Re: Tagamet fights candida?

[Guest guest]

Very interesting. Tagamet is usually used to treat acid-reflux, or

excessive stomach acid production. Some docs like

say acid-reflux is actually due to LOW stomach acid

levels.

I've had low acid levels for years. The food just sits in my

stomach unless I take hydrochloric acid capsules. Four-five

years ago, I had to take NINE caps to feel any warmth in my

stomach -- now I take 2 or 3.

Anyway, I've read that candida problems can also be connected

with low stomach acid levels, so this study really throws things

for a loop (in my mind anyway!). Am I off my rocker, or has

anyone else read similar reports?

And the zinc in the study -- was that 200mgs of elemental zinc, or

200mgs of zinc sulfate equal to a lower amount of elemental

zinc. Seems like an extremely high amount if it's the latter...

Thanks Penny,

Dan

> I can't remember if we discussed this here or not:

>

>

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2001/mar2001_report_tagamet

_1.html

>

>

> But I wanted to share that I experimented with this OTC

medication

> (normally used for acid indigestion and heartburn), and believe

that

> it may have thwarted a rapidly developing cold.

>

> As I reported before, I came down with a cold in January that

put me

> on my back and took me 6 weeks to recover from the various

> complications that came with it.

>

> When my daughter came down with a nasty cold last week, I

got really

> worried, both about myself catching another cold (from all her

> sneezing in the car) and also because she was under a lot of

> pressure with finals and a major dance performance coming

up. She

> couldn't afford to be sick.

>

> I had just read about Tagament, when I definitely started

coming

> down with the cold, so I decided that considering the fact that

> people take Tagament regularly with no problems, to give it a

shot.

> My daughter was really worried so she took it as well. We both

also

> took Vitamin C, echinacea, colloidal silver, elderberry and

cayenne

> pepper. So we were loaded up on immune boosters and

antimicrobials.

>

> But I really think that it was when we started the Tagament

> (cimetidine) that our colds were stopped (or diminished greatly

in

> my daughter's case). She was able to go back to school, and

danced

> the lead role in her ballet. Normally, she would have been sick

> quite a bit longer and it would have gotten more severe before

> improving.

>

> I did some further investigating and found the following: A study

> showing Tagament's effectiveness against Candida.

>

> Successful Treatment With Cimetidine and Zinc Sulphate in

Chronic

> Mucocutaneous Candidiasis.

> American Journal of the Medical Sciences. 311(4):189-190,

April 1996.

> Polizzi, Biancamaria MD; Origgi, MD; Zuccaro, Giovanni

MD;

> Matti, Paola MD; Scorza, Raffaella MD

> Abstract:

> The authors evaluated the clinical efficacy of a treatment with

> cimetidine and zinc sulphate in a patient with chronic

mucocutaneous

> candidiasis. Cimetidine was given at a dose of 400 mg three

times

> daily; zinc sulphate at a dose of 200 mg daily, then adjusted to

> maintain blood zinc levels at the upper normal range. This

treatment

> lasted 16 months. An impressive and significant reduction of

the

> infectious events and an increased CD4 (helper/inducer) cell

counts

> were observed. The authors conclude that this combined

> immunopotentiating treatment is safe and inexpensive to treat

> immunodeficiency disorders.

>

> © Copyright 1996 Southern Society for Clinical Investigation

>

> Jay Goldstein was apparently also using it for CFS (there's a

paper

> he wrote on cimetidine and Epstein Barr Virus that I can't

access).

>

> According to studies, it doesn't seem to work for warts,

however it

> seemed pretty conclusively to reduce the duration and severity

of

> measles. So this seems to have some real potenital as an

immune

> booster and viral inhibitor.

>

> Unfortunately, when asked, the company that makes

Tagament has no

> plans to investigate it for other applications because their

patent

> has run out, and it would not be profitable.

>

> Anyone have any experience with Tagament?

>

> penny

[Guest guest]

Hmmm, good questions that I can't answer. Personally, I'm pretty

sure that I have plenty of acid in my stomach. I tried taking HCA

myself, and all it seemed to do was burn my stomach.

penny

> > I can't remember if we discussed this here or not:

> >

> >

> http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2001/mar2001_report_tagamet

> _1.html

> >

> >

> > But I wanted to share that I experimented with this OTC

> medication

> > (normally used for acid indigestion and heartburn), and believe

> that

> > it may have thwarted a rapidly developing cold.

> >

> > As I reported before, I came down with a cold in January that

> put me

> > on my back and took me 6 weeks to recover from the various

> > complications that came with it.

> >

> > When my daughter came down with a nasty cold last week, I

> got really

> > worried, both about myself catching another cold (from all her

> > sneezing in the car) and also because she was under a lot of

> > pressure with finals and a major dance performance coming

> up. She

> > couldn't afford to be sick.

> >

> > I had just read about Tagament, when I definitely started

> coming

> > down with the cold, so I decided that considering the fact that

> > people take Tagament regularly with no problems, to give it a

> shot.

> > My daughter was really worried so she took it as well. We both

> also

> > took Vitamin C, echinacea, colloidal silver, elderberry and

> cayenne

> > pepper. So we were loaded up on immune boosters and

> antimicrobials.

> >

> > But I really think that it was when we started the Tagament

> > (cimetidine) that our colds were stopped (or diminished greatly

> in

> > my daughter's case). She was able to go back to school, and

> danced

> > the lead role in her ballet. Normally, she would have been sick

> > quite a bit longer and it would have gotten more severe before

> > improving.

> >

> > I did some further investigating and found the following: A

study

> > showing Tagament's effectiveness against Candida.

> >

> > Successful Treatment With Cimetidine and Zinc Sulphate in

> Chronic

> > Mucocutaneous Candidiasis.

> > American Journal of the Medical Sciences. 311(4):189-190,

> April 1996.

> > Polizzi, Biancamaria MD; Origgi, MD; Zuccaro, Giovanni

> MD;

> > Matti, Paola MD; Scorza, Raffaella MD

> > Abstract:

> > The authors evaluated the clinical efficacy of a treatment with

> > cimetidine and zinc sulphate in a patient with chronic

> mucocutaneous

> > candidiasis. Cimetidine was given at a dose of 400 mg three

> times

> > daily; zinc sulphate at a dose of 200 mg daily, then adjusted to

> > maintain blood zinc levels at the upper normal range. This

> treatment

> > lasted 16 months. An impressive and significant reduction of

> the

> > infectious events and an increased CD4 (helper/inducer) cell

> counts

> > were observed. The authors conclude that this combined

> > immunopotentiating treatment is safe and inexpensive to treat

> > immunodeficiency disorders.

> >

> > © Copyright 1996 Southern Society for Clinical Investigation

> >

> > Jay Goldstein was apparently also using it for CFS (there's a

> paper

> > he wrote on cimetidine and Epstein Barr Virus that I can't

> access).

> >

> > According to studies, it doesn't seem to work for warts,

> however it

> > seemed pretty conclusively to reduce the duration and severity

> of

> > measles. So this seems to have some real potenital as an

> immune

> > booster and viral inhibitor.

> >

> > Unfortunately, when asked, the company that makes

> Tagament has no

> > plans to investigate it for other applications because their

> patent

> > has run out, and it would not be profitable.

> >

> > Anyone have any experience with Tagament?

> >

> > penny

[Guest guest]

Often eating half an onion apple style will alleviate gut symptoms ..onions are a powerful antiseptic, after eating an onion apple style your mouth will be sterile , and it will impact on any undesirable stomach flora too ..worth a try... a shot for nothing as they say ...

-----Original Message-----From: infections [mailto:infections ]On Behalf Of penny Sent: 06 June 2005 18:41infections Subject: [infections] Re: Tagamet fights candida?Hmmm, good questions that I can't answer. Personally, I'm pretty sure that I have plenty of acid in my stomach. I tried taking HCA myself, and all it seemed to do was burn my stomach.penny> > I can't remember if we discussed this here or not:> > > > > http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2001/mar2001_report_tagamet> _1.html> > > > > > But I wanted to share that I experimented with this OTC > medication > > (normally used for acid indigestion and heartburn), and believe > that > > it may have thwarted a rapidly developing cold.> > > > As I reported before, I came down with a cold in January that > put me > > on my back and took me 6 weeks to recover from the various > > complications that came with it. > > > > When my daughter came down with a nasty cold last week, I > got really > > worried, both about myself catching another cold (from all her > > sneezing in the car) and also because she was under a lot of > > pressure with finals and a major dance performance coming > up. She > > couldn't afford to be sick. > > > > I had just read about Tagament, when I definitely started > coming > > down with the cold, so I decided that considering the fact that > > people take Tagament regularly with no problems, to give it a > shot. > > My daughter was really worried so she took it as well. We both > also > > took Vitamin C, echinacea, colloidal silver, elderberry and > cayenne > > pepper. So we were loaded up on immune boosters and > antimicrobials. > > > > But I really think that it was when we started the Tagament > > (cimetidine) that our colds were stopped (or diminished greatly > in > > my daughter's case). She was able to go back to school, and > danced > > the lead role in her ballet. Normally, she would have been sick > > quite a bit longer and it would have gotten more severe before > > improving.> > > > I did some further investigating and found the following: A study > > showing Tagament's effectiveness against Candida. > > > > Successful Treatment With Cimetidine and Zinc Sulphate in > Chronic > > Mucocutaneous Candidiasis. > > American Journal of the Medical Sciences. 311(4):189-190, > April 1996.> > Polizzi, Biancamaria MD; Origgi, MD; Zuccaro, Giovanni > MD; > > Matti, Paola MD; Scorza, Raffaella MD > > Abstract: > > The authors evaluated the clinical efficacy of a treatment with > > cimetidine and zinc sulphate in a patient with chronic > mucocutaneous > > candidiasis. Cimetidine was given at a dose of 400 mg three > times > > daily; zinc sulphate at a dose of 200 mg daily, then adjusted to > > maintain blood zinc levels at the upper normal range. This > treatment > > lasted 16 months. An impressive and significant reduction of > the > > infectious events and an increased CD4 (helper/inducer) cell > counts > > were observed. The authors conclude that this combined > > immunopotentiating treatment is safe and inexpensive to treat > > immunodeficiency disorders. > > > > © Copyright 1996 Southern Society for Clinical Investigation > > > > Jay Goldstein was apparently also using it for CFS (there's a > paper > > he wrote on cimetidine and Epstein Barr Virus that I can't > access).> > > > According to studies, it doesn't seem to work for warts, > however it > > seemed pretty conclusively to reduce the duration and severity > of > > measles. So this seems to have some real potenital as an > immune > > booster and viral inhibitor.> > > > Unfortunately, when asked, the company that makes > Tagament has no > > plans to investigate it for other applications because their > patent > > has run out, and it would not be profitable.> > > > Anyone have any experience with Tagament?> > > > penny

[Guest guest]

Wow, great tip. Hope I can remember that. Funny, maybe it's the

antiseptic that bothers some people's guts? Personally, I love

onions.

penny

> > > I can't remember if we discussed this here or not:

> > >

> > >

> > http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2001/mar2001_report_tagamet

> > _1.html

> > >

> > >

> > > But I wanted to share that I experimented with this OTC

> > medication

> > > (normally used for acid indigestion and heartburn), and

believe

> > that

> > > it may have thwarted a rapidly developing cold.

> > >

> > > As I reported before, I came down with a cold in January that

> > put me

> > > on my back and took me 6 weeks to recover from the various

> > > complications that came with it.

> > >

> > > When my daughter came down with a nasty cold last week, I

> > got really

> > > worried, both about myself catching another cold (from all

her

> > > sneezing in the car) and also because she was under a lot of

> > > pressure with finals and a major dance performance coming

> > up. She

> > > couldn't afford to be sick.

> > >

> > > I had just read about Tagament, when I definitely started

> > coming

> > > down with the cold, so I decided that considering the fact

that

> > > people take Tagament regularly with no problems, to give it a

> > shot.

> > > My daughter was really worried so she took it as well. We

both

> > also

> > > took Vitamin C, echinacea, colloidal silver, elderberry and

> > cayenne

> > > pepper. So we were loaded up on immune boosters and

> > antimicrobials.

> > >

> > > But I really think that it was when we started the Tagament

> > > (cimetidine) that our colds were stopped (or diminished

greatly

> > in

> > > my daughter's case). She was able to go back to school, and

> > danced

> > > the lead role in her ballet. Normally, she would have been

sick

> > > quite a bit longer and it would have gotten more severe

before

> > > improving.

> > >

> > > I did some further investigating and found the following: A

> study

> > > showing Tagament's effectiveness against Candida.

> > >

> > > Successful Treatment With Cimetidine and Zinc Sulphate in

> > Chronic

> > > Mucocutaneous Candidiasis.

> > > American Journal of the Medical Sciences. 311(4):189-190,

> > April 1996.

> > > Polizzi, Biancamaria MD; Origgi, MD; Zuccaro, Giovanni

> > MD;

> > > Matti, Paola MD; Scorza, Raffaella MD

> > > Abstract:

> > > The authors evaluated the clinical efficacy of a treatment

with

> > > cimetidine and zinc sulphate in a patient with chronic

> > mucocutaneous

> > > candidiasis. Cimetidine was given at a dose of 400 mg three

> > times

> > > daily; zinc sulphate at a dose of 200 mg daily, then

adjusted to

> > > maintain blood zinc levels at the upper normal range. This

> > treatment

> > > lasted 16 months. An impressive and significant reduction of

> > the

> > > infectious events and an increased CD4 (helper/inducer) cell

> > counts

> > > were observed. The authors conclude that this combined

> > > immunopotentiating treatment is safe and inexpensive to treat

> > > immunodeficiency disorders.

> > >

> > > © Copyright 1996 Southern Society for Clinical

Investigation

> > >

> > > Jay Goldstein was apparently also using it for CFS (there's a

> > paper

> > > he wrote on cimetidine and Epstein Barr Virus that I can't

> > access).

> > >

> > > According to studies, it doesn't seem to work for warts,

> > however it

> > > seemed pretty conclusively to reduce the duration and

severity

> > of

> > > measles. So this seems to have some real potenital as an

> > immune

> > > booster and viral inhibitor.

> > >

> > > Unfortunately, when asked, the company that makes

> > Tagament has no

> > > plans to investigate it for other applications because their

> > patent

> > > has run out, and it would not be profitable.

> > >

> > > Anyone have any experience with Tagament?

> > >

> > > penny

>

>

>

>

> -------------------------------------------------------------------

---------

> --

>

[Guest guest]

Concerning Tagament and Dr. G all I could find in his books is this

quote from the early 90's, there may be more but my current Doctor and

his wife (pwc) have borrowed two of my Dr. G books:

--------------------------------

" It had recently been discovered that suppressor T-cells had H-2

receptors on their cell membranes. I hoped that blocking these

receptors might ameliorate infectious mononucleosis. Using cimetidine

(Tagamet) and, later, ranitidine (Zantac), I was able to make most of

my patients with mononucleosis feel normal within days, sometimes

within hours. Their tonsillitis and enlarged lymph nodes resolved,

too. This treatment did not work in every case, especially those in

which unusual complications of mononucleosis, such as myocarditis,

were present. " - (Ann. Int. Med. 99(3): 410-411)

--------------------------------

Jerry

>

> > Often eating half an onion apple style will alleviate gut

> symptoms ..onions

> > are a powerful antiseptic, after eating an onion apple style your

> mouth will

> > be sterile , and it will impact on any undesirable stomach flora

> too ..worth

> > a try... a shot for nothing as they say ...

> > [infections] Re: Tagamet fights candida?

> >

> >

> > Hmmm, good questions that I can't answer. Personally, I'm pretty

> > sure that I have plenty of acid in my stomach. I tried taking HCA

> > myself, and all it seemed to do was burn my stomach.

> >

> > penny

> >

[Guest guest]

Found another Dr. G quote from his 2003 book regarding Tagament:

" ...much like my discovery in 1979 (Goldstein JA, 1983) that

cimetidine made acute infectious monoucleosis in teenagers or adults

(and varicella, too) resolve in one or two days. I am getting tired of

whining about it, but hardly anyone is aware of this treatment, even

now. Although I reported a 90 percent cure rate in over 100 patients

(rather high for a placebo response), the results were " anecdotal " .

Naturally, I was unable to get a grant to perform a double-blind,

placebo-controlled experiment. " But Tagamet (and later Zantac) is for

ulcers, " the reviewers would write. The fact that the chairman of the

department of infectious diseases at the local medical school was my

coinvestigator on the grant proposal did not grease the wheel at all. "

> > > Often eating half an onion apple style will alleviate gut

> > symptoms ..onions

> > > are a powerful antiseptic, after eating an onion apple style

your

> > mouth will

> > > be sterile , and it will impact on any undesirable stomach

flora

> > too ..worth

> > > a try... a shot for nothing as they say ...

> > > [infections] Re: Tagamet fights

candida?

> > >

> > >

> > > Hmmm, good questions that I can't answer. Personally, I'm

pretty

> > > sure that I have plenty of acid in my stomach. I tried taking

HCA

> > > myself, and all it seemed to do was burn my stomach.

> > >

> > > penny

> > >

[Guest guest]

Thanks Gerry,

Wow, wish I'd known that back when my oldest daughter had mono. It

was a bad case, and the beginning of her long term illness.

We've had another success with Cimetidine here. The same daughter

started coming down with a cold (all of her little dance students

have it) and I gave her the cimetidine, and apparently, she's beat

it off.

I'm going to definitely remember this for the future. At this point,

I'm just trying to decide when a good time might be to test it out

for a longer period of time, for more than fighting off colds. See

if it has any effects on the rest of this illness. It seems like a

fairly benign drug.

penny

> Concerning Tagament and Dr. G all I could find in his books is this

> quote from the early 90's, there may be more but my current Doctor

and

> his wife (pwc) have borrowed two of my Dr. G books:

>

> --------------------------------

> " It had recently been discovered that suppressor T-cells had H-2

> receptors on their cell membranes. I hoped that blocking these

> receptors might ameliorate infectious mononucleosis. Using

cimetidine

> (Tagamet) and, later, ranitidine (Zantac), I was able to make most

of

> my patients with mononucleosis feel normal within days, sometimes

> within hours. Their tonsillitis and enlarged lymph nodes resolved,

> too. This treatment did not work in every case, especially those in

> which unusual complications of mononucleosis, such as myocarditis,

> were present. " - (Ann. Int. Med. 99(3): 410-411)

> --------------------------------

> Jerry

>

>

[Guest guest]

Aghhh! That's maddening. My daughter missed close to 2 years of

school after contracting mono!!!! Thanks for the reference.

Goldstein can definitely be taken seriously.

penny

In infections , " geraldod "

<geraldod@y...> wrote:

> Found another Dr. G quote from his 2003 book regarding Tagament:

>

> " ...much like my discovery in 1979 (Goldstein JA, 1983) that

> cimetidine made acute infectious monoucleosis in teenagers or

adults

> (and varicella, too) resolve in one or two days. I am getting

tired of

> whining about it, but hardly anyone is aware of this treatment,

even

> now. Although I reported a 90 percent cure rate in over 100

patients

> (rather high for a placebo response), the results were " anecdotal " .

> Naturally, I was unable to get a grant to perform a double-blind,

> placebo-controlled experiment. " But Tagamet (and later Zantac) is

for

> ulcers, " the reviewers would write. The fact that the chairman of

the

> department of infectious diseases at the local medical school was

my

> coinvestigator on the grant proposal did not grease the wheel at

all. "

>

>

>

>

> > Concerning Tagament and Dr. G all I could find in his books is

this

> > quote from the early 90's, there may be more but my current

Doctor

> and

> > his wife (pwc) have borrowed two of my Dr. G books:

> >

> > --------------------------------

> > " It had recently been discovered that suppressor T-cells had H-2

> > receptors on their cell membranes. I hoped that blocking these

> > receptors might ameliorate infectious mononucleosis. Using

> cimetidine

> > (Tagamet) and, later, ranitidine (Zantac), I was able to make

most

> of

> > my patients with mononucleosis feel normal within days, sometimes

> > within hours. Their tonsillitis and enlarged lymph nodes

resolved,

> > too. This treatment did not work in every case, especially those

in

> > which unusual complications of mononucleosis, such as

myocarditis,

> > were present. " - (Ann. Int. Med. 99(3): 410-411)

> > --------------------------------

> > Jerry

>

[Guest guest]

I wouldn't be so sure. I was on Zantac for years starting with the

discovery of Epstein Barr and it didn't do anything to stop my progression

to CFS. They used to say Zantac was good for people with CFS but you don't

see that anymore.

Doris

----- Original Message -----

From: " penny " <pennyhoule@...>

> Wow, wish I'd known that back when my oldest daughter had mono. It

> was a bad case, and the beginning of her long term illness.

>

> --- In infections , " geraldod "

>>> Concerning Tagament and Dr. G all I could find in his books is this

>> quote from the early 90's, there may be more but my current Doctor

> and his wife (pwc) have borrowed two of my Dr. G books:

>> --------------------------------

>> " It had recently been discovered that suppressor T-cells had H-2

>> receptors on their cell membranes. I hoped that blocking these

>> receptors might ameliorate infectious mononucleosis. Using

> cimetidine

>> (Tagamet) and, later, ranitidine (Zantac), I was able to make most

> of

>> my patients with mononucleosis feel normal within days, sometimes

>> within hours. Their tonsillitis and enlarged lymph nodes resolved,

>> too. This treatment did not work in every case, especially those in

>> which unusual complications of mononucleosis, such as myocarditis,

>> were present. " - (Ann. Int. Med. 99(3): 410-411)

>> --------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Maybe because Epstein Barr doesn't cause CFS?

penny

> I wouldn't be so sure. I was on Zantac for years starting with the

> discovery of Epstein Barr and it didn't do anything to stop my

progression

> to CFS. They used to say Zantac was good for people with CFS but

you don't

> see that anymore.

>