Re: alan..fertile soil and quality foods

[Guest guest]

First, thanks for this really thoughtful letter. I just wanted to ask a

question. It seems pretty clear that there's another issue, which is just

nutrient replacement. The farmer that I get milk from simply sends around

200kg a year of calcium off his farm in the form of milk to the dairies.

That fact has to be managed and it has to be managed in a way that's sound

and balanced (after all, too much of a good thing can be bad. Consider

lakes and rivers that are deal because of too much phosphorous or nitrogen

or the problem of salinization due to irrigation)

This fact of micronutrients just leaving the farm is simply a consequence of

the way that we interact economically. My great-grandfather's farm didn't

have this problem. Almost all their food---extracted nutrients---got, one

way or another, recycled back into the land (compost, manure from animals

and people, cover crops, etc). This was subsistence farming; for them, the

goal was staying alive and living a satisfying life. But my grandfather had

a dairy farm. The milk from his cows left the farm and went to city people.

The manure and compost from the city people never got back to the farm, and

over some period of time that necessarily leads to a degradation of the

nutritional quality of the food. My grandparents made sure all their kids

got a good high school education by sending them to the boarding school

associated with their church. This cost money and was something that their

parents could not have considered. That money wasn't available to

subsistence farmers.

My understanding is that organic farmers deal with this by rock powders, and

things like that. (this was also the intuition that the biodynamics people

had in 1924) And I notice that you don't mention this kind of thing in your

discussion of how you maintain nutrient dense food. What are your thoughts

here?

Soren

> -----Original Message-----

> From: wetz@... [mailto:wetz@...]

> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2001 10:24 PM

>

> Subject: alan..fertile soil and quality foods

>

>

> Alan

>

> what do you consider the most important factors contributing to

> nutrient dense milk/meat? I see three principle attributes: 1.

> diversity of forage 2. actively growing forage 3. organic matter in

> soil

>

>

> 1. diversity of forage. a cow out to pasture can produce a good

> volume of milk by grazing a mono culture that is high in protein and

> energy...such as alfalfa or rye grass. but a mono culture does not

> address the need for a healthful, nutrient dense diet. just as we

> need to eat a variety of foods to be healthy, a cow needs to include

> a wide range of forages in its diet including; weeds, legumes,

> minerals, grasses, annuals etc.. each plant reacts with the soil

> differently and utilizes different soil elements. chicory will

> utilize many minerals in the soil that other plants to not use...some

> plants are deep rooted that allow mineral absorption from deep down

> that shallow rooted plants can not reach (such as alfalfa).

>

> 2. plants need to be actively growing to be palatable, nutritious,

> and full of protein and energy. Weston A Price wrote on the nutrient

> effects of rapidly growing grass on the quality of the cows milk.

> and it has been recently studied that the CLA content in milk is

> higher as the speed of grass growth increases. fast grass growth is

> attributed to temperature, moisture and organic matter. from what I

> have seen moisture is the key with temperature and organic matter

> variability can be compensated, to a degree, through control of the

> moisture.

>

> 3. organic matter in the soil. the soil has been mined in our

> country for the past 100+ years. we have been spoiled by the deep

> rich top soil that seems to never end. there is only one way to

> bring the soil back to life and that is through a paradigm change in

> our farming practices. a few keys are: A). proper crop rotation .

> returning crop land back to pasture c) reduce the size of farms D)

> more animals back on the land..an end to manufacture farming of our

> animals. this process of improving the organic matter in soil takes

> time. no quick fix. I read an article that included an example of

> this process on a north dakota farm. it took the farmer 8 years to

> improve the organic matter from 1.4% to 4%. and it took another 8

> years to bring it from 4% to 5%.

>

> my farming practices include:

>

> 1. forage diversity for my dairy cows. including: alfalfa,

> wheatgrass, orchard grass, brome, rye, oat, wild sunflower, milk

> weed, hemp, white clover, red clover, alsike clover, tall fescue,

> dock, dandelion, bind weed, morning glory, millet, fox tail, sand

> burr, crab grass, lambs quarter (this plant has 30% protein level at

> peak growth), cicer milk vetch, chicory, cone flower, flax, joe pye

> weed, garrison fox tail, pig weed, barn yard grass, blue grass, and

> others

>

> 2.actively growing forage. i have 130 acres under pivot irrigation.

> the forage has ample moisture to grow even during the driest periods.

>

> 3. organic matter. i have implemented strong organic matter

> production principles through rotational grazing practices. and

> returning all the crop land on the farm back to grass land.

>

>

> in your opinion, am i off base in my conclusion on what makes quality

> milk/meat. it is more than just fertile soil... fertile soil is only

> part of the equation. fertile soil be compensated for though

> diversity of forage and moisture as long as the fertility is a

> postion to contribute a healthy diverse pasture? is fertility of

> soil the same as organic matter in your book? or how would you

> measure fertility of soil?

>

> you are on the money in your comment that the farming practices have

> to be consumer driven.. consumers have been buying on price for a

> long time. and farmers have responded by producing on price. even

> our laws governing the agricultural community have been geared

> towards manufature farming practices.

>

> the consumer demand has to be load enough for the farmer to hear the

> demand shift and the load enough to change the laws binding the

> farmers from farming and marketing quality products.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> Alan

>

> fast grass growth is

> attributed to temperature, moisture and organic matter. from what I

> have seen moisture is the key with temperature and organic matter

> variability can be compensated, to a degree, through control of the

> moisture.

Alan, this is just part of it. A *high quality* pasture has to be

mineralized with appropriate amounts of calcium, magnesium, phosphorous,

etc. I really wish you could see the short video " The Other Side of the

Fence " which was produced by Professor A. Albrecht. It makes a

rather dramatic case that fenced in animals are often starving for minerals

when they are standing belly-deep in what looks like good grass. If you want

to go the professional's route, you may find it wise to contact ide

Laboratories and talk with any of their savvy consultants. ide was

founded by a farmer who was puzzled that his cows ate the new drywall

(calcium sulate) stalls he put in a barn. He really got an awakening when he

went to visit Albrecht, who tested the soil and advised him the cows were

starved for calcium. When the farmer put calcium on the pastures, the cows

promptly quit eating the stalls.

The more you study the foods in this country, both what humans get to eat AND

what animals get to eat, the more you will be astonished at the poor

quality. You're not the first to idly assume that lush green grass is

automatically of high quality. However, it is not so easy to fool the

animals. Put proper minerals on one end of a big pasture and watch how they

will eat *only* from that end.

ide is only one of many soil consultancies that firmly understand the

need for adequate minerals (nutrients) to be in the soil if one wants high

quality feed, meat, and milk. The vast majority of our soils have been mined

until they produce junk.

Regards,

Rex Harrill

[Guest guest]

* wetz@... (wetz@...) [010830 21:25]:

* Subject: alan..fertile soil and quality foods:

> Alan

>

> what do you consider the most important factors contributing to

> nutrient dense milk/meat? I see three principle attributes: 1.

> diversity of forage 2. actively growing forage 3. organic matter in

> soil

>

> 1. diversity of forage. a cow out to pasture can produce a good

> volume of milk by grazing a mono culture that is high in protein and

> energy...such as alfalfa or rye grass. but a mono culture does not

> address the need for a healthful, nutrient dense diet. just as we

> need to eat a variety of foods to be healthy, a cow needs to include

> a wide range of forages in its diet including; weeds, legumes,

> minerals, grasses, annuals etc.. each plant reacts with the soil

> differently and utilizes different soil elements. chicory will

> utilize many minerals in the soil that other plants to not use...some

> plants are deep rooted that allow mineral absorption from deep down

> that shallow rooted plants can not reach (such as alfalfa).

It seems like a good bet to try to duplicate the

prairies of the midwest and use that at least as

a starting point. There was a vast variety of plants

that no doubt was highly beneficial.

However, it has been has been suggested that " variety "

is meerly a necessary crutch for low quality food.

There are examples of healthy peoples (not to mention

animals) with very little variety in their diet, but

the *quality* of their food is excellent. Examples,

off the top of my head, are the Maasai that consume

soured milk and cow's blood almost exclusively (but

do eat small quantities of meat and herbs); and a

group of people living in the South Pacific whose

only food is a variety of sweet potato.

Given the food we have available, however, we'd better

stick with the " variety " method.

> 2. plants need to be actively growing to be palatable, nutritious,

> and full of protein and energy. Weston A Price wrote on the nutrient

> effects of rapidly growing grass on the quality of the cows milk.

> and it has been recently studied that the CLA content in milk is

> higher as the speed of grass growth increases. fast grass growth is

> attributed to temperature, moisture and organic matter. from what I

> have seen moisture is the key with temperature and organic matter

> variability can be compensated, to a degree, through control of the

> moisture.

The prairie Indians managed the land by periodically

setting fire to it to allow new grasses to break

through. It was that new growth that the bison

preferred and were attracked to.

> 3. organic matter in the soil. the soil has been mined in our

> country for the past 100+ years. we have been spoiled by the deep

> rich top soil that seems to never end. there is only one way to

> bring the soil back to life and that is through a paradigm change in

> our farming practices. a few keys are: A). proper crop rotation .

> returning crop land back to pasture c) reduce the size of farms D)

> more animals back on the land..an end to manufacture farming of our

> animals. this process of improving the organic matter in soil takes

> time. no quick fix. I read an article that included an example of

> this process on a north dakota farm. it took the farmer 8 years to

> improve the organic matter from 1.4% to 4%. and it took another 8

> years to bring it from 4% to 5%.

No question, that carbon in the soil is necessary.

> [ ... ]

> in your opinion, am i off base in my conclusion on what makes quality

> milk/meat.

You haven't even mentioned remineralizing the soil.

How can trace elements that are removed from the

soil and sold to the market be returned if the farmers

are not actively putting it back? How about

the minerals and trace minerals that were never

there in the first place? How can the meat and milk

have vitamin B12, for instance, if there isn't any

Cobalt in the soil? Where does the vitally important

anti-oxidant Selenium compounds come from if there

is no Selenium there? We have an epidemic of diabetes

in the world today. Is that possibly due to our farm

lands being depleted of Chromium and Vanadium? Who's

making sure that the soil has optimal amount of Zinc,

Copper, Iron, Manganese, and other elements necessary

to healthy plant, animal, and human life? Even elements

like Arsenic, Mercury and Lead seem to be necessary for

a long and healthy life. Are farmers making sure they

are there?

The bottom line is that if the soil doesn't contain

the nutrients necessary for healthy plant life, or

won't yield them to the plant, it doesn't matter how

much variety is grown, or how much carbon is in the

soil, or how fast it grown. And, those plants can't

have all the nutrients we need for good health.

> it is more than just fertile soil... fertile soil is only

> part of the equation. fertile soil be compensated for though

> diversity of forage and moisture as long as the fertility is a

> postion to contribute a healthy diverse pasture? is fertility of

> soil the same as organic matter in your book? or how would you

> measure fertility of soil?

Soil with organic matter is simply soil with organic

matter. Organic matter is necessary to fertile soil,

but absolutely not sufficient. The definition I like

best is fertile soil is one that produces healthy plants

and animals.

I don't know all the secrets to producing healthy soil,

but a few characteristics would be 1) balanced minerals

and trace minerals, and other elements (see Albrecht),

2) teaming soil organisms to make the minerals, trace

minerals and water fully available to the plants. Carbon,

Nitrogen, and Oxygen are part of 1), and without water

and suitable temperatures 2) isn't possible.

> you are on the money in your comment that the farming practices have

> to be consumer driven.. consumers have been buying on price for a

> long time. and farmers have responded by producing on price. even

> our laws governing the agricultural community have been geared

> towards manufature farming practices.

>

> the consumer demand has to be load enough for the farmer to hear the

> demand shift and the load enough to change the laws binding the

> farmers from farming and marketing quality products.

The irony is that by spreading rock dust, sea kelp, and/or

fish emulsions to remineralize the soils, and by stopping

the deep plowing that releases the carbon from the soil,

farmers can stop buying expensive chemical fertilizers and

pesticides, work less, save money, and produce more and higher

quality food. [ Of course the chemical industry won't be

any too happy. ]

--alan