Guest guest Posted May 5, 2005 Report Share Posted May 5, 2005 nelly, i didn't used to think b12 injections did much until i stopped doing them...the focusing in my r eye went crazy a couple of years ago but improved remarkedly after resuming b12 injections - later diagnosed as a retinopathy - retina not getting enough 02 secondard to babs....i also have a very high mmp9 which has to do with membrane permeability which b12 supposedly helps with..so i keep taking the b12 not to make things better but to keep them from getting worse.... also, i want to thank you for posting the stuff from sam donta - i really enjoyed reading all the sunmmaries on the site. but the donta stuff really resonates with me - i had a couple of ileus' in jan/feb and flagyl cleared them up - took about a month for all the pelvic floor pain to disappear...then i plateaued with flagyl...last week after reading that article, i looked in my cupboard and switched to cipro and zith and have been much improved from the flagyll and ketek combo....have also been using klinghardts kmt so it's really impossible to tell what is due to what - but i've always been on a roller coaster so correlation has always been difficult... thanks again, deb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 28, 2005 Report Share Posted September 28, 2005 Deb, Is a gluten-free diet good for alkalizing the blood? I have been on a no gluten diet for years, and whenever I have tried to go back to eating it, I am OK for a few days so I think, "goodo nothing is happening I might be able to start eating bread again" but after a few days WHAM! I am down for the count with a nasty vertigo episode. How do you see it all linking up? the alkalizing, the tini, the infections, the gluten? This is very interesting to me because I have never found an explanation for my not tolerating gluten, I have done all tests possible and I am not SUPPOSED to be intolerant to gluten, yet... Nelly [infections] nelly nelly - although pretty much homebound i feel very lucky - no headaches, dizzines, nausea......i think alkalizing the blood is key whether with salt/c, or plaquenil, and/or a gluten free diet....i also use raintree cat's claw ( recommended by buhner in his HEALING LYME book) which really seems to help clean out the gut....it's not toa free but seems more effective than any other cat's claw i've tried... may the headaches, vertigo, etc decide that they have visited you long enough and leave! deb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 28, 2005 Report Share Posted September 28, 2005 : It shouldn't be a universal problem. - unless the corn is harvested during a year when the weather is conducive to mold AND it attacked the kernels. Barb Referenced excerp: " Little do most practitioners know that corn is universally contaminated with mycotoxins. " > Try this nelly, > Still other scientists have directly implicated yeast and fungal toxins, > called mycotoxins, in the cause of Crohn's disease. Former World Health > Organization expert Dr. A.V. Costantini has found that people with Crohn's > often have aflatoxin, a mycotoxin made by Aspergillus molds, in their blood. > Barclay found that disease activity in patients with Crohn's was lower while > they followed a yeast-free diet, specifically avoiding baker's and brewer's > yeasts.[9] > > Some feel that the yeast, Candida albicans, may be the cause of Celiac > disease, also known as Sprue, or gluten-sensitive enteropathy.[10] Celiac > disease, doctors presume, is caused by a reaction to a protein particle > called gluten that exists in certain grains. > > This allergic-type reaction leads to inflammation and often severe symptoms > in not only the intestines but also the entire body. Conventional treatment > therefore involves suppressing the inflammation and symptoms with > anti-inflammatory medications. It also requires the avoidance of these > particular grains. Ironically, corn is a grain that does not contain gluten. > It therefore falls in the " okay to eat " list offered by conventional > practitioners and dieticians. Little do most practitioners know that corn is > universally contaminated with mycotoxins. > > > > http://www.healthe- livingnews.com/articles/fungal_etiology_of_inflammatory_ > bowel_disease.html > > Re: [infections] nelly > > > Deb, > > Is a gluten-free diet good for alkalizing the blood? I have been on a no > gluten diet for years, and whenever I have tried to go back to eating it, I > am OK for a few days so I think, " goodo nothing is happening I might be able > to start eating bread again " but after a few days WHAM! I am down for the > count with a nasty vertigo episode. > > How do you see it all linking up? the alkalizing, the tini, the > infections, the gluten? > > This is very interesting to me because I have never found an explanation > for my not tolerating gluten, I have done all tests possible and I am not > SUPPOSED to be intolerant to gluten, yet... > > Nelly > [infections] nelly > > > nelly - although pretty much homebound i feel very lucky - no headaches, > dizzines, nausea......i think alkalizing the blood is key whether with > salt/c, or plaquenil, and/or a gluten free diet....i also use raintree > cat's claw ( recommended by buhner in his HEALING LYME book) which really > seems to help clean out the gut....it's not toa free but seems more > effective than any other cat's claw i've tried... > may the headaches, vertigo, etc decide that they have visited you long > enough and leave! > deb > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 29, 2005 Report Share Posted September 29, 2005 , Been on ampho B for ...only 5 years! Among everything else against yeast. Try me , and see if I haven't been on it ! I had diarrhea/loose bowels constantly for nearly 20 years, the abx + everything else I do seems to have conquered that, my stools are now perfectly normal but I am still very sick. Thanks for the link on fecal transfusion but I don't think I am ready for that! Especially as I seem to have improved my stools (if not my gut function) immensely, so I think I'll keep on keeping on with my commercial probiotics and the rest (BTW, I use Jarrows Jarodophilus the 1kg jar, and it seems to work for my gut) Nelly Nelly , I do wonder why you consider that your not ready for human probiotics...Have you a different explanation as to why the fecal transfusions are so effective ?Do you still hold faith that comercial probiotics will restore "normal" flora .or is it "fecophobia" Editorial November 2000Volume 95, Number 11Pages 3028-3029 "Flora Power"—Fecal Bacteria Cure Chronic C. difficile Diarrhea J. Borody, M.D., F.R.A.C.P., F.A.C.G.a Persky and Brandt (1), in this issue of the Journal, amply demonstrated how normal human flora bacteria are capable of permanently eradicating C. difficile from the bowel. Lessons learned from this case may have far-reaching clinical implications. First, courage and an innovative spirit are required to carry out what was described by the authors as a "distasteful" procedure. The description reflects our cultural "fecophobia" and might have been viewed quite differently had the procedure been as routine as a blood transfusion—conceptually similar, but one that has largely lost its "hemophobia." Because the procedure is neither routine nor accepted, it is often dismissed even though it can be dramatically curative. The main lesson, then, is that patients with symptomatic, incurable C. difficile seeking out any form of help (2) are perhaps often maintained in a state of considerable suffering while a safe, rapid, and highly effective therapy is available to them virtually anywhere in the world. Yet the therapy is generally not discussed, published, or popularized. Clearly, with our patients' well-being in mind, this area requires further improvement through funded research and a scientific approach to its practice. The second clear lesson is the dramatic and curative, effect of this treatment. In eight reports (3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10), the overall cure rate was 60 of 67 treated patients. Generally those patients who failed to be cured were treated late and died from overwhelming pseudomembranous colitis (PMC) (4). Clinical improvement usually occurred within 1-4 days and has been reported to be curative, without recurrence. In fact, there are few medical therapies that reverse severe illness so dramatically. This begs the question as to how such dramatic treatment works, and whether it could be used or modified to cure other bowel conditions that may be infection-driven. Tvede et al. demonstrated in vitro how some but not other bacteria can profoundly inhibit the growth of pathogenic strains (6). A similar although less powerful phenomenon has been described for lactobacillus GG (11). It would seem that inhibitory substances, perhaps bacteriocins elaborated by bacteria, possess powerful antimicrobial properties. Unlike available antibiotics, these substances seem to have the added power of eliminating bacterial spores. In addition, the accompanying incoming mix of bacteria implants missing flora components such as Bacteroides species, restoring fecal physiology (10, 12), and deficient composition (6, 13), which may have initially permitted implantation of the pathogen such as C. difficile. Hence, colonic infusion of enteric flora may serve both as an antimicrobial and replacement therapy. The human fecal flora is a complex mix of organisms and is arguably the largest organ of the body, containing in a compact mass of living bacterial cells almost nine times more living cells than does the entire body (14). Given the bacteriacidal nature of fecal flora, as judged by the >95% cure of C. difficile, it is instructive to realize that C. difficile may be but one of many implanted infective agents mediating chronic GI disease. As H. pylori was found to be the infective cause of ulcer disease, so chronic clostridial (or other) infections may cause a portion of chronic GI disorders such as constipation, IBS, or IBD. Indeed, constipation responds to vancomycin (15, 16) and to fecal flora therapy (17, 18) as does IBS (5, 19). Ulcerative colitis (UC) has also been reported to go into prolonged remission after fecal flora infusion (20). We have confirmed this finding in our own prospective series of now seven patients with severe UC, five of whom remain in clinical remission without therapy 1-10 yr after treatment (19). In these conditions, no specific bacterial pathogens have yet been demonstrated. Similarly, when Eiseman et al. (3) treated his four PMC cases in 1957, C. difficile had not been discovered—yet the therapy was successful. This very finding teaches us that we can use bacteriotherapy to treat enteric infections without necessarily identifying the pathogen. Fecal bacteria home in on the pathogen, apparently because of their broad-spectrum activity. Hence, when the bacterial species is unknown, fecal bacteria can still dissect out the pathogen without the need to detect and diagnose the infection. Although scientifically it is satisfying to recognize the pathogen, strictly speaking this is not necessary. It is therefore feasible that progress in IBS/IBD treatment discovery could spring from a successful therapy rather than from pathogen identification. For those contemplating the use of this treatment, practical issues that stem from the report by Persky et al. include a) the method of treatment, and selection of donor. It seems that the method of delivery of the fecal slurry into the bowel results in cure, whether given by an enema suspended in saline (3, 4, 5, 7, 8, 9, 19) or milk (10, 12), by a small bowel infusion via a nasoduodenal tube (5, 7), a gastrostomy (9), or a colonoscope (Persky et al.). However, there may be advantages delivering via a colonoscope to infuse as proximally as possible, and to detect any colonic pathology. Selection of the donor is of crucial importance to avoid infecting the recipient with a separate disease. The donor should be tested at least for HIV, hepatitis A, B, and C, cytomegalovirus, and Epstein-Barr virus, with stool negative for any detectable parasites or bacterial pathogens. In our experience, choosing the patient's partner offers a theoretical advantage that any transmissible disease would have been transmitted and emerged by now. In the future, it is conceivable that "bacteriotherapy" using combined, selected bacterial strains resembling human fecal flora (6, 21, 22), perhaps in capsule form, may become a curative therapeutic agent for C. difficile infection and perhaps for those GI disorders that we now call "idiopathic" but that may well have an infective etiology. aCentre for Digestive Diseases, Sydney, Australia References 1. Persky SE, Brandt LJ. Treatment of recurrent Clostridium difficile-associated diarrhea by administration of donated stool directly through a colonoscope. Am J Gastroenterol 2000;95:3283-5. 2. C. Difficile Support Group: www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Falls/5272/index.html. 3. Eiseman B, Silen W, Bascom GS, Kauvar AJ. Fecal enema as an adjunct in the treatment of pseudomembranous enterocolitis. Surgery 1958;44:854-9. 4. Bowden TA, Mansberger AR, Lykins LE. Pseudomembranous enterocolitis: Mechanism of restoring floral homeostasis. Am Surg 1981;47:178-83. 5. Schwan A, Sjolin S, Trottestam U. Relapsing Clostridium difficile enterocolitis cured by rectal infusion of homologous faeces. 6. Tvede M, Rask-Madsen J. Bacteriotherapy for chronic relapsing Clostridium difficile diarrhoea in six patients. Lancet 1989;i:1156-60. 7. Flotterod O, Hopen G. Refractory Clostridium difficile infection. Untraditional treatment of antibiotic-induced colitis. Tidsskr Nor Laegeforen 1991;111:1364-5. 8. Paterson DL, Irdell J, Whitby M. Putting back the bugs: Bacterial treatment relieves chronic diarrhoea. Med J Aust 1994;160:232-3. 9. Lund-Tonnesen S, Berstad A, Schreiner A, et al. Clostridium difficile-associated diarrhea treated with homologous feces. Tidsskr Nor Laegeforen 1998;118:1027-30. 10. Gustafsson A, Lund-Tonnesn S, Berstad A, et al. Faecal short-chain fatty acids in patients with antibiotic-associated diarrhoea, before and after faecal enema treatment. Scand J Gastroenterol 1998;33:721-7. 11. Gorbach SL. Lactic acid bacteria and human health. Ann Med 1990;22:37-41. 12. Gustaffson A, Berstad A, Lund-Tonnesen S, et al. The effect of faecal enema on five microflora-associated characteristics in patients with antibiotic-associated diarrhoea. Scand J Gastroenterol 1999;34:580-6. 13. Butt HL, RH, McGregor NR, et al. Alteration of the bacterial microbial flora in chronic fatigue/pain patients. Proceedings: "The Clinical and Scientific Basis of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome: From Myth Towards Management," Feb. 1998, Sydney, Australia. 14. Hart CA. Antibiotic resistance: An increasing problem? Br Med J 1998;316:1255-6 (editorial). 15. Borody TJ, Noonan S, Cole P, et al. Oral vancomycin can reverse idiopathic constipation. Gastroenterology 1989;96:A52. 16. Celik AF, Tomlin J, Read NW. The effect of oral vancomycin on chronic idiopathic constipation. Aliment Pharmacol Ther 1995;9:63-8. 17. s PJ, P, Borody TJ. Chronic constipation reversed by restoration of bowel flora. A case and a hypothesis. Eur J Gastroenterol Hepatol 1992;4:245-7. 18. s PJ, Borody TJ. Putting back the bugs: Bacterial treatment relieves chronic constipation and symptoms of irritable bowel syndrome. Med J Aust 1993;159:633-4. 19. Borody TJ, L, s PJ, et al. Bowel flora alteration: A potential cure for inflammatory bowel disease and irritable bowel syndrome? Med J Aust 1989;150:604. 20. Bennet JD, Brinkman M. Treatment of ulcerative colitis by implantation of normal colonic flora. Lancet 1989;i:164. 21. Ricci N, Caselli M. Rectal infusion of bacterial preparations for intestinal disorders. Lancet 1983;ii:1494. 22. Pearce L, Bampton PA, Borody TJ, et al. Modification of the colonic microflora using probiotics: The way forward? Gut 1997;41(suppl 3):A63. Reprint requests and correspondence: J. Borody, M.D., F.R.A.C.P., F.A.C.G., Director, Center for Digestive Diseases, 144 Great North Road, Five Dock, Sydney, NSW 2046, Australia. Received Apr. 18, 2000; accepted Apr. 27, 2000. Copyright ©2000 the American College of GastroenterologyPublished by Elsevier Science Inc. [infections] nelly nelly - although pretty much homebound i feel very lucky - no headaches, dizzines, nausea......i think alkalizing the blood is key whether with salt/c, or plaquenil, and/or a gluten free diet....i also use raintree cat's claw ( recommended by buhner in his HEALING LYME book) which really seems to help clean out the gut....it's not toa free but seems more effective than any other cat's claw i've tried... may the headaches, vertigo, etc decide that they have visited you long enough and leave! deb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 29, 2005 Report Share Posted September 29, 2005 Tom Borody was the very first doctor I saw when I first became ill in 1982!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! >In the future, it is conceivable that "bacteriotherapy" using combined, selected bacterial strains resembling >human fecal flora (6, 21, 22), perhaps in capsule form, may become a curative therapeutic agent for C. >difficile infection and perhaps for those GI disorders that we now call "idiopathic" but that may well have an >infective etiology. Very ironic that over 20 years ago HE called my IBS "functional" and "idiopathic" when the whole time I was telling him it was INFECTIOUS and that flagyl improved it dramatically. He sent me packing! Told me I was too anxious, there, there, go and see a shrink!!!! So that's what he was saying in 2000, interesting! Wish he hadn't been such a slow learner! Anyway, , are you getting these fecal flora capsules into you? Nelly [infections] nelly nelly - although pretty much homebound i feel very lucky - no headaches, dizzines, nausea......i think alkalizing the blood is key whether with salt/c, or plaquenil, and/or a gluten free diet....i also use raintree cat's claw ( recommended by buhner in his HEALING LYME book) which really seems to help clean out the gut....it's not toa free but seems more effective than any other cat's claw i've tried... may the headaches, vertigo, etc decide that they have visited you long enough and leave! deb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 29, 2005 Report Share Posted September 29, 2005 isnt this the same T Borody, who was doing the crohns abx trials in Oz.. ?? On 29 Sep 2005, at 21:54, Jaep wrote: >  >> >>  >> , >>  >> Been on ampho B for ...only 5 years! Among everything else against >> yeast. Try me , and see if I haven't been on it ! >>  >> I had diarrhea/loose bowels constantly for nearly 20 years, the abx + >> everything else I do seems to have conquered that, my stools are now >> perfectly normal but I am still very sick. >>  >> Thanks for the link on fecal transfusion but I don't think I am ready >> for that! Especially as I seem to have improved my stools (if not my >> gut function) immensely, so I think I'll keep on keeping on with my >> commercial probiotics and the rest (BTW, I use Jarrows Jarodophilus >> the 1kg jar, and it seems to work for my gut) >>  >> Nelly >>  >>  >> Nelly , I do wonder why you consider that your not ready for human >> probiotics...Have you a different explanation as to why the fecal >> transfusions are so effective ?Do you still hold faith that comercial >> probiotics will restore " normal " flora .or is it " fecophobia " >>  >> >> <unknown.gif>Editorial >> November 2000 >> Volume 95, Number 11 >> Pages 3028-3029 >> >> >> " Flora Power " —Fecal Bacteria Cure Chronic C. difficile Diarrhea >> >> J. Borody, M.D., F.R.A.C.P., F.A.C.G.a >> >> >> Persky and Brandt (1), in this issue of the Journal, amply >> demonstrated how normal human flora bacteria are capable of >> permanently eradicating C. difficile from the bowel. Lessons learned >> from this case may have far-reaching clinical implications. First, >> courage and an innovative spirit are required to carry out what was >> described by the authors as a " distasteful " procedure. The >> description reflects our cultural " fecophobia " and might have been >> viewed quite differently had the procedure been as routine as a blood >> transfusion—conceptually similar, but one that has largely lost its >> " hemophobia. " Because the procedure is neither routine nor accepted, >> it is often dismissed even though it can be dramatically curative. >> The main lesson, then, is that patients with symptomatic, incurable >> C. difficile seeking out any form of help (2) are perhaps often >> maintained in a state of considerable suffering while a safe, rapid, >> and highly effective therapy is available to them virtually anywhere >> in the world. Yet the therapy is generally not discussed, published, >> or popularized. Clearly, with our patients' well-being in mind, this >> area requires further improvement through funded research and a >> scientific approach to its practice. >> >> The second clear lesson is the dramatic and curative, effect of this >> treatment. In eight reports (3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10), the overall >> cure rate was 60 of 67 treated patients. Generally those patients who >> failed to be cured were treated late and died from overwhelming >> pseudomembranous colitis (PMC) (4). Clinical improvement usually >> occurred within 1-4 days and has been reported to be curative, >> without recurrence. In fact, there are few medical therapies that >> reverse severe illness so dramatically. This begs the question as to >> how such dramatic treatment works, and whether it could be used or >> modified to cure other bowel conditions that may be infection-driven. >> Tvede et al. demonstrated in vitro how some but not other bacteria >> can profoundly inhibit the growth of pathogenic strains (6). A >> similar although less powerful phenomenon has been described for >> lactobacillus GG (11). It would seem that inhibitory substances, >> perhaps bacteriocins elaborated by bacteria, possess powerful >> antimicrobial properties. Unlike available antibiotics, these >> substances seem to have the added power of eliminating bacterial >> spores. In addition, the accompanying incoming mix of bacteria >> implants missing flora components such as Bacteroides species, >> restoring fecal physiology (10, 12), and deficient composition (6, >> 13), which may have initially permitted implantation of the pathogen >> such as C. difficile. Hence, colonic infusion of enteric flora may >> serve both as an antimicrobial and replacement therapy. >> >> The human fecal flora is a complex mix of organisms and is arguably >> the largest organ of the body, containing in a compact mass of living >> bacterial cells almost nine times more living cells than does the >> entire body (14). Given the bacteriacidal nature of fecal flora, as >> judged by the >95% cure of C. difficile, it is instructive to realize >> that C. difficile may be but one of many implanted infective agents >> mediating chronic GI disease. As H. pylori was found to be the >> infective cause of ulcer disease, so chronic clostridial (or other) >> infections may cause a portion of chronic GI disorders such as >> constipation, IBS, or IBD. Indeed, constipation responds to >> vancomycin (15, 16) and to fecal flora therapy (17, 18) as does IBS >> (5, 19). Ulcerative colitis (UC) has also been reported to go into >> prolonged remission after fecal flora infusion (20). We have >> confirmed this finding in our own prospective series of now seven >> patients with severe UC, five of whom remain in clinical remission >> without therapy 1-10 yr after treatment (19). In these conditions, no >> specific bacterial pathogens have yet been demonstrated. Similarly, >> when Eiseman et al. (3) treated his four PMC cases in 1957, C. >> difficile had not been discovered—yet the therapy was successful. >> This very finding teaches us that we can use bacteriotherapy to treat >> enteric infections without necessarily identifying the pathogen. >> Fecal bacteria home in on the pathogen, apparently because of their >> broad-spectrum activity. Hence, when the bacterial species is >> unknown, fecal bacteria can still dissect out the pathogen without >> the need to detect and diagnose the infection. Although >> scientifically it is satisfying to recognize the pathogen, strictly >> speaking this is not necessary. It is therefore feasible that >> progress in IBS/IBD treatment discovery could spring from a >> successful therapy rather than from pathogen identification. >> >> For those contemplating the use of this treatment, practical issues >> that stem from the report by Persky et al. include a) the method of >> treatment, and selection of donor. It seems that the method of >> delivery of the fecal slurry into the bowel results in cure, whether >> given by an enema suspended in saline (3, 4, 5, 7, 8, 9, 19) or milk >> (10, 12), by a small bowel infusion via a nasoduodenal tube (5, 7), a >> gastrostomy (9), or a colonoscope (Persky et al.). However, there >> may be advantages delivering via a colonoscope to infuse as >> proximally as possible, and to detect any colonic pathology. >> Selection of the donor is of crucial importance to avoid infecting >> the recipient with a separate disease. The donor should be tested at >> least for HIV, hepatitis A, B, and C, cytomegalovirus, and >> Epstein-Barr virus, with stool negative for any detectable parasites >> or bacterial pathogens. In our experience, choosing the patient's >> partner offers a theoretical advantage that any transmissible disease >> would have been transmitted and emerged by now. >> >> In the future, it is conceivable that " bacteriotherapy " using >> combined, selected bacterial strains resembling human fecal flora (6, >> 21, 22), perhaps in capsule form, may become a curative therapeutic >> agent for C. difficile infection and perhaps for those GI disorders >> that we now call " idiopathic " but that may well have an infective >> etiology. >> >> aCentre for Digestive Diseases, Sydney, Australia >> >> References >> >> 1. Persky SE, Brandt LJ. Treatment of recurrent Clostridium >> difficile-associated diarrhea by administration of donated stool >> directly through a colonoscope. Am J Gastroenterol 2000;95:3283-5. >> >> 2. C. Difficile Support Group: >> www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Falls/5272/index.html. >> >> 3. Eiseman B, Silen W, Bascom GS, Kauvar AJ. Fecal enema as an >> adjunct in the treatment of pseudomembranous enterocolitis. Surgery >> 1958;44:854-9. >> >> 4. Bowden TA, Mansberger AR, Lykins LE. Pseudomembranous >> enterocolitis: Mechanism of restoring floral homeostasis. Am Surg >> 1981;47:178-83. >> >> 5. Schwan A, Sjolin S, Trottestam U. Relapsing Clostridium difficile >> enterocolitis cured by rectal infusion of homologous faeces. >> >> 6. Tvede M, Rask-Madsen J. Bacteriotherapy for chronic relapsing >> Clostridium difficile diarrhoea in six patients. Lancet >> 1989;i:1156-60. >> >> 7. Flotterod O, Hopen G. Refractory Clostridium difficile infection. >> Untraditional treatment of antibiotic-induced colitis. Tidsskr Nor >> Laegeforen 1991;111:1364-5. >> >> 8. Paterson DL, Irdell J, Whitby M. Putting back the bugs: Bacterial >> treatment relieves chronic diarrhoea. Med J Aust 1994;160:232-3. >> >> 9. Lund-Tonnesen S, Berstad A, Schreiner A, et al. Clostridium >> difficile-associated diarrhea treated with homologous feces. Tidsskr >> Nor Laegeforen 1998;118:1027-30. >> >> 10. Gustafsson A, Lund-Tonnesn S, Berstad A, et al. Faecal >> short-chain fatty acids in patients with antibiotic-associated >> diarrhoea, before and after faecal enema treatment. Scand J >> Gastroenterol 1998;33:721-7. >> >> 11. Gorbach SL. Lactic acid bacteria and human health. Ann Med >> 1990;22:37-41. >> >> 12. Gustaffson A, Berstad A, Lund-Tonnesen S, et al. The effect of >> faecal enema on five microflora-associated characteristics in >> patients with antibiotic-associated diarrhoea. Scand J Gastroenterol >> 1999;34:580-6. >> >> 13. Butt HL, RH, McGregor NR, et al. Alteration of the >> bacterial microbial flora in chronic fatigue/pain patients. >> Proceedings: " The Clinical and Scientific Basis of Chronic Fatigue >> Syndrome: From Myth Towards Management, " Feb. 1998, Sydney, >> Australia. >> >> 14. Hart CA. Antibiotic resistance: An increasing problem? Br Med J >> 1998;316:1255-6 (editorial). >> >> 15. Borody TJ, Noonan S, Cole P, et al. Oral vancomycin can reverse >> idiopathic constipation. Gastroenterology 1989;96:A52. >> >> 16. Celik AF, Tomlin J, Read NW. The effect of oral vancomycin on >> chronic idiopathic constipation. Aliment Pharmacol Ther 1995;9:63-8. >> >> 17. s PJ, P, Borody TJ. Chronic constipation reversed by >> restoration of bowel flora. A case and a hypothesis. Eur J >> Gastroenterol Hepatol 1992;4:245-7. >> >> 18. s PJ, Borody TJ. Putting back the bugs: Bacterial treatment >> relieves chronic constipation and symptoms of irritable bowel >> syndrome. Med J Aust 1993;159:633-4. >> >> 19. Borody TJ, L, s PJ, et al. Bowel flora alteration: A >> potential cure for inflammatory bowel disease and irritable bowel >> syndrome? Med J Aust 1989;150:604. >> >> 20. Bennet JD, Brinkman M. Treatment of ulcerative colitis by >> implantation of normal colonic flora. Lancet 1989;i:164. >> >> 21. Ricci N, Caselli M. Rectal infusion of bacterial preparations for >> intestinal disorders. Lancet 1983;ii:1494. >> >> 22. Pearce L, Bampton PA, Borody TJ, et al. Modification of the >> colonic microflora using probiotics: The way forward? Gut >> 1997;41(suppl 3):A63. >> >> Reprint requests and correspondence: J. Borody, M.D., >> F.R.A.C.P., F.A.C.G., Director, Center for Digestive Diseases, 144 >> Great North Road, Five Dock, Sydney, NSW 2046, Australia. >> >> Received Apr. 18, 2000; accepted Apr. 27, 2000. >> >> Copyright ©2000 the American College of Gastroenterology >> Published by Elsevier Science Inc. >>  >>  >>> [infections] nelly >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> nelly - although pretty much homebound i feel very lucky - no >>>>>>>>> headaches, dizzines, nausea......i think alkalizing the blood >>>>>>>>> is key whether with salt/c, or plaquenil, and/or a gluten free >>>>>>>>> diet....i also use raintree cat's claw ( recommended by >>>>>>>>> buhner in his HEALING LYME book) which really seems to help >>>>>>>>> clean out the gut....it's not toa free but seems more >>>>>>>>> effective than any other cat's claw i've tried... >>>>>>>>> may the headaches, vertigo, etc decide that they have visited >>>>>>>>> you long enough and leave! >>>>>>>>> deb > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 29, 2005 Report Share Posted September 29, 2005  Bleu, Yes, here is the article. Maybe Barb's niece would like to see this Nelly http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=11926571 & query_hl=1 Dig Liver Dis. 2002 Jan;34(1):29-38. Related Articles, Links Comment in: Dig Liver Dis. 2002 Jan;34(1):9-12.Treatment of severe Crohn's disease using antimycobacterial triple therapy--approaching a cure?Borody TJ, Leis S, Warren EF, Surace R.Centre for Digestive Diseases, Sydney, Australia. tborody@...BACKGROUND: Mycobacterium avium subspecies paratuberculosis is probably the best candidate for a microbial cause of Crohn's disease although arguments to the contrary can be equally convincing. Growing evidence suggests that prolonged antimycobacterial combination therapy can improve Crohn's disease in some patients. AIM: To report long-term observations in patients with severe Crohn's disease treated with triple macrolide-based antimycobacterial therapy. PATIENTS: A series of 12 patients (7 male, 5 female; aged 15-42 years) with severe, obstructive or penetrating Crohn's disease were recruited. METHODS: Patients failing maximal therapy were commenced prospectively on a combination of rifabutin (450 mg/d), clarithromycin (750 mg/d) and clofazimine (2 mg/kg/d). Progress was monitored through colonoscopy, histology, clinical response and Harvey-Bradshaw activity index. RESULTS: Follow-up data were available for up to 54 months of therapy Six out of 12 patients experienced a full response to the antiMycobacterium avium subspecies paratuberculosis combination achieving complete clinical, colonoscopic and histologic remission of Crohn's disease. Four of these patients were able to cease treatment after 24-46 months, 3 of whom remained in total remission without treatment for up to 26 months and one patient relapsed after six months off treatment. A partial response to the anti-Mycobacterium avium subspecies paratuberculosis combination was seen in 2 patients showing complete clinical remission with mild histologic inflammation. Return to normal of terminal ileal strictures occurred in 5 patients. Harvey-Bradshaw activity index in patients showing a full or partial response to therapy fell from an initial 13.4 +/- 1. 91 to 0. 5 +/- 0. 47 [n = 8, p < 0. 001) after 52-54 months. CONCLUSIONS: Reversal of severe Crohn's disease has been achieved in 6/12 patients using prolonged combination anti-Mycobacterium avium subspecies paratuberculosis therapy alone. Three patients remain in long-term remission with no detectable Crohn's disease off all therapy These results support a causal role for Mycobacterium avium subspecies paratuberculosis in Crohn's disease while also suggesting that a cure may become possible.PMID: 11926571 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] Re: [infections] nelly isnt this the same T Borody, who was doing the crohns abx trials in Oz..?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 29, 2005 Report Share Posted September 29, 2005 Noble! A real find. I dont think it came up last time we discussed this that there were any published experiments. The UC remissions are especially interesting as I had sort of assumed any UC pathogens would be inside the gut tissue, whereas this seems to suggest they could be in the lumen. > > Editorial > > November 2000 > Volume 95, Number 11 > Pages 3028-3029 > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- > > > > > > " Flora Power " —Fecal Bacteria Cure Chronic C. difficile Diarrhea > > J. Borody, M.D., F.R.A.C.P., F.A.C.G.a > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- > > Persky and Brandt (1), in this issue of the Journal, amply > demonstrated how normal human flora bacteria are capable of permanently > eradicating C. difficile from the bowel. Lessons learned from this case may > have far-reaching clinical implications. First, courage and an innovative > spirit are required to carry out what was described by the authors as a > " distasteful " procedure. The description reflects our cultural " fecophobia " > and might have been viewed quite differently had the procedure been as > routine as a blood transfusion—conceptually similar, but one that has > largely lost its " hemophobia. " Because the procedure is neither routine nor > accepted, it is often dismissed even though it can be dramatically curative. > The main lesson, then, is that patients with symptomatic, incurable C. > difficile seeking out any form of help (2) are perhaps often maintained in a > state of considerable suffering while a safe, rapid, and highly effective > therapy is available to them virtually anywhere in the world. Yet the > therapy is generally not discussed, published, or popularized. Clearly, with > our patients' well-being in mind, this area requires further improvement > through funded research and a scientific approach to its practice. > > The second clear lesson is the dramatic and curative, effect of this > treatment. In eight reports (3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10), the overall cure rate > was 60 of 67 treated patients. Generally those patients who failed to be > cured were treated late and died from overwhelming pseudomembranous colitis > (PMC) (4). Clinical improvement usually occurred within 1-4 days and has > been reported to be curative, without recurrence. In fact, there are few > medical therapies that reverse severe illness so dramatically. This begs the > question as to how such dramatic treatment works, and whether it could be > used or modified to cure other bowel conditions that may be > infection-driven. Tvede et al. demonstrated in vitro how some but not other > bacteria can profoundly inhibit the growth of pathogenic strains (6). A > similar although less powerful phenomenon has been described for > lactobacillus GG (11). It would seem that inhibitory substances, perhaps > bacteriocins elaborated by bacteria, possess powerful antimicrobial > properties. Unlike available antibiotics, these substances seem to have the > added power of eliminating bacterial spores. In addition, the accompanying > incoming mix of bacteria implants missing flora components such as > Bacteroides species, restoring fecal physiology (10, 12), and deficient > composition (6, 13), which may have initially permitted implantation of the > pathogen such as C. difficile. Hence, colonic infusion of enteric flora may > serve both as an antimicrobial and replacement therapy. > > The human fecal flora is a complex mix of organisms and is arguably > the largest organ of the body, containing in a compact mass of living > bacterial cells almost nine times more living cells than does the entire > body (14). Given the bacteriacidal nature of fecal flora, as judged by the > >95% cure of C. difficile, it is instructive to realize that C. difficile > may be but one of many implanted infective agents mediating chronic GI > disease. As H. pylori was found to be the infective cause of ulcer disease, > so chronic clostridial (or other) infections may cause a portion of chronic > GI disorders such as constipation, IBS, or IBD. Indeed, constipation > responds to vancomycin (15, 16) and to fecal flora therapy (17, 18) as does > IBS (5, 19). Ulcerative colitis (UC) has also been reported to go into > prolonged remission after fecal flora infusion (20). We have confirmed this > finding in our own prospective series of now seven patients with severe UC, > five of whom remain in clinical remission without therapy 1-10 yr after > treatment (19). In these conditions, no specific bacterial pathogens have > yet been demonstrated. Similarly, when Eiseman et al. (3) treated his four > PMC cases in 1957, C. difficile had not been discovered—yet the therapy was > successful. This very finding teaches us that we can use bacteriotherapy to > treat enteric infections without necessarily identifying the pathogen. Fecal > bacteria home in on the pathogen, apparently because of their broad-spectrum > activity. Hence, when the bacterial species is unknown, fecal bacteria can > still dissect out the pathogen without the need to detect and diagnose the > infection. Although scientifically it is satisfying to recognize the > pathogen, strictly speaking this is not necessary. It is therefore feasible > that progress in IBS/IBD treatment discovery could spring from a successful > therapy rather than from pathogen identification. > > For those contemplating the use of this treatment, practical issues > that stem from the report by Persky et al. include a) the method of > treatment, and selection of donor. It seems that the method of delivery > of the fecal slurry into the bowel results in cure, whether given by an > enema suspended in saline (3, 4, 5, 7, 8, 9, 19) or milk (10, 12), by a > small bowel infusion via a nasoduodenal tube (5, 7), a gastrostomy (9), or a > colonoscope (Persky et al.). However, there may be advantages delivering via > a colonoscope to infuse as proximally as possible, and to detect any colonic > pathology. Selection of the donor is of crucial importance to avoid > infecting the recipient with a separate disease. The donor should be tested > at least for HIV, hepatitis A, B, and C, cytomegalovirus, and Epstein-Barr > virus, with stool negative for any detectable parasites or bacterial > pathogens. In our experience, choosing the patient's partner offers a > theoretical advantage that any transmissible disease would have been > transmitted and emerged by now. > > In the future, it is conceivable that " bacteriotherapy " using > combined, selected bacterial strains resembling human fecal flora (6, 21, > 22), perhaps in capsule form, may become a curative therapeutic agent for C. > difficile infection and perhaps for those GI disorders that we now call > " idiopathic " but that may well have an infective etiology. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- > > aCentre for Digestive Diseases, Sydney, Australia > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- > > References > > 1. Persky SE, Brandt LJ. Treatment of recurrent Clostridium > difficile-associated diarrhea by administration of donated stool directly > through a colonoscope. Am J Gastroenterol 2000;95:3283-5. > > 2. C. Difficile Support Group: > www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Falls/5272/index.html. > > 3. Eiseman B, Silen W, Bascom GS, Kauvar AJ. Fecal enema as an > adjunct in the treatment of pseudomembranous enterocolitis. Surgery > 1958;44:854-9. > > 4. Bowden TA, Mansberger AR, Lykins LE. Pseudomembranous > enterocolitis: Mechanism of restoring floral homeostasis. Am Surg > 1981;47:178-83. > > 5. Schwan A, Sjolin S, Trottestam U. Relapsing Clostridium difficile > enterocolitis cured by rectal infusion of homologous faeces. > > 6. Tvede M, Rask-Madsen J. Bacteriotherapy for chronic relapsing > Clostridium difficile diarrhoea in six patients. Lancet 1989;i:1156-60. > > 7. Flotterod O, Hopen G. Refractory Clostridium difficile infection. > Untraditional treatment of antibiotic-induced colitis. Tidsskr Nor > Laegeforen 1991;111:1364-5. > > 8. Paterson DL, Irdell J, Whitby M. Putting back the bugs: Bacterial > treatment relieves chronic diarrhoea. Med J Aust 1994;160:232-3. > > 9. Lund-Tonnesen S, Berstad A, Schreiner A, et al. Clostridium > difficile-associated diarrhea treated with homologous feces. Tidsskr Nor > Laegeforen 1998;118:1027-30. > > 10. Gustafsson A, Lund-Tonnesn S, Berstad A, et al. Faecal > short-chain fatty acids in patients with antibiotic-associated diarrhoea, > before and after faecal enema treatment. Scand J Gastroenterol > 1998;33:721-7. > > 11. Gorbach SL. Lactic acid bacteria and human health. Ann Med > 1990;22:37-41. > > 12. Gustaffson A, Berstad A, Lund-Tonnesen S, et al. The effect of > faecal enema on five microflora-associated characteristics in patients with > antibiotic-associated diarrhoea. Scand J Gastroenterol 1999;34:580- 6. > > 13. Butt HL, RH, McGregor NR, et al. Alteration of the > bacterial microbial flora in chronic fatigue/pain patients. Proceedings: > " The Clinical and Scientific Basis of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome: From Myth > Towards Management, " Feb. 1998, Sydney, Australia. > > 14. Hart CA. Antibiotic resistance: An increasing problem? Br Med J > 1998;316:1255-6 (editorial). > > 15. Borody TJ, Noonan S, Cole P, et al. Oral vancomycin can reverse > idiopathic constipation. Gastroenterology 1989;96:A52. > > 16. Celik AF, Tomlin J, Read NW. The effect of oral vancomycin on > chronic idiopathic constipation. Aliment Pharmacol Ther 1995;9:63- 8. > > 17. s PJ, P, Borody TJ. Chronic constipation reversed > by restoration of bowel flora. A case and a hypothesis. Eur J Gastroenterol > Hepatol 1992;4:245-7. > > 18. s PJ, Borody TJ. Putting back the bugs: Bacterial > treatment relieves chronic constipation and symptoms of irritable bowel > syndrome. Med J Aust 1993;159:633-4. > > 19. Borody TJ, L, s PJ, et al. Bowel flora alteration: > A potential cure for inflammatory bowel disease and irritable bowel > syndrome? Med J Aust 1989;150:604. > > 20. Bennet JD, Brinkman M. Treatment of ulcerative colitis by > implantation of normal colonic flora. Lancet 1989;i:164. > > 21. Ricci N, Caselli M. Rectal infusion of bacterial preparations > for intestinal disorders. Lancet 1983;ii:1494. > > 22. Pearce L, Bampton PA, Borody TJ, et al. Modification of the > colonic microflora using probiotics: The way forward? Gut 1997;41 (suppl > 3):A63. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- > > Reprint requests and correspondence: J. Borody, M.D., > F.R.A.C.P., F.A.C.G., Director, Center for Digestive Diseases, 144 Great > North Road, Five Dock, Sydney, NSW 2046, Australia. > > Received Apr. 18, 2000; accepted Apr. 27, 2000. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- > > Copyright ©2000 the American College of Gastroenterology > Published by Elsevier Science Inc. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 30, 2005 Report Share Posted September 30, 2005 Thanks Nelly: I actually sent that article to my neice in England a few weeks ago.. The info I get back from her Mom is sketchy - so I don't know all the decisions that are being made - but she told me that all the info I sent was turned over to the Doc (who said he'd read it) but she does not know if it influenced him at all or why they decided to wait on the surgery. I do know that they have her on some sort of combo abx along with steroids... and the latest report was that she was a 'little better'.. i.e. could eat alittle more than broth without pain. Barb > Bleu, > > Yes, here is the article. Maybe Barb's niece would like to see this > > Nelly > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi? cmd=Retrieve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=11926571 & query_hl=1 > > Dig Liver Dis. 2002 Jan;34(1):29-38. Related Articles, Links > > > Comment in: > a.. Dig Liver Dis. 2002 Jan;34(1):9-12. > > Treatment of severe Crohn's disease using antimycobacterial triple therapy--approaching a cure? > > Borody TJ, Leis S, Warren EF, Surace R. > > Centre for Digestive Diseases, Sydney, Australia. tborody@z... > > BACKGROUND: Mycobacterium avium subspecies paratuberculosis is probably the best candidate for a microbial cause of Crohn's disease although arguments to the contrary can be equally convincing. Growing evidence suggests that prolonged antimycobacterial combination therapy can improve Crohn's disease in some patients. AIM: To report long-term observations in patients with severe Crohn's disease treated with triple macrolide-based antimycobacterial therapy. PATIENTS: A series of 12 patients (7 male, 5 female; aged 15-42 years) with severe, obstructive or penetrating Crohn's disease were recruited. METHODS: Patients failing maximal therapy were commenced prospectively on a combination of rifabutin (450 mg/d), clarithromycin (750 mg/d) and clofazimine (2 mg/kg/d). Progress was monitored through colonoscopy, histology, clinical response and Harvey-Bradshaw activity index. RESULTS: Follow-up data were available for up to 54 months of therapy Six out of 12 patients experienced a full response to the antiMycobacterium avium subspecies paratuberculosis combination achieving complete clinical, colonoscopic and histologic remission of Crohn's disease. Four of these patients were able to cease treatment after 24-46 months, 3 of whom remained in total remission without treatment for up to 26 months and one patient relapsed after six months off treatment. A partial response to the anti-Mycobacterium avium subspecies paratuberculosis combination was seen in 2 patients showing complete clinical remission with mild histologic inflammation. Return to normal of terminal ileal strictures occurred in 5 patients. Harvey- Bradshaw activity index in patients showing a full or partial response to therapy fell from an initial 13.4 +/- 1. 91 to 0. 5 +/- 0. 47 [n = 8, p < 0. 001) after 52-54 months. CONCLUSIONS: Reversal of severe Crohn's disease has been achieved in 6/12 patients using prolonged combination anti-Mycobacterium avium subspecies paratuberculosis therapy alone. Three patients remain in long-term remission with no detectable Crohn's disease off all therapy These results support a causal role for Mycobacterium avium subspecies paratuberculosis in Crohn's disease while also suggesting that a cure may become possible. > > PMID: 11926571 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] > Re: [infections] nelly > > > isnt this the same T Borody, who was doing the crohns abx trials in Oz.. > > ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.