Re: Repost of My Message from 8/21/2009- Bloodwork questions

[Guest guest]

Hi Laurie,

That's interesting, do you happen to have a link to this or remember where you

read it? And if it's true, I wonder if that is also the case for people who

live close to any ocean who are likely to eat lots of iodine-rich seafood. Did

they prove it's due to evolving and not their higher intake of soy?

Although if I remember correctly, Dr. Hashimoto's first discovered cases of

hashi's were Japanese people. Someone correct me if that is wrong.

>

>

>

> I could be wrong but I think I read somewhere that the Japanese have evolved

so that the large intake of seaweed doesnt effect them the way it would effect

us. Evolution is an amazing thing, most people when they hear the word they

think of apes but its not that simplistic...

>

> Laurie

>

> --

[Guest guest]

Again I could be wrong and I have no idea where I read it or at that point in my

beginning research if soy was even mentioned...I dont seem to retain things as

well as I used to. I guess its something that can be googled and

researched...Sorry I couldnt be of help..those memory cells just aint what they

used to be, I remember snippets of things but not everything.

Laurie

> >

> >

> >

> > I could be wrong but I think I read somewhere that the Japanese have evolved

so that the large intake of seaweed doesnt effect them the way it would effect

us. Evolution is an amazing thing, most people when they hear the word they

think of apes but its not that simplistic...

> >

> > Laurie

> >

> > --

>

[Guest guest]

Hi and Laurie,

Maybe it's a similar theory to that of blood types evolving (or maybe the word

is better suited as adapting over a huge time period) due to famine, weather or

whatever reason people had to find other food sources. Like what Dr. D'Adamo

describes in his books, Eat Right 4 Your Type and The Blood Type Diet (I think

he has another book too).

Dr. Hakaru Hashimoto discovered what he called Struma Lymphmasota (Hashimoto's

Thyroiditis) in 1912 in Japanese women. He then researched more on this in

Germany and then went back to Japan and practiced medicine. American doctors

didn't have his research available to them until the 1920/1930's because of

language barriers.

I think it's important to remember that modern soy consumed in Asia is NOT

anything close to the GMO soy that is made and consumed in the good old USA, so

comparisons would be incompatible.

Best,

~Bj

> >

> >

> >

> > I could be wrong but I think I read somewhere that the Japanese have evolved

so that the large intake of seaweed doesnt effect them the way it would effect

us. Evolution is an amazing thing, most people when they hear the word they

think of apes but its not that simplistic...

> >

> > Laurie

> >

> > --

>

[Guest guest]

Bj

That sounds all very logical to me...also to me evolving is the perfect word

actually in my mind evolution is just mutations that end up being part of the so

called finished product that the object makes in order to adapt to it's

environment. Im sure there is a better stated definition in Websters

So I have noticed quite a few posts in the last week or so on GMO (Im guessing

Genetically Modified cant figure what the O means) soy...w/out really saying

what the bad part of soy is...Im curious to know, if posting it on the board is

not appropriate can you email it to me in plain english, my brain has a hard

time attaching to the scientific medical termanology.

I used to drink soy milk quite a bit (chocolate) I recently tried Almond milk

tastes pretty good so Ive been using that.

Laurie

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > I could be wrong but I think I read somewhere that the Japanese have

evolved so that the large intake of seaweed doesnt effect them the way it would

effect us. Evolution is an amazing thing, most people when they hear the word

they think of apes but its not that simplistic...

> > >

> > > Laurie

> > >

> > > --

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Laurie,

A genetically modified organism (GMO) or genetically engineered organism (GEO)

is an organism whose genetic material is altered using genetic engineering

techniques. These techniques use DNA molecules from different sources, which are

combined into one molecule to create a new set of genes.

Five main GM foods are soy, corn, cotton, canola, and sugar beets. Their

by-products are found in more than 70% of consumed products. The primary reason

the plants are engineered is to allow them to survive otherwise deadly

herbicides. They're inserted with bacterial genes in order to accomplish that.

Biotech companies sell the seed and herbicide as a package deal. The FDA doesn't

require safety testing on GMOs -- so almost none of the potential side effects

are evaluated before the crops are sold. The few animal feeding safety studies

that have been conducted, however, show serious problems. So, more natural

living consumers are demanding that cattle that are fed GM feed -- milk and

beef must be labeled as such, so consumers know what they are eating.

HTH,

~Bj

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > I could be wrong but I think I read somewhere that the Japanese have

evolved so that the large intake of seaweed doesnt effect them the way it would

effect us. Evolution is an amazing thing, most people when they hear the word

they think of apes but its not that simplistic...

> > > >

> > > > Laurie

> > > >

> > > > --

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I've also seen articles that says Japanese aren't affected by high iodine

(kelp), but I'm learning that isn't totally true. All of us - actually " adapt "

to levels of iodine. It does affect them. But you are correct - people who are

most at risk of developing problems from iodine are those who previously had low

iodine intake and then were abruptly exposed to larger quantities. Iodized salt

brought a lot of problems to certain people (gentically prone) in low iodine

areas.

" Conclusions: Iodine excess during early pregnancy seems to have no adverse

effects on the fetus in healthy Japanese women. To avoid hypothyroidism,

reducing excess dietary iodine intake to moderate intake may be beneficial for

pregnant woman in Japan. "

From:

Thyroid Function in Early Pregnancy in Japanese Healthy Women: Relation to

Urinary Iodine Excretion, Emesis, and Fetal and Child Development

http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/94/5/1683

Here's the possible mechanism:

http://www.liebertonline.com/doi/abs/10.1089/105072501300176462

Iodine-Induced Hypothyroidism

The hypothyroidism is transient and thyroid function returns to normal in 2 to 3

weeks after iodide withdrawal, but transient T4 replacement therapy may be

required in some patients. The patients who develop transient iodine-induced

hypothyroidism must be followed long term thereafter because many will develop

permanent primary hypothyroidism.

Just real quickly, here is another study on areas of Japan where kelp was

consumed often - this group also had higher rates of hypothyroidism. I assume

this is due to the " Wolf Chaikoff " effect mentioned above. That's when the

thyroid senses too much iodine coming in, and shuts off production to protect

the body from over production of hormone. This is the basis for why emergency

rooms use high levels of iodine SSKI drops (ie: large amts of iodine given to

the patient) to halt a thyroid storm - the thyroid will shut off production when

too much iodine comes in.

Association between dietary iodine intake and prevalence of subclinical

hypothyroidism in the coastal regions of Japan

N Konno, H Makita, K Yuri, N Iizuka and K Kawasaki

Department of Internal Medicine, Hokkaido Central Hospital for Social Health

Insurance, Sapporo, Japan.

The prevalence of thyroid dysfunction in relation to iodine intake was studied

in adults (n = 1061) in five coastal areas of Japan that produce iodine-rich

seaweed (kelp). The prevalence of hyperthyroidism (TSH < 0.15 mU/L) was similar

in these areas, whereas that of hypothyroidism (TSH > 5.0 mU/L) varied from

0-9.7%.

The relative frequency of above normal iodide concentration in the morning urine

(> or = 75 mumol/L) [high urinary iodide (UI)] varied from 3.7%-30.3%.

Together with previously reported results of a noncoastal city, the frequency of

high UI correlated significantly with that of hypothyroidism with negative

thyroid autoantibody (r = 0.829, n = 6, P < 0.05) but not with positive thyroid

autoantibody (r = 0.278, NS) or with that of hyperthyroidism (r = 0.038, NS)...

These results indicate that 1) the prevalence of hypothyroidism in iodine

sufficient areas may be associated with the amount of iodine ingested; 2)

hypothyroidism is more prevalent and marked in subjects consuming further

excessive amounts of iodine; and 3) excessive intake of iodine should be

considered an etiology of hypothyroidism in addition to chronic thyroiditis in

these areas.

___________________________________________________

> > >

> > > In your search for better health, here's a helpful tip:

> > >

> > > Just because 'references' are listed at the bottom of an article means

very little if you don't go look up details about those very references.

> > >

> > > I once found an article that Dr Mercola posted on his site, with the

headline " SOY KILLS BABIES " . He included a reference to a medical study he

claimed " proved this " , but offered no active link. With some extra work, I went

and found that study and learned that the article was an old one, and was simply

saying that babies who eat 100% soy formula -- without any iodine added -- will

cause babies to get goiters. Duh! The soy wasn't killing them - it was the

complete deprivatoin of iodine that was the cause. (we all need some iodine to

survive, and soy is a goitrogen). As soon as they began adding iodine to soy

baby formula, the problem went away.

> > >

> > > The same thing would have been seen if the baby was on 100% " anything

without iodine " . Milk from any mammal contains iodine.

> > >

> > > But the doctor who rang this scary warning (who is on the board of the

" REAL MILK " Washington DC lobby group) never explained the actual cause in his

article, and likely hoped that the reader would never go look up that study -

and simply take his word for it. Since then, I learned the " REAL MILK " lobby

has an entire budget devoted to their " Anti Soy " campaign -- there is nothing

taking away profits faster from these raw milk advocates than the benefits of

soy milk. Since their articles are viral on so many sites like this one, (90% of

them written by the same two authors - the President and VP of " Real Milk

Campaign " lobby group) my feeling is they are out to destroy the soy industry

for their own gain.

> > >

> > > So be very careful!

> > >

> > > The site Bj gave, http://www.healingdaily.com/detoxification-diet/soy.htm,

tries to make the claim that high rates of thyroid cancers in Asia is somehow

related to soy consumption, and uses this reference from 1976.

> > >

> > > " Asians throughout the world also have high rates of thyroid cancer(9) "

> > >

> > > This is the reference they used to back this statement up:

> > >

> > > 9. Searle, E. (ed.), Chemical Carcinogens, ACS Monograph 173,

American Chemical Society, Washington, DC, 1976.

> > >

> > > But this article this website is using as a source has nothing to do with

soy whatsoever! This referenced article is about the bombing of Hiroshima with

radioactive iodine isotopes (I-131), and how the population now (in 1976)

suffers from high rates of thyroid cancer due to the exposure across Asia to

this carcinogen.

> > >

> > > This is just downright deceptive. The best advice is to get your data from

medical articles that are peer reviewed for this exact type of fact twisting.

These other websites make it so you must on rely on your own investigation to

see if they might be twisting the facts or not - they don't have peer review

processes. Some sites are famous for doing this for their own gain.

> > >

> > > Most references will give you links to the study being sourced. This way

it makes it easy to dig deeper for the data they are using. But when I see a

commercial website that doesn't do that, this brings up red flags for me

immediately.

> > >

> > > Just some caution so you don't wind up avoiding something beneficial based

on fact-twisting from lobby groups.

> > >

> > > Val

> > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

b53cjf wrote:

> Hi Laurie,

> That's interesting, do you happen to have a link to this or remember where you

read it? And if it's true, I wonder if that is also the case for people who

live close to any ocean who are likely to eat lots of iodine-rich seafood. Did

they prove it's due to evolving and not their higher intake of soy?

>

> Although if I remember correctly, Dr. Hashimoto's first discovered cases of

hashi's were Japanese people. Someone correct me if that is wrong.

You are corrrect about Hashimoto's disease.

My two cents is evolution isn't that fast. But individuals can sometimes

accomodate or become used to diets higher than usual in some nutrients.

Others simply become allergic, and from my personal experience, once you

become allergic to a mineral or metal it isn't common to have the

allergy ever stop, indeed, in my case I've become increasingly sensitive

over the past 25 years.

sol

[Guest guest]

Actually if we go back to Jr. High School where we learned about Columbus we

learned that people back in 1492 were significantly shorter than what we are now

due to the fact that we have better diets and medical care...that is evolution,

Im sure people living in Japan have been eating seaweed long before Columbus

sailed the ocean blue. 500+ yrs in the grand scheme of things is quite fast.

Anyway who knows, not I, I know I read something about it somewhere but even

before GD my memory wasnt the best, now, I just say I suffer from CRS. Actually

its more like I can remember just not the whole thing

Laurie

> > Hi Laurie,

> > That's interesting, do you happen to have a link to this or remember where

you read it? And if it's true, I wonder if that is also the case for people who

live close to any ocean who are likely to eat lots of iodine-rich seafood. Did

they prove it's due to evolving and not their higher intake of soy?

> >

> > Although if I remember correctly, Dr. Hashimoto's first discovered cases of

hashi's were Japanese people. Someone correct me if that is wrong.

> You are corrrect about Hashimoto's disease.

> My two cents is evolution isn't that fast. But individuals can sometimes

> accomodate or become used to diets higher than usual in some nutrients.

> Others simply become allergic, and from my personal experience, once you

> become allergic to a mineral or metal it isn't common to have the

> allergy ever stop, indeed, in my case I've become increasingly sensitive

> over the past 25 years.

> sol

>