ATTN:: Penny - Heparin information

[Guest guest]

Hello again Penny---

I included the original topic thread in this posting--so you would

recall the previous topic matter.....ABX and INR

What I posted below was a repeat of what was touched on a couple of

days earlier in I & I.....--but I was unable to retrieve the past

postings at that time. So forgive the unintended ignorance!

Anyway, I have been able to recap on the Coagulation topics---and

still would like to ask you about this comment:

The other

> things

> > these docs have said is that heparin won't cut it (when dealing

> with

> > entrenched infection and genetic clotting disorder). Have to use

> > Coumadin. > >

Would you have any information on the heparin theories mentioned

here???? Or the doctors involved with those ideas??

I would really like to see that information...if you can point me in

the right direction??

CELEINE

In infections , " ravencat9461 "

<ravencat9461@y...> wrote:

> Hi Penny,

>

> I hadn't heard that one about heparin, do you have any links that I

> could read pertaining to the subject matter??

>

> When I clotted( I threw a PE) they started me on lovenex--which is

> LMW Heparin, and then moved me to coumadin. I'm FVL

>

> I am still curious about the levels below 3.5 that was orginally

> mentioned early in this thread--as the lower you go on the INR--the

> more viscousity the blood has( it has to have a level one to be

able

> to clott if you are a otherwise healthy patient)

>

> So, correct me if I'm not thinking correctly here....but wouldn't

you

> want to raise the INR, and thin out the blood somewhat---since the

> hypercoagulation due to excessive fibrin production due to chronic

> infection would produce thick, sticky blood?

>

> And make it much harder for the ABX to penetrate ,do their " job " ?

>

> Heparin and coumadin are used to control genetic forms of

> hypercoagulation( also called thrombophilia, or another term is

> thromboplastic) which are due to venous clotting( also called DVT's

> wwhich usually originate in the legs) and those who need to be

> treated due to a positive ISAC panel.

>

> Plavix, aspirin therapy, Pletel, ect are used for arterial clotting-

-

> due to platlet aggregation. This is the main factor behind

occlussive

> disease in the extremities.

>

> I've actually met some poor lyme sufferers that have both, venous

> clotting, and platlet aggregation

>

> That last statement is making me wonder....Penny, is that why the

> Heparin may work on some patients, and not others??

>

> CELIENE

>

>

>

> > > >

> > > > > Hi Penny,

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks for letting us know about the INR and

> > > > > Antibiotics not working if the INR is not below 3.5.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Where on the Internet can I read that ? Is there a

> > > > > website or weblink to that statement ?

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks,

> > > > > Al

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ____________________________________________________

> > > > Sports

> > > > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football

> > > > http://football.fantasysports.

[Guest guest]

Sorry Celeine. This is strictly hearsay, things my friend's

competent doctors have told her. I believe her 100% because this

particular friend has been dealing with this hereditary clotting

disorder and bone infection for 6 years, tried everything in the

book, multiple surgeries and i.v. abx, with a lot of

disappointments. I've watched all the trials and tribulations she

(and other good friends) have gone through, trying to beat this

thing we all share...bone infections and clotting disorders

('probable' disorder in my own case) while our lives go down the

tubes. She (and other friends) have travelled the country trying to

find the best doctors for the job and this is what they're being

told. But it's possible the docs are referring to specific clotting

disorders or situations, say post surgery only. All I know is they

feel that most i.d. docs are not getting it right (no big surprise

there), and also that they believe you need coumadin, especially

when doing i.v. abx, especially after surgery, if you want it to

work. Unfortunately, I have no abstracts to back that up, hence the

suggestion that we do more research on the topic, because I find it

really interesting, and perhaps important. That doesn't mean that

heparin may not be beneficial, just that these particular docs

believe you need coumadin when on i.v. abx and your INR at 3.5 IF

you've got the genetic clotting disorder.

penny

I can give you a couple of the doctors names if you back channel me.

> > > > >

> > > > > > Hi Penny,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Thanks for letting us know about the INR and

> > > > > > Antibiotics not working if the INR is not below 3.5.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Where on the Internet can I read that ? Is there a

> > > > > > website or weblink to that statement ?

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Thanks,

> > > > > > Al

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ____________________________________________________

> > > > > Sports

> > > > > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football

> > > > > http://football.fantasysports.