Baker on Re: Sampling is necessary

July 22, 2011

Wane:

1. FYI - Those English transplants in Canada knew about variability as

far back as 1910.

Buller from University of Manitoba (Man-a-Toe'-bah) at Winnipeg published a

nice paper in 1910 on daily (filter) air sampling for a more than a year [i

do like Canadians, except when they play the Penguins]. Buller has a nice 6

volume set of researches on fungi - good stuff totaling about 2,600 pages.

I showed a graph from the 1910 paper in a presentation at AIHCE 2008 where

you were the moderator for the Round Table that covered an overview of the

factors of variability in sampling; Dr. Shane was a speaker, as was Dr.

Burge, Spicer, and Dr. Jim Tucker.

And dare I mention that (the unethical) Dr. Vesper chastised us for not

considering PCR via ERMI as the best candidate given the constraints we

mentioned.

2. It's not just the Fungi, it's the Bacteria as well, which I

mentioned in another presentation that year; and another one in 2001.

One of the best papers I've ever seen on the subject is from the AIHA

Journal in 1968 on bacteria in submarines:

Samples at 23 locations in DD-833

2-29 samples per location, totaling 338 samples

Over a 24-hour period

Samples at 16 locations in DD-743

6-46 samples per location, totaling 359 samples

Over a 24-hour period

Wouldn't we all love to have that kind of data?

Interestingly enough, the data from that study strongly support the Pathcon

ca. 1993 suggestion of 200 CFU/m3 of bacteria as a trigger limit.

Tony

.......................................................................

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July 23, 2011

Tony, Miquel was the 1st person to conduct 30,000 air samples of mold and bacteria in the air of Paris in the 1860s. I have a copy of his original work. This sampling showed the variation in outdoor concentrations over a number of years. Buller, and Fienburg also did outside air sampling and again showed the typical outdoors variation. Kendricks also studied the variability in outside air by time of day. All of this outside air variability - not related to controlled indoor environments. That is still the question. Bob

Wane:

1. FYI - Those English transplants in Canada knew about variability as

far back as 1910.

Buller from University of Manitoba (Man-a-Toe'-bah) at Winnipeg published a

nice paper in 1910 on daily (filter) air sampling for a more than a year [i

do like Canadians, except when they play the Penguins]. Buller has a nice 6

volume set of researches on fungi - good stuff totaling about 2,600 pages.

I showed a graph from the 1910 paper in a presentation at AIHCE 2008 where

you were the moderator for the Round Table that covered an overview of the

factors of variability in sampling; Dr. Shane was a speaker, as was Dr.

Burge, Spicer, and Dr. Jim Tucker.

And dare I mention that (the unethical) Dr. Vesper chastised us for not

considering PCR via ERMI as the best candidate given the constraints we

mentioned.

2. It's not just the Fungi, it's the Bacteria as well, which I

mentioned in another presentation that year; and another one in 2001.

One of the best papers I've ever seen on the subject is from the AIHA

Journal in 1968 on bacteria in submarines:

Samples at 23 locations in DD-833

2-29 samples per location, totaling 338 samples

Over a 24-hour period

Samples at 16 locations in DD-743

6-46 samples per location, totaling 359 samples

Over a 24-hour period

Wouldn't we all love to have that kind of data?

Interestingly enough, the data from that study strongly support the Pathcon

ca. 1993 suggestion of 200 CFU/m3 of bacteria as a trigger limit.

Tony

.......................................................................

"Tony" Havics, CHMM, CIH, PE