Re: Penny - Antiobitics & INR ?

[Guest guest]

I doubt it, Al, but can't say for sure. I know this is from Dr.

MacMahon, for sure, and another really good doctor in San Fran, and a

few other docs who've actually helped people deal with entrenched bone

infections, but unfortunately, I don't know how to corroborate it, and

for all I know, it's not 100% true. But I do know the docs who believe

it also believe that almost everyone is being treated incorrectly, AND

that these doctors have had more success than most, sooooo, I think

it's worth at least looking at more research on clotting disorders.

Also, it's important that the 3.5 number may not apply to those who

don't have hereditary clotting disorders...only to those who do, but

how do we know how many of us have genetic clotting problems or if

it's just hypercoagulation due to infection? We need to get tested,

before we can really know.

I really recommend going to Dr. Gleuck's site. He's the director of

the Jewish Hospital in Cincinnatti. Pretty sure you can find him with

a quick search. Lots of good articles there, he's done a lot of the

studies that Hemex bases their stuff on.

Gotta run.

penny

> Hi Penny,

>

> Thanks for letting us know about the INR and Antibiotics not

working if the INR is not below 3.5.

>

> Where on the Internet can I read that ? Is there a website or

weblink to that statement ?

>

>

> Thanks,

> Al

[Guest guest]

I must have missed something. What is INR?

Thanks, Marie

--- Al Melillo <melillo3@...> wrote:

> Hi Penny,

>

> Thanks for letting us know about the INR and

> Antibiotics not working if the INR is not below 3.5.

>

>

> Where on the Internet can I read that ? Is there a

> website or weblink to that statement ?

>

>

> Thanks,

> Al

____________________________________________________

Sports

Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football

http://football.fantasysports.

[Guest guest]

--Hi Marie,

I'm not Penny, but I can answer your question

INR stands for the " International Ratio "

To understand more: if you just type in " INR " on google--it will tell

you more than I could post here about it.

A normal INR is 1 (one) this would be normal for those who are

healthy--as I am not able to comment on what was refered to the

ranges in the below posting( anything under 3.5)

Theraputic anti-coagulation levels( coumidin levels) are 2.0-3.0

If there was any thrombotic events at that level( people do still

clot at 2.0-3.0--but these are generally the genetic clotters) then

the coumadin levels are raised to 2.5-3.5

So, I am wondering.....are those of you on this thread--considering

the theraputic coumdin/heparin levels stated above.... being the

levels that are needed to be obtained for max ABX absorption?

Sorry to jump in on this thread--but another member of this group

brought this to my attention--as I'm a genetic clotter( Factor V

Leiden) and have been thru the coumadin trail.

CELIENE

- In infections , Marie Mayberry

<msmabrry@y...> wrote:

> I must have missed something. What is INR?

> Thanks, Marie

>

> --- Al Melillo <melillo3@e...> wrote:

>

> > Hi Penny,

> >

> > Thanks for letting us know about the INR and

> > Antibiotics not working if the INR is not below 3.5.

> >

> >

> > Where on the Internet can I read that ? Is there a

> > website or weblink to that statement ?

> >

> >

> > Thanks,

> > Al

>

>

>

>

> ____________________________________________________

> Sports

> Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football

> http://football.fantasysports.

[Guest guest]

Thanks for the info Celiene. I doubt that I have ever

been checked for hypercoagulation. It may be one more

thing to explore.

Marie

--- ravencat9461 <ravencat9461@...> wrote:

> --Hi Marie,

>

> I'm not Penny, but I can answer your question

>

> INR stands for the " International Ratio "

>

> To understand more: if you just type in " INR " on

> google--it will tell

> you more than I could post here about it.

>

> A normal INR is 1 (one) this would be normal for

> those who are

> healthy--as I am not able to comment on what was

> refered to the

> ranges in the below posting( anything under 3.5)

>

> Theraputic anti-coagulation levels( coumidin levels)

> are 2.0-3.0

>

> If there was any thrombotic events at that level(

> people do still

> clot at 2.0-3.0--but these are generally the genetic

> clotters) then

> the coumadin levels are raised to 2.5-3.5

>

> So, I am wondering.....are those of you on this

> thread--considering

> the theraputic coumdin/heparin levels stated

> above.... being the

> levels that are needed to be obtained for max ABX

> absorption?

>

> Sorry to jump in on this thread--but another member

> of this group

> brought this to my attention--as I'm a genetic

> clotter( Factor V

> Leiden) and have been thru the coumadin trail.

>

> CELIENE

>

>

> - In infections ,

> Marie Mayberry

> <msmabrry@y...> wrote:

> > I must have missed something. What is INR?

> > Thanks, Marie

> >

> > --- Al Melillo <melillo3@e...> wrote:

> >

> > > Hi Penny,

> > >

> > > Thanks for letting us know about the INR

> and

> > > Antibiotics not working if the INR is not below

> 3.5.

> > >

> > >

> > > Where on the Internet can I read that ? Is

> there a

> > > website or weblink to that statement ?

> > >

> > >

> > > Thanks,

> > > Al

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> ____________________________________________________

>

> > Sports

> > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy

> Football

> > http://football.fantasysports.

>

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Celiene,

Glad to have you jump in and share your experience. The other things

these docs have said is that heparin won't cut it (when dealing with

entrenched infection and genetic clotting disorder). Have to use

Coumadin. What are your thoughts?

penny

> >

> > > Hi Penny,

> > >

> > > Thanks for letting us know about the INR and

> > > Antibiotics not working if the INR is not below 3.5.

> > >

> > >

> > > Where on the Internet can I read that ? Is there a

> > > website or weblink to that statement ?

> > >

> > >

> > > Thanks,

> > > Al

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ____________________________________________________

> > Sports

> > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football

> > http://football.fantasysports.

[Guest guest]

Hi Penny,

I hadn't heard that one about heparin, do you have any links that I

could read pertaining to the subject matter??

When I clotted( I threw a PE) they started me on lovenex--which is

LMW Heparin, and then moved me to coumadin. I'm FVL

I am still curious about the levels below 3.5 that was orginally

mentioned early in this thread--as the lower you go on the INR--the

more viscousity the blood has( it has to have a level one to be able

to clott if you are a otherwise healthy patient)

So, correct me if I'm not thinking correctly here....but wouldn't you

want to raise the INR, and thin out the blood somewhat---since the

hypercoagulation due to excessive fibrin production due to chronic

infection would produce thick, sticky blood?

And make it much harder for the ABX to penetrate ,do their " job " ?

Heparin and coumadin are used to control genetic forms of

hypercoagulation( also called thrombophilia, or another term is

thromboplastic) which are due to venous clotting( also called DVT's

wwhich usually originate in the legs) and those who need to be

treated due to a positive ISAC panel.

Plavix, aspirin therapy, Pletel, ect are used for arterial clotting--

due to platlet aggregation. This is the main factor behind occlussive

disease in the extremities.

I've actually met some poor lyme sufferers that have both, venous

clotting, and platlet aggregation

That last statement is making me wonder....Penny, is that why the

Heparin may work on some patients, and not others??

CELIENE

> > >

> > > > Hi Penny,

> > > >

> > > > Thanks for letting us know about the INR and

> > > > Antibiotics not working if the INR is not below 3.5.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Where on the Internet can I read that ? Is there a

> > > > website or weblink to that statement ?

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Thanks,

> > > > Al

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ____________________________________________________

> > > Sports

> > > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football

> > > http://football.fantasysports.