Re: Re: Ulimate Success Guy Trashing this group in Paxil Progress

[Guest guest]

No Ben,

I'm not being petty. How petty was it of you to catagorically trash us all? This is about healing. I believe the overwealming majority of people here are here to get better and help others. Obviously your comments about this group you don't feel the same way. I know that you got good advice here. Listen, you started the negativity on your own by labeling all of us. You should know how much labels hurt in our condition. You should offer an apology. Not more verbal insults. You just lableled my entire life petty. Maybe it is and I should kill myself to make you happy! Dude, YOU need to stop the negativity..NOW!

Subject: Re: Ulimate Success Guy Trashing this group in Paxil ProgressTo: SSRIsex Date: Thursday, May 5, 2011, 8:55 PM

Are you serious right now? Are you trying to start a forum war of somekind. I was simply saying if you were looking for hope of recovery, you should try a forum where people have hope and believe in recovery like paxilprogress. Most people here wallow in self pity and assume they are screwed for life. I am not interested in that negativity.Some of you here are great people with a lot of good things to offer, but a lot of you are reckless and want to use more and more pharmecuticals, the same things that destroyed you in the first place.Then you post silly posts like this. How petty is your life? I am sorry things are this way for you.-Ben>> Just to let this group know, the guy who

broke through with the success this week has now trashed this entire group in PaxilProgress. He said he received a "hail storm" of negativity here. One person questioned the use of yohimbe and now we're all terrible people. > By the way, I am a member of both groups and and have gained tremendous information and support from both. I just think that someone trashing this place and the people here should be addressed. Thank you fellow supportive and NOT negative members of SSRIsex! Mike>

[Guest guest]

To all in this group,

I was the one who started this thread yesterday. I was very upset and angry about some things written elsewhere. I took some time, breathed deeply and began to think sensibly. My anger got the better of me (which is always a bad thing). I think that these groups have many things to offer those who trully want to move forward and improve their situations. I agree with Ben that there are those here who are simply looking for a quick fix and when it's not available look to more pharmaceuticals...Point taken...How these groups are seen by each and every one of us is going to be through our own subjective eyes. I may see it one way and Ben anonther way. Some of the people in this group, such as Sam Sam, are very well read on these subjects and help me with my own understanding of what is going on. I am very happy that I joined this site to hear how people are reacting to

something like inositol which is a naturally recurring substance. I joined this site to learn, gain understanding and hopefully help others when I experiencing something for me. Ben, I think it is fair to say that you and I both got offended quickly by what was written in certain places in the past. For that, I am sorry and hope that we can move on and that you and I can contribute positive things to this group or any others which offer advice and hope to all of us who need it. Lord knows we need it! Hope everyone has a pleasant weekend. Sincerely, PS ..As the creater of this thread, it would be great if a moderator killed it. I feel bad about bringing everyone down. Good Day

Subject: Re: Ulimate Success Guy Trashing this group in Paxil ProgressTo: SSRIsex Date: Friday, May 6, 2011, 3:06 AM

Let's not cause a war between ourselves. We're all going through our own hell and its a tough battle we're dealing with. I would agree that it's not nice hearing that this group gets bad mouthed on pp, the owners of that site are arrogant and dismissive as it is of any outside help from their forum.Certainly there are members on here that are negative but you can understand the loss of hope when they feel stuck with this horrible condition and go seeking help with socalled professionals but get no answers or validation. The one's who see improvement can help those members and encourage them to be positive and not give up hope. We've all been in that dark place where you think there is no way out but death. There is nothing better than coming on here and reading a post of a success story to give us hope and an option to try out to get better. I'm sure a lot members feel the sameThere e are great members on here like kaivey that offer

great advice, knowledge and support aswell as being open minded and tolerant of others ideas and treatments that you won't find on pp because on there, only way is to let time solve everything without trying anything new. Which is good but it doesn't need to be that way for everyone. If you do you try an alternative to time, you come up against a whole load of doubt and discouragement from the admin trying to make you feel bad for your choice of taking something.I was banned for the most dumbest of things on that site because I disagreed with a simple point after a thread I created. Got warned that I would get banned because I felt suicidal at one point. So I prefer this site to pp because varnon gives it's members more leeway and freedom of speech to say what they feel without the fear of being dictated or looked down upon.> >> > Just to let this group know, the guy who broke through with the success this week has now trashed this entire group in PaxilProgress. He said he received a "hail storm" of negativity here. One person questioned the use of yohimbe and now we're all terrible people. > > By the way, I am a member of both groups and and have gained tremendous information and support from both. I just think that someone trashing this place and the people here should be addressed. Thank you fellow supportive and NOT negative members of SSRIsex!

Mike> >>

[Guest guest]

Fascinating! You really have an in depth knowledge of our nervous system. Your

point about nerve connections between the genitals and eyeballs, is striking to

me because i have nerve pain in both areas and i didnt understand the

connection. These drugs are terrifying in terms of the depth of the damage they

can cause. I asked you to elaborate because some in the group say the problem is

serotonin and some say its dopamine. You demonstrate that its both

simultaneously. Do you think that any type of brain scan would show any of this

damage?

alex

Re: Ulimate Success Guy Trashing this group in Paxil Progress

Elaborate? Um...

Have you ever been searching for something for a long time only to discover it

is right in front of you?

The answer seems to be right in front of your nose.

Its like that...

This is really a basic premise of serotonin:

SSRIs, as well as drugs like MDMA, LSD, mushrooms, mescaline, and

piperazines....these ALL target the serotonin network.

Well, what is the serotonin network?

Simply put, it is the connection between the intestines and the brain!

There are many sections to the digestive tract:

You have the mouth and esophagus.

The stomach and biliary system (liver and gall bladder)

Then the small intestine - made up of three sections known as the duodenum, the

jejunum, and the ileum. Each is separated by a highly innervated valve. I

believe these valves represent transitions in the brain....from one region to

the next.

The large intestine is divided into the cecum and the colon.

Then, of course, comes the rectum.

From the mouth all the way to the rectum

[Guest guest]

hey - I have a newish friend who speaks about the same things as Sam. she is one of the few people who reacted properly when I told her about pssd, completely believing me and saying she would never, ever, go near the stuff now. in any case, Alfa, this friend is a great believer in fasting as a method of healing the gut. a while back I tried fasting for 24-36 hours at a time, once a week, and it was actually fun. but a few months ago I went for four days and I rapidly lost too much weight, which was too bad because I really thought it was a great experience otherwise. so far I haven't felt it affect pssd but theoretically I think it could, and this friend of mine as I said thinks it can heal this. So maybe it can be an alternative to exercising for you and an additional route for other people here. ---

Subject: Re: Re: Ulimate Success Guy Trashing this group in Paxil ProgressTo: SSRIsex Date: Sunday, May 8, 2011, 4:55 PM

This kinda makes sense. However, I'm wandering what about people who cannot exercise maybe due to some injury or something? Is there any hope for them?AlfaTo: ssrisex Sent: Sun, May 8, 2011 9:54:20 AMSubject: Re: Ulimate

Success Guy Trashing this group in Paxil Progress

Elaborate? Um...

Have you ever been searching for something for a long time only to discover it is right in front of you?

The answer seems to be right in front of your nose.

Its like that...

This is really a basic premise of serotonin:

SSRIs, as well as drugs like MDMA, LSD, mushrooms, mescaline, and piperazines....these ALL target the serotonin network.

Well, what is the serotonin network?

Simply put, it is the connection between the intestines and the brain!

There are many sections to the digestive tract:

You have the mouth and esophagus.

The stomach and biliary system (liver and gall bladder)

Then the small intestine - made up of three sections known as the duodenum, the jejunum, and the ileum. Each is separated by a highly innervated valve. I believe these valves represent transitions in the brain....from one region to the next.

The large intestine is divided into the cecum and the colon.

Then, of course, comes the rectum.

From the mouth all the way to the rectum are many many nerve endings.

Did you know that your rectum and genitals contain nerves that are connected to your eyes?

That's right - known as the 'occipital-anal' nerve. This is relatively new....

It is said to give one a 'shitty' outlook on life. :-)

No, seriously, the nervous system really does connect your anus/genitalia to your eyes! Amazing shit, right?

So, back to the small intestines...

The intestines are richly innervated and endowed with blood vessels like no other organ in the body!

When you eat food, blood rushes to the digestive tract in response.

The intestines are a mystery to science due to their complexity. Many doctors consider gastroenterology to be a difficult area of study, because there is much we do not understand about them. There are a variety of intestinal diseases that turn out to be VERY difficult to treat.

Irritable Bowel Syndrome patients are known for 'over-using' medical resources. They constantly return to the doctor for help with a condition that is poorly understood. Doctors have proven that IBS patients exhibit extreme anxiety at times, and this anxiety is directly linked to pressure in the gut. They actually inserted air balloons to apply local pressure just to prove this point. They also proved that psychological stress could induce changes in digestion and bowel movements. Doctors all over the country are shaking their heads...

That is just one easy example.

When surgery is performed on the intestines, such as dissection, the surgeons try to remove as little tissue as possible and stitch it back together. They wait to 'see if it still works'. Scary...

There are many involuntary muscles in the body, but NONE equals the size

and complexity of the smooth muscle surrounding the intestines.

Did you know that if all the villi in your intestines were stretched out

until they were flat, your small intestines would cover a football field?!

Whoah.

Well, the only way that this amazing organ works is through a network of

nerves that is more complex than any other: the serotonin or 5-HT system.

Tryptophan is turned into bile by the liver. This bile is so acidic it will dissolve a nail!

Typtophan is also turned into an acidic chemical known as serotonin. Nearly all of this serotonin is stored in the intestines.

But some of it is sent into the brain stem.

In the rear of the brain lies a precious little bundle of serotonin nerves known as the Raphe Nuclei. This is the beginning of the nerve bodies, which stretch and branch out into ever smaller fibers. The Raphe

Nuclei is not only connected to the brainstem, but it also communicates

with the Super Chiasmatic Nulcei, which receives light directly from the eyes! Your 'gut' is actually connected to your eyes! Take a moment to think about that...

From the Raphe Nuclei, the 5-HT network branches out to the rest of the brain.

What is amazing is how far reaching these nerves are. They appear to invade the entire brain!

Even in the distant reaches of the pre-frontal cortex....which is right behind your eyes, the serotonin nerves are quite dense.

This is the part of your brain that is the farthest away from your brainstem....it is the home of our higher thinking processes.....and yet

our 'gut'....our intestines are wired into this too!

That means when we have a visceral feeling....like having sex or taking a shit....it involves very complex thought pathways.

Your gut is attached to all of your mind. All of it.

That is amazing. Absolutely incredible...

Serotonin is acidic and it also has an inhibitory effect upon brain pathways.

That means it tends to interrupt the flow of electrical impulses. That makes sense, right? Acid being injected into fatty tissue will interrupt the flow of electricity across cell membranes...

Somehow, the brain reacts to this by increasing blood flow and glucose consumption in the area. The tissue is responding to the invasion of serotonin.

I think of it like a rubber band being pulled back.

As your intestines move food and bile through.....your intestines inject serotonin into different regions of the brain.

At first, this serotonin causes an inhibition....an interference with normal activity. This is perceived as stress.

This 'stress response' results in an increase in blood to the brain tissue, which is like the rubber band snapping back in response.

Don't you remember feeling that an orgasm was almost painful?

That the height of pleasure was associated with pain?

It is well established that a person experiencing an orgasm does not display a look of happiness on their face! It is a look of pain! If you don't buy this....look into sex research. Observing facial expressions during sex is not very difficult for scientists. During orgasm, people display a look of pain. Proven. Done....moving on.

I believe that the experience of orgasm sends a charge of serotonin into the far reaches of the pre-frontal cortex.

This rush of inhibitory, acidic fluid causes a 'snap' response. The shock of pleasure is very close to the experience of pain.

Brain scans have revealed that people, especially men, experience a sudden change in brain activity during orgasm. The rest of the brain goes quiet while the PFC goes mad. Why is it that the most advanced part of our human brains react so violently to orgasm?

There is a precious pathway that leads from the PFC all the way into the

limbic system....the primal brain which lies beneath the cerebral cortex.

Known as the 'meso-limbic reward pathway' - nearly all pleasurable experiences utilize this highway.

Whether it is drug use or sex, this pathway is very important. Even basic functions like eating require this, too. It is critical to our survival.

Serotonin itself may not be the key to this pathway. Remember, it has an

inhibitory effect....it causes reactions in the brain tissue. Serotonin

is known as a 'modulator' of other neurotransmitters.

Dopamine, however, plays a direct role.

Dopamine is indeed the cause of most pleasure....but many of the dopamine receptors rely on the serotonin pathways....the inhibitory effect.....the rubber band. Make sense?

When the serotonin pathways are eliminated, the nearby dopamine receptors no longer get the 'snap' effect.

The rush of blood and glucose stops....and the dopamine ceases to flow.

The 'meso-limbic reward pathway' is no longer able to experience the cascade reaction of dopamine release that it once did!

Without the blood-selfish, electricity inhibiting, acidic invader known as serotonin....these poor pathways simply do not function anymore.

Without this 'brain-gut' connection, your visceral reactions to pain or pleasure are altered.

Without serotonin, dopamine has a lot less meaning.

This is why many dopamine agonists, such as yohimbine, Wellbutrin, or even Meth have a profound effect. They directly increase dopamine to such an extent that it compensates for the loss. The fact that these work at all

is evidence for this theory of 'serotonin-dopamine' dependence. MDMA and SSRIs likely work by indirectly causing a release of dopamine through the 'rubber-band' response.

During the recovery process from SSRIs or MDMA, I believe this injection of serotonin becomes erratic.

The intestines are still pushing the chemicals through, but the nerve receptors in the brain no longer exist.

The cell body....the actual serotonin nerve itself is intact. But it no longer has the normal 'branches' extending from the tree. Make sense? The trunk is intact, and so are the big branches, but the tiny branches and leaves have been damaged.

The nerve is pulsating with acidic serotonin, but it cannot distribute it properly.

So now, the inhibitory effect is rather extreme in certain areas.

Brain tissue that would normally receive this 'gut juice' is no longer getting any....while other areas closer to the cell body are getting WAY

too much.

As a result, the 'inhibitory' effect is rather pronounced, and the brain tissue near the cell body is being tortured!

This is the cause of anxiety and depression. Your intestines are literally digesting parts of the brain!

In MDMA research it has been shown that in the Pre Frontal Cortex, the re-innervation of serotonin is abnormal. Not only is the quantity of nerves reduced, but there is a gradient. This gradient shows a decrease in density as the nerves get closer to the face. The part of the PFC closer to the back of the head displays a higher concentration of serotonin nerves. It is a 'back to front' gradient.

Serotonin is injected from the brain stem into the Raphe Nuclei in the back of your head.

It flows down the tree of nerves, but some areas of our brains are not able to handle this.

The serotonin begins to inhibit normal electrical impulses in these areas, causing anxiety.

This anxiety is possibly linked to an increase in dopamine production. This extreme local inhibition by serotonin is causing a global dopamine response.

Eventually, dopamine finds the pathways it is looking for and it spills over, causing relief.

Also, new serotonin receptors pop up. These are SERT binding sites, and they establish a new and permanent storage site for further serotonin injection.

MDMA research dose show that much of the brain recovers its SERT function, but it also shows some areas of reduced function, while others

have hyper-innervation. OK...

Here is another mystery: this should result in permanent malfunction in blood distribution!

Because serotonin plays such an important role in the distribution of capillaries around the brain, this MDMA induced damage should cause a major disruption in blood distribution.

BUT THIS IS NOT WHAT IS OBSERVED!

Why????

Eventually blood distribution in the brain DOES RETURN TO NORMAL.

In the research I have seen, this can take well over a year.

They do not understand why.

It is believed that re-innervation of serotonin fibers plays an important role, but they also suspect that other neurotransmitter systems are also being modified, such as GABA receptors.

I know this is confusing.....even to the scientists.

Neurology is in its infancy. We have a LONG way to go.But one thing that neurologists know for SURE is that even average blood distribution is CRITICAL to healthy brain function. Any patient that shows disruptions in blood distribution tends to have problems.This means that the brain is fighting to restore this balance of blood and glucose everywhere in the brain. The intestines may get all the credit for this, if my theory is correct. But one way or another, the brain fights and fights for this re-distribution to take place. Month after agonizing month, it never ever stops. Ever....If this isn't a sign of hope, I don't know what is.

I have only provided a crude theory for a much more complex process.

This is a combination of months of research as well as conjecture on my part.I cannot claim to be a doctor, but I have read hundreds of time-consuming studies done by actual doctors.

I hope that some of you gain more understanding as a result.

The restoration of blood distribution around the brain is a profound discovery!

It is a source of hope to all of us. Each and every one of us.

Another bit of hope:

Cardio exercise, when done daily for many months, will cause new capillaries to pop up!

This is proven in research, even in elderly patients. Total brain volume goes up....the brain literally weighs more!

But it takes many months to make a big difference. This is not achieved quickly.

Regardless of the extent of brain function left, it is understood that increased blood flow is ALWAYS good.

Also, exercise produces dopamine!

For maximum effect, I recommend a combination of cardio and weight lifting. Increases in dopamine, even if temporary, can be delightful for

even the most disconnected among us! I cannot count the number of times that I almost felt completely normal in the hours after an intense workout.

Finally, exercise increases a key protein in the brain known as BDNF. Brain Derived Neutrophic Factor is a protein that causes new STEM CELLS to become available to key areas of the brain. The areas proven to benefit so far are: the hippocampus, the basal forebrain, and the CORTEX. The cerebral cortex. The home to the PFC and all the higher thinking centers...

I cannot recommend exercise enough.Science is not yet advanced enough to understand the 'brain-gut' connection. To me this means doctors have no business prescribing Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitors, to any patient.And it certainly isn't advanced enough to understand the brain's plasticity. For many years, scientists said that we could never grow new nerve cells in the brain. We were born with a fixed supply, they said. That simply is not true, and it has been proven. To me this means there is hope for all of us. I guess I'm done for now.Good luck to all of you. Until next time...Sam