating about in serum, eosinophilia, high RBC turnover.> > Nelly