Guest guest Posted February 8, 2003 Report Share Posted February 8, 2003 Judy, what exactly are you insuring. Do you own a store or a shop where you manufacture? Sutton > Usually, I just lurk and learn, but I got an e-mail from my insurance > company yesterday that has totally blown me away. I make soaps, bath > products and a few lotions, mostly for a local (Canadian) market. I was > hoping to get a web page up and running in the next few months, but I've run > into a BIG glitch. Apparently the insurance I had last year - which runs > out on February 22 and cost me about $500.00 per year will now cost me > between $3,000.00 and $5,000.00 per year. If I want to just have my > premises and product insured, no liability, they will renew for $600.00 per > year. > > Are there any other Canadian folk out there who have run into this problem, > and what did you do? > Thanks for any info > > Judy McLay > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2003 Report Share Posted February 8, 2003 Thanks for the reply ! I'm just small time at the moment - home-based and I do mostly craft fairs and a little bit of wholesale. I was about to expand into more wholesale markets since I've been getting a good response to my goodies so far. Future plans included a web page and/or small shop, but.....I'm not sure which way to turn right now. I did have my product and supplies insured (fire, theft, etc.) as well as liability (in case of someone having problems with the product). I used to run a small catering company, so I was familiar with liability and just wanted to be covered. From what I understand from the e-mail I got, the problem is with the liability coverage if " I am selling to international and U.S. customers and on the internet " . I'm not sure if this means I can have liability coverage if I just sell to Canadian markets. Have you ever heard of this? Thanks Judy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2003 Report Share Posted February 8, 2003 Apparently the insurance I had last year - which runs > out on February 22 and cost me about $500.00 per year will now cost me > between $3,000.00 and $5,000.00 per year. If I want to just have my > premises and product insured, no liability, they will renew for $600.00 per > year. Judy, what was the reason given for the increase. Have you changed anything in your company? Have you started manufacturing products that are high risk? Pat. Peace, Joy, Serenity House of Scents tm. Body Oils, Fragrance Oils, Incense, Candles, Soap, Etc. pat@... http://www.houseofscents.com/ RE: liability insurance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2003 Report Share Posted February 8, 2003 No I haven't...but before you take any steps...I'd do some research into how many law suits have occured in Canada to date for cosmetic claims, what they were (if any) and what the outcome was...Then I would make a list of exactly what I wanted to insure. Then I would ask my insurer for exact details of what they will insure and for how much money. I would not buy any until I knew this absolutely, and I'd probably have my lawyer reveiw the policy before I bought it. (make sure to find out if your liability insurance is valid if your product is not challenge tested) I would think your household insurance would cover fire theft and such while the goods are in your house. RE: RE: liability insurance > Thanks for the reply ! > > I'm just small time at the moment - home-based and I do mostly craft fairs > and a little bit of wholesale. I was about to expand into more wholesale > markets since I've been getting a good response to my goodies so far. > Future plans included a web page and/or small shop, but.....I'm not sure > which way to turn right now. > > I did have my product and supplies insured (fire, theft, etc.) as well as > liability (in case of someone having problems with the product). > > I used to run a small catering company, so I was familiar with liability and > just wanted to be covered. From what I understand from the e-mail I got, > the problem is with the liability coverage if " I am selling to international > and U.S. customers and on the internet " . > > I'm not sure if this means I can have liability coverage if I just sell to > Canadian markets. Have you ever heard of this? > > Thanks > > Judy > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2003 Report Share Posted February 8, 2003 Hi Pat (great list by the way - I've learned so much) I haven't changed a thing. Here's what they told me: In regards to the renewal of your liability insurance coming due February 22, 2003, we have to inform you that we are unable to provide the same coverage as last year as the industry has changed since. Underwriters at insurance companies we represent, are only prepared to offer Premises Only liability with a Restricted Liability Clause. This means that coverage will not be offered on your product being sold on the internet because of fears of international and US customers, and liabilities that could ensue through their purchase of your product. Please note that coverage for your product being sold in the US over the internet will run around $3,000 - $5,000 per year. We don't know if you are prepared to pay such a large premium for the coverage, but the coverage is there. The policy that we can provide to you for $600 is just Premises Only liability policy, which would cover only bodily injury or property damage occurring on your business premises. Has anyone else run into this kind of thing? Judy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2003 Report Share Posted February 8, 2003 OK, now for some dumb questions - do soaps, dry bath products (salts, bath bombs, milk bath etc) and butters containing no water need challenge testing? I know that lotions do - one reason I don't do many lotions, and I do use preservatives, usually Phenonip or Germall II. As I mentioned before, I'm home-based at the moment, but I do have plans to expand and I want to follow the rules. Judy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2003 Report Share Posted February 8, 2003 > Hi Pat (great list by the way - I've learned so much) Thanks Judy. This means that coverage will > not be offered on your product being sold on the internet because of fears > of international and US customers, and liabilities that could ensue through > their purchase of your product. It looks like the insurance companies in Canada don't want to open themselves up to possible lawsuits from the US. I can't say as I blame them with the US being the most litigious country in the world. If I were you I would get some quick quotes from a few other insurers. If you run into the same problem with them you may be better off taking the insurance with your existing company and sell only within Canada. This is assuming they will write the same policy if you agree to only sell in Canada. I have a web site and I won't sell outside the US. My risk increases if I do that and it's simply not worth it to me. When your business grows to the point where you can afford to pay the additional costs, then it is time to consider doing business in other countries. Hope that helps. Pat. Peace, Joy, Serenity House of Scents tm. Body Oils, Fragrance Oils, Incense, Candles, Soap, Etc. pat@... http://www.houseofscents.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2003 Report Share Posted February 8, 2003 <<<<<<<<<This means that coverage will not be offered on your product being sold on the internet because of fearsof international and US customers, and liabilities that could ensue through their purchase of your product. ?>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It sounds like this would not be a problem if you were to stay strictly Canada sales. Verify this with the company and if you are willing to stay within your country's boundry than perhaps they will renew the policy with those stipulations at last years prices. Dee ><((((º>·.¸:.·´¯`·.><((((º> .¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> http://www.smartgroups.com/groups/HotSoapEtc http://www.hpsoapbook.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 9, 2003 Report Share Posted February 9, 2003 Hi Pat I think you've hit the nail on the head. The mere mention that you export to the USA sends them into a tizzy here. I had awful trouble getting insurance at an affordable rate that would cover me for home and USA. I've ended up with a policy I'm not happy with as the product liability cover is only 125,000 euros and public 1 million but as you can see the product side is far too low. I'm waiting on them to come back to me on raising the product liability cover so we'll see how that goes but I'm not expecting a result. They don't like insuring soap or cosmetics, the first thing they say is that people can get rashes. Insurance on the whole has gone through the roof here and any other quotes I got were over 2500 euros upwards. I couldn't afford this so I've settled on something rather than nothing. I'll just have to keep looking but don't have any hopes of getting anything cheaper than 2500 euros I was speaking to another soaper here yesterday and she told me a story that happened to her that reinforces the need for insurance. She sold M & P soap in loaves to a shop and they had cards stuck in the soap using florists wire with the ingredients etc The shop assistant pulled out the wire but a small sliver remained in the soap and of course you can imagine what the customer had to say. It didn't go to the insurers but it was a close call! Even though we would think soap and bath products are low risks you just can't envisage what could go wrong Pam It looks like the insurance companies in Canada don't want to open themselves up to possible lawsuits from the US. I can't say as I blame them with the US being the most litigious country in the world. If I were you I would get some quick quotes from a few other insurers. If you run into the same problem with them you may be better off taking the insurance with your existing company and sell only within Canada. This is assuming they will write the same policy if you agree to only sell in Canada. I have a web site and I won't sell outside the US. My risk increases if I do that and it's simply not worth it to me. When your business grows to the point where you can afford to pay the additional costs, then it is time to consider doing business in other countries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2003 Report Share Posted February 10, 2003 ----- Original Message ----- > I believe that most insurance companies are pretty good too...having said > that..I think most people who buy insurance policies...whatever kind, > (liability, disability, life etc) have no clue exactly what they are buying. That is probably because most people never buy insurance other than auto or house. You can't blame the insurance companies because the public is too lazy to read their policies. > To know exactly what you are buying you must read every single word of the > policy..plus all addendums and updates...and you must understand the > implications of all those words..and how they are interpretted by the > insurer.. You can get a darn good idea by just reading the declaration page. However, I think it is good policy to read the complete policy and familiarize yourself with the various terms. At least then you can talk intelligently with your insurance agent. Most people don't do this and most people get a surprise when the > crunch comes. I know I've learned from my errors with various insurance > policies. Sorry to hear you have had some bad experiences, . > At this point..with insurance companies on such a tight budget, I'd never > sign on the dotted line..or part with a nickle without having my lawyer > really survey the whole of the policy. You normally don't see the policy until after you have bought it. What you do see is advertising. I am speaking of the US and the laws in Canada may be completely different. Normally you have a 10 day window where you can read the policy and return it if you change your mind. In business, there are times when you need to consult with an attorney, it just goes with the territory. I don't consider buying an insurance policy one of those times. I'm not trying to disuade you or anyone else from consulting with your attorney. I just think for insurance, there are enough agents out there willing to give you all the information anybody would ever need to make an informed decision. Getting a good insurance agent should be a priority. The I'd make a list of questions that > I would want answered (in writing & signed by the insurer). One of those > questions would be will they pay legal costs of law suits and cover any > claims of non challenged, made in the home products? If you have product liability in the US the insurance company will pay legal costs (up to the policy limit) for lawsuits. Do the laws in Canada require your products to be challenge tested? Do Canadian laws prevent you from having a manufacturing facility in your home? If your answer is no to both of those questions then your policy should cover you...but like I said, I can only speak for US insurance practices. Pat. Peace, Joy, Serenity House of Scents tm. Body Oils, Fragrance Oils, Incense, Candles, Soap, Etc. pat@... http://www.houseofscents.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2003 Report Share Posted February 10, 2003 Well, after some long discussions with my insurance agent, I think I have my problems solved for the moment. I just can't sell anything outside of Canada. As long as that is stated on the policy I'm covered and the premium is $600.00 per year. I wouldn't want to be a new business though (I've had the policy with them for about four years now) since the minimum premium would be about $2,500.00 per year. So, sorry to the rest of the world, I can't sell you any of my goodies until I get much, much bigger! I want to thank everyone who replied to my somewhat panic-stricken plea for help. Back to my lurk and learn mode. I do love this list! Judy McLay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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