Re: Re: Scientists Behaving Badly...

[Guest guest]

I'd like to " second " Rich's comments.

I work with scientists everyday who are discovering new therapies and pushing the boundaries of immunology. They are, for the most part, purists. The one company I worked for where the scientists were not always ethical is about to go out of business - because of the crappy quality of its science. The FDA is wise to them, and doesn't want to have anything to do with them anymore.

Just as the Consumer Reports article on primal defense and others ought to be questioned, so should this article. As I said earlier, data can be used to mean almost anything. One needs to carefully evaluate the questions asked and the methodology used...

On 6/11/05, rvankonynen <richvank@...> wrote:

Hi, Penny. Calvin couldn't have said it better!I just want to put in a good word for most of the scientists I have been involved with. By and large, their goal really is to find out the truth. It's true that they have all the failings of other human beings, but most of them really don't want to put something out there with their name on it that they aren't pretty sure is true.

Some of the things that this particular study viewed as negative actions on the part of scientists I would regard as appropriate behavior. For example, throwing out data that you aren't sure is valid is the right thing to do. There are plenty of equipment problems that can give you bad data. You have to look it over carefully, and repeat the measurement if it looks strange.Ultimately a person who puts out something that is wrong will be found out, because important experiments are replicated by other labs. If a person gets a reputation for putting out junk, his or her peers figure that out, and the word gets around. A lot of this is self-regulating.Rich> I think the truth of the matter is, PEOPLE behave badly, and becoming > a doctor or scientist or lawyer or even priest or monk, doesn't > automatically exempt someone.> > Someone I know asked me once (when I was stressing about respecting an > elder), " do you know what happens to an ass*hole when he gets old? " I > said, " no, what? " . He said, " he becomes an old ass*hole.> > I think what we're dealing with is human ignorance. People are greedy, > power hungry, fearful, get angry, jealous, lie, cheat, all kinds of > negative behaviors. Having a degree doesn't automatically change that. > As a matter of fact, the more you get, often translates into the more > you want, and the more you're willing to do to get it.

> > That's why we're all so amazed when we meet a 100% nice or good > person, someone who'd never hurt a fly, say a harsh word, is genuinely > compassionate, etc. They're actually kind of rare. But even the worst > people have some positive qualities, and even the best people usually > have some negativity. > > penny