Guest guest Posted April 11, 2005 Report Share Posted April 11, 2005 Lovely constraints , you put it well.....Good luck with the pulsing ,I don't see you've any other choice in the circumstances... I wouldn't agree with your assessment of ARb's ,inflammation is a major factor in our illness & simply ARB's are effective against that inflammation .If you do not respond favourably to the drugs then the question must be "why?" as I see it the situation as this .. there are two engines driving inflammation... inflammation it's self [chain reaction] & infection ..it could be the infection is too entrenched too encompassing for the drugs to subdue . So in your situation its not what arb's can do for you it's what you can do for arb's ... If i've read the signs correctly Lamisil is duel ...Both anti bacterial & anti fungal ...if you get the chance to try it , I would appreciate your opinion ... & yes we will fill the world with healthy 's not to mention all the s & Jills -----Original Message-----From: Schaafsma [mailto:compucruz@...]Sent: 09 April 2005 22:00infections Subject: [infections] S. Thanks J.That link was actually quite helpful. I am a pretty self-directed patient, within the lovely constraints the health care system imposes.I am going to try this:I will discontinue Diflucan today. Tomorrow, I will start a gentle, gradual, laxative purge, with Magnesium, which my spine will thank me for (it spasms badly, no matter what I do, but Magnesium helps). I will take milk thistle and SAMe, because both combined seem to do my liver good in a hurry.I will continue this for four or five days and try the Diflucan again. If I get through two days ok, I may take a day off, then two more on. If that's fine, I'll try to do three days on, etc. If it doesn't, I'll consult and see if rather than forgo the Diflucan I can keep widening the pulse interval until I find one I can tolerate.I'm not interested in anymore ARBs. I do accept that some are helped by them, but see no evidence that this is true in a broad way of people with Lyme disease. I always reserve the right to be wrong, though, and I will pay attention to any explanations as to why, after a year of 320mg of Diovan, more than you-know-who used to get substantial improvement, I feel so much worse. Too little of a good thing is one explanation, but I do realize that. Just not one I find very convincing, going by my response. I felt slightly better during the first few months on Diovan. They were also months of cooler weather, and I ALWAYS feel better when the temperature stays well under 75 degrees.I am so glad to hear you're in much improved health, J! May the world be filled with healthy s, and may I join them soon! S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 12, 2005 Report Share Posted April 12, 2005 Hi J and S J Thanks for your explanation of the inflammation; I think many of us appreciate a simple overview as well as the more detailed descriptions. Is Lamisol a broad spectrum antifungal? S Firstly this is a late addition to the comments already made on your personal postings: I remain in awe of your ability to write from the heart, and more so since you do this whilst having to cope with a severe form of neuroborreliosis and the herxing. You have a talent for touching others with your prose, it has a profound affect upon those of us fortunate to have the opportunity to read them. Thank you. My protocol is very different from yours, but I have as least had experience of both borrelia and yeast/fungal die offs and the herxing associated with them. The first ever candida die off I experienced was a breeze compared with the borrelia die off, if you are having both occur together then I am not surprised it is hitting you so hard. My candida etc was first discovered in the 80s, it quickly became apparent that I had more than one strain and that I was allergic to the albicans strain, this effected not only the day to day symptoms but the die off as well. I saw a doctor who practices what in the US is referred to as integrative medicine, so he would use both meds and alternatives. Part of my treatment for the candida allergy was a homeopathic remedy candida - 200x, others have used this in varying potencies along with their antifungal meds. Homeopathic remedies rarely worked for me but this one did. It's cheap too. After two major and prolonged herxes I have decided I need to go more slowly. I have been severely affected for many years, and I clearly underestimated my bacterial load. So for now I am going for slow and steady, I finally stopped my protocol and then restarted it once the herxing had calmed down. Doing this paid off, my heart and body generally needed the break in order for me to move forward again, whilst off my protocol I concentrated on detoxing. Cheers, Tansy > Lovely constraints , you put it well.....Good luck with the pulsing ,I don't > see you've any other choice in the circumstances... I wouldn't agree with > your assessment of ARb's ,inflammation is a major factor in our illness & > simply ARB's are effective against that inflammation .If you do not respond > favourably to the drugs then the question must be " why? " as I see it the > situation as this .. there are two engines driving inflammation... > inflammation it's self [chain reaction] & infection ..it could be the > infection is too entrenched too encompassing for the drugs to subdue . So > in your situation its not what arb's can do for you it's what you can do for > arb's ... > > If i've read the signs correctly Lamisil is duel ...Both anti bacterial & > anti fungal ...if you get the chance to try it , I would appreciate your > opinion ... & yes we will fill the world with healthy 's not to mention > all the s & Jills > > > > [infections] S. Thanks J. > > > > That link was actually quite helpful. I am a pretty self-directed > patient, within the lovely constraints the health care system > imposes. > > I am going to try this: > > I will discontinue Diflucan today. Tomorrow, I will start a gentle, > gradual, laxative purge, with Magnesium, which my spine will thank > me for (it spasms badly, no matter what I do, but Magnesium helps). > I will take milk thistle and SAMe, because both combined seem to do > my liver good in a hurry. > > I will continue this for four or five days and try the Diflucan > again. If I get through two days ok, I may take a day off, then two > more on. If that's fine, I'll try to do three days on, etc. > > If it doesn't, I'll consult and see if rather than forgo the > Diflucan I can keep widening the pulse interval until I find one I > can tolerate. > > I'm not interested in anymore ARBs. I do accept that some are helped > by them, but see no evidence that this is true in a broad way of > people with Lyme disease. I always reserve the right to be wrong, > though, and I will pay attention to any explanations as to why, > after a year of 320mg of Diovan, more than you-know-who used to get > substantial improvement, I feel so much worse. > > Too little of a good thing is one explanation, but I do realize > that. Just not one I find very convincing, going by my response. I > felt slightly better during the first few months on Diovan. They > were also months of cooler weather, and I ALWAYS feel better when > the temperature stays well under 75 degrees. > > I am so glad to hear you're in much improved health, J! May the > world be filled with healthy s, and may I join them soon! > > S. > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- > -- > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2005 Report Share Posted April 13, 2005 Hi Tansy, glad you liked the simple version , Yes Lamisil [Terbinafine] is a broad action systemic Antifungal , but its only licensed to treat skin & nail fungal infections, Your story is interesting , I've no doubt that yeast has lifted the lid of Pandora's box ,it is or was fueling this Borrelia pandemic ..It looks like contact may have taken over as the prime mode of infection . The question now is does Borrelia downgrade the IS allowing Candida to grow & become pathogenic ?..It seems a good bet that its the case ..especially with the high dose ABX' we are obliged to take ...AF may become an essential component of our protocol .. [infections] S. Thanks J.> > > > That link was actually quite helpful. I am a pretty self-directed> patient, within the lovely constraints the health care system> imposes.> > I am going to try this:> > I will discontinue Diflucan today. Tomorrow, I will start a gentle,> gradual, laxative purge, with Magnesium, which my spine will thank> me for (it spasms badly, no matter what I do, but Magnesium helps).> I will take milk thistle and SAMe, because both combined seem to do> my liver good in a hurry.> > I will continue this for four or five days and try the Diflucan> again. If I get through two days ok, I may take a day off, then two> more on. If that's fine, I'll try to do three days on, etc.> > If it doesn't, I'll consult and see if rather than forgo the> Diflucan I can keep widening the pulse interval until I find one I> can tolerate.> > I'm not interested in anymore ARBs. I do accept that some are helped> by them, but see no evidence that this is true in a broad way of> people with Lyme disease. I always reserve the right to be wrong,> though, and I will pay attention to any explanations as to why,> after a year of 320mg of Diovan, more than you-know-who used to get> substantial improvement, I feel so much worse.> > Too little of a good thing is one explanation, but I do realize> that. Just not one I find very convincing, going by my response. I> felt slightly better during the first few months on Diovan. They> were also months of cooler weather, and I ALWAYS feel better when> the temperature stays well under 75 degrees.> > I am so glad to hear you're in much improved health, J! May the> world be filled with healthy s, and may I join them soon!> > S.> > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------> --> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2005 Report Share Posted April 13, 2005 Yeast is almost worse for me than borrelia, because of my allergies to mold/yeast, making me allergic to my own body in a sense and to molds in the environment etc. My mold tests with Dr Marinkovich were off the charts even for his patient population. Yet my yeast/candida which is of decades long duration and imo began as a teen when I received a lot of mercury/silver fillings when my braces wer eremoved (and I think that genetically I didn'thave good detox mechanisms for that) and then antibiotics for dog allergies and then cortisone etc...set me up for lifelong problems, anyway...they're mostly resistant to azoles. Nystatin had helped keep them in check for a while, the yeastie beasties. So what am I to do now? I got interested in mycograb, an antibody from England, I'm going to try and see how expesnive it is. I think it's IV. But safe as its an antibody. > > Lovely constraints , you put it well.....Good luck with the > pulsing ,I don't > > see you've any other choice in the circumstances... I wouldn't > agree with > > your assessment of ARb's ,inflammation is a major factor in our > illness & > > simply ARB's are effective against that inflammation .If you do not > respond > > favourably to the drugs then the question must be " why? " as I see > it the > > situation as this .. there are two engines driving inflammation... > > inflammation it's self [chain reaction] & infection ..it could be > the > > infection is too entrenched too encompassing for the drugs to > subdue . So > > in your situation its not what arb's can do for you it's what you > can do for > > arb's ... > > > > If i've read the signs correctly Lamisil is duel ...Both anti > bacterial & > > anti fungal ...if you get the chance to try it , I would appreciate > your > > opinion ... & yes we will fill the world with healthy 's not to > mention > > all the s & Jills > > > > > > > > [infections] S. Thanks J. > > > > > > > > That link was actually quite helpful. I am a pretty self- directed > > patient, within the lovely constraints the health care system > > imposes. > > > > I am going to try this: > > > > I will discontinue Diflucan today. Tomorrow, I will start a > gentle, > > gradual, laxative purge, with Magnesium, which my spine will thank > > me for (it spasms badly, no matter what I do, but Magnesium > helps). > > I will take milk thistle and SAMe, because both combined seem to > do > > my liver good in a hurry. > > > > I will continue this for four or five days and try the Diflucan > > again. If I get through two days ok, I may take a day off, then > two > > more on. If that's fine, I'll try to do three days on, etc. > > > > If it doesn't, I'll consult and see if rather than forgo the > > Diflucan I can keep widening the pulse interval until I find one I > > can tolerate. > > > > I'm not interested in anymore ARBs. I do accept that some are > helped > > by them, but see no evidence that this is true in a broad way of > > people with Lyme disease. I always reserve the right to be wrong, > > though, and I will pay attention to any explanations as to why, > > after a year of 320mg of Diovan, more than you-know-who used to > get > > substantial improvement, I feel so much worse. > > > > Too little of a good thing is one explanation, but I do realize > > that. Just not one I find very convincing, going by my response. I > > felt slightly better during the first few months on Diovan. They > > were also months of cooler weather, and I ALWAYS feel better when > > the temperature stays well under 75 degrees. > > > > I am so glad to hear you're in much improved health, J! May > the > > world be filled with healthy s, and may I join them soon! > > > > S. > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > -------- > > -- > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2005 Report Share Posted April 13, 2005 P.S. Though azoles can cause liver problems, lamisil can cause unexpected liver failure...a good drug but one should be cautious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2005 Report Share Posted April 13, 2005 Hi J Borrelia can actually alter the immune response to ensure its own survival, the more virulent the infection the more likely this is to happen, hence there is often no bull's eye rash. It can also mean the traditional tests often show false negatives. Some PWLD have had negative test results until well into their treatment protocols epsecially when they have been ill for a long time, then they start to test positive. A haematologist actually picked up some of this going on in 1983 but of course no one knew about these infections then, he just commented upon the impact. It would appear that not everyone with these zoonotic infections have yeast and fungal infections, but the long term high dose ABx treatments used can of course cause them to flare up. If we also look at the IS changes that can occur, then the higher occurance of yeast, fungal, and other infections in these DDs is easier to understand as well. When reading this and other message boards it is clear that for many patients CFIDS and even lyme disease are or become polymicrobial. Cheers, Tansy > > Lovely constraints , you put it well.....Good luck with the > pulsing ,I don't > > see you've any other choice in the circumstances... I wouldn't > agree with > > your assessment of ARb's ,inflammation is a major factor in our > illness & > > simply ARB's are effective against that inflammation .If you do not > respond > > favourably to the drugs then the question must be " why? " as I see > it the > > situation as this .. there are two engines driving inflammation... > > inflammation it's self [chain reaction] & infection ..it could be > the > > infection is too entrenched too encompassing for the drugs to > subdue . So > > in your situation its not what arb's can do for you it's what you > can do for > > arb's ... > > > > If i've read the signs correctly Lamisil is duel ...Both anti > bacterial & > > anti fungal ...if you get the chance to try it , I would appreciate > your > > opinion ... & yes we will fill the world with healthy 's not to > mention > > all the s & Jills > > > > > > > > [infections] S. Thanks J. > > > > > > > > That link was actually quite helpful. I am a pretty self- directed > > patient, within the lovely constraints the health care system > > imposes. > > > > I am going to try this: > > > > I will discontinue Diflucan today. Tomorrow, I will start a > gentle, > > gradual, laxative purge, with Magnesium, which my spine will thank > > me for (it spasms badly, no matter what I do, but Magnesium > helps). > > I will take milk thistle and SAMe, because both combined seem to > do > > my liver good in a hurry. > > > > I will continue this for four or five days and try the Diflucan > > again. If I get through two days ok, I may take a day off, then > two > > more on. If that's fine, I'll try to do three days on, etc. > > > > If it doesn't, I'll consult and see if rather than forgo the > > Diflucan I can keep widening the pulse interval until I find one I > > can tolerate. > > > > I'm not interested in anymore ARBs. I do accept that some are > helped > > by them, but see no evidence that this is true in a broad way of > > people with Lyme disease. I always reserve the right to be wrong, > > though, and I will pay attention to any explanations as to why, > > after a year of 320mg of Diovan, more than you-know-who used to > get > > substantial improvement, I feel so much worse. > > > > Too little of a good thing is one explanation, but I do realize > > that. Just not one I find very convincing, going by my response. I > > felt slightly better during the first few months on Diovan. They > > were also months of cooler weather, and I ALWAYS feel better when > > the temperature stays well under 75 degrees. > > > > I am so glad to hear you're in much improved health, J! May > the > > world be filled with healthy s, and may I join them soon! > > > > S. > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > -------- > > -- > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2005 Report Share Posted April 13, 2005 Hi Jill I do understand your predicament , Mycograb is in trials at the present time ...still a long way off from general release ,sounds promising though ...still I think as posted earlier a wholistic approach to your infection is the way to go ...Take a look at my web site ,it may help, its attracting 500 hits a week , & its keeping me busy answering query's ...it needs updating as you will see , but I was on the trail of infection ,just got it a little wrong ...[which is enough] http://yeast-candida-infections-uk.co.uk/ [infections] S. Thanks J.> >> >> >> > That link was actually quite helpful. I am a pretty self-directed> > patient, within the lovely constraints the health care system> > imposes.> >> > I am going to try this:> >> > I will discontinue Diflucan today. Tomorrow, I will start a> gentle,> > gradual, laxative purge, with Magnesium, which my spine will thank> > me for (it spasms badly, no matter what I do, but Magnesium> helps).> > I will take milk thistle and SAMe, because both combined seem to> do> > my liver good in a hurry.> >> > I will continue this for four or five days and try the Diflucan> > again. If I get through two days ok, I may take a day off, then> two> > more on. If that's fine, I'll try to do three days on, etc.> >> > If it doesn't, I'll consult and see if rather than forgo the> > Diflucan I can keep widening the pulse interval until I find one I> > can tolerate.> >> > I'm not interested in anymore ARBs. I do accept that some are> helped> > by them, but see no evidence that this is true in a broad way of> > people with Lyme disease. I always reserve the right to be wrong,> > though, and I will pay attention to any explanations as to why,> > after a year of 320mg of Diovan, more than you-know-who used to> get> > substantial improvement, I feel so much worse.> >> > Too little of a good thing is one explanation, but I do realize> > that. Just not one I find very convincing, going by my response. I> > felt slightly better during the first few months on Diovan. They> > were also months of cooler weather, and I ALWAYS feel better when> > the temperature stays well under 75 degrees.> >> > I am so glad to hear you're in much improved health, J! May> the> > world be filled with healthy s, and may I join them soon!> >> > S.> >> >> >> >> >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------> --------> > --> > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2005 Report Share Posted April 14, 2005 I " ll look at your website. Mycograb from my initial reading has orphan drug status already so my doc might be able to prescribe it. ly, I think I have a genetic weakness for fungal stuff. I cannot think of any other explanation I've had such a longstanding resistant tough problem with molds and fungi.- -- In infections , " Jaep " <Jaep@L...> wrote: > Hi Jill I do understand your predicament , Mycograb is in trials at the > present time ...still a long way off from general release ,sounds > promising though ...still I think as posted earlier a wholistic > approach to your infection is the way to go ...Take a look at my web site > ,it may help, its attracting 500 hits a week , & its keeping me busy > answering query's ...it needs updating as you will see , but I was on the > trail of infection ,just got it a little wrong ...[which is enough] > http://yeast-candida-infections-uk.co.uk/ > [infections] S. Thanks J. > > > > > > > > > > > > That link was actually quite helpful. I am a pretty self- > directed > > > patient, within the lovely constraints the health care system > > > imposes. > > > > > > I am going to try this: > > > > > > I will discontinue Diflucan today. Tomorrow, I will start a > > gentle, > > > gradual, laxative purge, with Magnesium, which my spine will > thank > > > me for (it spasms badly, no matter what I do, but Magnesium > > helps). > > > I will take milk thistle and SAMe, because both combined seem > to > > do > > > my liver good in a hurry. > > > > > > I will continue this for four or five days and try the > Diflucan > > > again. If I get through two days ok, I may take a day off, > then > > two > > > more on. If that's fine, I'll try to do three days on, etc. > > > > > > If it doesn't, I'll consult and see if rather than forgo the > > > Diflucan I can keep widening the pulse interval until I find > one I > > > can tolerate. > > > > > > I'm not interested in anymore ARBs. I do accept that some are > > helped > > > by them, but see no evidence that this is true in a broad way > of > > > people with Lyme disease. I always reserve the right to be > wrong, > > > though, and I will pay attention to any explanations as to > why, > > > after a year of 320mg of Diovan, more than you-know-who used > to > > get > > > substantial improvement, I feel so much worse. > > > > > > Too little of a good thing is one explanation, but I do > realize > > > that. Just not one I find very convincing, going by my > response. I > > > felt slightly better during the first few months on Diovan. > They > > > were also months of cooler weather, and I ALWAYS feel better > when > > > the temperature stays well under 75 degrees. > > > > > > I am so glad to hear you're in much improved health, J! > May > > the > > > world be filled with healthy s, and may I join them soon! > > > > > > S. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ ---- > ---- > > -------- > > > -- > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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