Re: Data, Star Trek and honesty

[Guest guest]

> Hi everybody,

>

> was just watching Star Trek Next Generation today and Data was

> watching a performance where Berkley acted really badly. Everyone

> clapped and Data was confused, because he couldn't understand why

> everyone was clapping when Berkley's performance had been so bad.

>

> This scenario reminds me of a recent experience I had myself. I

went

> to see a band play live. I had thier CD and thought their music was

> good; however I was disapointed by their live performance and at a

> later date I told one of the band members what I thought. He took

it

> extremely well and told me that everyone else had said they were

good

> and yet the band themselves knew that they had played badly that

> night and I was the 1st person to actually say what they already

> knew. He also said it was a relief to finaly hear someone actually

> say it, since they all already knew it, just nobody outside the

band

> was admitting it.

>

>

>

>

This is one of the things which confused me to no end when I was

younger. I could not lie to avoid hurting someone's feelings like NT

children did, but told the truth about how I felt. My mom

continuously got onto me for being " too honest " . Of course, this was

many years before anyone understood about Aspergers. I also had a

hard time telling people that I liked the gifts they gave me when in

reality, I wanted something else. When you want one certain item for

Christmas or birthdays and didn't get it-that really pissed me off.

Anyways, I really love Star Trek-especially Data since he reminds me

of some of my experiences being different than everyone else.

This episode reminds me of that story about the Emperor's Clothes-And

how only a small child told the truth which everyone else wouldn't

for fear of being thought of badly. The emperor didn't really have a

new suit-but everyone pretended that they could see his nice new

clothes. This reminds me of NTs when they lie like this.

[Guest guest]

Countless studies and surveys have been done on this topic. Most of them say that people tell "white lies" in order to maintain social cohesion and stability. In other words, people would hedge the truth in order not to be kicked out of the group, or get their head bashed in. This makes sense, after a fashion. For most of human history, the family unit and small tribes were the norm. Getting kicked out of such a group would be a virtual death sentence. (bear in mind this was a time when there were probably fewer than 10 million people on the planet and there were many dangerous animals about.) Today's social groups are more likely to be found in the office, though the family is still common. You have to sling a lot of BS in the office to keep everyone happy. NT's and their egos (not that I enjoy being critisized either, however).

Now, there are ways to tell the truth but not be so blunt as to really make the other person angry. If asked about how they performed, start out by stating the good points then mentioning a point or two where they need work. Personal appearance it much tougher though, and it is generally better to keep you mouth shut. If you have to answer, you might say that whatever is nice, but you prefer such and such. So, if someone usually wore their hair one way then changed it and it looks bad, you might say "that's a nice change, but I think the old way suited you better".

Still, some people will get used to you telling the truth and come to expect that and even respect it. Still, it helps to be able to couch it in terms that don't hurt too much. So, if someone asks if you like a new tie but it is a horrible gaudy thing, just say "no, that's a little wild for my taste", wild or whatever depending on what you think of it. The basic idea is not to use the harshest terms possible, the bluntest, but rather look toward the mid-range and up. Too soft or always agreeing and people won't like you just as if you were too blunt, though they will view as a suck up rather than a boor.

However, I did recently read an article that said being too nice at the office will hold back your career. Nothing new there since being nice in real life gets you treated badly too. Appearantly, being a jerk, treating people badly (though not by telling the truth), stealing other people's credit, are taken as signs of a go-getter and power. In other words, jerks are often seen as leaders and people who can get things done. This is why bullies are so popular in school. Its a throwback to the "ooga-booga" brain of our ancient ancestors, Eons ago and many steps back on the evolutionary scale. Too bad that has to persist given all that we have learned about leadership and so on.

[Guest guest]

,

You are right that it is still lying. It is something of a learned thing that I am aware of doing but it does ease social interaction somewhat. NT's probably know that they are lying when they do this as well. Many times I have seen NT's do this and then laugh at the person once they were gone.

The point of my comment was to point out why it was done. The other option is, of course, to say nothing at all. Either not comment on something you notice or not answer when someone asks you something. If you have to answer, the tie example is what I usually do. I will say that it is not something I would wear, but if they like it then it is fine. That's simply a tactful way of saying you don't like it, which isn't lying, but puts the truth a little more gently.

[Guest guest]

So, if someone usually wore their hair one way then

> changed it and it looks bad, you might say " that's a nice change,

but I think

> the old way suited you better " .

>

Hi,

not sure about that, surely that is still lying, if you think it

looks bad, to say 'it's a nice change' is lying. Sorry I still don't

get it. I prefer honesty, maybe I can't think quick enough or be

inventive enough to lie when asked an opinion, I tend to tell the

truth or try not to answer; but it does tend to be my 1st instinct to

answer truthfully (if sometimes rather bluntly).

[Guest guest]

> ,

>

> You are right that it is still lying. It is something of a learned

thing

> that I am aware of doing but it does ease social interaction

somewhat. NT's

> probably know that they are lying when they do this as well. Many

times I have

> seen NT's do this and then laugh at the person once they were gone.

Yes I've encountered this and still do not get it.

>

> The point of my comment was to point out why it was done. The other

option

> is, of course, to say nothing at all. Either not comment on

something you

> notice or not answer when someone asks you something. If you have

to answer, the

> tie example is what I usually do. I will say that it is not

something I would

> wear, but if they like it then it is fine. That's simply a tactful

way of

> saying you don't like it, which isn't lying, but puts the truth a

little more

> gently.

>

>

When it comes to clothes it is usually pretty easy to answer and I

usually go for the tact of 'if you like it - then it's fine, but it's

not something I'd wear', or something similair, like 'it's a bit

bright' etc. My mum has a tendency to give a very honest opinion and

I like to take her shopping with me if I have to buy clothes. For

example she will say 'your thighs look big in that' and I appreciate

the honesty.

When it comes to other things it is sometimes harder to give an

answer straight away and I need to think carefully about what I am

asked, say on a piece of writing or something like that.

Unfortunately when I have had a drink I tend to be bluntly honest

I find it really hard to be tactful, or stall for time when I have

consumed alchol

Best Regards,