Guest guest Posted April 1, 2005 Report Share Posted April 1, 2005 Sorry for interrupting here but this all sounds a bit familiar....I had implants in 98 and was diagnosed with hashis hypothyroid in 02 and its been hairloss and problems since then. I have never been able to get a dr to put me on the right meds and so I am still not regulated....hair loss and I am tired all the time and I eat a lot but have lost a lot of weight. Anyway, I am thinking of explanting and wrote Dr. Melmed but he said if it is only for hairloss that I want to take out the implants, I shouldn't do it. I'm trying to get some clarification on this because even if it''s not related to this thyroid condition (my mother is hypo as well), I will probably avoid other problems going forward?? > Hi Marie, > Can you please post the numbers of your TSH, Free t3 and Free t4. > I am on thyroid meds and I was told my numbers were " normal " . > > It would be interesting to actually know those numbers because, we are all different and one person can be very well at a certain level and another can be disabled at same. > > Did she test your cortisol too? > > Hugs.. > Dawn > > > Hello Everyone, > > Yet again I have hit another road block! I had another round of blood tests done, including the FREE T3 and T4 that everyone told me to have checked. Again, I am as healthy as any women would want to be! Great News, but what about the HAIR LOSS? I can't be too healthy if I am losing my freaking hair! > > I don't know where to go next. I'm trying to see a Dermatologist but the only one I would trust, is not taking any new patients. I don't want to go to just any Derm. > > I am going to get started on a healing program and vitamins from a Wellness specialist. It can't hurt! Who knows, maybe the vit. will help the hair loss...doubt it! > > Does anyone think I should have my test results faxed to Dr. Melmed or Kolb for a second opinion? Or anyone else for that matter? > > Any info would be appreciated! > > Marie > > > Opinions expressed are NOT meant to take the place of advice given by licensed health care professionals. Consult your physician or licensed health care professional before commencing any medical treatment. > > " Do not let either the medical authorities or the politicians mislead you. Find out what the facts are, and make your own decisions about how to live a happy life and how to work for a better world. " - Linus ing, two-time Nobel Prize Winner (1954, Chemistry; 1963, Peace) > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2005 Report Share Posted April 1, 2005 You said that you were diagnosed with hypo thyroid, yet also mentioned that you eat alot and lose a lot of weight. Have you had your thyroid checked recently? You may be hyperthyroid now. Losing weight, tiredness and hair loss are typical of hyperthyroid. Weight gain is typical for hypo. Sometimes people on thyroid meds get hyperthyroid because the meds are not regulated properly. Please get retested if you are losing weight despite eating normal. Also, we all think implants are involved in setting off autoimmune problems. I think you are right in stating that getting them out might prevent future problems from occurring. It sounds like Dr. Melmed thinks that if you think the explant will stop hair loss, he is not convinced it will. And he is right. It very well might not. But if you are trying to give your body the best chance to be healthy, I would get them out and I think he would agree. If they are not causing problems now (and there is no way of knowing if they are involved in your problems right now), it is still very likely they will in the future. Getting them out will just be one more step in the right direction to better health! Hugs kathy --- In , " interart81 " <interart81@y...> wrote: > > Sorry for interrupting here but this all sounds a bit familiar....I > had implants in 98 and was diagnosed with hashis hypothyroid in 02 and > its been hairloss and problems since then. I have never been able to > get a dr to put me on the right meds and so I am still not > regulated....hair loss and I am tired all the time and I eat a lot but > have lost a lot of weight. Anyway, I am thinking of explanting and > wrote Dr. Melmed but he said if it is only for hairloss that I want to > take out the implants, I shouldn't do it. I'm trying to get some > clarification on this because even if it''s not related to this > thyroid condition (my mother is hypo as well), I will probably avoid > other problems going forward?? > > --- In , dawn Aldredge <daldre@y...> wrote: > > Hi Marie, > > Can you please post the numbers of your TSH, Free t3 and Free t4. > > I am on thyroid meds and I was told my numbers were " normal " . > > > > It would be interesting to actually know those numbers because, we > are all different and one person can be very well at a certain level > and another can be disabled at same. > > > > Did she test your cortisol too? > > > > Hugs.. > > Dawn > > > > > > Hello Everyone, > > > > Yet again I have hit another road block! I had another round of > blood tests done, including the FREE T3 and T4 that everyone told me > to have checked. Again, I am as healthy as any women would want to > be! Great News, but what about the HAIR LOSS? I can't be too healthy > if I am losing my freaking hair! > > > > I don't know where to go next. I'm trying to see a Dermatologist > but the only one I would trust, is not taking any new patients. I > don't want to go to just any Derm. > > > > I am going to get started on a healing program and vitamins from a > Wellness specialist. It can't hurt! Who knows, maybe the vit. will > help the hair loss...doubt it! > > > > Does anyone think I should have my test results faxed to Dr. Melmed > or Kolb for a second opinion? Or anyone else for that matter? > > > > Any info would be appreciated! > > > > Marie > > > > > > Opinions expressed are NOT meant to take the place of advice given > by licensed health care professionals. Consult your physician or > licensed health care professional before commencing any medical > treatment. > > > > " Do not let either the medical authorities or the politicians > mislead you. Find out what the facts are, and make your own decisions > about how to live a happy life and how to work for a better world. " - > Linus ing, two-time Nobel Prize Winner (1954, Chemistry; 1963, Peace) > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2005 Report Share Posted April 1, 2005 Hi, The numbers say hypo definitely, but also.. you mentioned.. almost fainting. This could be indicative of adrenal fatigue. A quick test for this that you could do at home is... if you have a blood pressure machine.. you can buy one at your local pharmacy.. Lay down and take your blood pressure-------record that reading. Immediately stand up and take it again------record that reading. If the numbers are lower when you stand up, it is likely that you have adrenal insufficiency. With adrenal insufficiency, you will also have weight loss, hair loss, dizziness, craving for salt. This is a serious event that should be checked out as soon as possible. If you take more thyroid hormone on top of this issue without checking for an adrenal issue, you will feel much much worse. I know of a naturapathic doctor in New Hampshire that would prescribe you armour.. Not too much farther in flight from NYC. I have a NY guy too, but he's really way out there alternative. Dawn In , sandra weisenthal <interart81@y...> wrote: > Tks for yr reply. I had my TSH checked yesterday and > it came back at 3.3, which was higher than last month > at 2.16. So I am definitely hypo. But I have gotten > very thin. Today I could not even go to work, this > was the first time this has ever happened. I got up, > bathed, and almost fainted, I felt terrible, weak, > with no life or energy at all. My eyes have been > bothering me also, very very tired, an effort to keep > them open. I was dx'd with blepharitis (also a side > shoot of this hashis I imagine) about 1 yr ago and the > flare ups come and go but have gotten worse. I stayed > in bed very weak, not sleeping for 2 hours, but am now > up again. Someone recommended a Dr. Sheldon feld > in Texas and I called to see if he prescribes armour, > just in event he thinks I should change my meds. They > were adament that NO, he only believes in synthetic > meds so I didn't make the appt. Apparently he has a > thyroid clinic there and specializes in thyroid > disorders. However I believe is correct > (about.com) when she says endos in general believe in > straight numbers, not symptoms, they usually don't do > anything off the books. I am trying to arrange some > appts in NY so I can fly up (I live in Mexico) and see > hair and thyroid doctors but I am uncertain who to go > to. I tend to think that a doctor, but knowledgeable > in alternative medicine, would be best for me. S. > --- mikat828 <mikat828@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > You said that you were diagnosed with hypo thyroid, > > yet also > > mentioned that you eat alot and lose a lot of > > weight. Have you had > > your thyroid checked recently? You may be > > hyperthyroid now. Losing > > weight, tiredness and hair loss are typical of > > hyperthyroid. Weight > > gain is typical for hypo. Sometimes people on > > thyroid meds get > > hyperthyroid because the meds are not regulated > > properly. Please > > get retested if you are losing weight despite eating > > normal. Also, > > we all think implants are involved in setting off > > autoimmune > > problems. I think you are right in stating that > > getting them out > > might prevent future problems from occurring. It > > sounds like Dr. > > Melmed thinks that if you think the explant will > > stop hair loss, he > > is not convinced it will. And he is right. It very > > well might > > not. But if you are trying to give your body the > > best chance to be > > healthy, I would get them out and I think he would > > agree. If they > > are not causing problems now (and there is no way of > > knowing if they > > are involved in your problems right now), it is > > still very likely > > they will in the future. Getting them out will just > > be one more > > step in the right direction to better health! > > Hugs > > kathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Marie, > > > > Can you please post the numbers of your TSH, > > Free t3 and Free > > t4. > > > > I am on thyroid meds and I was told my numbers > > were " normal " . > > > > > > > > It would be interesting to actually know those > > numbers because, > > we > > > are all different and one person can be very well > > at a certain > > level > > > and another can be disabled at same. > > > > > > > > Did she test your cortisol too? > > > > > > > > Hugs.. > > > > Dawn > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello Everyone, > > > > > > > > Yet again I have hit another road block! I had > > another round of > > > blood tests done, including the FREE T3 and T4 > > that everyone told > > me > > > to have checked. Again, I am as healthy as any > > women would want to > > > be! Great News, but what about the HAIR LOSS? I > > can't be too > > healthy > > > if I am losing my freaking hair! > > > > > > > > I don't know where to go next. I'm trying to > > see a Dermatologist > > > but the only one I would trust, is not taking any > > new patients. I > > > don't want to go to just any Derm. > > > > > > > > I am going to get started on a healing program > > and vitamins from > > a > > > Wellness specialist. It can't hurt! Who knows, > > maybe the vit. > > will > > > help the hair loss...doubt it! > > > > > > > > Does anyone think I should have my test results > > faxed to Dr. > > Melmed > > > or Kolb for a second opinion? Or anyone else for > > that matter? > > > > > > > > Any info would be appreciated! > > > > > > > > Marie > > > > > > > > > > > > Opinions expressed are NOT meant to take the > > place of advice > > given > > > by licensed health care professionals. Consult > > your physician or > > > licensed health care professional before > > commencing any medical > > > treatment. > > > > > > > > " Do not let either the medical authorities or > > the politicians > > > mislead you. Find out what the facts are, and make > > your own > > decisions > > > about how to live a happy life and how to work for > > a better > > world. " - > > > Linus ing, two-time Nobel Prize Winner (1954, > > Chemistry; 1963, > > Peace) > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2005 Report Share Posted April 1, 2005 My implants are to be removed on April 13. This is the thing, they are alternative doctors, not endocrinologists, they don't subject you to the tyrrany of the TSH, but the treatment is altogether different. The belief is in treating the whole body and why it is responding the way it is.. getting to the root of the problem. Dr. Ali's saying to me every time I go to his office (I guess cause he thinks I am so dense), is that " You cannot grow beautiful flowers in rotten soil " " You need to weed the garden first " . What he is saying is that thyroid is not the root of the problem. He would regulate your thyroid and so would Dr. Thyr, but their belief system involves other natural remedies that they would want you to comply with, do you know what I mean? You must, you already see an ND. Dawn In , sandra weisenthal <interart81@y...> wrote: > Are they both very experienced in thyroid and > auto-immune disases? By the way did you remove your > implants? > --- Dawn A <daldre@y...> wrote: > > > > > Hi again, > > > > Another thing is that I know that if you are able to > > reduce those > > autoimmune attacks against your thyroid, you won't > > be swinging up > > and down so much. The implants probably aren't > > helping you > > unfortunately. > > > > I am from NYC area. I traveled from here at one > > point to an ND in > > New Hampshire here's the website.. if you go, see > > Dr.Thyr, she's > > great nashuanaturalmedicine.com > > > > Again, I do have an alternative medical doctor who > > practices in New > > York, he does do long distance treatment.. He has > > kept me as well as > > I could have gotten given the implant situation, and > > he knows his > > stuff. Call the Denville NJ office.. 973-586-4111 > > this is Dr. Ali, > > they will schedule you in NYC if you want to see him > > there. > > > > Both of these individuals will prescribe you > > desiccated thryoid such > > as armour, westhroid also cytomel. > > > > Dawn > > > > > > In , sandra weisenthal > > <interart81@y...> wrote: > > > I was in NY last week and went to endo and gyn and > > > both confirmed same blood pressure low at 100/60. > > The > > > endo seemed surprised that it was so low. Neither > > > tested it sitting and then standing. I think I > > will > > > test this weekend then at my mother'in'laws house > > > where she has a nurse in residence there...they > > can > > > check my pressure...good idea. I have been > > > corresponding with a naturopath in Connecticut > > > although I think he is sick of me by now, but he > > feels > > > my problem is adrenal and prescribed me adrenal > > and > > > liver detox drops as well as magnesium powder. > > The > > > problem I had with this, even though I took them > > for > > > several months Sept-Nov, was when I restarted in > > late > > > January after finally getting my TSH down to 3.3 > > from > > > 6.8, I then took the drops again and in 2 weeks > > felt > > > really bad making me retest and my TSH had gone up > > to > > > 6.4 in just 2 weeks! I immediately went off the > > detox > > > drops and magnesium thinking it was interfering > > with > > > the thyroid meds. I have been looking up TopDoc > > > profiles and see 2 people in NY...(are you from > > that > > > area?)...one is a Paris rho is listed as RRN > > and > > > works with a Dr. Fred Pescatore in NYC. They say > > she > > > works with a lot of thyroid patients, hashis, and > > uses > > > complimentary medicine as well. The other is > > > > > Ash whereby it says it also works with many > > thyroid > > > patients, believes in alternative medicines but I > > just > > > read that his speciality is environmental, and how > > > this can affect your health....Who do you know in > > NY?? > > > --- Dawn A <daldre@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > The numbers say hypo definitely, but also.. you > > > > mentioned.. almost > > > > fainting. This could be indicative of adrenal > > > > fatigue. A quick test > > > > for this that you could do at home is... if you > > have > > > > a blood > > > > pressure machine.. you can buy one at your local > > > > pharmacy.. > > > > > > > > Lay down and take your blood > > pressure-------record > > > > that reading. > > > > Immediately stand up and take it > > again------record > > > > that reading. > > > > > > > > If the numbers are lower when you stand up, it > > is > > > > likely that you > > > > have adrenal insufficiency. With adrenal > > > > insufficiency, you will > > > > also have weight loss, hair loss, dizziness, > > craving > > > > for salt. > > > > > > > > This is a serious event that should be checked > > out > > > > as soon as > > > > possible. If you take more thyroid hormone on > > top of > > > > this issue > > > > without checking for an adrenal issue, you will > > feel > > > > much much worse. > > > > > > > > I know of a naturapathic doctor in New Hampshire > > > > that would > > > > prescribe you armour.. Not too much farther in > > > > flight from NYC. I > > > > have a NY guy too, but he's really way out there > > > > alternative. > > > > > > > > Dawn > > > > > > > > > > > > In , sandra > > weisenthal > > > > <interart81@y...> wrote: > > > > > Tks for yr reply. I had my TSH checked > > yesterday > > > > and > > > > > it came back at 3.3, which was higher than > > last > > > > month > > > > > at 2.16. So I am definitely hypo. But I have > > > > gotten > > > > > very thin. Today I could not even go to work, > > > > this > > > > > was the first time this has ever happened. I > > got > > > > up, > > > > > bathed, and almost fainted, I felt terrible, > > weak, > > > > > with no life or energy at all. My eyes have > > been > > > > > bothering me also, very very tired, an effort > > to > > > > keep > > > > > them open. I was dx'd with blepharitis (also > > a > > > > side > > > > > shoot of this hashis I imagine) about 1 yr ago > > and > > > > the > > > > > flare ups come and go but have gotten worse. > > I > > > > stayed > > > > > in bed very weak, not sleeping for 2 hours, > > but am > > > > now > > > > > up again. Someone recommended a Dr. Sheldon > > > > feld > > > > > in Texas and I called to see if he prescribes > > > > armour, > > > > > just in event he thinks I should change my > > meds. > > > > They > > > > > were adament that NO, he only believes in > > > > synthetic > > > > > meds so I didn't make the appt. Apparently he > > has > > > > a > > > > > thyroid clinic there and specializes in > > thyroid > > > > > disorders. However I believe is > > > > correct > > > > > (about.com) when she says endos in general > > believe > > > > in > > > > > straight numbers, not symptoms, they usually > > don't > > > > do > > > > > anything off the books. I am trying to > > arrange > > > > some > > > > > appts in NY so I can fly up (I live in Mexico) > > and > > > > see > > > > > hair and thyroid doctors but I am uncertain > > who to > > > === message truncated === > > > __________________________________________________ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2005 Report Share Posted April 1, 2005 Oh, and yes, Dr. Ali is experienced in auto immune disease... but be forewarned..... he does not use an endocrinological approach at all.. he has cured many people of the most chronic illnesses.. he does not in any way use " conventional medicine " as his main stay. He uses supplements, detoxing, Intravenous therapy, chelation. And prescribes thyroid hormone to " support " the thyroid. Dawn > > > > > Tks for yr reply. I had my TSH checked > > yesterday > > > > and > > > > > it came back at 3.3, which was higher than > > last > > > > month > > > > > at 2.16. So I am definitely hypo. But I have > > > > gotten > > > > > very thin. Today I could not even go to work, > > > > this > > > > > was the first time this has ever happened. I > > got > > > > up, > > > > > bathed, and almost fainted, I felt terrible, > > weak, > > > > > with no life or energy at all. My eyes have > > been > > > > > bothering me also, very very tired, an effort > > to > > > > keep > > > > > them open. I was dx'd with blepharitis (also > > a > > > > side > > > > > shoot of this hashis I imagine) about 1 yr ago > > and > > > > the > > > > > flare ups come and go but have gotten worse. > > I > > > > stayed > > > > > in bed very weak, not sleeping for 2 hours, > > but am > > > > now > > > > > up again. Someone recommended a Dr. Sheldon > > > > feld > > > > > in Texas and I called to see if he prescribes > > > > armour, > > > > > just in event he thinks I should change my > > meds. > > > > They > > > > > were adament that NO, he only believes in > > > > synthetic > > > > > meds so I didn't make the appt. Apparently he > > has > > > > a > > > > > thyroid clinic there and specializes in > > thyroid > > > > > disorders. However I believe is > > > > correct > > > > > (about.com) when she says endos in general > > believe > > > > in > > > > > straight numbers, not symptoms, they usually > > don't > > > > do > > > > > anything off the books. I am trying to > > arrange > > > > some > > > > > appts in NY so I can fly up (I live in Mexico) > > and > > > > see > > > > > hair and thyroid doctors but I am uncertain > > who to > > > === message truncated === > > > __________________________________________________ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 2, 2005 Report Share Posted April 2, 2005 I have been reading alot about flax seed oil and cottage cheese. It can help reverse wasting disorders--not gaining weight though eating normally--and help with immune disorders, cancer etc. It helps get the energy back into the cells. This involves using pure cold pressed fresh flax seed oil. It must be fresh and kept refrigerated. It is then mixed thoroughly (with a blender) with cottage cheese (or yogurt) You should use at least 1/4 to 1/2 cup of cottage cheese with 2tbsp. of flax seed oil. I have been using it for a couple of weeks and really like it. It may take months to see some noticable improvements. If you want to find out more, go online to google or ask.com and put in cottage cheese and flax seed oil and it should bring up some sites that give alot more info than I am giving here. I really thinkyou should try it. It could really help you. And I definitely would get your implants out. Something is wrong--you shouldn't be losing weight like that. It may be something other than your thyroid since low thyroid doesn't cause weight loss. You probably need some blood tests including ANA. Lupus can also cause hair loss and weight loss and you don't necessarily have to have the rash to have lupus. You really need those implants out!! I think knows some thyroid specialists to recommend but they may be in illinois. Hopefully she will see your post and give you some recommendations. But I definitely think you have other things going on besides thryoid. I would schedule an appt with Dr. Melmed. Let us know what you decide to do. love kathy > > > > Hi Marie, > > > > Can you please post the numbers of your TSH, > > Free t3 and Free > > t4. > > > > I am on thyroid meds and I was told my numbers > > were " normal " . > > > > > > > > It would be interesting to actually know those > > numbers because, > > we > > > are all different and one person can be very well > > at a certain > > level > > > and another can be disabled at same. > > > > > > > > Did she test your cortisol too? > > > > > > > > Hugs.. > > > > Dawn > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello Everyone, > > > > > > > > Yet again I have hit another road block! I had > > another round of > > > blood tests done, including the FREE T3 and T4 > > that everyone told > > me > > > to have checked. Again, I am as healthy as any > > women would want to > > > be! Great News, but what about the HAIR LOSS? I > > can't be too > > healthy > > > if I am losing my freaking hair! > > > > > > > > I don't know where to go next. I'm trying to > > see a Dermatologist > > > but the only one I would trust, is not taking any > > new patients. I > > > don't want to go to just any Derm. > > > > > > > > I am going to get started on a healing program > > and vitamins from > > a > > > Wellness specialist. It can't hurt! Who knows, > > maybe the vit. > > will > > > help the hair loss...doubt it! > > > > > > > > Does anyone think I should have my test results > > faxed to Dr. > > Melmed > > > or Kolb for a second opinion? Or anyone else for > > that matter? > > > > > > > > Any info would be appreciated! > > > > > > > > Marie > > > > > > > > > > > > Opinions expressed are NOT meant to take the > > place of advice > > given > > > by licensed health care professionals. Consult > > your physician or > > > licensed health care professional before > > commencing any medical > > > treatment. > > > > > > > > " Do not let either the medical authorities or > > the politicians > > > mislead you. Find out what the facts are, and make > > your own > > decisions > > > about how to live a happy life and how to work for > > a better > > world. " - > > > Linus ing, two-time Nobel Prize Winner (1954, > > Chemistry; 1963, > > Peace) > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 3, 2005 Report Share Posted April 3, 2005 I have to greatly disagree with this, much as I would like to respect Dr. Melmed's opinion. But I think he is wrong. Perhaps he is not very closely following the disease processes with his patients, but even my own endocrinologist has admitted to me that he sees many women with implants who have thyroid issues. Hashimoto's is also characterized by the autoimmune aspect of thyroid dysfunction, and we all know that autoimmunity is THE MOST controversial aspect of breast implant illness. I have Hashimoto's and I am sorry, but there is nobody that can tell me the implants didn't do this to me. We have absolutely no family history of ANY thyroid disorders at all. I am the very first one to have hypothyroidism or any autoimmune disease, period. I hate to see doctors giving us information that may not be factual, and I can't say that he is, but I will say that thyroid issues have been very, very common even on our group, and I just think he is wrong. Just my two cents.... Patty > > > > Hi Marie, > > > > Can you please post the numbers of your TSH, > > Free t3 and Free > > t4. > > > > I am on thyroid meds and I was told my numbers > > were " normal " . > > > > > > > > It would be interesting to actually know those > > numbers because, > > we > > > are all different and one person can be very well > > at a certain > > level > > > and another can be disabled at same. > > > > > > > > Did she test your cortisol too? > > > > > > > > Hugs.. > > > > Dawn > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello Everyone, > > > > > > > > Yet again I have hit another road block! I had > > another round of > > > blood tests done, including the FREE T3 and T4 > > that everyone told > > me > > > to have checked. Again, I am as healthy as any > > women would want to > > > be! Great News, but what about the HAIR LOSS? I > > can't be too > > healthy > > > if I am losing my freaking hair! > > > > > > > > I don't know where to go next. I'm trying to > > see a Dermatologist > > > but the only one I would trust, is not taking any > > new patients. I > > > don't want to go to just any Derm. > > > > > > > > I am going to get started on a healing program > > and vitamins from > > a > > > Wellness specialist. It can't hurt! Who knows, > > maybe the vit. > > will > > > help the hair loss...doubt it! > > > > > > > > Does anyone think I should have my test results > > faxed to Dr. > > Melmed > > > or Kolb for a second opinion? Or anyone else for > > that matter? > > > > > > > > Any info would be appreciated! > > > > > > > > Marie > > > > > > > > > > > > Opinions expressed are NOT meant to take the > > place of advice > > given > > > by licensed health care professionals. Consult > > your physician or > > > licensed health care professional before > > commencing any medical > > > treatment. > > > > > > > > " Do not let either the medical authorities or > > the politicians > > > mislead you. Find out what the facts are, and make > > your own > > decisions > > > about how to live a happy life and how to work for > > a better > > world. " - > > > Linus ing, two-time Nobel Prize Winner (1954, > > Chemistry; 1963, > > Peace) > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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