Guest guest Posted September 30, 2011 Report Share Posted September 30, 2011 Its freaking annoying. Next time if you see a doctor tell them its nieve to assume that the dysfunction is all in ones head. Also why is it so inconceivable that there would be lasting side effects. Look up tardive dyskinesia. Its a common permanent side effect of antipsychotic medications. Your psychiatrist ought to know about it. Why is that possible but not long lasting side effects from SSRIs. Rediculuous. Also point out that just because he hasn't heard of PSSD before doesn't necessarily mean it doesn't exist. I get so sick of this shit. Its an obsolete idea that ED is mostly psychological and yet so many doctors still treat it that way. > > Hi guys, > > I read your stories and all we are very angry because they didn¢t warn us about the sexual side effects before the use. > > Today I saw a professor psychiatrist, hospital manager and I put out my anger to him I told him that all of us who suffer with pssd are very angry with our doctors because they didn¢t warn us and they didn¢t give us a choice to do. I told him that they ought to warn the patients about the sexual side effects so as to have their update and make responsibly their choices and take their risks. > > He told me that the side effects are written in the instructions and I told him that the data there are not correct. In the instructions say that the sexual side effects are affect 1-10% but in the reality the percentage is higher 35-75% and also nowhere but nowhere it isn¢t written that the sexual dysfunction can be permanent after quitting the drug. I told him that many patients want to sue their doctors and he reply that only vindictive people want to sue others. Probably they don¢t understand that they destroyed our lives. > > The professor doesn¢t believe in pssd and he said that the body returns to normal after 20 days after quitting and he also said that I can¢t return to normal because I believe that my problem is from the drugs and I don¢t let my body to relax. He also told me to make a personality test in the hospital. He believes that all the people with the same problem have psychological themes and that all the doctors will agree with this He told me that he based on science and i told him that behind the science are the pharmas... > > For this shit he took me 120 euro He said that the only thing that he cares about is me and how to be ok again and not the money but he finally asked me 120 euro without thinking the economic crisis and the fact that I am without job and insurance > > Furthermore the reply to this from my first doctor was that it¢s not right to tell people about side effects before the use because they can have them through the autosuggestion. > > The comments are yours... > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 30, 2011 Report Share Posted September 30, 2011 Hi , I think that the doctors should use their method of psychotherapy in order to find their subconscious incentives why they don¢t accept that PSSD exists ) But for all of us who have the problem it¢s very clear the fact that they don¢t accept pssd because they are afraid of their ¡ego¢ and their carrier. It¢s very difficult for them to accept the fact that one patient came to them in order to help him and the fact that they finally created more problems to his life. It¢s not only pssd, the most of us have various persistent side effects. It¢s very difficult for them. It¢s about their life and their whole personality. It¢s very difficult to accept that not only they didn¢t help us but actually they killed us. Furthermore, they are arrogant and they believe that they know all about health while the same time FDA and the instructions of the drugs say that they don¢t know how exactly the drugs function in the brain! My first doctor didn¢t hesitate to put the blame on me and she said that I don¢t have sexual dysfunction because of the drugs but because of my psychosis. Yes, she said that I have psychosis ) And when I denied this and told her that she actually destroyed my life, she became very very angry and told me that it was my high psychosis which didn¢t let me to see the truth and I need to take again drugs I laugh with this so as not to cry The professor doctor don¢t believe that I have psychosis but ¡somatoform epikodomiseis¢ (I am not sure that I translated correctly this term in English) which means in other words that I am stucked with the drugs and I believe that whatever happens to me, then it¢s due to the drugs. For example, he said, that I will put the blame on the drugs for all the illnesses and diseases I will have in the future, even though and for natural facts as anility. Ha-ha these people are totally crazy )) They don¢t know what they say and what they do... They talk by ignorance! They are dangerous! They don¢t accept simple truths and they will kill more innocent people in the future... I believe that they will have their consequences through the karma because they can¢t claim ignorance anymore... The patients are more clever, understanding and mature! Actually I said to the professor that I would prefer to read the comments of patients about the drugs rather than listening doctor¢s theories, as patients speak through their experiences while doctors only theoretically. > > > > Hi guys, > > > > I read your stories and all we are very angry because they didn¢t warn us about the sexual side effects before the use. > > > > Today I saw a professor psychiatrist, hospital manager and I put out my anger to him I told him that all of us who suffer with pssd are very angry with our doctors because they didn¢t warn us and they didn¢t give us a choice to do. I told him that they ought to warn the patients about the sexual side effects so as to have their update and make responsibly their choices and take their risks. > > > > He told me that the side effects are written in the instructions and I told him that the data there are not correct. In the instructions say that the sexual side effects are affect 1-10% but in the reality the percentage is higher 35-75% and also nowhere but nowhere it isn¢t written that the sexual dysfunction can be permanent after quitting the drug. I told him that many patients want to sue their doctors and he reply that only vindictive people want to sue others. Probably they don¢t understand that they destroyed our lives. > > > > The professor doesn¢t believe in pssd and he said that the body returns to normal after 20 days after quitting and he also said that I can¢t return to normal because I believe that my problem is from the drugs and I don¢t let my body to relax. He also told me to make a personality test in the hospital. He believes that all the people with the same problem have psychological themes and that all the doctors will agree with this He told me that he based on science and i told him that behind the science are the pharmas... > > > > For this shit he took me 120 euro He said that the only thing that he cares about is me and how to be ok again and not the money but he finally asked me 120 euro without thinking the economic crisis and the fact that I am without job and insurance > > > > Furthermore the reply to this from my first doctor was that it¢s not right to tell people about side effects before the use because they can have them through the autosuggestion. > > > > The comments are yours... > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2011 Report Share Posted October 1, 2011 When I first went to see a psychiatrist I was very scared and worried. I always had loads of friends but somehow I had gone into a depression and I felt alienated from everyone. I knew that what had caused this depression was a lifetime of low self esteem and feeling unatractive which had finally caught up with me after I had a very traumatic experience which greatly upset me. So the psychiatrist say's that I have a chemical imballance and that I needed medication but I knew it was bollocks, and all I needed was someone to talk to. So he gave me a prescription and told me to come back in a month and my heart broke into despair because I knew drugs could not help me, and what I needed was someone to talk to. The drugs did not work but only caused me more distress so I was put on more drugs. I'm was a young man and I so liked to look good, and this fucking git puts me on tablets that make me put on loads of weight causing me to worry more and feel even more unatractive. What the hell was he thinking? How could that make me feel better about myself? The tosser! So anyway, they then put more on more stuff to stop the worry, etc, and I'm so upset that so I carry on with the tablets hoping they might help, even if it makes no sense to me - plus I still believe that doctors are wise and clever. But I'm really hoping that they eventually will give me therapy when the meds don't work, but what I don't realise is that there is no other fucking treatment available. I knew nothing about brain biology and yet I knew that these fucking morons were completely wrong and that their treatment could never work, and so you can see that the placebo effect was never going to work on me. But the drugs went on to destroy my life just the same. They are not harmless pills. Kv > > > > > > Hi guys, > > > > > > I read your stories and all we are very angry because they didn¢t warn us about the sexual side effects before the use. > > > > > > Today I saw a professor psychiatrist, hospital manager and I put out my anger to him I told him that all of us who suffer with pssd are very angry with our doctors because they didn¢t warn us and they didn¢t give us a choice to do. I told him that they ought to warn the patients about the sexual side effects so as to have their update and make responsibly their choices and take their risks. > > > > > > He told me that the side effects are written in the instructions and I told him that the data there are not correct. In the instructions say that the sexual side effects are affect 1-10% but in the reality the percentage is higher 35-75% and also nowhere but nowhere it isn¢t written that the sexual dysfunction can be permanent after quitting the drug. I told him that many patients want to sue their doctors and he reply that only vindictive people want to sue others. Probably they don¢t understand that they destroyed our lives. > > > > > > The professor doesn¢t believe in pssd and he said that the body returns to normal after 20 days after quitting and he also said that I can¢t return to normal because I believe that my problem is from the drugs and I don¢t let my body to relax. He also told me to make a personality test in the hospital. He believes that all the people with the same problem have psychological themes and that all the doctors will agree with this He told me that he based on science and i told him that behind the science are the pharmas... > > > > > > For this shit he took me 120 euro He said that the only thing that he cares about is me and how to be ok again and not the money but he finally asked me 120 euro without thinking the economic crisis and the fact that I am without job and insurance > > > > > > Furthermore the reply to this from my first doctor was that it¢s not right to tell people about side effects before the use because they can have them through the autosuggestion. > > > > > > The comments are yours... > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2011 Report Share Posted October 2, 2011 Numbing the mind is not " success. " These drugs are no more effective than placebos. Are you saying that destroying the brains of 20% of their clients, is justified? Is evil justified in the name of profit? Greed and fraud are evil. Pharma is evil. I hope they get whats coming to them, in this life or the next. Re: Re: They didn't warn us! The fact that didn't work for you doesn't mean that they don't generally work. Antidepressants have a 80% success rate. You are on the other 20%. And certainly they are not harmless. No one claims that. > > > When I first went to see a psychiatrist I was very scared and worried. > I always had loads of friends but somehow I had gone into a depression > and I felt alienated from everyone. I knew that what had caused this > depression was a lifetime of low self esteem and feeling unatractive > which had finally caught up with me after I had a very traumatic > experience which greatly upset me. > > So the psychiatrist say's that I have a chemical imballance and that I > needed medication but I knew it was bollocks, and all I needed was > someone to talk to. So he gave me a prescription and told me to come > back in a month and my heart broke into despair because I knew drugs > could not help me, and what I needed was someone to talk to. > > The drugs did Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2011 Report Share Posted October 2, 2011 The fact that didn't work for you doesn't mean that they don't generally work. Antidepressants have a 80% success rate. You are on the other 20%. And certainly they are not harmless. No one claims that. When I first went to see a psychiatrist I was very scared and worried. I always had loads of friends but somehow I had gone into a depression and I felt alienated from everyone. I knew that what had caused this depression was a lifetime of low self esteem and feeling unatractive which had finally caught up with me after I had a very traumatic experience which greatly upset me. So the psychiatrist say's that I have a chemical imballance and that I needed medication but I knew it was bollocks, and all I needed was someone to talk to. So he gave me a prescription and told me to come back in a month and my heart broke into despair because I knew drugs could not help me, and what I needed was someone to talk to. The drugs did not work but only caused me more distress so I was put on more drugs. I'm was a young man and I so liked to look good, and this fucking git puts me on tablets that make me put on loads of weight causing me to worry more and feel even more unatractive. What the hell was he thinking? How could that make me feel better about myself? The tosser! So anyway, they then put more on more stuff to stop the worry, etc, and I'm so upset that so I carry on with the tablets hoping they might help, even if it makes no sense to me - plus I still believe that doctors are wise and clever. But I'm really hoping that they eventually will give me therapy when the meds don't work, but what I don't realise is that there is no other fucking treatment available. I knew nothing about brain biology and yet I knew that these fucking morons were completely wrong and that their treatment could never work, and so you can see that the placebo effect was never going to work on me. But the drugs went on to destroy my life just the same. They are not harmless pills. Kv > > > > > > Hi guys, > > > > > > I read your stories and all we are very angry because they didn¢t warn us about the sexual side effects before the use. > > > > > > Today I saw a professor psychiatrist, hospital manager and I put out my anger to him I told him that all of us who suffer with pssd are very angry with our doctors because they didn¢t warn us and they didn¢t give us a choice to do. I told him that they ought to warn the patients about the sexual side effects so as to have their update and make responsibly their choices and take their risks. > > > > > > He told me that the side effects are written in the instructions and I told him that the data there are not correct. In the instructions say that the sexual side effects are affect 1-10% but in the reality the percentage is higher 35-75% and also nowhere but nowhere it isn¢t written that the sexual dysfunction can be permanent after quitting the drug. I told him that many patients want to sue their doctors and he reply that only vindictive people want to sue others. Probably they don¢t understand that they destroyed our lives. > > > > > > The professor doesn¢t believe in pssd and he said that the body returns to normal after 20 days after quitting and he also said that I can¢t return to normal because I believe that my problem is from the drugs and I don¢t let my body to relax. He also told me to make a personality test in the hospital. He believes that all the people with the same problem have psychological themes and that all the doctors will agree with this He told me that he based on science and i told him that behind the science are the pharmas... > > > > > > For this shit he took me 120 euro He said that the only thing that he cares about is me and how to be ok again and not the money but he finally asked me 120 euro without thinking the economic crisis and the fact that I am without job and insurance > > > > > > Furthermore the reply to this from my first doctor was that it¢s not right to tell people about side effects before the use because they can have them through the autosuggestion. > > > > > > The comments are yours... > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2011 Report Share Posted October 2, 2011 Mind numbing is extremely common with antipsychotics, atypical or typical, especially on high doses. This is why they are prescribed only when strictly needed. You should withdraw your antipsychotic with the first sign of mind/soul numbness, as it does NOT lessen with time, it will only make you suffer. Many psychotic patients fall in depression because of this side effect. This side effect, though extremely common, it is not mentioned in any antipsychotic PI sheet. However psychiatrists are well aware of. But, yes, drugs are PROVED to be much more effective than placebos. They are not destroying brains, mind numbing is totally reversible upon antipsychotic removal. What may be NOT reversible are sexual side effects. Well at least not always. I don't care about greediness or their "evilness". I know they do it for profit. But I don't care about that. I only care to have my meds. And yes, some meds work great for me. However most don't. You may have to change many to find that which fits you. Numbing the mind is not "success." These drugs are no more effective than placebos. Are you saying that destroying the brains of 20% of their clients, is justified? Is evil justified in the name of profit? Greed and fraud are evil. Pharma is evil. I hope they get whats coming to them, in this life or the next. Re: Re: They didn't warn us! The fact that didn't work for you doesn't mean that they don't generally work. Antidepressants have a 80% success rate. You are on the other 20%. And certainly they are not harmless. No one claims that. > > > When I first went to see a psychiatrist I was very scared and worried. > I always had loads of friends but somehow I had gone into a depression > and I felt alienated from everyone. I knew that what had caused this > depression was a lifetime of low self esteem and feeling unatractive > which had finally caught up with me after I had a very traumatic > experience which greatly upset me. > > So the psychiatrist say's that I have a chemical imballance and that I > needed medication but I knew it was bollocks, and all I needed was > someone to talk to. So he gave me a prescription and told me to come > back in a month and my heart broke into despair because I knew drugs > could not help me, and what I needed was someone to talk to. > > The drugs did Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2011 Report Share Posted October 2, 2011 From where do you get that 80% figure? Kay > > > > > > > > > > Hi guys, > > > > > > > > > > I read your stories and all we are very angry because they > > didn¢t warn us about the sexual side effects before the use. > > > > > > > > > > Today I saw a professor psychiatrist, hospital manager and I put > > out my anger to him I told him that all of us who suffer with pssd > > are very angry with our doctors because they didn¢t warn us and they > > didn¢t give us a choice to do. I told him that they ought to warn the > > patients about the sexual side effects so as to have their update and > > make responsibly their choices and take their risks. > > > > > > > > > > He told me that the side effects are written in the instructions > > and I told him that the data there are not correct. In the > > instructions say that the sexual side effects are affect 1-10% but in > > the reality the percentage is higher 35-75% and also nowhere but > > nowhere it isn¢t written that the sexual dysfunction can be permanent > > after quitting the drug. I told him that many patients want to sue > > their doctors and he reply that only vindictive people want to sue > > others. Probably they don¢t understand that they destroyed our lives. > > > > > > > > > > The professor doesn¢t believe in pssd and he said that the body > > returns to normal after 20 days after quitting and he also said that I > > can¢t return to normal because I believe that my problem is from the > > drugs and I don¢t let my body to relax. He also told me to make a > > personality test in the hospital. He believes that all the people with > > the same problem have psychological themes and that all the doctors > > will agree with this He told me that he based on science and i told > > him that behind the science are the pharmas... > > > > > > > > > > For this shit he took me 120 euro He said that the only thing > > that he cares about is me and how to be ok again and not the money but > > he finally asked me 120 euro without thinking the economic crisis and > > the fact that I am without job and insurance > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore the reply to this from my first doctor was that it¢s > > not right to tell people about side effects before the use because > > they can have them through the autosuggestion. > > > > > > > > > > The comments are yours... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2011 Report Share Posted October 2, 2011 I think the people are sly enough to see this damn bastards writing here...and never take a pharma pill again ! but plz voran dont let them overrun this forum. its confusing enough... to find right information. > > Ioannis has come on here to defend pharma. He thinks they are on the side of the angels. We who disagree are morons, says he. Dr Breggin knows nothing, says he. I wish Vornan would not let apologists for pharma on this forum. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2011 Report Share Posted October 2, 2011 Hi Ioannis, 80% success??? Do you really believe it this? It¢s too high! Are you a psychiatrist? ) I will tell you my personal story. When I was on antidepressants I felt better, less stress and depression, felt happier so I believe that it was more than just a placebo effect. When I found out that I had sexual dysfunction I stopped the meds gradually and from then I have terrible withdrawals: bad headaches, brain damage, feel like zombie, emotional dullness, little akathesia and of course pssd So although I felt better when I was on the meds, the final result now is that I am 10 times more depressed, I have more problems than then, I feel frustrated from the doctors, hopeless and suicidal. SO THE FINAL RESULT IS NOT A SUCCESS!!! A MED WILL BE SUCCESSFUL ONLY WHEN YOU WILL FEEL BETTER WHILE YOU ARE ON IT AND WHEN YOU WILL CONTINUE TO FEEL BETTER AFTER DISCONTINUATION, WITHOUT SEVERE WITHDRAWALS AND WITHOUT SEVERE AND PERSISTENT SIDE-EFFECTS! - It¢s not a success if you feel better but you have sexual dysfunction. The final result will be more depression... - It¢s not success if you feel better but you put on 20-30 kilos. The final result will be again depression (especially if you are a woman) - It¢s not a success if you feel better but you also have for example akathesia. You will be mad. - It¢s not success if you feel better once but you have also 10 other side effects... I made a research and I didn¢t find one person to tell that is completely healed with the meds and now is still happy, back to the life without relapse or persistent side effects. The only thing I found was many people changed a lot of meds because of the side-effects in order to find those which will be good for them without the severe side-effects , I found people that changed meds because they didn¢t work for them, I found people who felt little better but they had relapse after discontinuation or very bad withdrawals and they forced to be again on the meds, I found people with persistent side-effects and mpla mpla.... I didn¢t find a complete therapy which means that you will still feel happy and better not only when you are on the therapy but and after of discontinuation without problems. I believe that there are few people who belong to this category. All the other patients have the hope ( may the illusion ) to be ok again with the help of the meds and they trust their arrogant doctors but they aren¢t in reality. And, unfortunately, I believe that the patients with the problems are 80% and not 20%. I read Ioannis that you take meds and that they work for you and I am happy for this. I wish you all the best and to be and feel better and after the discontinuation without problems and side-effects! Also I have a question for you: Do you have really pssd? And if so, are you angry with this? > > > > > > > > > > Hi guys, > > > > > > > > > > I read your stories and all we are very angry because they > > didn¢t warn us about the sexual side effects before the use. > > > > > > > > > > Today I saw a professor psychiatrist, hospital manager and I put > > out my anger to him I told him that all of us who suffer with pssd > > are very angry with our doctors because they didn¢t warn us and they > > didn¢t give us a choice to do. I told him that they ought to warn the > > patients about the sexual side effects so as to have their update and > > make responsibly their choices and take their risks. > > > > > > > > > > He told me that the side effects are written in the instructions > > and I told him that the data there are not correct. In the > > instructions say that the sexual side effects are affect 1-10% but in > > the reality the percentage is higher 35-75% and also nowhere but > > nowhere it isn¢t written that the sexual dysfunction can be permanent > > after quitting the drug. I told him that many patients want to sue > > their doctors and he reply that only vindictive people want to sue > > others. Probably they don¢t understand that they destroyed our lives. > > > > > > > > > > The professor doesn¢t believe in pssd and he said that the body > > returns to normal after 20 days after quitting and he also said that I > > can¢t return to normal because I believe that my problem is from the > > drugs and I don¢t let my body to relax. He also told me to make a > > personality test in the hospital. He believes that all the people with > > the same problem have psychological themes and that all the doctors > > will agree with this He told me that he based on science and i told > > him that behind the science are the pharmas... > > > > > > > > > > For this shit he took me 120 euro He said that the only thing > > that he cares about is me and how to be ok again and not the money but > > he finally asked me 120 euro without thinking the economic crisis and > > the fact that I am without job and insurance > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore the reply to this from my first doctor was that it¢s > > not right to tell people about side effects before the use because > > they can have them through the autosuggestion. > > > > > > > > > > The comments are yours... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2011 Report Share Posted October 2, 2011 What are you doing here, Ioannis? What do you want? This is a group about PSSD, not the efficacy of antipsychotics. And you are pulling statistics out of thin air. V > > > > > > > > > > Hi guys, > > > > > > > > > > I read your stories and all we are very angry because they > > didn¢t warn us about the sexual side effects before the use. > > > > > > > > > > Today I saw a professor psychiatrist, hospital manager and I put > > out my anger to him I told him that all of us who suffer with pssd > > are very angry with our doctors because they didn¢t warn us and they > > didn¢t give us a choice to do. I told him that they ought to warn the > > patients about the sexual side effects so as to have their update and > > make responsibly their choices and take their risks. > > > > > > > > > > He told me that the side effects are written in the instructions > > and I told him that the data there are not correct. In the > > instructions say that the sexual side effects are affect 1-10% but in > > the reality the percentage is higher 35-75% and also nowhere but > > nowhere it isn¢t written that the sexual dysfunction can be permanent > > after quitting the drug. I told him that many patients want to sue > > their doctors and he reply that only vindictive people want to sue > > others. Probably they don¢t understand that they destroyed our lives. > > > > > > > > > > The professor doesn¢t believe in pssd and he said that the body > > returns to normal after 20 days after quitting and he also said that I > > can¢t return to normal because I believe that my problem is from the > > drugs and I don¢t let my body to relax. He also told me to make a > > personality test in the hospital. He believes that all the people with > > the same problem have psychological themes and that all the doctors > > will agree with this He told me that he based on science and i told > > him that behind the science are the pharmas... > > > > > > > > > > For this shit he took me 120 euro He said that the only thing > > that he cares about is me and how to be ok again and not the money but > > he finally asked me 120 euro without thinking the economic crisis and > > the fact that I am without job and insurance > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore the reply to this from my first doctor was that it¢s > > not right to tell people about side effects before the use because > > they can have them through the autosuggestion. > > > > > > > > > > The comments are yours... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2011 Report Share Posted October 2, 2011 I came hear to hear how pssd could be treated, not to hear how users bash pharmaceutical companies, how enterprises conspire, how evil doctors are, and worse of all, that it is not worth taking meds. To the extent I am aware of, the antipsychotics can cause permanent sexual dysfunction. Correct me if I am wrong. I was taking escitalopram and risperdone, one of those caused my pssd. And it's not out of the air, that's what doctors told me. How do you disagree? Don't antidepressants cure depression? When I heard that "medication is bollocs" I felt it is better to advise someone to take some meds to cure depression, because I know by myself how terrible disease it is. What are you doing here, Ioannis? What do you want? This is a group about PSSD, not the efficacy of antipsychotics. And you are pulling statistics out of thin air. V > > > > > > > > > > Hi guys, > > > > > > > > > > I read your stories and all we are very angry because they > > didn¢t warn us about the sexual side effects before the use. > > > > > > > > > > Today I saw a professor psychiatrist, hospital manager and I put > > out my anger to him I told him that all of us who suffer with pssd > > are very angry with our doctors because they didn¢t warn us and they > > didn¢t give us a choice to do. I told him that they ought to warn the > > patients about the sexual side effects so as to have their update and > > make responsibly their choices and take their risks. > > > > > > > > > > He told me that the side effects are written in the instructions > > and I told him that the data there are not correct. In the > > instructions say that the sexual side effects are affect 1-10% but in > > the reality the percentage is higher 35-75% and also nowhere but > > nowhere it isn¢t written that the sexual dysfunction can be permanent > > after quitting the drug. I told him that many patients want to sue > > their doctors and he reply that only vindictive people want to sue > > others. Probably they don¢t understand that they destroyed our lives. > > > > > > > > > > The professor doesn¢t believe in pssd and he said that the body > > returns to normal after 20 days after quitting and he also said that I > > can¢t return to normal because I believe that my problem is from the > > drugs and I don¢t let my body to relax. He also told me to make a > > personality test in the hospital. He believes that all the people with > > the same problem have psychological themes and that all the doctors > > will agree with this He told me that he based on science and i told > > him that behind the science are the pharmas... > > > > > > > > > > For this shit he took me 120 euro He said that the only thing > > that he cares about is me and how to be ok again and not the money but > > he finally asked me 120 euro without thinking the economic crisis and > > the fact that I am without job and insurance > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore the reply to this from my first doctor was that it¢s > > not right to tell people about side effects before the use because > > they can have them through the autosuggestion. > > > > > > > > > > The comments are yours... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 3, 2011 Report Share Posted October 3, 2011 I don't disagree with you generally but I have heard countless people that they work for them. I know that people may relapse if they stop them too early and that they may have strong side effects. I am taking my meds for eight years and I will be taking them for my lifetime. If the side effects on you were so severe, you could try Wellbutrin which is milder and does not have sexual side effects, it actually may help. About pssd: I have anesthesia, both at my genitals and at my bottom and partial impotence. I am angry not at the evil pharmaceuticals but at my doctor. I told her my problems and she repeatedly insisted that it was the depression, not the meds. She told me that SSRI's impotence is temporary and escitalopram doesn't cause it at all. When she prescribed me Cialis and didn't work, she told me it was because it's psychological. Then I had a strong manic episode, and a doctor at the hospital told me that during mania I was supposed to have increased libido, not decreased. They diagnosed me as a bipolar, not depressive or borderline. I stopped all antidepressants and I'm taking lithium and lamictal and I feel much better. As I feel much better with meds, I want to tell people not to reject meds totally. And I know there are meds that don't cause PSSD. Hi Ioannis, 80% success??? Do you really believe it this? It¢s too high! Are you a psychiatrist? ) I will tell you my personal story. When I was on antidepressants I felt better, less stress and depression, felt happier so I believe that it was more than just a placebo effect. When I found out that I had sexual dysfunction I stopped the meds gradually and from then I have terrible withdrawals: bad headaches, brain damage, feel like zombie, emotional dullness, little akathesia and of course pssd So although I felt better when I was on the meds, the final result now is that I am 10 times more depressed, I have more problems than then, I feel frustrated from the doctors, hopeless and suicidal. SO THE FINAL RESULT IS NOT A SUCCESS!!! A MED WILL BE SUCCESSFUL ONLY WHEN YOU WILL FEEL BETTER WHILE YOU ARE ON IT AND WHEN YOU WILL CONTINUE TO FEEL BETTER AFTER DISCONTINUATION, WITHOUT SEVERE WITHDRAWALS AND WITHOUT SEVERE AND PERSISTENT SIDE-EFFECTS! - It¢s not a success if you feel better but you have sexual dysfunction. The final result will be more depression... - It¢s not success if you feel better but you put on 20-30 kilos. The final result will be again depression (especially if you are a woman) - It¢s not a success if you feel better but you also have for example akathesia. You will be mad. - It¢s not success if you feel better once but you have also 10 other side effects... I made a research and I didn¢t find one person to tell that is completely healed with the meds and now is still happy, back to the life without relapse or persistent side effects. The only thing I found was many people changed a lot of meds because of the side-effects in order to find those which will be good for them without the severe side-effects , I found people that changed meds because they didn¢t work for them, I found people who felt little better but they had relapse after discontinuation or very bad withdrawals and they forced to be again on the meds, I found people with persistent side-effects and mpla mpla.... I didn¢t find a complete therapy which means that you will still feel happy and better not only when you are on the therapy but and after of discontinuation without problems. I believe that there are few people who belong to this category. All the other patients have the hope ( may the illusion ) to be ok again with the help of the meds and they trust their arrogant doctors but they aren¢t in reality. And, unfortunately, I believe that the patients with the problems are 80% and not 20%. I read Ioannis that you take meds and that they work for you and I am happy for this. I wish you all the best and to be and feel better and after the discontinuation without problems and side-effects! Also I have a question for you: Do you have really pssd? And if so, are you angry with this? > > > > > > > > > > Hi guys, > > > > > > > > > > I read your stories and all we are very angry because they > > didn¢t warn us about the sexual side effects before the use. > > > > > > > > > > Today I saw a professor psychiatrist, hospital manager and I put > > out my anger to him I told him that all of us who suffer with pssd > > are very angry with our doctors because they didn¢t warn us and they > > didn¢t give us a choice to do. I told him that they ought to warn the > > patients about the sexual side effects so as to have their update and > > make responsibly their choices and take their risks. > > > > > > > > > > He told me that the side effects are written in the instructions > > and I told him that the data there are not correct. In the > > instructions say that the sexual side effects are affect 1-10% but in > > the reality the percentage is higher 35-75% and also nowhere but > > nowhere it isn¢t written that the sexual dysfunction can be permanent > > after quitting the drug. I told him that many patients want to sue > > their doctors and he reply that only vindictive people want to sue > > others. Probably they don¢t understand that they destroyed our lives. > > > > > > > > > > The professor doesn¢t believe in pssd and he said that the body > > returns to normal after 20 days after quitting and he also said that I > > can¢t return to normal because I believe that my problem is from the > > drugs and I don¢t let my body to relax. He also told me to make a > > personality test in the hospital. He believes that all the people with > > the same problem have psychological themes and that all the doctors > > will agree with this He told me that he based on science and i told > > him that behind the science are the pharmas... > > > > > > > > > > For this shit he took me 120 euro He said that the only thing > > that he cares about is me and how to be ok again and not the money but > > he finally asked me 120 euro without thinking the economic crisis and > > the fact that I am without job and insurance > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore the reply to this from my first doctor was that it¢s > > not right to tell people about side effects before the use because > > they can have them through the autosuggestion. > > > > > > > > > > The comments are yours... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 3, 2011 Report Share Posted October 3, 2011 I don't think that tryin to impress upon the Drs. that they might be wrong can ever achieve any success. If normal people find it almost impossible to do it, just think of trying to say to someone who probably has a big ego, is probably above average intelligence, has been treated as if he/she is knowledgeable and special. Someone who has had decades of education to deny that his road map is wrong from an ordinary mortal who he believes has mental issues coupled with the implication of the fact that if he is in fact wrong, everything he has built his worth on is empty. I do not believe that any of these Dr.'s ever considered reading up on any alternative sites and are completely sold on their medical bible plus this way is highly lucrative. Only thing we can do is use these Drs. intelligently and be our own final arbiter of what we choose to do with the information we collect and do our homework Unfortunately, life isn't fair.. Vinny PS: I have been on psych meds for 22 years and it has devestated my life. I did the best I knew at the time. Now I know better and act accordingly. What is done is done. Hope all of us continue to heal. Subject: Re: They didn't warn us!To: SSRIsex Date: Monday, October 3, 2011, 8:49 AM What are you doing here, Ioannis? What do you want? This is a group about PSSD, not the efficacy of antipsychotics. And you are pulling statistics out of thin air.V> > > > >> > > > > Hi guys,> > > > >> > > > > I read your stories and all we are very angry because they> > didn¢t warn us about the sexual side effects before the use.> > > > >> > > > > Today I saw a professor psychiatrist, hospital manager and I put> > out my anger to him I told him that all of us who suffer with pssd> > are very angry with our doctors because they didn¢t warn us and they> > didn¢t give us a choice to do. I told him that they ought to warn the> > patients about the sexual side effects so as to have their update and> > make responsibly their choices and take their risks.> > > > >> > > > > He told me that the side effects are written in the instructions> > and I told him that the data there are not correct. In the> > instructions say that the sexual side effects are affect 1-10% but in> > the reality the percentage is higher 35-75% and also nowhere but> > nowhere it isn¢t written that the sexual dysfunction can be permanent> > after quitting the drug. I told him that many patients want to sue> > their doctors and he reply that only vindictive people want to sue> > others. Probably they don¢t understand that they destroyed our lives.> > > > >> > > > > The professor doesn¢t believe in pssd and he said that the body> > returns to normal after 20 days after quitting and he also said that I> > can¢t return to normal because I believe that my problem is from the> > drugs and I don¢t let my body to relax. He also told me to make a> > personality test in the hospital. He believes that all the people with> > the same problem have psychological themes and that all the doctors> > will agree with this He told me that he based on science and i told> > him that behind the science are the pharmas...> > > > >> > > > > For this shit he took me 120 euro He said that the only thing> > that he cares about is me and how to be ok again and not the money but> > he finally asked me 120 euro without thinking the economic crisis and> > the fact that I am without job and insurance > > > > >> > > > > Furthermore the reply to this from my first doctor was that it¢s> > not right to tell people about side effects before the use because> > they can have them through the autosuggestion. > > > > >> > > > > The comments are yours...> > > > >> > > >> > >> >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 3, 2011 Report Share Posted October 3, 2011 NO, ANTIDEPRESSANTS DONT CURE DEPRESSION! You cant feel your penis because of them! Why do you regard people like me as the enemy? Did I give you numb genitals? I suffered depression for years. This is 100 times worse than depression. Granted i am not anxious like i used to be, THATS BECAUSE I FEEL NOTHING! The clinical trials you spoke of are done by pharma! They certify the safety of their own product. I call that a conflict of interest! Lithium may numb your mind so you can function, but thats not mental health. Read Dr. Breggins books. He does know the truth. Why is pharma not guilty in your view? Isnt the crack dealer responsible for the crack baby? They lock up folks who deal weed, but criminals in suits who hock prozac sit on the chamber of commerce. Mind altering drugs are bad for people. Thats the simple truth. I am not your enemy. I am a fellow sufferer. alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 3, 2011 Report Share Posted October 3, 2011 Hi Ioannis, These drugs can numb some of the pain for a while but they usually lead to worsening of symptoms in the long run because the brain gets used to the medication and so the dose needs to be increased. The brain fights back but this also fails in the end because the drug effect wears off as the brain makes disasterous changes. It is highly likely that the drugs you took caused your bipoalr illness, which is a very severe condition and often dificult to treat successfully in the long term. Many people have started out like you believing in what doctors say but end up suffering a lifetime of misery instead. I don't know anyone who takes meds for years on end and still feels okay; they still hurt but say that things get worse when they stop the meds, so they think the meds are helping a bit. Really what has happened is that their brain can't function without meds due to addiction, but their brains have been damaged by the meds and so they remain stuck in a medicated limbo world devoid of any real passion or zest. Their lives are usualy about more and more drugs, weight gain, and physical illnesses, like diabetes, which thse drugs tend to cause. Most of us here have decided to give up meds and go through the pain instead believing that this is our best chance for a cure for both PSSD and our nervous/ depressive illnesses, or whatever. We are all different, and some people's pain and pessimism might mean that they prefer the drugs, but the price paid can be huge. http://www.furiousseasons.com/archives/2009/02/study_antidepressants_cause_mania_in_bipolar_disorder.html Study: Anti-Depressants Cause Mania In Bipolar Disorder Regular readers know that I've been hammering on the use of anti-depressants in bipolar disorder and how the drugs cause mania and hypomania in some patients. My view is that these drugs should go from being standard treatment in bipolar disorder to being used as rarely as possible. Some researchers such as Tufts' Nassir Ghaemi have been brave enough to write about this as well, and during the recent NIH-funded STEP-BD study, we learned that placebo outperforms anti-depressants in treating bipolar depression and that the drugs increased manic symptoms severity. All of these points run counter to what most psychiatrists and doctors think they know about anti-depressant use in bipolar disorder. Hell, as I noted yesterday, there are docs who uses drug-caused mania to diagnose bipolar disorder (crazy, but true). Last week, a new study came out in the American Journal of Psychiatry and made it crystal clear that there's drug-induced mania and hypomania in the land. The study was lead-authored by Mark Frye of the Mayo Clinic and you should check out his and his co-authors' reported pharma funding at the end of the study, because it's a long list. That said, the study found that in a trial of anti-depressants in 176 adults, 44 people (25 percent) developed treatment-emergent mania, 44 people (25 percent) had no response whatsoever to anti-depressants used during the 10-week trial while 84 had some level of response to anti-depressants. Drugs used were Wellbutrin, Zoloft and Effexor. One wonders if the treatment-induced mania number wouldn't have been higher had Paxil been used. Patients were also on a mood stabilizer of some kind or an antipsychotic. There was no placebo control arm. Two things leap out at me. A 50 percent chance of having an anti-depressant be ineffective or cause mania is a stunningly high rate as is the 25 percent mania induction figure. A one in four chance of inducing mania in patients for a drug regimen that doesn't work really well doesn't strike me as a risk most informed patients would want to take. But to each, their own. By the way, nothing I've written here argues that depression (or bipolar depression) doesn't exist or that people shouldn't take it seriously (they should). It's just pointing out yet again that anti-depressants are a weak technology and simply aren't getting the job done. > > > > > >> > > > > > Hi guys,> > > > > >> > > > > > I read your stories and all we are very angry because they> > > didn¢t warn us about the sexual side effects before the use.> > > > > >> > > > > > Today I saw a professor psychiatrist, hospital manager and I put> > > out my anger to him I told him that all of us who suffer with pssd> > > are very angry with our doctors because they didn¢t warn us and they> > > didn¢t give us a choice to do. I told him that they ought to warn the> > > patients about the sexual side effects so as to have their update and> > > make responsibly their choices and take their risks.> > > > > >> > > > > > He told me that the side effects are written in the instructions> > > and I told him that the data there are not correct. In the> > > instructions say that the sexual side effects are affect 1-10% but in> > > the reality the percentage is higher 35-75% and also nowhere but> > > nowhere it isn¢t written that the sexual dysfunction can be permanent> > > after quitting the drug. I told him that many patients want to sue> > > their doctors and he reply that only vindictive people want to sue> > > others. Probably they don¢t understand that they destroyed our lives.> > > > > >> > > > > > The professor doesn¢t believe in pssd and he said that the body> > > returns to normal after 20 days after quitting and he also said that I> > > can¢t return to normal because I believe that my problem is from the> > > drugs and I don¢t let my body to relax. He also told me to make a> > > personality test in the hospital. He believes that all the people with> > > the same problem have psychological themes and that all the doctors> > > will agree with this He told me that he based on science and i told> > > him that behind the science are the pharmas...> > > > > >> > > > > > For this shit he took me 120 euro He said that the only thing> > > that he cares about is me and how to be ok again and not the money but> > > he finally asked me 120 euro without thinking the economic crisis and> > > the fact that I am without job and insurance > > > > > >> > > > > > Furthermore the reply to this from my first doctor was that it¢s> > > not right to tell people about side effects before the use because> > > they can have them through the autosuggestion. > > > > > >> > > > > > The comments are yours...> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> > >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 3, 2011 Report Share Posted October 3, 2011 Dear Kaivey, You are the first to treat me kindly. Others suggest that I am here to conspire in favor of pharmaceutical companies and against patients. One other told me I am damn bastard. I appreciate your kindness. Regarding the study you attached: Anti-depressants are very well known to cause mania. They don't cause the bipolar illness, but trigger and exacerbrate its symptoms. They may also cause psychotic symptoms. I was mistakenly prescribed anti-depressants because doctors believed I had major depression and borderline while I was simply bipolar or at least so believes my recent doc. No, my illness was not caused by meds. I am a victim of domestic abuse for approx. 20 years. Lithium and Lamictal saved my life. I mean that both literally and metaphorically. Literally because I was highly suicidal, I have made 4 attempts, one of them very serious. Also I stopped cutting my arms and playing with my blood. Metaphorically, because the dysphoria was gone, I sleep way much better, I stopped beating my parents, I stopped running frantically and jumping over the furniture and screaming, my dissociation and derealization is gone, I stopped seeing hallucinations and stopped hearing non-exitant music, etc. I have tried 15 anti-depressants, had no chance at all. I just got my PSSD from escitalopram and from Remeron I got about 60kg (132lb) of body weight. I was not informed about that. I tried all atypal antipsychotics but Zyprexa, only Risperdal worked, but it was numbing my soul, it "blocked" my mind so I quit it. Indeed when I remove my mood stabilizers, I get depressive within one or two weeks. So I will keep them for my lifetime. My PSSD was not caused by Lithium or Lamictal, it was caused by escitalopram (Lexapro/Cipralex). So the only real side effect I have from the mood stabilizers are polydypsia and polyuria. At sometimes I go to toilet every 5 mins. I may consume 4-10 liters or more of water a day. At the first weeks I had so intense trembling that sometimes I could step on the stairs, things well falling from my hands and I got wet when I was trying to drink from a cup. You've seen old people having Parkinsson's? Like that! Thankfully it could be condrolled by Inderal (a heart pressure med) and now it's gone. But the gain I got from lithium, is well worth the side effects. I strongly believe that depressive people should take meds. There are meds that don't cause sexual side effects. Wellbutrin for example. Also Remeron also but that causes weight gain. Also I heard an SSRI that was introduced in the US, Viibrid (vilazodone) who is supposed not to harm sex. If it is proved by time, I will try it. But even if you insist not to take meds, you could have psychotherapy. That helped me with my shame, anxiety and my OCD. I am very optimist, that given time, new meds will be developed, that are efficient and do not cause sexual side effects. That's just my story, it is my opinion. You know what they tell about opinions: "Opinions are like buttholes -- everybody has one" So I am entitled to my own. There is no reason to be treated as a pharma conspirator. Whatever I told, I did it because I honestly believed that it would be helpful. I don't take money from companies, check my facebook page, I am a computer engineer, not a doctor or a pharmacist. Hi Ioannis, These drugs can numb some of the pain for a while but they usually lead to worsening of symptoms in the long run because the brain gets used to the medication and so the dose needs to be increased. The brain fights back but this also fails in the end because the drug effect wears off as the brain makes disasterous changes. It is highly likely that the drugs you took caused your bipoalr illness, which is a very severe condition and often dificult to treat successfully in the long term. Many people have started out like you believing in what doctors say but end up suffering a lifetime of misery instead. I don't know anyone who takes meds for years on end and still feels okay; they still hurt but say that things get worse when they stop the meds, so they think the meds are helping a bit. Really what has happened is that their brain can't function without meds due to addiction, but their brains have been damaged by the meds and so they remain stuck in a medicated limbo world devoid of any real passion or zest. Their lives are usualy about more and more drugs, weight gain, and physical illnesses, like diabetes, which thse drugs tend to cause. Most of us here have decided to give up meds and go through the pain instead believing that this is our best chance for a cure for both PSSD and our nervous/ depressive illnesses, or whatever. We are all different, and some people's pain and pessimism might mean that they prefer the drugs, but the price paid can be huge. http://www.furiousseasons.com/archives/2009/02/study_antidepressants_cause_mania_in_bipolar_disorder.html Study: Anti-Depressants Cause Mania In Bipolar Disorder Regular readers know that I've been hammering on the use of anti-depressants in bipolar disorder and how the drugs cause mania and hypomania in some patients. My view is that these drugs should go from being standard treatment in bipolar disorder to being used as rarely as possible. Some researchers such as Tufts' Nassir Ghaemi have been brave enough to write about this as well, and during the recent NIH-funded STEP-BD study, we learned that placebo outperforms anti-depressants in treating bipolar depression and that the drugs increased manic symptoms severity. All of these points run counter to what most psychiatrists and doctors think they know about anti-depressant use in bipolar disorder. Hell, as I noted yesterday, there are docs who uses drug-caused mania to diagnose bipolar disorder (crazy, but true). Last week, a new study came out in the American Journal of Psychiatry and made it crystal clear that there's drug-induced mania and hypomania in the land. The study was lead-authored by Mark Frye of the Mayo Clinic and you should check out his and his co-authors' reported pharma funding at the end of the study, because it's a long list. That said, the study found that in a trial of anti-depressants in 176 adults, 44 people (25 percent) developed treatment-emergent mania, 44 people (25 percent) had no response whatsoever to anti-depressants used during the 10-week trial while 84 had some level of response to anti-depressants. Drugs used were Wellbutrin, Zoloft and Effexor. One wonders if the treatment-induced mania number wouldn't have been higher had Paxil been used. Patients were also on a mood stabilizer of some kind or an antipsychotic. There was no placebo control arm. Two things leap out at me. A 50 percent chance of having an anti-depressant be ineffective or cause mania is a stunningly high rate as is the 25 percent mania induction figure. A one in four chance of inducing mania in patients for a drug regimen that doesn't work really well doesn't strike me as a risk most informed patients would want to take. But to each, their own. By the way, nothing I've written here argues that depression (or bipolar depression) doesn't exist or that people shouldn't take it seriously (they should). It's just pointing out yet again that anti-depressants are a weak technology and simply aren't getting the job done. > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi guys, > > > > > > > > > > > > I read your stories and all we are very angry because they > > > didn¢t warn us about the sexual side effects before the use. > > > > > > > > > > > > Today I saw a professor psychiatrist, hospital manager and I put > > > out my anger to him I told him that all of us who suffer with pssd > > > are very angry with our doctors because they didn¢t warn us and they > > > didn¢t give us a choice to do. I told him that they ought to warn the > > > patients about the sexual side effects so as to have their update and > > > make responsibly their choices and take their risks. > > > > > > > > > > > > He told me that the side effects are written in the instructions > > > and I told him that the data there are not correct. In the > > > instructions say that the sexual side effects are affect 1-10% but in > > > the reality the percentage is higher 35-75% and also nowhere but > > > nowhere it isn¢t written that the sexual dysfunction can be permanent > > > after quitting the drug. I told him that many patients want to sue > > > their doctors and he reply that only vindictive people want to sue > > > others. Probably they don¢t understand that they destroyed our lives. > > > > > > > > > > > > The professor doesn¢t believe in pssd and he said that the body > > > returns to normal after 20 days after quitting and he also said that I > > > can¢t return to normal because I believe that my problem is from the > > > drugs and I don¢t let my body to relax. He also told me to make a > > > personality test in the hospital. He believes that all the people with > > > the same problem have psychological themes and that all the doctors > > > will agree with this He told me that he based on science and i told > > > him that behind the science are the pharmas... > > > > > > > > > > > > For this shit he took me 120 euro He said that the only thing > > > that he cares about is me and how to be ok again and not the money but > > > he finally asked me 120 euro without thinking the economic crisis and > > > the fact that I am without job and insurance > > > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore the reply to this from my first doctor was that it¢s > > > not right to tell people about side effects before the use because > > > they can have them through the autosuggestion. > > > > > > > > > > > > The comments are yours... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 3, 2011 Report Share Posted October 3, 2011 Hi Ioannis, I also get annoyed with the conspiracy theories I hear on here. That said there is a fair amount of published research showing SSRIs don't work very well except for in a minority of people. Its interesting to me as I am a geneticist. There is a genetic variant that has been tied to SSRI effectiveness. The allele frequency of the variant that means SSRIs won't work is about 70% if I recall correctly. That means 49% of people will be homozygous for the allele that means SSRIs won't work. 2*.7*.3, 42% of people will have a heterozygous phenotype (This could mean some effectiveness its hard to say) and 9% of people will see some positive effects from SSRIs. My guess is that in clinical studies, that 9% plus some of the heterozygotes for which SSRIs work (probably a certain percentage of them) make the slight differences that make the drugs appear to work. However for around half or more of people there is not going to be much benefit at all. I am a homozygote for the allele that suggests the drugs won't work. This isn't perfect. The allele isn't 100% penetrant (that is the trait is more complex than just that one gene, but there is a decent correlation, something like 7x more likely to see a positive response if you are a homozygote for the allele that makes SSRIs more effective Here are some of the things from 23andMe.com, the company that genotyped me. " Journal Neuron Study Size Replications None Contrary Studies None Applicable Ethnicities European Marker rs2032583 In this study, researchers examined 435 people who had been diagnosed with depression and treated with different anti-depressants. Of the 435, 133 were prescribed one of four common antidepressants – amitriptyline (Elavil), paroxetine (Paxil), venlafaxine (Effexor) and citalopram (Celexa). Researchers found two SNPs in the gene ABCB1, including rs2032583, that were significantly associated with the likelihood that a person would experience a remission of depression symptoms after taking one of those four antidepressants; the drugs were more likely to be effective among people with at least one G at rs2032583. The effect may be due to the fact that ABCB1 encodes a protein that is involved in ferrying substances across the blood-brain barrier, which protects the central nervous system from potentially dangerous substances in the rest of the body. " And the citation. Uhr M et al. (2008) . " Polymorphisms in the Drug Transporter Gene ABCB1 Predict Antidepressant Treatment Response in Depression. " Neuron 57(2):203-9. " Journal Neuropsychopharmacology Study Size Replications None Contrary Studies None Applicable Ethnicities European Marker rs6311 Anywhere from 20-70% of people taking a class of antidepressants called selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs) experience sexual side effects. In this study, researchers asked 81 people taking an SSRI (citalopram (Celexa), escitalopram (Lexapro), fluoxetine (Prozac), paroxetine (Paxil), or sertraline (Zoloft)) to take a self-administered survey about their sexual function. The subjects in this study were neither clinically depressed nor anxious. Based on adjusted scores from this survey, people with the CC genotype at rs6311 had 3.6 times greater odds of being categorized as having sexual dysfunction than people with the CT or TT genotype " And the citation Bishop JR et al. (2006) . " Serotonin 2A -1438 G/A and G-protein Beta3 subunit C825T polymorphisms in patients with depression and SSRI-associated sexual side-effects. " Neuropsychopharmacology 31(10):2281-8. Interestingly I am the CT genotype for this one though so supposedly my response should be more likely to be typical. If any of you get genotyped it would be interesting to see what you have in these positions. My guess is we will have more people with CC and maybe CT. 23andMe is currently doing a study on the genetics of SSRI side effects. I really encourage some of you to consider doing it. The more people that participate the more likely they will find something linked to sexual dysfunction. Anyhow just a thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi guys, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I read your stories and all we are very angry because they > > > > > didn¢t warn us about the sexual side effects before the use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Today I saw a professor psychiatrist, hospital manager and > > I put > > > > > out my anger to him I told him that all of us who suffer with > > pssd > > > > > are very angry with our doctors because they didn¢t warn us and they > > > > > didn¢t give us a choice to do. I told him that they ought to > > warn the > > > > > patients about the sexual side effects so as to have their > > update and > > > > > make responsibly their choices and take their risks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > He told me that the side effects are written in the > > instructions > > > > > and I told him that the data there are not correct. In the > > > > > instructions say that the sexual side effects are affect 1-10% > > but in > > > > > the reality the percentage is higher 35-75% and also nowhere but > > > > > nowhere it isn¢t written that the sexual dysfunction can be > > permanent > > > > > after quitting the drug. I told him that many patients want to sue > > > > > their doctors and he reply that only vindictive people want to sue > > > > > others. Probably they don¢t understand that they destroyed our > > lives. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The professor doesn¢t believe in pssd and he said that the > > body > > > > > returns to normal after 20 days after quitting and he also said > > that I > > > > > can¢t return to normal because I believe that my problem is from the > > > > > drugs and I don¢t let my body to relax. He also told me to make a > > > > > personality test in the hospital. He believes that all the > > people with > > > > > the same problem have psychological themes and that all the doctors > > > > > will agree with this He told me that he based on science and > > i told > > > > > him that behind the science are the pharmas... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For this shit he took me 120 euro He said that the only > > thing > > > > > that he cares about is me and how to be ok again and not the > > money but > > > > > he finally asked me 120 euro without thinking the economic > > crisis and > > > > > the fact that I am without job and insurance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore the reply to this from my first doctor was > > that it¢s > > > > > not right to tell people about side effects before the use because > > > > > they can have them through the autosuggestion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The comments are yours... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 4, 2011 Report Share Posted October 4, 2011 Hi, Clinical trials are supposed to be randomized. They cannot hire a patient knowing his genes type. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 4, 2011 Report Share Posted October 4, 2011 That isn't the point. The point is the diversity in people exists, and 70% of people won't respond. Statistically if 30% do respond, that is enough to show a difference between the two groups and thus the drug will be approved even if it doesn't work for the majority of people. Now because things are randomized some studies likely look better than others. This is indeed the case with some studies showing decent effectiveness and others showing the SSRIs don't work at all. I believe SSRIs do work, but for a minority of people. Read my other post on genetics. There is also an interesting review article I just posted. I don't believe in conspiracy theories, just the blatant fact that there is genetic diversity in our population and thus SSRIs will work for some and not others. There are plenty of studies that show they don't work better than placebo and a decent number that show they do. If there is indeed this genetic heterogeneity in the population it would explain the difference. In the future doctors will prescribe drugs to people based off their genotype. Its already happening to some degree and is a very active area of research at my graduate school. > > Hi, > Clinical trials are supposed to be *randomized*. > They cannot hire a patient knowing his genes type. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 4, 2011 Report Share Posted October 4, 2011 I full agree with you mate !!! > > NO, ANTIDEPRESSANTS DONT CURE DEPRESSION! You cant feel your penis because of them! Why do you regard people like me as the enemy? Did I give you numb genitals? I suffered depression for years. This is 100 times worse than depression. Granted i am not anxious like i used to be, THATS BECAUSE I FEEL NOTHING! The clinical trials you spoke of are done by pharma! They certify the safety of their own product. I call that a conflict of interest! Lithium may numb your mind so you can function, but thats not mental health. Read Dr. Breggins books. He does know the truth. Why is pharma not guilty in your view? Isnt the crack dealer responsible for the crack baby? They lock up folks who deal weed, but criminals in suits who hock prozac sit on the chamber of commerce. Mind altering drugs are bad for people. Thats the simple truth. I am not your enemy. I am a fellow sufferer. > > alex > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 4, 2011 Report Share Posted October 4, 2011 When a minority of insiders know the truth, but instead promote lies to a majority of outsiders, i call that a conspiracy. Pharma knows the truth about psych meds, but they lie so as to make mammon. They exploit the suffering of those in pain, so as to reap profits from blood money. That guy on this forum who killed himself, died because of pharma. His blood is on their hands. They are conspirators. There are a lot of conspiracies in this world. Communism was one of them, pharma is another. Communism is dead, lets hope pharma is on the ash heap of history one day. alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 4, 2011 Report Share Posted October 4, 2011 Doctors won't believe us due to the law of large numbers. There are millions of people who take these medications, and we only have a few thousand people in this group. We have become insignificant in there eyes because we are such a rare occurence and the medications have seemingly helped so many people despite people like us. It's bullshit but its the truth. > > Hi, > Clinical trials are supposed to be *randomized*. > They cannot hire a patient knowing his genes type. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 5, 2011 Report Share Posted October 5, 2011 I suspect the number of people affected by PSSD is far higher than membership to this group. My roommate, the only other person I know in the real world who has taken an SSRI, also has PSSD. Seems like a mighty big coincidence for such supposedly small numbers. > > > > Hi, > > Clinical trials are supposed to be *randomized*. > > They cannot hire a patient knowing his genes type. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2011 Report Share Posted October 7, 2011 This may sound crazy but I went for years not realising I had PSSD. I deeply suspected that antidpressants had caused it as it coincided with my sexual dysfunction but my doctor would have none of it suggesting that I might still be depressed, have high stress levels, or just haven't found the right person yet, etc. I saw three different doctors at my surgery who all said the same thing. I had never read about permanent sexual dysfunction caused from using antidpepressants anywhere, neither had I come across it on the web. But I had no passion for women anymore in a general way too, i.e, dancing with a stunning woman had no thrill to it. One day I was surfing the net when this charleton was advertising his '3 minute depression cure' where he warned of the dangers of medication including permanent sexual dysfuction. That got me interested so I started searching for this and then found a PSSD article afterwhich I discoverd the SSRISex site. I then became deelpy depressed for a while because I always held the belief that my continuuing anxiety was the cause of my loss of sex drive. I never mentioned my PSSD to work colleagues, friends, or family. I did have a girlfriend but there was not much sex anynore and she seemed to not care (but you never know what people are really thinking do you and she left me in the end). PSSD is just not something you don't go around telling people so there may be many more people out there, who, like me, are just completely baffled about what has happened to them as well as being embarressed about it. By the way, I found out that from an interent search that after paying your money for the the '3 minute depression cure', you were told to eat a load of chilli peppers and then you would forget your depression for 3 miniutes. A complete scam! But it had to be, didn't it? Kv > > > >> > > > Hi,> > > > Clinical trials are supposed to be *randomized*.> > > > They cannot hire a patient knowing his genes type.> > > >> > >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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