Re: What is expected with an EPISODE?

[Guest guest]

Are you on a sodium restriction? My hepatologist has me on under 2000mg of

sodium a day.

Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

Re: What is expected with an EPISODE?

Gail, you’ve given me something to do that will definitely help. I’ll start

keeping a record of what I eat – everything.

Too often around here it’s catch-as-catch-can because trips to the store or

even cooking something to eat are beyond my energy level – not enough spoons

to get it done!

I avoid fast-foods and Wal-Mart and other big stores. Can’t stand to see

America turned over to corporations – so that is standing me in good stead

at present. For awhile in the late ’80’s I worked at Long Silvers and

one of the sinful things done by the crew was to batter the past due (can’t

serve them after so many minutes) french fries with the fish batter and

re-fry them. Delicious but scary! We didn’t do it often. So BK discovered

that, eh?

So, questions now about cheese, pickles, sauerkraut, condiments. I don’t do

any MSG whatsoever (except on those rare visits to the Chinese buffet!)

After a while, with a record, I’ll know what to avoid. The “episodes” are

totally debilitating and I have a lot to do just to keep my head above the

surface.

Entropy sets in around here at a rate you wouldn’t believe. Nevermind – yes,

you would believe! We’re all bothered with that. There are some things that

simply cannot be left undone.

I’ll start that notebook first thing in the morning.

Thanks again to you ALL for the help I’m getting!

“I cannot and will not cut my conscience to fit this year’s fashions.” -

Lillian Hellman

- - - - -

Re: What is expected with an EPISODE?

Posted by: " gail ann " zeena3963@... zeena3963

Date: Tue Oct 16, 2007 6:48 pm ((PDT))

Hi ,

My episodes go two ways. Usually I have what i call a liver attack on day

one. Usually to eating something my liver doesn't like. My liver swells

up, hurts and i look 10 months pregnant within 2 hours of eating something i

shouldn't. (more on that later)

Day 2 is a migraine from hell. Day 3 is fatigue and dehydration sets in.

This day I call a liver hangover.

How i found what i cant eat was keeping track of what i ate and what would

set my liver off. My toxins are anything with white flour, artificial

sweeteners or meats and dairy with hormones. So I get free range chicken,

turkey and eggs. I also cannot drink pepsi, orange pop or ice teas with

dyes in them. Around here Jilberts milk and dairy products are hormone

free.

To improve my liver I eat things that are good for me.... lots of

(especially green ) veggies & fruits. Drinking water w/ lemon or lemonade

helps me also. I try to make as much as i can by scratch and stay away from

MSG things. It is really hard to watch, but once you start it gets easier.

I read the labels on everything. Example, did you know that at burger

king, they coat their fries with white flour??? Thats their secret to making

them crispy.

Everyone who has a liver disease has different toxins than the other person.

Example: I know someone who cant eat potatoes of any kind and i can. And

yet he could eat pizza and i cant.

I also found that laying down when my liver/tummy swells up with a heating

pad on my liver, helps with the pain and relaxes it and me!!!!

I'm in the middle of a episode now. But this time it was different for me.

Yesterday I had a horrid migraine, today is the liver swelling. And I know

tomorrow will bring me fatigue and maybe dehydration. I think is was

different this time cuz I have had a very stressful week.

The best advice I can give you is to LISTEN TO YOUR BODY. Try to eat the

things that are the best for you liver. I also take milk thistle (vitamin)

and just started taking flaxseed oil capsules.

Hope some of this may help you.

Take care, gail

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Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.12/1073 - Release Date: 10/16/2007

8:22 AM

[Guest guest]

I refuse to take pain meds. With arthritis since my 30’s, I took aspirin. My

doctor in Florida (the last good pcp I’ve had) told me to avoid all other

meds until aspirin just didn’t work any more. He said the side effects of

“arthritis pain meds” were too bad to even consider them until/unless they

became a last resort. Of course that aspirin came back to kick me in the

head later. I can touch NO aspirin now since the Plavix bleeding.

Then in Tennessee, the doc had me get cortisone shots in my hip, which

necessitated a trip to Nashville, etc. My hip felt like it was being ground

down.

So I asked if the cortisone actually helped the condition and if I didn’t

get it would it cause further deterioration and what if I didn’t get it at

all. His answer was that it helped pain for a while, no further

deterioration occurred during the painful periods, and the painful times

would “come and go.” I decided then to tough it. Been doing that ever since.

I am philosophically opposed to covering symptoms with pain meds. Of course

that may be because the pain hasn’t gotten that bad. And just because I

tough it and have, it seems, a high pain threshold, that doesn’t mean I

think others should do the same. Not by a long shot. We’re all unique in our

needs.

As long as I can, I’ll continue to just curl up and hibernate when I must

and tough it while I can. It’s the long days and nights of just feeling

“sicky” and energy-less that bother me horribly.

I look around at all I must do – dishes piled up, stuff dropped and never

picked up, floors needing mopping, etc. that dishearten me.

Maybe I’ll find a boarder who’s a clean-freak. Maybe that’s not a bad idea!

There are pleasant things I want to do, too, but if I do the necessary

first, there’s no energy left for the fun!

The decline in our standard of living may not be a sign of economic failure;

rather, it may be part of the cure for our economic ills. -- Hawken in

The Next Economy

- - - - -

Re: What is expected with an EPISODE?

Posted by: " Bob Aragon " robwalkingeagle@... robwalkingeagle

Date: Tue Oct 16, 2007 7:50 pm ((PDT))

I sterted to have pain like you describe last summer, and i tried to keep

track of what I thought it was. At first th doctor had me convinced that I

had an ulcer. So I started to study acid foods., I went on a low acid diet

for a while. Then she convinced me that I had gallbladder disease, so I went

on a low fat diet. I was never really convinced, but I was in so much pain,

and so sick, I would do just about anything to feel better. Now , my

hepstologist has me on a low sodium diet. I eat fat, but in moderation. I

eat meat, fish, chicken but in moderation. I am on a new pain drug that is

very effective at this dose. It is the first time in a year solid that I

have had a long mostly pain free day. I still had to be still because i was

afraid to activate the pain, but i will become more and more active as time

goes by., God willing.

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Checked by AVG Free Edition.

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8:22 AM

[Guest guest]

My latest doctor (the one who fired me) said there was NOTHING to do or

change or eat.

I have appointment with new doctor on November 2. He will probably send me

to a specialist. I hope.

However, I do not consume much sodium since I watch it for myself. Use sea

salt only.

I'm so low in use of salt that almost everything is too salty for me.

The decline in our standard of living may not be a sign of economic failure;

rather, it may be part of the cure for our economic ills. -- Hawken in

The Next Economy

- - - - -

Re: What is expected with an EPISODE?

Posted by: " robwalkingeagle@... " robwalkingeagle@...

robwalkingeagle

Date: Tue Oct 16, 2007 9:47 pm ((PDT))

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9:38 AM

[Guest guest]

What's the pain medication that you're on?

Colleen

Bob Aragon wrote:

I sterted to have pain like you describe last summer, and i tried to keep

track of what I thought it was. At first th doctor had me convinced that I had

an ulcer. So I started to study acid foods., I went on a low acid diet for a

while. Then she convinced me that I had gallbladder disease, so I went on a low

fat diet. I was never really convinced, but I was in so much pain, and so sick,

I would do just about anything to feel better. Now , my hepstologist has me on a

low sodium diet. I eat fat, but in moderation. I eat meat, fish, chicken but in

moderation. I am on a new pain drug that is very effective at this dose. It is

the first time in a year solid that I have had a long mostly pain free day. I

still had to be still because i was afraid to activate the pain, but i will

become more and more active as time goes by., God willing.

Re: What is expected with an EPISODE?

Hi ,

My episodes go two ways. Usually I have what i call a liver attack on day one.

Usually to eating something my liver doesn't like. My liver swells up, hurts and

i look 10 months pregnant within 2 hours of eating something i shouldn't. (more

on that later)

Day 2 is a migraine from hell. Day 3 is fatigue and dehydration sets in. This

day I call a liver hangover.

How i found what i cant eat was keeping track of what i ate and what would set

my liver off. My toxins are anything with white flour, artificial sweeteners or

meats and dairy with hormones. So I get free range chicken, turkey and eggs. I

also cannot drink pepsi, orange pop or ice teas with dyes in them. Around here

Jilberts milk and dairy products are hormone free.

To improve my liver I eat things that are good for me.... lots of (especially

green ) veggies & fruits. Drinking water w/ lemon or lemonade helps me also. I

try to make as much as i can by scratch and stay away from MSG things. It is

really hard to watch, but once you start it gets easier. I read the labels on

everything. Example, did you know that at burger king, they coat their fries

with white flour??? Thats their secret to making them crispy.

Everyone who has a liver disease has different toxins than the other person.

Example: I know someone who cant eat potatoes of any kind and i can. And yet he

could eat pizza and i cant.

I also found that laying down when my liver/tummy swells up with a heating pad

on my liver, helps with the pain and relaxes it and me!!!!

I'm in the middle of a episode now. But this time it was different for me.

Yesterday I had a horrid migraine, today is the liver swelling. And I know

tomorrow will bring me fatigue and maybe dehydration. I think is was different

this time cuz I have had a very stressful week.

The best advice I can give you is to LISTEN TO YOUR BODY. Try to eat the things

that are the best for you liver. I also take milk thistle (vitamin) and just

started taking flaxseed oil capsules.

Hope some of this may help you.

Take care, gail

Bracewell wrote: About “episodes” – what can I expect? I have had some

days when sudden

overwhelming and debilitating nausea has simply overcome me to the point

that I HAVE to go to bed and concentrate on going into suspended animation.

[is that self-hypnosis? ]

The fatigue is almost always with me. Now and again there’s a good, or

almost good, day with enough energy to accomplish something.

What else can I expect? Is there something to avoid? Needless to say, I have

my share of stress . . . but I can be ugly and just “cut ‘em loose” if I

must. Of course they will resent it, but I happen to be the “shoulder” for

just too many people at present!

The decline in our standard of living may not be a sign of economic failure;

rather, it may be part of the cure for our economic ills. -- Hawken in

The Next Economy

- - - - -

Re: Article About Liver Test

Posted by: " Jan Holman " janholmangmail (DOT) com arizonablackhat

Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 9:04 pm ((PDT))

.. . . . My episodes were very minor, but still weird. The last symptoms I

have had

are low blood platelets and fatigue. Dr. put me on b12 shots and trying to

get me approved for EPO shots (think I have the right initials) He doesn't

think they will approve them because their use would be off label.

This seems to be a great group. Jan H

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Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.11/1071 - Release Date: 10/15/2007

6:48 AM

[Guest guest]

Opana ER. It is new, and the big sister to dilaudid. (dilaudid is hydromorphone,

Opana is Oxymorphone.) It is a slow time release formula that is suppose to last

12 hours after you take it as the optimal dose for 3 days in a row. I am on

20mg. I am also givin 4 pills of 5 mg immediate release opana per day.

http://www.opana.com/

It is indicated for the treatment of moderate to severe long term pain. It works

very well so far. I was very reluctant to go this route, but my spirit could not

take this pain, and still thrive. Our dear friend Tricia who hasn't been heard

from in months now was taken off all her pain meds for listing on the transplant

list. I do not know that I will be able to make that sacrifice. I do not even

know why they would require this , but she was flat out suffering. I do pray for

her.

Re: What is expected with an EPISODE?

Hi ,

My episodes go two ways. Usually I have what i call a liver attack on day one.

Usually to eating something my liver doesn't like. My liver swells up, hurts and

i look 10 months pregnant within 2 hours of eating something i shouldn't. (more

on that later)

Day 2 is a migraine from hell. Day 3 is fatigue and dehydration sets in. This

day I call a liver hangover.

How i found what i cant eat was keeping track of what i ate and what would set

my liver off. My toxins are anything with white flour, artificial sweeteners or

meats and dairy with hormones. So I get free range chicken, turkey and eggs. I

also cannot drink pepsi, orange pop or ice teas with dyes in them. Around here

Jilberts milk and dairy products are hormone free.

To improve my liver I eat things that are good for me.... lots of (especially

green ) veggies & fruits. Drinking water w/ lemon or lemonade helps me also. I

try to make as much as i can by scratch and stay away from MSG things. It is

really hard to watch, but once you start it gets easier. I read the labels on

everything. Example, did you know that at burger king, they coat their fries

with white flour??? Thats their secret to making them crispy.

Everyone who has a liver disease has different toxins than the other person.

Example: I know someone who cant eat potatoes of any kind and i can. And yet he

could eat pizza and i cant.

I also found that laying down when my liver/tummy swells up with a heating pad

on my liver, helps with the pain and relaxes it and me!!!!

I'm in the middle of a episode now. But this time it was different for me.

Yesterday I had a horrid migraine, today is the liver swelling. And I know

tomorrow will bring me fatigue and maybe dehydration. I think is was different

this time cuz I have had a very stressful week.

The best advice I can give you is to LISTEN TO YOUR BODY. Try to eat the things

that are the best for you liver. I also take milk thistle (vitamin) and just

started taking flaxseed oil capsules.

Hope some of this may help you.

Take care, gail

Bracewell wrote: About “episodes” – what can I expect? I have had some

days when sudden

overwhelming and debilitating nausea has simply overcome me to the point

that I HAVE to go to bed and concentrate on going into suspended animation.

[is that self-hypnosis? ]

The fatigue is almost always with me. Now and again there’s a good, or

almost good, day with enough energy to accomplish something.

What else can I expect? Is there something to avoid? Needless to say, I have

my share of stress . . . but I can be ugly and just “cut ‘em loose” if I

must. Of course they will resent it, but I happen to be the “shoulder” for

just too many people at present!

The decline in our standard of living may not be a sign of economic failure;

rather, it may be part of the cure for our economic ills. -- Hawken in

The Next Economy

- - - - -

Re: Article About Liver Test

Posted by: " Jan Holman " janholmangmail (DOT) com arizonablackhat

Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 9:04 pm ((PDT))

.. . . . My episodes were very minor, but still weird. The last symptoms I

have had

are low blood platelets and fatigue. Dr. put me on b12 shots and trying to

get me approved for EPO shots (think I have the right initials) He doesn't

think they will approve them because their use would be off label.

This seems to be a great group. Jan H

No virus found in this outgoing message.

Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.11/1071 - Release Date: 10/15/2007

6:48 AM

[Guest guest]

,

Glad to here that I could help. I am still learning. And i understand about

those days that the fatigue is so bad you can barely get out of bed, much less

cook a dinner. But what I do, when I do cook, I make extra. Then I make my own

TV dinners and freeze them. They come in handy on the days that I work for my

lunch/dinners.

There is a book out there called " Love your Liver and live longer " by Dr

Cabott. My sweetie got it for me 2 years ago. When I read the book, I used a

yellow highlighter. Let me tell you, its like the book was written for me. It

explains alot of how your live works and etc.

In it is a diet you can follow to detox. I never did that. and my Nash doctor

did not recommend doing it either. But I just used the recipes in it as a guide

to learn what to eat and how to cook it, in the best interest of my liver. It

helped me alot. And some of the recipes are not too bad either.

Just throwing some more ideas out there for ya

Take care, gail

Bracewell wrote: Gail, you’ve given me something to

do that will definitely help. I’ll start

keeping a record of what I eat – everything.

Too often around here it’s catch-as-catch-can because trips to the store or

even cooking something to eat are beyond my energy level – not enough spoons

to get it done!

I avoid fast-foods and Wal-Mart and other big stores. Can’t stand to see

America turned over to corporations – so that is standing me in good stead

at present. For awhile in the late ’80’s I worked at Long Silvers and

one of the sinful things done by the crew was to batter the past due (can’t

serve them after so many minutes) french fries with the fish batter and

re-fry them. Delicious but scary! We didn’t do it often. So BK discovered

that, eh?

So, questions now about cheese, pickles, sauerkraut, condiments. I don’t do

any MSG whatsoever (except on those rare visits to the Chinese buffet!)

After a while, with a record, I’ll know what to avoid. The “episodes” are

totally debilitating and I have a lot to do just to keep my head above the

surface.

Entropy sets in around here at a rate you wouldn’t believe. Nevermind – yes,

you would believe! We’re all bothered with that. There are some things that

simply cannot be left undone.

I’ll start that notebook first thing in the morning.

Thanks again to you ALL for the help I’m getting!

“I cannot and will not cut my conscience to fit this year’s fashions.” -

Lillian Hellman

- - - - -

Re: What is expected with an EPISODE?

Posted by: " gail ann " zeena3963@... zeena3963

Date: Tue Oct 16, 2007 6:48 pm ((PDT))

Hi ,

My episodes go two ways. Usually I have what i call a liver attack on day

one. Usually to eating something my liver doesn't like. My liver swells

up, hurts and i look 10 months pregnant within 2 hours of eating something i

shouldn't. (more on that later)

Day 2 is a migraine from hell. Day 3 is fatigue and dehydration sets in.

This day I call a liver hangover.

How i found what i cant eat was keeping track of what i ate and what would

set my liver off. My toxins are anything with white flour, artificial

sweeteners or meats and dairy with hormones. So I get free range chicken,

turkey and eggs. I also cannot drink pepsi, orange pop or ice teas with

dyes in them. Around here Jilberts milk and dairy products are hormone

free.

To improve my liver I eat things that are good for me.... lots of

(especially green ) veggies & fruits. Drinking water w/ lemon or lemonade

helps me also. I try to make as much as i can by scratch and stay away from

MSG things. It is really hard to watch, but once you start it gets easier.

I read the labels on everything. Example, did you know that at burger

king, they coat their fries with white flour??? Thats their secret to making

them crispy.

Everyone who has a liver disease has different toxins than the other person.

Example: I know someone who cant eat potatoes of any kind and i can. And

yet he could eat pizza and i cant.

I also found that laying down when my liver/tummy swells up with a heating

pad on my liver, helps with the pain and relaxes it and me!!!!

I'm in the middle of a episode now. But this time it was different for me.

Yesterday I had a horrid migraine, today is the liver swelling. And I know

tomorrow will bring me fatigue and maybe dehydration. I think is was

different this time cuz I have had a very stressful week.

The best advice I can give you is to LISTEN TO YOUR BODY. Try to eat the

things that are the best for you liver. I also take milk thistle (vitamin)

and just started taking flaxseed oil capsules.

Hope some of this may help you.

Take care, gail

No virus found in this outgoing message.

Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.12/1073 - Release Date: 10/16/2007

8:22 AM

[Guest guest]

Hello to all....

Today is a better day. I hate the 3 day attacks. They knock me on my butt.

Anyhow to answer your question..... I am not on a low sodium diet from the

doctors. A dozen years ago I gave up salt. I do not add it anything unless I

have to. Like w/ certain recipes or they dont turn out. I use other

seasonings, especially natural pressed garlic. So giving up salt was easy for

me.

Taker easy. gail

PS okay i confess..... the only thing I salt are french fries. But I bake them

not fry them. LOL

robwalkingeagle@... wrote: Are you on a sodium restriction? My

hepatologist has me on under 2000mg of sodium a day.

Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

Re: What is expected with an EPISODE?

Gail, you’ve given me something to do that will definitely help. I’ll start

keeping a record of what I eat – everything.

Too often around here it’s catch-as-catch-can because trips to the store or

even cooking something to eat are beyond my energy level – not enough spoons

to get it done!

I avoid fast-foods and Wal-Mart and other big stores. Can’t stand to see

America turned over to corporations – so that is standing me in good stead

at present. For awhile in the late ’80’s I worked at Long Silvers and

one of the sinful things done by the crew was to batter the past due (can’t

serve them after so many minutes) french fries with the fish batter and

re-fry them. Delicious but scary! We didn’t do it often. So BK discovered

that, eh?

So, questions now about cheese, pickles, sauerkraut, condiments. I don’t do

any MSG whatsoever (except on those rare visits to the Chinese buffet!)

After a while, with a record, I’ll know what to avoid. The “episodes” are

totally debilitating and I have a lot to do just to keep my head above the

surface.

Entropy sets in around here at a rate you wouldn’t believe. Nevermind – yes,

you would believe! We’re all bothered with that. There are some things that

simply cannot be left undone.

I’ll start that notebook first thing in the morning.

Thanks again to you ALL for the help I’m getting!

“I cannot and will not cut my conscience to fit this year’s fashions.” -

Lillian Hellman

- - - - -

Re: What is expected with an EPISODE?

Posted by: " gail ann " zeena3963@... zeena3963

Date: Tue Oct 16, 2007 6:48 pm ((PDT))

Hi ,

My episodes go two ways. Usually I have what i call a liver attack on day

one. Usually to eating something my liver doesn't like. My liver swells

up, hurts and i look 10 months pregnant within 2 hours of eating something i

shouldn't. (more on that later)

Day 2 is a migraine from hell. Day 3 is fatigue and dehydration sets in.

This day I call a liver hangover.

How i found what i cant eat was keeping track of what i ate and what would

set my liver off. My toxins are anything with white flour, artificial

sweeteners or meats and dairy with hormones. So I get free range chicken,

turkey and eggs. I also cannot drink pepsi, orange pop or ice teas with

dyes in them. Around here Jilberts milk and dairy products are hormone

free.

To improve my liver I eat things that are good for me.... lots of

(especially green ) veggies & fruits. Drinking water w/ lemon or lemonade

helps me also. I try to make as much as i can by scratch and stay away from

MSG things. It is really hard to watch, but once you start it gets easier.

I read the labels on everything. Example, did you know that at burger

king, they coat their fries with white flour??? Thats their secret to making

them crispy.

Everyone who has a liver disease has different toxins than the other person.

Example: I know someone who cant eat potatoes of any kind and i can. And

yet he could eat pizza and i cant.

I also found that laying down when my liver/tummy swells up with a heating

pad on my liver, helps with the pain and relaxes it and me!!!!

I'm in the middle of a episode now. But this time it was different for me.

Yesterday I had a horrid migraine, today is the liver swelling. And I know

tomorrow will bring me fatigue and maybe dehydration. I think is was

different this time cuz I have had a very stressful week.

The best advice I can give you is to LISTEN TO YOUR BODY. Try to eat the

things that are the best for you liver. I also take milk thistle (vitamin)

and just started taking flaxseed oil capsules.

Hope some of this may help you.

Take care, gail

No virus found in this outgoing message.

Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.12/1073 - Release Date: 10/16/2007

8:22 AM

[Guest guest]

I'm glad today is a better day. I know about being knocked for a loop for

days, even weeks at a time. Maybe not your way, but we all have our

disasters. I'm still trying to understand exactly what you're calling an

episode, but it sounds to me like high blood sugar? Some people are very

sensitive to fluxuations in BG levels. Most to lows, but some to highs. I've

known of folks that are sensitive, and sickened by BG levels as low as 180.

I also know that stress, illness (like a liver flare up) and just pain can

cause BG levels to go higher for no other reason. Diet and medications can

be right on but the BG levels will go up. Also, check for infection. BG

levels can rise up to a week or more before the evidence of infection is

apparent anywhere else.

Hope you continue to feel better, and I'm sorry that you're having these

problems.

Sally (the invisible list member)

Re: Re: What is expected with an EPISODE?

Hello to all....

Today is a better day. I hate the 3 day attacks. They knock me on my butt.

Anyhow to answer your question..... I am not on a low sodium diet from the

doctors. A dozen years ago I gave up salt. I do not add it anything unless

I have to. Like w/ certain recipes or they dont turn out. I use other

seasonings, especially natural pressed garlic. So giving up salt was easy

for me.

Taker easy. gail

PS okay i confess..... the only thing I salt are french fries. But I bake

them not fry them. LOL

robwalkingeagle@... wrote: Are you on a sodium restriction? My

hepatologist has me on under 2000mg of sodium a day. Sent via BlackBerry

from T-Mobile